REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Trump's Afghanistan announcement

POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Saturday, August 26, 2017 10:10
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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 5:51 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


I think it's time we moved on from our very own self-created tempest-in-a-teapot arguments to something a little more substantial.

Quote:

Thank you very much. Thank you. Please be seated. Vice President Pence, Secretary of State Tillerson, members of the cabinet, General Dunford, Deputy Secretary Shanahan and Colonel Duggan. Most especially, thank you to the men and women of Fort Myer and every member of the United States military at home and abroad. We send our thoughts and prayers to the families of our brave sailors who were injured and lost after a tragic collision at sea as well as to those conducting the search and recovery efforts.

I am here tonight to lay out our path forward in Afghanistan and South Asia. But before I provide the details of our new strategy, I want to say a few words to the service members here with us tonight, to those watching from their posts, and to all Americans listening at home. Since the founding of our republic, our country has produced a special class of heroes whose selflessness, courage, and resolve is unmatched in human history.

American patriots from every generation have given their last breath on the battlefield - for our nation and for our freedom. Through their lives, and though their lives were cut short, in their deeds they achieved total immortality. By following the heroic example of those who fought to preserve our republic, we can find the inspiration our country needs to unify, to heal and to remain one nation under God. The men and women of our military operate as one team, with one shared mission and one shared sense of purpose.

They transcend every line of race, ethnicity, creed and color to serve together and sacrifice together in absolutely perfect cohesion. That is because all service members are brothers and sisters. They are all part of the same family. It’s called the American family. They take the same oath, fight for the same flag and live according to the same law.

They are bound together by common purpose, mutual trust and selfless devotion to our nation and to each other. The soldier understands what we as a nation too often forget, that a wound inflicted upon on a single member of our community is a wound inflicted upon us all. When one part of America hurts, we all hurt.

And when one citizen suffers an injustice, we all suffer together. Loyalty to our nation demands loyalty to one another. Love for America requires love for all of its people. When we open our hearts to patriotism, there is no room for prejudice, no place for bigotry and no tolerance for hate. The young men and women we send to fight our wars abroad deserve to return to a country that is not at war with itself at home. We cannot remain a force for peace in the world if we are not at peace with each other.

As we send our bravest to defeat our enemies overseas, and we will always win, let us find the courage to heal our divisions within. Let us make a simple promise to the men and women we ask to fight in our name, that when they return home from battle, they will find a country that has renewed the sacred bonds of love and loyalty that unite us together as one.

Thanks to the vigilance and skill of the American military, and of our many allies throughout the world, horrors on the scale of September 11, and nobody can ever forget that, have not been repeated on our shores. But we must acknowledge the reality I am here to talk about tonight, that nearly 16 years after September 11 attacks, after the extraordinary sacrifice of blood and treasure, the American people are weary of war without victory.

Nowhere is this more evident than with the war in Afghanistan, the longest war in American history - 17 years. I share the American people's frustration. I also share their frustration over a foreign policy that has spent too much time, energy, money, and most importantly, lives trying to rebuild countries in our own image instead of pursuing our security interests above all other considerations. That is why shortly after my inauguration, I directed Secretary of Defense Mattis and my national security team to undertake a comprehensive review of all strategic options in Afghanistan and South Asia.

My original instinct was to pull out, and historically I like following my instincts. But all my life, I have heard that decisions are much different when you sit behind the desk in the Oval Office. In other words, when you are president of the United States. So I studied Afghanistan in great detail and from every conceivable angle. After many meetings over many months, we held our final meeting last Friday at Camp David with my cabinet and generals to complete our strategy. I arrived at three fundamental conclusion about America's core interests in Afghanistan.

First, our nation must seek an honorable and enduring outcome worthy of the tremendous sacrifices that have been made, especially the sacrifices of lives. The men and women who serve our nation in combat deserve a plan for victory. They deserve the tools they need and the trust they have earned to fight and to win.

