REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Impeachment Investigation Is Underway, Judiciary Committee Says

POSTED BY: THG
UPDATED: Monday, October 21, 2019 15:49
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Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:35 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
And over 75% of people in the US supported the Iraq War.

Yanno, a billion flies eat shit. I bet you did, too.

It doesn't make it caviar.

Today, the Turks are rolling into Kurdish Syria and all Donald Trump has to say is, hey, the Kurds weren’t with us on the beaches of Normandy, so what kind of ally are they anyway? This has apparently finally gotten a rise from his evangelical fans, not because they care about the Kurds but because the Turks might end up killing some Christians too. I guess Trump forgot that the fate of Christians in the Middle East is a big deal to American evangelicals.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:47 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Quote:

Originally posted by SLOPPY SECONDS:
1kiki, you are mixing impeachment of judges with impeachment of Presidents. Even though both are called "impeachment", one is well established procedure and the other is not, mostly because there are thousands of judges at any time, but only one President.

Find me that quote, m'kay?

Because I have a quote from the very same section referencing William J. Clinton, and the HOUSE VOTE procedure used to start an impeachment inquiry, as an indicated practice.

So - go find that quote. Or I'll just figure you're doing your usual bullshitting (lying).

I'll give you some time to cover your ass. Then I'll post the quote from the House Manual.

The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.


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Wednesday, October 9, 2019 9:57 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

So - go find that quote. Or I'll just figure you're doing your usual bullshitting (lying).

The defendant, Trump, does not decide the rules of impeachment. The House of Representatives does and can change them without Trump's input. Whatever you think you know about impeachment, 1kiki, it counts for nothing. Whatever Trump thinks he knows about impeachment, 1kiki, it counts for less than nothing.

Trump does get to decide whether he will lie to the House or order witnesses to not testify or refuse to make available documents, including his tax returns. And the Senate decides if Trump is guilty, which Mitch McConnell has already said Trump won't be convicted.

You know how Trump gets removed from office? Election. Everything else is just sound and fury, although Trump's tax returns, held by the State of New York, could immediately set fire to the Trump Circus Big Top. The size of fire is proportional to the size of Trump's cheating. Little cheating, little fire. Big cheating, big fire, maybe big enough to ruin his election campaign 2020.

1kiki, you should immediately switch your energy to defending the privacy of Trump's tax records. That is the only place he is vulnerable because tax cheating does NOT get decided by Mitch McConnell or the GOP.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Wednesday, October 9, 2019 10:05 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


There either won't be an impeachment, or it won't go anywhere.

There really is no sense even arguing about this. Today or any day.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, October 9, 2019 10:13 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

So - go find that quote. Or I'll just figure you're doing your usual bullshitting (lying).

Quote:

Originally posted by SLOPPY SECONDS:
Whatever you think you know about impeachment, SLOPPY SECONDS, it counts for nothing.

FIFY

Meanwhile - that HOUSE MANUAL that lists procedures for impeaching a president, SLOPPY. You got that quote saying they don't need a vote? You got that quote saying the procedure doesn't apply to presidents?

YANNO, like you CLAIMED. Or were you, as usual, lying your ass off?

Quote:

Originally posted by SLOPPY SECONDS:
But beyond those lines, there isn’t much more information spelling out exactly how the process should work — which gives the House free rein to decide how things can go, including whether to launch the inquiry with a full floor vote or not.



Quote:

Originally posted by SLOPPY SECONDS:
1kiki, you are mixing impeachment of judges with impeachment of Presidents. Even though both are called "impeachment", one is well established procedure and the other is not, mostly because there are thousands of judges at any time, but only one President.



The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 12:38 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


In the 105th Congress, an independent counsel transmitted to the House under section 593 of title 28, United States Code, a communication containing evidence of alleged impeachable offenses by President William J. Clinton. The House adopted a privileged resolution reported by the Committee on Rules referring the communication to the Committee on the Judiciary, immediately releasing portions to the public, restricting Members’ access to the communication, and restricting access to committee meetings and hearings on the communication. Later, the House adopted a privileged resolution reported by the Committee on the Judiciary authorizing an impeachment inquiry by that committee.

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 7:33 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


1kiki, how many Presidents were removed by the Senate? Zero. How many Presidents removed by Death? Eight. How many Presidents? Forty-four. One President served nonconsecutive terms, which is why Trump in numbered Forty-five.

The score is Senate: 0, Death: 8
It looks like Death wins the game.

