More lies and alibis. by Fremdfirma

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

More lies and alibis.

POSTED BY: FREMDFIRMA
UPDATED: Sunday, July 15, 2007 14:26
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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:19 AM

FBI lied to get ISPs to turn over data

Nick Farrell
UK Inquirer
Friday, July 13, 2007

THE FBI'S counter terrorism unit sent a large number of fake emergency letters to phone companies, asking them to turn over phone records immediately.

According to Wired, the letters are part of a legitimate procedure which is supposed to be used so that the spooks can get access while the Feds are getting a warrant.

But it seems that the letters, signed by Larry Mefford,the Executive Assistant Director, in charge of the Counterterrorism/Counterintelligence Division, were faked and the department had no intention of getting a warrant.

More than 60 of the letters have been made found and made available by the Electronic Frontier Foundation,

It seems that the FBI have been ignoring guidelines about how they are supposed to be using these letters. Perhaps they were re-assured when Alberto Gonzales told a Congress that there was no way that the FBI would ever do anything like lie to ISPs.

========

Here's a hefty

for all those "But they'd never do that!" jackasses who stood in the way of folks with sense enough to KNOW this would happen.

The FBI was originally designed to help enforce prohibition, a terrible idea that has long since been shown to be an utter and ruinous failure - and then trying to clean up the organized crime CAUSED by prohibition, and then Prohibition II, the "War on Drugs" which shows they didn't learn a goddamn thing in the meantime, and now "Terrorism".... and in all this time, all we've seen is political maneuvering, citizen intimidation and harrassment, and not ONE WHIT of any kind of realistic progress on their assigned tasks.

So.. can we fucking FIRE these guys yet ?

Above all things, I loathe incompetence.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:22 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Exclusive: FBI Data Mining Program Raises Eyebrows in Congress
Share June 12, 2007 11:53 AM

Justin Rood Reports:
Lawmakers are questioning whether a proposed FBI anti-terrorist program is worth the price, both in taxpayer dollars and the possible loss of Americans' privacy.

The National Security Analysis Center (NSAC) would bring together nearly 1.5 billion records created or collected by the FBI and other government agencies, a figure the FBI expects to quadruple in coming years, according to an unclassified FBI budget document obtained by the Blotter on ABCNews.com.

Those numbers alone raised concerns from two congressmen, Reps. Brad Miller, D-Calif., and James Sensenbrenner, Jr., R-Wisc., the chair and ranking member of the oversight panel of the House Science and Technology Committee.

The FBI has a track record of improperly -- even illegally -- gathering personal information on Americans, most recently through the widespread abuse of so-called National Security Letters, the two men noted in a letter to Congress' investigative body, the Government Accountability Office.

Miller and Sensenbrenner asked GAO to determine whether the NSAC will include records on U.S. citizens, and whether there are protections in place to make sure all the data in the program was legally collected.

Of further concern to the two congressmen are the FBI's stated hopes to "pro-actively" mine the data to find terrorists using "predictive" analysis, according to its budget request, an unproven method according to experts and even the U.S. intelligence chief's office.

In theory, predictive analysis involves mapping a known pattern of terrorist behavior -- for instance, the sequence and timing of such mundane activities as bank transactions and travel purchases -- against a massive collection of such records like the NSAC databases. If an individual's actions match the pattern, they can be considered a suspect, even if they have no known ties to any suspected terrorists or known terrorist groups.

Such a method would help identify "sleeper cells," the FBI claims in its request -- secret groups of terrorists living innocuously within the United States, waiting for a signal from a terrorist group leader to assemble and strike.

But to date the approach has not proven workable. So far, terrorism researchers "cannot readily distinguish the absolute scale of normal behaviors" for terrorists or ordinary Americans, conceded a 2006 document from the Office of the Director of National Intelligence and obtained by National Journal magazine. In other words, no one can figure out how terrorists act differently from normal Americans.

"We had no idea how on God's earth you would characterize and capture normal behavior," a former researcher for the ill-fated Total Information Awareness (TIA) program told the magazine last October.

TIA, the government's first attempt at anti-terrorism data mining on a massive scale, had its funding stripped by Congress over widespread concerns it would violate privacy laws. The National Security Agency -- arguably a more tech-savvy outfit than the FBI, whose computer woes are legendary -- continues to pour millions into data mining research.

The FBI has requested $12 million for its NSAC project. That amount would pay for 90,000 square feet of space and an additional 53 employees, according to its budget request. Whether Congress will approve the funds has yet to be determined.

