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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
Palin resigning as Alaska governor
Thursday, July 9, 2009 7:51 AM
KWICKO
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)
Quote: I mean, didn't John Edwards risk everything to run for VP? He didn't run TWO campaigns to try and keep his then-current Senate seat, in hopes of becoming Vice President. If he HADN'T run for VP he surely would have campaigned to keep his Senate seat.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 7:56 AM
RIPWASH
Quote:Originally posted by rue: "You CAN'T be serious? YOU!?!? NON-PARTISAN!?!?!?" I've gone out of my way to criticize Obama and Clinton (both of them). When have you ever criticized --- oh, let's take Palin as an example ? Or McCain ? *************************************************************** Silence is consent.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 8:13 AM
RUE
I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!
Thursday, July 9, 2009 8:45 AM
Quote: And I don't recall seeing you saying anything against Obama in that time, so you'll have to forgive me for saying what I said, or point me to a thread where you did opine negatively toward Obama.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 9:19 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Okay, just so we're clear here, Rip... You HAVE seen me go off on Obama, right? I mean, I'm pretty damned sure I'm fairly partisan, in that I definitely support one party over the other (while fervently wishing for a third to take over at least one of our current crop...). That said, I'm a Democrat in the sense that Will Rogers was a Democrat. He's the one who famously said, "I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat."
Quote:Where I'm *NOT* "partisan" is in the "no-criticism-of-my-party-or-candidates" sense. I think the Democrats are dead wrong on most gun rights issues. I think Pelosi and Reid are absolutely the wrong people to head up the Democratic majorities in Congress. And I *KNOW* Obama is hugely wrong on torture and warrantless wiretaps, to name just two. I have a sense that he's really dragging his feet and about to screw up majorly on health care and gay rights, too. Unfortunately, nobody here can name me one single Republican candidate that was going to do a single thing on any of these issues better than Obama has. I didn't vote for him because he's perfect, but because he was the choice I was given.
Quote:Oh, and back on a purely partisan note... When can we on the left start referring to Sarah Palin as your "messiah" or "the one" or the second coming or the anointed? I mean, isn't that what the right is viewing her as?
Thursday, July 9, 2009 9:40 AM
Thursday, July 9, 2009 9:49 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Just for comic relief... Mark McKinnon, former policy advisor and media consultant to President George W. Bush and to Republican presidential candidate and Senator John McCain, in an interview on The Rachel Maddow Show on MSNBC, referred to Sarah Palin as "crazier than an acre of snakes". I laughed chocolate milk out my nose when he said it. I'd never heard it put quite that way before, but it damned well fits. Mike Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day... Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 9:50 AM
SIGNYM
I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 10:04 AM
Quote:Originally posted by SignyM: If DEMS do half as much - as Clinton and Edwards did- they're out on a rail
Thursday, July 9, 2009 10:51 AM
Quote:Okay MAYBE Reagan, but I cared not one whit about politics back then so can't speak intelligently to that.
Quote: Obama got that nickname from the "right" because of the way he presented himself and the way others perceived him to be - the solution to all of life's problems.