1kiki, the whole game of removing the President by a 2/3 vote in the Senate has always failed. The game was poorly designed and is run in the Senate by morons and clowns. The rules of the game change, but the result is always the same. The details of how it fails this time will not change how the game will run the next time. It will continue to fail, forever, because the Senate won't expel its clowns and morons from playing in the game.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_presidents_of_the_United_States_
who_died_in_office


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 7:55 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


In SECONDRATE's ever-sifting kaleidescope of thoughts, SECONDRATE jump tracks froHouse rules to Senate effectiveness, to death. SECONDRATE has no idea which of his ideas takes precedence and cannot control his own thoughts. SECONDRATE is


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 7:59 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

Burisma paid Joe Biden $900,000 for lobbying – Ukrainian MP

17:43, 09.10.2019 4 min read

KYIV. Oct 9 (Interfax-Ukraine) – Former U.S. Vice President Joe Biden received $900,000 for lobbying activities from Burisma Group, Ukraine's Verkhovna Rada member Andriy Derkach said citing investigation materials.

Derkach publicized documents which, as he said, "describe the mechanism of getting money by Biden Sr." at a press conference at Interfax-Ukraine's press center in Kyiv on Wednesday.

MORE AT https://en.interfax.com.ua/news/press-conference/617936-amp.html

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 8:00 AM

THG


T



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Thursday, October 10, 2019 8:02 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
In SECONDRATE's ever-sifting kaleidescope of thoughts, SECONDRATE jump tracks froHouse rules to Senate effectiveness, to death. SECONDRATE has no idea which of his ideas takes precedence and cannot control his own thoughts. SECONDRATE

Signym, you are as stupid as Trump and 1kiki. The Senate won't end Trump's Presidency but you know what could end Trump early? A stroke. If you took his blood pressure while he was running his mouth, we'd know for sure. See Woodrow Wilson's stroke:
www.history.com/this-day-in-history/woodrow-wilson-suffers-a-stroke

I can't see Melania Trump becoming acting President like Edith Wilson did:
www.politico.com/story/2018/10/02/this-day-in-politics-oct-2-1919-8531
86

This sounds like something Trump would do: "Edith and Wilson’s aide, Joe Tumulty, helped a journalist, Louis Seibold of the New York World, write a false account of a purported interview with the president. (Seibold won the 1921 Pulitzer Prize for national reporting for his fabricated account of the interview.)"

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 8:39 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


White House Counsel Pat Cipollone sent an eight-page-long middle finger to House Democratic leaders on Tuesday, pledging resistance to the impeachment inquiry into President Trump.

As a legal matter, Cipollone’s letter is nonsense. Several court decisions make it clear that the White House is not above the law. Executive privilege is real, and it sometimes prevents some inquiries into presidential behavior, but it is not an absolute privilege — especially in the context of a criminal investigation.

As a practical matter, however, Trump is likely to get away with it because there’s no one who can stop him. House investigators and others may be able to obtain a court order requiring the White House to comply with an investigation. But if Trump continues to refuse, Congress and the courts have limited options.

As Alexander Hamilton once wrote of courts: the judiciary “may truly be said to have neither FORCE nor WILL, but merely judgment; and must ultimately depend upon the aid of the executive arm even for the efficacy of its judgments.”

The constitutional mechanism, meanwhile, for dealing with a lawless president — impeachment and conviction — requires at least 20 Republican senators to vote to remove a president of their own party.

So long as Trump believes that his fellow partisans will hang together, he has little incentive to comply with a court order.

www.vox.com/2019/10/10/20906172/trump-congressional-subpoenas-constitu
tional-crisis-impeachment


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 9:01 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Trump hasn't acted lawlessly.

If you truly believe that he is now, I bet you regret the way the Legacy Media has not picked its battles, and subsequently, how you haven't either.


Something like 55% of less than 5% of the people who actually watch the news and pay any attention to any of this are for impeachment.

Wooptie doooo

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 9:22 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Trump hasn't acted lawlessly.

If you truly believe that he is now, I bet you regret the way the Legacy Media has not picked its battles, and subsequently, how you haven't either.


Something like 55% of less than 5% of the people who actually watch the news and pay any attention to any of this are for impeachment.

Wooptie doooo

Do Right, Be Right. :)

For one, the "Legacy Media" is not in a battle. It is in a business. But there is a battle going on in which most Americans do NOT pay attention, which is why they lose it: Between 1989 and 2018, the top one percent increased its total net worth by $21 trillion. The bottom 50 percent actually saw its net worth decrease by $900 billion over the same period.
www.commondreams.org/news/2019/06/14/eye-popping-analysis-shows-top-1-
gained-21-trillion-wealth-1989-while-bottom-half


6ix, in this battle, the GOP protects people like me from people like you by keeping the minimum wage at a minimum and by lowering my taxes. On the other hand, the Democrats don't protect me from higher wages and higher taxes. Maybe I should vote for Trump next time, since he is making me richer?