The bureau did not respond to a request for comment.

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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:44 AM

FREMDFIRMA

FBI Details Data Mining Efforts

WASHINGTON, July 11, 2007
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(AP) The FBI is gathering and sorting information about Americans to help search for potential terrorists, insurance cheats and crooked pharmacists, according to a government report obtained Tuesday.

Records about identity thefts, real estate transactions, motor vehicle accidents and complaints about Internet drug companies are being searched for common threads to aid law enforcement officials, the Justice Department said in a report to Congress on the agency's data-mining practices.

In addition, the report disclosed government plans to build a new database to assess the risk posed by people identified as potential or suspected terrorists.

The chairman of the Senate committee that oversees the Justice Department said the database was "ripe for abuse." The American Civil Liberties Union immediately derided the quality of the information that could be used to score someone as a terror threat.

The report, sent to Congress this week, marked the department's first public detailing of six of its data-mining tools, which look for patterns to catch criminals. The disclosure was required by lawmakers when they renewed the USA Patriot Act in 2005. It comes as the Justice Department faces sharp criticism from Congress and civil liberties advocates for violating peoples' privacy rights in terror and spy investigations.

Justice spokesman Dean Boyd said the databases are strictly regulated to protect privacy rights and civil liberties.

"Each of these initiatives is extremely valuable for investigators, allowing them to analyze and process lawfully acquired information more effectively in order to detect potential criminal activity and focus resources appropriately," Boyd said in a statement.

All but one of the databases — the one to track terrorists — have been up and running for several years, the report showed. The lone exception is the System to Assess Risk, or STAR, program to rate the threat posed by people already identified as suspected terrorists or named on terror watch lists.

The system, still under construction, is designed to help counterterror investigators save time by narrowing the field of people who pose the greatest potential threat and will not label anyone a terrorist, Boyd said.

But it could be based, in part at least, on commercial or public information that might not be accurate — potentially ranking an innocent person as a terror threat. Watch lists, for example, have mistakenly identified people as suspects based on their similar names or birthdates to terrorists.

The Justice report also leaves open the possibility that the STAR program might draw up lists of terror suspects based on information from other sources, including from Data Mart. The report described Data Mart as a collector of government information, but also travel data from the Airlines Reporting Corp. and other information from private data-aggregators like ChoicePoint Inc. Private data aggregators often sell commercial credit records as well as other databases, like voter and vehicle registration.

"When you put bad information into a system and you don't have any mechanism of ensuring the information is of high quality, you're certain to get bad information spit out on the back end," said ACLU senior legislative counsel Tim Sparapani. "And that has profoundly negative consequences for the individuals who are wrongly identified as potential terrorists."

The five other databases detailed in the report include:

An identity theft intelligence program, used since 2003, to examine and analyze consumer complaints to identify major identity theft rings in a given geographic area.

A health care fraud system that looks at billing records in government and private insurance claims databases to identify fraud or over-billing by health care providers. It also has been running since 2003.

A database created in 2005 that looks at consumer complaints to the Food and Drug Administration to identify larger trends about fraud by Internet pharmacies.

A housing fraud program that analyzes public data on real estate transactions to identify fraudulent housing purchases, including so-called property flipping. The database was built in 1999.

A system that compares National Insurance Crime Bureau information against other data to crack down on fake car accident insurance claims and identify major offenders.

The 38-page report was four months late in being sent to Congress for required oversight. Senate Judiciary Chairman Patrick Leahy said it "raises more questions than it answers."

"Unfortunately, the Congress and the American public know very little about these and other data mining programs, making them ripe for abuse," said Leahy, D-Vt.

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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:49 AM

FREMDFIRMA

===================
So.. for "Terrorism" to "Umm, fraud, yeah, that's the ticket, sure..." to "We don't need a reason, PEONS!" to....

Where does it end folks ?

Shut it down, now - call your rep and give that fucker a kiwi enema, then go ask your local police chief if he really wants to be the FBI's bitch.

And while yer at it, since they've played fast and loose with OUR personal info, dig out said info on every FBI employee you can find, and feed it to every spammer, scumbag, credit and identity thief, bulk mailer, telemarketer and other scumbag you can possibly find.

See how much they like being on the recieving end of this shit.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:51 AM

OLDENGLANDDRY

Hmmm,
Seems to be the usual deathly silence from the right of the House.

