REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Obama's E.O. on lifting Embryonic Stem Cell ban is driving AURaptor crazy!

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 1, 2009 13:36
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 5498
PAGE 1 of 4

Friday, March 6, 2009 2:21 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


More waste of Federal $$'s, first and foremost. Added to the fact that

A) There's no ban on PRIVATE $$ that can be used for such studies

B) There's no ban of STATE $$ for the same

and

C) Adult stem cells are by far the more proven , effective, safe and reliable source for treatments and cures.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 2:24 PM

CHRISISALL


Thanks, Doc.

"Thanks." -Hero, 2009

The laughing Chrisisall

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 2:32 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
More waste of Federal $$'s, first and foremost. Added to the fact that

A) There's no ban on PRIVATE $$ that can be used for such studies

B) There's no ban of STATE $$ for the same

and

C) Adult stem cells are by far the more proven , effective, safe and reliable source for treatments and cures.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.



The fact that you're so dead-set against it, tells me that it's the absolute right thing to do.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 3:00 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Thanks, Doc.

"Thanks." -Hero, 2009

The laughing Chrisisall



Oh, and your test results came back. You're gonna need a bigger dose of penicillin.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 3:02 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Oh, and your test results came back. You're gonna need a bigger dose of penicillin.


Hmmm. You were closer to amusing with the other one, but don't give up!!

"Thanks." -Hero, 2009

The laughing Chrisisall

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 3:19 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:


The fact that you're so dead-set against it, tells me that it's the absolute right thing to do.



And there we have on display for all to see, a snap shot of the depths of your cognitive skills.

" If'n he's for it, then I'm agin' it!! "




NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 3:24 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Oh, and your test results came back. You're gonna need a bigger dose of penicillin.


Hmmm. You were closer to amusing with the other one, but don't give up!!


The laughing Chrisisall



Please, for the love of god, SHUT UP!



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 4:17 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


And the private sector has stepped up to the plate on embryonic stem cells, done tons of research and generated dozens of treatments.

Why, I'll bet you could name them all Rap !

C'mon boy, speak !

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 4:40 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
And the private sector has stepped up to the plate on embryonic stem cells, done tons of research and generated dozens of treatments.

Why, I'll bet you could name them all Rap !

C'mon boy, speak !

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.



Thank you for making my point FOR me! If there was any REAL promise in EMBRYONIC stem cells, the private sector would be all over this. Meanwhile, adult stem cells have yielded all manner of treatments. I think the rate is in the area of 100 to 0 over embryonic.





It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 5:45 PM

DICKCHENEY


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Oh, and your test results came back. You're gonna need a bigger dose of penicillin.


Hmmm. You were closer to amusing with the other one, but don't give up!!


The laughing Chrisisall



Please, for the love of god, SHUT UP!



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.



Go Fuck Yourself!

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 6:17 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


thank you, Chrissy.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 6:35 PM

CELLARDOOR


Do all political threads around here boil down to people insulting and swearing at each other within a few posts? Are you guys being serious or just recreating barroom brawls...? Just trying to figure out the atmosphere I guess, still being a newcomer.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Friday, March 6, 2009 11:34 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Nah, and I'd say about 80% of that isn't serious anyways - by now we've known each other for YEARS, and Rappy is sorta class clown with a side order of village idiot.

Me, now, im kinda the voice of reason, and *I* am a malevolent, misotheistic, misanthropic anarchist!

So, as you can clearly see, we're all mad here.

Welcome to wonderland, alice!

-Frem
PS. Really, we're not that bad, just don't take any of us too seriously, especially when we're bein serious!

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 2:45 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Thank you for making my point FOR me! If there was any REAL promise in EMBRYONIC stem cells, the private sector would be all over this. Meanwhile, adult stem cells have yielded all manner of treatments. I think the rate is in the area of 100 to 0 over embryonic.


