Sign Up | Log In
REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
Ron Paul and 'Honest Rape'...
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 8:00 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Bytemite:
Please quote me wherever I said that an embryo will inevitably become a human, or that they are "precious." For that matter, I'd like to see me talking about "pink fluffy bunny rabbits," as I am one of the most caustic and unpleasant bitches you have probably seen here or anywhere else, and such a think is unlikely to come out of my mouth as anything except mockery like what you used here.
Quote:I did say that they represent a unique genetic combination that might be useful, and I said that they are a distinct lifeform. But for that matter, have you ever heard me say that life is the end-all of the universe and just soooo important?
It is *A* important thing, but I don't even think it has to be preserved at all costs. Ultimately, all we are is just chemicals, mildly more interesting than the clumps of goop and stew and other chemicals swirling around in the universe.
Quote:I am arguing, rationally I think, about human genetics and survival prospects, and for taking a third option which allows women control over their reproduction AND which preserves genetic material. What are YOU arguing about, or against? Have I said anything in particular you don't like? Do you not like my idea of developing technology to incubate viable aborted fetuses?
Quote:I mean, hell, I don't even LIKE babies. They're smelly and unhygienic, let alone noisy, co-dependent, and anatomically grotesque. I'm embarrassed I ever was one, and thank goodness for infantile amnesia.
Quote:Don't exist? When did they stop existing? Before or after conservation of mass?
And I don't imagine the mothers who have lost them, even the ones who didn't want them, would agree with you.
Rather unfortunate turn of phrase.
Tuesday, February 07, 2012 8:11 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 4:28 AM
Definitely, in a culture with a derth of young children and worries about the future of the "tribe" (whether conscious or not) or a higher risk of childhood mortality, there will be more importance placed on fetuses.
Quote:Abortions happened all throughout history
Quote:But it's never exactly been accepted until recently.
Quote:it's the potential to BECOME a child
Quote:The human being that we need to protect is the mother.
Quote:poor women are not the only ones to procure abortions.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 6:51 AM
Freedom is Important because People are Important
The human being that we need to protect is the mother.
First and foremost, of course. But abortion, planned parenthood et al, are far more of a risk to her health than childbirth.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 9:47 AM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 10:41 AM
Quote:According to the UN, Lesotho has the highest rape rate of any country (91.6)
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 11:10 AM
Quote:I was speaking a little broader about how I what I have heard some anti abortionists say about the process of pregnancy.
Quote:The idea doesn't thrill me, but if it were developed as an option, it should be just that, an option of choice. I would still of course argue for termination of the fetus to be a choice.
Quote:And I adore babies.
Quote:They no longer exist when they have been terminated. And I did say "except perhaps to your parents who may have had hopes and dreams for their children".
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 11:18 AM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 2:43 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 2:45 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Bytemite:
Frem posted a comic once that pretty much sums up my reactions to an infant. Other than the THROWING part, anyway.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 3:00 PM
Quote:Originally posted by Bytemite:
Until the horrible plague, nuclear war, and other such near-extinction events.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 3:23 PM
Pregnancy is... A somewhat gross biological process
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 3:40 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 4:28 PM
Quote: Anthony, I meant for us, now.
Quote: But the healthcare issue and the moral question should not be muddled with one another.
Quote: As for protecting the individual from the state, surely the individual is at more risk if there is an orchestrated effort to exterminate them.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 4:38 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 5:16 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 6:18 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 6:23 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 6:46 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 7:08 PM
Quote:"abortion, planned parenthood et al, are far more of a risk to her health than childbirth."
Quote:"I don't think anyone has yet argued that life saving treatments should not be available, this is a total strawman argument."
Quote:"Statistically there are very few viable pregnancies that would pose a health risk to which abortion is the best option; the ones of which this is true are mainly the ectopic pregnancies.
Quote:It's not speculation or conspiracy theory. This is history.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 7:24 PM
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)
Quote:Originally posted by AnthonyT:
That history has little to do with a destitute woman getting reproductive health care at a clinic in the 21st century.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 7:29 PM
Quote:I was arguing against your assertion that abortion is more of a risk to the mother's health than childbirth.
This response to an earlier article on maternal mortality by LeBolt and others argues that mortality rates of women having an abortion should be separately compared to women having vaginal delivery and women having cesarean delivery, the latter being subject to higher mortality rates partly because of the ocmplications that lead to the cesarean and partly because of increased risks inherent in the abdominal route. Maternal mortality following a cesarean is approximately 100/100,000 live births, roughly 10-20 times higher than mortality following vaginal delivery. The incidence of cesarean section generally ranges from 10-20% of deliveries; assuming the national figure to be 10%, some 90% of the 22,257 live births reported by LeBolt, or 2,253, were due to cesarean deliveries. Using these figures, the maternal mortality rate for vaginal deliveries would be 1.1/100,000 live births, less than the death-to-case rate of 1.9/100,000 legal abortions reported by LeBolt. The maternal mortality rate for cesarean deliveries would then be approximately 53 times greater than that for legal abortion, but the mortality rate for legal abortion would be almost twice as high as that for vaginal deliveries. Even if the effect of artificially lowering the mortality rate for vaginal deliveries because high-risk mothers are more likely to have cesarean deliveries were eliminated by adjusting for preexisting medical conditions between the vaginal and cesarean delivery groups, the increased rate of mortality associated with childbirth would still be accounted for by cesarean deliveries.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 8:05 PM
Quote:It kind of depends.
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 8:34 PM
Wednesday, February 08, 2012 9:05 PM
Thursday, February 09, 2012 6:24 AM
NEW POSTS TODAY
All FIREFLY graphics and photos on this page are copyright 2002-2012 Mutant Enemy, Inc., Universal Pictures, and 20th Century Fox.
All other graphics and texts are copyright of the contributors to this website.
This website IS NOT affiliated with the Official Firefly Site, Mutant Enemy, Inc., or 20th Century Fox.