REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Jill Stein's recount effort .. now dead

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Saturday, December 17, 2016 19:18
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Saturday, December 3, 2016 11:10 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

The Green Party cannot build the political power necessary for the transformative changes we need by allying with two capitalist parties that serve the interests of the wealthy. That is why it is imperative that the Green Party is independent of those parties. We stay independent to give people an alternative to the corruption of two money-based parties. Greens reject donations from corporations and their political action committees to ensure we are accountable to the people and so that the people’s agenda is not superseded by the corporate agenda.

There are significant electoral reforms needed to make elections more democratic and more representative of the people. While we support electoral reforms, including how the vote is counted, we do not support the current recount being undertaken by Jill Stein.



Full statement here.

http://www.flowersforsenate.org/greens_speak_out_recount

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 12:30 AM

RIVERLOVE


Jill Franken-Stein dropped her recount effort in Pennsylvania today.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/12/03/politics/jill-stein-drops-pennsylvania-r
ecount/index.html



eta: Hours after announcing she was dropping her recount quest the psycho said it was back on.
Hi-larious!

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 11:49 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Jill is forging ahead with a lawsuit filed in Federal court, on "Constitutional" grounds. If the PA and WI recount isn't completed in time, their electors will not be represented in the Electoral College.

According to WI observers, Democrats are slowing down the recount. This fits in with my concept of Jill's plan, which is to delay enough Electors from the Electoral College so that there is a numerical hope of persuading enough Electors to defect, or muck up the Electoral College vote so that Trump's election is in doubt.

In theory, Trump had 306 Electoral College votes. Seven Electors have already pledged to be "faithless", so that's 299. If WI (10) and PA (20) can't attend the Electoral college, that's 269. Still well more than Hillary's 232 (and doubtful that there would be 37 18 more "faithless Electors") but less than 270.

In the meantime, the Democratic Party is doing its best to claw back victory from the jaws of a defeat that they themselves engineered when they decided to crown their beloved entitled Hillary...

Quote:

Unprecedented harassment': Pa. GOP slams state for releasing Trump electors' contact information

http://www.pennlive.com/news/2016/12/unprecedented_harassment_pagop.ht
ml


and
Quote:

Pennsylvania's electors are getting deluged with anti-Trump messages

http://triblive.com/politics/politicalheadlines/11570991-74/electors-s
tate-pennsylvania


This may sound like good news for liberaloids, but it is setting up the nation for a revolt. The DNC is now resorting to after-the-fact "dirty tricks" to upend the chessboard because they don't like the results. And Jill is helping them. If the DNC DOES manage to put frail Hillary in office she will be nothing but a puppet for neocons and globalists of both parties, and every other politician will resist her every step of the way: NONE of her "progressive agenda" will ever be enacted, and we will have 8 Supreme Court Justices to the end of her term.

Jill, of course, has destroyed her own reputation with the Green Party.

*Shouts and waves* I hope the money was worth it, Jill!

The DNC should just have run a VIABLE candidate instead of bowing to big-money interests. Bernie would have won in a landslide, and it's doubtful that he would even be that damaging to the elites and the neocons, given the GOP Congress. But having shot themselves in the head, the DNC is ready to shoot the GOP in the foot.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 12:56 PM

REAVERFAN


Why is everyone so upset if there's nothing to hide?

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 2:40 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by reaverfan:
Why is everyone so upset if there's nothing to hide?



By demanding a complete hand-recount, Jill Stein places completion of the recount beyond the date required for certification. And that makes it nothing more than interference in the process.

And it's not even necessary. Dood, I do QA on all kinds of data. ONE aspect of QA is that you can take a subset of results for closer examination.

For example, let's say that I have 1000 samples. If I re-analyze 10 percent (chosen at random) that will reveal whether or not there are significant errors. Similarly, I can do a hand-recount on some of the votes, and compare that to the machine count. If they're within the expected error of each other (ALL counting processes have error, even hand-counting) then I can accept the overall results.

