ANGELUS ARCANUM

Connor was the worst character ever!

POSTED BY: DAX82
UPDATED: Monday, July 2, 2007 07:10
SHORT URL:
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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 4:36 AM

DAX82


I think the show went downhill as soon as they introduced pain in the ass Connor. As soon as he was out of the picture the show was great again, except for losing Cordelia.


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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 4:41 AM

REGINAROADIE


Hear hear.

Whenever I hear about Anakin Skywalker being nothing but a whiny bitch in the two SW prequels, I always being up Connor. Because there has never been a more whinier teenager in all of sci-fi/fantasty than Connor. He has set the bar that some have tried to surpass, but never clear like this whiny bitch does on a daily basis.

**************************************************
"We have five million Cybermen. How many are you?"
"Four"
You would destroy the Cybermen with four Daleks?"
"We would destroy the Cybermen with ONE Dalek. You are superior in only one respect."
"What is that?"
"You are better at dying."

Trash talk between a Cyberman and a Dalek. It doesn't get any better than that.

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 5:32 AM

DAYVE


I agree... not one of Whedon's best characters...

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 6:04 AM

AMYEL


Of course he was whiny. He grew up in hell. That just couldn't have been a pleasant childhood.

I thought Connor was annoying too, but there was no way he could be anything else. He was kidnapped and raised in a hell dimension by a bitter man who was determine to wreak bloody vengeance on the kid's father. No one who grows up like that is going to be a positive cheerful person.

He's not my least favorite character. Mine might be Mrs. SamBot "I am so AWESOME and understanding!" Finn.

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 9:54 AM

CYBERSNARK


Quote:

Originally posted by reginaroadie:
Because there has never been a more whinier teenager in all of sci-fi/fantasty than Connor.

You obviously haven't met Chad "Kicker" Jones from Transformers: Energon.

Whiny I can tolerate, but Kicker I honestly wanted to die.

EVERYTHING he said was in HYSTERICS!!!!111!!

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 11:39 AM

DEEPGIRL187


I have to agree with Amyel. There was no other way for Connor to be, especially with his upbringing. And personally, I thought he was pretty cool during season five. He was finally able to resolve the feelings he had toward Angel. And if you want to talk about the worst character ever, my vote goes to Glory. Season five of Buffy would have kicked even more ass were it not for her.

*************************************************

"So long and goodnight."

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 6:58 PM

13


I'm not gonna get into Connor, but my worst character?

That little turd Gavin. Grr...


jk. Love Daniel Dae Kim.


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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 7:06 PM

13


testing

wrong thread, but I just can't bring myself to take a stroll in troll country.


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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 7:06 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Snarf from Thundercats was pretty frackin whiney.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 7:10 PM

13


Don't speak ill of the dead!

And the Chinese stewed...

(Ah, my first Robot Chicken reference!)


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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 7:36 PM

DAX82


I cant believe you didnt like Glory. I loved Glory, I thought she was one of the best characters and is part of the reason why season 5 was my favorite.Was it the character itself that you didnt like or the actress. Who would you have play Glory?

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Tuesday, November 7, 2006 7:41 PM

DAX82


Im sorry but if I grew up in hell I would be a psycho , not a whiny little bitch. Not only was he a whiny little bitch but he was just plain stupid. Theres no excuse for that. I have Connors auto card and even looking at that pisses me off.

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Wednesday, November 8, 2006 6:56 AM

DEEPGIRL187


I didn't like Glory because I couldn't take her seriously as a bad guy. God or no, she wasn't the type to inspire fear for me. Angelus, Willow, The First Evil, or God help me, even the Master and Adam were more evil and frightening for me and the characters as well. Glory was a selfish airhead with a shoe fetish. In my opinion, she didn't really deserve the title of big bad, no matter how much damage she caused.

*************************************************

"So long and goodnight."

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Wednesday, November 8, 2006 10:22 AM

13


Doc was scarier.


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Wednesday, November 8, 2006 11:37 AM

ZEEK


You wanna talk bad characters? Go watch Season 2 of Lost. Not one character has any consistancy through the season. They don't develope. They just flop around like fish out of water. I especially hated Ana Lucia. Even the basis for her character was pretty bad.