"Wooptie doooo" to quote 6ix.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 9:26 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Go ahead. Vote for Trump.

We both live in states where it doesn't matter anyway.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 12:20 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

The Latest: Ukraine to probe alleged 2016 US interference

By Associated Press
October 10, 2019 at 7:33 AM EDT

KYIV, Ukraine — The Latest on Ukrainian president’s “media marathon” (all times local):

2:25 p.m.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy says his country will “happily” investigate whether Ukrainians interfered in the 2016 U.S. elections. ... He said it’s in Ukraine’s interest to determine what happened.

NOTE: This is investigation on whether or not Ukraine inerfered in the USA election on behalf of Hillary Clinton.

Quote:

President Donald Trump asked Zelenskiy for such an investigation in a July phone call
If any of you moronic liberaloids and crazy never-Trumpers had read the transcript, you should have noticed that THAT was Trump's big request from Urkaine. Biden was an afterthought.
Quote:

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy says there was “no blackmail” in a phone call with U.S. President Donald Trump that helped spark an impeachment inquiry.

Responding Thursday to questions from The Associated Press, Zelenskiy said that he only learned after their July 25 phone call that the U.S. had blocked hundreds of millions of dollars in military aid to Ukraine.

So stick it up your arses about this "quid pro quo" and "dangling aid in return for favors". This is NOT the first time that Zelenskiy has said this, nor is it the first time it was posted here, but even tho you absorb lies like crazy, relevant FACTS seem to bounce off your helmet-like heads ... especially SECONDRATE, who is nuts and lives in a world of complete denial.

Because of copyright restrictions I've only posted snippets and a link. You can find more here

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/the-latest-ukraine-to-prob
e-alleged-2016-us-interference/2019/10/10/c4d79802-eb51-11e9-a329-7378fbfa1b63_story.html


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 12:32 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


As I understand it, Trump will cooperate with the investigation but only if Pelosi allows Republicans to participate in meetings, to cross examine and be able to call rebuttal witnesses, and allow Trump counsel during House testimony.

Those protections were accorded Bill Clinton, and Hillary Clinton (when she was investigated for Benghazi) and it's only fair. Otherwise Pelosi is just heading a kangaroo court. So I'm glad that Trump is giving House Dems the big middle finger; they deserve it.

As more information comes out, I think the House Dems will be sorry that they concocted this (yet another) hoax on the American people. Barr and Durham were in Italy pursuing the FISA investigation/ Steele "dossier". It will be interesting to see what comes of their investigation.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 1:38 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
As I understand it, Trump will cooperate with the investigation but only if Pelosi allows Republicans to participate in meetings, to cross examine and be able to call rebuttal witnesses, and allow Trump counsel during House testimony.

Those protections were accorded Bill Clinton, and Hillary Clinton (when she was investigated for Benghazi) and it's only fair. Otherwise Pelosi is just heading a kangaroo court. So I'm glad that Trump is giving House Dems the big middle finger; they deserve it.

Setting up a kangaroo court - that's exactly why House dems ignored their own House rulebook for starting an impeachment inquiry, which calls for a full House vote. (And repub participation.)

And in all the reporting I've seen on this since it began (which is a lot), the lack of repub participation, and the fact that this is a 100% dem effort without a repub in sight, had been glided-past maybe 4 times.

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 3:20 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


The Actual Laws Trump Has Broken, Just With the Ukraine and China Affairs, Could Land Him 10 Years in Prison.
https://theintercept.com/2019/10/10/trump-crimes-law/

Attorney General William Barr’s Department of Justice has declined to press charges against Trump, but Barr won't be in charge forever. The House of Representatives is pushing forward with its impeachment inquiry. In the meantime, Trump has said that he will refuse to cooperate with lawful subpoenas — itself a prima facie violation of 2 U.S. Code § 192, “Refusal of witness to testify or produce papers,” punishable by a year in prison.

Coercing his deputies into joining in the conspiracy would also runs afoul of the law. “As I said on the phone, I think it’s crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign,” Bill Taylor, the top American diplomat in Ukraine, reiterated in a text message to Trump official Gordon Sondland, strongly suggesting he was pursuing the strategy against his own wishes.

If Taylor felt coerced into helping with “a political campaign,” that implicates 18 U.S. Code § 610, which covers that crime rather clearly under the title: “Coercion of political activity.”

The law reads: “It shall be unlawful for any person to intimidate, threaten, command, or coerce, or attempt to intimidate, threaten, command, or coerce, any employee of the Federal Government … to engage in … any political activity.” The sentence caps at three years.

