REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

new deadly human-to-human-transmissible coronavirus emerges out of China

POSTED BY: 1KIKI
UPDATED: Thursday, October 12, 2023 02:05
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Monday, January 3, 2022 11:28 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



There's some preliminary data showing that Omicron does offer a level of protection against Delta. And Delta does offer a smaller level of protection against Omicron.
https://www.thestreet.com/lifestyle/omicron-could-provide-increased-pr
otection-against-delta-study-finds
https://inews.co.uk/news/health/omicron-can-get-after-delta-covid-immu
nity-variant-protect-new-strain-explained-1355021

But, like much of the data, it's subject to review, revision, and even reversal.

see below


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Monday, January 3, 2022 11:40 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



I thought this was a pretty complete and dispassionate examination of COVID-19 pandemic science to date.

‘Science is flawed’: COVID-19, ivermectin, and beyond
https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/science-is-flawed-covid-19-i
vermectin-and-beyond#How?

Science has a gap between its mechanics and outputs.

The mechanics of science are fine. The machines always get bigger and more efficient. New tools are always developed. Techniques become more sophisticated over time, and more knowledge is acquired.

The outputs of science are not. The culture of academia demands publication and warrants little retrospection about potential errors — this means that mistakes are rarely corrected, and even outright fraud is often left undetected in academic literature.

Take ivermectin. It is an amazingly successful antiparasitic medication that has treated literally billions of people in the time since it was invented, and it has almost eliminated some parasitic diseases from the world.

It has also been globally promoted as a cure for COVID-19 by a group of passionate fans. It is likely that more ivermectin has been taken to prevent or treat COVID-19 than any other single medication, except perhaps dexamethasone.

And yet, we do not know if ivermectin is actually useful in the treatment of COVID-19 at all.

A recent review from the Cochrane collaboration — long considered the gold standard in medical research — concluded that ivermectin should not be used for the treatment or prevention of COVID-19 outside of well-conducted clinical trials, which is a stark contrast to the hundreds of millions of doses still being taken for those exact reasons.

How?

In early 2020, people were desperate for any kind of treatment for COVID-19. A melange of partial evidence emerged.

This included: a laboratory study showing that the drug acted as a strong antiviral in a petri dish, a study in a French nursing home where the residents took ivermectin to treat a scabies outbreak and seemed to subsequently enjoy higher survival rates, and preprint reporting that ivermectin reduced the mortality from COVID-19 by 90%.

All three were weak evidence in different ways. Single in vitro studies are very poorly predictive of eventual clinical outcomes, and the nursing home paper was an accidental and uncontrolled observational study — what if the residents had never been exposed to SARS-CoV-2 in the first place? The clinical study was entirely fabricated and later withdrawn from the preprint server, subsequent to great scandal.

The ivermectin story somehow got even worse from there. In late 2020, studies started popping up showing what can only be described as simply incredible results for the medication — a 90% mortality benefit or a 100% reduction in cases when used as a prophylactic.

After nearly a year, myself and other data sleuths demonstrated that many of these studies probably never happened, but the damage was well and truly done long before the first fake paper was retracted.

...

This story could’ve been told very differently. Imagine a world where the initial laboratory paper came with a disclaimer, where the fraudulent preprint was looked on with skepticism immediately, and where the positive trials were assessed for fraud before they were even published.

Instead, at every stage, the process of highlighting concerns with data is ignored, with peer-review being the only flimsy barrier to publication for terrible research.

When we most needed effective fact-checking, our grand institutions of scientific research instead reviewed studies in a matter of days, if not hours, and posted fraudulent studies online to be shared across the world.

It’s tempting to say that research into ivermectin is uniquely flawed, but that’s clearly not true — realistically, it would be remarkable if a broken system produced only one failure.

....

Trials of favipiravir, another repurposed COVID-19 medication, have recently been retractedTrusted Source due to data concerns. There are now nearly a dozen studies looking at whether vitamin D has a benefit in COVID-19 that have been corrected or withdrawn entirely over the last 18 months.

The website Retraction Watch keeps a running tally of the pandemic-related studies that have been retracted. As of publication, the figure is 199 and growing every week.

Even worse, those are just the papers that people have looked into. Errors in science are rarely noticed because there is simply no reward for pointing out other people’s mistakes.

...

