REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

A thread for Democrats Only

POSTED BY: THGRRI
UPDATED: Thursday, December 5, 2019 12:22
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Monday, July 1, 2019 8:49 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Trump presents himself as an alpha male, bigger, badder and sexier than anyone else in the zoo. Threats and insults are his standard operating procedure. People don’t support him because they think he’s nice or sophisticated in his reasoning.

The irony, of course, is that once you get past his mouth he turns out to be an uncommonly weak and ineffectual president. True, his allies and cronies are securing judgeships and eviscerating regulations, but Trump himself is 99% Public Relations. His job is to distract you from what the real movers and shakers in the White House, the Cabinet, and the GOP controlled Senate are doing.

The New York Times, by giving us megadoses of Trump’s mouth, is a megaphone for him. If they secretly want him to be re-elected, they should continue doing more of that and less and less covering what his Cabinet and the Senate are doing. But here’s a better way:

1. Absolutely no front page news on Trump unless he actually does something — and saying stupid or mean stuff doesn’t qualify as doing.

2. Change the ruling meme from “He is upending the world through his threats and insults” to “He is a blowhard who actually does almost nothing.” Treat him not like an alpha but more like an omega with endless vocalizations, best ignored.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



Good luck.

Should have been doing that for 3 years now, but yanno.

Not sure why you singled out the NYT though. The entirety of the MSM works for him in this regard.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Monday, July 1, 2019 9:02 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:

Not sure why you singled out the NYT though. The entirety of the MSM works for him in this regard.

Why NYT? Because Trump has tweeted hundreds of times about the "failing" New York Times. It is failing . . . to comprehend how Trump is manipulating the news to distract voters from how much money the GOP is looting every year. The national debt grows by about $trillion per year. The Treasury bonds for that debt are being purchased by rich members of the GOP. Also, the IRS does not collect about $500 billion from rich members of the GOP cheating on their taxes. Looting, in other words. Look at Trump; don't look at the numbers or else you see what has been happening for about 40 years, since Ronald Reagan.

https://factba.se/topic/twitter?q=failing&f=
www.cnbc.com/2018/08/01/debt-laden-us-government-is-expanding-the-size
-of-treasury-bond-auctio.html

http://business.time.com/2013/03/27/the-600-billion-the-i-r-s-cant-col
lect
/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth_inequality_in_the_United_States


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 1, 2019 9:36 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


You've also been mesmerized by Trump, SECOND. What with your endless posts about his tweets, your endless posts about about op-eds about his tweets, your endless posts about about op-eds about op-eds about his tweets ... and so on.

YOU are the NYTimes' perfect audience. So is the democratic party.

Long, long ago I decided Trump in particular was one politician completely not worth paying attention to. I decided to focus on the dems, because I wanted to see if they could get clean of their 'but Trump!' (and 'RUSSIA!!!RUSSIA!!!RUSSIA!!!') addiction, and try and become a real alternative for what ails the country.

Granted, my focus is peculiar. I have two issues I focus on. And I don't care HOW a candidate presents themselves, I pay attention to the content. BTW, if you want to know how peculiar that makes me, Kamala Harris' meteoric post-debate poll rise is due to presentation. (As was pointed out in a post-debate analysis, as a prosecutor, she's had lots of practice putting on a good show to influence juries.) But I listened to what she said, and she was a weather-vane on the issues. And THAT came across as completely, coldly self-serving.

Anyway, overall, the dems have nearly all failed to break out of the Trumpian drug-haze.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 10:16 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

Remember your signature? No matter which Democrat becomes President, so long as the GOP has at least 40 Senators, that Democrat will be ineffective. Will making the GOP a minority in the Senate fix America? No, not until you fix American voters, too. The country needs voters who are unforgiving of their Congressman's mistakes.

So long as the majority of voters approve/admire/support the troops and what they claim to do for a living (not what they actually do), America will be at war, irregardless of who is President, because your local Congressman will keep voting to fund war. Remember how ridiculously difficult it was to end the Vietnam War? It was because a majority of Americans supported the troops, despite a few million hippie protestors not giving their support. That war only ended when Congress realized that the troops would never win, no matter how many bombs were dropped, or years passed. Only then did Congress cut-off the money. Congress is even slower to realize the troops will never win in Afghanistan and it is years past time to cut-off funding for that nonsense. That won't change with a new President. So long as the majority of voters support our troops in the good-for-nothing-useful Army/Navy/Air Force/Marines, the Congress will keep paying for war and the President will keep the troops in the field, irregardless of which party has the Presidency.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 1, 2019 10:24 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Way to show us all how you only talk to the voices in your head, SECOND!




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 10:49 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Way to show us all how you only talk to the voices in your head, SECOND!

And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

1kiki, now you are repeating Signym's talking point about "second".

So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg? He is nothing like any Republican who has ever run for President. I'd vote for him in the primary, but the average primary voter won't. If he was President, he would still be stuck with what Congress will or won't allow to be done. He would not be able to move things in a new direction. The Constitution won't allow it. Either Congress picks a direction, or it does not happen. And when was the last time a majority in Congress had a direction or a goal other than making money? Congress loves to pretend that it is the President who creates all new ideas and sets the country's direction. Pretending that guidance comes only from the President hides the fact that Congress doesn't have a majority for any new ideas and hides who is really in charge. Buttigieg has all kinds of ideas. None of them will be implemented under his Presidency because of Congress:
https://peteforamerica.com/issues/#Democracy

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 1, 2019 11:45 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Last election, I was a single issue voter. I didn't want us humans to blow the world up. I made that point repeatedly.

Sure I discussed a lot of things. This *IS* a discussion board after all. I discussed how democrats have failed us for decades. I pointed out that Hillary was an abysmal candidate with historic net negative ratings even before the primary. I said the DNC was undemocratic and corrupt. I said the platform was about appealing to victim-hood. I proposed that if I were running a campaign, I would base it on a FAIR DEAL theme.