Like if there was real promise in landing a man on the moon, the private sector would have done it. NASA wasting tax dollars AGAIN



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 3:05 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Thank you for making my point FOR me! If there was any REAL promise in EMBRYONIC stem cells, the private sector would be all over this. Meanwhile, adult stem cells have yielded all manner of treatments. I think the rate is in the area of 100 to 0 over embryonic.


Like if there was real promise in landing a man on the moon, the private sector would have done it. NASA wasting tax dollars AGAIN



And if there was any REAL promise in "spreading democracy", the private sector would have invaded Iraq...

Mike

I can't run no more
with that lawless crowd
while the killers in high places
say their prayers out loud.
But they've summoned, they've summoned up
a thundercloud
and they're going to hear from me.

- Anthem, by Leonard Cohen

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 3:15 AM

KIRKULES


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Thank you for making my point FOR me! If there was any REAL promise in EMBRYONIC stem cells, the private sector would be all over this. Meanwhile, adult stem cells have yielded all manner of treatments. I think the rate is in the area of 100 to 0 over embryonic.


Like if there was real promise in landing a man on the moon, the private sector would have done it. NASA wasting tax dollars AGAIN



If there was any promise of a return on investment the private sector would have gone to the moon long ago. Private companies spend much more money on medical research than the government does and profit from the results. Your comparison makes no sense. There are cases like space travel where the government must be involved because we see value in the goals but understand that the return on investment will be nonexistent or so far down the road it's not practical for private sector investment, but I don't see how stem cell research qualifies. If down the road there was no result from private research and there was still promise for stem cells I could see government involvement, but at this point it's just involving the government bureaucracy where it is not necessary.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 4:22 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by Kirkules:
If there was any promise of a return on investment the private sector would have gone to the moon long ago. Private companies spend much more money on medical research than the government does and profit from the results. Your comparison makes no sense.



It makes perfect sense. The private sector has benefited MASSIVELY from the Apollo program. As you point out, the private sector won't get involved without a guaranteed return, and that won't happen until someone demonstrates that a return is possible, without it being guaranteed. IF we left everything to the private sector, very little of what we currently have would exist. I'd go so far to say that most modern technology owes it's existence to government grants, which the private sector took over after the initial government funded research proved that it could pay off.

The point is that something that hasn't been researched yet having no proof of being worthwhile is a stupid argument. If that had been the prevailing thought of man over our existence, we'd still be living in the African Savannah.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 7:42 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

I'd go so far to say that most modern technology owes it's existence to government grants, which the private sector took over after the initial government funded research proved that it could pay off.


Yup. If the private sector saw promise in the internet, Al Gore wouldn't have had to invent it!

(That'll probably give BOTH sides fits, trying to figure out just what I meant...)

Mike

I can't run no more
with that lawless crowd
while the killers in high places
say their prayers out loud.
But they've summoned, they've summoned up
a thundercloud
and they're going to hear from me.

- Anthem, by Leonard Cohen

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 7:55 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Yup. If the private sector saw promise in the internet, Al Gore wouldn't have had to invent it!

(That'll probably give BOTH sides fits, trying to figure out just what I meant...)


Heh. Well, the Internet was invented long before Al Gore, and not in the states either (or at least exclusively). It started life as the packet switching network of the US DoD, and various colleges and Universities back in the sixties, all that was publicly funded. HTML was invented at CERN, again largely public money there.

And Actually, Al Gore had a fairly major role in creating the legal frame work of the modern internet, and I think he helped channel funds to Mosaic, the first graphical web browser.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:00 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:

The point is that something that hasn't been researched yet having no proof of being worthwhile is a stupid argument. If that had been the prevailing thought of man over our existence, we'd still be living in the African Savannah.




The false premise you're relying on is that embryonic stem cell studies have not taken place, when in fact the opposite is true. Enough studies have been done to show that embryonic stem cells are near worthless when compared to adult stem cells. There's the reoccurring problem of tumors w/ relation to ESCs, which isn't present w/ ASCs. So, further study needs to take place w/ ESC just to reach the starting point we've long ago found with ASC.

