REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Countdown Clock to Trumps impeachment " STARTS"

POSTED BY: THGRRI
UPDATED: Friday, September 13, 2019 14:50
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Sunday, September 30, 2018 2:17 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN



Only 2,404 days remaining on the Impeachment Clock.

How exciting. 001380

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Sunday, September 30, 2018 5:47 PM

THG


Big donor to Trump campaign made overture to top Russian official, boasting of connections

The businessman, who donated $273,000 in 2016, wanted a face-to-face meeting with a Russian official.

A Russian-born American businessman who gave hundreds of thousands of dollars to support Donald Trump's run for president in 2016 offered to brief a high-ranking Russian official during the final months of the campaign, according to a series of emails reviewed by NBC News.

The businessman, Simon Kukes, a Houston-based oil executive, sent an email to the official in Moscow in July 2016, boasting of his connections to the Trump campaign and requesting a face-to-face meeting.


“I have been actively involved in Trump’s election campaign, and am part of the group on strategy development,” Kukes wrote in the email to Vyacheslav Pavlovsky, vice president of the state-owned Russian Railways and a former Russian ambassador to Norway. “I will be in Switzerland July 20th till August 2nd. Let me know how you are doing, and whether you want to meet.”

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/big-donor-trump-campaign
-made-overture-top-russian-official-boasting-n913791


tick tock
T


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Sunday, September 30, 2018 8:41 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted:
37 days left until the Nov. elections and subpoena power.

tick tock

T



Maybe.

I don't know if I'd go trusting those polls from the same people who were telling you certainties 2 years ago though.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Are there really any polls left suggesting Dems have a chance?

Other than 2nd graders.



Every one I've seen has them taking the house pretty easily, although they are showing that taking the senate is a long shot.

I'd say that if you think that the hidden Trump vote meant something in 2016, it's got to be double that in 2018, assuming people go out and vote.

The moral outrage that began in the build up to the 2016 election has reached a fever pitch and anybody who would come out and say that they support the Republican Party could be labeled a rapist or a nazi or a rape sympathizer, yada yada yada.

I don't think that vote is going to go favorably for the Democrats in November.



I've seen evidence of a glimmer of hope though. The wild claims by the extreme Leftists are becoming so insane that everybody else is starting seeing them for what they are... most importantly, the center-left Liberals. Like any moral outrage like the right-wing Satanic Panic of the 80's, McCarthyism, or the Salem Witch trials, this too will pass.

It won't be in time for the 2018 election, but it might be in time for the 2020 election. Time will tell.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, September 30, 2018 10:28 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted:
37 days left until the Nov. elections and subpoena power.

tick tock

T



Maybe.

I don't know if I'd go trusting those polls from the same people who were telling you certainties 2 years ago though.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Are there really any polls left suggesting Dems have a chance?

Other than 2nd graders.


Every one I've seen has them taking the house pretty easily, although they are showing that taking the senate is a long shot.

I'd say that if you think that the hidden Trump vote meant something in 2016, it's got to be double that in 2018, assuming people go out and vote.

The moral outrage that began in the build up to the 2016 election has reached a fever pitch and anybody who would come out and say that they support the Republican Party could be labeled a rapist or a nazi or a rape sympathizer, yada yada yada.

I don't think that vote is going to go favorably for the Democrats in November.



I've seen evidence of a glimmer of hope though. The wild claims by the extreme Leftists are becoming so insane that everybody else is starting seeing them for what they are... most importantly, the center-left Liberals. Like any moral outrage like the right-wing Satanic Panic of the 80's, McCarthyism, or the Salem Witch trials, this too will pass.

It won't be in time for the 2018 election, but it might be in time for the 2020 election. Time will tell.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

You mean the 43 Seat majority that GoP has in the House will be wiped out? Seriously?
I believe it is currently 236 to 193. Where are these flips going to take place? I would wager none of the House seats from WI flipping. Nor Gov. But Sen will.

I can't believe that a list of these 25 States could be too burdensome to itemize.

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Tuesday, October 2, 2018 9:53 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

The wild claims by the extreme Leftists are becoming so insane that everybody else is starting seeing them for what they are... most importantly, the center-left Liberals. Like any moral outrage like the right-wing Satanic Panic of the 80's, McCarthyism, or the Salem Witch trials, this too will pass.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Like this claim that Trump is the Tax Cheater in Chief?
Quote:

The manipulation of values to evade taxes was central to one of the most important financial events in Donald Trump’s life. In an episode never before revealed, Mr. Trump and his siblings gained ownership of most of their father’s empire on Nov. 22, 1997, a year and a half before Fred Trump’s death. Critical to the complex transaction was the value put on the real estate. The lower its value, the lower the gift taxes. The Trumps dodged hundreds of millions in gift taxes by submitting tax returns that grossly undervalued the properties, claiming they were worth just $41.4 million.