It’s also illegal, according to 18 U.S. Code § 595, when a government official, “in connection with any activity which is financed in whole or in part by loans or grants made by the United States, or any department or agency thereof, uses his official authority for the purpose of interfering with, or affecting, the nomination or the election of any candidate for the office of President.” That statute could add another year to the sentence.

Prosecutors, in trying to pressure defendants into a plea bargain, often engage in what’s known as “stacking,” where they find every conceivable charge and stack them to the ceiling, threatening decades in prison if the defendant contests all the charges. A prosecutor who wanted to stack charges against Trump could ding him for 18 U.S. Code § 607, “Place of solicitation,” and 52 U.S. Code § 30121, “Contributions and donations by foreign nationals.” Essentially, it’s illegal to solicit contributions to your presidential campaign from the Oval Office and illegal to solicit from foreign nationals no matter where you do it from: “It shall be unlawful for an individual who is an officer or employee of the Federal Government, including the President … to solicit or receive a donation of money or other thing of value in connection with a Federal, State, or local election, while in any room or building occupied in the discharge of official duties by an officer or employee of the United States, from any person.”

That’s another three years.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 3:50 PM

THG


tick tock
T


New FOX News Poll: Most Americans Want Trump Impeached And Out Of Office


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Thursday, October 10, 2019 3:54 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


And a billion flies eat shit.

How does it taste?

The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 4:21 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Read the article. I smell and awful lot of "if" coming offa that plan.

But SECONDRATE buys into it because he's crazy.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

You idiots have been oppressing the entire sexual spectrum as long as you have existed. I can't wait for the day your kind is dead - WISHIMAY

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 4:49 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


"If true"

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 5:11 PM

CAPTAINCRUNCH

... stay crunchy...


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Read the article. I smell and awful lot of "if" coming offa that plan.

But SECONDRATE buys into it because he's crazy.




He's guilty of so much more than using the US government to smear his upcoming rival it's hilarious, in a black humor kind of way. The level of corruption is so deep... we saw only the top of it with Russia!Russia!Russia! Funny thing, I think we all knew at some level he was a lying, corrupt piece of sh*t, just some chose to ignore it because Hillary!Hillary!Hillary! and some even for {i]Russia!Russia!Russia!

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 5:22 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Read the article. I smell and awful lot of "if" coming offa that plan.

But SECONDRATE buys into it because he's crazy.




He's guilty of so much more than using the US government to smear his upcoming rival it's hilarious, in a black humor kind of way. The level of corruption is so deep... we saw only the top of it with Russia!Russia!Russia! Funny thing, I think we all knew at some level he was a lying, corrupt piece of sh*t, just some chose to ignore it because Hillary!Hillary!Hillary! and some even for {i]Russia!Russia!Russia!



And yet the only proof you have besides feels is a Billy Bush tape.

Sad.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 7:32 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Did you miss the point that so long as Trump is President and Barr is Attorney General, Trump will NOT be charged? But Trump won't always be President. Maybe Pence will be the next President. Maybe he will give Trump a blanket pardon, same as President Ford gave to Nixon:
Quote:

I, GERALD R. FORD, President of the United States, pursuant to the pardon power conferred upon me by Article II, Section 2, of the Constitution, have granted and by these presents do grant a full, free, and absolute pardon unto Richard Nixon for all offenses against the United States which he, Richard Nixon, has committed or may have committed or taken part in during the period from January 20, 1969 through August 9, 1974.
https://watergate.info/1974/09/08/text-of-ford-pardon-proclamation.htm
l


All President Pence need do is change names and dates. Trump's Pardon is ready to go. The next Democrat for President sure is not giving Trump a pardon. The next Democrat won't honor a self-pardon that Trump gives to Trump. Trump has to resign, or else never leave the White House. President-for-Life Donald Trump has a nice sound to it.

When Ford reads to the nation the text of the pardon, he said July 20, 1969, but the pardon says January 20, the first day Nixon was in office.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 8:03 PM

THG


Quote:

Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Read the article. I smell and awful lot of "if" coming offa that plan.

But SECONDRATE buys into it because he's crazy.




He's guilty of so much more than using the US government to smear his upcoming rival it's hilarious, in a black humor kind of way. The level of corruption is so deep... we saw only the top of it with Russia!Russia!Russia! Funny thing, I think we all knew at some level he was a lying, corrupt piece of sh*t, just some chose to ignore it because Hillary!Hillary!Hillary! and some even for {i]Russia!Russia!Russia!