Connor I didn't mind much. Sure he was easily manipulated but think about it, the only human he previously knew was his father (well holtz pretending to be his father...whatever). I'm sure he just grew up inherently trusting other people like they were his parents.

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 4:54 AM

JWHEDONADDICT


I can't believe I'm saying this, but I disagree.
I had my own problems with Connor, mainly it was what he did to Angel by sinking him to the bottom of the ocean which I never got past until the series was over and I re-watched them (how's THAT for a run-on sentence, Fredikins!). However, now that my emotions about that aren't as fresh as they once were, I'm not as blinded by them anymore. If Joss were to say tomorrow that he's creating a spinoff Connor trilogy, well, I'm SO there!!!

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 5:03 AM

JWHEDONADDICT


Hello, Connor WAS a psycho! Remember the last several eps. of Season 4? But it was around then (right before Angel slashed his throat) that I started to really sympathize with him. Up till then, it had all been about sinking Angel to the bottom of the ocean, not feeling remorse for that and those he put in danger because Angel couldn't be there to help them and finally, being ready to murder the rest of the group for Jasmine, even though he knew she was a lie. Now that Connor is more well-adjusted and has both real and fake memories, it'd be interesting to see the character continue. I'm all for a spinoff!!!!!!!!

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 10:13 AM

DAX82


Your words actually made my eye twitch. By far Connor was the biggest bitch in the history of television(thats right HISTORY) If that nerd Connor got his own spinoff I would throw up and start a fire. I have no understanding of people who like or sympathize for Connor. This ones for you Connor

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 10:43 AM

JWHEDONADDICT


Your response made me laugh...thanks for that.

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 11:00 AM

JWHEDONADDICT


I really never understood the point of the Ana Lucia character on Lost. The producers kept saying all along that it was going to be a quadrangle type thing with Kate, Sawyer and Jack, yet she never showed any interest in any of them unless she wanted something else. I feel like we were given mixed signals about her and the end result was that the whole thing backfired because no one cared anymore. I couldn't even care that she killed Shannon because they waited until it was too late to make HER a sympathetic character.

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Saturday, November 18, 2006 7:02 PM

MISSTRESSAHARA


There can be no contest about the most whiney bitchy "I wish I could bitch slap him with my brain" character.

Wesley Crusher.

Even his name makes me cringe. Hopefully the Borg can assimilate that little turd.

That felt good.

If I'm a bitch, then life just got interesting

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Sunday, November 19, 2006 10:49 AM

MRBLUESUN


I completely agree with all those of you who said that Connor was an irritating, whiny little S.O.B. I mean sure he was raised in a hell dimension by some bitter old man who kidnapped him at birth but that,my dear friends, is an opening for angst and anger NOT a cue to bee the a whinging little bastard.
Mind you as bad as Connor is he is not the worst. For my money its got to be that hamster faced assistant of the ninth and tenth incarnation of Dr Who, Rose Tyler.
I mean...my god the fact that they allowed the Doctor to travel through space and time with a freakin chav was bad enough, but on top of that the actress who played her (Billy Piper) gawked and yawped more than Julia Roberts and the character itself was frankly two dimensional.
Not one of Russel T Davies best ideas.

'Oh brave new world, that hath such people in it' from Shakespeare's 'The Tempest'

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Sunday, December 10, 2006 1:34 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Connor takes the biscuit. Not the actors fault, the character was just poorly written and the arc lacked vision.

It also confined the Angel mythos to a very insular plane - which took some doing to write it out of.


www.cirqus.com

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Sunday, December 10, 2006 1:49 PM

SHANNARA


it's threads like this that make the internet such a great place. :D
some of those posts are truly quite hilarious and i thank you all for the chuckle.

i hated connor. but not with the loathing displayed by others. i ended up hating cordelia as well, and i pretty much blame the show for her destruction.

also, wesley crusher irritated the snot out of me.

however.... my favourite show of all time produced the worst two f'ing characters of all time in shannara-land. buffy took a big nose-dive with the awful awful dear-god tell me it's a mistake, i can't believe you did this to me, introduction of DAWN and TARA. i've never wanted to slap someone for stuttering before, but i was sorely pressed to refrain from throwing objects at the television.