The same set of buildings would be sold off over the next decade for more than 16 times that amount.

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-sc
hemes-fred-trump.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, October 2, 2018 11:01 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You mean the 43 Seat majority that GoP has in the House will be wiped out? Seriously?
I believe it is currently 236 to 193. Where are these flips going to take place? I would wager none of the House seats from WI flipping. Nor Gov. But Sen will.

I can't believe that a list of these 25 States could be too burdensome to itemize.



I'm not personally making the argument. I'm just saying that any polls I've seen show the likely hood of the GOP maintaining the house as a long shot.

If I were a gambling man that's not the way that I'd wager though.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, October 2, 2018 11:04 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Like this claim that Trump is the Tax Cheater in Chief?



No. That's an example of something that might be legitimate, but won't be taken seriously by anybody because it's lost in the last 700+ different anti-Trump stories the news has shit out every day since he was in office.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 7:33 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Like this claim that Trump is the Tax Cheater in Chief?



No. That's an example of something that might be legitimate, but won't be taken seriously by anybody because it's lost in the last 700+ different anti-Trump stories the news has shit out every day since he was in office.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

I think you touched on the ultimate difference between the bottom 50% of the population and the top 50% -- being able to tune out the noise and concentrate on the signal. Somebody at bottom would see this story and they would envy Trump. Maybe be angry at life's unfairness, but they would still vote for him again if they had the chance. Somebody at the top would find it extremely revealing of Trump's motivations, because the story contradicts everything Trump has said about himself. It also involves Trump stealing $ billions in taxes, more and more the older Donald got:
Quote:

Fred Trump was relentless and creative in finding ways to channel this wealth to his children. By age 3, Donald Trump was earning $200,000 a year in today’s dollars from his father’s empire. He was a millionaire by age 8. By the time he was 17, his father had given him part ownership of a 52-unit apartment building. Soon after Mr. Trump graduated from college, he was receiving the equivalent of $1 million a year from his father. The money increased with the years, to more than $5 million annually in his 40s and 50s.

Fred Trump’s real estate empire was not just scores of apartment buildings. It was also a mountain of cash, tens of millions of dollars in profits building up inside his businesses, banking records show. In one six-year span, from 1988 through 1993, Fred Trump reported $109.7 million in total income, now equivalent to $210.7 million. It was not unusual for tens of millions in Treasury bills and certificates of deposit to flow through his personal bank accounts each month.

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-sc
hemes-fred-trump.html


The Times was able to trace this out because Donald Trump's father got rich from government housing loans. The Times put together a picture of how government favored the Trumps, who in gratitude then cheated on the taxes they owed the government. That would include Donald Trump, who followed the family example.

To summarize: Trump has been a huge tax cheater for all the life of his father, who died in 1999, and after, as his father's estate was sold off.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 8:38 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Like this claim that Trump is the Tax Cheater in Chief?



No. That's an example of something that might be legitimate, but won't be taken seriously by anybody because it's lost in the last 700+ different anti-Trump stories the news has shit out every day since he was in office.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

I think you touched on the ultimate difference between the bottom 50% of the population and the top 50% -- being able to tune out the noise and concentrate on the signal. Somebody at bottom would see this story and they would envy Trump. Maybe be angry at life's unfairness, but they would still vote for him again if they had the chance. Somebody at the top would find it extremely revealing of Trump's motivations, because the story contradicts everything Trump has said about himself.



lol. That's cute. You took an entire paragraph to say that Democrats are smarter than Republicans.

How's that for tuning out the noise and concentrating on the signal, Second?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 9:11 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

lol. That's cute. You took an entire paragraph to say that Democrats are smarter than Republicans.

How's that for tuning out the noise and concentrating on the signal, Second?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Jesus Christ, 6ixStringJack, what is wrong with you? Do you ever stop and wonder why you are not rich, when you are obviously, at least to me, smarter, stronger, harder working than the typical 1 Percenter? Probably one of the following: a) You didn't click the link. b) You didn't read it. c) You didn't try hard enough to understand what you were reading. Repeat that a few thousand times, or some equivalent example that doesn't involve the internet, and you can waste your entire life.

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-sc
hemes-fred-trump.html
Quote:

GRAT is short for grantor-retained annuity trust.

The Times found evidence that the Trumps dodged hundreds of millions of dollars in gift taxes by submitting tax returns that grossly undervalued the real estate assets they placed in Fred and Mary Trump’s GRATs.

