REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

OHMYGAWD!

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Thursday, January 17, 2013 08:48
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Monday, January 14, 2013 7:55 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I say
Quote:

California is sitting on a massive amount of shale oil and could become the next oil boom state. But only if the industry can get the stuff out of the ground without upsetting the state's powerful environmental lobby.

Running from Los Angeles to San Francisco, California's Monterey Shale is thought to contain more oil than North Dakota's Bakken and Texas's Eagle Ford -- both scenes of an oil boom that's created thousands of jobs and boosted U.S. oil production to the highest rate in over a decade.

As a result of the San Andres fault, California's geologic layers are folded like an accordion rather than simply stacked on top of each other like they are in other Shale states. The folds have naturally cracked the shale rock, and much of California's current "conventional" oil production -- the third largest in the nation -- is thought to come from the Monterey.

But the folds mean recent advancements that have made shale oil and gas profitable to extract -- horizontal drilling combined with hydraulic fracturing -- don't work as well in California. It's hard to drill horizontally if the shale is not flat.

Still, the U.S. Energy Information Agency estimates there are over 15 billion barrels of oil that can be recovered using today's technology.

Several oil companies have put together research teams to work on the Monterey, said Katie Potter, head of exploration and production staffing at NES Global Talent, a company that recruits oil industry professionals.

Last month, the government held a lease sale to drill in the Monterey. While only a modest 18,000 acres were offered, they were all snapped up.

Occidental (OXY, Fortune 500), which is California-based and has long held acres in the Monterey, has had some success using a technology known as deep acid injection, said IHS's Trammel.

The process involves injecting hydrofluoric or other acids deep underground, where they eat away at the shale rock and allow the oil to flow. It's cheaper than fracking, said Trammel. And while it sounds ominous, it may not be as controversial, as the volumes involved are far less and it's not done under such pressure, he said.

Fracking could still become an issue, as it has in other states where it's led to fears over groundwater contamination, said Nathan Matthews, a Sierra Club attorney based in San Francisco. And there's no guarantee acid injection is much better.

Plus, there's air pollution, road congestion and other issues that go along with an oil boom.

Regulations or not, there's still no guarantee there will be an oil boom at all.

"It might not live up to its expectations," said Fadel Gheit, a senior energy analyst at Oppenheimer. "The industry has not concluded whether it's boom or bust." More at http://money.cnn.com/2013/01/14/news/economy/california-oil-boom/index
.html?iid=HP_LN&hpt=hp_t2
]

Given how irresponsible oil companies are, what's happening in other places they're fracking, and how fracking may be on the way out anyway, NOT HERE!!

I think I'm going to be sick...

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Monday, January 14, 2013 9:08 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Aw, c'mon - join the fracking party! After all, what's a few thousand percent increase in earthquake activity in a place like California, where you're already used to the damn things.

And yes, we get them quite regularly in the fracking areas of Texas now, too. This is a new phenomenon here.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Monday, January 14, 2013 9:26 AM

BYTEMITE


Pretty sure they're trying to kill everyone.

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Monday, January 14, 2013 10:54 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Hmmmm



(Yes, that's a pun on Midnight Gardening)

-F

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Monday, January 14, 2013 11:15 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Aw, c'mon - join the fracking party! After all, what's a few thousand percent increase in earthquake activity in a place like California, where you're already used to the damn things.

And yes, we get them quite regularly in the fracking areas of Texas now, too. This is a new phenomenon here.


There is ZERO evidence that fracking causes tremors, quakes, bad air, pollution, or a hazard or smell of any kind. You are all Gore-loving job haters. In fact, fracking is good for the Earth, it makes nearby soil better to grow stuff in, it recycles liquids, it makes people happy, yet is non-addictive. It also reverses climate change, even though there is no such thing.
Grow up, people!

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Monday, January 14, 2013 1:24 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Long live Otisburg!

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Monday, January 14, 2013 2:00 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Long live Otisburg!

Otisburg?
OTISBURG??

