REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Bunk or New Technology?

POSTED BY: ANTHONYT
UPDATED: Saturday, November 28, 2009 11:30
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Saturday, November 28, 2009 7:50 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

When I was much younger, some gentlemen put heavy water under electrolysis and got a result they called 'Cold Fusion.' Others repeated the experiments and asserted that there was no fusion occuring, and that the researchers were hoaxsters. However, something always bothered my unlearned mind about the incident. First, I didn't see how the researchers were benefitting from the hoax. Second, there were some reported phenomenon with the experiment that were never dealt with. They claimed cold fusion, no fusion was found, and they were thereafter ridiculed and ignored.

But it occurred to me that while they may have been mistaken in their conclusions about the experiment, there might have been something ELSE going on that they misinterpreted. Unfortunately, these Cold Fusion Experiments seemed to become a poison that every scientist was afraid to touch, and no one seemed to care much about what might have been going on, even if it wasn't cold fusion.

Recently, I became aware of another group of researchers, this group operating within a corporation called Blacklight.

http://smartenergygroups.com/CandyO/posts/59-Fool-s-gold-or-fuel-gold-
http://www.blacklightpower.com/index.shtml
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacklight_Power

Because they've received substantial investment and/or grants, they have every incentive to lie and cheat so that they can steal. However, I can't help but be tantalized by one of their early premises- Something else was going on with those Cold Fusion Experiments, and while it may not be Cold Fusion, it can still be useful.

Working from the basic premise that something WAS happening, they've explored ways to use chemistry to change the nature of hydrogen atoms. This seems preposterous, which adds allure because any startling new discovery of even the valid sort must necessarily seem preposterous at first. (If History is to be my guide.)

But of course this may be just another big hoax. It's always exciting to think that we've cracked a remarkable new energy source, or achieved some unexpected insight into our understanding of the universe... And that excitement can cloud reason. Even if this guy doesn't understand what he's done, even if he's wrong about how it works, and even if he's a loon, I would very much like to believe that he fell backwards into a new type of energy.

So I hand this to my more learned colleagues and ask their opinions. Bunk or Science? Hoax, or the Future?

What do you think?

--Anthony


"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Saturday, November 28, 2009 8:53 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:

When I was much younger, some gentlemen put heavy water under electrolysis and got a result they called 'Cold Fusion.' Others repeated the experiments and asserted that there was no fusion occuring, and that the researchers were hoaxsters. However, something always bothered my unlearned mind about the incident. First, I didn't see how the researchers were benefitting from the hoax. Second, there were some reported phenomenon with the experiment that were never dealt with. They claimed cold fusion, no fusion was found, and they were thereafter ridiculed and ignored.

But it occurred to me that while they may have been mistaken in their conclusions about the experiment, there might have been something ELSE going on that they misinterpreted. Unfortunately, these Cold Fusion Experiments seemed to become a poison that every scientist was afraid to touch, and no one seemed to care much about what might have been going on, even if it wasn't cold fusion.

Recently, I became aware of another group of researchers, this group operating within a corporation called Blacklight.

Because they've received substantial investment and/or grants, they have every incentive to lie and cheat so that they can steal. However, I can't help but be tantalized by one of their early premises- Something else was going on with those Cold Fusion Experiments, and while it may not be Cold Fusion, it can still be useful.

Working from the basic premise that something WAS happening, they've explored ways to use chemistry to change the nature of hydrogen atoms. This seems preposterous, which adds allure because any startling new discovery of even the valid sort must necessarily seem preposterous at first. (If History is to be my guide.)




I remember reading of this 'Blacklight' thing before...To me , that's sort of an ironic name , given that some promising physics discoveries 'go black' for reasons of national security...Some years ago , there was a young woman of Chinese heritage working in a NASA lab in Huntsville who'd made promising inroads into the 'anti-gravity' technologies , and that was darpa'ed right into the dark...

There are plenty of technologies that could solve all sorts of clean energy problems , but there are also forces at work in the cause of suppressing energy independence...

