REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Fascistic immigration policy continues to kill kids

POSTED BY: REAVERFAN
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 17, 2019 20:39
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Sunday, June 30, 2019 10:28 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:


So far, all we're doing is creating desperate exploitable people and then importing them into the USA for the corporations' convenience. - SIGNY

We're doing more than that. We're creating desperate exploitable citizens who are in competition with cheaper foreign labor, automation and all of the illegals we take into the country.
Then to top that all off, we gimp our own people by not even bothering to teach them the Metric System in their formative years. Dollars to donuts that 95% or more of the people sitting in "concentration camps" right now know how to use the Metric System and have been using it all of their lives. - SIX

Yup - the f*cking metric system! That's the real problem! = GSTRING

Wow, GSTTRING, it looks like you missed a whole triple ice cream banana split and focused on the cherry on top!

Well, you DO know the old saying, right? When the finger points to the moon, the fool looks at the finger


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .



Haha!

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, June 30, 2019 10:49 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Another Einstein checks in. I dunno, geenius, just off the top of my head maybe you use the carrot to get people to legally cross the border? That's what you want, right? - CC

Not really. IF you had read my post about what I want for this nation, the answer is ... only legitimate political asylum-seekers.- SIGNY

You mean... legal immigrants? Like I just said? -CC

I mean people who meet the criteria for political asylum, which is a much narrower category than today's "legal" immigrants since we have a quota-based allowance for family re-unification, special skills, and people requesting asylum NOT for political reasons etc.

Do you know how many immigrants out system allows LEGALLY?

Of course not! You're just spouting generalities which lack subtance!

Our system allows 675,000 LEGAL immigrants into this country every year.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/how-united-states-
immigration-system-works

https://immigrationroad.com/visa-bulletin/immigrant-visa-annual-limit-
and-cap.php

I would drop that to less than half.

Quote:

Unless of course, you don't want that as well. - CC

Well, give the man a gold star! IF we manage to stop interfering everywhere in the world, we can stop feeling responsible for all of the damage that we've done. (Yes, I know ... there are some people who still naively believe that we're on some sort of fucking worldwide mission of mercy. HAHAHAHA!!!) - SIGNY-

Wait, so you really don't want any immigration allowed to this country? Close the borders for good? (except "legitimate political asylum-seekers," whoever that is. I'm sure the definition of that will be interesting).- CC

See above

Quote:

We do not have the means to solve the world's problems,- SIGNY

When you speak in such broad generalizations you lose credibility.- CC

We do not have the means to solve the world's problems. Name one world problem that we can solve. Lack of infrastructure in the southern hemisphere? Political corruption? Poverty? Tyranny? Inequality? Climate shift? Overfishing? Plastic pollution? Heck, we can't even solve something relatively limited, like polio or malaria! I suppose we DO have the capacity to solve overpopulation if we set of strategically-placed nuclear bombs ... I'll give you that one!

Quote:

nor do we have the means to take in an infinite number of impoverished people.- SIGNY
We're not trying to take in an infinite number of people.
When you speak nonsense and make sh*t up you lose all credibility.- CC

Okay, an "indefinite" number.

So, be specific: What's a good number for YOU? A million? Two million? Twenty million? More? Less?

Quote:

Hell, we can't even take care of our own homeless, mentally ill, unemployed, sick people who've been squeezed out of our ever-so-gracious system! - SIGNY

Maybe we should make them emigrate! That would solve the problem!
When you think the solution to such enormous problems are a couple of pithy sentences on a forum,

Like you just wrote?
Quote:

you lose all credibility.- CC

Hmm... well, I've written more than "a couple" of pithy sentences, but YOU refused to read them!

Importantly, I traced our moral culpability for the current immigration crisis all the way back to over a century of repeatedly invading, destabilizing, and overthrowing nascent democratic movements to our south, movements which were attempting land reform, education, higher wages, independent foreign and economic policy etc. We've ALWAYS been on the side of our banks, our corporations, and their internal elites and their military juntas, and this didn't happen just once but over and over, and is still happening today (Venezuela, Cuba, Honduras - thank you Hillary Clinton for that one! ... Brazil ...) As such, we have thwarted each nation's natural political and economic development and have a huge responsibility for how they are today. Of course, we have no idea how things would have turned out without our meddling, maybe better, maybe worse, but at least WE wouldn't be in the chain of events. So the FIRST thing we need to do is STOP MEDDLING IN THEIR INTERNAL POLITICS.

Quote:

WHY for god's sake do we think we can, or should, take care of "everyone else"? - SIGNY
Who is "we?" The phony big bad you're trying to create?- CC

If you listen to most of the DNC candidates, and a lot of our Democratic politicians in CA, Texas, New Mexico, and New York City, that's exactly what "we" should be doing. Our fearless leader, for example, Gavin Newsom, thinks we (Californians) should be footing the medical bills for illegal aliens here in CA, and this will be funded by taxes in citizens. Now if THAT isn't showing preference for illegals over citizens, I don;t knwo what is.

Quote:

IF we can manage to solve OUR problems ... and so far, we haven't done such a bang-up job, have we? ... THEN we might have a clue how to solve someone else's. So far, all we're doing is creating desperate exploitable people and then importing them into the USA for the corporations' convenience. - SIGNY

How many immigrants have become successful, valuable US citizens that you/other citizens have benefitted from having in this country?- CC

What percent? I dunno, YOU tell ME. Illegal aliens take in a larger percentage of goernment help than citiznes. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/washington-secrets/census-confirms-
63-percent-of-non-citizens-on-welfare-4-6-million-households


Quote:

Don't you employ non-native nannies?- GSTTRING
Yanno, when you keep on throwing this ad-hominum up, in spite of the fact that I have addressed it at length many times, that tells me you're just a tool. I have NEVER hired an illegal alien housekkeeper or gardener or workman. I insist on not only seeing a driver's license and a Social Security card (which I check on e-Verify) but (for our nannies) native-English speaking skills and car insurance. I pay Social Security and unemployment. My current gardener was a homless citizen when I first employed him (he's now, fortunately, in assisted housing) I don't go to Home Depot to pick up day laborers.

Quote:

Uh-huh.- CC
Uh uh. So, yanno, fuck you. Get it right next time and stop being such a dick.

Quote:

Do you buy produce of any kind... on and on. You don't even know how.
I don't know "how" ? I don't know "how" what? I can't stop agribusiness from hiring illegls, THAT'S MY OBJECTION. I don't want to buy stuff produced by $1/hr stoop labor. I buy a lot of my produce from farmer's market, and I'm willing to pay more for food that's produced using legal, union labor.

Quote:

This post of yours has no substance, all recycled BS. You're not really thinking, just typing the usual crud.-GSTRING
Yanno, when you make general comments like that, you lose all credibility.

You CLEARLY don't know anything about the immigration process, or the economic problems that illegal immigrants cause workers here in this country, or crazy infrastrucural demands (housing, water, schools, healthcare, transportation) that a few extra million people can place on a city, or the dysfunctional policies that're being promoted by most Democratic candidates and many Democratic politicians.