Again, there was no BAN on private or even public $$ ( at the state level ) for ESC research. ASCs have all the benefit and none of the problems ( genetically or morally ) as ESCs. It's a waste of Fed $$ trying to make work what we already know doesn't work.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:05 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The false premise you're relying on is that embryonic stem cell studies have not taken place, when in fact the opposite is true. Enough studies have been done to show that embryonic stem cells are near worthless when compared to adult stem cells. There's the reoccurring problem of tumors w/ relation to ESCs, which isn't present w/ ASCs. So, further study needs to take place w/ ESC just to reach the starting point we've long ago found with ASC.

Again, there was no BAN on private or even public $$ ( at the state level ) for ESC research. ASCs have all the benefit and none of the problems ( genetically or morally ) as ESCs. It's a waste of Fed $$ trying to make work what we already know doesn't work.


Hmm, funny that it's been proven not to work, given that the first human embryonic stem cell trial wasn't approved until this year:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/23/stem.cell/

That they've conducted research already and it failed is another RapFact™, also known as a lie.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:20 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


your information is a lie, citizen. Tumors have been found w/ embryonic stem cells.

* http://www.usnews.com/blogs/heart-to-heart/2009/03/04/why-embryonic-st
em-cells-are-obsolete.html


Quote:



Why Embryonic Stem Cells Are Obsolete
March 04, 2009 11:52 AM ET | Bernadine Healy, M.D. | Permanent Link | Print

Embryonic stem cells.
Scientists may be growing impatient, but President Obama has been rightly taking his time in addressing a campaign promise to lift the ban on federal funding for research using new lines of stem cells to be taken from human embryos. Even for strong backers of embryonic stem cell research, the decision is no longer as self-evident as it was, because there is markedly diminished need for expanding these cell lines for either patient therapy or basic research. In fact, during the first six weeks of Obama's term, several events reinforced the notion that embryonic stem cells, once thought to hold the cure for Alzheimer's, Parkinson's, and diabetes, are obsolete. The most sobering: a report from Israel published in PLoS Medicine in late February that shows embryonic stem cells injected into patients can cause disabling if not deadly tumors.

The report describes a young boy with a fatal neuromuscular disease called ataxia telangiectasia, who was treated with embryonic stem cells. Within four years, he developed headaches and was found to have multiple tumors in his brain and spinal cord that genetically matched the female embryos used in his therapy.

His experience is neither an anomaly nor a surprise, but one feared by many scientists. These still-mysterious cell creations have been removed from the highly ordered environment of a fast-growing embryo, after all. Though they are tamed in a petri dish to be disciplined, mature cells, research in animals has shown repeatedly that sometimes the injected cells run wildly out of control—dashing hopes of tiny, human embryos benignly spinning off stem cells to save grown-ups, without risk or concern.

That dream was still alive only a few weeks before this report. Within days of Obama's inauguration, the Food and Drug Administration approved its first-ever embryonic stem cell study in humans: the biotech company Geron's plan to inject highly purified human embryonic cells into eight to 10 patients with acute spinal cord injuries. (The cells are from a stem cell line approved by Bush because it predated his ban.) The FDA should now be compelled to take another look: Are eight to 10 patients enough, or one year of monitoring sufficient, to assess safety? And doctors who participate in the trial will have to ask what every doctor must ask before performing research on a human subject: Were I this patient, would I participate? Would I encourage my loved ones to do so?

Even as the future of embryonic stem cells has dimmed, adult stem cell research has scored major wins evident just in the past few months. These advances involve human stem cells that are not derived from human embryos. In fact, adult stem cells, which occur in small quantities in organs throughout the body for natural growth and repair, have become stars despite great skepticism early on. Though this is a more difficult task, scientists have learned to coax them to mature into many cell types, like brain and heart cells, in the laboratory. (Such stem cells can be removed almost as easily as drawing a unit of blood, and they have been used successfully for years in bone marrow transplants.)

