REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

How stupid are people??

POSTED BY: WASHSYOUNGERSEXIERBR
UPDATED: Saturday, November 4, 2006 07:45
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Wednesday, November 1, 2006 9:10 AM

WASHSYOUNGERSEXIERBR

Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges

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Wednesday, November 1, 2006 11:36 AM

HUGHFF


I noticed in the newspaper this morning that scientists have identified the cause of SIDS (Sudden Infant Death Syndrome a.k.a. cot death) as under-development in the brain stem. Yes, literally the baby forgets to breath.

I don't know if this relates to your post as the web-blocker at work won't let me in.

www.cpfc.org - my life
www.nbhs.school.nz - my work

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Wednesday, November 1, 2006 12:00 PM

WHIMSICALNBRAINPAN


Do you really have to ask? What kills me is that they are breeding!

"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle." http://whimsicalnbrainpan.blogspot.com/

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 10:25 AM

TPAGE


Has anyone every seen Rick Mercer's Talking with Americans?

Granted, I am sure not some Americans know that Canada is not all about Igloos and Polar Bears... however some Americans believed Canada had no coastline and said if we built a Navy we could keep them in American harbours because we're friends!

Friends maybe, knowledgable, not always.


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Thursday, November 2, 2006 11:56 AM

MALBADLATIN


Canadians used to be pretty cool people. My family lived near the border to British Columbia and we spent a lot of time camping, fishing and hiking in the southern portion of the province. I'm unsure why, during the last twenty years, they have degenerated into sniveling mean spirited America bashers.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 11:58 AM

CHRISMOORHEAD


You mean like the rest of the world?

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 1:08 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
You mean like the rest of the world?

Because to not cowl down and beg like a dog whenever the US president hollers and fucks you over is mean spirited.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 1:39 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Y'know, I was more saying that in accordance with everyone hating us, and not so much in agreement with them being "sniveling".

I cringe whenever I think of how the rest of the world perceives us, in just about everything from intelligence to culture. That our pop culture is how most of the world knows us is truly humiliating.

But let's not pretend that there's not trash in other countries. I don't know why it's so entertaining to put a microphone in the face of the dumbest American you can find, and say "It must be because of their nationality". All it takes is editing out the clips of people who got those questions right in order to make it seem like everyone got them wrong. And if you were to do the same thing in another country with an equal amount of people, I believe you'd find that you had to edit out just as many people.

FACT: There are stupid people everywhere.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 1:53 PM

CITIZEN


Didn't say there wasn't, but there are reasons for people 'hating' America. For instance the do as we say not as we do international attitude. Expecting fair and equitable trade TO other countries but not FROM other countries.

No matter how stupid they are I've never known anyone to not know who George Bush is, or for that matter Jacques Chirac, so anyone not knowing who Tony Blair is, is pretty bad, what with Britain being your closest ally and all.

And really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important.

But really one of the big things us 'foreigners' don't like is when genuine grievances are dismissed as, "They're just jealous cause they're not American."



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 2:32 PM

ERIC


I wonder if a legal case for a treason charge could be made that Bush's actions have given aid and comfort to 'the enemy' when Americans traveling abroad must fear for their physical safety because of anger over his asshattery...

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 2:36 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


World affairs? Hell, many Americans don't even know what goes on in their own borders! Too often ( Jay Leno, Dave Letterman ) have done the 'man on the street ' type interviews, and it's pathetic.

Ask them who the VP is , or if they can find Texas on a map of the US, and watch the hilarity follow.





People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 3:44 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Quote:

No matter how stupid they are I've never known anyone to not know who George Bush is, or for that matter Jacques Chirac, so anyone not knowing who Tony Blair is, is pretty bad, what with Britain being your closest ally and all.


Yeah, they are pretty bad. But I don't believe that they don't have an equivalent in your country, or that they're anything but a minority in this country. Like I said, they could have asked 100 people that day and kept the 8 retards.

Quote:

And really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important.


The "attitude"? As in, what everyone assumes is what must be going through every American's mind? I'd call you a might presumptuous if you subscribed to that line of thinking.

Quote:

But really one of the big things us 'foreigners' don't like is when genuine grievances are dismissed as, "They're just jealous cause they're not American."