I've been extremely specific. I know the numbers, I know the facts. You? You just type surious generalities and when you ARE specific (like your repeated accusation that I hire illegals) you're just plain wrong, or you're just plain lying.

When you have something SPECIFIC to say ... oh, like how many immigrant YOU would take in, and what the criteria would be for admitting them, and how you would stem the flow, and resolve the initial cause of mass migrations, and eliminate our moral culpability, and how you would either fold illegals into our economic system without causing employment disclocation or deport them over time ... well then, please feel free to post something useful!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Sunday, June 30, 2019 1:25 PM

REAVERFAN



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Sunday, June 30, 2019 2:03 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
... why people are so desperate and willing to endure extreme conditions, even death, to come here ...

If they're so desperate for something better - for someplace not so controlled by local gangs gunning FOR THEM - why not go a few towns over? Or just across their borders into the next country over? Or seek asykum in Mexico? Why will the US and ONLY the US do?

Here's the reason. It's like dieting. If you're not hungry enough to eat a celery stalk, you're not hungry.

Or, since I have to be explicit for the lame of mind, if you're not desperate enough to go ANYwhere, you're not desperate.

ETA - So let me outline the story for you. People are putting their kids at risk by trying to cross illegally not because they're 'desperate' for anything better; and not because they're seeking legal status in the US. It's a different motivation. They're hoping to hit the jackpot - to cross undetected into the US, and to disappear into the background.

And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Sunday, June 30, 2019 2:27 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
"legitimate political asylum-seekers" whoever that is. I'm sure the definition of that will be interesting).

Here's the generic definition from Homeland Security:
Quote:

A refugee is a person outside his or her country of nationality who is unable or unwilling to return to his or her country of nationality because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion. An asylee is a person who meets the definition of refugee and is already present in the United States or is seeking admission at a port of entry. Refugees are required to apply for Lawful Permanent Resident (“green card”) status one year after being admitted, and asylees may apply for green card status one year after their grant of asylum.
Are you following so far? There's some big words in there.
(*BTW, I hope you've noticed there's no spot for economic refugees.)
Take that definition and change it to this "on account of ... political opinion."
Clear enough?
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
We do not have the means to solve the world's problems,

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
When you speak in such broad generalizations you lose credibility.

OK, here's a broad generality: the earth revolves around the sun. How much credibility have I lost?
You get stuck on the stupidest things, CEREALMUSH. Like the form of a statement rather than its content. Or the 'source' of news, rather than its veracity.
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
nor do we have the means to take in an infinite number of impoverished people.

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
We're not trying to take in an infinite number of people.
When you speak nonsense and make sh*t up you lose all credibility.

And yet, it's a valid question you're trying to avoid.
Has the US set limits? It's a simple YES/ NO question you SHOULD be able to answer to determine whether or not Signy speaks 'nonsense'.

AND I EXPECT AN ANSWER.
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Hell, we can't even take care of our own homeless, mentally ill, unemployed, sick people who've been squeezed out of our ever-so-gracious system!

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
Maybe we should make them emigrate! THAT WOULD SOLVE the problem!
When you think the SOLUTION to such enormous problems are a couple of pithy sentences on a forum, you lose all credibility.

EXCEPT SIGNY DIDN'T PROPOSE THE SOLUTION _ YOU _ DID.

When you lie like that, you lose whatever shred of believability you might have thought you had. And, when you try to refute a point with complete shit-ass made up snark, you don't.
Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
How many immigrants

sounds of tires screeching to a halt on the pavement

You forgot the word ILLEGAL. LEGAL V ILLEGAL. One is not like the other. No one is complaining about LEGAL immigrants.

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
Filing under: ... running up her post count.


Filing under: too chicken to post Russian Troll™.



And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 5:07 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Well, speak of the devil ....

Quote:

US Government Tops All for Creating Refugees
Eric Zuesse
June 30, 2019

On June 19th, Statistica headlined “Number of forcibly displaced people reaches new high”, and when one looks at the data, one finds an even bigger story which stands behind those numbers:

This new report from the United Nations documents Statistica’s headline, and it proves that America’s regime-change operations have actually created around half of the world’s refugees. It proves that America’s penchant for invading and trying to overthrow the governments that its billionaires want to replace (“regime-change”) has been by far the biggest of all single causes of refugees worldwide, vastly higher than any other government. Regardless of how bad those other governments might possibly be, the US regime is far worse — at least as being the cause, the creator, of the world’s refugee problems.

Consider the countries that the US regime has recently regime-changed or attempted to:

The US regime invaded Afghanistan in 2001, Iraq in 2003, Syria in 2012-2019, and has been applying, in order to overthrow the Government of Venezuela, strangulating economic sanctions. All of those four target-countries (Syria, Venezuela, Iraq, and Afghanistan) lead the list of nations that are bleeding the most refugees. The US regime’s “regime-change” operations abroad are therefore certainly the leading cause of the world’s refugee-crisis.

That’s the big news in the new UN report, though it is news that the report itself ignores.

The biggest of these crises in 2018 were Syria and Venezuela, which were the US regime’s most recent regime-change operations. But Afghanistan and Iraq are also among the top bleeders of refugees — even now, over 15 years after the US regime had invaded them.

On 26 January 2019, Britain’s Independent headlined “Venezuela crisis: Former UN rapporteur says US sanctions are killing citizens: ‘Modern-day economic sanctions and blockades are comparable with medieval sieges of towns’” ...

MORE AT

https://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2019/06/30/us-government-tops-a
ll-for-creating-refugees
/

But, I knew that already. And now, you do too.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:03 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

But, I knew that already. And now, you do too.

At home, defense spending crowds out funds for everything else a prosperous economy and a healthy society need. Abroad, it has led us to become a country reflexively reliant on the military and one quite different from what we think ourselves to be or, I believe, wish to be.

For many years, the United States has increasingly relied on military strength to achieve its foreign policy aims. In doing so, it has paid too little heed to the issues that military power cannot solve, to the need for diplomatic capabilities at least as strong as military ones and, in particular, to the necessity of multilateral problem-solving — as slow and frustrating as it often is — to address current threats. Sadly, it took a rash and unbelievably unwise decision by the president to throw away the Iran nuclear deal for members of Congress and the public to begin to appreciate what tough, patient diplomacy can achieve.

We are now at the point of allocating too large a portion of the federal budget to defense as compared to domestic needs, tolerating too much spending that doesn’t buy useful capability, accumulating too much federal debt, and yet not acquiring a forward-looking, twenty-first-century military built around new cyber and space technologies. We have become complacent and strategically flabby about adapting to a profoundly altered world. Major change will require a quality of leadership we haven’t seen in a long time, from men and women in the White House, Congress, and the Pentagon who are respected for their knowledge and national security experience and who are willing to pay a political price for what must be done. Even then the process will be tough, slow, and painful, but it is surely overdue.

America’s Indefensible Defense Budget
www.nybooks.com/articles/2019/07/18/americas-indefensible-defense-budg
et
/

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 1, 2019 9:28 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

Another Einstein checks in. I dunno, geenius, just off the top of my head maybe you use the carrot to get people to legally cross the border? That's what you want, right? - CC

Not really. IF you had read my post about what I want for this nation, the answer is ... only legitimate political asylum-seekers.- SIGNY

You mean... legal immigrants? Like I just said? -CC

I mean people who meet the criteria for political asylum, which is a much narrower category than today's "legal" immigrants since we have a quota-based allowance for family re-unification, special skills, and people requesting asylum NOT for political reasons etc.

