REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Rush was right

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Sunday, February 3, 2013 05:44
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Thursday, January 24, 2013 12:48 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



There should have been something for everyone in President Barack Obama’s
second inaugural address. For liberals, a full-throated call to arms. For
conservatives, vindication.

Obama settled once and for all the debate over his place on the political
spectrum and his political designs. He’s an unabashed liberal determined to
shift our politics and our country irrevocably to the left. In other words, Obama’s foes — if you put aside the birthers and sundry other lunatics — always had him pegged correctly.

If you listened to Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham, you got a
better appreciation of Obama’s core than by reading the president’s friends and
sophisticated interpreters, for whom he was either a moderate or a puzzle yet to
be fully worked out.

Rush, et al., doubted that Obama could have emerged from the left-wing milieu
of Hyde Park, become in short order the most liberal U.S. senator, run to
Hillary Clinton’s left in the 2008 primaries and yet have been a misunderstood
centrist all along. They heeded his record and his boast in 2008 about
“fundamentally transforming the United States of America,” and discounted the
unifying tone of his rhetoric as transparent salesmanship.

They got him right, even as he duped the Obamacons, played the press and
fooled his sympathizers. David Brooks, the brilliant and winsome New York Times
columnist, has been promising the arrival of the true, pragmatic Obama for years
now. In his column praising the second inaugural address, he appeared finally to
give up. “Now he is liberated,” Brooks wrote. “Now he has picked a team and put
his liberalism on full display.”

Paul Krugman, also of The New York Times, wrote blog posts over the past few
years titled “Obama the Moderate” and “Obama the Moderate Conservative.” For
Krugman, Obama could never have proved himself a liberal short of an order to
liquidate the kulaks. Even he, though, wrote of the second inaugural: “Obama has
never been this clear before about what he stands for.”

After years of portraying Obama as cautiously picking through warmed-over
Republican ideas, an Eisenhower Republican miscast by his opponents as a liberal
ideologue, Obama’s allies exulted in his open embrace of liberal ideology.

The media, as a general matter, loved the speech. They praised Obama’s
post-partisanship and now they praise his post-post-partisanship. They aren’t
strictly contradicting themselves because the content is the same. In his old
post-partisan phase, the president passed a nearly $1 trillion stimulus, a
universal health care bill sought by the left for decades and a massive
regulation of Wall Street. All prior to his “liberation.”


One theory is that Obama has been forced into his unabashed liberalism by the
irrational recalcitrance of Republicans. But you don’t advance a philosophically
cogent view of American history in an inaugural address in a fit of pique. It
wasn’t Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell who made Obama believe that
progressivism somehow represents the logical outgrowth of the American founding.

It wasn’t House Speaker John Boehner who made him weave Medicaid, Medicare and
Social Security into the flag as the 51st, 52nd and 53rd stars.

Yes, Obama would have preferred to pass his agenda with Republican votes.
That wouldn’t have made the agenda any different or changed his conviction that
History with a capital “H” runs in one direction — toward more government and
social liberalism. If anything, it would have re-enforced his belief that his
remaining opponents were outside the mainstream and deserving only of his pity
or his scorn.

Obama is making his play, as the newest cliché goes, to become the liberal
Reagan. As soon as he won reelection, we went from the Obama administration to
the Obama years, and that is no mean feat. Becoming an enduringly transformational figure like Reagan, though, is a different proposition. He will have to leave office adored. He will have to cement his legacy by winning a defacto third term. His big policies will have to work, as Reagan’s did in winning the Cold War and reviving the economy.

For all of the ideological ambition of his second inaugural, the policy
agenda was thin or unachievable. Reducing wait-times at the polls isn’t a major
item. At the federal level, gay marriage is largely up to the courts. He will
get much less on guns than he wants and probably nothing significant from
Congress on climate change. His best chance for a breakthrough is on
immigration, which divides Republicans.

The virtue of the address was making his intentions unmistakable, although
Rush Limbaugh never mistook them in the first place.

Rich Lowry is editor of National Review.


