REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

One more......

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 29, 2013 08:05
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 840
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Friday, January 25, 2013 9:21 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

After killing his parents and three younger siblings at home, 15-year-old Nehemiah Griego reloaded an assault rifle and a .22-caliber rifle and planned to go somewhere "populated" and randomly shoot more people until he could be killed in a shootout with law enforcement, authorities said.

The New Mexico teen also sent a picture of his dead mother to his girlfriend, and met her and her grandmother at the church where his father used to work, according to charging documents.

It wasn't immediately clear if that contact avoided further bloodshed. But a statement of probable cause says Griego spent time at the church, first talking to his girlfriend and her grandmother and then meeting with the church pastor and a security guard.

Church officials called authorities

After killing his father, Griego said he reloaded the guns so "he could drive to a populated area to murder more people," according to the statement.

His plan, the statement said, was to "shoot people at random and eventually be killed while exchanging gunfire with law enforcement." Much more at http://news.yahoo.com/report-mexico-teen-planned-more-shootings-163446
042.html




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Friday, January 25, 2013 9:36 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Yep. Another person with mental health issues who couldn't, or wouldn't, get help. We really need to do something about mental health care in this country.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Friday, January 25, 2013 10:30 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Amen. Along with all the other ways of coming at the problem, wouldn't you say?

I would also like to see a cite to anywhere it's been determined this kid had mental-health issues. Brought up in what they're describing as a pretty horrific and dysfunctional family, I'm not sure leaping to the conclusion that he's mentally ill is necessarily appropriate. However, the ONE good thing that might come out of all this bullshit is an improvement to our mental-health system. Hopefully...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Friday, January 25, 2013 10:56 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:
I would also like to see a cite to anywhere it's been determined this kid had mental-health issues.



Other than the fact he shot his sleeping mother, then his younger brother who was asleep with her, then his two other younger siblings, then laid in ambush for his father to come home so he could kill him, and then planned on suicide by cop?

If you can posit a reason for someone doing this, other than them having mental health issues, I'd be interested in hearing it.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Friday, January 25, 2013 2:52 PM

AGENTROUKA


Apparently, he took both weapons used "from his parents' closet".

Lack of properly locking away these weapons from their children's reach seems to have been a factor. I mean... apart from whatever it was drove him to this, obviously.

I think mental health issues is a foregone conclusion. The kids himself calls it "anger issues".

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Friday, January 25, 2013 2:56 PM

AGENTROUKA


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:

Brought up in what they're describing as a pretty horrific and dysfunctional family, I'm not sure leaping to the conclusion that he's mentally ill is necessarily appropriate.



Where in the article is that brought up? They state that there is no record of problems and heap praise on the father. Or do you have other sources you didn't link to?

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Saturday, January 26, 2013 7:43 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


It wasn't in an article, it was in two different interviews, one with a Sunday-school teacher of his and one with a neighbor. They indicated a dysfunctional familiy where (as the neighbor said) "I never saw any love expressed between parents and the children). Daddy was a "converted gang member" turned pastor, and according to what I heard from the Sunday-school teacher, was "beyond what I would call strict".
Quote:

The teen had no history of mental illness, and drugs and alcohol didn't appear to be a factor, Houston said. He did note, however, that the teen liked violent video games, including "Modern Warfare" and "Grand Theft Auto." Houston did not say whether he believed the games were a factor.

Greg Griego was a gang member-turned pastor who had once served at Calvary, one of Albuquerque's largest Christian churches. He had an extensive arrest record from his gang days.
....
In addition to the two rifles, there were two 12-gauge pistol-grip shotguns in the home, Houston said. Griego's father had taught him to use guns, and they shot together on a regular basis, Houston said. More at

Quote:

Greg Griego's wife, a son and two daughters were already dead. One of his other sons, Nehemiah, 15, was waiting for him in a bathroom with a high-velocity AR-15 rifle, police say.

Greg Griego, who'd turned around a troubled life and involvement with gangs to become a chaplain .... was returning home from an overnight shift at the Albuquerque Rescue Mission when he was killed early Saturday morning. Excerpts from http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-griego-albuquerq
ue-shooting-20130123,0,5069135.story
]
There's much mention of him loving video games and only coming alive when he discussed them, while having a flat affect when talking about his family and the killing. Where he played the video games isn't mentioned in any article, tho'
Quote:

local media said the home schooled teen wasn’t allowed to play video games, and that his family never let him watch violent shows on television.
....
He waited for her to fall asleep, and then is believed to have helped himself to his parents’ guns, including an AR-15 assault rifle and a .22 caliber pistol.

They’d been kept in a closet, and not in a safe, the report said.Excerpts from: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/n-m-teen-accused-killing-family-
quiet-article-1.1243888#ixzz2J6NwxMzN
I met Nehemiah, I knew something wasn't right," Harrison said Wednesday. "I could feel it, I could see it in his eyes and I could see it in his behavior and his demeanor so the red flags went up and that's when I called the sheriff's department."

Harrison said he drove Griego back to the family's rural southwest Albuquerque home to meet authorities, interviewing him along the way.

"He went into detail of where they were, where the guns were and he was very matter-of-fact, really cold so I knew something wasn't right," Harrison said.
....
He said he doesn't know why Griego decided to come to the church, but that it was like a second home for the boy, who was schooled at his house. Excerpt from http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/23/nehemiah-griego-new-mexico-fa
mily-murder_n_2533035.html
]
There's a video of his uncle giving a statement:
Quote:

That clip doesn’t show other parts of the interview. But, according to local television reports, Griego questioned during the interview the potential role in the killings of his nephew’s 12-year-old girlfriend, with whom Nehemiah reportedly exchanged a series of text messages — including a photograph of 40-year-old Sarah Griego’s dead body. Sheriff’s officials have said the girl is not facing any charges at this time.