Do you know how many immigrants out system allows LEGALLY?

Of course not! You're just spouting generalities which lack subtance!

Our system allows 675,000 LEGAL immigrants into this country every year.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/how-united-states-
immigration-system-works

https://immigrationroad.com/visa-bulletin/immigrant-visa-annual-limit-
and-cap.php

I would drop that to less than half.

Quote:

Unless of course, you don't want that as well. - CC

Well, give the man a gold star! IF we manage to stop interfering everywhere in the world, we can stop feeling responsible for all of the damage that we've done. (Yes, I know ... there are some people who still naively believe that we're on some sort of fucking worldwide mission of mercy. HAHAHAHA!!!) - SIGNY-

Wait, so you really don't want any immigration allowed to this country? Close the borders for good? (except "legitimate political asylum-seekers," whoever that is. I'm sure the definition of that will be interesting).- CC

See above

Quote:

We do not have the means to solve the world's problems,- SIGNY

When you speak in such broad generalizations you lose credibility.- CC

We do not have the means to solve the world's problems. Name one world problem that we can solve. Lack of infrastructure in the southern hemisphere? Political corruption? Poverty? Tyranny? Inequality? Climate shift? Overfishing? Plastic pollution? Heck, we can't even solve something relatively limited, like polio or malaria! I suppose we DO have the capacity to solve overpopulation if we set of strategically-placed nuclear bombs ... I'll give you that one!

Quote:

nor do we have the means to take in an infinite number of impoverished people.- SIGNY
We're not trying to take in an infinite number of people.
When you speak nonsense and make sh*t up you lose all credibility.- CC

Okay, an "indefinite" number.

So, be specific: What's a good number for YOU? A million? Two million? Twenty million? More? Less?

Quote:

Hell, we can't even take care of our own homeless, mentally ill, unemployed, sick people who've been squeezed out of our ever-so-gracious system! - SIGNY

Maybe we should make them emigrate! That would solve the problem!
When you think the solution to such enormous problems are a couple of pithy sentences on a forum,

Like you just wrote?
Quote:

you lose all credibility.- CC

Hmm... well, I've written more than "a couple" of pithy sentences, but YOU refused to read them!

Importantly, I traced our moral culpability for the current immigration crisis all the way back to over a century of repeatedly invading, destabilizing, and overthrowing nascent democratic movements to our south, movements which were attempting land reform, education, higher wages, independent foreign and economic policy etc. We've ALWAYS been on the side of our banks, our corporations, and their internal elites and their military juntas, and this didn't happen just once but over and over, and is still happening today (Venezuela, Cuba, Honduras - thank you Hillary Clinton for that one! ... Brazil ...) As such, we have thwarted each nation's natural political and economic development and have a huge responsibility for how they are today. Of course, we have no idea how things would have turned out without our meddling, maybe better, maybe worse, but at least WE wouldn't be in the chain of events. So the FIRST thing we need to do is STOP MEDDLING IN THEIR INTERNAL POLITICS.

Quote:

WHY for god's sake do we think we can, or should, take care of "everyone else"? - SIGNY
Who is "we?" The phony big bad you're trying to create?- CC

If you listen to most of the DNC candidates, and a lot of our Democratic politicians in CA, Texas, New Mexico, and New York City, that's exactly what "we" should be doing. Our fearless leader, for example, Gavin Newsom, thinks we (Californians) should be footing the medical bills for illegal aliens here in CA, and this will be funded by taxes in citizens. Now if THAT isn't showing preference for illegals over citizens, I don;t knwo what is.

Quote:

IF we can manage to solve OUR problems ... and so far, we haven't done such a bang-up job, have we? ... THEN we might have a clue how to solve someone else's. So far, all we're doing is creating desperate exploitable people and then importing them into the USA for the corporations' convenience. - SIGNY

How many immigrants have become successful, valuable US citizens that you/other citizens have benefitted from having in this country?- CC

What percent? I dunno, YOU tell ME. Illegal aliens take in a larger percentage of goernment help than citiznes. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/washington-secrets/census-confirms-
63-percent-of-non-citizens-on-welfare-4-6-million-households


Quote:

Don't you employ non-native nannies?- GSTTRING
Yanno, when you keep on throwing this ad-hominum up, in spite of the fact that I have addressed it at length many times, that tells me you're just a tool. I have NEVER hired an illegal alien housekkeeper or gardener or workman. I insist on not only seeing a driver's license and a Social Security card (which I check on e-Verify) but (for our nannies) native-English speaking skills and car insurance. I pay Social Security and unemployment. My current gardener was a homless citizen when I first employed him (he's now, fortunately, in assisted housing) I don't go to Home Depot to pick up day laborers.

Quote:

Uh-huh.- CC
Uh uh. So, yanno, fuck you. Get it right next time and stop being such a dick.

Quote:

Do you buy produce of any kind... on and on. You don't even know how.
I don't know "how" ? I don't know "how" what? I can't stop agribusiness from hiring illegls, THAT'S MY OBJECTION. I don't want to buy stuff produced by $1/hr stoop labor. I buy a lot of my produce from farmer's market, and I'm willing to pay more for food that's produced using legal, union labor.

Quote:

This post of yours has no substance, all recycled BS. You're not really thinking, just typing the usual crud.-GSTRING
Yanno, when you make general comments like that, you lose all credibility.

You CLEARLY don't know anything about the immigration process, or the economic problems that illegal immigrants cause workers here in this country, or crazy infrastrucural demands (housing, water, schools, healthcare, transportation) that a few extra million people can place on a city, or the dysfunctional policies that're being promoted by most Democratic candidates and many Democratic politicians.

I've been extremely specific. I know the numbers, I know the facts. You? You just type surious generalities and when you ARE specific (like your repeated accusation that I hire illegals) you're just plain wrong, or you're just plain lying.

When you have something SPECIFIC to say ... oh, like how many immigrant YOU would take in, and what the criteria would be for admitting them, and how you would stem the flow, and resolve the initial cause of mass migrations, and eliminate our moral culpability, and how you would either fold illegals into our economic system without causing employment disclocation or deport them over time ... well then, please feel free to post something useful!



Another diarrhea post from Lysherassov.

You CLEARLY don't know anything about the immigration process, you just think you do.

Seriously, do you actually read what other people write? Or just decide what you think they mean is better because it's easier for you to make sh*t up?

For instance:
Quote:

Don't you employ non-native nannies?
Yanno, when you keep on throwing this ad-hominum up, in spite of the fact that I have addressed it at length many times, that tells me you're just a tool. I have NEVER hired an illegal alien housekkeeper or gardener or workman... - SIGFORBRAINS



Where does it it say I said illegal?

The point I made - if you could actually read and be honest about what you read - was that we all benefit from LEGAL immigration, the kind you benefit from directly, the kind that you have in your personal history.