"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 1:42 PM

ARLO

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Twas 1987 when one of my hometown local radio stations decided to add his little show tween golden oldies, weather and news. This was technically before his national synDICKation. At first it seemed as if it was some sort of satirical attempt by a guy who was trying to break out of radio advertisement and into comedy (and it didn't seem like he was doing a very good job of it). He obviously loved the sound of his own voice. Then came the day he devoted a whole half hour (his time-slot, then) to asserting that it was impossible to contract HIV and develop AIDS through heterosexual sex (Tennessee state Sen. Stacey Campfield [R] must have been a fan of his way back when). It was irresponsible and downright criminally liable, in my opinion. To this day I'm surprised that not one lawsuit from a former fan became a 'come to Jesus' moment shortly afterwards. And he just keeps getting louder and more stupid. I'm just as surprised that his sponsors went so long before many of them realized that the guy would literally say any shocking thing just to get attention.

Yeah, Rush is still (far) right. And usually always wrong. =0)

sincerely, 1933

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:01 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


So, instead of acknowledging / commenting on the point made clearly in the article posted, you decided to ignore it, and offer up your own opinion on Rush, going back 25 years, where you show disdain for syndication. Probably because Rush has been doing his show successfully for so very long, when AirAmerica couldn't even make a dent in the talk radio market, even when they were stealing $ from poor, inner city kids.

http://michellemalkin.com/2005/07/27/air-america-stealing-from-poor-ki
ds
/


Of course, Rush has never claimed to be anything other than to the Right ( though never 'far' Right wing ) where as so many hard core ,extreme far Leftists pretend that they're actually in the centre.




"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:08 PM

CHRISISALL


An American President spouting rhetoric & pushing an agenda that's ineffective at best.
Any news that's NEW???

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:09 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


So Obama, a liberal, pushes as liberal agenda...OH MY GOD!!!!!!!



I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:15 PM

ARLO

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Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

So, instead of acknowledging the point made clearly in the article posted, you decided to ignore it, and offer up your own unsubstantiated opinion on Rush, going back 25 years, where you show disdain for syndication. Probably because Rush has been doing his show successfully for so very long, when AirAmerica couldn't even make a dent in the talk radio market, even when they were stealing $ from poor, inner city kids.

http://michellemalkin.com/2005/07/27/air-america-stealing-from-poor-ki
ds
/


Of course, Rush has never claimed to be anything other than to the Right ( though never 'far' Right wing ) where as so many hard core ,extreme far Leftist pretend that they're actually in the centre.



You entitled the thread 'Rush was right.' I took my lead from that. You shouldn't be whining that my response is unfair nor should you try to read things into it (aka - weaving a straw man). Rush is right-wing practically to the point of lunacy. Rush is right (correct) mainly in his own mind and the fan-minds he has wrapped around his personality. Even a fair number of Republicans have come to that conclusion. And when someone is indeed that far right (be it Rush or a fanboy of his ... or even some of those rare fangirls) then their overall perspective, regarding moderate politics, is not only questionable but pretty much a given loss. The author of the article you present is a perfect example.

So, how do you want to approach this? Are you going to actually provide something substantial and less opinionated to ...

a. Support Rush and hope others here will buy it?

b. Attack the president and hope that more than two or three others will help you, based on this opinion article supporting Rush and attacking Mr. Obama?

c. Actually develop a rational debate topic that works with insightful material rather than inciteful attention bait?

sincerely, 1933

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:31 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by ARLO:
a. Support Rush and hope others here will buy it?

b. Attack the president and hope that more than two or three others will help you, based on this opinion article supporting Rush and attacking Mr. Obama?

c. Actually develop a rational debate topic that works with insightful material rather than inciteful attention bait?


None of the above.
d. Illicit responses that can be used as condescension fodder.

Let him do it. Be magnanimous.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:40 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
So Obama, a liberal, pushes as liberal agenda...OH MY GOD!!!!!!!



I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.



Only Obama wasn't treated by the MSM as " liberal ". Per the article, if you bothered to read it, the MSM went to lengths to paint Obama as anything BUT a " liberal " .

Rush knew better, and said as much.

Ergo, Rush was right.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:43 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Rush also says that every abortion should be performed with a gun.


I'm sure Rappy agrees with him 100% on that, too.


Color me unimpressed.



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:44 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by ARLO:

You entitled the thread 'Rush was right.'



That was the title of the article posted.

Seems you didn't bother to read it.

The rest of your post was a pointless array of rambling, inept silliness.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:46 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Rush also says that every abortion should be performed with a gun.

I'm sure Rappy agrees with him 100% on that, too.

Color me unimpressed.




Cite ?

Oh, that's right. You're famous for making shit up and or completely misstating what others say.

Kinda like Cheney and his " Deficits don't matter " lie you love to promote.