None of this is to say that there is no good science. The vaccine trials alone are perhaps the most impressive scientific work that has ever been done, with efficacious immunizations developed, tested, and trialed in under 1 year.

The RECOVERY and SOLIDARITY /Trusted Source/ clinical trials, which looked at repurposed drugs to treat COVID-19, have almost certainly saved millions of lives during the pandemic.

The problem is that large, well-conducted clinical trials are far from the norm. In a recent systematic review /Trusted Source/ of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19, the median number of people enrolled per arm in clinical trials was 59 — one study looked at just two patients.

Without even carefully assessing these studies, we can say that most of them were probably a waste of time.

Indeed, if you look at the meta-analytic model from this review, virtually our entire knowledge of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19 comes from just two studies, which recruited about 70% of all the people whom this drug had ever been tested on.

This is despite nearly 300 trials of the drug registered on clinicaltrials.gov, and the highest research spend of any single medication in the early pandemic.

If all of those tiny trials had been linked together, they may have achieved something useful, but instead, we’re left with two good studies and a smattering of largely pointless research.

...

Where does all this leave us?

Science has some enormous issues. Unless we can find a way to reward error-checking with actual money, we will continue to accept that a worrying proportion of our research output — the studies that we use to make life-and-death decisions — is either fake or incredibly problematic.

While it is tempting to think of this as a tedious problem among eggheads, that couldn’t be further from the truth.

It is not unlikely that you or your family have personally been impacted by bad research during COVID-19 — maybe you were given hydroxychloroquine during a hospital stay or took some metformin just in case. Perhaps you live in a place that reopened schools based on a study with mathematical errors or were told that masks constituted child abuse due to a paper that was later withdrawn.

Overall, there is a real impact of bad science in our everyday lives that the pandemic has thrown into stark relief.

Worse still, we know another pandemic is coming eventually. If we don’t fix these issues now, the next time a new disease spreads through our world, we will be doomed to repeat the mistakes of COVID-19. And that is perhaps the most worrying thought of all.

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Monday, January 3, 2022 11:56 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


A bunch of over-educated, self-righteous assholes who all think they're right and can't ever agree with each other.

Science is the biggest religion out there.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Tuesday, January 4, 2022 12:07 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


I'm sure the "science" behind this decision in NY is sound.

https://nypost.com/2022/01/02/nys-racial-risk-factor-for-covid-treatme
nt-is-illegal-and-immoral/

Quote:
New York City’s and state’s departments of health have reached a divisive and destructive low. In new guidelines rationing scarce, lifesaving oral antiviral medications and the one monoclonal antibody preparation that is effective against the Omicron variant of the SARS-CoV-2 virus that causes COVID-19, they instruct providers to “consider race and ethnicity” and give preference to those who are “Black, Indigenous, and People of Color.” These directives are immoral, illegal and bear no relation to the science.


They just can't fucking help themselves.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Monday, January 24, 2022 8:30 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



I just did a quick inet search for Omicron and COVID-19 vaccines (mostly reported in the US is Pfizer/BioNTech, the next most reported is Moderna).

I specifically looked for numbers. So far, available numbers are coming out of NYS.


This link gives an analysis of available NYS numbers January 20, 2022 showing a roughly 1/7 infection rate for the fully vaccinated v unvaccinated:
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/coronavirus/omicron-ny-covid-cases-bre
akthrough-infection-fully-vaccinated-symptoms/3504616/

and this is to me the article's graphic of interest:



This article from earlier January 3, 2022 gives slightly lowers numbers of vaccine protection from Omicron v unvaccinated, but it's still in the range of later numbers.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/coronavirus/
ny-covid-hospitalizations-top-2021-surge-levels-as-omicron-
drives-95-of-cases/3476250/


I ran across an article that claimed
Data Show Triple-Vaxxed More Likely To Get Omicron Than Vaxxed
https://www.citizensjournal.us/data-show-triple-vaxxed-more-likely-to-
get-omicron-than-vaxxed/

OMG! How could something like this be hidden!

