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TROLLOLOL: News Websites Employ Moderators To Curb Nasty Comments

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Saturday, July 22, 2023 08:28
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Friday, December 27, 2013 10:00 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

Mix blatant bigotry with poor spelling. Add a dash of ALL CAPS. Top it off with a violent threat. And there you have it: A recipe for the worst of online comments, scourge of the Internet.

Blame anonymity, blame politicians, blame human nature. But a growing number of websites are reining in the Wild West of online commentary. Companies including Google and the Huffington Post are trying everything from deploying moderators to forcing people to use their real names in order to restore civil discourse. Some sites, such as Popular Science, are banning comments altogether.

The efforts put sites in a delicate position. User comments add a lively, fresh feel to videos, stories and music. And, of course, the longer visitors stay to read the posts, and the more they come back, the more a site can charge for advertising.

What websites don't want is the kind of off-putting nastiness that spewed forth under a recent CNN.com article about the Affordable Care Act.

"If it were up to me, you progressive libs destroying this country would be hanging from the gallows for treason. People are awakening though. If I were you, I'd be very afraid," wrote someone using the name "JBlaze."

YouTube, which is owned by Google, has long been home to some of the Internet's most juvenile and grammatically incorrect comments. The site caused a stir last month when it began requiring people to log into Google Plus to write a comment. Besides herding users to Google's unified network, the company says the move is designed to raise the level of discourse in the conversations that play out under YouTube videos.

One such video, a Cheerios commercial featuring an interracial family, met with such a barrage of racist responses on YouTube in May that General Mills shut down comments on it altogether.

"Starting this week, when you're watching a video on YouTube, you'll see comments sorted by people you care about first," wrote YouTube product manager Nundu Janakiram and principal engineer Yonatan Zunger in a blog post announcing the changes. "If you post videos on your channel, you also have more tools to moderate welcome and unwelcome conversations. This way, YouTube comments will become conversations that matter to you."

Anonymity has always been a major appeal of online life. Two decades ago, The New Yorker magazine ran a cartoon with a dog sitting in front of a computer, one paw on the keyboard. The caption read: "On the Internet, nobody knows you're a dog." At its best, anonymity allows people to speak freely without repercussions. It allows whistle blowers and protesters to espouse unpopular opinions. At its worst, it allows people to spout off without repercussions. It gives trolls and bullies license to pick arguments, threaten and abuse.

But anonymity has been eroding in recent years. On the Internet, many people may know not only your name, but also your latest musings, the songs you've listened to, your job history, who your friends are and even the brand of soap you prefer.

"It's not so much that our offline lives are going online, it's that our offline and online lives are more integrated," says Mark Lashley, a professor of communications at La Salle University in Philadelphia. Facebook, which requires people to use their real names, played a big part in the seismic shift.

"The way the Web was developed, it was unique in that the avatar and the handle were always these things people used to go by. It did develop into a Wild West situation," he says, adding that it's no surprise that Google and other companies are going this route. "As more people go online and we put more of our lives online, we should be held accountable for things we say."

Nearly three-quarters of teens and young adults think people are more likely to use discriminatory language online or in text messages than in face to face conversations, according to a recent poll from The Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research and MTV. The poll didn't distinguish between anonymous comments and those with real identities attached.

Huffington Post is also clamping down on vicious comments. In addition to employing 40 human moderators who sift through readers' posts for racism, homophobia, hate speech and the like, the AOL-owned news site is also chipping away at anonymous commenting. Previously, anyone could respond to an article posted on the site by creating an account, without tying it to an email address. This fall, HuffPo began requiring people to verify their identity by connecting their accounts to an email address.

"We are reaching a place where the Internet is growing up," says Jimmy Soni, managing editor of HuffPo. "These changes represent a maturing (online) environment."

This doesn't mean that people have to use their names when commenting. But Soni says the changes have already made a difference in the quality of the comments. The lack of total anonymity, while not a failsafe method, offers people a "gut check moment," he says. There have been "significantly fewer things that we would not be able to share with our mothers," in the HuffPo comments section since the change, Soni says.

Newspapers are also turning toward regulated comments. Of the largest 137 U.S. newspapers -- those with daily circulation above 50,000 -- nearly 49 percent ban anonymous commenting, according to Arthur Santana, assistant communications professor at the University of Houston. Nearly 42 percent allow anonymity, while 9 percent do not have comments at all.