Quote:Why else would he have said right before the election (paraphrasing here), "Hey! I better reign up on the rhetoric because there's no possible way I can actually do everything I'm promising." Did he ACTUALLY say that? Not quite, thus the paraphrasing, but he said something quite similar.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 10:57 AM
Thursday, July 9, 2009 10:58 AM
Quote:Posted by RIPWash: My turn to say . . . HUH? Clinton was run out on a rail to be left in the political wilderness? Really? I recall him being rallied around, Democrats standing on the steps of Congress in protest to the vote to impeach him.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 11:17 AM
Quote:Originally posted by rue: As I recall, 'Clinton the other' was the Dem shoe-in candidate --- and Obama was the dark horse who came in at the nomination wire out of nowhere. Obama fought, and fought hard against that subterranean prejudice no one talks about anymore, to be the first BLACK president of the US. That he won has as much to say about the mismanagement of the McCain campaign as anything else. I don't recall any anointing at any time. *************************************************************** Just a little dose of recent history to set the record straight.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 11:56 AM
Thursday, July 9, 2009 12:00 PM
Thursday, July 9, 2009 12:15 PM
Quote: “I said before, I always planned on serving and working hard - working harder than I ever worked — and I’m going to continue to do that,” the senator said.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 1:08 PM
Thursday, July 9, 2009 2:52 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote:Posted by RIPWash: My turn to say . . . HUH? Clinton was run out on a rail to be left in the political wilderness? Really? I recall him being rallied around, Democrats standing on the steps of Congress in protest to the vote to impeach him. So do you think Sanford should be impeached? I know you think he should "go away" - but do you think he should be IMPEACHED? How about John Ensign? He called for Clinton's impeachment, said if he were ever to find himself in such a situation, he hoped he'd have the courage to do the right thing and resign - and then not only slept with the wife of a staffer, but even went so far as to put their 19-year-old son on the payroll as a "policy expert" (what policy was he an expert on at 19?), AND to double her salary AT TWO DIFFERENT POSITIONS WITH TWO DIFFERENT EMPLOYERS that he oversaw - positions and salaries that ended when he stopped banging her, it should be mentioned. Should HE be impeached? I know you wish they'd go away; I know you hope they'd have the decency to stand by their words and convictions (Sanford was a freshman Congressman at the time of the Lewinsky scandal, and he also called for Clinton's impeachment). What I want to know is, if they won't just go away - and clearly they won't - SHOULD THEY BE IMPEACHED? If so, why? If not, why not? Mike Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day... Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 2:59 PM
Quote:Anyway, off the topic of republicans who don't know the difference between doing the right thing and pretending to be righteous, and back to Palin ... oops - that's where we came in.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 3:07 PM
Quote:Originally posted by rue: As I recall, 'Clinton the other' was the Dem shoe-in candidate --- and Obama was the dark horse who came in at the nomination wire out of nowhere. In the presidential campaign Obama fought, and fought hard, against that subterranean prejudice no one talks about anymore, to be the first BLACK president of the US. That he won has as much to say about the mismanagement of the McCain campaign as anything else. I don't recall any time when he was a foregone conclusion. I don't recall any anointing at any time. *************************************************************** Just a little dose of recent history to set the record straight.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 4:36 PM
Quote: If Sanford and Ensign lied under oath at some point, yes, they should be impeached. But as they have shown bad judgment (especially Sanford, leaving and not telling anyone where he was going - SHEESH! what a maroon!), then they need to step down.
Thursday, July 9, 2009 5:25 PM
GINOBIFFARONI
Quote:Originally posted by SignyM: Quote:Anyway, off the topic of republicans who don't know the difference between doing the right thing and pretending to be righteous, and back to Palin ... oops - that's where we came in. 'zactly.
Friday, July 10, 2009 12:57 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote: If Sanford and Ensign lied under oath at some point, yes, they should be impeached. But as they have shown bad judgment (especially Sanford, leaving and not telling anyone where he was going - SHEESH! what a maroon!), then they need to step down. Well, according to Sanford's past statements, "lied under a different oath - the oath to his wife." At least that's what he said when it was someone who wasn't him doing the cheating... It's going to be interesting to see if Sanford and Ensign did indeed break the law by paying mistresses and their families, by traveling to far-off countries on the taxpayers' dime to commit adultery, etc. And if it turns out that they HAVE broken the law, it's going to be interesting to see who turns out to support them. In retrospect, I suppose Bill Clinton's biggest mistake was either (a) agreeing to be deposed under oath, or (b) not having a sudden attack of amnesia. The former seemed to work out pretty well for Dubya ("I won't testify under oath, and you can't even take notes about what I say.") and Cheney, and the latter has worked for everyone from "Fredo" Gonzalez to Tricky Dick Nixon to Ronald Reagan. If you won't go under oath, or if you just say "I don't recall", no one can pin anything on you! Mike Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day... Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
Friday, July 10, 2009 2:38 AM
HERO
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: See, in politics - and Senator McCain, will back me up on this, I'm sure, as will former President Bush - you keep your day job while running for higher office, and if you win that higher office, THEN you leave your day job.