This time around I'm a two-issue voter. I don't want us humans to blow the world up, or burn it up (if at all avoidable at this point).

In the last election, I didn't vote for Trump. But I did vote against Hillary. This time around, once again, I will NOT vote for a democrat 'just because'. I won't put them on my team if they're going to be scoring points for the other side.

But rest assured, SECOND, my vote in California will count for nothing in this deep blue state. You can sleep well knowing that my two issues will probably be swept away by the tide of "RUSSIA!TRUMP!" and "the poor illegal immigrants".

"(Buttigieg) is nothing like any Republican who has ever run for President." He's a democrat.

Pete is an intelligent, articulate debater. I don't know how deep his rhetoric goes. And he gave short shrift to my two issues. I would have to hear more before I figure out if he's likely to shift his focus from the mayoral to the global, as I think these crises demand.


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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 5:23 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Will making the GOP a minority in the Senate fix America? No, not until you fix American voters, too.



In other words: we're screwed.

Thank you for putting a big chunk of the responsibility and blame on the backs of voters. They get a pass all too often. It is similar to how we need to shine the light on Consumers, and why much of our current money grubbing and wasteful landscape is the result of their own ignorance and greed.

We've inspired me to update a quote:
"The only problem with Democracy is that you get the government you deserve."

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 5:40 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
https://peteforamerica.com/issues/#Democracy



I would vote for Mayor Pete for many reasons. The least of them, but still worthy, would be to see him shaking Putin's hand. What an image - goofy Pete with weasel Putin. Or Kim, or Xi - or any foreign leader after seeing that f*cking orange fake news pos posing as president.
Pete seems like what a modern president should be - less celebrity and more technocrat. Less *personality* and more ideas and problem solving. I'm ready.

May have to wait for 2024 though.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:44 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Pete is an intelligent, articulate debater. I don't know how deep his rhetoric goes. And he gave short shrift to my two issues. I would have to hear more before I figure out if he's likely to shift his focus from the mayoral to the global, as I think these crises demand.

You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that. The majority leader of Senate has Trump on a long leash. Trump thinks he can go where he pleases, but the Senate could jerk him out of office in a month, if the majority leader wanted to. For one example, Trump can't get his wall built because the majority leader never wanted it.

There is a strong chance, likely better than even, that if a Democrat wins the presidency in 2020 she will take office with a Senate still controlled by Mitch McConnell and the Republicans. Apart from the occasional bill to keep the government open or to address some issue about which there is no particular controversy, McConnell will allow no significant legislation to pass. No ambitious health care reform, no universal child care, no climate change initiative, nothing.

Not only that, McConnell will go even farther than he did under Barack Obama to stifle the rest of the president’s agenda. Republicans will refuse to confirm any cabinet member who has any kind of liberal bona fides. They will slow the filling of judicial vacancies to a crawl, or they may simply refuse to confirm any judges at all. That, of course, goes for the Supreme Court too. Should any vacancies occur, McConnell will announce that he has discovered some new “rule” embedded in a remark some Democrat made decades ago which demands that as long as the presidency and the Senate are held by different parties, no Supreme Court seat shall be filled. After all, they got along with eight members while McConnell waited for Trump to be elected, and they’ll do just fine with eight again. Or seven. Or six.

Meanwhile, that same Supreme Court — having already repealed Roe v. Wade and made it impossible for unions to organize — will be steadily striking down one action after another taken by that Democratic president, as it goes about dismantling the administrative state and whittling the president’s power down to a shadow of what it is, on the longstanding Republican judicial principle that the rules change completely when there’s a Democrat in the White House.

If your response to this picture is to say, “C’mon, they wouldn’t go that far,” I’d be curious to know what life is like in the alternate universe you’ve been inhabiting for the last 20 years.

"What Democrats Don't Get About the Republican Party"
https://prospect.org/article/what-democrats-dont-get-about-republican-
party


The GOP is never beaten, because it never stops fighting. Even when Democrats think they've won.


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:58 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Will making the GOP a minority in the Senate fix America? No, not until you fix American voters, too.



In other words: we're screwed.

Thank you for putting a big chunk of the responsibility and blame on the backs of voters. They get a pass all too often. It is similar to how we need to shine the light on Consumers, and why much of our current money grubbing and wasteful landscape is the result of their own ignorance and greed.

We've inspired me to update a quote:
"The only problem with Democracy is that you get the government you deserve."

The voters, both Democrat and Republican, let their Republican Congressman and state officials get away with anything when the voters could go to the election headquarters or district offices of that Republican official and break windows to show they are displeased in the extreme. That is happening in Hong Kong.
www.pressreader.com/usa/the-sacramento-bee/20190702/281646781688691

What are Republicans doing that they should not? They are copying the worst features of newly emerging democracies around the world. (By the way, it is not the breaking of windows that is the key. It is a mass of people who are visibly angry which will move, even frighten, a politician who correctly thinks he can do anything because only a very few people will be rude to him today and all he need worry about is the next election, which is years away.)

Republicans pay lip service to Democracy, but they actively try to undermine its institutions.

www.nytimes.com/2019/07/01/opinion/republicans-trump-democracy.html

What defines competitive authoritarian states? They are “civilian regimes in which formal democratic institutions exist and are widely viewed as the primary means of gaining power, but in which incumbents’ abuse of the state places them at a significant advantage vis-à-vis their opponents.” Sound like anyone you know?

I discovered the book somewhat by accident, ordered it and read it immediately. As the subtitle states, the authors, working in a field that Mr. Levitsky likes to call “comparative regime studies,” were looking at regimes in the developing world and the former Eastern Bloc in the years after Communism’s collapse — years, that is, when a number of countries were moving, however fitfully, toward democratization.