Curbing anonymity doesn't always help. Plenty of people are fine attaching their names and Facebook profiles to poorly spelled outbursts that live on long after their fury has passed.

In some cases, sites have gone further. Popular Science, the 141-year-old science and technology magazine, stopped allowing comments of any kind on its news articles in September.

While highlighting responses to articles about climate change and abortion, Popular Science online editor Suzanne LaBarre announced the change and explained in a blog post that comments can be "bad for science."

Because "comments sections tend to be a grotesque reflection of the media culture surrounding them, the cynical work of undermining bedrock scientific doctrine is now being done beneath our own stories," wrote LaBarre.

We can't wait to see the response to this story. http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trollolol-news-websites-employ-moder
ators-to-curb-nasty-comments
]


Sounds familiar...



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Friday, December 27, 2013 11:50 AM

DEVERSE

Hey, Ive been in a firefight before! Well, I was in a fire. Actually, I was fired from a fry-cook opportunity.


While not specifically a "new" phenomena of the internet, I have found more and more websites that feature a comment area are either moderating or just eliminating comments all together. There is certainly more that I notice that have a "report" feature so moderators may be notified of a potentially obnoxious comment.
The part of this I find hilarious is the voices crying out that such actions are a limitation or an out and out violation of the right of freedom of speech. The really amazing part of this is that people think that some right/freedom of the USA extends to cover a website that is not hosted in the USA or that think a website is not owned by anyone and certainly not by someone who may set rules of conduct for comments to the website.

If there is anything surprising about a greater level of moderation occurring on websites is that it didn't happen sooner.


Oh let the sun beat down upon my face;
With stars to fill my dream;
I am a traveler of both time and space;
To be where I have been

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Friday, December 27, 2013 12:17 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Yeah, pretty amazing, isn't it? Given how nasty the internet has become, I just shake my head and smile at all these people screaming "freedom of speech!" like it's a God-given right for everyone, everywhere to say/write everything and anything they want anywhere and everywhere. Kind of like the Second Amendment, a lot of people don't understand what it actually SAYS. Every other website I've ever been on (save one, also dedicated to Firefly) has had moderators; I guess it's not surprising that people like that gravitated to comment sections, where previously there WEREN'T moderators to spew their vile.

I guess it was inevitable, given how virulent the internet has become over time that eventually those kind of people wouldn't consider anyone as having any right to any boundaries whatsoever, and that their "right" to be vicious and foul trumps everyone else's rights. Natural course of the devolution I guess, as are the implementation of some effort to curb it.

Also not surprising, given the right wing has figured out how to use "commenters" to further their agenda. As Folkenflik as told by former Fox News employees:
Quote:

In a chapter focusing on how Fox utilized its notoriously ruthless public relations department, Folkenflik reports that Fox's PR staffers would "post pro-Fox rants" in the comments sections of "negative and even neutral" blog posts written about the network. According to Folkenflik, the staffers used various tactics to cover their tracks, including setting up wireless broadband connections that "could not be traced back" to the network.

Fox PR staffers were expected to counter not just negative and even neutral blog postings but the anti-Fox comments beneath them. One former staffer recalled using twenty different aliases to post pro-Fox rants. Another had one hundred. Several employees had to acquire a cell phone thumb drive to provide a wireless broadband connection that could not be traced back to a Fox News or News Corp account. Another used an AOL dial-up connection, even in the age of widespread broadband access, on the rationale it would be harder to pinpoint its origins. Old laptops were distributed for these cyber operations. Even blogs with minor followings were reviewed to ensure no claim went unchecked. ("Murdoch's World: The Last of the Old Media Empires", pg. 67)




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Friday, December 27, 2013 12:35 PM

BYTEMITE


It doesn't violate the first amendment, but it does call into question online privacy issues and open discourse.

While the nasty stuff does and will always exist, once you start removing that it is all too easy to begin censoring ideas that are inconvenient for the website/ moderators. I've been around. I've seen how that works. I've seen how people with that power inevitably abuse it.

Imagine if you will if the Arab Spring had been censored in this manner. I don't even know if the Arab Spring was GENUINE, but it's important for such venues to remain open, and ANONYMOUS, for legitimate popular movements.