But when have facts ever impressed you ? Seems fairy tales and lies are what get you all hot and bothered.


"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:47 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

The rest of your post was a pointless array of rambling, inept silliness.


Yes, as was mine. We must attempt to redirect our array to more effective & reasonable posts. Sorry.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:53 PM

ARLO

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Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by ARLO:

You entitled the thread 'Rush was right.'



That was the title of the article posted.

Seems you didn't bother to read it.

The rest of your post was a pointless array of rambling, inept silliness.




You not liking a response doesn't make it inappropriate or rambling. C'mon, you're bound to be used to not getting high praise or good marks when the thread you offer up to your fellow forum members merely involves finding an article to cut and paste to 'prove' your prejudices were right all along and that, once again, when it comes to you actually forming substance to support it all you can do is complain about others. =0)

sincerely, 1933

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 2:59 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Only Obama wasn't treated by the MSM as " liberal ". Per the article, if you bothered to read it, the MSM went to lengths to paint Obama as anything BUT a " liberal " .

Rush knew better, and said as much.

Ergo, Rush was right.



I don't think you, Rush or the author of the article know what the MSM is.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 3:39 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Only Obama wasn't treated by the MSM as " liberal ". Per the article, if you bothered to read it, the MSM went to lengths to paint Obama as anything BUT a " liberal " .

Rush knew better, and said as much.

Ergo, Rush was right.



I don't think you, Rush or the author of the article know what the MSM is.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.




Yeah, Rush and I absolutely do. If you listen to his show, he'll play clips of the major news shows, weekend talk shows. What's so uncanny is how different networks will all use the exact same language, same words , when describing something in the news. It's almost as if they meet with each other,and all agree to portray something in exactly the same manner, then go out and parrot each other, over and over and over.


Cheney and 'gravitas', was one prime example. But there's been many others too.

@ Arlo - you completely ignored the point of the article, and then asked what evidence there was for MY conclusion.

I hadn't made any, just posted the article. In it, ample evidence was given, not just ' opinion'. You dismissed that, entirely, and then went on about your merry, chatting up one non sequitur after another, on the evils of Rush.

The POINT was, he had Obama pegged, long before the MSM did, and even when they were saying Obama was a moderate, when he never was.

How is this even a problem for you ? Seems to me as if you just don't like anyone talking negatively about Barry, or pointing out that, indeed, Rush WAS right.


Deal w/ it.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 3:59 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Rush WAS right.


All hail.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 4:03 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Rush WAS right.


All hail.




Better recognize.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 4:04 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Yeah, Rush and I absolutely do. If you listen to his show, he'll play clips of the major news shows, weekend talk shows. What's so uncanny is how different networks will all use the exact same language, same words , when describing something in the news. It's almost as if they meet with each other,and all agree to portray something in exactly the same manner, then go out and parrot each other, over and over and over.



So Fox never described Obama a liberal?

...and yes Fox News is the largest MSM TV network.

Also, didn't Rush say Romney was going to win and the GOP was going to re-take the Senate? Well you know what they say, even a broken clock is right twice.

Congratulations for Rush pointing out a Liberal Democrat is a Liberal.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 4:05 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:


Better recognize.


Yep. You know, someone loves you, AU. Hang on to that.

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Thursday, January 24, 2013 4:06 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!



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Thursday, January 24, 2013 4:43 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:

So Fox never described Obama a liberal?

...and yes Fox News is the largest MSM TV network.

Also, didn't Rush say Romney was going to win and the GOP was going to re-take the Senate? Well you know what they say, even a broken clock is right twice.

Congratulations for Rush pointing out a Liberal Democrat is a Liberal.



What's FOX have to do w/ this thread? Anything ? But if you want to point out that FOX was as right about Obama as Rush, then by all means, go for it.

FOX News gets the largest ratings on cable. Not sure that it's the largest viewed network. It counters NBC, CBS, ABC, CNN, MSNBC, and now, seemingly Al Jazeera. ( aka Current )

Calling the outcome of an election isn't the same thing as honestly reporting to the public who a politician is or what he stands for.

And again, while most thinking Americans understood what Rush was saying, that Obama was THE most liberal of US candidates to run for the office of President, the MSM ( excluding FOX ) all tried to paint Barry as some sort of messiah, a great unifier and moderate.

Rush is as he's most often been, consistently right on such matters. Only now, someone felt the need to point that out to the public. Better late than never, I suppose.