There are sections on Mozambique, Kenya and Cameroon; on Taiwan, Malaysia and Cambodia; and on Russia, Belarus and Ukraine. In the late 2000s, when the authors were assembling their research, these were the kinds of countries they had in mind when they conjured up the phrase “competitive authoritarianism.”

But today, incredibly, the phrase has begun to bring to mind the United States of America. I literally gasped as I read certain passages, notably the part about the important role of a strong party in winning elections and in controlling legislatures. “Legislative control is critical in competitive authoritarian regimes,” the authors write. They list four reasons. You can bet Mitch McConnell knows every one of them, and probably a couple more.

For all of its unfairness and growing dysfunction, American democracy has not slid into competitive authoritarianism.

So we’re not there right now. But we may well be on the way, and it’s abundantly clear who wants to take us there.

For one, there’s President Trump. Think of his efforts to do things like politicize the institutions of the executive branch, to try to turn the Department of Justice into his personal law firm. Think of his threat in 2016 that he would honor the results of the election “if I win,” and his recent musings about staying beyond two terms. These are all manifestations of competitive authoritarianism.

Second — and maybe even more so — there’s the Republican Party. The gerrymandering enabled them to maintain their House majority during the Obama years even as Democratic House candidates were winning more votes. But there’s much more. Recent Republican behavior — from the 2016 stolen Supreme Court seat to the legislative shenanigans that followed gubernatorial defeats in North Carolina and Wisconsin to voter suppression efforts across numerous states — suggests a party whose commitment to democratic politics has weakened.

There is ample space between well-functioning democracy and outright authoritarianism. It has a name: competitive authoritarianism. It’s hard to believe that we have to have this conversation in the United States, but we’d all better learn about it, and grapple with the grim reality it is trying to impose on us.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 7:58 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:04 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


SECOND

I'm guessing you think Biden is 'the anointed one' and everyone else should drop out for the sake of party unity. And if they don't, they're back-stabbing republicans in democrats' names.

So, how did that Hillary thing work out for you?




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:10 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).

And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

1kiki, have you ever read your signature? You equate democrats with republicans. The two parties are utterly different. The reason why both parties give the same crappy results is that when Republicans don't control 100% of the Federal government, the GOP still controls the Federal government, so long as there are 41 stubborn GOP Senators. And GOP judges don't resign when the Presidency switches parties. And tax laws passed by the GOP don't magically revert back to what they were before Trump when the President is a Democrat. And the average voter does not come to his senses about the uselessness of America's Army/Navy/Air Force/Marines, even when our troops have proved they are useless time and time again to solve international problems.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:15 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).






And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:35 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).



And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

You know what American military is good for? Trump said it: Fire and Fury like the world has never seen. But I think the military is not so good at winning the Korean War/Vietnam War nor solving international problems, unless you believe WWII was won by nuking Hiroshima. If you are a Republican or a Trump voter, you believe killing civilians at Nagasaki won the war because that was the last thing the Air Force did, immediately before the signing of the Japanese surrender.

Trump explaining how he will force the North Koreans to disarm themselves:


The video is two years old. I wonder how well Trump's threats, followed by humbling himself by kissing Kim's ass, are working? Trump has congratulated himself for not having been nuked by Kim. And by respecting Kim's power, Trump has insured Kim will remain dictator for life. I don't think those are the proper criteria for an American President successfully solving an international problem that Kim represents . . .

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:52 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).






And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac


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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 9:03 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
So are you impressed with Pete Buttigieg?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
You are too focused on one office, and it is the wrong one at that.

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
No, YOU are too focused on one office. Unless you're also ignorant of the fact that 'Mayor Pete' is running for president (along with being ignorant of the fact that he's a democrat).



And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac


Nice comment, 1kiki, but did you recognize that the GOP, even after Trump is not President, will still have the power to stymie anything the Democrats might want to do? That is the way the rules of the Senate work. That is the way the Supreme Court works. And that is the way the Pentagon works - it does not get a lower budget, even when it loses wars. The White House may change hands, but the Republicans don't get kicked out of the Federal government, Republican generals are not forced to retire, and the Republicans don't lose the power to stop the Democrats.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 11:08 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

The White House may change hands, but the Republicans don't get kicked out of the Federal government, Republican generals are not forced to retire, and the Republicans don't lose the power to stop the Democrats.
Ah. SECOND discovers the "deep state" but mistakes it for Republicans in the Pentagon.

Do you know, SECOND, that Obama fired 197 military officers over 5 years?
https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/197-military-officers-pu
rged-by-obama
/ The President can do that, you know, as Commander-in-Chief, so there's no use whinging about the Pentagon. And between 2008-2016 the Pentagon acquired a very pro-Obama flavor, so whatever ills you think the Pentagon may have committed since 2008, you can pin that one on Obama.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 2:18 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

The White House may change hands, but the Republicans don't get kicked out of the Federal government, Republican generals are not forced to retire, and the Republicans don't lose the power to stop the Democrats.
Ah. SECOND discovers the "deep state" but mistakes it for Republicans in the Pentagon.

Do you know, SECOND, that Obama fired 197 military officers over 5 years?
https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/197-military-officers-pu
rged-by-obama
/ The President can do that, you know, as Commander-in-Chief, so there's no use whinging about the Pentagon. And between 2008-2016 the Pentagon acquired a very pro-Obama flavor, so whatever ills you think the Pentagon may have committed since 2008, you can pin that one on Obama.

Signym, you couldn't have picked a worse reference. It quotes Breitbart.com's Facebook page. That is as authoritative as quoting Jayne's tweets at https://twitter.com/AdamBaldwin
Adam Baldwin is Trump-loving/Obama-hating and very suitable to play Jayne.