To date, most of the stem cell triumphs that the public hears about involve the infusion of adult stem cells. We've just recently seen separate research reports of patients with spinal cord injury and multiple sclerosis benefiting from adult stem cell therapy. These cells have the advantage of being the patient's natural own, and the worst they seem to do after infusion is die off without bringing the hoped-for benefit. They do not have the awesome but dangerous quality of eternal life characteristic of embryonic stem cells.

A second kind of stem cell that has triumphed is an entirely new creation called iPS (short for induced pluripotent stem cell), a blockbuster discovery made in late 2007. These cells are created by reprogramming DNA from adult skin. The iPS cells are embryonic-like in that they can turn into any cell in the body—and so bypass the need for embryos or eggs. In late February, scientists reported on iPS cells that had been transformed into mature nerve cells. While these cells might become a choice for patient therapy in time, scientists are playing this down for now. Why? These embryonic-like cells also come with the risk of cancer.

James Thompson, the stem cell pioneer from the University of Wisconsin who was the first to grow human embryonic stem cells in 1998, is an independent codiscoverer of iPS cells along with Japanese scientists. Already these reprogrammed cells have eclipsed the value of those harvested from embryos, he has said, because of significantly lower cost, ease of production, and genetic identity with the patient. They also bring unique application to medical and pharmaceutical research, because cells cultivated from patients with certain diseases readily become laboratory models for developing and testing therapy. That iPS cells overcome ethical concerns about creating and sacrificing embryos is an added plus.

The importance of stem cells for medical research has never been greater, and the scientific and public clamor for unimpeded research is fully understandable. But it's important that Obama and everyone supporting a lifting of the ban be clear with the public on what is involved in this decision; it's more complex than advertised. The ban Bush became famous for restricted the use of federal research dollars just to adult stem cells and embryonic stem cells already in existence at the time of his executive order. Lifting this ban so that researchers can use frozen embryos that would otherwise be discarded—they've been donated by couples who have had in vitro fertilization treatments—has drawn wide and bipartisan support from Congress. It's an easy lift.

The more ethically charged decision—less understood by the public and one Congress has avoided—involves the ban on creating human embryos in the laboratory solely for research purposes. In fact, President Clinton is the one who balked at allowing scientists to use government money for embryo creation and research on stem cells harvested from such embryos; Bush only affirmed the Clinton ban. The scientific community has been able to attract nonfederal money for such work, and it is going on all the time in stem cell institutes. Scientists want relief from the inconvenience and expense of keeping that work and the money that supports it separate from federal dollars.

Reversing the executive orders of two prior presidents on embryo creation, which even the Congress has been unwilling to tackle, is a far bigger issue than lifting the ban on the use of IVF embryos slated for destruction. Obama stands for transparency, and it's important for him to make sure the public understands his decision, including that all stem cells are not the same or created equally.



Science does not start or end w/ U.S. Federal funding or the FDA's approval.

*edit - making citizen look like a complete jack ass, as well as a liar AND a moron simply isn't any fun any more. It's just too damn easy to do, and wastes too much of my valuable time.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:23 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
your information is a lie, citizen. Tumors have been found w/ embryonic stem cells.


Ahh, yes. I post information from an outside source, while we have your say so.

Funny that if my information is a lie, you can't drag anything more substantial out of your over stuffed arse than your say so. Yet another RapFact™.

You've got nothing.

I see you drag up an opinion piece you can't even post a link for. As usual you prove yourself a liar, no help from anyone required



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:31 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


::: hands citizen a dish towel :::::

Here, wipe the embryonic gunk off your face, mate.






It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:35 AM

CITIZEN


I don't want it, it's got Rush Limbaughs semen on it from last time you too had a meeting.