According to Fred Trump’s 1995 gift tax return, obtained by The Times, the Trumps claimed that properties including 25 apartment complexes with 6,988 apartments — and twice the floor space of the Empire State Building — were worth just $41.4 million. The implausibility of this claim would be made plain in 2004, when banks put a valuation of nearly $900 million on that same real estate.

The methods the Trumps used to pull off this incredible shrinking act were hatched in the strategy sessions Donald Trump participated in during the early 1990s, documents and interviews show. Their basic strategy had two components: Get what is widely known as a “friendly” appraisal of the empire’s worth, then drive that number even lower by changing the ownership structure to make the empire look less valuable to the I.R.S.



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 11:42 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
Jesus Christ, 6ixStringJack, what is wrong with you? Do you ever stop and wonder why you are not rich, when you are obviously, at least to me, smarter, stronger, harder working than the typical 1 Percenter? Probably one of the following: a) You didn't click the link. b) You didn't read it. c) You didn't try hard enough to understand what you were reading. Repeat that a few thousand times, or some equivalent example that doesn't involve the internet, and you can waste your entire life.



I'm not sure what your game is here, friend.

That's got to be the nicest thing I've ever seen you say about anybody... in the RWED or otherwise.

I'm sure you'll forgive me if I don't trust the motivations behind your flattery.



Assuming I take everything you just said at face value, what do you propose here? That reading this particular anti-Trump story is going to change my life and begin my climb into the 1%?

I've mentioned before that I don't want to be rich. I don't want power or responsibility. I want to be free to do as I please and have the freedom to say "I Won't" when somebody tries to take that away from me. Sure, it would be nice to have just a little bit more to have some fun money, but I'm working on that.


Nobody can say for sure where they'd be right now if things were different 2 years ago, but I can't imagine that I wouldn't be somewhere along the same path that I am right now if Hillary had won and/or I voted for her. It was either turn my life around or die. I chose the former. I can't imagine that if Hillary had won that I would have chosen the latter on her account.

Trump hasn't done anything to improve my lot in life in the last 2 years. Save for about a hundred extra bucks I'll get on my tax returns next year, I've never once claimed that he has. I know that I'm living life far below my potential, but I'm 1000% better than where I was 2 years ago and I really don't want or need much more than I have right now.

The financial shenanigans that all of our Corrupt Politicians pull on both sides of the aisle are so far removed from my life that they might as well be on the moon. None of them are ever going to ask for my opinion about it, and I'm in no position to do anything about it either.

So again, I'll ask... what exactly is your game here?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 2:07 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

So again, I'll ask... what exactly is your game here?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

6ix, you made another one of those arguments that it does not matter who you vote for. Stop doing that, please. I vote, too, and I mostly lose. The Federal government was never intended to be responsive to your and my needs. You are smart enough to know that. Trump is probably not the only person who scammed you, 6ixStringJack. You cannot hit back at Trump, but there are people closer to you that you can get to do what you want. Be more alert and thereby avoid misfortunes in the future. (This is starting to sound like fortune cookie philosophy.) 6ix, you can do it, while I know a lot of people who cannot, for various sad reasons.

Show fff.net that you see through Trump's games. He will continue for years to deny his fortune was built on tax cheating. Congress might not care. Voters might not care. But New York state might care enough to make a tax case against Trump. Since we are talking about a $ billion, Trump will spend $millions on lawyers to delay justice for many years. Don't expect this to go to trial anytime soon.
Quote:

The practices allowed Trump and his siblings to inherit more than $1 billion from his father's real estate empire while paying a fraction of what they should have owed in gift and estate taxes, according to the Times.
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/409623-trump-blasts-nyt-ta
x-story-a-hit-piece



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 5:10 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
6ix, you made another one of those arguments that it does not matter who you vote for. Stop doing that, please. I vote, too, and I mostly lose. The Federal government was never intended to be responsive to your and my needs. You are smart enough to know that. Trump is probably not the only person who scammed you, 6ixStringJack. You cannot hit back at Trump, but there are people closer to you that you can get to do what you want. Be more alert and thereby avoid misfortunes in the future. (This is starting to sound like fortune cookie philosophy.) 6ix, you can do it, while I know a lot of people who cannot, for various sad reasons.



I'm pretty sure at this point that I'm being scammed by any politician from local on up that has had any jurisdiction in my vicinity since I was born. The good news is, I'm in good company.

I've done well in local elections, but at the cost of other people. It's kind of a zero sum game when there are limited resources around. I'm sure I've talked about my property taxes before and how I cut them in half on my own without needing to get any lawyers involved. After that, I voted in the right people who took our situation to the state and struck an agreement with the legislature that if specific changes weren't made within the spending of an adjoining city in our township, that we could seceded from it and join one of the others in the vicinity. This further dropped my property taxes another $200 per year, for a total of around $1,400 in tax savings every year less than the price the previous owners were unwittingly paying.