Chances are if someone's saying this, they're either trying to piss you off, or they live in a trailer park. If you actually want to discuss grievances, talk to someone who's willing, or better yet, someone who's able to do something about them. I don't know why you think that giving Joe Schmo American "The biz" is going to get you anywhere, but be my guest... just remember, we don't argue with your soccer hooligans about politics, so don't argue with our trailer trash.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 3:54 PM

FLF


I think anyone defending america should see Borat first.
I'm not saying all americans are the same (i have some cousins in New Jersey who are great people) - but this guy basically got frat boys to admit they thought slavery was great.
He also met a guy at a rodeo who admitted that he thinks people with moustaches look like terrorists and that gays should be hanged, as well as getting a whole crowd at said rodeo to cheer when he said 'I hope, George Bush kills every terrorist' *cheer* 'I hope President Bush can one day drink from the blood of every man, woman, and child in Iraq' *cheer* and 'It should be made that not even lizards can live in Iraq for 1000yrs'.

Now those cheers, more than anything - chill me to the bone.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 4:31 PM

ANTIMASON


i didnt think any of those questions were difficult, and i dont really know anyone(save for a typical teenager)who would have come off looking as uninformed as those people. those clips had to have been compiled of a minority of the populace.. sure its funny, but its an inappropriate stereotype that i dont care to see perpetuated; unless the implication is that we are a mentally deficient or inferior country.. which certainly makes our place as world superpower peculiar

something i found interesting from that video was when one of these people near the end, an older gentleman, actually said 'alqaeda is a branch of masonry'; now im sure the people who filmed this took this guy for a kook, but he may have provided more insight and TRUE knowledge then even they recognized. thats what i gathered from that video.. some people may be uninformed, but it doesnt make them any less out of touch with reality then anyone else

i agree that Americans can sometimes be hypocritical and ego-centric, but im not gonna kid myself and believe that it happens to us in a vacuum and all the other industrialized nations are wonderfully selfless and modest(*dont forget-more intelligent). we all have our problems, so dont assume youre so safe because youre in the EU or somewhere else; your leaders are just as corrupt and manipulative as ours... we just happen to be a greater force when we are coerced. its just when it happens here, its a little more blatant (whereas people in the UK dont even notice the 4 1/2 million cameras watching their every move)


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Thursday, November 2, 2006 4:42 PM

TPAGE


I don't think many people hate America because of the citizens level of intelligence (and I do not mean to imply that the video is representative of the population) but because of how America handles world affairs.

I'm not just talking about Bush but throughout history. Almost every major international agreement the US has signed yet has the poorest record of enforcement (though the other side of the coin is America then uses excuses such as other countries not following those same agreements to boycott or what not).

Hell, we've all heard how it was America who financed Osama bin Laden and organisations such as Al-Queada (spelling?).


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Thursday, November 2, 2006 7:52 PM

KANEMAN


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
You mean like the rest of the world?

Because to not cowl down and beg like a dog whenever the US president hollers and fucks you over is mean spirited.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.



Another hate filled post from an American hating limey............

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 7:54 PM

KANEMAN


"Didn't say there wasn't, but there are reasons for people 'hating' America"

Blah blah.......

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 11:47 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
Yeah, they are pretty bad. But I don't believe that they don't have an equivalent in your country, or that they're anything but a minority in this country. Like I said, they could have asked 100 people that day and kept the 8 retards.

Then why don't we see them with stunning regularity? Why is it other Americans say things like this:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
World affairs? Hell, many Americans don't even know what goes on in their own borders! Too often ( Jay Leno, Dave Letterman ) have done the 'man on the street ' type interviews, and it's pathetic.

Ask them who the VP is , or if they can find Texas on a map of the US, and watch the hilarity follow.

I'm sorry but this level of disconnect has never been demonstrated in the populations of other developed nations. Please note that I'm not calling them stupid, you're inference not mine, merely ignorant and lacking of perspective.
Quote:

The "attitude"? As in, what everyone assumes is what must be going through every American's mind? I'd call you a might presumptuous if you subscribed to that line of thinking.
Before going off half-cocked at my 'presumptuousness' please read what I'm saying, not what you presume I'm saying . I said the attitude that comes across, the attitude that wings it's way over here. It is America that exports this attitude, and America that must change it if it is not representative of true sentiment.
Quote:

Chances are if someone's saying this, they're either trying to piss you off, or they live in a trailer park. If you actually want to discuss grievances, talk to someone who's willing, or better yet, someone who's able to do something about them. I don't know why you think that giving Joe Schmo American "The biz" is going to get you anywhere, but be my guest...
Actually it seems to be the heartfelt from many. I remember seeing an interview with an American Woman whose Husband was killed in a terrorist attack who assumed the world wide dislike for Americans was because they "were Jealous". Maybe she was trailer trash, maybe she wanted to piss the world off even more, she didn't look it.

