REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Out2Lunch Backs Down, Admits the 'Birfers' are Complete Nutjobs!

POSTED BY: HERO
UPDATED: Friday, August 7, 2009 18:45
SHORT URL:
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Monday, July 27, 2009 4:36 AM

BYTEMITE


Kwicko doesn't like Obama, out2theblack. He's just stirring the mud puddle, like he usually does.

I don't know about SignyM and Rue, but I think their argument isn't based on that they think Obama is infallible, but rather that they think the birth certificate thing has been proven enough. Although you all say there's bad blood between you, so I'm just going to try to stay out.

Anyway. There are shortcomings to democracy, I'll admit, because the rule of the majority is not necessarily a good thing. But to say that a Republic amends that? I'll have to disagree. I think a Republic puts the power into the hands of a select few that only say they're representing the greatest good, when really they're serving their own ends and twisted ideas of how to make the world better.

Basically, I have more faith in my fellow man than do a lot of people, least of which our country's founding fathers. I have faith that The People are willing to negotiate to workable solutions, when our representatives surely aren't.

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Monday, July 27, 2009 5:11 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


O2B: You wouldn't know reasoned debate if it gave you a blow job. The biggest weapon in your "reasoned debate" armamentarium seems to be name-calling, and the second seems to be putting words in people's mouths. If you think "shouting down the small voices of dissent" means bringing up facts (Obama has a birth certificate from the state of Hawaii, there was a birth announcement on the newspaper at the time) and logic (This would place the beginning of your "conspiracy" all the way back to Obama's BIRTH. Like they knew he was going to be President some day...?) then those "small voices of dissent" must be awfully fragile, easily blown away by the winds of logic.

So, Small Voice of Dissent: WHO did I try to get banned? Name names. Point to the post. Back up your statement with a fact.

Because, for the record, I have NEVER tried to get anybody "banned".

Where have I expressed unwavering support of Obama? Am I not decrying the corporate/ bank bailout on an almost weekly basis? Have I not criticized him for supporting the telecoms immunity from prosecution, keeping Abu Ghraib photos secret, furthering the use of signing statements, claiming "state secrets" privilege, and proposing indefinite preventive detention?

Because, for the record I am NOT an Obama fan.

You hardly respond on-point to a dissenting opinion. If anyone is trying to shout down anyone, it's you, my friend, with your dishonest, self-pitying posts.

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Monday, July 27, 2009 5:56 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


O2B... what, no refutation?


Well, I know that won't prevent you from coming up with the same old crap very soon. I just wanted to make a point about your dishonesty. And you made it for me.

Thanks!

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:03 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Out2Lunch wrote:

Sort of like , here in RWED , the tyranny of sickynym-ruetard-squicko attempting to shout down the small voices of dissent , and seeking to have folk with which thay disagree 'banned' , allowed no voice at all...




Cites, please? Show me where I sought to have ANYONE banned, or admit you're lying.

Quote:



Their kind are those who want to refute the so-called 'birthers' by screaming 'birth certificate !' , which is actually the same tactic they employed at the outset , with little in the way of facts being brought to the fore by their side subsequently...



Let me put frame this in an argument YOU can understand, because this is EXACTLY what you've been doing for six months or more:

Your kind are those who want to refute the President by screaming "birth certificate!", which is actually the same tactic you've employed from the outset, with nothing at all in the way of facts being brought to the fore by your side.

Quote:


Their faith in the obamessiah is not easily undone...Apparently , they believe all should heil the all-mitey-obamessiah...



MY "faith" in Obama (I have no idea who "the obamessiah" is supposed to be; I know only that there is a President of the United States named Barack Obama) is EXACTLY as strong as your grovelling worshipfulness of George W. Bush. Think about that for a while.


Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:14 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Kwicko doesn't like Obama, out2theblack. He's just stirring the mud puddle, like he usually does.



You're close to correct, Bytemite. I voted for Obama, volunteered for him, donated money to his campaign, and did so gladly, hoping he would live up to his campaign promises.

While I don't hate the man, I AM deeply disappointed with him on several key issues, because he ran on the left, and the day he took office, he steered sharply to the middle, where he's stayed ever since. I wanted a progressive, and I got "Bush Lite". Whether I vote for the man again in 2012 is entirely up to him, but it's not likely at all that I'll work for him or give money again.

He was never my "messiah" because, simply put (and this is the part that Out2Lunch simply can't pound through his fucking skull with a 12-pound sledgehammer), I'm an atheist, and a devout one. I *HAVE* no "messiah" because I don't believe in such things. I voted for a man, because I thought he was the better man of the choices I was given. And had Hillary won the nomination, I'd have voted for her. Had Ron Paul won the Republican nomination, there's every chance I'd have voted for HIM. None of those people are gods by any stretch of the imagination. I "worship" Obama in EXACTLY the same way that Out2Lunch "worships" George W. Bush, as I said before.

Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:18 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by SignyM:
O2B... what, no refutation?

Thanks!



You are welcome , StickyNymph !

You amaze me , you really do...

Like , how do you type with your mouth so full ,
Ms. Reasoned Debate ?