THEY RUINED MY FAVOURITE SHOW!!!!

and finally, Dawn was about to throw herself into a magical vortex of cast deletion, and what happens? buffy jumps instead. nooooooooooooo!!!!! the double horror!!

they finally killed off t-t-t-tara (i don't make fun of people who stutter, honestly, but her fake stutter was insufferable) but by then the damage was done.

ok ok ok, one caveat. my favourite two episodes of all time were "once more with feeling" and "tabula rasa" and tara was front and centre in both and was absolutely marvellous, in "once more with feeling" in particular.

so i officially nominate dawn for the whiney bitch award.

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Sunday, December 10, 2006 1:53 PM

SHANNARA


Quote:

Originally posted by dax82:
Your words actually made my eye twitch. By far Connor was the biggest bitch in the history of television(thats right HISTORY) If that nerd Connor got his own spinoff I would throw up and start a fire. I have no understanding of people who like or sympathize for Connor. This ones for you Connor



ah shit, i laughed even harder reading this a second time.

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Tuesday, December 12, 2006 3:18 PM

DRU


I liked Connor. I didn't care too much for Dawn. The worst actress was probably the woman who played Rileys wife Sam on Buffy.

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Thursday, December 21, 2006 10:55 AM

CHARLENE


I like Connor.
Think about what he went through! He was a totally believable character. When I think about it, I don't remember ever being annoyed with him!

--------------------------------------------------

I am 94% Like River Tam

The Fugitive. You are clever and dangerous, which is a nasty combination.
The fact you are crazy too just adds to your charm.
They did bad things to you, but you know their secrets.
They will regret how they made you.

--------------------------------------------------

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Thursday, December 21, 2006 12:30 PM

THEREALME


I tolerated Conner until he participated in the murder of an innocent. I could excuse the rest, but this was something even HOltz would have objected to.

However, he has become a useful non-role model. I am watching Buffy and Angel with a friend and her 13-year-old boy. WHenever the boy gets in trouble I can say, "Hey, remember when Conner did xxxx? Well..."

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Thursday, December 21, 2006 3:58 PM

CHARLENE


but he didn't really "participate", did he? Cordy or should I say Jasmine killed the poor girl, Conner didn't know what to do, he couldn't deal with the situation. I like to believe that he would'e freed the girl if Cordy wouldn't have come and killed her.

--------------------------------------------------

I am 94% Like River Tam

The Fugitive. You are clever and dangerous, which is a nasty combination.
The fact you are crazy too just adds to your charm.
They did bad things to you, but you know their secrets.
They will regret how they made you.

--------------------------------------------------

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Saturday, December 23, 2006 11:22 PM

THEMANTHEYCALLEDJAMES


agreed....the second Darla showed up to Angel's crib pregnant.....it was the start of some really stupid storylines

shame S3 already had some actuall good things happening ...maybe if they focused on the conflict between Holtz and Angel instead of the contrived Vamp kid the second half of S3 would have worked out.

Also Darla's death was one of the LAMEST in tv history...one killing her was corny just based on the fact that she had already been killed (they revived) 3 other times also she was SUCH a great villian if she died it need to be in a showdown with Angel...not in his arms (pregnant come on) trying to be sympathetic


They only Connor episode I liked was at the VERY END of Seaosn5 (when everyone gets their memory back)

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Thursday, February 8, 2007 10:16 AM

DRU


I still like Connor. Wish Angel got another season to see an episode or two with a well adjusted Connor and his relationship with his father.

On the topic of whiny characters, I would say Adric, the fifth's Doctor companion. I was very happy when he blew up. Wesley Crusher from Star Trek the Next Generation. I never liked Dawn's character from Buffy, although season 7 was the best for her character.

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Thursday, February 8, 2007 10:16 AM

DRU


I still like Connor. Wish Angel got another season to see an episode or two with a well adjusted Connor and his relationship with his father.