READ IT AGAIN

And you still can't understand why no one responded to your "what kind of country do we want?" even when you posted it 20 times. You're such a dumbass.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 12:20 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Don't you employ non-native nannies?- GSTRING

Yanno, when you keep on throwing this ad-hominum up, in spite of the fact that I have addressed it at length many times, that tells me you're just a tool. I have NEVER hired an illegal alien housekkeeper or gardener or workman... - SIGNY

Where does it it say I said illegal? - GSTRING

OK, GSTRING, let me answer this question as you asked it: NO, I HAVE NEVER HIRED A NON-NATIVE NANNY. I needed someone whose English was far better than just "getting by". Someone to whom I could explain what a seizure looked like. Someone who could reliably call 911 and tell them in detail what was going on. Someone that I could get a report on at the end of the day if anything unusual happened.


Quote:

Another diarrhea post from Lysherassov.
You CLEARLY don't know anything about the immigration process, you just think you do.- GSTRING

My DAD was an immigrant. My HUSBAND is an immigrant. I worked with immigrants from all over the world, so once again- and with all due respect - fuck off.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 1, 2019 3:31 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
OK, GSTRING, let me answer this question as you asked it: NO, I HAVE NEVER HIRED A NON-NATIVE NANNY.



Well, at least you acknowledge you were full of sh*t for saying I said "illegal." It's always so hard to get you to own your own cock-ups.

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM: My DAD was an immigrant. My HUSBAND is an immigrant. I worked with immigrants from all over the world, so once again - and with all due respect - fuck off.



If you really have worked with immigrants "from all over the world" you'd know that in most cases, 1 to 1, they will work circles around most US born workers. And I'd gladly switch out 30 million Trumptards for 30 million immigrants.

BTW my wife is an immigrant, my grand parents were all immigrants, so you can shove your "but muh family" phony ownership condescension crap up your @ss. With all due respect.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 5:18 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


So I take it that your wife isn't too keen on illegal immigration either, Most legal immigrants aren't.
Now, this is why I would like to limit LEGAL immigration to asylees:

If you allow "family reunification" or "chained migration" you have a tendency to allow people who simply want to take advantage of the system. We see that here in the Chinese community, where husband and wife immigrate, then sponsor mom and set her up in their home, then (once the government stops looking at whether mom is being properly supported by spnosor, typically a little over three years) set "mom" up on welfare,even tho she's living in a milion dollar house and driving a mercedes. My chinese friends filled me in on that.

OTOH, if you allow only "the best and the brightest", then you are literally robbing other nations of THEIR best and brightest, causing a "brain drain". Then on top of that, like in any other sector immigrants will work for less. Quite often it's not that technical positions can't be filled by Americans who will do the job just as well if not better, it's just that companies don't want to spend $50,000 for an engineer when they could pay someone $9/hr to (say) write the Boeing 747 MAX software. (whichbtw is what happened). Why pay an American nurse $30,000 when you can pay a Philippina doctor $25,000 to do the same job?

I've probably conducted over 250 interviews for technical positions in my professional life, of both native and foreign-born. Maybe we had really good screening procedures bt I didn't see any overall difference in technical skill, altho I HAVE noticed that some Chinese women were super-hierarchy-conscious and tended to suck up to the boss (me) even as they were knifing their peers and underlings in the back. NOT a good trait!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:33 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:

Well, at least you acknowledge you were full of sh*t for saying I said "illegal." It's always so hard to get you to own your own cock-ups.

CEREALMUSH

I'm waiting for YOU to own up to YOUR cock-ups - outright lies, strawmanning, and snark. But I'm not holding my breath.

I'm just pointing out what a hypocritical, amoral fucktard you are.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:34 PM

REAVERFAN


if true there need to be a LOT of agents fired.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/insi...-post-sexist-memes_n_5d1a424ee4b
082e5536da6bf


These are supposed to be professionals. I smell a lawyer feeding frenzy that will cost Millions.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:35 PM

REAVERFAN


@AOC
This just broke: a secret Facebook group of 9,500 CBP officers discussed making a GoFundMe for officers to harm myself & Rep. Escobar during our visit to CBP facilities & mocked migrant deaths. This isn’t about “a few bad eggs.” This is a violent culture.
https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1145726686589329410?s=20

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:36 PM

REAVERFAN


Migrants told to drink from toilets at El Paso border station, Congresswoman alleges
https://www.kvia.com/news/border/mi...rder-station-congresswoman-alleg
es/1090951789


I get so sick of these clowns acting like they think they're patriots, or that anyone is on board with their hate. They're traitors.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:37 PM

REAVERFAN


Inside the Secret Border Patrol Facebook Group Where Agents Joke About Migrant Deaths and Post Sexist Memes
The three-year-old group, which has roughly 9,500 members, shared derogatory comments about Latina lawmakers who plan to visit a controversial Texas detention facility on Monday, calling them “scum buckets” and “hoes.”


https://www.propublica.org/article/...social&utm_source=twitter&am
p;utm_campaign=buffer


More from the report:

Created in August 2016, the Facebook group is called “I’m 10-15” and boasts roughly 9,500 members from across the country. (10-15 is Border Patrol code for “aliens in custody.”) The group described itself, in an online introduction, as a forum for “funny” and “serious” discussion about work with the patrol. “Remember you are never alone in this family,” the introduction said
ProPublica received images of several recent discussions in the 10-15 Facebook group and was able to link the participants in those online conversations to apparently legitimate Facebook profiles belonging to Border Patrol agents, including a supervisor based in El Paso, Texas, and an agent in Eagle Pass, Texas. ProPublica has so far been unable to reach the group members who made the postings.

ProPublica contacted three spokespeople for CBP in regard to the Facebook group and provided the names of three agents who appear to have participated in the online chats. CBP hasn’t yet responded.
The postings, in his view, reflect what “seems to be a pervasive culture of cruelty aimed at immigrants within CBP. This isn’t just a few rogue agents or ‘bad apples.’”
And in early 2018, federal investigators found a raft of disturbing and racist text messages sent by Border Patrol agents in southern Arizona after searching the phone of Matthew Bowen, an agent charged with running down a Guatemalan migrant with a Ford F-150 pickup truck. The texts, which were revealed in a court filing in federal court in Tucson, described migrants as “guats,” “wild ass shitbags,” “beaners” and “subhuman.” The messages included repeated discussions about burning the migrants up.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 7:38 PM

REAVERFAN


And about AOC

Members of the Border Patrol Facebook group were not enthused about the tour, noting that Ocasio-Cortez, a Democrat from Queens, had compared Border Patrol facilities to Nazi concentration camps. Escobar is a freshman Democrat representing El Paso.

One member encouraged Border Patrol agents to hurl a “burrito at these bitches.” Another, apparently a patrol supervisor, wrote, “Fuck the hoes.” “There should be no photo ops for these scum buckets,” posted a third member.

Perhaps the most disturbing posts target Ocasio-Cortez. One includes a photo illustration of her engaged in oral sex at an immigrant detention center. Text accompanying the image reads, “Lucky Illegal Immigrant Glory Hole Special Starring AOC.”

Another is a photo illustration of a smiling President Donald Trump forcing Ocasio-Cortez’s head toward his crotch. The agent who posted the image commented: “That’s right bitches. The masses have spoken and today democracy won.”