More over giving "Joe Schmo" American the real reasons why people tend to dislike America if they think its because the worlds jealous of them would be an adroit course of action wouldn't it? Unless you think education is useless to open the eyes of people who may be ignorant? Perhaps teaching the above who Tony Blair actually is wouldn't help? Also since I'm unlikely to be in a position to talk to someone in the higher echelons of government, so it seems fairly unlikely that I'll be able to talk to anyone other than "Joe Schmo American", so really the only way that we can realistically take your statements is as a polite way of saying "shut up about your grievances johnny foreigner, nobody over here cares". Which would be rather proving my point no?

Which brings me on to my almost final point. If you don't wish to discuss things, no one's holding you down with a gun to your head. You are free to participate, or not, and the appropriate course of action is to not post, rather than getting overly defensive and throwing gilded insults around.
Quote:

just remember, we don't argue with your soccer hooligans about politics, so don't argue with our trailer trash.
Maybe, maybe not, but I can tell you even our football hooligans know who Jacques Chirac and George Bush are.

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Thursday, November 2, 2006 11:51 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by kaneman:
"Didn't say there wasn't, but there are reasons for people 'hating' America"

Blah blah.......

Kaneman, please, you know what happened last time you tried to read one of my posts, you don't want another brain haemorage do you?
Quote:

Another hate filled post from an American hating limey............
Not at all my Pet Yankee Doodle Dandy. I have a number of American friends, certainly more than you my hatefilled twisted little troll fiend.

Really I leave the American hating to the violent ignorant troglodyte Neo-Cons such as yourself.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
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Friday, November 3, 2006 12:47 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Quote:

Then why don't we see them with stunning regularity?


Because you're not looking for them. You're looking for people to prove your point. It's only human, but it's also very biased. I can tell you that out of my friends, there's... 0 who don't know who Tony Blair is. But if you like letting the minority represent us and form and opinion based on them, I guess there's validity in that somewhere (Maybe that our uneducated people are more uneducated than others? Kinda sounds dubious to me.)

Quote:

I'm sorry but this level of disconnect has never been demonstrated in the populations of other developed nations. Please note that I'm not calling them stupid, you're inference not mine, merely ignorant and lacking of perspective.


Did you ever ask anyone from Japan these same questions? And don't worry, you can call them stupid if you want.

[qoute]Before going off half-cocked at my 'presumptuousness' please read what I'm saying, not what you presume I'm saying . I said the attitude that comes across, the attitude that wings it's way over here. It is America that exports this attitude, and America that must change it if it is not representative of true sentiment.


You're still describing this "attitude" as a sentiment that "America" exports. If "America" exports the attitude, then you're implying that it is the attitude of "America", right? And that would be assuming, on your part, that all Americans feel it? I don't know how autonomous yours or anyone else’s country is, but people here in the states actually have differing opinions on things. You don't think there's people born and raised here saying the exact same things as you? Saying that "America must
change it" is asking us to change your mind for you. Sorry, Jack, but your mind's your own business.

It's ridiculous that you can condemn a nation or it's people for having blanket opinions about issues, when you're doing the same thing to them. I mean if you scroll up, I was willing to concede several points in agreement with you, but you don't even seem content with that. There are a lot of jerks who will throw around the title "American hater" just so that they
don't have to think, but by grouping us all in to one category, you really seem to be conforming to that title.

Now maybe I've mis-read what you've been saying. Maybe your only problem is with the same people I've been describing, and not with America as a whole. Right now the issue seems to be whether or not those people are a majority or a minority.

Quote:

Actually it seems to be the heartfelt from many. I remember seeing an interview with an American Woman whose Husband was killed in a terrorist attack who assumed the world wide dislike for Americans was because they "were Jealous". Maybe she was trailer trash, maybe she wanted to piss the world off even more, she didn't look it.