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Monday, January 14, 2013 2:03 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Aw, c'mon - join the fracking party! After all, what's a few thousand percent increase in earthquake activity in a place like California, where you're already used to the damn things.

And yes, we get them quite regularly in the fracking areas of Texas now, too. This is a new phenomenon here.


There is ZERO evidence that fracking causes tremors, quakes, bad air, pollution, or a hazard or smell of any kind. You are all Gore-loving job haters. In fact, fracking is good for the Earth, it makes nearby soil better to grow stuff in, it recycles liquids, it makes people happy, yet is non-addictive. It also reverses climate change, even though there is no such thing.
Grow up, people!



Also, don't worry about nuclear waste repositories, that stuff is totes safe. You can fertilize your vegetable garden with it, and eat it with a spoon.

Mmm. Yellow cake.

http://www.sltrib.com/ci_11858471

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Monday, January 14, 2013 2:38 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Also, don't worry about nuclear waste repositories, that stuff is totes safe. You can fertilize your vegetable garden with it, and eat it with a spoon.

Mmm. Yellow cake.


Y'know, I actually HAVE! It kinda tastes like crap, but now I have crazy abilities & stuff...

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Monday, January 14, 2013 2:59 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Long live Otisburg!

Otisburg?

It's a little bitty place.
Quote:

OTISBURG??
Just a small town.



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Monday, January 14, 2013 3:08 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Long live Otisburg!

Otisburg?

It's a little bitty place.
Quote:

OTISBURG??
Just a small town.



Go jump off Teschmacher Peaks.

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Monday, January 14, 2013 5:26 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


Most people are opposed to fracking, at least most people I know. My uncles aren't though, my dad and I tried to explain why its not a good choice for us or for the earth and they thought we were silly. At least we know we're right.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Monday, January 14, 2013 7:47 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:

Go jump off Teschmacher Peaks.


Prefer the six-year younger version as Miss Wildhack in Slaughterhouse Five. Can we have the dome light turned off please.




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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 10:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

There is ZERO evidence that fracking causes tremors, quakes, bad air, pollution, or a hazard or smell of any kind.

Rebuttal:
Quote:

Earthquakes triggered by fluids injected deep underground, such as during the controversial practice of fracking, may be more common than previously thought, a new study suggests.

However, researchers have long known that fluid-injection operations can trigger earthquakes. For instance, in 2006 one geothermal energy site triggered four earthquakes in Basel, Switzerland, ranging from 3.1 to 3.4 on the Richter scale. Fracking also appears linked with Oklahoma's strongest recorded quake in 2011, as well as a spate of more than 180 minor tremors in Texas between Oct. 30, 2008, and May 31, 2009.More at http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/07/fracking-earthquake-conne_n_1
752414.html
who live near natural gas wells are being exposed to elevated levels of several air pollutants, including the known carcinogen, benzene. That's the conclusion of a study from the Colorado School of Public Health. The study strongly suggests that a much closer look is needed at just how these pollutants are affecting people's health.

The report, based on three years of monitoring the air in Garfield County, Colorado, found a number of potentially toxic hydrocarbons in the air near the wells, such as xylene, ethylbenzene and toluene, chemicals known to cause respiratory and neurological problems. Garfield County has recently been the site of rapidly expanding gas development. More at http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/04/fracking-could-cause
-elevated-levels-of-air-pollutants-near-gas-wells/256158/
Environmental Protection Agency announced today that for the first time they have found evidence of groundwater pollution as a result of hydraulic fracturing.

The EPA discovered chemicals in a drinking water aquifer in west-central Wyoming. Residents were claiming that their well water reeked of chemicals, says Time.