Time to bust out the guillotines and execute some Nazis.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 8:38 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


https://www.huffpost.com/entry/inside-the-secret-border-patrol-faceboo
k-group-where-agents-joke-about-migrant-deaths-and-post-sexist-memes_n_5d1a424ee4b082e5536da6bf


Quote:

roughly 9,500 members from across the country

Quote:

In one exchange, group members responded with indifference and wisecracks to the post of a news story about a 16-year-old Guatemalan migrant who died in May while in custody at a Border Patrol station in Weslaco, Texas. One member posted a GIF of Elmo with the quote, “Oh well.” Another responded with an image and the words “If he dies, he dies.”
two posts
Quote:

several recent discussions in the 10-15 Facebook group
Quote:

Several of the postings reviewed by ProPublica refer to the planned visit by members of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus
several definition
"1. more than two but not many.
synonyms: some, a number of, a few, not very many, a handful of, a small group of"
Quote:

three agents who appear to have participated in the online chats
three agents
Quote:

posts target Ocasio-Cortez. One includes ... Another is a photo
two posts
Quote:

seems to be a pervasive culture of cruelty aimed at immigrants within CBP. This isn’t just a few rogue agents or ‘bad apples.’


FWIW I don't doubt there are racist, sexist - let's include homophobic and xenophobic as well - agents and supervisory people. And whoever they are, if their actions ON THE JOB reflect that, they should be investigated, and if guilty, punished up to and including dismissal.

But I'd need to see more than 2, or 3, or a 'small number' of posts out of a group of 9,500 members (who undoubtedly have on average more than one post each) before I'd call it a 'pervasive culture'.

Or, if we're going to use ProPublica's metrics, we could call this site a terrorist nest because of the threats SECOND had made towards Trump. Per capita, we're far worse here.





And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 8:43 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by 1kiki:
Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
"legitimate political asylum-seekers" whoever that is. I'm sure the definition of that will be interesting).

Here's the generic definition from Homeland Security:
Quote:

A refugee is a person outside his or her country of nationality who is unable or unwilling to return to his or her country of nationality because of persecution or a well-founded fear of persecution on account of race, religion, nationality, membership in a particular social group, or political opinion. An asylee is a person who meets the definition of refugee and is already present in the United States or is seeking admission at a port of entry. Refugees are required to apply for Lawful Permanent Resident (“green card”) status one year after being admitted, and asylees may apply for green card status one year after their grant of asylum.
Are you following so far? There's some big words in there.
(*BTW, I hope you've noticed there's no spot for economic refugees.)
Take that definition and change it to this "on account of ... political opinion."
Clear enough?
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
We do not have the means to solve the world's problems,

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
When you speak in such broad generalizations you lose credibility.

OK, here's a broad generality: the earth revolves around the sun. How much credibility have I lost?
You get stuck on the stupidest things, CEREALMUSH. Like the form of a statement rather than its content. Or the 'source' of news, rather than its veracity.
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
nor do we have the means to take in an infinite number of impoverished people.

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
We're not trying to take in an infinite number of people.
When you speak nonsense and make sh*t up you lose all credibility.

And yet, it's a valid question you're trying to avoid.
Has the US set limits? It's a simple YES/ NO question you SHOULD be able to answer to determine whether or not Signy speaks 'nonsense'.

AND I EXPECT AN ANSWER.
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Hell, we can't even take care of our own homeless, mentally ill, unemployed, sick people who've been squeezed out of our ever-so-gracious system!

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
Maybe we should make them emigrate! THAT WOULD SOLVE the problem!
When you think the SOLUTION to such enormous problems are a couple of pithy sentences on a forum, you lose all credibility.

EXCEPT SIGNY DIDN'T PROPOSE THE SOLUTION _ YOU _ DID.

When you lie like that, you lose whatever shred of believability you might have thought you had. And, when you try to refute a point with complete shit-ass made up snark, you don't.
Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
How many immigrants

sounds of tires screeching to a halt on the pavement

You forgot the word ILLEGAL. LEGAL V ILLEGAL. One is not like the other. No one is complaining about LEGAL immigrants.

Quote:

Originally posted by CEREALMUSH:
Filing under: ... running up her post count.


Filing under: too chicken to post Russian Troll™.

Well, pismo inadvertantly implied a good question. Although not dealt with here, because another point was focused on.


How many Illegal Aliens have become successful, valuable US citizens that you/other citizens have benefitted from having in this country?


Other than the Kenyan #44, no Illegal Aliens have become President, right? Other than some Hollywoods folk and Rappers who have been deported, can anyboy name any Illegal Alien of any worth? Who has ever done any good? I cannot recall a single one from our history books.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 8:48 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"At the later news conference, Castro said word of the toilet incident surfaced as the Congressional delegation met with 15 to 20 migrant women — mostly mothers separated from their children — at Hondo Pass to discuss conditions at the facility.

"In fact, one of the women said that she was told by an agent to drink out of the toilet," he explained."

Claims were made by one woman.

I think the focus should be to determine if, in fact, clean drinking water is freely available to all detainees at all times. Because it's a serious health and safety item, that appears to me to be the most salient and important fact to determine. That should be able to be done by a simple inspection of the facilities. Either there are drinking water utilities wherever detainees are kept, and they're working, or not.


BTW, out of all the democratic candidates, Castro seemed extremely biased towards Hispanics and dismissive of everyone else. The only topic he expounded on, and with great passion, was whatever was related to Hispanics. As one example out of many, when asked why he was running for President, he said proudly: "“In fact, you know, my first visit after I announced my candidacy wasn’t to Iowa or New Hampshire. It was to San Juan, Puerto Rico ...”"

Way to stick it to the gringos, Mr. Castro.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Monday, July 1, 2019 8:54 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

One of the problems with Trump's "solution" is it's all stick and no carrot.-CC
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

It's a truism that if you want to "stop" ppl from doing something, you punish them.
If you want people to "do" something, you reward them.

How in god's name do you set up a "reward" system that stops people from illegally crossing the border?

Another Einstein checks in. I dunno, geenius, just off the top of my head maybe you use the carrot to get people to legally cross the border? That's what you want, right? Unless of course, you don't want that as well.

Don't freak - that will never happen with this admin. They don't want ANY immigrants from Mexico on down either, so you're "safe."

Are you insane?

You think a carrot is needed to get people to want to enter America?

Can you name one single country in the world that does NOT have people waiting in line to enter America?

America admitted 1.18 Legal Immigrants in 2016.
There were 10.7 Million Illegal Aliens in America in 2016 - apparently 52% of them from Mexico. This is down from 12.2% in 2007, since the Rock-The-Vote Recession sent the Mexicans back home in droves.
In 2010 and 2011, almost 400,000 Deportations were performed, and total of 2.5 million from 2009-2015.

I don't see any shortage of folk wanting to enter America.

Somebody mentioned 675,000 Legal Immigrants last year. If true, that is more than the current populations of Wyoming, and Vermont, and also the 2010 population of North Dakota.