How could you take a grieving wife’s words as how she actually feels about something? You know I read a newspaper article recently about a grieving mother who was begging and pleading with George Bush to stop the war because she lost her son. Both sides are granted representation here in the states.

Quote:

More over giving "Joe Schmo" American the real reasons why people tend to dislike America if they think its because the worlds jealous of them would be an adroit course of action wouldn't it? Unless you think education is useless to open the eyes of people who may be ignorant? Perhaps teaching the above who Tony Blair actually is wouldn't help? Also since I'm unlikely to be in a position to talk to someone in the higher echelons of government, so it seems fairly unlikely that I'll be able to talk to anyone other than "Joe Schmo American", so really the only way that we can realistically take your statements is as a polite way of saying "shut up about your grievances johnny foreigner, nobody over here cares". Which would be rather proving my point no?


Have you "helped" any of them yet? My point is not that the knowledge wouldn't be helpful, only that you can't teach people who are unwilling to learn. And chances are, anyone who's willing already knows, and anyone who doesn't know isn't willing. It's just an exercise in futility, so I'll thank you to not put words in my mouth.

Quote:

Which brings me on to my almost final point. If you don't wish to discuss things, no one's holding you down with a gun to your head. You are free to participate, or not, and the appropriate course of action is to not post, rather than getting overly defensive and throwing gilded insults around.


Part of the problem here is that you found any sort of "gilded insult" in anything I said. It really betrays, whether you intended it to or not, that you're looking for something to be wrong. I never asked you not to share your opinions, I'm only telling you my observation of other Americans from my point of view. Most of us already know everything you're telling us, and those who don't know aren't going to listen, especially not if you act snide and speak to them from some position of superiority. I know why people hate America as a whole, and I tend to agree with a lot of it. But I also resent that we as individual people are judged by our greater lot. The reason we made this country in the first place is so that we could have our individuality and own existence separate from a national governing body. We have moved a long, very unfortunate distance from that ideal, but it still effects today. Anyways, you can continue to look for Americans to enlighten with your way of thinking. All I can promise you is that even if you get one of them to see things your way, you'll have gotten about fifty more of them even more fervent about their hate for other countries. If you just want to flex some mental muscle and show how smart you are, great, but if you're actually trying to accomplish anything, you're just working against yourself.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 12:52 PM

CITIZEN


I see, so telling me that I'm saying all americans are stupid isn't putting words in my mouth?
EDIT:
Quote:

You're still describing this "attitude" as a sentiment that "America" exports. If "America" exports the attitude, then you're implying that it is the attitude of "America", right? And that would be assuming, on your part, that all Americans feel it?
Uhh, no, I'm saying that this is an apparent attitude that makes it's way over here, and that non-Americans aren't making it up becuase they hate america.

And being snide? Is that what I was doing. Are you sure that I'm not the only one not reading into things that aren't there?



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 1:23 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Actually, I just did a word search on the page for "stupid", and I never said that you called all Americans stupid. So, no, that's be your putting words in your own mouth.

And that attitude's only apparent to people who want to see it that way. A U.S. government official just got his ass kicked by a bunch of anti-war Americans on a college campus where most of the people think the same way you do about America. So that "attitude" is deffinately not coming from them. It's also not coming from me. Or anyone I know. So my problem here is that you're assuming it's coming from "America" in general.

Finally, forgive me if I saw snideness where there was none (as I'm certain there was none in that final sentence, either.). But at least I'm being man enough to admit I could be wrong.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:10 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Actually, I just did a word search on the page for "stupid", and I never said that you called all Americans stupid. So, no, that's be your putting words in your own mouth.
You said I was saying all Americans were like them [the people in the video], who I said were ignorant. That is putting the following words into my mouth:
"All Americans are ignorant" which is most defiantly not what I'm saying.

I simplified the sentence while preserving the sentiment, I hadn't realised that we would be nitpicking the exact words so closely.
Quote:

And that attitude's only apparent to people who want to see it that way.
Is that right? So let me get this straight, the fact that I recognise that this 'attitude' is not representative proves nothing, but the fact that I notice it proves that I want to see all Americans as ignorant. Nope you're really going to have to run that by me again.
Quote:

A U.S. government official just got his ass kicked by a bunch of anti-war Americans on a college campus where most of the people think the same way you do about America.
Maybe you can tell me what my attitude toward America is again.
Quote:

So my problem here is that you're assuming it's coming from "America" in general.
No now you've really lost me. Are we even having the same conversation?
Quote:

Finally, forgive me if I saw snideness where there was none (as I'm certain there was none in that final sentence, either.).
Nor in this one.
Quote:

But at least I'm being man enough to admit I could be wrong.
And certainly no gilded insults here.