On the topic of whiny characters, I would say Adric, the fifth's Doctor companion. I was very happy when he blew up. Wesley Crusher from Star Trek the Next Generation. I never liked Dawn's character from Buffy, although season 7 was the best for her character.

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Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:21 AM

CLJOHNSTON108


I actually haven't watched TV since Babylon 5 ended in '98, just DVDs of shows I hear a lot of great things about.

Watched Seasons 2&3 of Buffy, and I managed to see the first couple of episodes of Angel at a friend's house, but that was it.
Haven't had the money to buy the DVDs of both shows.
Found Season 1 of Buffy (from the box set) for $12.99, so that's a start.

I was curious about the "puppet" business, so I read the transcripts of the eps from "Smile Time" on to the end.

Having said all of that, I kinda liked Connor, at least in "Origin"!

I really dug the scene where he's getting ready to fight Sahjahn.

When he says "You can take a moment, if you want. There's some weapons and stuff over here if you think you'll need them," and Sahjahn says "Thanks," it sorta reminded me of The Princess Bride, right before Inigo & The Man in Black/Westley fought.

Hearing all your comments, though, I'm almost afraid to fill in the rest of the blanks in my Buffyverse knowledge!


________________________

"Spry for a dead fella!"

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Tuesday, February 20, 2007 9:56 PM

EMBERS


Quote:

Originally posted by dax82:
Your words actually made my eye twitch. By far Connor was the biggest bitch in the history of television(thats right HISTORY) If that nerd Connor got his own spinoff I would throw up and start a fire. I have no understanding of people who like or sympathize for Connor. This ones for you Connor


but have you watched season 5 Connor yet?
I thought they redeemed him well!

And I hated Glory, I can barely stand Buffy's season 5 because I just thought that character was so lame...




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Monday, February 26, 2007 6:40 AM

RIVER6213


I really disliked the character Conner. The only time I came near to liking him was:

1. He 1st showed up from that vortex, and killed that creature and immediately started attacking Angel and company.

2. When Connor told Jasmine that he loved her and then killed her.

3. When The man they all called Jayne was beating the stuffing out of Angel and Connor showed up and started slapping Jayne around until Jayne kicked him into the wall. This gave Angel enough time to attack again.

Besides all of those scenes the Connor character really wasn't worth much of anything. I guess being all broody, whiny and annoying, plus being a back-stabbing little creepoid, not to mention off-shore dumping of daddy is a good indication that being raised in a hell dimension is bad for you.

-River

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Wednesday, April 4, 2007 9:52 AM

INDIGOSTARBLASTER


We haven't seen all of season 5 yet -- so far Connor's been magically transplanted into a normal family and we haven't seen him since -- so I can't say anything about his eventual redemption (based on what previous posters have said).

What I can say is that I've gritted my teeth through the teenage angst of all of Connor, Dawn and Buffy in their time. Yes, I know it's more or less a normal phase of human development, and yes, I agree that Connor had such an incredibly lousy, abusive childhood that he can't be blamed for his particularly extreme manifestation of it, but it's still incredibly annoying to wait for them to grow out of it.

So. If Connor gets to grow out of his angst during season 5, I'm relieved to hear it. I was very happy to see Dawn growing up substantially during season 7 of Buffy -- it redeemed her character in my eyes.

As for Buffy, I suppose she wasn't actually a teenager at the time, but the "thing" that I waited impatiently for her to grow out of was her torment over her BDSM relationship with Spike during season 5 of Buffy. I kept shouting at the screen, "It's not a big deal. It's just a slightly kinky, mostly physical sexual relationship with an entirely willing partner with no illusions as to your emotional commitment here. It doesn't mean your moral core is crumbling. Relax!"

Whew. I didn't realize how much I wanted to get that off my chest :)

All that said, I've really enjoyed both shows and would like to give all props to Joss et al.

Indigo S.

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Wednesday, April 4, 2007 11:34 AM

RIVER6213


Quote:

Originally posted by IndigoStarblaster:
We haven't seen all of season 5 yet -- so far Connor's been magically transplanted into a normal family and we haven't seen him since -- so I can't say anything about his eventual redemption (based on what previous posters have said).