Again, you prove yourself a liar who can't back up word one of his science and freedom hating idiocy.

EDIT:
I see you've added a few things to your post that weren't there previously. Again you prove yourself a liar. You can't help yourself can you?





More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:39 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
I don't want it, it's got Rush Limbaughs semen on it from last time you too had a meeting.

Again, you prove yourself a liar who can't back up word one of his science and freedom hating idiocy.





Evidence to support my claim ? Check

Link from where evidence was found ? Check

Proof that you're a liar, punk AND a coward? Check, check, check.






It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:43 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
I don't want it, it's got Rush Limbaughs semen on it from last time you too had a meeting.

Again, you prove yourself a liar who can't back up word one of his science and freedom hating idiocy.



* While we have an open policy concerning messages, please be civil when responding to others.*



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:44 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Link from where evidence was found ? Check


Check your post again. The link there is the one from my post. Proof that you are a liar: Check and check.
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Proof that you're a liar, punk AND a coward? Check, check, check.


Proof that none of these things are true of me, but 100% true of the question truth dodging gimp that is AURetard: Check Check check and check.

Thanks again for proving you are a liar and a retard!

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 8:44 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

* While we have an open policy concerning messages, please be civil when responding to others.*


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Proof that you're a liar, punk AND a coward? Check, check, check.



* While we have an open policy concerning messages, please be civil when responding to others.*

Did I forget to mention Hypocrite?



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:03 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


It's funny that you'd call anyone a hypocrite, as you didn't even READ the post I gave ( link or no link ) before you dismissed it , out of hand. Called it some "opinion piece", and accused me of possibly writing it myself. Sorry, but you're just such a complete and utter tool ( this is being civil, mind you, because it's been documented that you are a liar, a coward, an idiot and a tool )



And FYI, I was on the straight and level to start this thread, it was Frem who interjected the first insults. Per usual. ( But I ignored that nonsense ) It was still you , concerning our back and forth, who started w/ the insults.

Quote:

Hmm, funny that it's been proven not to work, given that the first human embryonic stem cell trial wasn't approved until this year:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/01/23/stem.cell/

That they've conducted research already and it failed is another RapFact™, also known as a lie.



Bravo, moron.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:09 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
It's funny that you'd call anyone a hypocrite, as you didn't even READ the post I gave ( link or no link ) before you dismissed it , out of hand. Called it some "opinion piece", and accused me of possibly writing it myself.


That's because it's the kinda thing a proven liar like you would do. You've only just added a link, without noting that you hadn't done so till now. Another lie, from a proven lying hypocrite. No wonder no one takes you seriously!
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Sorry, but you're just such a complete and utter tool ( this is being civil, mind you, because it's been documented that you are a liar, a coward, an idiot and a tool )


Again, you prove yourself a coward a liar and a moron. Which is a statement of fact, you prove it every time you post.

Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
And FYI, I was on the straight and level to start this thread, it was YOU who interjected the first insults. Per usual.


Erm, nope. There's no insult there. Again you lie as usual.

Bravo, Liar.

Why do you hate science anyway?



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:22 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Now your parrot act kicks in. Predictable.

I debunk your claims on embryonic stem cell research, the tumors caused ( WHEN ? ) in trials which started YEARS ago, despite your silly claim that they're just NOW getting under way.

I provide for you a link, to a story containing info from a peer reviewed web site, the Public Library of Science.

Funny, that even in England, you'd refer to the USFDA as the be all , end all to things and studies related to embryonic stem cells. MY GOD, you're such a sheep, and it's not even YOUR bureaucracy!!!

And the BEST you can come up with is ignore the details, parrot your old, disproved and outlandishly pathetic insults, because you're not MAN enough to deal w/ having your hat handed to you, even over the internet.

In the whole human history of adversarial engagements, there's never been such a one sided affair as the way I've trounced you here.

Congrats. You're less than road kill.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:25 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Now your parrot act kicks in. Predictable.