But like I said, that comes at a cost to somebody else. Somebody else had to make up the $1,200 that I wasn't paying after I proved my case, and the $200 per year I'm saving reflects a tax savings for everybody in my city which is coming out of the poor relief of a city that was using more than anybody else by about 30 times. Shortly after this all went down, some high profile government people there were arrested for scams too.

Quote:

Show fff.net that you see through Trump's games.


I see the games. I'm the only one here that regularly argues against any good news regarding the economy or job outlook. It was bad under GWB, it was worse under Obama, and it's still a damn site from good under Trump. Trump correctly called the numbers bullshit when he was campaigning, but now that he's in charge he's lying about how good everything is just like any other politician would.

Meanwhile, those yearly additions to the national debt remain at terrifying levels.

Quote:

He will continue for years to deny his fortune was built on tax cheating.


I'm going to say that there should be an investigation. But I don't think the end result is going to show that Trump was cheating... at least not any more than any other rich person in his position would have gotten away with. I know quite a bit more about taxes and tricks than your average prole, but I'm not going to even pretend to know about tax law at that level, and all of the loopholes, tax shelters, and legal grey-areas that are available to people who could literally afford to burn a pile of money larger than I'd ever make in my life right in front of me just for kicks.


Quote:

Congress might not care. Voters might not care. But New York state might care enough to make a tax case against Trump. Since we are talking about a $ billion, Trump will spend $millions on lawyers to delay justice for many years. Don't expect this to go to trial anytime soon.
Quote:

The practices allowed Trump and his siblings to inherit more than $1 billion from his father's real estate empire while paying a fraction of what they should have owed in gift and estate taxes, according to the Times.



What I find unfortunate is that this is a story that nobody is going to care about a week from now because there will be 5 more stories to talk about then. You know that as well as I do. A month from now, nobody will even remember it and it will be just another vague reason in the back of anti-Trumper's minds to hate him.

The reason that this is unfortunate is because it SHOULD be investigated immediately. Even if the end result doesn't net a win for Democrats against Trump, it should be found to EXACTLY how something like that could happen to know EXACTLY what needs to be done to ensure that it NEVER happens again. Whether that be closing loopholes, passing new legislation, putting people in prison, or any or all of the above.



You ask me if I know why I'm not rich.

I can't say for certain, and I know that it's more than one reason, but I've got a pretty good idea what one of them are.

I save $1,400/yr. on property taxes because I'm among the few smart and tenacious enough to right a wrong against me. But I still feel a tinge of guilt after doing so. I realize that somebody else is paying for that. Whether it be higher property taxes on some other suckers or group of suckers, or a little less SNAP benefits in somebody else's account.


Meanwhile, the 1%'s are robbing the rest of the country blind on taxes everyday and not giving it a second thought because it is their god given right to shit on everyone else.




I don't mostly tune out of this stuff, and I haven't largely opted out of the rat race out of laziness or ignorance. I just want to do my own thing, and not have to answer to anybody else. Maybe one day I'll change my mind about that and find a catalyst to rekindle that ambition I once had. I'll never rule anything out. But right now, I've found what I've been looking for and it works for me.

I know you know that I have a ton of free time now. I also speak about how I have seen roughly 20 hours of TV and movies this year at the same time. I'm not sitting around vegging out mindlessly. I'm learning a lot of new things that will improve my own life and those around me, and I've got some projects I'm working on that will benefit others down the road. None of it will happen overnight though.

My most valuable currency today is my time. I might not ever make myself rich off of it, but maybe I can help enrich the lives of others one day with it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 6:08 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

My most valuable currency today is my time. I might not ever make myself rich off of it, but maybe I can help enrich the lives of others one day with it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

You proved it with this one long answer ( although I always strongly suspected ) that you are far more agile than I. That's the person I wanted revealed. I hope there is less and less trouble in your future! ( I am also pleased that the NYTimes revealed Trump to be the tax cheater I always strongly suspected.) I hope there is more and more trouble in his future.
Quote:

“The Tax Department is reviewing the allegations in the Times article and is vigorously pursuing all appropriate avenues of investigation,” said James Gazzale, a spokesman for the New York Department of Taxation and Finance.

On Capitol Hill, some Democrats renewed calls for Trump to release his tax returns — which he has repeatedly declined to do, unlike his predecessors.