What if every home were powered by a sealed canister of fissile material within a refrigerator-sized concrete casket in the backyard ? That technology is like the RTG's that powered the Lunar Module science experiments , and there has been serious talk of commercializing that , but 'decentralized' power and energy 'independence' don't fly , with governments or commercial utility companies...

Also , despite the prospect of small sodium-cooled 'fast' fission reactors cleaning up a lot of nuclear 'waste' and completely solving the energy issues of the country , that doesn't fly with either the Clinton or ScamBO administrations. Or the globalist Alliance terror-formers , calling the shots...

And , the technology is 'shovel-ready', right now...

http://homelandsecuritynewswire.com/toshiba-tests-liquid-sodium-fast-r
eactor


http://74.125.93.132/search?q=cache:D9znD0kLcOsJ:nuclearstreet.com/fil
es/folders/1654/download.aspx+liquid-sodium+fast+reactor&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us


"...Owing to the number of sodium fast reactors built and demonstrated around the world, and thus their technological maturity, the primary focus of the R&D is on the recycle technology and economics of the overall system. On the reactor side,demonstration of passive safety and improvements in inspection and serviceability will be emphasized."

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Saturday, November 28, 2009 8:56 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Well, I dunno about this one in particular, but I am a bit irate at CERN currently - the very same lines of fusion research they had such a large role in flaming and discrediting back in 1998, NOW they are pretending they didn't and fronting them as the wave of future energy ?

They tried that back in 1993 with some cooperation from ITER, but since the original researchers who they were so nasty to would *NOT* help them, other than pointing out certain obvious mistakes they refused to correct, it was prettymuch a washout.

One other fascinating item is the hydrogen-from-water machines, some of which *have actually worked* once or twice, but have never been reliable enough to validate, because there's just something missing or misunderstood which causes them to never work properly for any length of time or in any reliable fashion - test results can vary dramatically on tests even five minutes apart under identical conditions so there is an X-factor there we just haven't figured out yet.

Meyers was the closest, but his vehicle came apart due to the (unknown at the time) effects of hydrogen embrittlement, and he was assassinated shortly thereafter, in any case.

Bubble Fusion has many of the same problems, despite being *successfully* replicated at least once by the folks down at RPI.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_fusion
Worse was just how far folks went to discredit Taleyarkhan, the sheer amount of effort and resources involved in that made me damn suspicious of it, and still does.

Remember, I tend to eyeball things outside my competence from a criminal investigation viewpoint, and that spoke to me the same way an extraordinarily elaborate and detailed alibi would, you understand ?

And of course, some corporation has thrown down a patent to prevent further research along those lines, which looks even more like a deliberate roadblock.

It isn't the technical problems so much as the political ones which present the most danger to this kind of R&D because the energy companies and their Government collaborators/enablers will stop at nothing to prevent any effective research - the Geek farm has twice baited them with absolutely bullshit "research" into buying it out just to shut it down, which is a rather unethical but effective way to secure funding.

What bothers me most is that sooner or later, someone *is* going to pull it off, and manage to not be knocked off or discredited - and the very first damn thing our Government will try to do is weaponise it.

Bad enough we have sufficient thermonuclear stuff to wipe the planet clean of life, but the potential to turn this place into a Binary Star System bothers me given that I do not trust the hands it would be in, since they would kill us all rather than let slip the leash, you know ?

There's also religious implications, at least for me - this is the Fire of the Gods, and toying with it is a pretty damned arrogant usurpation unless we know for sure what the hell we're doing, while weaponising it is a blasphemy beyond measure.

-Frem

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Saturday, November 28, 2009 9:18 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:

...One other fascinating item is the hydrogen-from-water machines, some of which *have actually worked* once or twice, but have never been reliable enough to validate, because there's just something missing or misunderstood which causes them to never work properly for any length of time or in any reliable fashion - test results can vary dramatically on tests even five minutes apart under identical conditions so there is an X-factor there we just haven't figured out yet.

Meyers was the closest, but his vehicle came apart due to the (unknown at the time) effects of hydrogen embrittlement, and he was assassinated shortly thereafter, in any case.

...Remember, I tend to eyeball things outside my competence from a criminal investigation viewpoint, and that spoke to me the same way an extraordinarily elaborate and detailed alibi would, you understand ?