Second, the consequences of a rapid exit are both predictable and unacceptable. 9/11, the worst terrorist attack in our history, was planned and directed from Afghanistan because that country was ruled by a government that gave comfort and shelter to terrorists. A hasty withdrawal would create a vacuum that terrorists, including ISIS and al Qaeda, would instantly fill, just as happened before September 11. And as we know, in 2011, America hastily and mistakenly withdrew from Iraq.

As a result, our hard-won gains slipped back into the hands of terrorist enemies. Our soldiers watched as cities they had fought for and bled to liberate and won were occupied by a terrorist group called ISIS. The vacuum we created by leaving too soon gave safe haven for ISIS to spread, to grow, recruit and launch attacks. We cannot repeat in Afghanistan the mistake our leaders made in Iraq.

Third and finally, I concluded that the security threats we face in Afghanistan and the broader region are immense. Today, 20 U.S.-designated foreign terrorist organizations are active in Afghanistan and Pakistan. The highest concentration in any region anywhere in the world. For its part, Pakistan often gives safe haven to agents of chaos, violence and terror. The threat is worse because Pakistan and India are two nuclear-armed states, whose tense relations threaten to spiral into conflict, and that could happen.

No one denies that we have inherited a challenging and troubling situation in Afghanistan and South Asia, but we do not have the luxury of going back in time and making different or better decisions.

When I became president, I was given a bad and very complex hand, but I fully knew what I was getting into. Big and intricate problems. But one way or another, these problems will be solved. I am a problem solver. And in the end, we will win. We must address the reality of the world as it exists right now, the threats we face, and the confronting of all of the problems of today, an extremely predictable consequences of a hasty withdrawal. We need look no further than last week's vile, vicious attack in Barcelona to understand that terror groups will stop at nothing to commit the mass murder of innocent men, women and children.

You saw it for yourself. Horrible. As I outlined in my speech in Saudi Arabia, three months ago, America and our partners are committed to stripping terrorists of their territory, cutting off their funding and exposing the false allure of their evil ideology. Terrorists who slaughter innocent people will find no glory in this life or the next. They are nothing but thugs and criminals and predators, and, that’s right, losers. Working alongside our allies, we will break their will, dry up their recruitment, keep them from crossing our borders, and yes, we will defeat them, and we will defeat them handily.

In Afghanistan and Pakistan, America's interests are clear. We must stop the resurgence of safe havens that enable terrorists to threaten America. And we must prevent nuclear weapons and materials from coming into the hands of terrorists and being used against us or anywhere in the world, for that matter. But to prosecute this war, we will learn from history.

As a result of our comprehensive review, American strategy in Afghanistan and South Asia will change dramatically in the following ways: A core pillar of our new strategy is a shift from a time-based approach to one based on conditions. I’ve said it many times, how counterproductive it is for the United States to announce in advance the dates we intend to begin or end military options.

We will not talk about numbers of troops or our plans for further military activities. Conditions on the ground, not arbitrary timetables, will guide our strategy from now on. America's enemies must never know our plans or believe they can wait us out. I will not say when we are going to attack, but attack we will.

Another fundamental pillar of our new strategy is the integration of all instruments of American power: diplomatic, economic, and military, toward a successful outcome. Someday, after an effective military effort, perhaps it will be possible to have a political settlement that includes elements of the Taliban and Afghanistan, but nobody knows if or when that will ever happen. America will continue its support for the Afghan government and the Afghan military as they confront the Taliban in the field.

Ultimately, it is up to the people of Afghanistan to take ownership of their future, to govern their society, and to achieve an everlasting peace. We are a partner and a friend, but we will not dictate to the Afghan people how to live or how to govern their own complex society. We are not nation building again. We are killing terrorists.

The next pillar of our new strategy is to change the approach in how to deal with Pakistan. We can no longer be silent about Pakistan's safe havens for terrorist organizations, the Taliban, and other groups that pose a threat to the region and beyond.