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:24 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Sort of like , here in RWED , the tyranny of sickynym-ruetard-squicko attempting to shout down the small voices of dissent , and seeking to have folk with which thay disagree 'banned' , allowed no voice at all...





MY "faith" in Obama (I have no idea who "the obamessiah" is supposed to be; I know only that there is a President of the United States named Barack Obama) is EXACTLY as strong as your grovelling worshipfulness of George W. Bush. Think about that for a while.




Grovelling worshipfulness of Dubya ?

You must be mad...

Surely you are confusing me with someone else...

Or , you are just confused...Might try not using that 12-pound sledge hammer on your head any more...It's not helping you...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:32 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
Grovelling worshipfulness of Dubya ?

You must be mad...

Surely you are confusing me with someone else...

Or , you are just confused...Might try not using that 12-pound sledge hammer on your head any more...It's not helping you...




Wow, are YOU an idiot. I was illustrating that I worship Obama exactly as much as you worship Dubya. You claim you don't, which is rather the point. Neither do I.

I'm really sorry you're too fucking stupid to figure that out. Really.

Guess maybe you shouldn't read with your mouth full, eh?

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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:36 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
Kwicko doesn't like Obama, out2theblack. He's just stirring the mud puddle, like he usually does.

I don't know about SignyM and Rue, but I think their argument isn't based on that they think Obama is infallible, but rather that they think the birth certificate thing has been proven enough.

Basically, I have more faith in my fellow man than do a lot of people, least of which our country's founding fathers. I have faith that The People are willing to negotiate to workable solutions, when our representatives surely aren't.



Well , he liked him enough to campaign for him , give him money , and VOTE for him...

Then , he turns around and claims he doesn't have any 'faith' in him...

That's comical...Actually , it's hysterical !

You say Squicko is just stirring the mud puddle...Like he usually does !

I think you've got quite a point , there...

Sometimes , the more something is stirred , the more it stinks...

If Squick doesn't like that , he might want to rethink his Alliance-s and take a different approach...

Back to topic :

pResident wanting to be able to throw a switch and suppress free speech :

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2009/04/should-obama-control-inter
net


'...The bill does not only add to the power of the president. It also grants the Secretary of Commerce "access to all relevant data concerning [critical] networks without regard to any provision of law, regulation, rule, or policy restricting such access." This means he or she can monitor or access any data on private or public networks without regard to privacy laws...

Meanwhile , the pResident's 'fight the smears' website has largely gone down the 'memory hole' :

Obama’s “Fight the Smears” Disappears & Keyes v. Obama Eligibility Case to be Heard on Merits

http://ironicsurrealism.blogivists.com/2009/07/13/obamas-fight-the-sme
ars-disappears-obama-eligibility-case-will-be-heard-on-merits
/




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Monday, July 27, 2009 8:48 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:

Guess maybe you shouldn't read with your mouth full, eh?



Yes , because you're so danged funny , I keep spewing lunch all over the monitor !

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Monday, July 27, 2009 9:28 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


It's sad really - to see such an idiot showing all the world what an ass he is, for everyone to see.

Some people (OTB, this means you) have no sense of shame.

***************************************************************

But, to get to the topic at hand - really, WHY are you still here ? WHY are you letting a few dollars and a little bit of your time stand in the way of getting that real PROOF that Obama was born wherever you think he was born ?

You really should be pursuing the truth with everything you've got ! Not in some half-assed whiny I-can't-find-the-YouTube-link-on-the-internet sort of way.

THIS is your life's work, man ! Go for it !

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Monday, July 27, 2009 9:38 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by SignyM:
O2B: You wouldn't know reasoned debate if it gave you a blow job. The biggest weapon in your "reasoned debate" armamentarium seems to be name-calling, and the second seems to be putting words in people's mouths...

...You hardly respond on-point to a dissenting opinion. If anyone is trying to shout down anyone, it's you, my friend, with your dishonest, self-pitying posts.



Those ain't exactly my *words* going in your mouth...

I ain't feeling any self-pity at all , these days...

Your desperation is showing , and I REALLY like that...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 10:19 AM

OUT2THEBLACK




'...The several states are lining up to reclaim their sovereignty and telling the federal government to butt out. This is being done in myriad ways but all are related in that most claim that the Tenth Amendment protects the states from federal tyranny. States are passing resolutions, memorials and two states have passed laws and they intend to apply those laws for their citizens. The two states are Montana and Tennessee.'
http://restoretherepublic.com/category/latest-news



'...The United States has gradually degenerated from a Republic based on individual liberties to a socialized oligarchy run by an exclusive few. The country was founded upon the platform of individual rights.-

We declared our independence from Great Britain because of excessive regulation and taxation. Americans fought for the right to live their lives free from the subjugation of an overbearing governmental body. The Founding Fathers declared our independence with these immortal words:

-We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

Since the administration of Franklin Delano Roosevelt, the United States has gone from taking personal responsibility for our own lives to dependence on government to make all decisions in our lives. There are 306 million Americans and we have defaulted on our responsibility for governing this nation to 535 corrupt politicians, 10 "too big to fail" banks, a secretive Central Bank, 17,000 corporate lobbyists, and thousands of government bureaucrats. Essentially 306 million citizens are managed by a few thousand elitist rulers. George Orwell's classic novel Animal Farm was inspired by the a scene he witnessed:

"I saw a little boy, perhaps ten years old, driving a huge carthorse along a narrow path, whipping it whenever it tried to turn. It struck me that if only such animals became aware of their strength we should have no power over them, and that men exploit animals in much the same way as the rich exploit the proletariat." '

http://www.opednews.com/articles/ANIMAL-FARM--2009-by-Jim-Quinn-090725
-660.html


http://ironicsurrealism.blogivists.com/2009/07/13/obamas-fight-the-sme
ars-disappears-obama-eligibility-case-will-be-heard-on-merits


http://rs6.net/tn.jsp?et=1102654038655&s=15229&e=001tC8q-mmcjFK8oMoiYc
jlO7d56kmWDXykrQ4-AQTh_m0N8ZtiK26qIjBV1UVVm97bC79vzvGfdNwHKDAacAquZ6Ik78WVYPzHsyP1biTWe2e9EwTFUTFrjKnfALiq6slmhGP4orhpAOR3Imgx52t7RveXLZAtw_JncsFWKybkCU8
=

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Monday, July 27, 2009 10:57 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:

Guess maybe you shouldn't read with your mouth full, eh?



Yes , because you're so danged funny , I keep spewing lunch all over the monitor !



Try reading with your mouth closed. It'll help, I swear.

Breathe through your nose. I know you can do it!

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Monday, July 27, 2009 10:58 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:


Back to topic :

pResident wanting to be able to throw a switch and suppress free speech :

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2009/04/should-obama-control-inter
net


'...The bill does not only add to the power of the president. It also grants the Secretary of Commerce "access to all relevant data concerning [critical] networks without regard to any provision of law, regulation, rule, or policy restricting such access." This means he or she can monitor or access any data on private or public networks without regard to privacy laws...





Back to topic? How do you figure this tripe has anything to do with "the topic"?

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Monday, July 27, 2009 11:02 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
Your desperation is showing , and I REALLY like that...




Gotta say, Out2Lunch, the one who's looking truly desperate here is you.

And it sounds kind of creepy and gross, you saying that you REALLY like your women to be showing their desperation!

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Monday, July 27, 2009 11:20 AM

BYTEMITE


I love Orwell's books. 1984 is pretty much one of three dystopic books that built the foundations of how I view government.

I agree with everything you just said, and I ask, if you think our Republic has turned into an oligarchy, what do you think would stop a republic, newly rebuilt upon the ruins of this old one, from traveling down the same path?

This is what my problem is with a republic. I believe that the upwards concentration of power is inevitable, until finally you declare yourself an empire, and corruption lurks within every facet of your system.

>_> I don't like Republics. I think they are dishonest, and manipulative, and inevitably lead to corruption and downfall.

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Monday, July 27, 2009 12:20 PM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
...And it sounds kind of creepy and gross, you saying that you REALLY like your women to be showing their desperation!



StickyNymph isn't one of MY women...I'm actually not in that b'ness...

Folk do notice , though , that she sticks with you and the ruetard...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 12:25 PM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:


Back to topic :

pResident wanting to be able to throw a switch and suppress free speech :

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2009/04/should-obama-control-inter
net


'...The bill does not only add to the power of the president. It also grants the Secretary of Commerce "access to all relevant data concerning [critical] networks without regard to any provision of law, regulation, rule, or policy restricting such access." This means he or she can monitor or access any data on private or public networks without regard to privacy laws...





Back to topic? How do you figure this tripe has anything to do with "the topic"?



Good on you for calling a Lefty site 'tripe' , but plainly there's more than a little that you don't *get*...

Maybe you should bother reading the article , rather than going off 'half-cocked'. Again .

You and your man , ScamBO , plainly don't care for 'the rules'...

That's why you don't get or entertain grandiose notions , like 'Free Speech'...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 12:35 PM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Bytemite:
I love Orwell's books. 1984 is pretty much one of three dystopic books that built the foundations of how I view government.

I agree with everything you just said, and I ask, if you think our Republic has turned into an oligarchy, what do you think would stop a republic, newly rebuilt upon the ruins of this old one, from traveling down the same path?



The 'end of the world' , as we know it...

Quote:

This is what my problem is with a republic. I believe that the upwards concentration of power is inevitable, until finally you declare yourself an empire, and corruption lurks within every facet of your system.



Well , if not inevitable , then certainly likely...Ending 'corporate personhood', and lobbying by any entitities other than individuals , would be helpful...Ending 'usury' , except by community-owned banks , would kick the bricks from under the 'big boys'...Instituting a 50-year maximum life-cycle for all business endeavors and contracts would do a huge amount of good...Economies , and governments , are really all 'local' , so the instituting of Lawful Money with intrinsic value would help to end credit monopolies , AND the overarching Empires of Big Government and Big Business...

Quote:

>_> I don't like Republics. I think they are dishonest, and manipulative, and inevitably lead to corruption and downfall.


That leaves us exactly where we are...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 12:45 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
...And it sounds kind of creepy and gross, you saying that you REALLY like your women to be showing their desperation!