"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Friday, January 25, 2013 3:00 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


You need to watch something other than FOX. Maybe than you will see that what you wrote is basicly the digested food waste of a bull.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Friday, January 25, 2013 7:31 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

You entitled the thread 'Rush was right.' I took my lead from that. You shouldn't be whining that my response is unfair nor should you try to read things into it (aka - weaving a straw man). Rush is right-wing practically to the point of lunacy. Rush is right (correct) mainly in his own mind and the fan-minds he has wrapped around his personality. Even a fair number of Republicans have come to that conclusion. And when someone is indeed that far right (be it Rush or a fanboy of his ... or even some of those rare fangirls) then their overall perspective, regarding moderate politics, is not only questionable but pretty much a given loss. The author of the article you present is a perfect example.

Excellent. And so eloquent. I love your grasp of English, as well as your grasp of the issues. However, "Rush is right-wing practically to the point of lunacy"...practically??
Quote:

You need to watch something other than FOX. Maybe than you will see that what you wrote is basicly the digested food waste of a bull.

Nice one, Chris. Prize for first giggle of the day.

Any discussion of Rush Limbaugh is a waste of time--as is any attempt to communicate with Rap. Additionally, Rush Limbaught IS NOT RIGHT WING. Limbaugh does what he does for MONEY--the more outrageous, the more equally insane right-wingers he attracts. Works for him. Pretty good gig when you think about it; no need to be correct, make any sense or use your brain. Just blather as loudly and as long as you can in as outrageous terms as you can come up with, and you pull in a great salary. We should all be so lucky!

What poor Rap doesn't get is that fat, fatuous Rush is using HIM, along with his other acolytes, without giving a damn about them or his country. He has admitted as much:
Quote:

Rush Limbaugh openly admitted that his number one priority as a broadcaster is not to influence policy or sway peoples’ opinions. Rather, his foremost priority every day is to attract as large an audience as possible, hold that audience as long as possible, and then deliver that audience to advertisers in exchange for large sums of money.

Limbaugh can afford to live the way he wants. When we met he was on the verge of signing a new eight-year contract with his syndicator, Premiere Radio Networks. He estimated that it would bring in about $38 million a year. To sweeten the deal, he said he was also getting a nine-figure signing bonus. (A representative from Premiere would not confirm the deal.) “Do you know what bought me all this?” he asked, waving his hand in the general direction of his prosperity. “Not my political ideas. Conservatism didn’t buy this house. First and foremost I’m a businessman. My first goal is to attract the largest possible audience so I can charge confiscatory ad rates. I happen to have great entertainment skills, but that enables me to sell airtime.” http://rush-matters.com/current-events/rush-limbaugh-admits-im-just-a-
businessman


There it is, in his own words: "First and foremost I’m a businessman. My first goal is to attract the largest possible audience so I can charge confiscatory ad rates.

One excellent comment to the article:
Quote:

I was and am aware of Rush Limbaugh’s entertaining techniques and “insincere patter” for several years now. I am not a person who listens to his program because I love to hate him, nor do I listen because I believe what he says. I just think of him as a financial wizard and as a failure of a human being. There are many things about Rush Limbaugh’s popularity that appalls me. It is amazing that, literally, millions of people believe that he is speaking the truth; and THEY think just the way HE (Limbaugh) thinks! How did we end up with so many ignorant people in the United States? Even more appalling, he doesn’t really mean what he says, but, obviously, enjoys the exploitation of the ignorance of a specific percentage of our population.

Absolutely on point! That's really all that needs be said about Limbaugh. Sadly, Rap will never stop believing he is some kind of marvelous Cassandra figure--or something--and carefully ignores that his ignorance is being exploited for money.

"How did we end up with so many ignorant people in the United States?" Good question. Part of the answer: Rush Limbaugh.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, January 25, 2013 7:43 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

And he just keeps getting louder and more stupid.
He keeps getting louder because all of that oxycontin that he took made him deaf.

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Friday, January 25, 2013 7:52 AM

STORYMARK


Ah, another comedy thread.




Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 12:13 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


So.

Rush is a pompous windbag and the article is so much gobbledy-gook.

Next!


SGG

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 3:31 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
You need to watch something other than FOX.



Oh, good. Someone telling me what I "NEED" to watch. Any suggestions ?

Quote:

Maybe than you will see that what you wrote is basicly the digested food waste of a bull.




Deny much? I get that you don't like Rush, but really... you're acting like a child. And it's not just you. And I get that you don't WANT anything positive or good said about him, but really... you're being ridiculous.