Friday, July 10, 2009 4:16 AM
DEADLOCKVICTIM
Quote:Originally posted by rue: Anyway, off the topic of republicans who don't know the difference between doing the right thing and pretending to be righteous.....]
Friday, July 10, 2009 5:06 AM
PIRATECAT
Friday, July 10, 2009 5:25 AM
Quote:...and she's already booked to make appearances in Texas supporting the Republicans.
Friday, July 10, 2009 5:27 AM
Quote:Originally posted by PirateCat: Romney is gonna be the man. Palin doesn't have a chance. You have to have an insider. It's Harvard vs Yale. There ya go.
Friday, July 10, 2009 8:10 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote:Originally posted by PirateCat: Romney is gonna be the man. Palin doesn't have a chance. You have to have an insider. It's Harvard vs Yale. There ya go. You mean Brigham Young University vs. Wasila School of Cosmetology and Pageant-Walkin'?
Friday, July 10, 2009 8:45 AM
FREMDFIRMA
Quote:Originally posted by PirateCat: Romney is gonna be the man.
Saturday, July 11, 2009 3:42 AM
Saturday, July 11, 2009 11:15 AM
GRIPPER
Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:02 PM
Saturday, July 11, 2009 2:31 PM
WASHNWEAR
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote: Also, it's being reported that he paid the woman $25,000 in "severance" after the screwing stopped and the affair ended. Sources are saying this may be a felony violation of campaign funding laws.
Quote: Also, it's being reported that he paid the woman $25,000 in "severance" after the screwing stopped and the affair ended. Sources are saying this may be a felony violation of campaign funding laws.
Saturday, July 11, 2009 4:47 PM
Saturday, July 11, 2009 10:17 PM
Quote:Once again Romney's religon is an issue.
Monday, July 13, 2009 1:59 AM
Quote:Originally posted by gripper: You are known by the quality of your enemies....considering all the various folks that hav elined up for a cheap shot at Palin;I'd say she is good people.
Monday, July 13, 2009 2:14 AM
BIGDAMNNOBODY
Quote:Originally posted by rue: along with your typing, spelling and grammar, which make you seem like exactly like the ignorant redneck hick that is reported to be Palin's exact source of support.
Monday, July 13, 2009 4:14 AM
Quote:Originally posted by rue: ...along with your typing, spelling and grammar...
Monday, July 13, 2009 4:46 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Hero: Thats why liberals hate Palin.
Quote: They can't fight her on the issues, so they fight her on how she talks, how she dresses, what her family is doing, etc...all the things that would not matter if she was a liberal.
Quote: You could say something brillent and world changing...but if its a conservative idea, then you'd better spell it right and use the correct grammer.
Quote: [sarcasm]Thanks for that. Good to see you come out of hiding with another substantive missive. Your fact based, non-generalizing, and ad hominem free posts are surely missed around these parts.[/sarcasm]
Monday, July 13, 2009 4:57 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: ...you CAN'T say something brilliant and world-changing AND have it be a conservative idea.
Monday, July 13, 2009 5:48 AM
Monday, July 13, 2009 6:28 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Was there supposed to be something new or brilliant in that mindless doublespeak?
Monday, July 13, 2009 6:33 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Hero: Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Was there supposed to be something new or brilliant in that mindless doublespeak? We were in a period of decline, people were really demoralized. He lifted their spirits and gave them the economic tools to create the longest period of sustained growth in American history and along the way he kicked a little Soviet and terrorist ass. H "Hero. I have come to respect you"- Chrisisall, 2009.
Monday, July 13, 2009 7:20 AM
Quote: It is no coincidence that our present troubles parallel and are proportionate to the intervention and intrusion in our lives that result from unnecessary and excessive growth of government.
Quote: It is time for us to realize that we're too great a nation to limit ourselves to small dreams. We're not, as some would have us believe, doomed to an inevitable decline.