But it turns out it's 'fake news'. I know that bc I tracked back to the original paper:
Coronavirus (COVID-19) Infection Survey, UK: Characteristics related to having an Omicron compatible result in those who test positive for COVID-19

Coronavirus (COVID-19) Infection Survey, UK: Characteristics related to having an Omicron compatible result in those who test positive for COVID-19 (84.8 kB xlsx)
https://www.ons.gov.uk/file?uri=/peoplepopulationandcommunity/
healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/
adhocs/14107coronaviruscovid19infectionsurveyuk
characteristicsrelatedtohavinganomicroncompatibleresult
inthosewhotestpositiveforcovid19/omicronpredictorsofpositivityadhoc.xlsx

which states:
Vaccination status: Those who have received three doses of a vaccine and test positive for COVID-19 are more likely to be infected with infections compatible with the Omicron variant compared with those who are unvaccinated, though individuals who had received at least one dose of a COVID-19 vaccine continued to be less likely to test positive for COVID-19, regardless of variant.* It is too early to draw conclusions from our data on the effectiveness of vaccines against the Omicron variant.

* emphasis in original

So if we're to draw any conclusion at all (which the publication cautions against), it's that overall people who are vaccinated against COVID-19 are less likely to get infected, though they have less protection against Omicron than other variants.



But looking at the NYS and British data, I'd say the vaccines are still very good at protecting against confirmed COVID-19 infection, even Omicron. (Of course many people may have been exposed to Omicron, and technically been infected, in the sense that some of the virus latched onto some cells. But the vaccine gave their immune system the tools to quickly detect and destroy the virus before it could be detected either by the individual or through testing.) Though of course no vaccine is 100%.

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Monday, January 24, 2022 9:51 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Thanks for clarifying that fake news item.

It pisses me off no end when writers deliberately abuse statistics to mislead the reader. It's CLEARLY on purpose, nothing at all accidental about it. Just plain malicious reporting.

****

I see China is still aiming for "zero Covid" and still using lockdowns. I really don't understand that. It's like they fucked up by letting the virus loose, and now they're trying to undo history bc they lost face, or something.

Seems like if their vaccine works, they should change their approach. Must be something cultural going on that I don't grok, like trying to prove the superiority of their system or something.

Personally, I think they undertook the research bc they were so anxious to keep up with the west, were taking the convenient way riding on US coattails, and so insecure about their own scientific abilities and that bit them in the ass. They're kind of weasely that way. Maybe next time they won't try to slide their way ahead. I have very little respect for that kind of behavior.

I still would have loved to be a fly on the wall when Xi and Putin talked about it. That's an awfully big "forgive" to extend.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Tuesday, January 25, 2022 7:36 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


My niece gets a vaccine and within a week she has full blown Covid and gave it to my brother and his wife.

Good vaccine.

Good luck, mudbloods.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 6:30 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



. Well . Dang .

So much for my hopes that Omicron is a natural vaccine for COVID-19. Initial data looks like that while various strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta stimulate antibodies against Omicron, Omicron doesn't stimulate antibodies against other strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta.

Omicron protects you against Omicron, for a while. That's about it.

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 6:40 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Also, I just thought I'd bring this up in case anyone runs across this and is curious. Supposedly there was a many-thousand person observational study on ivermectin done in Itajaí, Brazil with fantastic results!

But all is not what it seems.

The city itself reports that very very few of the supposed prophylactic doses of ivermectin were ultimately delivered. https://saude.itajai.sc.gov.br/noticia/26084/nota-de-esclarecimento--t
ratamentos-profilaticos Running through google translate gets you this:
Quote:
when the Health Department started distributing ivermectin, 138,216 residents took the first dose. Fifteen days later that number dropped to 93,970 people who took the second and third doses. Subsequently, only 8,312 people withdrew the fourth and fifth doses. That is, there was no biweekly continuity of the use of ivermectin, as recommended.
So whatever results of this study there were, they can't be correlated with ivermectin use, which was spotty and/or inconsistent.

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 9:59 AM

SECOND

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly


Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My niece gets a vaccine and within a week she has full blown Covid and gave it to my brother and his wife.

Good vaccine.

Good luck, mudbloods.
From Australia comes this information about vaccination: Whilst partial protection against COVID-19 may be as soon as 12 days after the first dose, this protection is likely to be short lived. The second dose encourages the body to create stronger protection (immunity) against the SARS-CoV-2 virus that causes COVID-19.

Individuals may not be fully protected until 7-14 days after their second dose of the Pfizer (Comirnaty) or AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria)) vaccine.

https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/i
s-it-true/is-it-true-how-long-does-it-take-to-have-immunity-after-vaccination

6ix, since your niece got covid in 7 days, but the vaccine takes 12 days to provide partial protection, your niece wasn't protected from covid.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 10:32 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My niece gets a vaccine and within a week she has full blown Covid and gave it to my brother and his wife.