“I knew there had to be a compelling reason why this president departed from previous presidents in not disclosing his income tax returns,” said Sen. Richard J. Durbin (Ill.), the Senate’s second-ranking Democrat.

www.washingtonpost.com/politics/new-york-tax-agency-weighs-investigati
on-after-report-that-trump-family-built-wealth-through-tax-avoidance-schemes-and-fraud/2018/10/02/5119f24e-c680-11e8-b2b5-79270f9cce17_story.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 6:45 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"Get what is widely known as a “friendly” appraisal of the empire’s worth, then drive that number even lower by changing the ownership structure to make the empire look less valuable to the I.R.S."

When Trump can point to an appraiser's signature and an official ownership record - doesn't that let him, personally, off the hook?




tic tac

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 7:59 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Get what is widely known as a “friendly” appraisal of the empire’s worth, then drive that number even lower by changing the ownership structure to make the empire look less valuable to the I.R.S."

When Trump can point to an appraiser's signature and an official ownership record - doesn't that let him, personally, off the hook?




tic tac

You cannot use Facts, Logic, Truth in an argument like this. That is not fair, and far too confusing to Libtards and Trolls who cannot see your honest and sensible progression.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 8:12 PM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You cannot use Facts, Logic, Truth in an argument like this.

We don't expect you to.

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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 8:53 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You cannot use Facts, Logic, Truth in an argument like this.

We don't expect you to.

Like I said....


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You cannot use Facts, Logic, Truth in an argument like this. That is not fair, and far too confusing to Libtards and Trolls who cannot see your honest and sensible progression.


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Wednesday, October 3, 2018 9:39 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Get what is widely known as a “friendly” appraisal of the empire’s worth, then drive that number even lower by changing the ownership structure to make the empire look less valuable to the I.R.S."

When Trump can point to an appraiser's signature and an official ownership record - doesn't that let him, personally, off the hook?

No. Why? Try to follow the events: The most common form of subterfuge in the Trump arsenal was valuation fraud. Basically, Fred Trump would turn over some piece of property to Donald Trump as a gift and value it at, say, $10 million. A year later Donald would sell it for $50 million. There were plenty of variations on this theme, and it turns out the IRS pretty much never audits this kind of thing. Over the years, the Trumps avoided hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes using this ruse. Donald knows both prices, the low and the high. He knows he is cheating. The IRS remains ignorant of what Donald and his appraisers have done. It becomes obvious when sufficient attention is paid to the details which can be found here:

www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-tax-sc
hemes-fred-trump.html


Aside from the tax shenanigans, the article also makes it clear that Donald Trump is the farthest thing imaginable from a self-made billionaire. He regularly claims that the only money he ever got from his father was a $1 million loan, but that’s hogwash.

Donald hoovered up nearly half a billion dollars from his father — and then squandered nearly all of it. He lost everything in the 80s; was bailed out by dad; nearly lost everything again in the early 2000s; was bailed out by selling off dad’s inherited empire; and then finally made some money on his own as a reality TV star. He is not quite the worst businessman ever to inherit a fortune, but he sure seems to be in the top 100 or so.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 12:56 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"Basically, Fred Trump would turn over some piece of property to Donald Trump as a gift and value it at, say, $10 million. A year later Donald would sell it for $50 million."

But Fred Trump doesn't put the value on the property - an appraiser does. And the sale price is the result of a negotiation between buyer and seller - Donald Trump might just have found really motivated buyers.

I'm pointing out that fraud would be hard to prove.




tic tac

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 6:11 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN



Only 2,400 days remaining on the Impeachment Clock.

How exciting. 001380

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 6:14 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Basically, Fred Trump would turn over some piece of property to Donald Trump as a gift and value it at, say, $10 million. A year later Donald would sell it for $50 million."

But Fred Trump doesn't put the value on the property - an appraiser does. And the sale price is the result of a negotiation between buyer and seller - Donald Trump might just have found really motivated buyers.

I'm pointing out that fraud would be hard to prove.




tic tac

It doesn't sound like Trump made nearly as much as the purchasers of New Amsterdam.


Purchased from a Manahatta Tribe in 1626 for 60 Guilders, about $1,200 in today's Dollar.

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 9:14 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Basically, Fred Trump would turn over some piece of property to Donald Trump as a gift and value it at, say, $10 million. A year later Donald would sell it for $50 million."

But Fred Trump doesn't put the value on the property - an appraiser does. And the sale price is the result of a negotiation between buyer and seller - Donald Trump might just have found really motivated buyers.

I'm pointing out that fraud would be hard to prove.

A better point is that the IRS "audits" (ha-ha-ha) the Trump tax returns, but it depends on Trump to honestly calculate the tax. A real audit would look at the hypothetical price of the real estate, a price that a tax payer is strongly motivated to low ball, and compare it to other properties that are selling recently. The IRS does NOT do that; it depends on DONALD to honestly do that.