"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:34 AM

PENGUIN








King of the Mythical Land that is Iowa

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 8:01 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Bingo Penguin.

And ahhh, here comes the Rap with his "child" stuff again. I wonder what it says about him that he inevitably reverts to the "juvenile" and "child" and such put-downs?

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 8:05 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
Bingo Penguin.

And ahhh, here comes the Rap with his "child" stuff again. I wonder what it says about him that he inevitably reverts to the "juvenile" and "child" and such put-downs?

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.



Niki, what else would YOU call it when non responses to the issue are posted, and all that's offered is mindless, baseless ad hominems, w/ out a iota of support ?

Petty, juvenile, childish... all apply. There are other words for it, but that would only play into the pointless name calling which you CLAIM you're against.

Maybe not so much, after all, huh?


And point of fact, the GOP, despite openly opposing Obama and his policies, HAVE indeed offered up sensible, good faith gestures in compromise. Obama? For all his glowing words, has offered up vitriol, arrogance and defiance, as well as to cast a wide net of demagoguery. Obama is all talk, where as the GOP at least tries to meet in the middle. Much to their demise.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:43 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Obama is all talk, where as the GOP at least tries to meet in the middle.

LOL, that was good.

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 11:25 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Good because it was true.

Raising taxes on those already paying more than their fair share, when doing so will have a null effect on debt reduction. Thanks, GOP

Kicking the can down the road, after vowing to be the grown ups in the discussion, and finally put a lid on the debt ceiling ? Thanks, GOP.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 12:48 PM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Good because it was true.


Of course it was; no fight here.

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 3:27 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Oh, good. Someone telling me what I "NEED" to watch. Any suggestions ?



Want real news, start with NPR.

Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:Deny much? I get that you don't like Rush, but really... you're acting like a child. And it's not just you. And I get that you don't WANT anything positive or good said about him, but really... you're being ridiculous.


Deny what, that Obama is a liberal. No one ever denied that. I'm sorry that you and Rush don't know the difference between what the President's political beliefs are and how he has governed. Of course the likes of you think the Health Care law was socialist when it originally came from the conservative Heritage Foundation and was the GOPs conservative answer to Hillary care.

You also don't understand that the GOP only compromised when it got backed into a corner and had no choice.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 8:57 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Thank you, Nick--you're far more concise than I could manage to be!

I love this:
Quote:

Niki, what else would YOU call it when non responses to the issue are posted, and all that's offered is mindless, baseless ad hominems, w/ out a iota of support ?

Now THAT's a keeper to be tossed back at Rap when he does precisely that...which is virtually every post of course...like the two you just quoted.


Or like this one:
Quote:

And point of fact, the GOP, despite openly opposing Obama and his policies, HAVE indeed offered up sensible, good faith gestures in compromise. Obama? For all his glowing words, has offered up vitriol, arrogance and defiance, as well as to cast a wide net of demagoguery. Obama is all talk, where as the GOP at least tries to meet in the middle.

Mindless, baseless ad hominems w/out AN iota of support. Yup.

Good gawd, he wouldn't touch NPR with a ten-foot pole! He doesn't venture out of his safe zone--anything extreme and right wing--where he feels safe.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 10:30 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Deny what, that Obama is a liberal. No one ever denied that.

Errr, actually I deny that; Obama is a moderate Conservative, Bush & Romney are far right wing Conservatives.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 12:46 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Deny what, that Obama is a liberal. No one ever denied that.

Errr, actually I deny that; Obama is a moderate Conservative, Bush & Romney are far right wing Conservatives.



If you are talking world politics, than yes. In the US political spectrum the President is seen as a liberal.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 12:52 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kwicko:
Rush also says that every abortion should be performed with a gun.

I'm sure Rappy agrees with him 100% on that, too.

Color me unimpressed.




Cite ?

Oh, that's right. You're famous for making shit up and or completely misstating what others say.

Kinda like Cheney and his " Deficits don't matter " lie you love to promote.




You're saying that Cheney never said those words? Hell, even your senile buddy Geezer quoted them back to you, dipshit.

And by the way, here's Rush, from his own website:

"You know how to stop abortion? Require that each one occur with a gun."

His exact words, quoted on his own website, by him.

http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2013/01/16/revenge_on_the_bitter_cli
ngers


Suck it, fatty.

Quote:


But when have facts ever impressed you ? Seems fairy tales and lies are what get you all hot and bothered.