Pakistan has much to gain from partnering with our effort in Afghanistan. It has much to lose by continuing to harbor criminals and terrorists. In the past, Pakistan has been a valued partner. Our militaries have worked together against common enemies. The Pakistani people have suffered greatly from terrorism and extremism. We recognize those contributions and those sacrifices, but Pakistan has also sheltered the same organizations that try every single day to kill our people. We have been paying Pakistan billions and billions of dollars, at the same time they are housing the very terrorists that we are fighting. But that will have to change. And that will change immediately. No partnership can survive a country's harboring of militants and terrorists who target U.S. service members and officials. It is time for Pakistan to demonstrate its commitment to civilization, order and to peace.

Another critical part of the South Asia strategy for America is to further develop its strategic partnership with India, the world's largest democracy and a key security and economic partner of the United States. We appreciate India's important contributions to stability in Afghanistan, but India makes billions of dollars in trade with the United States, and we want them to help us more with Afghanistan, especially in the area of economic assistance and development. We are committed to pursuing our shared objectives for peace and security in South Asia and the broader Indo-Pacific region.

Finally, my administration will ensure that you, the brave defenders of the American people, will have the necessary tools and rules of engagement to make this strategy work and work effectively and work quickly.

I have already lifted restrictions the previous administration placed on our war fighters that prevented the secretary of defense and our commanders in the field from fully and swiftly waging battle against the enemy.

Micromanagement from Washington, D.C. does not win battles. They are won in the field drawing upon the judgment and expertise of wartime commanders and frontline soldiers, acting in real time with real authority and with a clear mission to defeat the enemy. That’s why we will also expand authority for American armed forces to target the terrorist and criminal networks that sow violence and chaos throughout Afghanistan.

These killers need to know they have nowhere to hide, that no place is beyond the reach of American might and American arms. Retribution will be fast and powerful.

As we lift restrictions and expand authorities in the field, we are already seeing dramatic results in the campaign to defeat ISIS, including the liberation of Mosul in Iraq. Since my inauguration, we have achieved record-breaking success in that regard. We will also maximize sanctions and other financial and law enforcement actions against these networks to eliminate their ability to export terror. When America commits its warriors to battle, we must ensure they have every weapon to apply swift, decisive and overwhelming force.

Our troops will fight to win. We will fight to win. From now on, victory will have a clear definition — attacking our enemies, obliterating ISIS, crushing al-Qaida, preventing the Taliban from taking over Afghanistan and stopping mass terror attacks against America before they emerge. We will ask our NATO allies and global partners to support our new strategy, with additional troop and funding increases in line with our own. We are confident they will.

Since taking office, I have made clear that our allies and partners must contribute much more money to our collective defense, and they have done so.

In this struggle, the heaviest burden will continue to be borne by the good people of Afghanistan and their courageous armed forces.

As the prime minister of Afghanistan has promised, we are going to participate in economic development to help defray the cost of this war to us. Afghanistan is fighting to defend and secure their country against the same enemies who threaten us. The stronger the Afghan security forces become, the less we will have to do. Afghans will secure and build their own nation and define their own future. We want them to succeed. But we will no longer use American military might to construct democracies in faraway lands or try to rebuild other countries in our own image. Those days are now over. Instead, we will work with allies and partners to protect our shared interests.

We are not asking others to change their way of life but to pursue common goals that allow our children to live better and safer lives. This principled realism will guide our decisions moving forward. Military power alone will not bring peace to Afghanistan or stop the terrorist threat arising in that country.

But strategically-applied force aims to create the conditions for a political process to achieve a lasting peace. America will work with the Afghan government as long as we see determination and progress.

However, our commitment is not unlimited, and our support is not a blank check. The government of Afghanistan must carry their share of the military, political and economic burden. The American people expect to see real reforms, real progress and real results.

Our patience is not unlimited. We will keep our eyes wide open. In abiding by the oath I took on January 20, I will remain steadfast in protecting American lives and American interests. In this effort, we will make common cause with any nation that chooses to stand and fight alongside us against this global threat.