If Obama had fired 500 of those worthless generals and admirals, it would not have been too many. Those guys have given America one military loss after another for decades, killed civilians by the hundreds of thousands, wasted $trillions. But the only way they can lose their jobs is for things unconnected to their actual performance at winning wars -- like running their mouths to reporters. McChrystal was fired for talking shit about Obama to Rolling Stones. Instead, he should have been fired for not being able to find his own ass with both hands. And there are 499 others that are just as incompetent, but just as convinced they are absolutely essential . . . in their own imaginations, not in reality.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanley_A._McChrystal

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/R44389.pdf

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 2:40 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
If Obama had fired 500 of those worthless generals and admirals, it would not have been too many.

Perhaps you're too focused on one office.





And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 7:39 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
If Obama had fired 500 of those worthless generals and admirals, it would not have been too many.

Perhaps you're too focused on one office.





And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

Perhaps I am too focussed on the military? Perhaps because it costs a trillion dollars per year and is a constant source of friction between America and the entire world? Republicans love the "troops" too much: President Trump got Navy SEAL (and murderer) Edward Gallagher removed from the brig and transferred to better custody conditions at a Navy hospital before trial.

The biggest bombshell in the case occurred on June 20 when Gallagher's colleague, Special Operator 1st Class Corey Scott, perjured himself by claiming to have asphyxiated the ISIS fighter back in 2017, contrary to the testimony of at least seven other SEALs who said it was Gallagher who stabbed the ISIS fighter after medics administered treatment to him. Scott had been given immunity from prosecution for his testimony. He then changed the story he told to prosecutors as soon as he got on the witness stand. Because of the immunity, he won't be prosecuted.

If you want to know why America loses wars, despite killing people by the hundreds of thousands, at the cost of trillions, this trial is a model, a work of art, a showpiece on how fucked up the American military is. For that achievement thank the President and half the Generals on the 4th of July. America salutes them for their incompetence serving the nation.

www.foxnews.com/us/navy-seal-edward-gallagher-found-not-guilty-on-murd
er-and-attempted-murder-charges


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 10:57 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.




Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
If Obama had fired 500 of those worthless generals and admirals, it would not have been too many.

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Perhaps you're too focused on one office.

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
something or other

fify

SECOND, YOU are the one who claims I'm hyper-focused on one office. Me, I barely post about Trump, or indeed any president, unless I'm discussing a salient thing they did using the power of their office: for example, Obama, with the stroke of a pen, crowning himself Deporter in Chief, or FDR using the power of the bully pulpit.
Shall we talk about your hundreds, if not a thousand or more, pointless posts hyper-focused on Trump?

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 7:25 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

fify

SECOND, YOU are the one who claims I'm hyper-focused on one office. Me, I barely post about Trump, or indeed any president, unless I'm discussing a salient thing they did using the power of their office: for example, Obama, with the stroke of a pen, crowning himself Deporter in Chief, or FDR using the power of the bully pulpit.
Shall we talk about your hundreds, if not a thousand or more, pointless posts hyper-focused on Trump?

The Federal government does a million things per day, but who in the government did each one of those things? Just for rhetorical reasons, we might write President FDR fought Hitler, that kind of stuff. But we all know FDR fought nobody from his wheelchair. Presidents are pushed around by external events. Presidents pretend they are in charge, but it doesn't look that way to me. Japan bombs Pearl Harbor. Hitler declares war on America. Then FDR "decides" to fight Hitler. If FDR was really making the decision to fight Hitler, he would have gone to war after Dunkirk, or even before that when Denmark falls, but he would not have waited for Pearl Harbor.

Imagine if the Iraqis, smarter than George Bush, had not tricked Bush, and the Pentagon, and the State Department into an American withdrawal to end in 2011, after Bush was gone. Trump would still be trapped in Iraq. The Afghans were less clever and that war had not started with promises to free the people from an evil dictator like Saddam Hussein. Afghanistan was pure revenge for 9/11. The American people wanted revenge on somebody, so Bush had to deliver something. Now Trump is trapped in Afghanistan. He can't simply quit and walk away. His party in Congress and his voters make him stay in that stupid war he will never win. The same with Obama, his party and his voters made him stay in a stupid war, because his party and voters had delusions America could win it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S.%E2%80%93Iraq_Status_of_Forces_Agree
ment


Yesterday, Trump said he wants to get U.S. troops completely out of Afghanistan but said Pentagon leaders have convinced him not to, saying the American military presence there is preventing terrorist attacks.
www.militarytimes.com/news/pentagon-congress/2019/07/02/trump-pentagon
-leaders-want-to-keep-troops-in-afghanistan
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 7:46 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Democrats are learning the wrong lesson from Donald Trump. The correct lesson: He ran as a moderate — and it worked.

www.vox.com/2019/7/2/20677656/donald-trump-moderate-extremism-penalty

If Trump is president, the thinking goes among Democrats, it’s the ultimate proof of “lol nothing matters” politics. And if anything does matter, it’s riling up your base to go to war, not trimming and tucking to persuade precious swing voters. The old rules no longer apply, or perhaps they were never true at all.

Activists are pressing candidates to take aggressively progressive stands on broad issues like Medicare-for-all but also narrower ones like including undocumented immigrants in health care plans and providing relief from graduate school debt.

This is, however, precisely the wrong lesson to learn from the Trump era.

It’s true that Trump is president, but it’s not true that Trump ran and won as an ideological extremist. He paired extremely offensive rhetoric on racial issues with positioning on key economic policy topics that led him to be perceived by the electorate as the most moderate GOP nominee in generations. His campaign was almost paint-by-numbers pragmatic moderation. He ditched a couple of unpopular GOP positions that were much cherished by party elites, like cutting Medicare benefits, delivered victory, and is beloved by the rank and file for it.