Quote: I do not believe in a fate that will fall on us no matter what we do. I do believe in a fate that will fall on us if we do nothing. So, with all the creative energy at our command, let us begin an era of national renewal.
Quote: Let us renew our determination, our courage, and our strength. And let us renew our faith and our hope.
Quote: We have every right to dream heroic dreams. Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look. You can see heroes every day going in and out of factory gates.
Quote: Others, a handful in number, produce enough food to feed all of us and then the world beyond.
Quote: You meet heroes across a counter, and they're on both sides of that counter. There are entrepreneurs with faith in themselves and faith in an idea who create new jobs, new wealth and opportunity. They're individuals and families whose taxes support the government and whose voluntary gifts support church, charity, culture, art, and education. Their patriotism is quiet, but deep. Their values sustain our national life.
Monday, July 13, 2009 7:53 AM
Monday, July 13, 2009 7:59 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Because, y'know, there's nothing more American than an entrepenuer with a dream - unless it's a corporation with a dream of crushing that small business!
Monday, July 13, 2009 9:32 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Oh, and by the way, BigDamnKnob-Buddy...
Monday, July 13, 2009 11:14 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: From Ronald Reagan's first inaugural address: Quote: It is no coincidence that our present troubles parallel and are proportionate to the intervention and intrusion in our lives that result from unnecessary and excessive growth of government. No coincidence? There was also no evidence to suppport this claim. It's one of those truisms - it SOUNDS good, so it must be true. Rarely is that the case, however...
Quote: Quote: It is time for us to realize that we're too great a nation to limit ourselves to small dreams. We're not, as some would have us believe, doomed to an inevitable decline. Again, flowery language without the merest scintilla of substance. Can you imagine the outrage on the right if someone with a name like Barack Obama were to utter such a thing today?
Quote: Quote: I do not believe in a fate that will fall on us no matter what we do. I do believe in a fate that will fall on us if we do nothing. So, with all the creative energy at our command, let us begin an era of national renewal. So in other words, it doesn't matter what you do, as long as you do SOMETHING! Unless, of course, your name is Jimmy Carter - then it only matters what you do, because whatever you do is wrong, based only on who you are. What is an "era of national renewal", anyway? That sounds like New-Deal-style liberalism to me! Reagan was a socialist!
Quote: Quote: Let us renew our determination, our courage, and our strength. And let us renew our faith and our hope. Oh, NOES! He used the "hope" word! And after extolling us to do something, anything, now he says all we need to "do" is renew our faith? That sounds an awful lot like doing nothing. Try this next time there's a tornado bearing down on your house: Pray. Don't run, don't go inside, don't seek shelter, just pray. Renew your faith, and see how that works out for ya. Be sure to try it with a hurricane, too. What's the worst that could happen?
Quote: Quote: We have every right to dream heroic dreams.
Quote: We have every right to dream heroic dreams.
Quote: Those who say that we're in a time when there are no heroes, they just don't know where to look. You can see heroes every day going in and out of factory gates.
Quote: Quote: Others, a handful in number, produce enough food to feed all of us and then the world beyond. But not for long. Before his second term was over, Reagan would have overseen the dismantling of the family farm in favor of giant corporate farm-factories. But I'm sure he admired their heroism in fighting for a doomed idea that he himself was determined to crush.
Quote: Quote: You meet heroes across a counter, and they're on both sides of that counter. There are entrepreneurs with faith in themselves and faith in an idea who create new jobs, new wealth and opportunity. They're individuals and families whose taxes support the government and whose voluntary gifts support church, charity, culture, art, and education. Their patriotism is quiet, but deep. Their values sustain our national life. And apparently they're the reason we have to give corporations more welfare and bailouts, and fuck the little people, because while Republicans love to claim that the little people are the real heroes in America, they've never once actually stood up for those people. Instead, they consistently and constantly stand in the way of the little guy, and firmly on the side of Big Business. Because, y'know, there's nothing more American than an entrepenuer with a dream - unless it's a corporation with a dream of crushing that small business!
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