All tying in real world identities does is then tie online activity to real life activity. And while the real world consequences might sound good to everyone in terms of forcing people to moderate their own comments and try for a greater level of civility - there was a lady over the holidays who made some appallingly racist comments about South Africa and AIDs while traveling there on Twitter and was subsequently harranged by the entire world and lost her job before she even LANDED - you must also all realize exactly where this leads to.

It leads to the very kind of cronyism and abuse of power that chased Niki off the boards she used to go to before these. It leads to bullying and power plays and smack down from the authoritarians who do not tolerate dissent.

It leads to Big Brother.

I quote, unusually, from a movie. Which was, in fact, a ridiculous romantic drama - don't judge me - but which happened to sum this up extremely well.

Quote:

America isn't easy. America is advanced citizenship. You gotta want it bad, 'cause it's gonna put up a fight. It's gonna say "You want free speech? Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who's standing center stage and advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours. You want to claim this land as the land of the free? Then the symbol of your country can't just be a flag; the symbol also has to be one of its citizens exercising his right to burn that flag in protest. Show me that, defend that, celebrate that in your classrooms. Then, you can stand up and sing about the "land of the free".


Our country is, has been, and always will be more than just Congress shall make no law. Our country, our society, and our citizenry are driven by the ideals we strive for, the values we hold dear, that were enumerated in that constitution.

We can disagree about them, we can find some of those concepts were worded poorly or have aged poorly. But we ought to think very carefully about the consequences before dismissing them entirely from any public or private venue.

Because if we do, we might find that money has drowned out the voice of the people entirely, and the internet becomes an empty echo chamber, devoid of meaning or connection, a soulless deserted entity used only to hock products.



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Friday, December 27, 2013 12:52 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


First off, it has nothing to do with Constitutional limits, okay? The people in question have every right to shout their opinions from the rooftops, or get their own websites and spew whatever they want. It's not a "right" to attack others, spew obscenities and fake accounts, not to "comment" but specifically to achieve an agenda. The people who pay for those websites have the right to control their own websites.

Second, I don't like moderators either, and believe me, I've experienced my share of their wrongdoing! Which is why I find it particularly sad that NEWS and informational websites are being essentially FORCED to utilize moderators to try and keep their comments sections civil.

ETA: Uh...you edited out your warning at the end, to which I responded before you deleted it: When you have a group of people who are focused on abusing their right to "comment" and are doing so specifically to alienate, attack and misinform to the degree that's happening now, what alternative would you suggest?

ETA: You edited again and rephrased your warning. My question still applies...and if you hadn't noticed, money already HAS drowned out the voice of the people all over this country, and the commenters doing this stuff ARE drowning out the voice of people, by utilizing fake accounts so they can deliberately slather comment sections.

ETA: Damn, you keep revising! And yes, the internet already HAS become "an empty echo chamber" in many ways, and FauxNews has learned how to utilize it as such extremely well, as have others on ALL sides of virtually everything.

So as to my question: What would YOU do as an alternative?


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Friday, December 27, 2013 12:57 PM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

When you have a group of people who are focused on abusing their right to "comment" and are doing so specifically to alienate, attack and misinform to the degree that's happening now, what alternative would you suggest?


The only thing you can do. You let them. And then you answer them with the truth.

TPTB think that money can buy hearts and minds, and that money can buy both forgiveness and easy amnesia.

But so long as venues of information remain open, and there exist dedicated people willing to stand up against the onslaught and refuse to compromise their integrity, money ultimately cannot replace reality.

Quote:

ETA: Damn, you keep revising!


I do that a lot. It is indicative of a disorganized mind. I rarely think of everything I'd like to say in a timely manner, and even more rarely phrase it to the exact specifications I would like the first time around.

Every one of my posts could probably reasonably be considered a work in progress even as it is posted, though I do my best to retain specific points of contention unaltered so as not to disrupt the flow of conversation or change the meaning of the post. If I am talking out my ass, I like that to remain clear, and allow myself to be wrong.

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Friday, December 27, 2013 1:07 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


I disagree. I think a concerted campaign of misinformation INTENDED not to "comment" but to intimidate and misinform those reading the material in question can't effectively be "answered" with the truth--at the very least, not without those determined to counteract it spending many man hours doing so. I don't think making it necessary for them to do so should be a "right" of anyone. Rational critique is valid; ugly bullshit intended merely to intimidate, offend and silence other voices is not, IMHO.