Says the guy who fantasizes about being in the pants of a 14-year-old girl...





"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 2:11 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


I understand the impulse in thinking that facts are meaningful, but you have to remember - they won't change little rappy. There is never a fact proving him wrong that he won't quietly slink away from in one thread, only to trot out the same crap later on. Trying to clear out his mind-lint is like trying to get rid of bedbugs.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 3:45 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I understand the impulse in thinking that facts are meaningful, but you have to remember - they won't change little rappy. There is never a fact proving him wrong that he won't quietly slink away from in one thread, only to trot out the same crap later on. Trying to clear out his mind-lint is like trying to get rid of bedbugs.




Not true - you can actually get rid of bed bugs! Rappy's insanity and inanity seem to be hard-wired into him.

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Monday, January 28, 2013 12:00 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


FAUX NEWS ALERT.

Obama plans to implement Democrat policies!!
"It's what we feared all along," said one shocked Republican.

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Monday, January 28, 2013 1:23 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Deny what, that Obama is a liberal. No one ever denied that.



YES THEY DID !!

That's the entire point here. That the MSM actually DID try to paint Obama as a "moderate", when in fact he's the most Left leaning individual in the WH - EVER.

Quote:

I'm sorry that you and Rush don't know the difference between what the President's political beliefs are and how he has governed. Of course the likes of you think the Health Care law was socialist when it originally came from the conservative Heritage Foundation and was the GOPs conservative answer to Hillary care.


Don't care where it came from,( cites for the Heritage origins? ) the answer to Hillary's socialist medicare isn't an even MORE socialist plan.

Quote:



You also don't understand that the GOP only compromised when it got backed into a corner and had no choice.



It had a choice. What it hasn't had is leadership.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Monday, January 28, 2013 1:31 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
I understand the impulse in thinking that facts are meaningful, but you have to remember - they won't change little rappy. There is never a fact proving him wrong that he won't quietly slink away from in one thread, only to trot out the same crap later on. Trying to clear out his mind-lint is like trying to get rid of bedbugs.



Thanks 1kiki. More empty,baseless blathering from you, as you simply refuse to follow the discussion.

Nothing in your post above is in the least bit worth while or relevant. Just petty ad hominems and no substance, what so ever.


Oh, and Kwickie, once again, you're completely making shit up, trying to attack me on phony charges. You clearly have me confused with Democratic Senator Bob Menendez.

More sad proof that you're in so far over your head, you can't debate any issue, you just shovel shit around, and hope it sticks.



"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Tuesday, January 29, 2013 9:05 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


It means nothing, especially to Rap I realize, but the fact that the Republicans and Heritage Foundation originally came up with the individual mandate for health insurance has been challenged. I offer:
Quote:

The mandate made its political début in a 1989 Heritage Foundation brief titled “Assuring Affordable Health Care for All Americans.”

Under the Heritage plan, there would be such a requirement.” The mandate made its first legislative appearance in 1993, in the Health Equity and Access Reform Today Act, which was sponsored by John Chafee, of Rhode Island, and co-sponsored by eighteen Republicans, including Bob Dole, who was then the Senate Minority Leader.

Ten years later, Senator Ron Wyden, an Oregon Democrat, began picking his way back through the history—he read “The System” four times—and he, too, came to focus on the Chafee bill. He began building a proposal around the individual mandate, and tested it out on both Democrats and Republicans. “Between 2004 and 2008, I saw over eighty members of the Senate, and there were very few who objected,” Wyden says. In December, 2006, he unveiled the Healthy Americans Act. In May, 2007, Bob Bennett, a Utah Republican, who had been a sponsor of the Chafee bill, joined him. Wyden-Bennett was eventually co-sponsored by eleven Republicans and nine Democrats, receiving more bipartisan support than any universal health-care proposal in the history of the Senate. It even caught the eye of the Republican Presidential aspirants. In a June, 2009, interview on “Meet the Press,” Mitt Romney, who, as governor of Massachusetts, had signed a universal health-care bill with an individual mandate, said that Wyden-Bennett was a plan “that a number of Republicans think is a very good health-care plan—one that we support.”

This process led, eventually, to the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act—better known as Obamacare—which also included an individual mandate. But, as that bill came closer to passing, Republicans began coalescing around the mandate, which polling showed to be one of the legislation’s least popular elements. In December, 2009, in a vote on the bill, every Senate Republican voted to call the individual mandate “unconstitutional.”