Trump's former Russia adviser set to give damning testimony on Giuliani, Sondland

WASHINGTON — Fiona Hill, who was until recently President Donald Trump's top aide on Russia and Europe, plans to tell Congress that Rudy Giuliani and E.U. ambassador Gordon Sondland circumvented the National Security Council and the normal White House process to pursue a shadow policy on Ukraine, a person familiar with her expected testimony told NBC News.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trumps-former-russia-adviser-s
et-to-give-damning-testimony-on-giuliani-sondland/ar-AAIB2D5?ocid=spartanntp


Yep, Russia Russia Russia

T



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Thursday, October 10, 2019 9:45 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
a person familiar with her expected testimony told NBC News.




ANON

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 9:48 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I see that The Intercept, and SECONDRATE, have already determined Trump's guilt, absent of a trial and actual ... yanno. evidence.

Did you miss the point that so long as Trump is President and Barr is Attorney General, Trump will NOT be charged? But Trump won't always be President. Maybe Pence will be the next President. Maybe he will give Trump a blanket pardon, same as President Ford gave to Nixon:
Quote:

I, GERALD R. FORD, President of the United States, pursuant to the pardon power conferred upon me by Article II, Section 2, of the Constitution, have granted and by these presents do grant a full, free, and absolute pardon unto Richard Nixon for all offenses against the United States which he, Richard Nixon, has committed or may have committed or taken part in during the period from January 20, 1969 through August 9, 1974.
https://watergate.info/1974/09/08/text-of-ford-pardon-proclamation.htm
l


All President Pence need do is change names and dates. Trump's Pardon is ready to go. The next Democrat for President sure is not giving Trump a pardon. The next Democrat won't honor a self-pardon that Trump gives to Trump. Trump has to resign, or else never leave the White House. President-for-Life Donald Trump has a nice sound to it.

When Ford reads to the nation the text of the pardon, he said July 20, 1969, but the pardon says January 20, the first day Nixon was in office.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



He won't be found guilty of anything in any court of law. I'm sure he's not worried about it. Democrat president or no.


Billy Bush tapes. That's it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 10:32 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

He won't be found guilty of anything in any court of law. I'm sure he's not worried about it.

Just a few weeks ago it seemed that Trump would skate on charges both of colluding with Russia to subvert the 2016 election and of obstruction of justice; the Mueller report was basically a bust, partly because the story was complicated, partly because of Robert Mueller’s diffidence.

But Trump has managed to make things clear. First he demanded that foreign regimes produce dirt on domestic political rivals, not just in phone calls but right there on camera. Now he’s engaged in a crude, obvious effort to stonewall the House impeachment inquiry that is clearly an impeachable offense in itself.

Why did he hand the Democrats so much ammunition? Partly he seems to have gotten high on his own supply — he actually seems to believe the bizarre conspiracy theories his supporters drum up to excuse his actions. Also, he lacks self-restraint. Even if he considers any effort to hold him accountable a form of treason, he should have known better than to blurt it out in public.

If Trump were cannier and more self-controlled, he would be unstoppable. He has the backing of a party whose elected representatives have shown no sign of scruples. He has de facto state media in the form of Fox News and the rest of the Murdoch empire. He has already managed to corrupt key government agencies, including the Justice Department.

Indeed, these advantages are so large that he may yet prevail. The only reason he could falter is Trump’s own deficiencies.

It says a lot about the modern G.O.P. that the party is still solidly behind a man so obviously, grotesquely, not up to the job. I am grateful that Trump is immature and incompetent. His character flaws may bring him down, but Republicans will learn from that. Next time they will find a Trump clone minus the obvious problems with dishonesty and mental instability.

"Luckily, Trump Is an Unstable Non-Genius"
www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/opinion/donald-trump.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Thursday, October 10, 2019 11:23 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Just a few weeks ago it seemed that Trump would skate on charges both of colluding with Russia to subvert the 2016 election and of obstruction of justice; the Mueller report was basically a bust, partly because the story was complicated, partly because of Robert Mueller’s diffidence.

But Trump has managed to make things clear. First he demanded that foreign regimes produce dirt on domestic political rivals, not just in phone calls but right there on camera. Now he’s engaged in a crude, obvious effort to stonewall the House impeachment inquiry that is clearly an impeachable offense in itself.

Why did he hand the Democrats so much ammunition? Partly he seems to have gotten high on his own supply — he actually seems to believe the bizarre conspiracy theories his supporters drum up to excuse his actions. Also, he lacks self-restraint. Even if he considers any effort to hold him accountable a form of treason, he should have known better than to blurt it out in public.

If Trump were cannier and more self-controlled, he would be unstoppable. He has the backing of a party whose elected representatives have shown no sign of scruples. He has de facto state media in the form of Fox News and the rest of the Murdoch empire. He has already managed to corrupt key government agencies, including the Justice Department.