On forums, depending on the forum OWNER's opinion, I have nothing wrong with it; one can choose to be involved or not, as we do here. But why should people have the right to ruin something for everyone else, when they already have the right to put up their OWN website and say whatever they want?

I readily agree it's a double-edged sword and I don't like it AT ALL, but they are making it necessary, as I see it. And screw TPTB; there are quite a few "powers" out there who HAVE bought "hearts and minds", misinformed them, lied to them, and brainwashed them into mindless lemmings as it is, why should they have any "right" to silence others by overwhelming them?

ETA: Okay, I gotta get out of this thread, you edited again and we'll probably keep cross-posting if I keep responding. Just wanted to say yeah, me too about the editing and everything else you wrote on that, but I don't think it's a sign of a "disorganized" mind, rather I think it's more a sign of an ORGANIZED mind; we re-read what we wrote and realize we'd rather say it differently, better, or add something to it.


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Friday, December 27, 2013 1:15 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT


Hey, D.

I like to think of comment boards on a website as the equivalent of a "Letters to the Editor" page of a print newspaper. That page BELONGS to the Publisher- freedom of speech, the Press, whatever, does not apply, other than to HIM. He can print there whatever he receives that he wants to print. Obvious hate speech can go directly into the Dumpster. Even points of view that the Publisher disagrees with CAN be discarded without ever seeing the light of day. That would be considered unethical by today's standards, but it's still pragmatically true.

Now, a discussion site such as this board is slightly different. The same rule COULD still apply: HIM who pays the Bills owns it, so he can censor whatever he wants. Our guy Haken doesn't do that-- he just provides the sandbox and lets us all play however we want, almost all the time. For which we don't salute him often enough.

That proposition of mine is a tricky slippery slope, though---it's pretty easy to decide that something is objectionable, or blasphemous, or just hate speech or insulting and drop the hammer on it, just because you disagree with it.

But censoring something just on the basis of taste or insultingness MIGHT be a desirable feature. It might improve the tone of the discussion. Or NOT.

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Friday, December 27, 2013 2:02 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Their website, their rules.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Saturday, December 28, 2013 10:11 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


"I like to think of comment boards on a website as the equivalent of a "Letters to the Editor" page of a print newspaper." Good point, NewOld, the comparison is absolutely right on with letters to the editor of "the old days".


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Saturday, December 28, 2013 11:09 AM

WHOZIT


Quote:

Originally posted by DEVERSE:
While not specifically a "new" phenomena of the internet, I have found more and more websites that feature a comment area are either moderating or just eliminating comments all together. There is certainly more that I notice that have a "report" feature so moderators may be notified of a potentially obnoxious comment.
The part of this I find hilarious is the voices crying out that such actions are a limitation or an out and out violation of the right of freedom of speech. The really amazing part of this is that people think that some right/freedom of the USA extends to cover a website that is not hosted in the USA or that think a website is not owned by anyone and certainly not by someone who may set rules of conduct for comments to the website.

If there is anything surprising about a greater level of moderation occurring on websites is that it didn't happen sooner.


Oh let the sun beat down upon my face;
With stars to fill my dream;
I am a traveler of both time and space;
To be where I have been



True, many sites with comments sections do not want filthy posts, some people who post on sites type some pretty nasty stuff that should be removed. Some sites BAN some people who go way over the top.

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Tuesday, December 31, 2013 6:21 AM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by M52NICKERSON:
Their website, their rules.


This, exactly this.
And for which the mighty Haken does not recieve half enough credit for allowing RWED to be a hands-off free-for-all where one can't depend on a "friendly" moderator to SILENCE the opposition for you, and you MUST represent your position effectively or be curbstomped into a laughingstock.

But credit he has, and my respect, which is not easily earned, for such, because all too many forums fall to silencing voices of dissent and become useless to debate, resulting in a circlejerk of ego stroke and soon enough following, the failure of the forum cause there's nothing TO discuss, given that all opposing forces have long since learned they'll simply be banned for their temerity and thus have no means to argue the point.

Not to mention just how amusing it is to watch our reichwingnuts whimper and flail helplessly, drowning in a sea of their own incompetence and incoherence, without a mod to bail them out, cause that just never does get old, does it now ?

-Frem

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Saturday, July 22, 2023 8:28 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

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