Good vaccine.

Good luck, mudbloods.
From Australia comes this information about vaccination: Whilst partial protection against COVID-19 may be as soon as 12 days after the first dose, this protection is likely to be short lived. The second dose encourages the body to create stronger protection (immunity) against the SARS-CoV-2 virus that causes COVID-19.

Individuals may not be fully protected until 7-14 days after their second dose of the Pfizer (Comirnaty) or AstraZeneca (Vaxzevria)) vaccine.

https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/i
s-it-true/is-it-true-how-long-does-it-take-to-have-immunity-after-vaccination

6ix, since your niece got covid in 7 days, but the vaccine takes 12 days to provide partial protection, your niece wasn't protected from covid.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at https://www.mediafire.com/two



She wasn't protected from the shot that gave her covid.

Her parents, who were vaccinated, weren't protected from the covid their daughter got from the shot.


Now they've all got mud in their blood for no reason.

But hey! They get to go on a cruise.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:13 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


"The shot that gave her Covid"

That's so boneheaded it's not even funny, SIX!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:21 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


You're basing that off of old vaccination tech that has been tested for generations.

This is new tech, and a new vaccine that didn't get the 10-12 years of testing it should have gotten before it was released to the public.


Anybody saying to you that that the vaccine is safe is lying to you because nobody without a time machine knows that this is true.

We'll revisit that topic in 2034. I hope Haken keeps the lights on until then.

And hopefully the mudbloods are still around too, or I guess it won't matter.

Quote:
She wasn't protected from the shot that gave her covid.


Better luck with who your parents are next life, kid. Hopefully you'll get a pair that won't fail at protecting you and who would never dream of risking selling out your entire future so they can go on another cruise.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:28 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

. Well . Dang .

So much for my hopes that Omicron is a natural vaccine for COVID-19. Initial data looks like that while various strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta stimulate antibodies against Omicron, Omicron doesn't stimulate antibodies against other strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta.

Omicron protects you against Omicron, for a while. That's about it.
I've been wondering about that. There were SO MANY mutations in the Omicron spike protein I wondered whether the immune system would even recognie a non-Omicron variant!

Do you have a source?

But I DO wonder then, about the mechanism by which Omicron displaced other variants. Bc while Omicron surged, the previous variant (currently, delta) FELL. If there was no protection from delta... and if it IS possible to have two infections at the same time ... then wouldn't you see combined Delta/Omicron infections?

I know it DOES happen with the flu- they call it "flurona", a combined flu-corona infection. But like combined delta/Omicron infection, it's pretty rare.

So maybe there's something about being immediately sick with Omicron that provides temporary protection from Delta (and other variants) at least during the period of illness. General immune system activation, or something, which allows Omicron to displace other versions, not just surge alongside them.

If true, there are going to be an awful lot of disappointed people who were counting on "herd immunity" from Omicron to save us from the lab-created gain-of-function virus.

I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:31 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.


The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.

Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:42 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
You're basing that off of old vaccination tech that has been tested for generations.

This is new tech, and a new vaccine that didn't get the 10-12 years of testing it should have gotten before it was released to the public.


Anybody saying to you that that the vaccine is safe is lying to you because nobody without a time machine knows that this is true.

We'll revisit that topic in 2034. I hope Haken keeps the lights on until then.

And hopefully the mudbloods are still around too, or I guess it won't matter.

Quote:
She wasn't protected from the shot that gave her covid.


Better luck with who your parents are next life, kid. Hopefully you'll get a pair that won't fail at protecting you and who would never dream of risking selling out your entire future so they can go on another cruise.

SIX, if you would just learn A LITTLE about biology it would save you from so much stupidity!

The vaccine represents only A PORTION of the virus: just the spike protein. The function of the spike protein is to latch onto human cell ACE receptors.

THAT'S IT.

The spike protein CANNOT make more virus! The ONLY thing that the vaccine can do is make more spike protein.

All of that viral genetic information ... the nucleocapsid, envelope, and membrane proteins ... which create ACTUAL NEW VIRUS PARTICLES ... are elsewhere. IN THE VIRUS. NOT IN THE VACCINE.