The Trumps have been testing since Donald was a baby how much real auditing is going on at the IRS. As the years go by, the Trump get more extreme about cheating, because they know that nobody is looking, at least until the NYTimes looked. The IRS was falsely told that the price is a 5th of the actual price, later claiming a 16th of the actual price. There was one property the Trumps valued at less than zero, claiming it needed renovation. That is about as extreme cheating as you can get, but the IRS did NOT notice, because that property was lumped into some other properties being transferred to Donald.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 1:36 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

My most valuable currency today is my time. I might not ever make myself rich off of it, but maybe I can help enrich the lives of others one day with it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

You proved it with this one long answer ( although I always strongly suspected ) that you are far more agile than I. That's the person I wanted revealed. I hope there is less and less trouble in your future!



I really want to believe that you're being genuine here. It just seems such an about face from our previous interactions the last 2 years of my sobriety. (I can't speak for anything before that, since I honestly don't remember you or having conversations with you before I was sober).

For now though, I will give you the benefit of the doubt and take what you say at face value, because people can and do change. I would hope that if nothing else, my fall into the void and clawing my way back out of it day by day would at least be proof that people can change.



I see a shift. It's small, but it's noticeable to those who are paying attention. I noticed it with you before anybody else.


I'd imagine that the more you're vested in any of this that it's got to be exhausting to be battling it out with people who really aren't your enemies every single day.


I'm no New Age hippie tree hugger, even though I have gone gluten free, but this shit has got to stop man. It's not good for any of us to be at each other's throats every day.

I know that I've been saying things along those lines here for a while, and I also know that I've had moments of weakness where I get triggered and jump back into it. But it feels good seeing that the tides may be turning.


We might never really agree on anything much at all. But at least we can be civil with each other about things and have conversations about them like adults should be doing. I get the feeling that a lot of stuff happens right in front of us that we should be trying to stop, but we're all too busy insulting each other to even notice them.


Anyways... Thanks. I hope there's less trouble in my future too. I've still got plenty of problems that I let pile up that I'm still trying to sort out. Here's hoping that luck doesn't throw me any wicked curve balls until at least I can get things all back on track.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 4, 2018 3:11 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Good answer, 6ix. Now I'll return to my regular educational programming: How Crooked Is Trump?

When the New York Times talks about the grantor-retained annuity trust (GRAT), I think every estate planner will tell you all wealthy planners use GRATs. They do reduce clients’ taxes, but falsifying the valuation of the property that you’re putting into that trust, that’s illegal. That’s where the Trumps pushed it too far. They supercharged it.

If the Trumps falsified valuations or played really aggressively with them, that’s different. If they used these shell corporations to rig the rate increases in the rent-stabilized apartments, that’s something different. There’s smoke there — there could be serious issues there. Now, the president might say, “This is my father. If there was fraud, this was him, not me.” Except the Times has done a good job of showing that Donald Trump was integrally involved in all of this.

Trump used GRATs in a way they weren't intended to be used, by falsifying the value of property, but should there be GRATs at all? The Obama administration tried to shut them down, but it wasn’t passed by Congress. Obama tried a different tactic. If there is going to be GRATs, Obama only wanted to allow them for legitimate business purposes, not to avoid estate and gift taxes. Congress didn’t pass that law either.

More, from an expert, about Trump's illegal tactics and why he got away with it, at
www.vox.com/the-goods/2018/10/3/17934360/trump-taxes-illegal-new-york-
times-expose


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 5, 2018 7:48 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


In this morning's news, how does South Korea handle a crooked President?
It takes years, but the story ends with:

South Korea jails former president Lee for 15 years on corruption charges

Lee faced charges that he accepted around $10 million in illegal funds from institutions like Samsung and his own intelligence service, fueling ongoing concerns over the cozy ties between government and business leaders.

Lee, 76, has denied any wrongdoing, saying the investigation that led to the trial was politically motivated “revenge” by current President Moon. Trump will also be denying wrong doing, even while being sentenced at 76.

More at www.reuters.com/article/us-southkorea-politics-corruption/south-korea-
jails-former-president-lee-for-15-years-on-corruption-charges-idUSKCN1MF0J1


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 5, 2018 7:58 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
In this morning's news, how does South Korea handle a crooked President?
It takes years, but the story ends with:

South Korea jails former president Lee for 15 years on corruption charges

Lee faced charges that he accepted around $10 million in illegal funds from institutions like Samsung and his own intelligence service, fueling ongoing concerns over the cozy ties between government and business leaders.