What I can say is that I've gritted my teeth through the teenage angst of all of Connor, Dawn and Buffy in their time. Yes, I know it's more or less a normal phase of human development, and yes, I agree that Connor had such an incredibly lousy, abusive childhood that he can't be blamed for his particularly extreme manifestation of it, but it's still incredibly annoying to wait for them to grow out of it.

So. If Connor gets to grow out of his angst during season 5, I'm relieved to hear it. I was very happy to see Dawn growing up substantially during season 7 of Buffy -- it redeemed her character in my eyes.

As for Buffy, I suppose she wasn't actually a teenager at the time, but the "thing" that I waited impatiently for her to grow out of was her torment over her BDSM relationship with Spike during season 5 of Buffy. I kept shouting at the screen, "It's not a big deal. It's just a slightly kinky, mostly physical sexual relationship with an entirely willing partner with no illusions as to your emotional commitment here. It doesn't mean your moral core is crumbling. Relax!"

Whew. I didn't realize how much I wanted to get that off my chest :)

All that said, I've really enjoyed both shows and would like to give all props to Joss et al.

Indigo S.



Yes, I agree that given enough time Connor would have developed into a much better character. I just got tired of all his drama and anger. The brat could clearly see that Angel was trying to do his best. If Angel was truly bad as Connor's step-father told him, Connor would have been able to figure it out in short order, but the kid wasn't even going to listen in the begining, so Angel had to beat him up a few times, or catch a bullet in the chest before Connor suddnely realized that maybe what he was told about Angel might have been a lie.

Dawn from BtVS annoyed me in the beginning, but in her case I sort of liked her. I really liked her later on when she got older. You have to admit that Dawn developed into a couragous character worthy of bearing the name "Summer."

-River

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Wednesday, April 4, 2007 11:38 AM

MRBLUESUN


My God is this thread still going?!!

I may wear brown, but theres a little purple mixed in there too.

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Friday, April 6, 2007 1:38 AM

SERENITYINSCOTLAND


Gotta say, first time through Conner did my head in - I was with the 'I hate Conner crowd' all the way.

Just in the process of watching Angel from start to finish again (midway through season 5). And now I hold my hand up - I was wrong.

He's a great character. He was manipulated his whole life by Holtz, Justine and Cordelia/Jasmine. He doesn't have the same moral compass as the rest of us because noone has ever taught him about right and wrong. Sure Angel gave a couple of preachy speeches about being a champion, but never had a chance to properly teach him. And considering all this, even with all the awful things hes done (don't include sinking Angel - he was tricked into thinking he was evil), he still makes the right choice in the end and kills Jasmine. And once he has a moral compass in season 5 based on his fake life, his character got a much more positive reaction from the fanbase.

His reaction to Angel's line in 'Spin the Bottle' "I never asked to be born" says a lot for me. And his wrenching line in 'Home' almost had me in tears this time through.
"Can't be save by a lie. Can't be saved at all"

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Monday, April 9, 2007 2:33 AM

DANIELFYRE


I have mixed feelings about Conner's character. When he was initially introduced I thought it would be a cool idea for Angel to be a father and be able to have some type of real attachment to someone who if he got close wouldn't ultimately lead to his reverting to Angelus. As far as Connor's winnyness well yeah he did live in a hell demension raised by a guy who essentially stole him out of revenge he took the whole whinning to a new level. Early on its understandable, but that doesn't make it any less annoying. Also I would agree that given the way he was raised that he would be more broody as opposed to whinny. The post-new life Conner was a far more tolerable dare I say even likeable character for me. I think Joss wrote himself into a pickle with Conner's development and the only way to get him out of it was pretty much pulling that whole new life hiatus for him. In the end I could deal with Conner.

One character I however hated EVERYTHING about was/is Dawn. I think beyond the annoyingness of her was the way she was dropped into the series. I'm sorry but that has got to be Joss's worst writting ever. The whole idea of her just pissed me off. One second she's not there then bam annoying brat in the living room, what the hell? I honestly thought that the mistake would've been realized and "taken care of" by now but no into season 8 the brat is still alive and pissing me off...I hate you Dawn (Michelle Trachtenburg remains hot though...)