StickyNymph isn't one of MY women...I'm actually not in that b'ness...



Yeah, I didn't think she was that desperate. Sounds like you definitely ARE, though.

Quote:

Folk do notice , though , that she sticks with you and the ruetard...



Just as they notice that you stick with PirateNews...



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Monday, July 27, 2009 1:06 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Our local TN Army National Guard MP unit shipped out to Iraq this weekend, for the umpteenth time.

TV news failed to ask them about why didnt they just sue Obama to show his birth certificate, when the Pentagon cancels warzone orders. Even our own TN legislators sued Obama for his birth certificate.

Obama's 'birth certificate' not acceptable in Hawaii? Even state requires long-form document for some eligibility, identification issues...
www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=100451

Obama: Where have all his records gone? Footprints of president's own history either vanish or remain covered up, Hawaii destroyed his "original" birth certificate in 2001, family refuses to release their copy...
www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=100613

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Monday, July 27, 2009 1:08 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:

You and your man , ScamBO , plainly don't care for 'the rules'...




Wait - are you going to explain "the rules" to me again? I especially love the part where you try to explain to me what the "natural-born citizen" clause of the Constitution says, because that NEVER gets old, listening to you try to make claims that are plainly NOT in the Constitution.

Quote:


That's why you don't get or entertain grandiose notions , like 'Free Speech'...



So I'll ask again, since I see you're dodging the question I asked earlier:

Where and when did I try to restrict anyone's free speech? Where and when did I try to get anyone banned, as you claimed earlier? Show me the posts, show me the threads, or admit that you're lying (which you most definitely are) and making shit up out of pure desperation.

Show me where I tried to have anyone banned. Put up or shut up!

Seems you have a problem with free speech, at least when it comes to someone using it to shoot down your ridiculous claims, outright lies and utter bullshit.




Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Monday, July 27, 2009 1:10 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Ending 'usury' , except by community-owned banks...


Why do community-owned banks get a pass on usury?

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Monday, July 27, 2009 9:10 PM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Ex DC cop and Bohemian Grover Chris Matthews goes insane:

Quote:

VIDEO: "Manchurian Candidate Obama"
www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/#32177752

He includes the following for targeting and profiling:

People who believe that the Bilderberg Group impacts international policies

People who question the Federal Reserve's intentions

People who question the income tax

People who care about US borders

People who wonder why the government consistently attempts to circumvent the 2nd Amendment

People who believe that what happened on 9/11 is different than what the government has told us

People who voted for Ron Paul

People who question anything the government has told us over the past 100 years.


Continuous blinking is proof of lying.

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Monday, July 27, 2009 9:22 PM

CUDA77

Like woman, I am a mystery.


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:

You and your man , ScamBO , plainly don't care for 'the rules'...




Wait - are you going to explain "the rules" to me again? I especially love the part where you try to explain to me what the "natural-born citizen" clause of the Constitution says, because that NEVER gets old, listening to you try to make claims that are plainly NOT in the Constitution.

Quote:


That's why you don't get or entertain grandiose notions , like 'Free Speech'...



So I'll ask again, since I see you're dodging the question I asked earlier:

Where and when did I try to restrict anyone's free speech? Where and when did I try to get anyone banned, as you claimed earlier? Show me the posts, show me the threads, or admit that you're lying (which you most definitely are) and making shit up out of pure desperation.

Show me where I tried to have anyone banned. Put up or shut up!

Seems you have a problem with free speech, at least when it comes to someone using it to shoot down your ridiculous claims, outright lies and utter bullshit.




Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

Clearly you don't get it. He's obviously expecting YOU to go and prove your innocence. The burden of proof is on YOU to prove that you have not tried to get him or anyone else banned. That's the way it works. O2TB makes some outrageous claim based on little to no credible evidence then refuses to see evidence to the contrary (see: truth) and merely continues to spout the original claim.

And see, I can prove this too. All my evidence is right here in this thread.


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Tuesday, July 28, 2009 3:25 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


O2B

So I said
Quote:

O2B: You wouldn't know reasoned debate if it gave you a blow job. The biggest weapon in your "reasoned debate" armamentarium seems to be name-calling, and the second seems to be putting words in people's mouths. If you think "shouting down the small voices of dissent" means bringing up facts (Obama has a birth certificate from the state of Hawaii, there was a birth announcement on the newspaper at the time) and logic (This would place the beginning of your "conspiracy" all the way back to Obama's BIRTH. Like they knew he was going to be President some day...?) then those "small voices of dissent" must be awfully fragile, easily blown away by the winds of logic.

So, Small Voice of Dissent: WHO did I try to get banned? Name names. Point to the post. Back up your statement with a fact.

Because, for the record, I have NEVER tried to get anybody "banned".

Where have I expressed unwavering support of Obama? Am I not decrying the corporate/ bank bailout on an almost weekly basis? Have I not criticized him for supporting the telecoms immunity from prosecution, keeping Abu Ghraib photos secret, furthering the use of signing statements, claiming "state secrets" privilege, and proposing indefinite preventive detention?

Because, for the record I am NOT an Obama fan.

You hardly respond on-point to a dissenting opinion. If anyone is trying to shout down anyone, it's you, my friend, with your dishonest, self-pitying posts.

