Dutch rethink Christianity for a doubtful world by Niki2

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Dutch rethink Christianity for a doubtful world

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Monday, June 6, 2022 10:30
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Saturday, August 20, 2011 3:19 PM

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Oh, to take a step back from specific religious beliefs - I think religion is a process of interaction between the brain and language. Once people developed the ability to flexibly communicate (not necessarily exclusive to humans) it became the logical step to combine words in a way that represented things which didn't exist - if I know the color red from flowers for example, but the only dress I've seen is brown, I might still combine the two concepts into 'red-dress'. Once unlocked, the ability to use language imaginatively - and falsely - led to the next logical step, which is myth. And having projected our word-system onto reality, it is easy to project our word-system onto the non-real.

If you look at the various religions through time, you'll see they say a lot about the society and, being extremely diverse, probably very little about anything permanent and literally universal. The male-dominated societies have alpha-male gods, the egalitarian hunter/ gatherers have the spring god, the rain god, the fish god etc.

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Sunday, August 21, 2011 7:34 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Well said, Kiki.

As regards

Quote:
Personally I have never understood why God, and Organized religion have to be mutually exclusive

They're not, but in many ways they are. Organized religion is belief in one God and that one God being the ONLY valid god; no religgion allows the concept of believing in a universal spirit that guides or creates or whatever; only the one THEY specify. That's where they become mutually exclusive.

For me personally, organized religion is also where MEN decided what was and what wasn't, and those following those religions have to take that at face value. One can believe in a god or a God or gods and that covers the concept of something beyond us which affects us; if one believes in a specific religion, one has to believe all the things written BY MEN about that god or gods, or one is excommunicated or shunned or whatever. Given the writings are those of humans, and specifically men, in a way it makes a mockery of the idea of a spirit who created everything out of any form of benevolence.

Riona, may I ask, if you don't mind telling us, how old you are? I'm just curious, from some of the things you've said.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Sunday, August 21, 2011 10:14 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

Oh, I just wanted to say - I'm not entirely against religion. While for many, maybe even nearly all, people it leads to a closed mind and self-righteous judgmentalism, for a few it allows the expression of their better nature - it allows them to act with trust in following their conscience, in the context of a brutal economy and anti-social culture which breeds common cynicism at best, and leaders like Cheney and minions like Rap and Wulf at worst.

Though, if we improved our society, maybe we wouldn't need religion.

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Monday, August 22, 2011 6:40 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

"What Kiki said" about religion bringing good things for some.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Monday, August 22, 2011 8:45 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Hi Niki, I'm 25.

I'm going to call the belief in a god or gods, which one cannot persay identify and which are good in some way, created things, and pertain to spirituality but not prescribed spirituality Vaguerism, they believe in this entity/entities and regard them, but can't quantify or identify them and believe that living a good life is the aim. I think "vaguerism is quite common in our society currently. If someone knows a better name for this then please tell me so I can call it the right thing, I totally made that word up and I'm not attached to it in any way. Its different than deism, though related, because doesn't deism center around the idea that God created everything and then sat back to let it happen and that we can't really connect with Him as such. And agnostic is when people aren't sure whether they believe in a higher power or not, maybe there is and maybe there isn't. I'm really into labels by the way, sometimes they are a problem, like when they aren't necessary and then they bother me. But when they are helpful then I like them.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, August 23, 2011 7:02 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Try "spirituality" or "spiritualism".

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Tuesday, August 23, 2011 2:15 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht

Spirituality can pertain to so many things, for instance spirituality is important to me, but the belief outlined above doesn't fit how I believe, so I think spirituality is not indicative of what I said because its too broad. I see a difference between being vague and being broad.

And spiritualism is when people have seances and things like that, not what I described above at all.

I'm just looking for a good word to call it.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, August 23, 2011 2:35 PM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

Call it whatever helps you to define it.

--Anthony

_______________________________________________

“If you are not free to choose wrongly and irresponsibly, you are not free at all”

Jacob Hornberger

“Freedom is not worth having if it does not connote freedom to err. It passes my comprehension how human beings, be they ever so experienced and able, can delight in depriving other human beings of that precious right.”

Mahatma Gandhi

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Monday, June 6, 2022 10:28 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

Least Religious Countries 2022
https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/least-religious-cou
ntries

Euthanasia Practices in the Netherlands
https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/controversy/euthanasia-and-assist
ed-suicide/euthanasia-practices-in-the-netherlands.html

Zelensky confronts Dutch PM
https://www.bignewsnetwork.com/news/272568917/zelensky-confronts-dutch
-pm

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Monday, June 6, 2022 10:30 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Things keep going the way they're going and you can expect to see the Church gain a lot more power.

--------------------------------------------------

Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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