Terrorists, take heed. America will never let up until you are dealt a lasting defeat. Under my administration, many billions of dollars more is being spent on our military. And this includes vast amounts being spent on our nuclear arsenal and missile defense. In every generation, we have faced down evil, and we have always prevailed.

We prevailed because we know who we are and what we are fighting for. Not far from where we are gathered tonight, hundreds of thousands of America's greatest patriots lay in eternal rest at Arlington national cemetery. There is more courage, sacrifice and love in those hallowed grounds than in any other spot on the face of the Earth.

Many of those who have fought and died in Afghanistan enlisted in the months after September 11, 2001. They volunteered for a simple reason: they loved America and they were determined to protect her. Now we must secure the cause for which they gave their lives. We must unite to defend America from its enemies abroad. We must restore the bonds of loyalty among our citizens at home, and we must achieve an honorable and enduring outcome worthy of the enormous price that so many have paid.

Our actions and in months to come, all of them will honor the sacrifice of every fallen hero, every family who lost a loved one and every wounded warrior who shed their blood in defense of our great nation.

With our resolve, we will ensure that your service and that your family’s will bring about the defeat of our enemies and the arrival of peace. We will push onward to victory with power in our hearts, courage in our souls and everlasting pride in each and every one of you.

Thank you. May God bless our military, and may God bless the United States of America. Thank you very much. Thank you.



Plus comments from NPR http://www.npr.org/2017/08/21/545038935/watch-live-trump-s-address-on-
afghanistan-next-steps-for-u-s-engagement







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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 6:14 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Filtered thru NPR?


That is why you fail.

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 8:53 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


It's a transcript, dude. If it will make you feel better, I'll see if I can find an official WH transcript.

The alt right is in a tizzy about this. Most see this "strategy" ... which really isn't ... as a betrayal of one of Trump's core promises, and an indication that he has conceded control of foreign policy to the military.

If this is Trump's real intention and not some sort of head-fake, then he's been outplayed by the MIC.

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:20 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

If this is Trump's real intention and not some sort of head-fake, then he's been outplayed by the MIC.

MIC = Military Industrial Complex
MOAB = Mother of All Bombs.

Trump dropped the MOAB on Afghanistan in April. This speech was more of the same. Trump wasn't outplayed by the MIC. This is what he always wanted. He simply lied about what he would do while he campaigned. Trump faked sincerity.

www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/trump-drops-the-mother-of-all-bombs-o
n-afghanistan


www.nationalreview.com/article/446823/moab-donald-trump-success

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:23 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

This is what he always wanted. - SECOND
And you know this .... how?

But, I see what you mean. Trump promised the military a budget increase. He also said (earlier) that he would stop "micromanaging" the military - the decision to drop MOAB was made in the field, not in the WH. And then, there were the missile strikes on Syria, and the military threats against N Korea.

So one possibility is that, in the State/CIA v. military internecine war, Trump decided on the military. In contrast to Hillary, who would have continued with State/CIA.

*****

One of the alt right that I heard (I forget who, it wasn't anybody well-known) said that they voted for Trump, even with his pro-military stance - because THEY thought the military would be more practical about warfare. But this person went on to say (in essence) that Generals like Mattis don't know dick about warfare, that it takes six seconds to start a war but they STILL haven't figured out how to get out of Afghanistan, and that a whole bunch of Generals should be fired for dereliction of duty. In his view, Trump's stint in a military academy makes military authorities like surrogate fathers, and that Trump places far too much trust in them. In this man's view, Tillerson is much more competent.



-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 10:33 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

This is what he always wanted. - SECOND
And you know this .... how?

Trump lies constantly. It is his defining characteristic:

www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/lists/people/comparing-hillary-clinto
n-donald-trump-truth-o-met
/

www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/08/donald-trump-lied-and-lied-and-
lied-in-arizona
/

Trump faked his way through his campaign. He never conducted himself as if political leadership carried with it an obligation to clarify issues instead of merely getting elected.