I debunk your claims on embryonic stem cell research, the tumors caused ( WHEN ? ) in trials which started YEARS ago, despite your silly claim that they're just NOW getting under way.

I provide for you a link, to a story containing info from a peer reviewed web site, the Public Library of Science.

Funny, that even in England, you'd refer to the USFDA as the be all , end all to things and studies related to embryonic stem cells. MY GOD, you're such a sheep, and it's not even YOUR bureaucracy!!!

And the BEST you can come up with is ignore the details, parrot your old, disproved and outlandishly pathetic insults, because you're not MAN enough to deal w/ having your hat handed to you, even over the internet.

In the whole human history of adversarial engagements, there's never been such a one sided affair as the way I've trounced you here.

Congrats. You're less than road kill.


And now your "I'll shout that I'm the winner, and hope someone believes it" act.

Congrats, you've just proven that you've lost. Not to mention that you've proven yourself a liar again by saying you've linked to the Public Library of Science (*).

you're such a freedom hating terrorist.



* A statement true when it was made, I have no doubt he'll go back to edit his posts to include it.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:30 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:


you're such a freedom hating terrorist.



Where's the retraction that no ESC research has been done because of W's ban on Federal Funding ? Where's the admission that I was right, and you were wrong, concerning the issue of tumors and ESC trials , which were started YEARS ago, and aren't now just getting underway. As you knowingly LIED about.

C'mon.... be the better man. Admit I schooled you on this one, and move on. Don't let your humiliation linger.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:35 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:


you're such a freedom hating terrorist.



Where's the retraction that no ESC research has been done because of W's ban on Federal Funding ? Where's the admission that I was right, and you were wrong, concerning the issue of tumors and ESC trials , which were started YEARS ago, and aren't now just getting underway. As you knowingly LIED about.

C'mon.... be the better man. Admit I schooled you on this one, and move on. Don't let your humiliation linger.


Err, I don't consider an ill conceived injection in Moscow a human trial. The FDA trial is the first Human trial, it's the difference between having a proper X-Ray, and standing inside a nuclear reactor. As usual you've 'schooled' no one. All you've done is shown that getting medical treatments from a backstreet butcher is a bad idea, and that you can't tell the difference between a human trial, and just injecting some cells stripped from some foetus. You've still yet to bring up any evidence of actual scientific human trials yet. In truth, I've really not heard of any, so if you could stop being a dick and supply that evidence, that would be great, cheers.

Marie Currie got cancer from her experiments with Radiation. So your argument is that Radiation, like X-Rays and Cancer Radiation Therapy are proven to have no worth? Well done!

Don't let your humiliation and lies linger.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:46 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Naww......I didn't think you were man enough to apologize, even after getting humiliated.

Thanks for at least proving me right on that account!





It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 9:50 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Naww......I didn't think you were man enough to apologize, even after getting humiliated.

Thanks for at least proving me right on that account!



That's what I thought, you've got nothing, and even though you've been proven wrong, you still demand an apology from other people, hoping no one will notice how wrong you are.

You've got no case, as usual you prove yourself a desperate liar.





More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 10:21 AM

ELVISCHRIST


Quote:

Posted by AuRaptor:


*edit - making AuRaptor look like a complete jack ass, as well as a liar AND a moron simply isn't any fun any more. It's just too damn easy to do, and wastes too much of my valuable time.



Fixed.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 10:30 AM

ELVISCHRIST


Quote:



Where's the retraction that no ESC research has been done because of W's ban on Federal Funding ? Where's the admission that I was right, and you were wrong, concerning the issue of tumors and ESC trials , which were started YEARS ago, and aren't now just getting underway. As you knowingly LIED about.



Well, technically he didn't "lie" if he didn't have knowledge of such events. I know you yourself have said that many, many times.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 10:33 AM

ELVISCHRIST


Quote:


Naww......I didn't think you were man enough to apologize, even after getting humiliated.