"Eric Griego recently appeared on a nationally syndicated talk show, and as a result, the Sheriff has received new requests for interviews today in response to statements apparently made by Mr. Griego. Sheriff Houston stands by the facts as presented in the investigation of this horrific case." Excerpts from http://www.abqjournal.com/main/2013/01/24/abqnewsseeker/bernco-sheriff
-wont-comment-on-griego-family-statements.html
]
What "statements" did Griego make that resulted in people wanting a new interview?
Quote:

The statement noted that several family members were military veterans. "Pictures of [Nehemiah Griego] being circulated in his dad's old fatigues were part of his interest in someday being a soldier," the family statement noted. Excerpt from http://abcnews.go.com/US/alleged-mexico-family-killer-nehemiah-griegos
-girlfriend-tells/story?id=18290148&page=2


We can probably never know what makes a person do what he did, so I'm just trying to put bits and pieces together to get a picture. Tried to find the interviews I saw, but have been unable to.

Obviously news stories can be wrong, nobody but the boy knows why he did what he did, and we can guess forever whether he was suffering from an existing mental illness, snapped, or what.

Trying to put together a picture, I thought about a father who was a gang member then became a pastor (as some who get religion or are reformed from violence can be overly strict and hard to live with, and who can sometimes put themselves into something "redeeming" at the cost of paying attention to their own family), who was homeschooled (thereby not getting normal social interaction), felt the church was a second home (might there have been something wrong with his first home?), wore fatigues and wanted to be in the military, loved violent video games but wasn't allowed to play them or see violent TV at home (maybe played them at his girlfriend's house? Certainly went THERE first after the murders...how much time did he spend there, with a different family?). The father was apparently deeply involved in trying to "save" jail inmates in several places and, coming home at 5am from an overnight shift doing such things again makes me wonder how much time he spent with his own family.

Why would a young man who everyone described as "bright", "polite" and "talented", who'd never had problems with the law before, suddenly do such a thing? Unquestionably he was mentally unstable/really fucked up when he did it, but people don't "suddenly" become mentally ill, there are almost always signs along the way.

I'm just guessing, nothing more, because I find people fascinating and am often curious about what makes them tick. One thing I'm REALLY curious about is why I can't find the two interviews I saw....? I've looked on YouTube, Googled the story, and they're nowhere. All I can tell you is I DID see them...if anyone else unearths one or the other, I'd be grateful if they'd post them.

One other thing is absolutely unquestionable to me: not keeping guns locked away made all this possible.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Sunday, January 27, 2013 7:31 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


I agree that if you have kids and you have guns the guns need to be locked up for safety. Sometimes kids do idiot crap, but you can't take back idiot crap with guns. Mental illness has to start somewhere. Maybe it just sort of ... started. Or maybe it was clear that there was a problem but because the family homeschooled him they were in denial and no one else saw it so no one could say "you guys need to get it checked out". Homeschool families are often too private and don't like to get help, they also seem often to be in denial when things are different with their kids. Can you tell I'm not a fan of homeschooling? I'm only okay with it if its done in a homeschool co op style with other families and kids.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Monday, January 28, 2013 6:17 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up


Quote:

Originally posted by RionaEire:
I agree that if you have kids and you have guns the guns need to be locked up for safety.



I agree.

I believe one of Pres. Obama's proposals was to encourage parents to secure firearms. I'd suggest a possible tax credit for firearms locks and safes, and increased penalties for parents in instances like when their kids get guns and either have accidental shootings or take them to school.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Monday, January 28, 2013 10:27 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


A very good point, and one I hope gets addressed.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Monday, January 28, 2013 10:53 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)





And yet another shooting at a gun show over the weekend. Boy, you can really feel the increased safety, huh?



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Monday, January 28, 2013 4:38 PM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


The thing is, this stuff has been going on for a long time, but now Niki is looking for it, as are you all, so you're noticing it more. That's not to say its not a problem, because it obviously is, but cases of people shooting their family members and then shooting, or almost shooting, themselves, are not new, at least not in my area, they're on the news a lot and its sad. The thing that I think makes this case stick out more is that the shooter is a boy who is not yet grown. It seems like usually these cases, at least in my area, are of a father who shoots his wife and their kid(s).

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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Tuesday, January 29, 2013 7:59 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


No, Riona; I've noticed it for a long time; it's sickened and saddened me, and I'm not "looking for it". Instead of just passing those stories by as potential discussion points here, I'm posting some them. I don't have to look for them; I have several webcites I check first every day, and that's where these stories appear and HAVE BEEN appearing all along.

I'm posting them now because it's an issue that's in the news and I feel that maybe it's time I bring it to our attention in the hopes that maybe some who've been unaware of it realize just HOW OFTEN these things happen; it might actually make someone think a minute, who knows? If it makes just one person think, it's worth it.

Of course it's not new. And what I post is only a miniscule part of what goes on every day in this country. But maybe the fact that it isn't new, it's common, so we don't pay attention to it unless it's something huge, should give us pause.

There are many, many things that can be done in this country to deal with this problem; maybe, just maybe now that it's got the public's--and the legislators'--attention, some steps may be taken to deal with it, instead of just accepting that it "happens all the time" and ignoring it.

As opposed to Rap, who consistently put up stories about Islamic terrorist happenings, none of which happen here and about which we can do very little if anything, I'm putting up instances of what happens every day, something which potentially endangers ALL of us (which Islamic terrorism does NOT, as it happens halfway around the world from us) and about which we MIGHT be able to do something.

I hope you better understand my motivation now.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

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Tuesday, January 29, 2013 8:05 AM

RIONAEIRE

Beir bua agus beannacht


Good points Niki, very well written post.

"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya

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