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Friday, July 13, 2007 5:53 AM

CHRISISALL

Careful Frem, you'll scare the women-folk.

Chrisisall

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Friday, July 13, 2007 6:02 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

I ... love Big Brother.

***************************************************************

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Friday, July 13, 2007 6:06 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
citizen intimidation and harrassment

They don't intimidate me.

But they do do some good work, if Mulder and Scully weren't out there busting Alien balls you'd have to leave it all to that arsehole Will Smith.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Friday, July 13, 2007 6:34 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

GOOD THING I DONATED A SH*TLOAD OF $$$ TO THE EFF.

---------------------------------
Always look upstream.

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Friday, July 13, 2007 7:20 AM

SERGEANTX

If you don't have anything to hide...

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Friday, July 13, 2007 8:42 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Thought you'd catch me by asking that question again in a different context - eh ?? I'm too smart for your tricky interrogation tactics ... AHA AHA AHA HA HA HA HA :maniacal grin:

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Friday, July 13, 2007 3:19 PM

FREMDFIRMA

More grist for the mill.

http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2007/07/fbi-patriot-act.html

We're gonna be rammin this up their booty crossways, believe it.

-F

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Friday, July 13, 2007 3:37 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Frem

Damn I hope you're right.

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

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Saturday, July 14, 2007 4:10 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by oldenglanddry:
Hmmm,
Seems to be the usual deathly silence from the right of the House.

First I've heard of it. I prefer to find out about the facts before I give a knee jerk reaction.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, July 14, 2007 4:54 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
I prefer to find out about the facts before I give a knee jerk reaction.

Will wonders never cease?

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, July 14, 2007 5:29 PM

FREMDFIRMA

I don't see how it could be anymore clear than it already is.

They lied, abused that provision to steal personal data for unapproved data-mining unrelated to national security.

Our own intel agencies are more of a terrorist threat to us than Al Qeada ever was or will be.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Saturday, July 14, 2007 6:18 PM

FREMDFIRMA

And the hits just keep comin, folks.
This one from http://www.progressive.org/mag_wx070907

White House Manual for Silencing Critics
July 9, 2007 By Matthew Rothschild

So the truth comes out.

After a myriad of stories about people being excluded from events where the President is speaking, now we know that the White House had a policy manual on just how to do so.
Called the “Presidential Advance Manual,” this 103-page document from the Office of Presidential Advance lays out the parameters for how to handle protesters at events.
“Always be prepared for demonstrators,” says the document, which is dated October 2002 and which the ACLU released as part of a new lawsuit. (For a copy of the lawsuit or the document itself, go to www.aclu.org/freespeech/protest/silenced.html < http://www.aclu.org/freespeech/protest/silenced.htm>.)
In a section entitled “Preventing Demonstrators,” the document says: “All Presidential events must be ticketed or accessed by a name list. This is the best method for preventing demonstrators. People who are obviously going to try to disrupt the event can be denied entrance at least to the VIP area between the stage and the main camera platform. . . . It is important to have your volunteers at a checkpoint before the Magnetometers in order to stop a demonstrator from getting into the event. Look for signs they may be carrying, and if need be, have volunteers check for folded cloth signs that demonstrators may be bringing.”
In another section, entitled “Preparing for Demonstrators,” the document makes clear that the intention is to deprive protesters of the right to be seen or heard by the President: “As always, work with the Secret Service and have them ask the local police department to designate a protest area where demonstrators can be placed, preferably not in view of the event site or motorcade route.”
The document also recommends drowning out protesters or blocking their signs by using what it calls “rally squads.” It states: “These squads should be instructed always to look for demonstrators. The rally squad’s task is to use their signs and banners as shields between the demonstrators and the main press platform. If the demonstrators are yelling, rally squads can begin and lead supportive chants to drown out the protestors (USA!, USA!, USA!). As a last resort, security should remove the demonstrators from the event site.”
The document offered advice on how to recruit members for such squads: “The rally squads can include, but are not limited to, college/young republican organizations, local athletic teams, and fraternities/sororities.”
The document does contain a warning in bold, however: “Remember—avoid physical contact with demonstrators.” It also advises to make sure that whatever action is taken to drown out the demonstrators does not “cause more negative publicity than if the demonstrators were simply left alone.”

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Saturday, July 14, 2007 11:35 PM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
I don't see how it could be anymore clear than it already is.