Are you? I've seen you get humiliated several times, yet I've yet to see you ever issue an apology over it. It's okay, I'll wait.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 3:33 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


"Meanwhile, adult stem cells have yielded all manner of treatments."

Yes with all research funded by federal grant money. So, Rap, the Wonder Dog, name me which companies did the research on adult embryonic stem cells.

C'mon boy ! Sit ! I saaaaiiid SIT !! Now roll over !

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Saturday, March 7, 2009 3:43 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Bernadine Healy: "Appointed in 1991 by President George H. W. Bush to be the first female head of the institutes. ... Healy was a Republican candidate for the U.S. Senate in 1994." Considering what actual researchers said: "The authors discuss the extremely rare nature of this side effect and speculate that the patient's underlying condition may itself have allowed the tumor to become established ... Although this report indicates the need for caution in stem cell therapy, the authors conclude that their findings "do not imply that the research in stem cell therapeutics should be abandoned."

Weird how Healy takes a single instance of an (apparently) unauthorized medical 'treatment', and uses it to reach a scientifically invalid 'conclusion'. Think she's got a conservative political agenda ?



I did some checking on embryonic stem cells and cancer or tumors done by real researchers doing real research. I found nothing, nada, and also, zip.

Why, if it was such an awful problem it should be all over the place, right Rap, the Wonder Dog ?

C'mon boy ! Paw once if yes, twice if no ! C'mon by ! You can do it !
***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 12:19 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by rue:
I did some checking on embryonic stem cells and cancer or tumors done by real researchers doing real research. I found nothing, nada, and also, zip.

Why, if it was such an awful problem it should be all over the place, right Rap, the Wonder Dog ?

C'mon boy ! Paw once if yes, twice if no ! C'mon by ! You can do it !


Yeah, that's what I was saying. The kid went to Moscow, which being Moscow either has no medical laws to speak of, or he was treated by the Russian Mafia, and all they did is rip some cells off of an embryo, and inject them into him. I mean that's hardly a medical trail in anyones vernacular. That's like saying "well me and some buds sawed this guys leg off once, and he died, pretty much proves that Amputations have no medical application huh!"

So again, I say: there's been no human trials of embryonic stem cells.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 10:16 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


But Rue & Cit, didn't you see where AuLapdog already declared himself the winner at the internet? He's claimed victory, so anything which contradicts his RapFacts™ at this point merely makes you look desperate, don'tcha know?






Mike

I can't run no more
with that lawless crowd
while the killers in high places
say their prayers out loud.
But they've summoned, they've summoned up
a thundercloud
and they're going to hear from me.

- Anthem, by Leonard Cohen

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 10:20 AM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
But Rue & Cit, didn't you see where AuLapdog already declared himself the winner at the internet? He's claimed victory, so anything which contradicts his RapFacts™ at this point merely makes you look desperate, don'tcha know?



Indeed! How silly of me. I stand properly chastised, after losing the interwebs.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 9:20 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
More waste of Federal $$'s, first and foremost. Added to the fact that

A) There's no ban on PRIVATE $$ that can be used for such studies

B) There's no ban of STATE $$ for the same

and

C) Adult stem cells are by far the more proven , effective, safe and reliable source for treatments and cures.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.


Who is the retard that changed the thread title again? Can he please go back to 3rd grade and leave this to the grownups?

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 9:45 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Now your parrot act kicks in. Predictable.

I debunk your claims on embryonic stem cell research, the tumors caused ( WHEN ? ) in trials which started YEARS ago, despite your silly claim that they're just NOW getting under way.

I provide for you a link, to a story containing info from a peer reviewed web site, the Public Library of Science.

Funny, that even in England, you'd refer to the USFDA as the be all , end all to things and studies related to embryonic stem cells. MY GOD, you're such a sheep, and it's not even YOUR bureaucracy!!!