Far from being a counterexample, Trump’s election is, if anything, a testament to the theory that moderation pays off. The millions of progressives baffled that someone as coarse, ignorant, and scandal-plagued as Trump could win an election should reflect on the fact that he was able to partially recover from those things due to his positions on the issues.

That’s not to say that Trump ran a sober-minded, issue-oriented campaign. Far from it. His main themes were dedicated to mobilizing ugly racial sentiments. But racism is not new to American politics. Had Trump ran on a conventional Republican platform of cutting Social Security and Medicare, Democrats would have hammered him for it — just as they hammered McCain and Romney — and won the votes of many older non-college whites who are racist enough to like Trump but sufficiently non-racist to have voted for Democrats in the past.

The research case that moderation matters for electoral wins, meanwhile, remains pretty solid. Lots of other things matter too, and it would be foolish to label any particular position or candidate as categorically “unelectable.” But overall, moderate candidates are more likely to win; more precisely, candidates who take popular positions on the issues are more likely to win than candidates who take unpopular ones.

Of course, politics matters because policy matters, so taking a calculated risk on an unpopular position for the sake of getting something important does make sense. But adopting an unpopular position that you won’t be able to deliver on even if you win the election is not just costly, it’s reckless — jeopardizing the interests of the people you’re supposed to be helping.

Remember: nothing will become law when there are 41 GOP Senators or more opposing it. There will be 50. Then why sacrifice getting elected by taking liberal positions that can't pass into laws?

More at www.vox.com/2019/7/2/20677656/donald-trump-moderate-extremism-penalty

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 11:24 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

fify

SECOND, YOU are the one who claims I'm hyper-focused on one office. Me, I barely post about Trump, or indeed any president, unless I'm discussing a salient thing they did using the power of their office: for example, Obama, with the stroke of a pen, crowning himself Deporter in Chief, or FDR using the power of the bully pulpit.
Shall we talk about your hundreds, if not a thousand or more, pointless posts hyper-focused on Trump?

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
The Federal government does a million things per day, but who in the government did each one of those things?

And yet Obama and FDR did those things, despite your confabulations to pretend they didn't.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 12:08 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

And yet Obama and FDR did those things, despite your confabulations to pretend they didn't.

And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

I have doubts that you will ever understand that Democratic Presidents are restrained in what they can do by what the Constitution will allow, while guys like Trump and Nixon have got their own little area that they move freely around in and it is smaller and only partially overlaps the one in the Constitution. I could draw you Venn Diagrams of what the Constitution allows, what Democrats allow, what Republicans allow, but you won't understand those, either.

Venn diagram showing the uppercase glyphs shared by the Greek, Latin, and Cyrillic alphabets
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Venn_diagram_gr_la
_ru.svg


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 1:59 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
I have doubts that you will ever understand that Democratic Presidents are restrained in what they can do by what the Constitution will allow, while guys like Trump and Nixon have got their own little area that they move freely around in and it is smaller and only partially overlaps the one in the Constitution.

I'd like to see you try to make that case, SECOND.

It's easy to pretend you have knowledge by pretending to be superior - harder to prove it, with quotes and links.

Let's get specific with two close-in-time presidents, under the same operational frameworks and Constitutional decisions: What did Bush do OUTSIDE OF THE CONSTITUTION that Obama didn't?




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Thursday, July 4, 2019 5:31 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


A $15 federal minimum wage won’t cost Americans jobs, new study says
www.vox.com/2019/7/2/20678821/15-federal-minimum-wage-increase-study

In January, House Democrats introduced the Raise the Wage Act, which would eventually raise the federal minimum wage to $15 an hour by 2024. The law would also tie future changes to changes in median workers’ pay. So if middle-class wages go up — or down — so would the minimum wage.

The bill, which has more than 200 co-sponsors (all Democrats), would also phase out the lower minimum wage for tipped workers such as restaurant servers and valets, which has been $2.13 an hour since 1996.

Big business groups are not happy about the fight for $15. Neither are their Republican allies in Congress, who have long pushed back against any effort to raise the federal minimum wage.

They’re planning to vote in July or August.

The bill would more than likely die in the Senate, or, as Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer calls it, Mitch McConnell’s “legislative graveyard.” But if things turn out well for Democrats in 2020, there’s a good chance the next president will sign a bill to double the federal minimum wage, giving 28 million workers a raise.

And based on the latest research, the pay raise won’t lead many workers to the unemployment line.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, July 4, 2019 5:57 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Let's get specific with two close-in-time presidents, under the same operational frameworks and Constitutional decisions: What did Bush do OUTSIDE OF THE CONSTITUTION that Obama didn't?

The Constitution lets the the Supreme Court decide what is unconstitutional, but there is a big butt: The Supreme Court will make no decision until Congress brings the case to them. I assume that in the 18th Century they couldn't imagine that Congress wouldn't. The most straightforward example of Congress not following the Constitution: the President has gone to war many times since 1943 without a declaration of war from Congress. Not once has Congress taken a case to the Supreme Court about the President unconstitutionally going to War. I guess your typical Congressman has shrugged off that responsibility to decide and let the Pentagon make the decision about what is possible with the budget they have been given by Congress, then the Pentagon informs the President what he could be doing next with the troops. But who knows anymore who is making the decisions about wars? I don't know. But the Constitution, when it was written, clearly stated who makes the decision.

www.senate.gov/pagelayout/history/h_multi_sections_and_teasers/WarDecl
arationsbyCongress.htm

https://constitutioncenter.org/blog/when-congress-once-used-its-powers
-to-declare-war


The people making unconstitutional decisions about where to invade next are very unlikely to die if they make the wrong decision. Being unafraid of dying for their mistakes could explain why America is constantly at war: www.bbc.com/news/magazine-28669943

"Gen Greene is not only the highest ranking US military official to have been killed since the start of the war in Afghanistan, his death also marks the first time in more than 40 years that a general has been killed in combat." Except he was NOT in combat. He was at Camp Qargha's Marshal Fahim National Defense University in Kabul, Afghanistan, making a routine visit to the training facility.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_J._Greene#Death

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, July 4, 2019 2:43 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


You haven't answered the challenge that addresses your own claim.