And of course, some corporation has thrown down a patent to prevent further research along those lines, which looks even more like a deliberate roadblock.

It isn't the technical problems so much as the political ones which present the most danger to this kind of R&D because the energy companies and their Government collaborators/enablers will stop at nothing to prevent any effective research - the Geek farm has twice baited them with absolutely bullshit "research" into buying it out just to shut it down, which is a rather unethical but effective way to secure funding.

-Frem



There was a Midwestern farmer , 8th-grade education , had grown up all his life with no electricity , because when the REA came through and tried getting his parents to hook up , they'd have none of it , reasoning that they'd never needed electrics and had gotten along just fine...

Eventually his folks died , and he decided that free energy could be useful , so he started studying in libraries everything he could find about producing hydrogen by electrolysis.

He built a system powered by windmills , that pumped his water , ran it into a tank , and applied an electric current from a wind-powered-generator, which he used to gather and compress the hydrogen...

He had hydrogen to burn , so he not only heated his home and ran his generators , he also converted his Ford pickup to run on compressed H2...He would use only a small amount of gasoline from his regular fuel tank to start and warm the engine , then throw a valve lever to switch to H2 power...

I also knew a farmer outside town where I lived in California who did all the same sort of stuff , but he used a
methane-producing 'digester' to run everything on...get this...chicken manure .

All the sort of obstruction Frem tells about has been going on a longish time , since at least when Dr. Diesel met an untimely end after demonstrating an engine running on peanut oil...

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Saturday, November 28, 2009 9:33 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

I have to admit I'm not yet sold on the idea of using food products as fuel. I'd have to be sure peanut oil had no legitimate food uses and was a useless byproduct before I'd want to advocate burning it to run cars.

Anyhow, at 30 bucks per gallon, peanut oil isn't making me feel warm and fuzzy as a gasoline replacement.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

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Saturday, November 28, 2009 11:04 AM

OUT2THEBLACK


Quote:

Originally posted by AnthonyT:


I have to admit I'm not yet sold on the idea of using food products as fuel. I'd have to be sure peanut oil had no legitimate food uses and was a useless byproduct before I'd want to advocate burning it to run cars.

Anyhow, at 30 bucks per gallon, peanut oil isn't making me feel warm and fuzzy as a gasoline replacement.

--Anthony



Price of fuel for US military trucks in Afghanistan ?

$400 per gallon . Not kidding .

http://rawstory.com/2009/10/us-pays-400-per-gallon-for-gas-in-afghanis
tan
/

Those trucks are MFD , (multi-fuel-diesel) capable of burning any flammable hydrocarbon .
Even peanut oil , the price of which is artificially inflated .

One of the major markets for peanut oil is to the US Navy , which uses it for cooking purposes , particularly aboard submarines , because it doesn't smoke and contaminate the breathing air...

Ever pick up any mass-market peanut butter ? They typically contain almost NO PEANUT OIL...Why ?

Because it is much more profitable and self-serving for the processors to extract that natural oil and replace it with
brain-clogging Hydrogenated tropical oils , or Hydrogenated rapeseed (canola) oil...

In Germany , one of the major winter cover crops is Oilseed Rape , which is used for what ?

Not food , but 'biodiesel' motor fuel...Which they've done for generations...

You needn't worry about biodiesel impacting the production of food crops . It doesn't have to be that way , because it's perfectly fine to refine used , waste vegetable oil and transesterify it into motor diesel...


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Saturday, November 28, 2009 11:30 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


AnthonyT

I tried using the term 'hydrino' in a google scholar search and got very little beyond whatever was published by the claimant.

What I don't understand is how 'hydrinos' are supposed to be created with small amount of energy input.

And, alas, to be efficient as a fuel, you need to get more energy out of them than you put into creating them.

As for cold fusion, the idea is that using ultrasonics wil cause hydrogens to atomically fuse (the ultrasonic waves will force a small part of the molecular population close enough together to fuse). IF it worked, you would have to put a lot of energy into it, you'd not get a lot of fusion out of it, and FOR SURE it would not be self-sustaining.

Sadly, I will file this in the 'dead issue' file until something causes me to look further.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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