That's one of the reasons why your body develops a much more vigorous immune response to an infection, v response to a vaccine: bc with an actual infection, your immune system sees and responds to the ENTIRE GENOMIC SEQUENCE, not just the jacket.

Yanno, you saying that you can get a virus from the vaccine is like saying you can read a book by looking at the cover.

*****

Now, some of the OLD vaccine technology ... the stuff that you keep banging on about being so well-tested .... some of THOSE use ACTUAL WHOLE ACTIVE VIRUSES ... things you CAN actually get sick from! Like I said: If you'd bother to learn just a LITTLE biology ... absorb some information that's been around for decades before Covid ... it might save you from so much misunderstanding!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 11:44 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.


The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.

Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."
You know my situation SIX.
That's like saying "Go kill yourself"
That's just cruel and stupid on your part.
Go fuck yourself.
I'm writing you off as a human being worth caring about.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 12:22 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.


The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.

Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."
You know my situation SIX.
That's like saying "Go kill yourself"
That's just cruel and stupid on your part.
Go fuck yourself.
I'm writing you off as a human being worth caring about.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake




My step-uncle had just undergone chemo before the vaccines came out. He and his family have never been vaccinated. He and his family also all got Covid when Delta was around and nobody died.

My cousin, on the other hand, a healthy and athletic 30 year old male who doesn't drink or smoke got leukemia several months after being vaccinated.

And now my niece gets covid after getting jabbed and gives it to both of her parents who are fully vaccinated.



I'm doing no such thing.

I'm telling you to live your fucking life to the fullest BECAUSE of your condition.

It would be sad knowing that you passed silently, hidden away in your house for the rest of your life. You deserve better than that.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 12:34 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:
SIGNYM:
I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.

SIX: The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.
Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.

SIGNY: You know my situation SIX.
That's like saying "Go kill yourself"
That's just cruel and stupid on your part.
Go fuck yourself.
I'm writing you off as a human being worth caring about.

SIX: My step-uncle had just undergone chemo before the vaccines came out. He and his family have never been vaccinated. He and his family also all got Covid when Delta was around and nobody died.

My cousin, on the other hand, a healthy and athletic 30 year old male who doesn't drink or smoke got leukemia several months after being vaccinated.
And now my niece gets covid after getting jabbed and gives it to both of her parents who are fully vaccinated.
I'm doing no such thing.
I'm telling you to live your fucking life to the fullest BECAUSE of your condition.
It would be sad knowing that you passed silently, hidden away in your house for the rest of your life. You deserve better than that.


It's one thing to have HAD chemo, It's another to be in the middle.

do you know what chemo does?

NO OF COURSE NOT BC YOU CAN'T BE BOTHERED WITH REALITY.

IT SUPPRESSES YOUR IMMUNE SYSTEM.

NOW, IF ONE IS YOUNG, AND HEALTHY, AND THEIR IMMUNE SYSTEM IS WORKING, COVID IS USUALLY NOT A BG DEAL.

I AM NOT YOUNG, OR HEALTHY, AND MY IMMUNE SYSTEM ISN'T WORKING.

COVID COULD EASILY LAND ME IN ICU, OR THE GRAVE.

NOW, IF ALL I HAD TO WORRY ABOUT WAS MYSELF, I MIGHT TAKE THAT RISK. BUT WE HAVE A DAUGHTER TO TAKE CARE OF, AND IT'S MY RESPONSIBILITY TO STAY ALIVE... NOT FOR ME, BUT FOR HER.

OF COURSE, YOU CAN'T BE BOTHERED TO CORRECT YOUR IDIOCY AND GRASP REALITY.

SO, LIKE I SAID- STOP TRYING TO RATONALIZE YOUR CRUELTY AND YOUR IDIOCY, AND GO FUCK YOURSELF.

YOU'RE A WASTE OF OXYGEN.

OH, AND BTW- THANKS FOR BLABBING MY HEALTH SITUATION ALL OVER THE INTERNET, ASSHOLE.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 12:42 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
It's one thing to have HAD chemo, It's another to be in the middle.

do you know what chemo does?

NO OF COURSE NOT BC YOU CAN'T BE BOTHERED WITH REALITY.


Don't give me that shit. And don't do that to yourself either.

You said the following, definitively and as if completely defeated:

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.


So you're no longer looking forward to visiting family again, some day.

Any day. Either during chemo or a year from now.

All hope is gone.