Here is your claim, and the challenge, again, in case you forgot. You drew a distinction between democratic presidents as being more constitutional, and republican presidents as less so.
Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
I have doubts that you will ever understand that Democratic Presidents are restrained in what they can do by what the Constitution will allow, while guys like Trump and Nixon have got their own little area that they move freely around in and it is smaller and only partially overlaps the one in the Constitution.

I challenged you to come up with SPECIFIC DIFFERENCES using two recent presidents who operated under similar circumstances such as House rules, Senate rules, and Supreme Court rulings ('W' Bush and Obama).
Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
I'd like to see you try to make that case, SECOND.

It's easy to pretend you have knowledge by pretending to be superior - harder to prove it, with quotes and links.

Let's get specific with two close-in-time presidents, under the same operational frameworks and Constitutional decisions: What did Bush do OUTSIDE OF THE CONSTITUTION that Obama didn't?






And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac


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Thursday, July 4, 2019 3:34 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


So, I made a list off the top of my head about things that might be unconstitutional

mass data collection of Americans
drone-killing Americans w/out a trial
torture


SECOND has submitted starting wars without Congressional declaration

I'm going to mull on this but I hope others add to the list.

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Thursday, July 4, 2019 3:35 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


just for reference Congressional ability to bring suits re the Constitution to Federal Courts, and to participate in those proceedings

https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R42454.pdf
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/R45636.pdf

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Friday, July 5, 2019 7:06 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
So, I made a list off the top of my head about things that might be unconstitutional

mass data collection of Americans
drone-killing Americans w/out a trial
torture


SECOND has submitted starting wars without Congressional declaration

I'm going to mull on this but I hope others add to the list.

Until the Supreme Court makes a ruling, any action by the President is in a quantum superposition of constitutional/unconstitutional. And the Supreme Court has completely avoided that part of its responsibility for many decades. The Supreme Court told Nixon he could not constitutionally withhold his records from Watergate. Then you have to jump all the way back in history to FDR and Truman to find a Supreme Court telling a President he can't do something. If the Federal Government was functioning the way it was imagined in the 18th Century, the Supreme Court would be making decisions a dozen times per year about constitutional/unconstitutional action by the President. But we don't live in that world and so the actual number of decisions is zero.

One example 1kiki mentioned: "drone-killing Americans w/out a trial"
The Supreme Court didn't take that case, which means it is still in a quantum superposition of constitutional/unconstitutional. Trump took advantage of the Supreme Court's indecision to blow up with a drone the daughter of a guy Obama blew up with a drone. Who knows if it is Constitutional? Who is going to do anything about it if it wasn't? Certainly neither the Supreme Court nor Congress.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki#Lawsuit_against_the_US

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, July 5, 2019 12:00 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Trump picks another Fed member who believes in the gold standard.

The United States abandoned the gold standard in 1971, and today the majority of economists in America believe reviving it would be disastrous for the US economy.

Yet that isn't stopping President Donald Trump from naming a longtime proponent of returning to the gold standard, conservative scholar Judy Shelton, as his latest pick for a seat on the Federal Reserve Board.

Both of Trump's most recent previous would-be nominees, conservative analyst Stephen Moore and businessman Herman Cain, endorsed returning to the gold standard. But Shelton is far more identified with her advocacy for the idea, which is based on the belief that the price of gold is stable and would make the dollar less susceptible to inflation or other volatility.

"It sounds kind of persuasive if you haven't studied economics, but it's really completely counter-factual and for good reason," said Darrell Duffie, a finance professor at Stanford University. "Gold is an incredibly volatile asset relative to the US dollar as we know it today. It's just a misperception that if we were to go to the gold standard that we would have more stable prices."

An idea that keeps coming back around

The gold standard has a long history in Republican economics.
In the 1980s, President Ronald Reagan launched the first Gold Commission, headed by monetarist Anna Schwartz, who eventually came out against the endeavor with her colleague Milton Friedman.

But the Republican Party revived the idea in its 2012 and 2016 campaign platforms, calling for a new commission to investigate the viability of a return to gold standard system. Former GOP presidential candidates, including Senators Ted Cruz of Texas and Rand Paul of Kentucky, have supported the idea.

As a candidate, Trump told GQ magazine: "Bringing back the gold standard would be very hard to do, but, boy, would it be wonderful. We'd have a standard on which to base our money."

More at www.cnn.com/2019/07/05/economy/judy-shelton-gold-standard-federal-rese
rve/index.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, July 5, 2019 12:21 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
I have doubts that you will ever understand that Democratic Presidents are restrained in what they can do by what the Constitution will allow, while guys like Trump and Nixon have got their own little area that they move freely around in and it is smaller and only partially overlaps the one in the Constitution.

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
Until the Supreme Court makes a ruling, any action by the President is in a quantum superposition of constitutional/unconstitutional.

So you're saying no presidents do anything outside of the Constitution, because - it's in a legal quantum state?? Is that your claim NOW?

I'm glad to see you argued yourself out of your biased impression of democratic v republican presidents.

But if I read you trying to again make ANY point about constitutionality, I'll just refer you back to yourself http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61954&mid=1
078593#1078593
, and you can have a fun time arguing yourself in circles.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Friday, July 5, 2019 3:14 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:

So you're saying no presidents do anything outside of the Constitution, because - it's in a legal quantum state?? Is that your claim NOW?