Otherwise, I can validate the vote-counting machines specifically. To confirm it's accuracy, I just run a set of known test-ballots through the machines and THEN confirm that the results are as expected (within the known accuracy of the vote). At that point, I can do a MACHINE recount on ALL of the ballots, because I've validated the machine.

If the data is transmitted to a database on a remote server, and I'm concerned about the data transmission or it's authenticity on the remote database, I can then take my known data and compare it to the remote results.

Like I said, I'm pretty sure Jill is insisting on the kind of recounts that she is, not because it's necessary but because she wants to take the recount states out of the Electoral College.

That explains why she's focusing only on the states that Trump won, not on the states that Hillary won by a narrow margin. That makes her a shill for Hillary.

Capisce?



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 2:44 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



It's not that people want to 'hide' the vote count - it's that Jill and the DNC want entire states to be dropped from the count completely - they want to disenfranchise all voters from targeted states.

I think republicans should get in the game, and do that to states that voted for Hillary.




How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 3:01 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

It's not that people want to 'hide' the vote count - it's that Jill and the DNC want entire states to be dropped from the count completely - they want to disenfranchise all voters from targeted states.

I think republicans should get in the game, and do that to states that voted for Hillary.



Good idea!



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 3:35 PM

REAVERFAN


Unsatisfactory answer. Trump won, yet exit polls showed him down by 4%. Again, if there's nothing to hide, why should you care?

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 4:01 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Unsatisfactory answer
No, it's a completely satisfactory answer. Part of the problem isn't whether or not to recount, but HOW to do the recount. I think I repeated the concept "full hand recount" SEVERAL times, no??? I thought I was pretty clear what the problem was!

Quote:

In Michigan, the Board of State Canvassers certified Trump's win over Clinton by 10,704 votes out of about 4.8 million cast. Stein's team said it plans to demand a statewide hand-recount on Wednesday, in accordance with the 48-hour deadline to do so.

In Wisconsin, where Trump defeated Clinton by a percentage point, the bipartisan state Elections Commission announced plans to begin a recount on Thursday, provided that proper payment for the recount has been received by the state. It rejected the Stein campaign’s request for a statewide hand recount, instead leaving it to each county to decide whether to use a machine or not. The Stein campaign said it was filing a legal challenge to trigger an all-hand recount.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/11/28/jill-s
tein-files-for-recount-in-pennsylvania-as-trump-team-keeps-up-talk-of-voter-fraud-with-no-evidence
/

Quote:

The Stein campaign wants to go farther than that. It wants a full hand recount of the votes in counties that use opti-scan machines, which are similar to machines that scan standardized tests. These machines have a paper trail, and county officials say a recount would involve recounting the paper ballots
.
http://billypenn.com/2016/11/29/jill-steins-pennsylvania-recount-lawsu
it-gets-a-hearing
/


Given that a full hand recount of all of the votes is ENTIRELY UNNECESSARY (and I outlined several procedures that could be used to objectively assess the vote without having to go through the pain of a full hand-recount) and that this procedure could make the three targeted (Trump only) states unable to certify their votes on time, Jill's actions look like nothing so much as a partisan time-wasting election-tampering effort.

Quote:

Trump won, yet exit polls showed him down by 4%.

Where?

When?

Cites please.



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 4:19 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

yet exit polls showed him down by 4%


Cite? Country-wide? In contested states?






How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?

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Sunday, December 4, 2016 7:49 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


So - FWIW I was for a recount - and still am, up until it voids all the votes from entire states.

All you Hillary-philes - is that a cost you find acceptable to get the result you want?




How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?

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Monday, December 5, 2016 10:50 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.



Quote:

yet exit polls showed him down by 4% -REAVERFAN

Cite? Country-wide? In contested states?- KIKI

I guess REAVERFAN is still trying to find that data.