Lee, 76, has denied any wrongdoing, saying the investigation that led to the trial was politically motivated “revenge” by current President Moon. Trump will also be denying wrong doing, even while being sentenced at 76.

More at www.reuters.com/article/us-southkorea-politics-corruption/south-korea-
jails-former-president-lee-for-15-years-on-corruption-charges-idUSKCN1MF0J1


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



If he's guilty, I'm all for it.

But it's got to be more than just a witch hunt to get one man. If he's guilty of what your sources are alleging, there were a LOT of other people involved, and they all need to go down as well.

But that's not enough either. It needs to be made EXTREMELY CLEAR how he was able to get away with these alleged crimes, who else was involved, what loopholes or legal gray areas were taken advantage of, and they need to be buttoned up.

But wait... there's more.

Then there needs to be more oversight in the future to make sure that they're not just finding other ways to do this, which you know full well they will find, and those need to be buttoned up as well.



And investigating all of the Clinton and Clinton Foundation's financial shenanigans wouldn't hurt either. And I don't think it would be a tough sell to get Trump voters on board with any of this if Trump doesn't have the Clinton's investigated like he promised, but they're ALL going to be investigated after the fact.



Our government needs an enema. Let's flush 'em all out and start over.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, October 9, 2018 5:01 PM

REAVERFAN


While Mueller Stays Quiet, Suspicious Trump–Russia Clues Keep Popping Up
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/10/muellers-quiet-but-suspic
ious-russia-clues-keep-popping-up.html



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Tuesday, October 9, 2018 5:45 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.







tic tac

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Saturday, October 13, 2018 10:12 AM

THG

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Monday, October 15, 2018 12:12 PM

THG


Warren says Trump should pay up on $1 million offer

Sen. Elizabeth Warren on Monday called out President Trump over his offer to pay $1 million if she could prove she had Native American heritage. In a series of tweets, Warren told Trump to send a check to the National Indigenous Women’s Resource Center, which supports Native American victims of sexual violence.

Earlier Monday, Warren publicly released the results of a DNA analysis that “strongly support” that she has Native American ancestry.

https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/411403-warren-reminds-trump-he-off
ered-1-million-if-she-proved-her-native-american


T

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Thursday, October 18, 2018 12:23 PM

THG


T

Ever since reaching a deal with special counsel Robert Mueller, Paul Manafort has kept the Russia prosecutors busy.


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Thursday, October 18, 2018 12:38 PM

THG


T

Michael Cohen is still meeting with federal prosecutors


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Thursday, October 18, 2018 4:56 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


The investigation is over and everyone who was going to be indicted has already been.

They're going to come out and give Trump the all clear, but they're going to wait until after the election.

I can't blame them, because to do it right now would almost ensure that the Republicans maintain a majority in the house and senate, but it would be viewed as election interference and would only further polarize the right and left.

Sorry to burst your bubble man.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 19, 2018 6:15 PM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

The investigation is over and everyone who was going to be indicted has already been.




Spy Bosses Warn Of Foreign Interference As Feds Unseal New Russia Charges

Russia's active measures scheme has a budget of tens of millions of dollars, and the funding came through a company controlled by a close associate of Russian President Vladimir Putin, prosecutors say.

https://www.npr.org/2018/10/19/658931932/spy-bosses-warn-of-foreign-in
terference-as-feds-unseal-new-russia-charges





T

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Friday, October 19, 2018 6:29 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

The investigation is over and everyone who was going to be indicted has already been.




Spy Bosses Warn Of Foreign Interference As Feds Unseal New Russia Charges

Russia's active measures scheme has a budget of tens of millions of dollars, and the funding came through a company controlled by a close associate of Russian President Vladimir Putin, prosecutors say.

https://www.npr.org/2018/10/19/658931932/spy-bosses-warn-of-foreign-in
terference-as-feds-unseal-new-russia-charges





T



Everything is going to be alright.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 19, 2018 8:28 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN



Only 2,385 days remaining on the Impeachment Clock.

How exciting. 001416

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Friday, October 19, 2018 8:31 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN



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Sunday, October 21, 2018 8:47 AM

THG


tick tock

T


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Sunday, October 21, 2018 9:29 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
tick tock

T






I found the perfect clock for T's countdown.


....



This one might even be better.





Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 21, 2018 10:09 AM

THG



"Oh dear! Oh dear! I shall be too late!" to stop Mueller.

T


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Sunday, October 21, 2018 10:23 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Mueller's done buddy.

He's just doing the right thing and not putting it out there until after the elections. At least somebody learned from previous mistakes (cough cough Comey).