So far my only assertions have been that there are reasons for any America hatred that doesn't stem from Jealousy. Oh and that the rest of the world isn't a bunch of snivelling America haters, which was a misunderstanding I believe we've cleared up.

I don't see much admission on your end of being wrong, nor do I see a real need to admit that I might be wrong, given that the rest of the world doesn't hate America out of jealousy, that's not something I can be wrong about its a simple fact. So maybe you could point out what it is about what I've been saying I could be wrong about, I've missed it evidently.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:37 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.


Sorry, I just have to add two things, then I'll leave you two to... whatever it is that you're doing (Discussing? Arguing? Debating?).

Quote:

I can tell you that out of my friends, there's... 0 who don't know who Tony Blair is.


That has more to do with who you choose to associate with than the intelligence level of all Americans (in general).

Quote:

So my problem here is that you're assuming it's coming from "America" in general.


Three words: George Walker Bush.

---

It's not that Americans (in general) are necessarily stupid - they just don't care enough to know, or haven't actually used their government educations. So, it is the American people that contribute more to this failure , or the institutions that allow them to go through life without knowing (or seeing the significance in knowing) these things?

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink." But, is the good ole US of A leading enough people to water (or, for that matter, water that's fine to drink)?

---
"What the world needs now is love, sweet love - it's the only thing that there's just too little of. What the world needs now is love, sweet love. No, not just for some, but for everyone."

http://richlabonte.net/tvvote

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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:50 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Quote:

You said I was saying all Americans were like them [the people in the video], who I said were ignorant. That is putting the following words into my mouth:
"All Americans are ignorant" which is most defiantly not what I'm saying.

I simplified the sentence while preserving the sentiment, I hadn't realised that we would be nitpicking the exact words so closely.



I beleive I already pointed out previously that if you're not saying that all Americans are ignorant to international matters, then we're simply disagreeing on the number of them that are. You could have just said right there that "I don't think that the people in those videos represent all of America" and we would have been done with it. That's been my whole point this entire time.

Quote:

Is that right? So let me get this straight, the fact that I recognise that this 'attitude' is not representative proves nothing, but the fact that I notice it proves that I want to see all Americans as ignorant. Nope you're really going to have to run that by me again.


You never said that it wasn't representative of the nation at first. What you were saying was "The reason people hate/dislike Americans is...". And the only thing I was trying to convice you of was that not all, and not the majority, of people are as ignorant to international happenings as you've been accusing them of being. It'd be like me saying "People don't like the English because they're pompus". Yeah, it's a stereotype, a lot of people in America and other countries beleive it. But it's not true. My grandpa's English, and my mom's English born, and I've had plenty of family visit from England. None of them fit the stereotype.

In short, I can recognize the fault in stereotyping an entire nation, but you haven't conceeded that point until just now.

You said "to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important.", and all I've been trying to tell you this whole time that that's just not true. You've either been too stubborn or, worse, too convinced that you're actually right on that point to conceed it.

This whole thing began with me making an observation the world hates America. Not a complaint, just a comment. It was more meant for shits and giggles than anything. But you saw it and just had to give me what-for, about how the hate was justified and all. And I even accepted your reasons as being true. But of your greivences, you said that little portion that I quoted, and what you said there was simply not true.

And "to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important." is not the same as saying that Americans are ignorant, then you're kidding yourself.

Anyways, whatever else you're trying to argue, I'm not interested. You said right off the bat that you're not saying all Americans are ignorant, and even if you said something to the contrary before, I'm willing to accept that.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:50 PM

FUTUREMRSFILLION


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
Didn't say there wasn't, but there are reasons for people 'hating' America. For instance the do as we say not as we do international attitude. Expecting fair and equitable trade TO other countries but not FROM other countries.

No matter how stupid they are I've never known anyone to not know who George Bush is, or for that matter Jacques Chirac, so anyone not knowing who Tony Blair is, is pretty bad, what with Britain being your closest ally and all.

And really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important.

But really one of the big things us 'foreigners' don't like is when genuine grievances are dismissed as, "They're just jealous cause they're not American."