O2B... what, no refutation? Well, I know that won't prevent you from coming up with the same old crap very soon. I just wanted to make a point about your dishonesty. And you made it for me. Thanks!

and you said
Quote:

Like , how do you type with your mouth so full , Ms. Reasoned Debate ?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!!

Do you EVER respond on-point?

Are you capable of responding on-point?

Piece of advice: If you find yourself in a hole, stop digging. M'kay?

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Tuesday, July 28, 2009 6:23 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Just to bring everyone up to speed, this is where we left off:

Quote:


Kwicko wrote:

So I'll ask again, since I see you're dodging the question I asked earlier:

Where and when did I try to restrict anyone's free speech? Where and when did I try to get anyone banned, as you claimed earlier? Show me the posts, show me the threads, or admit that you're lying (which you most definitely are) and making shit up out of pure desperation.

Show me where I tried to have anyone banned. Put up or shut up!




Whassamatta, Out2Lunch? No response? No "proof" of what you claim is true?

It's okay to admit you're a liar. It really won't come as a shock to anyone.




Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Tuesday, July 28, 2009 12:41 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


While Out2Lunch ponders his response and readies himself to admit that he's been lying, here's more news the "birthers" won't be able to accept:

Quote:



Hawaii again declares Obama birth certificate real
(AP)

By JAYMES SONG, Associated Press Writer – Tue Jul 28, 1:54 am ET

HONOLULU – State officials in Hawaii on Monday said they have once again checked and confirmed that President Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen, and therefore meets a key constitutional requirement for being president.
They hoped to stem a recent surge in the number of inquiries about Obama's birthplace.
"I ... have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen," Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said in a brief statement. "I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago."
So-called "birthers" — who claim Obama is ineligible to be president because, they argue, he was actually born outside the United States — have grown more vocal recently on blogs and television news shows.
Fukino issued a similar press release Oct. 31, but was prompted to speak out again because of the renewed attention on Obama's beginnings. Hawaii's Health Department has been flooded in recent weeks with questions from individuals and several national TV news networks asking for proof that Obama was indeed born in Hawaii.
"They just keep asking over and over and over again," Health Department spokeswoman Janice Okubo said.
The Constitution states that a person must be a "natural-born citizen" to be eligible for the presidency. Birthers contend that Obama's birth certificate is a fake, and many say he was actually born in Kenya, his father's homeland. They've challenged his citizenship in court.
One widely circulated YouTube clip of a town hall meeting showed a Republican congressman getting booed for saying Obama is a citizen. Talk show host Rush Limbaugh and CNN's Lou Dobbs have also raised the issue, and 10 Republican members of Congress co-sponsored a bill that would require future presidential candidates to provide a copy of their original birth certificate.
However, it appears Congress has moved on and has accepted Obama's island birthplace. The U.S. House on Monday unanimously approved a resolution recognizing and celebrating the 50th anniversary of Hawaii becoming the 50th state. A clause was included that reads: "Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961."
State law bars the release of a certified birth certificate to anyone who does not have a tangible interest.
However, Obama's birth certificate along with birth notices from the two Honolulu newspapers were brought forward even before he took office. But that's done nothing to shake the belief by many Obama critics that the president was born abroad.



Read the full story at

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090728/ap_on_re_us/us_obama_birth_certifi
cate




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Wednesday, July 29, 2009 7:09 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:

I am now of the opinion that the question needs to be settled, so it is my hope that soldiers will continue to challenge the President in such numbers until he produces the document.




So you're officially NOT in favor of the nation rallying behind the President? Seems to me that was one of the big issues with the righties under Bush - that whether you agreed with his post-9/11 stance or not, we should all rally behind the Commander In Chief. To do otherwise was to act in a way that was, and I quote, "un-American".

Why must you hate the troops so, "Hero"? Why do you not want them to get the needed reinforcements and replacements? Why are you calling for large-scale mutiny by soldiers against the Commander In Chief?

And by the way, I've never seen Dubya's birth certificate. Guess that means we were never legally in Afghanistan in the first place, eh? I mean, I *KNOW* we never had any legal basis for invading Iraq, so that's a no-brainer. But we need to immediately pull all our troops out of Afghanistan as well, since you can't prove that Bush was ever legally the President.



Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Wednesday, July 29, 2009 7:25 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


"Whassamatta, Out2Lunch? No response? No "proof" of what you claim is true?

It's okay to admit you're a liar. It really won't come as a shock to anyone."

Well, on a continuum of disordered thinking, there's PN, then Rap, then OutToLunch, with Rap and OTL pretty close on the scale. You may have noticed every now and then each can get even more - how shall I say it - incoherent- than usual. They spew the tangled mess that is their mind. It's interesting to me. So THAT'S what's been in there all this time.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Friday, July 31, 2009 3:36 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Just a quick bump in case Out2Lunch looks in over the weekend. It's been the better part of a week now, and he hasn't brought forth one shred of evidence that I - or ANYONE - has ever tried to have him banned from this site.

He did pop his pumpkin-sized head up in another thread on Wednesday, but when I brought up his lying and asked for his "proof", he ran away yet again.



Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:

Quote:


That's why you don't get or entertain grandiose notions , like 'Free Speech'...



So I'll ask again, since I see you're dodging the question I asked earlier:

Where and when did I try to restrict anyone's free speech? Where and when did I try to get anyone banned, as you claimed earlier? Show me the posts, show me the threads, or admit that you're lying (which you most definitely are) and making shit up out of pure desperation.

Show me where I tried to have anyone banned. Put up or shut up!

Seems you have a problem with free speech, at least when it comes to someone using it to shoot down your ridiculous claims, outright lies and utter bullshit.



Mike

Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.


If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college...

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 8:10 AM

BIGDAMNNOBODY


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Just a quick bump in case Out2Lunch looks in over the weekend. It's been the better part of a week now, and he hasn't brought forth one shred of evidence that I - or ANYONE - has ever tried to have him banned from this site.

He did pop his pumpkin-sized head up in another thread on Wednesday, but when I brought up his lying and asked for his "proof", he ran away yet again.


So, why is it so important to you?

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 8:33 AM

RIVERDANCER


Yeah, Kwicko, why is the truth so important to you? I mean, gawd!

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 9:59 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Just a quick bump in case Out2Lunch looks in over the weekend. It's been the better part of a week now, and he hasn't brought forth one shred of evidence that I - or ANYONE - has ever tried to have him banned from this site.

He did pop his pumpkin-sized head up in another thread on Wednesday, but when I brought up his lying and asked for his "proof", he ran away yet again.


So, why is it so important to you?



Since you brought it up again, why is it so important to YOU?




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Saturday, August 1, 2009 1:18 PM

BIGDAMNNOBODY


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Since you brought it up again, why is it so important to YOU?


It's not.
You don't see me hounding you about your media not affecting today's youth comment.
How about Rue leaving her non-surprise thread when a few Poster's disagreed with her premise with the links to back it up.
You still haven't apologized for calling me a racist. A complete lie which you tried stawmanning my argument with.
I was just curious, why the double standard? Why not let other's off the hook as has been done for you?

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 1:47 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

You still haven't apologized for calling me a racist. A complete lie which you tried stawmanning my argument with.




Quote:

You don't see me hounding you about your media not affecting today's youth comment.




No, instead I see you "hounding" me about you being called a racist. BTW, I *did* apologize for that. Twice. I told you I was sorry I mistook you for a racist, when clearly you're an authoritarian lapdog. Maybe you haven't gotten that far in the thread yet. I'll wait.

And by the way, why is it so important to you?

Quote:

I was just curious, why the double standard? Why not let other's off the hook as has been done for you?


I'm curious, too: why do YOU have a double standard? Why are you so willing to let "other's" off the hook, yet you keep following me from thread to thread hounding me...


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Saturday, August 1, 2009 2:15 PM

BIGDAMNNOBODY


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
No, instead I see you "hounding" me about you being called a racist. BTW, I *did* apologize for that. Twice. I told you I was sorry I mistook you for a racist, when clearly you're an authoritarian lapdog. Maybe you haven't gotten that far in the thread yet. I'll wait.


Thank-you.
This is the first time you apologized. Your other attempt in the thread was a poor excuse at deflecting.
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
And by the way, why is it so important to you?


Trying to keep you on your toes.
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
I'm curious, too: why do YOU have a double standard? Why are you so willing to let "other's" off the hook, yet you keep following me from thread to thread hounding me...


I don't quite know. Something about you just rubs me the wrong way, I guess.

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 4:20 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)




In other words, you've got nothing.

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 5:12 PM

BIGDAMNNOBODY


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
In other words, I've got nothing.


Fixed that for you. And yet you still post as if the one with the most post's wins or something.

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 5:46 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:

I've got nothing.



There, fixed that for you.

Quote:


And yet you still post as if the one with the most post's wins or something.




And yet you still respond to my every post as if that "make's" you the winner or something.

BTW, nice try at deflection.

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Saturday, August 1, 2009 5:57 PM

BIGDAMNNOBODY


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
And yet you still respond to my every post as if that "make's" you the winner of something.


Pot, meet kettle.

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Sunday, August 2, 2009 2:15 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
And yet you still respond to my every post as if that "make's" you the winner of something.


Pot, meet kettle.



Did you just call me black?


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Wednesday, August 5, 2009 5:35 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Back to the topic at hand - the Obama birth certificate.

Head Birther Orly Taitz, internet dentist, has FOUND Obama's REAL birth certificate, from Kenya. Or Zanzibar. Or Australia. Or somewhere definitely NOT Hawaii or anywhere else in the U.S.

Too bad the one she tried to enter into evidence is a poorly-done forgery, though...

From Salon.com:

Quote:

Orly Taitz responds to forgery charges
Orly Taitz, the birther lawyer who released the document that was supposedly a copy of President Obama's Kenyan birth certificate, has now taken to her blog with an angry screed in response to the evidence that her find is in fact a poorly done forgery.