-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Monday, December 5, 2016 11:02 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



All you Hillary-philes - is voiding all votes from entire states a cost you find acceptable to get the result you want?
As for my general question - I didn't realize it was so difficult for so many people! I THOUGHT the answer - which is 'NO!' - would be obvious to everyone. Especially to lovers of freedom and democracy.




How did your beloved 'democratic' party fuck up so badly?

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Monday, December 5, 2016 11:10 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.



Quote:

All you Hillary-philes - is voiding all votes from entire states a cost you find acceptable to get the result you want? ....

As for my general question - I didn't realize it was so difficult for so many people! I THOUGHT the answer - which is 'NO!' - would be obvious to everyone. Especially to lovers of freedom and democracy.

I guess Hillary-philes are still looking for that answer too!



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Friday, December 9, 2016 9:54 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Here is a good summary of where the recounts stand:

Quote:

The recount is more than 70% complete in Wisconsin, and Clinton has gained just 82 votes on Trump, who won the state by more than 22,000 votes...The recount is on schedule to finish by the Monday deadline.

The Michigan presidential recount that involved about 34 counties is on hold and may not be completed after a federal judge's ruling Wednesday.... The state elections board said the recount would stop after Goldsmith's decision. Trump won Michigan by about 10,700 votes over Clinton. ... One county — Ingham — had finished its recount of more than 134,000 ballots Wednesday. As a result, President-elect Trump gained 73 votes, while Hillary Clinton gained 138. Green Party candidate Stein lost two votes.

Green Party-backed lawyers continued to be in a holding pattern Wednesday after asking a federal judge Monday to order a recount of the [Pennsylvania] state’s Nov. 8 presidential election result. Stein's request for a recount must wait at least until a federal court hearing on Friday, just four days before the Dec. 13 federal deadline for states to certify their election results. [Recount not possible]

A partial recount continued in Nevada at the request of independent presidential candidate Roque De La Fuente ... Secretary of State spokeswoman Gail Anderson said the recount will be finished by the end of this week.

Three Central Florida voters have ... filed [a lawsuit] Monday in Leon Circuit Court, they assert that Clinton, not Trump, actually won Florida... They're asking for a hand recount of every paper ballot in Florida, at the expense of defendants including President-elect Trump, Gov. Rick Scott and the 29 Republican presidential electors from Florida. But ... Clint Curtis, an Orlando attorney representing the plaintiffs, said the defendants may not respond by the time the Electoral College meets on Dec. 19.


MORE AT
http://www.freep.com/story/news/nation/2016/12/06/election-2016-recoun
t-where-5-states-stand/95037554
/

What I would suggest is that rather than trying to upend the vote, Jill Stein and other interested parties pay for an after-the-fact recount of the counties or cities that they find most troubling, and seek to improve the voting system using that data. It is almost impossible to do a decent recount under the current rushed situation.

It was an after-the-fact recount of the FL vote, paid for by a consortium of seven newspapers, which led to the revelation that it wasn't "hanging chads" which swung the vote, but an ELECTRONIC MISCOUNT which deducted about 1200 counts from Gore. IF the news media wants to redeem its reputation from their biased pre-election coverage, this ... and followup ... would be a worthwhile project.





-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Friday, December 9, 2016 10:25 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Keep recounting until you get the result you want.

Worked for Al Franken in MN. Worked in the WA gubernatorial election...

But the votes here are too wide. No evidence of vast voter tampering, even though in Michigan, 18,000 votes were cast w/ out any voter ID presented.

Do ANYTHING they can think of to disrupt, agitate, harass the system.

ANYTHING.

Michael Moore, who gave possibly the best impassioned reasons as to why anyone was going to vote FOR Trump is now saying he plans to some how disrupt the Inauguration.


Crazy is what the Left call home


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Sunday, December 11, 2016 3:25 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


I think Jill Stein was actually, quite possibly, the smartest 3rd Party outsider EVER....

She just did what NO political shill from either side could have ever or would have ever done....