This will all be a huge embarrassment for Democrats, but it will be released after the election and two years before the next Presidential election, so with the short attention span of the average person it shouldn't negatively impact the 2020 election for the Democrats either.

That is your only silver lining out of this man. Best you start getting over it now.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 21, 2018 10:32 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Mueller's done buddy.

He's just doing the right thing and not putting it out there until after the elections. At least somebody learned from previous mistakes (cough cough Comey).

This will all be a huge embarrassment for Democrats, but it will be released after the election and two years before the next Presidential election, so with the short attention span of the average person it shouldn't negatively impact the 2020 election for the Democrats either.

That is your only silver lining out of this man. Best you start getting over it now.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

No matter what Mueller reports, or when, it might make no difference so long as Mitch McConnell controls the Senate.

Whatever secret reservations McConnell and other traditional Republican leaders have about Trump’s character, governing style, and possible criminality, they openly rejoice in the payoff they have received from their alliance with him and his base: huge tax cuts for the wealthy, financial and environmental deregulation, the nominations of two conservative Supreme Court justices (so far) and a host of other conservative judicial appointments, and a significant reduction in government-sponsored health care (though not yet the total abolition of Obamacare they hope for).

McConnell and the Republicans have prided themselves on the early returns on their investment in Trump. There is little indication that even an explosive and incriminating report from Special Counsel Robert Mueller will rupture the alliance.

Faced with the Mueller investigation into Russian meddling in the US election and collusion with members of his campaign, Trump and his supporters’ first line of defense has been twofold — there was “no collusion” and the claim of Russian meddling is a “hoax.” The second line of defense is again twofold: “collusion is not a crime” and the now-proven Russian meddling had no effect. I suspect that if the Mueller report finds that the Trump campaign’s “collusion” with Russians does indeed meet the legal definition of “criminal conspiracy” and that the enormous extent of Russian meddling makes the claim that it had no effect totally implausible, many Republicans will retreat, either implicitly or explicitly, to the third line of defense: “Better Putin than Hillary.” There seems to be nothing for which the demonization of Hillary Clinton does not serve as sufficient justification, and the notion that a Trump presidency indebted to Putin is far preferable to the nightmare of a Clinton victory will signal the final Republican reorientation to illiberalism at home and subservience to an authoritarian abroad.

More at www.nybooks.com/articles/2018/10/25/suffocation-of-democracy/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Sunday, October 21, 2018 11:41 AM

THG


With the democrats controlling the house and having subpoena power, the public will find out how corrupt the Trump administration is and how the republicans helped cover it up.

T


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Sunday, October 21, 2018 2:38 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


We'll see.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, October 23, 2018 3:19 PM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Mueller's done buddy.

He's just doing the right thing and not putting it out there until after the elections. At least somebody learned from previous mistakes (cough cough Comey).

This will all be a huge embarrassment for Democrats, but it will be released after the election and two years before the next Presidential election, so with the short attention span of the average person it shouldn't negatively impact the 2020 election for the Democrats either.

That is your only silver lining out of this man. Best you start getting over it now.




Here you go dummy.


Mueller investigation digs for longtime Trump advisor Roger Stone's connections to WikiLeaks

In recent weeks, a grand jury in Washington has listened to more than a dozen hours of testimony and FBI technicians have pored over gigabytes of electronic messages as part of the special counsel's quest to solve one burning mystery: Did longtime Trump advisor Roger Stone — or any other associate of the president — have advance knowledge of WikiLeaks' plans to release hacked Democratic emails in 2016?

While outwardly quiet for the last month, Robert S. Mueller III's investigators have been aggressively pursuing leads behind the scenes about whether Stone was in communication with the online group, whose disclosures of emails believed to have been hacked by Russian operatives disrupted the 2016 presidential campaign, according to people familiar with the special counsel probe.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-pol-roger-stone-wikileak
s-20181022-story.html


T

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Tuesday, October 23, 2018 3:36 PM

THG


Here ya go Jack, dummy.


Mueller's team is currently fighting – in open court – to compel a former Stone aide to testify before a federal grand jury about Stone and other matters. And last week, ABC News reported that Mueller's team is pressing for answers about Stone from their newest cooperator, former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/targeted-mueller-trump-confidante-roge
r-stone/story?id=58661978


T

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Tuesday, October 23, 2018 6:06 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Here ya go Jack, dummy.



Don't make me grab you by the pussy.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, October 28, 2018 9:08 AM

THG


Tick tock folks, tick tock

T


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Sunday, October 28, 2018 9:11 AM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
Here ya go Jack, dummy.



Don't make me grab you by the pussy.




No female parts here dummy just a 357. I'd love to let see how well that works as a deterrent to people getting stupid with me, dummy.

T


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