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
]

Citizen - the US is 50 times LARGER than the UK. Quite frankly, many Americans have what to them are more important things to worry about than some country they will never see and know little about.

You know what I found really amazing about the media in the UK? They spent (and I am talking telly and radio and tabloids) an alarming amount of time bashing America and making "only in America" statements that had no basis in fact. Is America wonderful - not always, but then neither is the UK. Like the US has the patent on stupidity. I once had a British woman that wore a UK size 22 tell me that all Americans were fat. I told her to oder anthoer fish and chips.

It is all just stupid. Neither country is better than the other. There are wonderful things about the UK just as there are wonderful things about the US. And if it makes you feel any better. I have never heard anyone, either in our media or in conversation say that "they are just jealous because they aren't Americans".


----
Bestower of Titles, Designer of Tshirts, Maker of Mottos, Keeper of the Pyre

I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"

FORSAKEN original


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Friday, November 3, 2006 3:56 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Yeah, what she said!

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:05 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

And "to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important." is not the same as saying that Americans are ignorant, then you're kidding yourself.
This is neither what I said (by virtue of being a partial quote completely out of context) nor what I intended. Indeed this usage of my quote is just like saying:
You said "People don't like the English because they're pompus".



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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:32 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.


GB:

::giggles hysterically::

---
"What the world needs now is love, sweet love - it's the only thing that there's just too little of. What the world needs now is love, sweet love. No, not just for some, but for everyone."

http://richlabonte.net/tvvote

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:34 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


I just wanted to say you might reconsider the photo. [IMG]

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:43 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Why's that?

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 4:55 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:
You know what I found really amazing about the media in the UK? They spent (and I am talking telly and radio and tabloids) an alarming amount of time bashing America and making "only in America" statements that had no basis in fact. Is America wonderful - not always, but then neither is the UK. Like the US has the patent on stupidity. I once had a British woman that wore a UK size 22 tell me that all Americans were fat. I told her to oder anthoer fish and chips.

Yes hypocrisy is everywhere. Though let us not forget which nation is number one in the obesity league before we ramp up the righteous indignation too much.
Quote:

It is all just stupid. Neither country is better than the other. There are wonderful things about the UK just as there are wonderful things about the US. And if it makes you feel any better. I have never heard anyone, either in our media or in conversation say that "they are just jealous because they aren't Americans".
And for your next trick you can tell me where I said the UK is better than the US.
Quote:

Citizen - the US is 50 times LARGER than the UK. Quite frankly, many Americans have what to them are more important things to worry about than some country they will never see and know little about.
The UK is ranked by most sources as the second most powerful military on Earth, behind the US, and has the fourth largest economy. The UK is the USA's closest military and political ally on the world stage. Whatever way you cut it the UK is extremely important to American interests.

If the UK isn't important enough to know anything about or care about, who is outside of the US?

I really think you need to rethink what you just said. I never said that I thought "to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important" was representative, but you have, just now. I'm curious as to why Chris is agreeing with a sentiment that he crawled all over me about when I didn't even make it.

It seems you just made the case I was being grilled over for making when I wasn't.



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No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:06 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


"And really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important."

Happy? Still looks the same to me. Sorry if cutting down on the words took away from your original intent, but maybe I was just lost on what it was to begin with.

Care to restate your point?

Also, she never said that you said the UK was better than the US. I think she was making a general statement to address and diffuse what seemed to be a growing sentiment on this thread that it was turning into UK vs. US. Again, you managed to find conflict with someone not looking for it. You're talented like that.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:17 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
"And really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there is AMERICA and some other, things, some stuff that you know, isn't American, not really important."

Happy? Still looks the same to me. Sorry if cutting down on the words took away from your original intent, but maybe I was just lost on what it was to begin with.

Care to restate your point?

You don't get the difference between "to Americans there is " and "really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there"? The sentances, intent and meaning are entirely different.
Quote:

Also, she never said that you said the UK was better than the US. I think she was making a general statement to address and diffuse what seemed to be a growing sentiment on this thread that it was turning into UK vs. US.
Not by me, I remember you brought up footbal hooligans. I responded to what appeared to be an accusation that I was saying "the UK is better than the US" which was neither my intent nor my actions as far as I can see. I merely voiced that I never said such a thing because I do not know why FMF was telling me otherwise.