Michigan is changing it's Statewide laws concerning Voting after this recount, and unearthing the nearly 20,000 false ballots that were cast. They are even spending 3 Million Dollars in a program that will give free State IDs to ANY legitimate Citizen, and will require the photo ID when you vote in an election in the future.

You would still be able to cast an "Absentee Ballot", but assuming you weren't overseas serving in the millitary or were incapacitated and on hospice, you would have 10 days to show up and give your photo ID as proof of citizenship or your vote is thrown out.




This is EXACTLY what I said should happen in other threads.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, December 11, 2016 7:18 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Just to clarify

Quote:

Thanks, Jill: Michigan House passes voter-ID bill after vote-fraud hyperbole

Be careful what you wish for … you just might get it. Jill Stein didn’t get the recount she wanted in Michigan, but she did get the state to take vote-integrity issues seriously. Meeting in its lame-duck session, the state House of Representatives passed a tough voter-ID bill that includes $3 million for funding of free state identification and birth certificates after over 18,000 voters cast ballots without identification in the presidential election:

Michigan’s Republican-led House on Wednesday night approved a strict voter identification proposal over strenuous objections from Democrats who argued the plan could disenfranchise properly registered voters.

Michigan voters without photo identification could still cast a provisional ballot under the controversial legislation, but they would have to bring an ID to their local clerk’s office within 10 days of an election in order for their vote to count.


Current law requires a photo ID too, but also allows for voters to sign an affidavit under oath that attests to their identity and eligibility. The House might have had ample reason to wonder about abuse under that system when looking at the distribution of the practice. The Detroit News’ Jonathan Oostling reports that almost half of all such votes took place in heavily Democratic Wayne County, and almost 6,000 in the city of Detroit alone. That seems oddly disproportional, given that Wayne County accounted for just 16% of the state’s total.

It’s worth noting that Trump won Michigan by 10,704 votes, well below that total of non-ID ballots. That might tend to bolster Stein’s general complaint about potential voter fraud, but a recount wouldn’t be able to determine whether those ballots were cast fraudulently anyway. Ballots are cast secretly, so they do not contain any identifying marks. Once cast, a ballot from an ineligible voter is indistinguishable from legitimate ballots, and a recount would count them again, too. If the recount is about integrity and not the outcome, then Stein and her allies should be cheering this change in the statute, assuming it passes the state Senate.

What about that? Republicans have a supermajority in Michigan’s upper chamber, 27-11, so it would seem to be a slam-dunk that this change will get to Governor Rick Snyder’s desk. The GOP did lose a couple of members on the House vote, but they’ve got room to breathe in the Senate. Unless Snyder surprises Republicans with a veto, the bill should pass into law at the end of the session. About that, though …

Gov. Rick Snyder of Michigan surprised his fellow Republicans on Tuesday, refusing to sign two bills that would have required voters to show photo identification before obtaining an absentee ballot. The vetoes are an election-year rarity for the party, which has pressed for tougher voter identification laws nationwide.

The bills were among three that Mr. Snyder returned to legislators after approving 11 other measures in a package of election changes based on proposals by Michigan’s secretary of state, Ruth Johnson. They were passed by lawmakers two weeks ago. “These reforms will make a good election system even better by adding appropriate safeguards and improving transparency,” Mr. Snyder said. He said the vetoed bills “could create voter confusion among absentee voters.”

Sara Wurfel, a spokeswoman for the governor, said that confusion had to do with a part of the bills that would have made voters check a citizenship box before receiving a ballot. Mr. Snyder suggested that verification of a person’s citizenship should be done only once, when a voter is first registered, she said.


That happened in 2012, and the citizenship checkbox requirement has been dropped. Snyder’s in his second term now too, and might feel more ready to implement better protection against voter fraud and ballot integrity — now that Stein’s paved the way for action. Thanks, Jill!


http://hotair.com/archives/2016/12/08/thanks-jill-michigan-house-passe
s-voter-id-bill-after-vote-fraud-hyperbole
/



-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

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Sunday, December 11, 2016 9:25 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Thank you for the link Sigs...