Indeed, these advantages are so large that he may yet prevail. The only reason he could falter is Trump’s own deficiencies.

It says a lot about the modern G.O.P. that the party is still solidly behind a man so obviously, grotesquely, not up to the job. I am grateful that Trump is immature and incompetent. His character flaws may bring him down, but Republicans will learn from that. Next time they will find a Trump clone minus the obvious problems with dishonesty and mental instability.

"Luckily, Trump Is an Unstable Non-Genius"
www.nytimes.com/2019/10/10/opinion/donald-trump.html

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Friday, October 11, 2019 6:59 AM

THG


At least four national security officials raised alarms about Ukraine policy before and after Trump call with Ukrainian president

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/at-least-four-national-securit
y-officials-raised-alarms-about-ukraine-policy-before-and-after-trump-call-with-ukrainian-president/ar-AAIAZm4?ocid=spartanntp


This thing is going to end many a career.

tick tock

T



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Friday, October 11, 2019 7:34 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
At least four national security officials raised alarms about Ukraine policy before and after Trump call with Ukrainian president

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/at-least-four-national-securit
y-officials-raised-alarms-about-ukraine-policy-before-and-after-trump-call-with-ukrainian-president/ar-AAIAZm4?ocid=spartanntp


This thing is going to end many a career.

tick tock

T






I want everybody to read this article and see how gross the ANON is. Too many instances to even bother re-posting here when the article is just full of ANON.

Also, I wonder after reading about it if I was wrong about Bolton being a the next "good guy" to the Lefties. It sure seems that articles like this could be leading up to this if they persist.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 11, 2019 7:43 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.

What grade to you give Trump for his stupid move in Syria this week? Impeachable grade stupidity?

Trump has defended his abandonment of our Kurdish allies in Syria, declaring that “I was elected on getting out of these ridiculous endless wars” that have left America “bogged down, watching over a quagmire.” Listening to the president, Americans might think that we still have large numbers of U.S. troops fighting on fronts across the Middle East. We do not.

The days when we deployed hundreds of thousands of troops in the Middle East are long gone. Today, we have 14,000 troops in Afghanistan, about 5,000 in Iraq and just 1,000 in Syria. That is a grand total of about 20,000 troops in all three countries. By contrast, we have about 37,950 U.S. troops in Germany, 12,750 in Italy, 53,900 in Japan, and 28,500 in South Korea — a total of over 133,000. In fact, we now have three times more troops deployed in Spain (3,200) than we do in Syria.

Trump gave Turkey permission to wipe out the Kurds during a phone call on Sunday. If we allow Turkey to wipe out our Kurdish allies, who will be left on the ground in Syria to fight the Islamic State? Answer: No one. Since Trump has reduced the U.S. military presence in Syria to just 1,000 troops, that means we are depending on the Kurds to keep the Islamic State down. We are also depending on the Kurds to guard about 10,000 captured Islamic State fighters held in prisons in Syria — including 2,000 extremely dangerous foreign fighters.

The cry that America is fighting “endless wars” is a canard. Our force levels in Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan are a shadow of their former selves, and U.S. forces are not doing the fighting but rather arming and training allies who are doing the fighting for us. But after watching Trump abandon our allies in Syria to be slaughtered, why would anyone step forward to help America in the fight against Islamist radicalism? The president can’t have it both ways. If you don’t want American forces fighting “endless wars,” then you can’t betray your allies doing the fighting.

www.houstonchronicle.com/opinion/outlook/article/Thiessen-Thump-s-cry-
that-America-is-fighting-14509965.php


The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 8:11 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


lol at the mental gymnastics of the pro-war machine.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 11, 2019 10:29 AM

THG


DA da da da. Trump loses again in court. He has to give congress his taxes. Last stop, Supreme Court.

tick tock Donnie

T



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Friday, October 11, 2019 10:35 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.

Quote:

Originally posted by second:
What grade to you give Trump for his stupid move in Syria this week? Impeachable grade stupidity?

Speaking of stupidity ... what a stupid thing to post. SLOPPY thinks that all fullness of 'history' can be known in mere hours.

SLOPPY is a deranged idiot.

The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Friday, October 11, 2019 11:07 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.

Quote:

Originally posted by second:
What grade to you give Trump for his stupid move in Syria this week? Impeachable grade stupidity?

Speaking of stupidity ... what a stupid thing to post. SLOPPY thinks that all fullness of 'history' can be known in mere hours.

SLOPPY is a deranged idiot.

With one phone call, and given 3 days, Trump's go ahead to Turkey was followed by a war between Turkey and the Kurds in Syria. History has spoken and it said Trump's strategy is idiotic.