I'm glad to see you argued yourself out of your biased impression of democratic v republican presidents.

But if I read you trying to again make ANY point about constitutionality, I'll just refer you back to yourself http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=61954&mid=1
078593#1078593
, and you can have a fun time arguing yourself in circles.

1kiki, wrong as usual. The Supreme Court has avoided ruling on whether the President had done something Constitutional since it ruled that Nixon could not withhold evidence on Watergate. The experience so traumatized the Supreme Court that it didn't ever want to do it again. My goodness, they had to make a decision in only days, rather than months. And they had to make themselves clear, rather than have a separate opinion from all nine judges. Too much stress!

That has left America where it is today: the President doesn't know what the hell is Constitutional or not. The Court won't tell him with one voice. Neither will Congress. That leaves the White House lawyers, trembling at the wrath of the President, telling the President whatever he wants to hear about Constitutionality.

It is a very ineffective system when one branch (Supreme Court, the Mommy branch) is too lazy/cowardly/slow to decide what is Constitutional and the other branch (Congress, the Daddy branch) is schizophrenic, hearing hundreds of confused/angry voices buzzing in its head about what is Constitutional. That leaves the third branch (President, the Baby branch) to be a whinny child, making decisions depending on the personality of the child sitting in the President's chair. Smart child or dumb child? Strong or weak self-control? Stoical or prone to tantrums? Truthful or dishonest?

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, July 5, 2019 4:06 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
Until the Supreme Court makes a ruling, any action by the President is in a quantum superposition of constitutional/unconstitutional.

is not like
Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
That has left America where it is today: the President doesn't know what the hell is Constitutional or not.

Have fun debating yourself.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Wednesday, July 10, 2019 6:56 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Why Trump Fears the Secret British Memo Calling Him a Clown

It’s notable that rather than lashing out with his customary viciousness, Trump is attempting to isolate the issue to the idiosyncratic views of a single, “wacky” ambassador who will soon be replaced. Meanwhile, Trump insists he maintains good relations with the royal family and the (unnamed) next British prime minister.

The president’s unusual restraint may reflect two realities that Democrats ought to bear in mind. A pollster once told me that one of the few foreign-policy facts that registers in the minds of the electorate is the country’s standing with its allies; a rift with friendly nations actually bothers lots of people. A Pew survey from a couple years ago found that 59 percent of Americans believe their country “should take into account the interests of its allies even if it means making compromises with them,” while only 36 percent agreed that it “should follow its own national interests even when its allies strongly disagree.” Trump’s notion of “America first” does not command popular support, and hostility toward a country like Great Britain can actually hurt Trump.

Second, the memo validates questions about Trump’s fitness for office. In a recent poll, 65 percent of the public agreed Trump has “acted in a way that’s unpresidential.” Of course, some of that 65 percent approve of Trump’s overall performance anyway — they’re Republicans, after all — but the size of this number shows just how many Americans find his conduct distasteful or worse.

The case against Trump contains so many damning particulars, it is difficult to narrow it down. But the existence of a written memo confirming the view of a close American ally that Trump is utterly unfit for office might qualify as one of those facts the opposition should bring to the public’s attention.

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/trump-fears-secret-british-memo
-kim-darroch.html


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, July 11, 2019 8:39 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly




The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, July 13, 2019 7:56 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


For most Republicans, whether they were prominent pundits or everyday voters, there proved to be no contradiction between conservatism and Trumpism. Quite the opposite, actually. According to Gallup, 94 percent of self-identified conservative Republicans approve of the job Trump is doing. This is because conservatism isn’t, for most people, an ideology. It’s a group identity.

A clever 2018 paper by political scientists Michael Barber and Jeremy Pope tested this experimentally. Trump was constantly adopting contradictory positions on issues, and his reputation for saying and doing anything primed voters to believe he really had said whatever you told them he’d said. “There has never been a president (or any party leader) who shifts back and forth so often between liberal and conservative issue positions,” they wrote, and that opened space for a revealing study.

Here’s how it worked: Barber and Pope asked voters if they agreed or disagreed with different policies. Because of the "flexibility" of Trump’s rhetoric, they were able to pick policies where Trump had, at some point, taken both a liberal policy position and a conservative policy position. And so some voters were asked about the policy without a cue telling them what Trump thought, but other voters were asked about the policy and given either Trump’s liberal position on the policy or his conservative one.

The idea here was to see how much of a difference Trump’s positioning made, and to whom. The people who identified as most strongly conservative were the likeliest to move in response to Trump. And the effect was about the same size whether Trump was taking the conservative or liberal position. It was the direction of Trump, not the direction of the policy, that mattered. Interestingly, there wasn’t an equal and opposite reaction among liberals: They didn’t change position.

Mark Sanford, politician, explained why Republicans switch their beliefs as Trump switches back and forth: “People would come up and they say, ‘Look, he’s the quarterback. You got to go with the quarterback.’”

More at www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/7/12/20690910/donald-trump-justin
-amash-republicans-primaries-conservatives



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Saturday, July 13, 2019 8:44 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Have fun debating yourself.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Saturday, July 13, 2019 9:27 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Back on cartoons, huh?

Here's what Democrats really believe happened with Clinton's emails...



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, July 16, 2019 10:04 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Author Stephen King predicted the rise of Trump 40 years ago



The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 7:06 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Fox News mentioned AOC more than 3,000 times in a six-week span. Watch this supercut. It’s dizzying:


There’s a reason conservative media focuses relentlessly on Ocasio-Cortez, and to a lesser but still disproportionate extent, Tlaib and Omar. Vilifying nonwhite, female members of Congress electrifies their audience is a way that vilifying, say, Rep. Richard Neal, the powerful but bland chair of the House Ways and Means Committee, does not. The strategy of Fox News and much of the conservative media is to activate white threat in a browning America. Elevating and demonizing extremely liberal, nonwhite, young, female politicians is one way they do it.