And the BEST you can come up with is ignore the details, parrot your old, disproved and outlandishly pathetic insults, because you're not MAN enough to deal w/ having your hat handed to you, even over the internet.

In the whole human history of adversarial engagements, there's never been such a one sided affair as the way I've trounced you here.

Congrats. You're less than road kill.



It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.


Golly. AuRap, Jongstraw, and Kirkules have been mopping the floor, and cleaning the toilet with you guys, all week long and throughout the RWED territories. I have no idea how they've found the time to joust with all you twits, but it has been entertaining and heartening.
Kudos.

The point was perhaps missed, when somebody pointed out how much a failure Embryonic was versus Adult, that the FAILED route is the one the Democrats and other liberals must decree - never the successful option.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 11:15 PM

CITIZEN


Quote:

Originally posted by jewelstaitefan:

Golly. AuRap, Jongstraw, and Kirkules have been mopping the floor, and cleaning the toilet with you guys, all week long and throughout the RWED territories. I have no idea how they've found the time to joust with all you twits, but it has been entertaining and heartening.
Kudos.

The point was perhaps missed, when somebody pointed out how much a failure Embryonic was versus Adult, that the FAILED route is the one the Democrats and other liberals must decree - never the successful option.



You can tell 'Raps lost when his idiot sock puppet comes out to declare him the winner!



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

NOTIFY: Y   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 11:36 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by ElvisChrist:
Quote:


Naww......I didn't think you were man enough to apologize, even after getting humiliated.



Are you? I've seen you get humiliated several times, yet I've yet to see you ever issue an apology over it. It's okay, I'll wait.



The few times I've made errors, I've owned up to them. But never have I been so far off as citizen here. He asked for evidence, I gave it. He asked for a link , I gave it. On the very core of the issue, and not some trivial side issue of grammar or context, citizen has stepped into it, up to his shoulders. And refuses to acknowledge the error of his ways.




It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

Sunday, March 8, 2009 11:44 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:

You can tell 'Raps lost when his idiot sock puppet comes out to declare him the winner!




And that differs greatly when your 'droids come out and take YOUR side.... how ?






It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

A concern of the GOP is that the people aren't informed enough to understand their policies, while a fear of the Dems is that the people ARE.

NOTIFY: N   |  REPLY  |  REPLY WITH QUOTE  |  TOP  |  HOME  

YOUR OPTIONS

NEW POSTS TODAY

USERPOST DATE

OTHER TOPICS

DISCUSSIONS
Well... He was no longer useful to the DNC or the Ukraine Money Laundering Scheme... So justice was served
Thu, March 28, 2024 12:44 - 1 posts
In the garden, and RAIN!!! (2)
Thu, March 28, 2024 11:50 - 3410 posts
Elections; 2024
Thu, March 28, 2024 11:18 - 2071 posts
BUILD BACK BETTER!
Thu, March 28, 2024 11:16 - 6 posts
Salon: NBC's Ronna blunder: A failed attempt to appeal to MAGA voters — except they hate her too
Thu, March 28, 2024 07:04 - 1 posts
Russia Invades Ukraine. Again
Thu, March 28, 2024 05:27 - 6154 posts
Russian losses in Ukraine
Wed, March 27, 2024 23:21 - 987 posts
human actions, global climate change, global human solutions
Wed, March 27, 2024 15:03 - 824 posts
NBC News: Behind the scenes, Biden has grown angry and anxious about re-election effort
Wed, March 27, 2024 14:58 - 2 posts
RFK Jr. Destroys His Candidacy With VP Pick?
Wed, March 27, 2024 11:59 - 16 posts
Russia says 60 dead, 145 injured in concert hall raid; Islamic State group claims responsibility
Wed, March 27, 2024 10:57 - 49 posts
Ha. Haha! HAHA! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!!!!
Tue, March 26, 2024 21:26 - 1 posts

FFF.NET SOCIAL