You've defeated yourself. You've allowed THEM to take full and total control of your life and your mind via the non-stop terrorism campaign they've waged against all of us for almost two years now.



You and your husband are not going to outlive your daughter. You never were. Not before covid. Not before cancer. You always knew that this was the case.

Do not hide behind her now.

If you and your husband have not taken the necessary steps to make sure that DD will be as whole as possible when one and eventually both of you are gone, you'd better do it.


I'm sorry that I struck a nerve with you today. But I will not sit back and watch you fucking give up on everything now and not say anything about it.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 12:47 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.



Quote:
SIX: The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.
Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.


SOME DAY- NOT SOON- I WILL VISIT DISTANT RELATIVES.

WE HAVE DONE, AND CONTINUE TO DO, AS MUCH AS WE CAN TO MAKE OUR DAUGHTER AS SELF-SUFFICIENT AS POSSIBLE, BUT THERE IS MORE TO DO.

THE LONGER WE CAN STAY INVOLVED THE BETTER OFF SHE WILL BE.

GO FUCK YOURSELF, SIX.

And now I'm going to do something more useful than argue with an asshole. Please don't let reality hit you on the way out.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 1:57 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:
SIX: The only thing keeping you from visiting family is your irrational fear.
Get over it. Go visit your family. Now.


SOME DAY- NOT SOON- I WILL VISIT DISTANT RELATIVES.


Good to hear it. Because that's not what you said before.

You don't have to convince me of anything. But you shouldn't say things like you did because if you start repeating something to yourself enough it tends to become your reality.

Don't ever tell yourself or anyone else that "in light of new news" you're not ever going to see your family again.


Quote:
WE HAVE DONE, AND CONTINUE TO DO, AS MUCH AS WE CAN TO MAKE OUR DAUGHTER AS SELF-SUFFICIENT AS POSSIBLE, BUT THERE IS MORE TO DO.

THE LONGER WE CAN STAY INVOLVED THE BETTER OFF SHE WILL BE.


There's ALWAYS going to be more to do. No matter what you and your husband do, you're NEVER going to feel that you did enough. The only way you could ever be satisfied with the job you did before it's time to go is if you were shitty parents and you just didn't care.

But don't use that in conjunction with your fear from what they've been telling you to keep you from living. That's not fair to her. I don't know how aware your daughter is of such things, but I can't imagine that she'd be happy knowing that you isolated yourself for the rest of your life on her behalf. If she is capable of picking that up, she's the one who's going to have to live with that knowledge and guilt for the rest of her life.

Quote:
GO FUCK YOURSELF, SIX.


I'm going to let these go today.

Quote:
And now I'm going to do something more useful than argue with an asshole. Please don't let reality hit you on the way out.



My reality is just fine. You need to take some time to reevaluate yours.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 2:12 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

. Well . Dang .

So much for my hopes that Omicron is a natural vaccine for COVID-19. Initial data looks like that while various strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta stimulate antibodies against Omicron, Omicron doesn't stimulate antibodies against other strains of COVID-19 like Alpha and Delta.

Omicron protects you against Omicron, for a while. That's about it.
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I've been wondering about that. There were SO MANY mutations in the Omicron spike protein I wondered whether the immune system would even recognie a non-Omicron variant!

Do you have a source?

But I DO wonder then, about the mechanism by which Omicron displaced other variants. Bc while Omicron surged, the previous variant (currently, delta) FELL. If there was no protection from delta... and if it IS possible to have two infections at the same time ... then wouldn't you see combined Delta/Omicron infections?

I know it DOES happen with the flu- they call it "flurona", a combined flu-corona infection. But like combined delta/Omicron infection, it's pretty rare.

So maybe there's something about being immediately sick with Omicron that provides temporary protection from Delta (and other variants) at least during the period of illness. General immune system activation, or something, which allows Omicron to displace other versions, not just surge alongside them.

If true, there are going to be an awful lot of disappointed people who were counting on "herd immunity" from Omicron to save us from the lab-created gain-of-function virus.

I know I'm disappointed! I was looking forward to visiting family again, some day.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

Oh, I'm sorry to have posted such news so definitively! IT'S VERY PRELIMINARY.

I've been trying to read the little clues to see which way the wind is blowing. Anyway, I don't have a link. It was a single news article with no link to any original source, not even an (XXX)RxIV preprint server (med/ bio/ etc).