This is what House Democratic leadership fears: that Ocasio-Cortez and the Squad, through their dominance of social media and their centrality on conservative media, will become the faces of the House Democratic majority. Centering American politics on the rising power of unapologetically liberal, young, nonwhite politicians is the right’s best hope for holding power: As reams of research show, when white Americans believe themselves losing demographic and political control of the country, they become far more conservative.

More at www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/7/16/20695031/trump-ocasio-cortez
-omar-pressley-tlaib-pelosi-squad


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 9:54 AM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by Oonjerah:
I'm an actual, registered Democrat.

But I'm not sure what the topic is. Democrats can post in here,
and talk about themselves ... about why they are democrats ...
or what democrats believe in?

    My parents were Republicans.
    I was an adult in my 40's before I found out I was a democrat.
I didn't really know what the 2 parties stood for, so I asked a
friend who loves politics what I was.

Republicans tend to be conservative. Democrats tend to be liberal.
Can I even say what those words mean? Not very well.
Conservatives stand for law & order. i.e., Authority.
Democrats believe in human rights and equality. i.e., Freedom.
Anarchists believe in every man for himself?


... oooOO}{OOooo ...



T


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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 11:19 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


I’m struck at how many people have come up to me recently and said, “Trump’s going to get re-elected, isn’t he?” And in each case, when I drilled down to ask why, I bumped into the Democratic presidential debates in June. I think a lot of Americans were shocked by some of the things they heard there. I was.

Dear Democrats: This is not complicated! Just nominate a decent, sane person, one committed to reunifying the country and creating more good jobs, a person who can gain the support of the independents, moderate Republicans and suburban women who abandoned Donald Trump in the midterms and thus swung the House of Representatives to the Democrats and could do the same for the presidency. And that candidate can win!

But please, spare me the revolution! It can wait. Win the presidency, hold the House and narrow the spread in the Senate, and a lot of good things still can be accomplished. “No,” you say, “the left wants a revolution now!” O.K., I’ll give the left a revolution now: four more years of Donald Trump.

That will be a revolution.

More at www.nytimes.com/2019/07/16/opinion/trump-2020.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 12:06 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Biden is your only candidate out there that has a chance with polling data that fits any of that criteria, and he's just a white Obama.

Or to put it another way, he's just a Democratic Bush.

I'd say the Democrats have about a 15 to 20% chance of getting Trump out. That number goes down if anybody but Biden is nominated.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 12:07 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
I’m struck at how many people have come up to me recently and said, “Trump’s going to get re-elected, isn’t he?” And in each case, when I drilled down to ask why, I bumped into the Democratic presidential debates in June. I think a lot of Americans were shocked by some of the things they heard there. I was.

Dear Democrats: This is not complicated! Just nominate a decent, sane person, one committed to reunifying the country and creating more good jobs, a person who can gain the support of the independents, moderate Republicans and suburban women who abandoned Donald Trump in the midterms and thus swung the House of Representatives to the Democrats and could do the same for the presidency. And that candidate can win!

But please, spare me the revolution! It can wait. Win the presidency, hold the House and narrow the spread in the Senate, and a lot of good things still can be accomplished. “No,” you say, “the left wants a revolution now!” O.K., I’ll give the left a revolution now: four more years of Donald Trump.

That will be a revolution.

More at www.nytimes.com/2019/07/16/opinion/trump-2020.html




Great article from someone I tend to agree with all the time, Thomas Friedman. He would be my Consigliere if I were president - at least on speed dial. He points out many of the problems that come from Trump that aren't even caused directly by him. Namely, hating him so much people want to go to opposite extremes to balance things out.

I don't know how any rational person could argue with:

"I was shocked that so many candidates in the party whose nominee I was planning to support want to get rid of the private health insurance covering some 250 million Americans and have “Medicare for all” instead. I think we should strengthen Obamacare and eventually add a public option.

I was shocked that so many were ready to decriminalize illegal entry into our country. I think people should have to ring the doorbell before they enter my house or my country.

I was shocked at all those hands raised in support of providing comprehensive health coverage to undocumented immigrants. I think promises we’ve made to our fellow Americans should take priority, like to veterans in need of better health care."

Unless it's because Trump. I do it sometimes myself because he's such a loathsome pos. It might take half dozen presidents before we get past the Trump Effect.

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Wednesday, July 17, 2019 12:10 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:

There’s a reason conservative media focuses relentlessly on Ocasio-Cortez, and to a lesser but still disproportionate extent, Tlaib and Omar. Vilifying nonwhite, female members of Congress electrifies their audience is a way that vilifying, say, Rep. Richard Neal, the powerful but bland chair of the House Ways and Means Committee, does not. The strategy of Fox News and much of the conservative media is to activate white threat in a browning America. Elevating and demonizing extremely liberal, nonwhite, young, female politicians is one way they do it.

This is what House Democratic leadership fears: that Ocasio-Cortez and the Squad, through their dominance of social media and their centrality on conservative media, will become the faces of the House Democratic majority. Centering American politics on the rising power of unapologetically liberal, young, nonwhite politicians is the right’s best hope for holding power: As reams of research show, when white Americans believe themselves losing demographic and political control of the country, they become far more conservative.



Or, yanno, it's their ridiculous Socialist views that are getting them the attention they deserve.

But no... That would mean that women in America, particular minority women in positions of power, have a voice. That goes against everything that the Democrats stand for.

They're victims because they're women. They're victims because they're not white. They're victims even though they hold great positions of power and get paid the same as every old white male colleague.

They're eternally victims.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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