While we're on the subject why do you bring me to task for saying all Americans are ignorant, when my words were that the attitude appears to come accross that America doesn't care about the outside world so much, but praise FMF when she outright says it?
Quote:

Again, you managed to find conflict with someone not looking for it. You're talented like that.
Pot. Kettle. Black.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:25 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Quote:

Originally posted by yinyang:
GB:

::giggles hysterically::

---
"What the world needs now is love, sweet love - it's the only thing that there's just too little of. What the world needs now is love, sweet love. No, not just for some, but for everyone."

http://richlabonte.net/tvvote]

Glad you enjoyed, try this one

http://by122fd.bay122.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg?&msg=7D23B44B-097
2-48C6-B843-1D01BF4B1BD4&start=0&len=760396&curmbox=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&a=8bbfa80a8d3183c0b0cbdf77d0227593ea9b9d8d981f5c379b9545ebfddc1a80&mimepart=5


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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:28 PM

YINYANG

You were busy trying to get yourself lit on fire. It happens.


You're not gonna fool me, GB - I'm onto you.

-.- (That's me, watching you with my squinty eyes.)

---
"What the world needs now is love, sweet love - it's the only thing that there's just too little of. What the world needs now is love, sweet love. No, not just for some, but for everyone."

http://richlabonte.net/tvvote

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:29 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Do you really want to know? In public?
Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
Why's that?

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.


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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:34 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


You could PM me if you think it deserves descretion.

But generally, no, I don't have a whole lot of shame.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:43 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Glad you enjoyed, try this one

http://by122fd.bay122.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg?&msg=7D23B44B-097
2-48C6-B843-1D01BF4B1BD4&start=0&len=760396&curmbox=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&a=8bbfa80a8d3183c0b0cbdf77d0227593ea9b9d8d981f5c379b9545ebfddc1a80&mimepart=5



You're going to have to explain that one?



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:46 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


Quote:

You don't get the difference between "to Americans there is " and "really the overwhelming attitude that comes across is that to Americans there"? The sentances, intent and meaning are entirely different.


No, because they both express the sentiment that Americans are ignorant to the rest of the world, and either way you say it, it's your opinion, whether or not you put the buffer "The overwhleming attitude" before the statement. But like I said, I'm open to the possability of me misinterperating it. So sorry if that's the case.

Quote:

Not by me, I remember you brought up footbal hooligans. I responded to what appeared to be an accusation that I was saying "the UK is better than the US" which was neither my intent nor my actions as far as I can see. I merely voiced that I never said such a thing because I do not know why FMF was telling me otherwise.


I think she was saying it to everybody. But again, I could be wrong. I just think you took it a little too much like an accusation.

Quote:

While we're on the subject why do you bring me to task for saying all Americans are ignorant, when my words were that the attitude appears to come accross that America doesn't care about the outside world so much, but praise FMF when she outright says it?


Because you refered to "America" as a whole. She made a reference to certain Americans, and was speaking more in a "If it's true that they're ignorant, then this is why" sense. Your first response to me was done with the attitude that you should tell me off with facts about how America fucks everyone else over, even though I was just making a slapstick comment to someone who said Canadians dislike us.

As to the "Pot. Kettle. Black.", well, re-read that last sentence. I wasn't the one who took issue with a freggin joke.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:54 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


"But generally, no, I don't have a whole lot of shame."[IMG]
Ohhhkaayyy ....
deleted

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Friday, November 3, 2006 5:55 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by ChrisMoorhead:
No, because they both express the sentiment that Americans are ignorant to the rest of the world, and either way you say it, it's your opinion, whether or not you put the buffer "The overwhleming attitude" before the statement. But like I said, I'm open to the possability of me misinterperating it. So sorry if that's the case.

The intent of the two sentances are entirely different, that's just the way it is. The "buffer" as you put it as if it's meaningless changes the entire dynamic of the sentance. One is a statement of what Americans ARE, the other is a statement about how they come across. Saying they're the same is like saying black is white.
Quote:

I think she was saying it to everybody. But again, I could be wrong.
It appeared in a post responding to me with my name addressed at the top, I think I can be forgiven for being that 'egocentric' that I assumed it was directed toward me.
Quote:

As to the "Pot. Kettle. Black.", well, re-read that last sentence. I wasn't the one who took issue with a freggin joke.
No, you're the one who started the thread "what's so bad about tough guys?" You're the one who had a vast number of people on this site up in arms over your comments and assumed it was somehow their fault.