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 10:52 PM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
He simply lied about what he would do while he campaigned. Trump faked sincerity.



You might be right about that.

What's rather infuriating is that you say this every day in here but you believe after 8 years of Obama that he was somehow any different in that regard.

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 11:24 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6stringJoker:

What's rather infuriating is that you say this every day in here but you believe after 8 years of Obama that he was somehow any different in that regard.

Believe me (I stole Trump's phrase) I will never say it again after this final time:

Compare Trump to Obama. I’ll wait, but don’t come back with a know-nothing answer. Don’t be one of those people who refuse to discern who is mostly a liar and who sometimes lies and which of their statements are actually lies.

www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/
www.politifact.com/personalities/barack-obama/

Trump in Arizona last night just told lie after lie after lie with barely a pause for breath. And everyone in the audience, most of whom probably don’t follow this stuff in gruesome detail, believed him. His 15-minute rant about Charlottesville—which he had prepared notes for—was just a flat-out lie about what he said, when he said it, and what he was criticized for. After that he lied about CNN turning off their cameras. He lied about the size of the protest outside. He lied about job creation. He lied about his tweeting. He lied (yet again) about the New York Times apologizing for its campaign coverage of him. He lied about the media ignoring big stories. He lied about auto companies bringing jobs back to America. He lied about how much illegal immigration has declined. He lied about extreme vetting. He lied about Obamacare. He lied about how close he was to repealing it. He lied about defense spending. He lied about clean coal. He lied about economic growth. He lied about corporate tax rates.

It was a 77-minute spittle-flecked presentation of alternate reality. And above all, it was a continuation of his war on the media. His goal is to convince all of his followers, not just the true believers, that everything in the mainstream press is a deliberate fiction and they shouldn’t believe any of it.

Republicans are very close to believing that literally nothing they hear is true unless they hear it from Trump. This is the road to catastrophe if it keeps up.

www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/08/donald-trump-lied-and-lied-and-
lied-in-arizona
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, August 23, 2017 11:34 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6stringJoker:

What's rather infuriating is that you say this every day in here but you believe after 8 years of Obama that he was somehow any different in that regard.

Believe me (I stole Trump's phrase) I will never say it again after this final time:

Compare Trump to Obama. I’ll wait, but don’t come back with a know-nothing answer. Don’t be one of those people who refuse to discern who is mostly a liar and who sometimes lies and which of their statements are actually lies.

www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/
www.politifact.com/personalities/barack-obama/

Trump in Arizona last night just told lie after lie after lie with barely a pause for breath. And everyone in the audience, most of whom probably don’t follow this stuff in gruesome detail, believed him. His 15-minute rant about Charlottesville—which he had prepared notes for—was just a flat-out lie about what he said, when he said it, and what he was criticized for. After that he lied about CNN turning off their cameras. He lied about the size of the protest outside. He lied about job creation. He lied about his tweeting. He lied (yet again) about the New York Times apologizing for its campaign coverage of him. He lied about the media ignoring big stories. He lied about auto companies bringing jobs back to America. He lied about how much illegal immigration has declined. He lied about extreme vetting. He lied about Obamacare. He lied about how close he was to repealing it. He lied about defense spending. He lied about clean coal. He lied about economic growth. He lied about corporate tax rates.

It was a 77-minute spittle-flecked presentation of alternate reality. And above all, it was a continuation of his war on the media. His goal is to convince all of his followers, not just the true believers, that everything in the mainstream press is a deliberate fiction and they shouldn’t believe any of it.

Republicans are very close to believing that literally nothing they hear is true unless they hear it from Trump. This is the road to catastrophe if it keeps up.

www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/08/donald-trump-lied-and-lied-and-
lied-in-arizona
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

using a Libtard filter like politifact or motherjones as your reference standard?
Really?
Not even making any pretense of an attempt at balance or non-bias?
Great foundation to build upon. Not.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 12:26 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Believe me (I stole Trump's phrase) I will never say it again after this final time:



I am so tempted to put that in my signature, even though I just admonished everyone else for their signatures yesterday.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 1:10 AM

WISHIMAY


DEFLECT DEFLECT DEFLECT


WHAT DOES OBAMA OR HILLARY HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING RIGHT NOW???