This shift—Democrats lining up behind the Republican-crafted mandate, and Republicans declaring it not just inappropriate policy but contrary to the wishes of the Founders—shocked Wyden. “I would characterize the Washington, D.C., relationship with the individual mandate as truly schizophrenic,” he said. Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2012/06/25/120625fa_fact_klein#ixzz
2JOM8j8Fa
]
We all know of course that Rap will side step, attack, or somehow deny the facts, but there they are, for all to see.

And no, Obama is no the leftie he's being argued as being here. He IS a moderate, a centrist Republican if you will. The British easily saw it as it was (ironically, with mention of the very health-care issue as well), and make the argument far better than I could:
Quote:

Vote Obama – if you want a centrist Republican for US president

Even the policy Democratic loyalists point to as proof of the president's progressive bona fides – his healthcare plan, which mandates the purchase of policies from the private health insurance industry – was designed by the Heritage Foundation, one of the nation's most rightwing thinktanks, and was advocated by conservative ideologues for many years (it also happens to be the same plan Romney implemented when he was governor of Massachusetts and which Newt Gingrich once promoted, underscoring the difficulty for the GOP in drawing real contrasts with Obama).

How do you scorn a president as a far-left socialist when he has stuffed his administration with Wall Street executives, had his last campaign funded by them, governed as a "centrist Republican", and presided over booming corporate profits even while the rest of the nation suffered economically?

A staple of GOP politics has long been to accuse Democratic presidents of coddling America's enemies (both real and imagined), being afraid to use violence, and subordinating US security to international bodies and leftwing conceptions of civil liberties.

But how can a GOP candidate invoke this time-tested caricature when Obama has embraced the vast bulk of George Bush's terrorism policies; waged a war against government whistleblowers as part of a campaign of obsessive secrecy; led efforts to overturn a global ban on cluster bombs; extinguished the lives not only of accused terrorists but of huge numbers of innocent civilians with cluster bombs and drones in Muslim countries; engineered a covert war against Iran; tried to extend the Iraq war; ignored Congress and the constitution to prosecute an unauthorised war in Libya; adopted the defining Bush/Cheney policy of indefinite detention without trial for accused terrorists; and even claimed and exercised the power to assassinate US citizens far from any battlefield and without due process?

In sum, how do you demonise Obama as a terrorist-loving secret Muslim intent on empowering US enemies when he has adopted, and in some cases extended, what was rightwing orthodoxy for the last decade? The core problem for GOP challengers is that they cannot be respectable Republicans because, as Krugman pointed out, Obama has that position occupied. They are forced to move so far to the right that they render themselves inherently absurd. Excerpts from http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/dec/27/vote-obama-centris
t-republican



Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Tuesday, January 29, 2013 9:15 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Others make the point far better than I ever could as well:
Quote:

Living overseas, and following American politics and politics in other Countries, Obama definitely is a centrist. Put aside your own political beliefs, anger or love for President Obama. No matter what side you stand on.. look at all the Policies, and where he has stood, where the Democrats have stood, and where the Republicans have stood... it's all out there in the public domain. FYI - Obama has been a centrist before he even ran for office, people claim he is Liberal, he is not. People have moved so far to the right in the GOP field, that people claim him to be Liberal or moving far to the left. He is not. Those instances where many on the left were hammering Obama for 'caving' to Republicans in 2009/2010, are not policies agreed to by someone who is Liberal, he has been trying to meet Republicans in the middle by going against many of the policies pushed hard by the far left. [ihttp:// www.economist.com/economist-asks/barack-obama-centrist]]
How about something from "Republicans for Obama"?
Quote:

The Republican party isn't what it used to be. Our leaders and our most vocal activists have written moderates out of the party and have refused to work with the other side, to the detriment of the nation. Center-right presidents such as Reagan, Bush Sr., Ford, Nixon and Eisenhower would have no chance being nominated today.

President Obama has shown himself to be a common-sense centrist. He has cut taxes when necessary, has taken steps to protect the environment, and has aggressively pursued Islamic extremists who threaten America. Most notably, he has reformed our healthcare system by signing a Republican-inspired healthcare plan into law. In most other points in our party's history, Obama would fit in well as a Republican. More at http://www.republicansforobama.org/]
Or, you could hear what The American Conservative (they don't come more "right" than THAT!) has to say:
Quote:

Is Barack Obama a Republican Realist?