I'd hate to think that something I posted while under the influence of 20 or so cheap beers was an untruth.

Reading that article not only confirms what I said, but also confirms the truth of the "Fake News" Outlet I watched it from on YouTube.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, December 11, 2016 4:53 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Keep recounting until you get the result you want.

Worked for Al Franken in MN. Worked in the WA gubernatorial election...

But the votes here are too wide. No evidence of vast voter tampering, even though in Michigan, 18,000 votes were cast w/ out any voter ID presented.

Crazy is what the Left call home


Funny how recounting until you get the result you want only seems to work for Libtards, huh?

That Al Franken abortion was a rape of the Election process.

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Sunday, December 11, 2016 8:52 PM

RIVERLOVE


Quote:


That Al Franken abortion was a rape of the Election process.


That recount was challenged in the courts by Norm Coleman and they ruled against him. So it wasn't a "rape of the election process". It was the legal and lawful way disputes are settled in America. You win some, you lose some.

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Monday, December 12, 2016 7:51 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by Riverlove:
Quote:


That Al Franken abortion was a rape of the Election process.


That recount was challenged in the courts by Norm Coleman and they ruled against him. So it wasn't a "rape of the election process". It was the legal and lawful way disputes are settled in America. You win some, you lose some.


yeah. When the judges are Libtards appointed by Libtards and ruling as Libtards, they are anonymously dubbed "Judges". But when they can think for themselves and not always follow Party directives, they are "partisan" and "conservative" and "right".

So they have a 5 Judge Panel to rule that right-leaning ballots such as Military Service members serving abroad and voting via absentee are disqualified without standard, but wrong-leaning ballots such as those from felons voting absentee from prison are included. Although Coleman had a lead in the votes, the Panel took away the lead and gifted it to Franken, the Democrat Farm Labor party candidate. Thousands of votes were thrown into play, with hundreds of vote margins. Ballots went missing, and then some were double-counted (of course, this was in Dem-controlled Minneapolis).
So then the 3-Judge Panel is appointed by DFL supporting African-American Justice Alan Page, who appoints as the leader his fellow DFL crony Judge Elizabeth Hayden (already a hack DFL appointee), and Kurt Marben (an "Independent" appointee from Gov Ventura), and Denise D. Reilly, the pretend balance, (appointed by a liberal GOP Governor, and spirited away from that bastion of balance and fairness, U-Minn Law School, where she was a Professor).


Stacking the deck to make a railroad to a pre-ordained conclusion of raping the Election process and defrauding the election and disenfranchising the honest voters of MN does not a "win some, lose some" scenario make.

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Saturday, December 17, 2016 5:26 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


It looks like the recount effort has died.

Interestingly, the worst problems in Michigan were in Detroit, where Democrats were in charge of the precincts. In many cases there were more votes tallied than there were votes in the ballot box. Usually it was just by one or two votes, but in one case there were 250 votes tallied and only 90 ballots.

I still would be interested in what a recount would show, but for Democrats I guess the advice would be "Be careful what you wish for".




-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake


"If I could write inflammatory commentary to scorch the eye brows and lashes off Trump, Signym or 1kiki, I would.- SECOND"

You're suffering from the various stages of grief including bargaining, denial, and anger, all at once


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Saturday, December 17, 2016 7:18 PM

RIVERLOVE


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

It looks like the recount effort has died.


It was D.O.A. from the git-go.

Quote:

Interestingly, the worst problems in Michigan were in Detroit, where Democrats were in charge of the precincts. In many cases there were more votes tallied than there were votes in the ballot box. Usually it was just by one or two votes, but in one case there were 250 votes tallied and only 90 ballots.

Not surprising their math is askew. When they run out of fingers it gets tough for 'em.

Quote:

I still would be interested in what a recount would show, but for Democrats I guess the advice would be "Be careful what you wish for".

The final recount in Wisc. had Trump picking up a couple hundred more votes. The recount in Penn. never started.

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