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Monday, July 1, 2019 11:17 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Pictures reveal that AOC was NOT crying over the facilities at a port of entry, she was crying while facing an empty parking lot. While wearing a $600 watch





OH THE ANGUISH! OH THE INHUMANITY!

Can you say photo-op (fake news)? Sure you can!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 1, 2019 11:23 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


"They left because of poverty. My husband called me from Mexico. He said that they had no problem and they were well.” Maybe they should have stayed in MehHEEko, where they were well and had no problem, instead of gambling their lives trying to hit the jackpot.




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 12:53 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Well, pismo inadvertantly implied a good question. Although not dealt with here, because another point was focused on.
How many Illegal Aliens have become successful, valuable US citizens that you/other citizens have benefitted from having in this country?

Cesar Chavez and Dolores Huerte both came to mind, but when I looked them up they were both born in the USA.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 4:31 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Pictures reveal that AOC was NOT crying over the facilities at a port of entry, she was crying while facing an empty parking lot. While wearing a $600 watch


OH THE ANGUISH! OH THE INHUMANITY!

Can you say photo-op (fake news)? Sure you can!

I heard that AOC claimed she was abused by CBP.

However, word is that she waltzed into the CBP Station, and went right up to and in the face of CBP Agents and yelled and screamed and abused them, without provocation. The video is reportedly in the possession of CBP, but many hope the video can be released - maybe Trump can de-classify it.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 4:53 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

Well, pismo inadvertantly implied a good question. Although not dealt with here, because another point was focused on.
How many Illegal Aliens have become successful, valuable US citizens that you/other citizens have benefitted from having in this country?

Cesar Chavez and Dolores Huerte both came to mind, but when I looked them up they were both born in the USA.

In 1986 Reagan gave amnesty to 3 Million Illegal Aliens. So it's not like there is not an ample supply of folk to make good in America.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 5:08 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

One of the problems with Trump's "solution" is it's all stick and no carrot.-CC
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

It's a truism that if you want to "stop" ppl from doing something, you punish them.
If you want people to "do" something, you reward them.

How in god's name do you set up a "reward" system that stops people from illegally crossing the border?

Another Einstein checks in. I dunno, geenius, just off the top of my head maybe you use the carrot to get people to legally cross the border? That's what you want, right? Unless of course, you don't want that as well.

Don't freak - that will never happen with this admin. They don't want ANY immigrants from Mexico on down either, so you're "safe."

Are you insane?

You think a carrot is needed to get people to want to enter America?

Can you name one single country in the world that does NOT have people waiting in line to enter America?

America admitted 1.18 Legal Immigrants in 2016.
There were 10.7 Million Illegal Aliens in America in 2016 - apparently 52% of them from Mexico. This is down from 12.2% in 2007, since the Rock-The-Vote Recession sent the Mexicans back home in droves.
In 2010 and 2011, almost 400,000 Deportations were performed, and total of 2.5 million from 2009-2015.

I don't see any shortage of folk wanting to enter America.

Somebody mentioned 675,000 Legal Immigrants last year. If true, that is more than the current populations of Wyoming, and Vermont, and also the 2010 population of North Dakota.

Sorry I didn't complete this last night.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:07 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:

You think a carrot is needed to get people to want to enter America?



Clearly the dumbest poster FFF.net has ever had. Or one of Kiki's puppets.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:09 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
While wearing a $600 watch



You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!



No? That doesn't bother you? Liar or Hypocrite?

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 6:19 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
While wearing a $600 watch



You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!


I remember seeing that golden penthouse on one of the news shows. It reminded me of Belle Watling's place in Gone With The Wind. And AOC's watch .. meh. $600 is nothing when it comes to watches. What's she supposed to wear...a Timex?

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 8:11 PM

REAVERFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Pictures reveal that AOC was NOT crying over the facilities at a port of entry, she was crying while facing an empty parking lot. While wearing a $600 watch



Can you say photo-op (fake news)? Sure you can!


That lie was thoroughly debunked.
Of course, Russian trolls specialize in being lying little bitches.

You couldn't tell the truth if you were paid to.
Don't ever come to America. We'll destroy you.

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 10:26 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/aoc-empty-parking-lot/ The roadway leading to the encampment was closed off to news media and protesters. “Obviously,” he said, “there weren’t kids two feet away.”
Were there any at all within her view?
Quote:

The so-called empty parking lot was in fact a roadway leading towards the Tornillo Border Patrol station
So, she was crying over an empty road?
Quote:

Aguirre said. “Her watch — OK she has a new watch.
A new expensive watch?
Quote:

She finally got to the fence and right BEYOND that road
which also managed to be
Quote:

WAY to the left, was the [migrant tent city] camp, and it represented something that made her emotional,” Aguirre told us.
So, she wasn't crying because she saw something terrible, or anything at all, but because of the ideas in her head ... which can't be photographed ...



So here's the story according to Snopes - AOC was crying while looking at an empty road, NOT because of something terrible she saw in front of her, but because she had ideas in her head. While wearing an expensive new watch.

Thanks for clearing that up, Snopes! That tells us everything we need to know about those facilities!




And if democrats don't do anything different, how are they any better?
tic tac

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Tuesday, July 2, 2019 11:15 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!

OMG!!! I'm outraged! It's butt-fucking ugly!
Quote:

No? That doesn't bother you?
Holy crap! YES, it bothers me! It's the worst pile of architectural go se ever.

Quote:

Liar or Hypocrite?
Are you asking me if AOC is liar or hypocrite?

Why choose? Both, maybe?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 3:37 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!

OMG!!! I'm outraged! It's butt-fucking ugly!
Quote:

No? That doesn't bother you?
Holy crap! YES, it bothers me! It's the worst pile of architectural go se ever.

Quote:

Liar or Hypocrite?

Are you asking me if AOC is liar or hypocrite?

Why choose? Both, maybe?






You rationalize obvious double standards with such ease. Like a seasoned pro.

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 8:35 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Why are migrant children dying in U.S. custody? At least seven children are known to have died in immigration custody since last year, after almost a decade in which no child reportedly died while in the custody of U.S. Customs and Border Protection.

The string of cases continue to raise questions around the conditions in which migrant children are being kept. "Children are not like adults. They get sick more quickly and each hour of delay can be associated with serious complications," says a doctor.

www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/why-are-migrant-children-dying-u-s-custody
-n1010316


The straight answer is that if Trump runs childcare like a dog pound, dogs and children will die.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 10:09 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!- CC
OMG!!! I'm outraged! It's butt-fucking ugly!- SIGNY
No? That doesn't bother you?- CC
Holy crap! YES, it bothers me! It's the worst pile of architectural go se ever.-SIGNY

Liar or Hypocrite? - CC
Are you asking me if AOC is liar or hypocrite?
Why choose? Both, maybe?

SIGNY

You rationalize obvious double standards with such ease. Like a seasoned pro. :wink- CC



Hey butthead ... did you finally get some advice on internet libel? Then maybe you should know that in light of your LONG HISTORY of defaming me (and other people around here) your nudge-nudge-wink-wink insinuations aren't going to help you.


You can't seem to separate my criticism of AOC from a defense of Trump. My beef with AOC is that she's an idiot pretending to be a socialist. I think her proposed policies mostly suck and won't solve the wealth gap.