Referring to the discovery that the purportedly Kenyan document was almost certainly based on a copy of a birth certificate issued for an Australian man, David Jeffrey Bomford, Taitz writes, "Recently Obama’s thugs in main stream (sic) media came up with this Bomford report in order to stop my efforts in exposing and prosecuting Obama. Though typically I don’t have time to waste on each and every dumb obot, since it got to National TV and my children's friends called my children, I’ll spend a few minutes to debunk the obots." She continues:

1. Kenya became an independant (sic) country in 1963, not 1964. The seal of Kenya was correct ...



Except that it wasn't. And isn't.

Quote:


5. Bomford report was created to try to discredit my efforts



Yup, once again Obama sends his agents back in time to discredit the birthers. Seems Bomford's Australian birth certificate has been online on archives.org since at least 2007.

Quote:


6.lastly, I am not supposed to waste my time and money on this issue, Obama us the one who is supposed to provide evidence of legitimacy



And according to the U.S. government, he has. It's interesting that someone who claims to be a lawyer (and on her website, she even claims to be certified to appear before the U.S. Supreme Court!) knows so little about the law. If you accuse somebody, you're supposed to prove them guilty; it's not on them to prove their innocence.

Of course, this is also the same woman who claimed on MSNBC that Obama isn't a citizen because both of his parents weren't citizens, which she says in a constitutional requirement for citizenship. Obviously, she's never read the "natural-born citizen" clause nor the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution of the United States.

Now, she DOES claim to be certified to appear before the Supreme Court of the United States, and on her website she even has a picture of her "certificate" which entitles her to do so. Only thing is, that certificate is a forgery. You know how I can tell? Because I haven't held it in my own hands! She refuses to come to my house and show it to me, and I've demanded repeatedly that she do so! What has she got to hide? WHAT IS SHE HIDING?!

Quote:


7. Kenyan BC provides more info than the piece of garbage Obama posted on the net, which doesn’t have the name of the hospital, name of the doctor or signatures.

8. Chioumi Fukino (sic) and Obama and all their Nazi Brown Shirts in the main stream media need to give it a rest and provide an original hospital BC and the corresponding big thick hospital Birthing file from the Kapiolani hospital. If they don’t have such a file, all of them need to resign immediately or they will be prosecuted for massive fraud and treason to this Nation. (in case you didn’t know, treason carries punishment of life in prison or death penalty).



Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't threatening the President of the United States with death a crime?

Quote:


A couple of points: It's true that Kenya became an independent country in 1963, not 1964. No one's denying that. The real issue, which Taitz avoids, is that the document she released is marked as having come from the Republic of Kenya in February of 1964, when the country was actually known as the Dominion of Kenya -- it wasn't a republic until 10 months later.



And according to some sources, Mombassa was actually a part of the country of Zanzibar at the time the document was allegedly "created", not Kenya.

Quote:


And the idea that the Bomfort document on which the forgery was based "was created to try to discredit my efforts" is pretty ridiculous -- Archive.org shows it linked to on the site from which it was taken as far back as 2007.

Finally, the "Chioumi Fukino" Taitz refers to is in fact Dr. Chiyome Fukino, the director of the Hawaii Department of Health, who has repeatedly verified that the state has Obama's birth certificate on file and that he was in fact born there. She's become a birther target for doing so.

In another post to her blog, Taitz asked only, "If Kenyan BC that I provided would not be genuine, Hillary would not be rushing to Kenya, would she?"

Of course, Clinton's trip to Kenya was actually announced and briefed by the State Department before Taitz released the forgery.



Ah, yes - Once Hillary's trip was announced, this nutloaf ginned up a fake "Kenyan" birth certificate, by way of Australia. What's the matter, couldn't you find a picture of a REAL Kenyan birth certificate to copy?

Complete article and feedback at

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2009/08/04/taitz_response/


Anyway, as far as "proof" of what she claims, this is one internet dentist who's just been defanged.

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Thursday, August 6, 2009 6:25 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)



Just a quick bump in case Out2Lunch looks in over the weekend. It's been the better part of TWO WEEKS now, and he hasn't brought forth one shred of evidence that I - or ANYONE - has ever tried to have him banned from this site.

He HAS popped his pumpkin-sized head up here and there, but when I brought up his lying and asked for his "proof", he ran away yet again.

At this point, I can only surmise that he has no such evidence (because I've never done what he claims), and is too much the coward to just step forward and admit that he was lying out of desperation and a desire to try to smear someone he couldn't win a rational debate with.



Mike

Sweeping generalizations are always wrong!

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Thursday, August 6, 2009 7:00 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


By the way, here's the "real" birth certificate posted by internet dentist and online lawyer Orly Taitz:

http://orlytaitzesq.com/obama-certified-copy-of-registration-of-birth-
in-kenya.htm


Oddly, one of the birfer arguments against Obama is that his mom was not old enough to confer citizenship to her son if he were born outside the U.S. That allegation is not supported by the poorly-made forgery posted on Taitz's website, since it lists her age as "18 years" - surely old enough to confer citizenship!

It's also kind of funny that this "birth certificate" provides exactly NONE of the information that birfers dismiss the ACTUAL birth certificate from Hawaii for not providing. And this one has the added advantage of being filled out three years AFTER Obama's birth, in a city that wasn't in Kenya then...