Not a goddamn thing.

Can you really do another three years of deflecting all the stupid crap Trump does by bringing up ancient history, EVERY TIME??

If you can, you are even dumber than I thought. In fact every time one of you idiots tries to deflect







HERE'S YER SIGN.


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Thursday, August 24, 2017 1:45 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


cliff notes

Thank you very much
path forward in Afghanistan and South Asia
for our nation and for our freedom
enemies overseas
American people are weary of war without victory
not trying to rebuild countries in our own image
instead of pursuing our security interests
instinct was to pull out
But
three fundamental conclusions about America's core interests in Afghanistan
1 honorable and enduring outcome ... victory ... win
2 a rapid exit would create a vacuum ... As a result ... ISIS
3 security threats in Afghanistan and the broader region are 20 U.S.-designated foreign terrorist organizations
committed to stripping terrorists of their territory, cutting off their funding and exposing the false allure of their evil ideology
break their will, dry up their recruitment, keep them from crossing our borders
America's interests are ... stop the resurgence of safe havens ... prevent nuclear weapons and materials from coming into the hands of terrorists
American strategy shift from a time-based approach to one based on conditions
integration of all instruments of American power: diplomatic, economic, and military
no longer be silent about Pakistan's safe havens
develop its strategic partnership with India
lifted restrictions on fully and swiftly waging battle against the enemy
expand authority for American armed forces to target networks
victory — attacking our enemies, obliterating ISIS, crushing al-Qaida, preventing the Taliban from taking over Afghanistan and stopping mass terror attacks against America before they emerge
NATO allies and global partners to support
we will make common cause with any nation that chooses to stand and fight alongside us against this global threat




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 2:13 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


It's a great job of melding Trump's campaign promises to go after ISIS with the fiction the US is really, truly against terrorists. Really. We are.




Trump is not the problem. He set himself against the Deep State's agenda. And the Deep State's been heading for WWIII for years.
As for you, you're just a Deep State useful idiot, furthering its agenda. So I hope you enjoy cesium in your coffee. You've earned it.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 2:23 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Hey kiki,

Why don't you look at Wishy's past and see how many times she blamed GWB for Obama's failings?

That would be interesting.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 3:21 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Say that reminds me............

Notice how his mouth never moves, well...almost



Very craftily worded conundrum.


SGG

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 6:05 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:

using a Libtard filter like politifact or motherjones as your reference standard?
Really?
Not even making any pretense of an attempt at balance or non-bias?
Great foundation to build upon. Not.

To get at their style of fact-checking, I have to quote a little of it, but you could look at the whole thing, you know:
www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2017/aug/22/fact-checking-pre
sident-donald-trumps-campaign-ral
/

Trump said in Phoenix, "Economic growth has surged to 2.6 percent … Remember I said we’re going to try and hit 3 percent, we’re already at 2.6 percent, maybe I’ll have to increase my offer."

Trump actually promised 4 percent GDP growth during the campaign. At the presidential debate in Las Vegas, he said: "And I actually think we can go higher than 4 percent. I think you can go to 5 percent or 6 percent."

The GDP indeed grew at an annual rate of 2.6 percent between April and June, according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis, more than double the rate at which it grew in the first quarter (1.2 percent).

Trump said in Phoenix, "This was the scene of my first rally speech. Right? The crowds were so big, almost as big as tonight."

Trump is known to exaggerate his crowds, and he exaggerated the size of that crowd that first came to see him back in July 2015 at the Phoenix Convention Center.

Then-candidate Trump described an audience of 10,000 to 15,000 to 20,000 people coming to see him for his July 11, 2015, speech.

But the city fire department said capacity for the ballroom where Trump spoke in 2015 was 4,200 people. The doors were closed at 4,169 attendees, said Phoenix Fire Department spokeswoman Shelly Jamison.