But yanno, this doesn't have to be an either-or choice! I can be critical of both her AND Trump, right? I only agree with Trump on three things, remember? That's a pretty limited palette of things to agree on! Now, I happen to think that they're necessary to fixing what ails us ... necessary but not sufficient ... so he got my vote on those three things ... but I'm not claiming to support him in everything, or to think that he's a nice person.

Now, IN REALITY, it is a widely acknowledged FACT that deaths in custody UNDER OBAMA were about the same as deaths in custody under Trump so far. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/immigrant-deaths-under-trump-o
n-par-with-obama-numbers-dhs


There were more deaths at the border UNDER OBAMA than under Trump, so far. https://www.koat.com/article/border-deaths-under-obama-vs-trump/256879
75
Those pictures of kids in cages were taken UNDER OBAMA.

The stats have not been collected for 2019, and I expect that thanks to a surge of entrants at the border which approximately tripled the number of entrants for a month (b4 Trump threatened Mexico with tariffs if they din't stop "passing thru" central America migrants to the USA border) there wll be more deaths in custody/at the border for 2019, but on a per person basis, the record is about the same.

Any death under USA custody is one too many, but let's be realistic about this: Trump is no worse than Obama. You're just bitching because, yanno, Trump!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 11:11 AM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Hey butthead ... did you finally get some advice on internet libel? Then maybe you should know that in light of your LONG HISTORY of defaming me (and other people around here) your nudge-nudge-wink-wink insinuations aren't going to help you.




Hey @ssh*le, remember that time you said I wanted to see innocent civilians bombed? No? Well, the Internet does. Your long history of threatening me and other posters here is duly noted and logged. I'm sure any court will take that behavior into consideration, especially since no one here has ever threatened you.

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You can't seem to separate my criticism of AOC from a defense of Trump. My beef with AOC is that she's an idiot pretending to be a socialist. I think her proposed policies mostly suck and won't solve the wealth gap.



You took a cheap shot at AOC (who I could give a rats pa-tooty about) for wearing a $600 watch, but you give Trump a pass - I call that double standard. Sorry you don't agree.

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 11:30 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

The stats have not been collected for 2019, and I expect that thanks to a surge of entrants at the border which approximately tripled the number of entrants for a month (b4 Trump threatened Mexico with tariffs if they din't stop "passing thru" central America migrants to the USA border) there wll be more deaths in custody/at the border for 2019, but on a per person basis, the record is about the same.

Any death under USA custody is one too many, but let's be realistic about this: Trump is no worse than Obama. You're just bitching because, yanno, Trump!

Don't spout that nonsense about one death is too many. The majority of American voters don't care about 1 death or 1 million deaths. They don't care. They never have. They never will. Changing Presidents does not change that prisons and jails throughout the US are continuously plagued by surges in mortality rates due to varying degrees of underfunding, understaffing, negligence and a system inadequately in place to address serious mental healthcare and medical issues of individuals caught within the system. It is the American way. Fly the flag on the 4th of July, tomorrow. That, the majority of voters care about. Prisoner deaths? Not so much.

www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/may/26/us-prisons-jails-inmate-deaths

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 12:36 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Your long history of threatening me ...
Bullshit.

GO!
Find those "threats"!
Fetch!!

QUOTES AND LINKS PLEASE.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 12:40 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

You took a cheap shot at AOC (who I could give a rats pa-tooty about) for wearing a $600 watch
And pretending to be a socialist

Quote:

but you give Trump a pass
He doesn't pretend to be a socialist.
Again, you can't seem to separate one thought from the other. I have a lot of criticisms of Trump, but him pretending to be a socialist isn't one of them.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 1:25 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

You took a cheap shot at AOC (who I could give a rats pa-tooty about) for wearing a $600 watch
And pretending to be a socialist



You really want me to believe that you're bent up about AOC "pretending to be a socialist???"

Thanks for the funny.

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 1:29 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Don't spout that nonsense about one death is too many. The majority of American voters don't care about 1 death or 1 million deaths. They don't care. They never have. They never will. Changing Presidents does not change that prisons and jails throughout the US are continuously plagued by surges in mortality rates due to varying degrees of underfunding, understaffing, negligence and a system inadequately in place to address serious mental healthcare and medical issues of individuals caught within the system. It is the American way. Fly the flag on the 4th of July, tomorrow. That, the majority of voters care about. Prisoner deaths? Not so much.



I think there are a number of Trump supporters who, on the inside, are ok with these deaths because they think of them as savages, less than human, "it'll teach the others a lesson!"

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 1:51 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

You took a cheap shot at AOC (who I could give a rats pa-tooty about) for wearing a $600 watch
And pretending to be a socialist



You really want me to believe that you're bent up about AOC "pretending to be a socialist???"

Thanks for the funny.

you really want to believe I'm "bent" about AOC pretending to be a socialist?

I tend not to get "bent" about a politician's personal foibles, more about their policies. As you said, it was a cheap shot. One cheap shot for another. Don't hyperfocus on small points. That's just diversionary.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, July 3, 2019 6:19 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

You must really be outraged over Trump's golden penthouse!- CC
OMG!!! I'm outraged! It's butt-fucking ugly!- SIGNY
No? That doesn't bother you?- CC
Holy crap! YES, it bothers me! It's the worst pile of architectural go se ever.-SIGNY

Liar or Hypocrite? - CC
Are you asking me if AOC is liar or hypocrite?
Why choose? Both, maybe?

SIGNY

You rationalize obvious double standards with such ease. Like a seasoned pro. :wink- CC



Hey butthead ... did you finally get some advice on internet libel? Then maybe you should know that in light of your LONG HISTORY of defaming me (and other people around here) your nudge-nudge-wink-wink insinuations aren't going to help you.


You can't seem to separate my criticism of AOC from a defense of Trump. My beef with AOC is that she's an idiot pretending to be a socialist. I think her proposed policies mostly suck and won't solve the wealth gap.

But yanno, this doesn't have to be an either-or choice! I can be critical of both her AND Trump, right? I only agree with Trump on three things, remember? That's a pretty limited palette of things to agree on! Now, I happen to think that they're necessary to fixing what ails us ... necessary but not sufficient ... so he got my vote on those three things ... but I'm not claiming to support him in everything, or to think that he's a nice person.

Now, IN REALITY, it is a widely acknowledged FACT that deaths in custody UNDER OBAMA were about the same as deaths in custody under Trump so far. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/immigrant-deaths-under-trump-o
n-par-with-obama-numbers-dhs


There were more deaths at the border UNDER OBAMA than under Trump, so far. https://www.koat.com/article/border-deaths-under-obama-vs-trump/256879
75
Those pictures of kids in cages were taken UNDER OBAMA.

The stats have not been collected for 2019, and I expect that thanks to a surge of entrants at the border which approximately tripled the number of entrants for a month (b4 Trump threatened Mexico with tariffs if they din't stop "passing thru" central America migrants to the USA border) there wll be more deaths in custody/at the border for 2019, but on a per person basis, the record is about the same.

Any death under USA custody is one too many, but let's be realistic about this: Trump is no worse than Obama. You're just bitching because, yanno, Trump!