“Samples taken from two deep-water monitoring wells in Pavillion, Wyoming, showed synthetic chemicals such as glycols and alcohols ‘consistent with gas production and hydraulic fracturing fluids,’ the agency said today in an e-mailed statement,” reports Bloomberg. More at http://www.energyandcapital.com/articles/fracking-causes-water-polluti
on-in-wyoming/1962
fracturing has raised environmental concerns and is challenging the adequacy of existing regulatory regimes.[56] These concerns have included ground water contamination, risks to air quality, migration of gases and hydraulic fracturing chemicals to the surface, mishandling of waste, and the health effects of all these, as well as its contribution to raised atmospheric CO2 levels by enabling the extraction of previously-sequestered hydrocarbons.[5][34][46] Because hydraulic fracturing originated in the United States,[57] its history is more extensive there than in other regions. Most environmental impact studies have therefore taken place there.Wiki


Some of why we're not hearing about it is because
Quote:

Several organizations, researchers, and media outlets have reported difficulty in conducting and reporting the results of studies on hydraulic fracturing due to industry[58][59][60] and governmental pressure, and expressed concern over possible censoring of environmental reports.[58][61][62] Researchers have recommended requiring disclosure of all hydraulic fracturing fluids, testing animals raised near fracturing sites, and closer monitoring of environmental samples.[63] After court cases concerning contamination from hydraulic fracturing are settled, the documents are sealed. The American Petroleum Institute deny that this practice has hidden problems with gas drilling, while others believe it has and could lead to unnecessary risks to public safety and health.[64] Wiki

Many articles/studies/etc., can be found which support the hazards of fracking. Not only that, but
Quote:

The industry is exempt from some of the most fundamental legal safeguards for public resources. The list is almost hard to believe:

- Oil and gas companies are exempt from the Safe Water Drinking Act. (It wasn't always that way—thank the 2005 Energy Policy Act, passed under Bush and now known as the Halliburton Loophole.)

- Waste related to oil and gas exploration and production is exempt from the Resource Conservation and Recovery Act. (So there are no regulations on its disposal, meaning it can be handled in any way a company pleases, from being injected into the ground—regardless of its proximity to water supplies, animal habitats, etc.—to just being left on the land.)

- Because of loopholes in the Clean Air Act, oil and gas wells are not subject to restrictions on hazardous air pollutants. Garfield County, Colorado, for example, a site where a lot of fracking has taken place, has shown elevated levels of several hazardous air pollutants. More at http://science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/conservation/issues/fra
cking-takes-land-away.htm



Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:04 AM

BYTEMITE


I believe Chris-is-all was not being serious.

I was not being serious about eating nuclear waste from a respository.

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:27 AM

HERO


Fracking used to be a good thing.

It wasn't so long ago we all wanted a good frack. So said we all...

H

Hero...must be right on all of this. ALL of the rest of us are wrong. Chrisisall, 2012

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 11:37 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I believe Chris-is-all was not being serious.

I was not being serious about eating nuclear waste from a respository.

We are troublemakers.

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 12:49 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


Hero makes an excellent point, people always take cool words and turn them into other things, usually which I don't think are all that cool. Back in the early 00s fracking was like rutting, something we all wish we had more of in life, :) Now fracking sucks because it means something different and that thing sucks.

My dad called me all excited because there's this new fracking documentary on public access coming up, I think he thought we could watch it and have some good things to say to the uncles that will convince them its bad, but I had to burst his bubble and tell him we don't have that channel.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 2:50 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


If it's on public access, it's likely online as well. Have you tried that?

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 3:57 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
Hero makes an excellent point

Hero is usually right on all of this. The bulk of us all are wrong generally, being the LIBrul dopes that we are.
(Thought I'd give him a nicer quote for his tag)

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Wednesday, January 16, 2013 5:46 PM

JONGSSTRAW


A hero ain't nuthin' but a sandwich.

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Thursday, January 17, 2013 8:48 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Apologies, Chris. I'm so used to refuting the bullshit people throw out here that I didn't notice who posted it.

But no, don't give him further fodder for his sig...he'll only take "Hero is usually right on all of this" and leave out the rest. Some people are reeeely desperate for approval, enough so that they'll tout their own worth publicly. Reminds me of my mom, who would repeat to me ANY time ANYONE ever told her she was smart or pretty. Really sad...

Yup, hero is just a sandwich: A piece of malarky between two pieces of bullshit. Doesn't sound very yummy...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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