His foreign policy recalls George H.W. Bush—and his domestic policy could be Ike's or Nixon's.

I never considered Obama to be a non-interventionist or a member of the peace movement. In fact, both in terms of his public statements and policies, Obama reminded me of President George H.W. Bush and his top “realist” foreign-policy advisors James Baker and Brent Scrowcroft: favoring pragmatism and a muddling-through approach over the pursuit of grand designs and ideological crusades; selective and preferring short military engagements over full-blown wars; Teddy Roosevelt over Woodrow Wilson.

Indeed, much of Obama’s cautious response to the so-called “Arab Spring” recalled Bush I’s efforts to deal with the fall of the Berlin Wall and the collapse of Communism. And the decision to kick Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait but not to invade Iraq provided a clear contrast between Bush I’s Realpolitik and the messianic foreign policy of Bush II. From that perspective, Obama’s leading-from-behind in Libya, Syria, and the rest of the Middle East, coupled with the acceleration of the military withdrawal from Iraq (and apparently from Afghanistan), are pure Bush I, which explains why many neocons hated Papa Bush with the same intensity with which they now despise Obama.

With the selection of Republican Hagel, an intellectual heir to the Baker-Scrowcroft Realpolitik tradition, Obama has taken a major step toward transforming his presidency into a replica of the administration of George H.W. Bush, at least when it comes to foreign policy.

In a way, much of what Obama has been advocating on domestic policy is not very different from what a Bush I administration (or Nixon, Ford or Eisenhower) would be doing, ranging from raising taxes, reforming immigration policy, or protecting the environment. Obama, in short, is not a socialist or a even a social-democrat, just a good old centrist Republican. More at http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/is-barack-obama-a-repu
blican-realist/


In essence, the THINKING Republicans in this country recognize Obama for what he is; it's only the irrational screaming heads like Rushbo who make money from riling up their audience by pretending he's a drooling, hard-core leftie--for their OWN purposes, not because it is in any way true!

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Tuesday, January 29, 2013 11:46 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Don't care where it came from,( cites for the Heritage origins? ) the answer to Hillary's socialist medicare isn't an even MORE socialist plan.



This sums up how stupid you are very nicely. It shows that you have no idea what the health care law does, nor do you have any idea what socialist means.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2010/apr/01/barack-
obama/obama-says-heritage-foundation-source-health-excha
/

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/06/28/individual-health-care-insu
rance-mandate-has-long-checkered-past
/

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Wednesday, January 30, 2013 3:44 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Stupid folks confuse stupidity w/ ignorance.

The root of ObamaCare and that many have put forth the idea of compulsory enrollment doesn't NOT make it socialized medicine.

It is.

Regardless of who presents it, or what Justice Roberts tries to sell.

To claim the GOP offered up this plan 20 years ago, only shows how far to the extreme Left this party has drifted, or more accurately, how far to the Left it's always been.


"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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Wednesday, January 30, 2013 5:13 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Stupid folks confuse stupidity w/ ignorance.

The root of ObamaCare and that many have put forth the idea of compulsory enrollment doesn't NOT make it socialized medicine.

It is.

Regardless of who presents it, or what Justice Roberts tries to sell.

To claim the GOP offered up this plan 20 years ago, only shows how far to the extreme Left this party has drifted, or more accurately, how far to the Left it's always been.



Still not socialist because socialism is about common or state ownership. Nothing in the health care law comes close to that. You seem to be stupid and ignorant.

So by your logic the Left supported a plan which the Right at one time supported and it is the Left that has moved more to the Left or has stayed up. Holy fuck that is retarded.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Friday, February 1, 2013 10:44 AM

FOLLOWMAL


Quote:

Originally posted by Penguin:






King of the Mythical Land that is Iowa



As usual, Pengy says more with one picture than lots and lots of words.
This is priceless, I'm gonna snurch it and share it with my family. :)
May I Pengy?



http://www.kidsneedtoread.org

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Friday, February 1, 2013 12:18 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:

Still not socialist because socialism is about common or state ownership. Nothing in the health care law comes close to that. You seem to be stupid and ignorant.



Nothing comes close to that ? Who is it that taxes you , if you don't enlist in Lord Obama's all glorious h-c plan?

The US Govt. But it's no in any way claiming ownership, right ?



Quote:



So by your logic the Left supported a plan which the Right at one time supported and it is the Left that has moved more to the Left or has stayed up. Holy fuck that is retarded.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.



It's funny to see you try to play grown up.



"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

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