Yes, your observation looks like it matches reality - Omicron seems to DISPLACE Delta, which it imo could only do if it conferred at least some immunity to Delta. Otherwise there'd be an Omicron surge on top of a Delta surge.

imo Jack is a second SECOND. And either he's made himself that way every time he decides he's so omniscient he's justified in trolling people who aren't trolling him - whose 'crime' is merely disagreeing in an honest discussion .... or SECOND is influencing Jack's posting in some way.

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 2:16 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


As long as you're still spouting your opinion from behind that mask, nobody cares about your opinion Kiki.

You had Sigs resigning herself to never seeing family again after reading your trash studies conducted by trash people.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 2:43 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


GOFUCKYOURSELFSIX.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, January 26, 2022 2:46 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


For your own health, I'm going to stop posting in this thread today.



--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Thursday, January 27, 2022 4:12 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Hubby had an interesting theory about how Omicron might displace other variants without involving the immune system: what if Omicron literally occupies all of the ACE receptors and doesn't leave room for any other variant? So they literally starve to death, in a sense bc they can't find any host cells?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Thursday, January 27, 2022 6:39 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


https://justthenews.com/politics-policy/coronavirus/covid-panel-milita
ry-service-members-see-spikes-miscarriages-cancer

Quote:
Whistleblower bombshell: DOD medical data reveals surges in oft-cited vax 'adverse events' in 2021

Three military doctors say medical billing code data captured by Defense Medical Epidemiology Database shows sharp spikes in miscarriages, myocarditis, cancer diagnoses, Bell's palsy, female infertility.

According to the data found by the military doctors, there was also a nearly 300% increase in cancer diagnoses, from a 38,700-per-year average in 2016-2020 to 114,645 in 2021.




So who does my previously healthy 30 year old cousin get to sue for getting Leukemia after receiving the jab?

Asking for everyone.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Thursday, January 27, 2022 7:31 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


A lot of ppl delayed getting tested or seeing a doctor until after vaccination.

It would be interesting to see if there was a DROP in cancer diagnosis in 2019-2020 as pl stayed away from doctor's offices, clinics, and screening tests. They do expect to see that in the general population altho the data isn't out yet.

I read the link, they ruled that out for miscarriages but didn't detail the other dxs.

And what about conditions Not expected to be associated with vaccines?

Did they go up too? Stay the same? Go down? You need some sort of internal control to understand the data.

Because if you're looking for something and filtering the data, you might find an artefact of your process, not the real deal.

So, interesting but I would like to see the data.

The truth is out there. You just need to find it.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Thursday, January 27, 2022 8:30 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


My whole point Sigs, is that there's no reasonable validation for getting a vaccination that is untested. And there's certainly no justification for anybody with any power to try to force or coerce anyone to get an untested vaccination.

There is no reason for anybody to trust any of the people telling you that it's safe, and there is no way for them to possibly know that that claim is even true until time tells us if it's true or not.

The people running things do everything in their power to silence any voices even asking any questions. That alone is sus.


I don't want to be right about them being wrong. Either out of ignorance or intentionally lying to us about the safety. If people are going to have cancer and miscarriages from the vaccine, than a whole lot of people I care about are going to get cancer and aren't going to be able to have any kids. My cousin might already be one of them. Thankfully, his sister and her husband did not get the vaccination because they're trying to have a kid and weren't going to take that risk.



I don't understand why somebody as skeptical as you always defends them. Your behavior has changed on this one issue.



There has been tens of Billions of dollars made off of this so far, and the entire geopolitical landscape has had a seismic shift because of it.

None of the people benefiting from any of this were to be trusted before this happened. None of them should be trusted now.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Thursday, January 27, 2022 11:04 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


I guess I missed the Anniversary celebration of this thread.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 1:42 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Hubby had an interesting theory about how Omicron might displace other variants without involving the immune system: what if Omicron literally occupies all of the ACE receptors and doesn't leave room for any other variant? So they literally starve to death, in a sense bc they can't find any host cells?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


I'd have to think about the biology some (is it the ACE-2 receptor in the lungs or in the upper airways where infection first takes place?), but ... yeah, that could be.


Anyway, another question I'd have is if the Omicron variant is competitive or non-competitive with Delta for an attachment site.

The are 2 different kinds of attachment in the very generic sense - competitive and non-competitive.