But we don't want a Knee Jerk reaction, unless we're taring a whole political wing as evil, and dangerous of course.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 1:13 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
The document does contain a warning in bold, however: “Remember—avoid physical contact with demonstrators.” It also advises to make sure that whatever action is taken to drown out the demonstrators does not “cause more negative publicity than if the demonstrators were simply left alone.”

Sounds like a reasonable tactic from a White House that gets it. Fighting fire with fire, but instructing folks to avoid physical contact or do anything to cause more negative publicity. Folks have the right to protest, but there's no right that they be heard.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 1:18 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Alphabet Agencies are an equal opportunity evil, Cit.

Doesn't matter who's prez, doesn't matter who's in power, they still do this crap, always have, it's just now with a better informed public, they get caught out quicker - remember, in order to expose COINTELPRO, ordinary americans had to burglarize the place and outright steal the evidence.

And everytime they've been forbidden to do something by congress (Carnivore/Omnivore) they go right on and do it anyway, look at the Dept of Justice laughing off subpeanos, for example.

I saw we issue a search warrant for this stolen info, and when they predictably refuse to comply, go down there with Representatives of Congress, a TAC-SWAT team and their stupid little APC and go *take* it from them, arresting anyone who refuses to comply for obstruction of justice.

Hell, bring a camera crew and put it on CNN Live, even.

And then take it all out back, servers, hard copy, tapes, drives, the whole freakin lot of it, douse it with gasoline and torch it, have us a regular Bar-B-Q in the parking lot.

Then revoke their charter and arrest every single one of em who violated it in any way, and send the rest of em packing for the unemployment line, with a lifetime ban on government employment.

You wanna clean out the corruption, start at the roots - it won't ever happen, realistically, but that is what SHOULD be done, and what, legally, OUGHT to be done.

Just sayin.

Ain't no political "side" to em, they are their own brand of slime without significant party affiliation.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 1:23 AM

FREMDFIRMA

People who wanna be heard bad enough, WILL be heard, all attempting to corrall, silence, or drown them out will do is guarantee escalation of events to inevitable violence.

Is that really the way to handle it ?

You silence peaceful demonstrators enough times, they'll eventually come back with pitchforks and torches, just ask Marie Antionette.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 1:23 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Meh, Doubled it, planck bubble stablizer failure.

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 1:30 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Alphabet Agencies are an equal opportunity evil, Cit.

Actually, in a lot of instances I agree. I'm just pointing out, that too some, they're only bad when the 'wrong' people are running them.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 3:29 AM

SERGEANTX

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
You silence peaceful demonstrators enough times, they'll eventually come back with pitchforks and torches, just ask Marie Antionette.

I guess what bugs me so much about this is that we no longer see leadership and government service as separate from political campaigning. It's all the same. The white house, from this document, clearly sees itself as an arm of a political campaign.

When leaders engage in manipulating public opinion through means other than appeals to reason and virtue, it's called propaganda. That used to be considered a bad thing.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 3:43 AM

LEADB

Quote:
Originally posted by SergeantX:
If you don't have anything to hide...

SergeantX

If you don't have anything to hide, you get creamed all the same. Let's say you hold a position which is against the current government's desire. It so 'happens' some slightly inaccurate information is added to -your- records on some database some where; the 'powers' now decide you are a terrorist threat based on this information, and declare you an enemy combatant. Since you are an enemy combatant, you have no legal rights, and are forcibly removed from the country where you can be interrogated using 'necessary means'.

We have some very dangerous precedents being set where due process can be bypassed for US citizens. Frankly, I think a fair bit of this will ultimately be deemed unconstitutional, I just hope things don't get too bad before that happens.

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 4:26 AM

SERGEANTX

Quote:
Originally posted by leadb:
Frankly, I think a fair bit of this will ultimately be deemed unconstitutional, I just hope things don't get too bad before that happens.

I wish I was as confident. Even if we do somehow regain our political sanity, all it will take is another 'booster shot' from terrorists to send us reeling once again. And I think there are enough people out there who are angry enough at the US to do just that.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Sunday, July 15, 2007 2:26 PM

FREMDFIRMA

The scary part Sarge is that some of those very angry folk live *IN* the US.. folks like McVeigh, Krar, and others with a grudge, legitimate or no.

This whole ball o wax isn't just formenting potentive terrorists in the middle east, it's formenting them HERE, too - some of the folk I deal with ain't as rational as most of you guys, and keepin a lid on that often takes a great deal of persuasion.

That pot's gonna boil over too, soon enough, things keep goin the way they are.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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