Look at all the pixelation around so much of the lettering. Looks to be not only a photochop job, but a really, really lousy one at that.

The self-anointed "Queen of the Birfers" has torpedoed her own case in the most amateurish of ways. And she actually tried to enter this garbage into evidence!

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Friday, August 7, 2009 9:53 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Perhaps unlike the ScamBO pRESIDENCY ,

'...The new document released by Taitz bears none of the obvious traits of a hoax.

One of the issues Taitz must deal with will be the authentication of the document. Critics immediately jumped on the Feb. 17, 1964, date for the document, explaining that the "republic" of Kenya wasn't assembled until in December of that year.

Media Matters wrote, "Sorry, WorldNetDaily: Kenya wasn't a republic until Dec. 1964."

But Kenya's official independence was in 1963, and any number of labels could have been applied to government documents during that time period.

At Ameriborn Constitution News, the researcher noted that the independence process for the nation actually started taking (place) as early as 1957, when there were the first direct elections for Africans to the Legislative Council.

"Kenya became an Independent Republic, December 12, 1963, which gives more [credibility] that this is a true document," the website stated.

The 1963 independence is corroborated by several other information sources, including the online African History.'

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=105764

Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
By the way, here's the "real" birth certificate posted by internet dentist and online lawyer Orly Taitz:

http://orlytaitzesq.com/obama-certified-copy-of-registration-of-birth-
in-kenya.htm


Oddly, one of the birfer arguments against Obama is that his mom was not old enough to confer citizenship to her son if he were born outside the U.S. That allegation is not supported by the poorly-made forgery posted on Taitz's website, since it lists her age as "18 years" - surely old enough to confer citizenship!



'...The requirements for citizenship, and its very definition in American statute law, have changed since the Constitution was ratified in 1788. Congress first recognized the citizenship of children born to U.S. parents overseas on March 26, 1790, stating that "the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States."[8] To date, the Naturalization Act of 1790 has been the only U.S. law explicitly conferring statutory "natural born" citizenship. In 1795, Congress removed the words "natural born" from the law; the Naturalization Act of 1795 says only that foreign-born children of American parents "shall be considered as citizens of the United States."[9]

All persons born in the United States, except those not subject to the jurisdiction of the U.S. government (such as children of ambassadors or other foreign diplomats) are citizens under the Fourteenth Amendment.[10] Additionally, under sections 301–309 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (restated in sections 1401–1409 of Title 8 of the United States Code), current U.S. law defines numerous other categories of individuals born abroad, as well as people born in most U.S. territories and possessions, as being "nationals and citizens of the United States at birth."[11] The phrase "natural born citizen," however, does not appear in the current statutes dealing with citizenship at birth.

The law governing the citizenship of children born outside the U.S. to one or more U.S.-citizen parents has varied considerably over time.[12] Current U.S. statutes define various categories of individuals born overseas as "citizens at birth," including (for example) all persons "born outside of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents both of whom are citizens of the United States and one of whom has had a residence in the United States or one of its outlying possessions, prior to the birth of such person[s]."[13]

...The State Department also asserts that "the fact that someone is a natural born citizen pursuant to a statute does not necessarily imply that he or she is such a citizen for Constitutional purposes." [17] This position seems to be at odds with the fact that Congress in 1790 felt it could confer natural born citizenship on those born abroad to American parents. Ultimately, it will take a Supreme Court decision to settle the matter once an American citizen born abroad runs for and wins the presidency.'






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Friday, August 7, 2009 10:06 AM

RIVERDANCER


Quote:

Originally posted by out2theblack:
blah blah blah Kenya's official independence was in 1963 blah blah



You posted 'points' which have already been refuted earlier in the thread. That's impressive, even for you.

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Friday, August 7, 2009 10:07 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


That's a long, long way from your (and internet-dentist and online-lawyer Orly Taitz's) earlier claim that BOTH parents had to be U.S. citizens in order for their child to qualify for citizenship.

But thanks for proving my point.

Mike

Sweeping generalizations are always wrong!

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Friday, August 7, 2009 10:26 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
By the way, here's the "real" birth certificate posted by internet dentist and online lawyer Orly Taitz:

http://orlytaitzesq.com/obama-certified-copy-of-registration-of-birth-
in-kenya.htm


Oddly, one of the birfer arguments against Obama is that his mom was not old enough to confer citizenship to her son if he were born outside the U.S. That allegation is not supported by the poorly-made forgery posted on Taitz's website, since it lists her age as "18 years" - surely old enough to confer citizenship!

It's also kind of funny that this "birth certificate" provides exactly NONE of the information that birfers dismiss the ACTUAL birth certificate from Hawaii for not providing. And this one has the added advantage of being filled out three years AFTER Obama's birth, in a city that wasn't in Kenya then...

Look at all the pixelation around so much of the lettering. Looks to be not only a photochop job, but a really, really lousy one at that.



Pixellation ?

That's pretty typical of old , typewritten documents...Only it wasn't called pixellation back then...

A forensic document expert would note that what Mikey calls 'pixellation' is just a characteristic of individual typewriters...

That's how document experts could tell which machines were used for creating particular documents...The idiosyncrasies of various typewriters...

You can look it up , later...

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