But I get it, you can insinuate that the entire world is nothing more than snivelling America haters and it's a funny joke. I make one comment about the attitude you export, in part through your elected representatives and thats a terrible bigoted thing to say. I guess that's what we call double standards.

Oh and how, exactly in a medium where there is none of the normal tells of intent, such as how something is said, body language and so on was I supposed to know it was a joke? Crystal ball?



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:03 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
How about this one ?


http://by122fd.bay122.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg?&msg=7D23B44B-097
2-48C6-B843-1D01BF4B1BD4&start=0&len=760396&curmbox=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&a=8bbfa80a8d3183c0b0cbdf77d0227593ea9b9d8d981f5c379b9545ebfddc1a80&mimepart=12
can find my way to the msn login on my own, thanks all the same...



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:10 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
How about this one ?


http://by122fd.bay122.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg?&msg=7D23B44B-097
2-48C6-B843-1D01BF4B1BD4&start=0&len=760396&curmbox=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&a=8bbfa80a8d3183c0b0cbdf77d0227593ea9b9d8d981f5c379b9545ebfddc1a80&mimepart=12
can find my way to the msn login on my own, thanks all the same...



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.



Sorry, when I hit the link it goes to a bumper sticker

A picture of Bush with his idiot smile and next to it " George doesn't work here "

and underneath, " Canada : America done right "

I thought it funny


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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:13 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


What was I just saying about people going out of their way to find conflict? I mean, I asked you to say what was on your mind and all (although I thought it would be more along the lines of 'your dick's hanging out') but really, is that the type of opinion you form of a total stranger from seeing one photograph?

Maybe you're not familiar with most art we have representing the Celts of ancient Scotland. They were a very proud, boastful people. They also dressed in what looks to many people like pajamas. I don't know where the axle grease comment came from... I'm not oiled down in the picture (but I could get some pics of that if you'd like ). And the dustbin lid is a foam shield... yeah, not too much better, but a required part of a full-contact dark-age combat game I play. If you think that looks ridiculous, it's a good thing you can't see the foam sword in my right hand that I cropped out.

But going back to my chosen pose, I try and reflect the culture I'm representing when I pose for these photographs. As you can see here:

[IMG]

Where I'm playing an aloof Sohei, or here:

[IMG]

Where I'm playing a shugyosha.

I'll also not that I used the following signatures for a time:

[IMG]
[IMG]

But changed them because other people took issue with them. Well, frankly, I'm tired of doing that. It seems like no matter what I do or say, people take issue with it, and I'm not going to cater to their fragile damn sensibilities anymore. I apologize for causing you pain, but you're just going to have to deal with it.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkyries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:19 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


As I said in my first response to you, I was agreeing more with the "world hates us" thing than the "Sniveling" comment. I know it's been a long debate, but if you scroll up, you can see, my very first response to you, says exactly that.

I was trying to avoid issue with you right from the start.

Quote:

Oh and how, exactly in a medium where there is none of the normal tells of intent, such as how something is said, body language and so on was I supposed to know it was a joke? Crystal ball?


Again, read my first response to you. I outright told you what I meant. If telling you outright doesn't work, then I'm at a loss as to what else to do.

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:25 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Hey, I took you at your word. I thought I made it plain what I'd say would be negative. And you pretty much said - go ahead. But I've deleted my comments.

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Friday, November 3, 2006 6:34 PM

CHRISMOORHEAD


You didn't have to delete them. Like I said in my opening line, I know I asked you. My astonishment was not that you made the comment, but rather that you would assess someone you didn't know so negatively because of a single picture. Whether or not you typed it, that's just... well, it's not right.

Anyways, not looking to draw this out, just wanted to say again (as I so often am forced to do with everyone) that I wasn't looking to suppress what you said, although I do hope I managed to change your opinion about me.

Oh, and out of legitimate curiosity, what were you referring to as being axle grease? Like I said, my body wasn't greased, so I'm thinking maybe you mistook the cut on my face for a long smear of it?

[IMG]
Place my body on a ship and burn it on the sea,
Let my spirit rise, Valkiries carry me.
Take me to Valhalla where my brothers wait for me.
Fires burn into the sky, my spirit will never die.

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