To keep a new war from starting, Trump only had to NOT give the President of Turkey what he wanted from Trump in that phone call. We will never know if Trump felt that Trump Towers Istanbul would go bankrupt if Trump did not give Turkey's President what he asked for -- which was to move American troops out of the way of Turkish troops so that the invasion of Syria could begin this week. That is exactly the kind of thing that would get him impeached.

Obviously, if Trump had done what he said he was going to do while campaigning, he would not own Trump Towers Istanbul today and he would not have to weigh which is more important to himself: making Trump money in Istanbul or starting a new war.

"Some Hard Truths About Turkey’s Invasion Of The Syrian Kurds"
www.forbes.com/sites/melikkaylan/2019/10/11/some-hard-truths-about-tur
keys-invasion-of-the-syrian-kurds
/

"Turkish party: Seize Trump's hotel to protest sanctions"
www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/aug/2/turkish-party-seize-trumps-hot
el-protest-sanctions
/
I am sure Trump is aware he could have lost a hotel this week if he did not cooperate with Turkey's War on Kurds. What is more important to Trump? A few thousand dead Kurd women and children? Or Trump's hotel in Istanbul? I think we know it is the hotel. I think he should be impeached for that, even though he will deny he let a war start because he loves money.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 11:08 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by THG:
DA da da da. Trump loses again in court. He has to give congress his taxes. Last stop, Supreme Court.

tick tock Donnie

T





That's not going to go the way you hope it does.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 11, 2019 11:34 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

That's not going to go the way you hope it does.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

Are you saying that the legal system does not go the way it is expected? Trump agrees:
Donald J. Trump @realDonaldTrump tweeted:
What a disgraceful legal system for this guy to still be around after all of these years.
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1182679369174716423

If the system was not disgraceful, Trump would not "still be around after all of these years."

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 11:36 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Are you saying that the legal system does not go the way it is expected?



Yup. Still no justice for Epstein or his clients.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 11, 2019 1:45 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Are you saying that the legal system does not go the way it is expected?



Yup. Still no justice for Epstein or his clients.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

There is justice! Turns out, the president is not above the law.

A federal appeals court held TODAY that Trump’s claims that he is immune to congressional oversight have no basis in law.

If the Supreme Court does not interfere with this decision, that means the House Oversight Committee will soon gain access to Trump’s financial records — including his tax forms.

The case is Trump v. Mazars USA
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1trAO6IWcy-WZlVQJTzZFUz1551RIwe7w/view
www.documentcloud.org/documents/6467307-Trump-v-Mazars.html

The decision is 134 pages long, and took 3 months to write, but this is the only paragraph that counts: "Having considered the weighty interests at stake in this case, we conclude that the subpoena issued by the Committee to Mazars is valid and enforceable. We affirm the district court’s judgment in favor of the Oversight Committee and against the Trump Plaintiffs.

So ordered."

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:01 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Double post...

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:09 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
Are you saying that the legal system does not go the way it is expected?



Yup. Still no justice for Epstein or his clients.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

There is justice! Turns out, the president is not above the law.

A federal appeals court held TODAY that Trump’s claims that he is immune to congressional oversight have no basis in law.



I knew about the news you linked in the rest of your post before my previous reply.

Slow on the uptake again today?




BTW...

Judge David S. Tatel - Nominated by Bill Clinton, October 7th, 1994
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_S._Tatel

Patricia Millett - Nominated by Barack Obama, December 10th, 2013
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patricia_Millett

Dissenting opinion by Neomi Rao - Nomiated by Donald Trump, March 18th, 2019
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neomi_Rao




No sense in arguing the obvious bias of the verdict here.

Just asking you how you figure this is going to end with the current makeup of the Supreme Court when the bias leans the other way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_justices_of_the_Supreme_Court_of
_the_United_States#Current_justices_of_the_Supreme_Court




Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:27 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Dissenting opinion by Neomi Rao - Nomiated by Donald Trump, March 18th, 2019
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neomi_Rao

Trump placed this particular person on this particular court to protect him from this particular subpoena. The dissenting opinion from the Trump judge was that Trump's tax returns stay secret until Trump is charged with tax evasion, but he can't be charged until tax returns are not secret and can be audited. The other two judges laughed at that Catch 22 nonsense from Trump's judge, the judge Trump owns. Trump has placed two of his judges on the Supreme Court. That might not be enough to protect Trump from the subpoena when this case goes to the Supreme Court.

I forgot to mention that Trump promised while campaigning to make these records known to all Americans, but once the moment came to make them known, Trump decided to sue to keep them secret.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:34 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.




Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
What grade to you give Trump for his stupid move in Syria this week? Impeachable grade stupidity?

Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:Speaking of stupidity ... what a stupid thing to post. SLOPPY thinks that all fullness of 'history' can be known in mere hours.