For the record, the 2015 Phoenix rally was his second campaign event. Trump held a campaign rally June 17, 2015, in New Hampshire.

Just to make a final point: Afghanistan's Taliban are not forgiving of Presidential exaggeration, unlike say, a crowd of Arizona Republicans.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 8:57 AM

6STRINGJOKER


I haven't paid attention to any crowd sizes after the election, but his crowds were huge before the election. He wasn't making that up.





BTW, Wishy...

You lefties keep the behavior of the last six months up, it's going to be 7 more years of Trump that we can blame stuff on Obama and Hillary for, not only 3.

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Thursday, August 24, 2017 1:25 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Undercounting crowds and audiences of non-liberal interests has been a Libtard sport for decades, not merely years.

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Friday, August 25, 2017 12:09 AM

WISHIMAY


Quote:

Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Hey kiki,

Why don't you look at Wishy's past and see how many times she blamed GWB for Obama's failings?




I wasn't in RWED much pre-2009 and didn't get involved in many political issues, because as ineffectual as Obama was in many things, he wasn't ignorant and offensive as Trump is. GWB was not the brightest Pres, but he was more of a joke than despicable. I didn't have much of an opinion on him because I was busy trying to survive raising a small child. Do your own dirty work, lazy troll.

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Friday, August 25, 2017 12:17 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Nope... nothing important Wishy adds to the conversation here either.

Just more diarrhea of the fingers.

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Friday, August 25, 2017 12:28 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by Wishimay:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Hey kiki,

Why don't you look at Wishy's past and see how many times she blamed GWB for Obama's failings?

I wasn't in RWED much pre-2009 and didn't get involved in many political issues, because as ineffectual as Obama was in many things, he wasn't ignorant and offensive as Trump is. GWB was not the brightest Pres, but he was more of a joke than despicable. I didn't have much of an opinion on him because I was busy trying to survive raising a small child. Do your own dirty work, lazy troll.

Is her comprehension failing? Or is her reply merely incomplete?

Although Obama wreaked havoc pre-2009, it wasn't as POTUS. Obama began Occupy Oval Office in 2009. That would be when Bobo and other Libtards started blaming his failures on GWB.

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Saturday, August 26, 2017 7:51 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Thank you
Afghanistan and South Asia (India and Pakistan. Poor Bangladesh is just too poor to mention!).

The wonderfulness of people of entered the military
Togetherness
Winning!

But ... war without victory.

Three conclusion about America's core interests in Afghanistan.

First, good money and good lives after bad, like Vietnam

Second, the dominos will fall to al Qaeda and ISIS, like Vietnam
Because, 9-11! Terrorists!

Third because terrorist! Horrible terrorists! Over there! Nuclear!

And, winning!

America's interests are clear. We must stop the resurgence of safe havens that enable terrorists to threaten America from waaaaay over there! Nuclear! Afghanistan! Yellowcake! (Oh, wait, that was from before ... nevermind)

Integration of all instruments of American power: diplomatic, economic, and military. Because, we weren't doing that before? State/ CIA were squabbling with Prntagon?

Killing terrorists. Over there.

Pakistan. Terrorists. Who threaten us from over there.

India big (like China) More Afghanistan aid. Defeat one-belt-one-road.

Military freedom and military money.

Winning!
Fighting there so we don't have to fight here!
More winning!



*******

As people much smarter than me said ...I'll know Trump is serious when the (CIA) poppy fields start burning.

-----------
By the way, GSTRING, I predicted your response PERFECTLY
* ... and then you'll say I'm "too wordy". And then you will - as always- refuse to address the pertinent points, and respond with even more lies and even more bullshit personal attacks.*

And voila! Here it is http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61835&mid=1
035581#1035581

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Saturday, August 26, 2017 10:10 AM

6STRINGJOKER


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Is her comprehension failing? Or is her reply merely incomplete?



Pick one.

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