-Daniel Fyre

"real men juggle geese"

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Monday, April 9, 2007 3:54 AM

SHANNARA


thank you thank you thank you!!!

although i didn't actually mind the cool way she was written into the storyline, i absolutely loathed the character herself, and it really really lessened my enjoyment of the show. i've been bitter about it for years now, as some here can probably attest to already.

look! over there. it's dawn up against a wall!


"A ship like this, be with you until the day you die"

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Monday, April 9, 2007 6:03 AM

EMPIREX


Quote:

Originally posted by DRU:
I liked Connor. I didn't care too much for Dawn. The worst actress was probably the woman who played Rileys wife Sam on Buffy.



LOL! That's what happens when they let super-models act...

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Monday, April 9, 2007 9:31 AM

RIVER6213


I totally could not stand the character called Drucilla. she was so beyond annoying, and to have her kill a slayer with her fingernails?!!?? My hate for that character expanded 10-fold after that. Drucilla was by far the worst character in the Jossverse.

-River



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Wednesday, April 11, 2007 1:02 PM

DANIELFYRE


Sorry but I just have to say that I liked Dru. I think she was a cool character. Even though she rambled without meaning (or at least it seemed) everything she said had depth to it. If you pay attention she tells the future in metaphor constantly, and the dialogue was fun to listen to in that you'd (or at least I would) constantly be trying to figure out what she was saying beyond what she was saying. I liked River from Firefly in that way too. Maybe I just have something for the fairly attractive (if not downright hot) crazy chicks (actually that sorta explains my current love intrest, but I digress...) I don't know I think Dru is a character that is overlooked because of her ramblings and almost imp-ish nature but I like the character that way. Anyone feel free to rebuttle.

-DanielFyre

"real men juggle geese"

P.S. - I just realized your username and signature is River...which really surprises me 'cause seeing that I'd think you'd like Dru in the same way you obviously like River.

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Wednesday, April 11, 2007 1:15 PM

SABRI3L


Fuck! I'm watching the show for the first time now. I didn't know they lost Cordeilia!

*--------------------------------------------*
Forsaken Knitter of Cunning Jayne Hats

Hell on wheels

Come" target="_BLANK">http://www.cafepress.com/teaanddumplings">Come visit my store on CafePress!

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Monday, April 16, 2007 5:41 PM

RIVER6213


Quote:

Originally posted by Sabri3l:
Fuck! I'm watching the show for the first time now. I didn't know they lost Cordeilia!

*--------------------------------------------*
Forsaken Knitter of Cunning Jayne Hats

Hell on wheels

Come" target="_BLANK">http://www.cafepress.com/teaanddumplings">Come visit my store on CafePress!



Cordy's death bothered me also.

-River

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Tuesday, April 17, 2007 10:52 AM

FEITY


I think they noticed their mistake with season 4 connor, so they made shiny new season 5 connor cool and acceptable.

Willow's a demon!?

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Sunday, April 22, 2007 2:20 PM

WOLFPOET


I'm only watched 2 episodes of Angel so far, and I started in the middle of an unknown season, so it's really confusing. But coincidentally, the 2nd episode I watched had Connor killing that demon in it. This is the first time I've seen him and he annoyed the hell out of me.
And yes, Kyle, 'tis I. Drat, they need a hug icon. *hugs*

"I thought it would be nice to lie down and close my eyes. It never occurred to me that I am already asleep." - "Enigma" by Trapt

This is very River, don't you think?

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Sunday, April 22, 2007 7:12 PM

RIVER6213


STOP!

You got to go back and watch them in order!

-River

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Tuesday, May 8, 2007 4:43 PM

GIRLYBILLY


yeah i really hated dawns character too like super whinny and not teenagery at all like buffy had teenager problems and vampire promblems at that age but they where really and she didn't go around whinning. dawn made the whole girl powerness of the show less girly power and more whinny power. i see the need for a family firgure when joyce died but could have giles or willow or xander filled that roles, they kind of did but could they have without dawn. and when she was first introduced you where like wtf it was bad. sorry i'm sure michelle is a nice person but dawn's presense writing and acting where bad!! really bad!!

girly billy
but more girly then billy

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