SLOPPY is a deranged idiot.

Quote:

Originally posted by SECOND:
With one phone call, and given 3 days, Trump's go ahead to Turkey was followed by a war between Turkey and the Kurds in Syria. History has spoken and it said Trump's strategy is idiotic.

You have no idea what was in that phone call. It might have been as simple as - Turkey is going in anyway. Get your troops out of the way (there were 50 left, I think) or we're going through them. And if your troops fight, we'll involve Russia. Good luck with that.

It'll be a long, long time before anyone knows ALL the relevant facts.

But that doesn't stop you from being a deranged idiot, does it SLOPPY?

The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

Signy posted this elsewhere, it just took me a couple minutes to research this;

https://news.bitcoin.com/turkey-throws-another-wrench-into-the-usds-wo
rks-and-joins-russian-swift
/
Turkey Throws Another Wrench Into the USD's Works and Joins Russian Swift

Let's see ... Turkey has Russia's defense system and is no longer reliant on buying US arms; and has joined the SWIFT alternative, blunting any sanctions efforts.

OOPS. They've slipped the US leash.

And to round out the info, so has Iran.
https://www.eurasiareview.com/22092019-have-moscow-and-tehran-essentia
lly-turned-away-from-us-dollar-oped
/
“Russia and Iran will transfer payments using an alternative system to the internationally recognized SWIFT money transfer network, Governor of Iranian central bank, ..."

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:38 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


It's always interesting to go back and grade these things in the light of history.
Quote:

Originally posted by second:
With one phone call, and given 3 days, Trump's go ahead to Turkey was followed by a war between Turkey and the Kurds in Syria. History has spoken and it said Trump's strategy is idiotic.

To keep a new war from starting, Trump only had to NOT give the President of Turkey what he wanted from Trump in that phone call. We will never know if Trump felt that Trump Towers Istanbul would go bankrupt if Trump did not give Turkey's President what he asked for -- which was to move American troops out of the way of Turkish troops so that the invasion of Syria could begin this week. That is exactly the kind of thing that would get him impeached.

Obviously, if Trump had done what he said he was going to do while campaigning, he would not own Trump Towers Istanbul today and he would not have to weigh which is more important to himself: making Trump money in Istanbul or starting a new war.

"Some Hard Truths About Turkey’s Invasion Of The Syrian Kurds"
www.forbes.com/sites/melikkaylan/2019/10/11/some-hard-truths-about-tur
keys-invasion-of-the-syrian-kurds
/

"Turkish party: Seize Trump's hotel to protest sanctions"
www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/aug/2/turkish-party-seize-trumps-hot
el-protest-sanctions
/
I am sure Trump is aware he could have lost a hotel this week if he did not cooperate with Turkey's War on Kurds. What is more important to Trump? A few thousand dead Kurd women and children? Or Trump's hotel in Istanbul? I think we know it is the hotel. I think he should be impeached for that, even though he will deny he let a war start because he loves money.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly



The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:44 PM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

It'll be a long, long time before anyone knows ALL the relevant facts.

But that doesn't stop you from being a deranged idiot, does it SLOPPY?

The relevant fact is that Trump had been threatened last year by Turkey to have his property taken away. Trump, out of selfishness or greed, did not sell that property so that Turkey could never threaten him or America, again. Turkey did it again. Trump's choice was to either move American troops out of the way so that Turkey can attack the Kurds or else this time Turkey will really take away Trump's property. Trump better abandon that property, fast, or it will happen again and Trump will once again have to decide if his money is more important than America.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:50 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.




The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

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Friday, October 11, 2019 3:53 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It'll be a long, long time before anyone knows ALL the relevant facts.

But that doesn't stop you from being a deranged idiot, does it SLOPPY?

The insane never-Trumpers will be driven even more insane in the wash/rinse/spin/repeat/ cycle they mistake for reality.

Signy posted this elsewhere, it just took me a couple minutes to research this;

https://news.bitcoin.com/turkey-throws-another-wrench-into-the-usds-wo
rks-and-joins-russian-swift
/
Turkey Throws Another Wrench Into the USD's Works and Joins Russian Swift

Let's see ... Turkey has Russia's defense system and is no longer reliant on buying US arms; and has joined the SWIFT alternative, blunting any sanctions efforts.

OOPS. They've slipped the US leash.

And to round out the info, so has Iran.
https://www.eurasiareview.com/22092019-have-moscow-and-tehran-essentia
lly-turned-away-from-us-dollar-oped
/
“Russia and Iran will transfer payments using an alternative system to the internationally recognized SWIFT money transfer network, Governor of Iranian central bank, ..."


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