Less total deaths under Obamination because CBP does not detain Illegal Aliens fleeing disastrous Obamanomics Economy, back to Mexico.

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Friday, July 5, 2019 5:45 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN



Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:

One of the problems with Trump's "solution" is it's all stick and no carrot.-CC
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

It's a truism that if you want to "stop" ppl from doing something, you punish them.
If you want people to "do" something, you reward them.

How in god's name do you set up a "reward" system that stops people from illegally crossing the border?

Another Einstein checks in. I dunno, geenius, just off the top of my head maybe you use the carrot to get people to legally cross the border? That's what you want, right? Unless of course, you don't want that as well.

Don't freak - that will never happen with this admin. They don't want ANY immigrants from Mexico on down either, so you're "safe."

Are you insane?

You think a carrot is needed to get people to want to enter America?

Can you name one single country in the world that does NOT have people waiting in line to enter America?

America admitted 1.18 Legal Immigrants in 2016.
There were 10.7 Million Illegal Aliens in America in 2016 - apparently 52% of them from Mexico. This is down from 12.2% in 2007, since the Rock-The-Vote Recession sent the Mexicans back home in droves.
In 2010 and 2011, almost 400,000 Deportations were performed, and total of 2.5 million from 2009-2015.

I don't see any shortage of folk wanting to enter America.

Somebody mentioned 675,000 Legal Immigrants last year. If true, that is more than the current populations of Wyoming, and Vermont, and also the 2010 population of North Dakota.


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
You think a carrot is needed to get people to want to enter America?/b]

Clearly the dumbest poster FFF.net has ever had. Or one of Kiki's puppets.

So, this means you have no sensible response to your insanity? Or you just finally realized how insipid your comment was?

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Monday, July 15, 2019 11:10 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


This was the subject of discussion between CC and me. All I can say is: About time!

Quote:

Trump Ends Asylum Protections For Most Migrants At US-Mexico Border
In what we suspect will be immediately greeted by an avalanche of "we're a nation of (legal) immigrants" and calls of 'racism' and 'hitler', AP reports that the Trump administration on Monday moved to end asylum protections for most Central American migrants.

According to a new rule published in the Federal Register, asylum seekers who pass through another country first will be ineligible for asylum at the U.S. southern border.

The rule, expected to go into effect Tuesday, also applies to children who have crossed the border alone.

AP does note, however, that there are some exceptions:

If someone has been trafficked, if the country the migrant passed through did not sign one of the major international treaties that govern how refugees are managed (though most Western countries have signed them)...

or if an asylum-seeker sought protection in a country but was denied, then a migrant could still apply for U.S. asylum.


The new rule also will apply to the initial asylum screening, known as a "credible fear" interview, at which migrants must prove they have credible fears of returning to their home country. It applies to migrants who are arriving to the U.S., not those who are already in the country.

By way of background, things have escalated quite dramatically in the last decade:

During the budget year for 2009, there were 35,811 asylum claims, and 8,384 were granted.

During 2018 budget year, there were 162,060 claims filed, and 13,168 were granted.

An awful lot of people making specious claims

Quote:

Immigration courts are backlogged by more than 800,000 cases, meaning many people won't have their asylum claims heard for years despite move judges being hired.

As AP notes, the policy is almost certain to face a legal challenge, and we suspect some judge somewhere in California is already drafting the order to strike down this policy, so don't hold your breath for any further slowdown in illegal border crossings.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 15, 2019 12:37 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
An awful lot of people making specious claims

Quote:

Immigration courts are backlogged by more than 800,000 cases, meaning many people won't have their asylum claims heard for years despite move judges being hired.

As AP notes, the policy is almost certain to face a legal challenge, and we suspect some judge somewhere in California is already drafting the order to strike down this policy, so don't hold your breath for any further slowdown in illegal border crossings.


Trump had a plan back in April, but then he denied he had a plan to get around the courts: Judiciary Democrats seek details on Trump’s reported offer to pardon border chief

04/16/2019 04:25 PM EDT

Top Democrats on the House Judiciary Committee requested information Tuesday related to President Donald Trump’s reported offer to pardon a top border official if he acted illegally to block asylum seekers.

Multiple media outlets reported Friday that Trump earlier this month told Customs and Border Protection Commissioner Kevin McAleenan he'd pardon him if he broke the law to deny migrants the ability to petition for asylum. It wasn’t clear whether the president intended the remark as a joke, and Trump denied later that day on Twitter that he "offered pardons to Homeland Securi[t]y personnel in case they broke the law."

More at www.politico.com/story/2019/04/16/trump-pardon-border-chief-1360503

Nobody knows what Trump's plans are, not even Trump.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 15, 2019 1:06 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


"Trump Fans the Flames of a Racial Fire"

Mr. Trump ritually denies any racial animus or motivations. His fight against illegal immigration, he says, is only about securing the border and protecting the country.

“I am the least racist person you have ever met,” he has said more than once. But he does not go out of his way to avoid looking like he is, and his string of Twitter posts on Sunday left his own advisers unable or unwilling to defend him. None of six spokespeople for the White House or his campaign initially responded to requests for comment.

One of the only administration officials who was already booked for the Sunday talk shows, Mark Morgan, the acting commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, made clear he wanted no part of it. “You’re going to have to ask the president what he means by those specific tweets,” he said on “Face the Nation” on CBS.

Other presidents have played racial politics or indulged in stereotypes. Secret tapes of Lyndon B. Johnson and Richard M. Nixon show them routinely making virulently racist statements behind closed doors. Mr. Nixon’s Southern strategy was said to be aimed at disenchanted whites. Ronald Reagan was accused of coded racial appeals for talking so much about “welfare queens.”

Mr. Trump’s history on race has been well documented, from his days as a developer settling a Justice Department lawsuit over discrimination in renting apartments to his public agitation during the Central Park Five case in New York. Jack O’Donnell, the former president of Trump Plaza Hotel and Casino in Atlantic City, later wrote that Mr. Trump openly disparaged others based on race, complaining, for example, that he did not want black men managing his money.

“Trump has not only always been a racist, but anyone around him who denies it, is lying,” Mr. O’Donnell said on Sunday. “Donald Trump makes racist comments all the time. Once you know him, he speaks his mind about race very openly.”

www.nytimes.com/2019/07/14/us/politics/trump-twitter-race.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Monday, July 15, 2019 1:09 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


This new regulation was published in the Federal Register, which means it's official.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, July 15, 2019 1:21 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
This new regulation was published in the Federal Register, which means it's official.

You are wrong, again. https://federalregister.gov/d/2019-15246 says it has NOT been published and it is NOT official until tomorrow: "This document is unpublished. It is scheduled to be published on 07/16/2019. Once it is published it will be available on this page in an official form. Until then, you can download the unpublished PDF version."

Immigrant rights advocates vowed to challenge a new "racist" and "patently unlawful" policy from the Trump administration—set to take effect Tuesday—that aims to block many refugees from being eligible for asylum at the U.S. southern border.
www.commondreams.org/news/2019/07/15/racist-and-patently-unlawful-trum
p-unveils-new-rule-block-asylum-seekers-southern


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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