Of the non-competitive type, one common example is carbon monoxide and how it sticks to hemoglobin. Carbon monoxide attaches to hemoglobin roughly 400X more strongly than oxygen does. To all intents and purposes, the CO is never coming off the hemoglobin, it's permanently stuck there until the hemoglobin gets destroyed. So anything else - like oxygen - can no longer attach to hemoglobin. And that's how people with carbon monoxide poisoning can die - their hemoglobin is too full-up with carbon monoxide and can no longer carry enough oxygen to their body (at ordinary concentrations and pressures. That's why ppl with carbon monoxide poisoning are sometimes treated in hyperbaric chambers.).

Carbon monoxide is a non-competitive inhibitor of oxygen.

Then there's competitive inhibition, where the 2 chemicals actively jostle each other on and off an attachment place. (I can't think of a common example.)


If Omicron is in essence a non-competitive inhibitor of Delta, that would make it even more effective as a Delta blocking agent.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 1:59 AM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.



Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
A lot of ppl delayed getting tested or seeing a doctor until after vaccination.

It would be interesting to see if there was a DROP in cancer diagnosis in 2019-2020 as pl stayed away from doctor's offices, clinics, and screening tests. They do expect to see that in the general population altho the data isn't out yet.

I read the link, they ruled that out for miscarriages but didn't detail the other dxs.

And what about conditions Not expected to be associated with vaccines?

Did they go up too? Stay the same? Go down? You need some sort of internal control to understand the data.

Because if you're looking for something and filtering the data, you might find an artefact of your process, not the real deal.

So, interesting but I would like to see the data.

The truth is out there. You just need to find it.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

I'm all about going to original data. First of all the link provided from Jack's story isn't an up-to-date one. But hey, if I couldn't find the real link, that would be pretty pathetic.

But at the real link, sadly, I'm not and will not become an 'authorized user'. Well, darn. So much for an interesting traipse through the numbers.

I agree, Signy. Without more information, the story is uninterpretable.



I also question the time period of their baseline, btw. That's another thing that could easily mask the facts.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 5:52 AM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Sorry you are ill, Signy. Hope the chemo does the trick and you get through it as well as can be expected. I can understand why you are laying low.

My own covid experience, seeing as though anecdotal appears to mean something here. Son got COVID on new years eve, same as everyone who partied on that night. He tested postive and I tested negative. He is twice vaxed with pfizer and I was twice vaxed with AZ. When he was just started to be symptomatic, I got myself the booster, not quite ethical as I was pretty sure he had it but I double masked and was in and out in a flash. I knew that AZ was not effective against omicron, particularly as time goes on.

Son got it mildly, a summer cold, with a residual cough afterwards. We kept our distance in the house and I didn't develop any symptoms. It's an interesting one. Summer here, easy to keep the air circulating and be outside most of the time, but not sure that booster would have worked its magic in that timeframe.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 7:46 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


We can't believe anything that isn't printed by the Legacy Media without heavy scrutiny.

Anything that is published by the Legacy Media though, we just buy those numbers.



--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Friday, January 28, 2022 8:09 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Sorry you are ill, Signy. Hope the chemo does the trick and you get through it as well as can be expected. I can understand why you are laying low.

My own covid experience, seeing as though anecdotal appears to mean something here. Son got COVID on new years eve, same as everyone who partied on that night. He tested postive and I tested negative. He is twice vaxed with pfizer and I was twice vaxed with AZ. When he was just started to be symptomatic, I got myself the booster, not quite ethical as I was pretty sure he had it but I double masked and was in and out in a flash. I knew that AZ was not effective against omicron, particularly as time goes on.

Son got it mildly, a summer cold, with a residual cough afterwards. We kept our distance in the house and I didn't develop any symptoms. It's an interesting one. Summer here, easy to keep the air circulating and be outside most of the time, but not sure that booster would have worked its magic in that timeframe.



This sounds like any joke I've heard about Branch Covidians.

You seriously double masked?



Good for you. I think that's the key to finally getting over this. Everyone who is afraid can just wear two masks for the rest of their lives and the rest of the world can just go on living.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."

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Friday, January 28, 2022 3:25 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
A lot of ppl delayed getting tested or seeing a doctor until after vaccination.

It would be interesting to see if there was a DROP in cancer diagnosis in 2019-2020 as pl stayed away from doctor's offices, clinics, and screening tests. They do expect to see that in the general population altho the data isn't out yet.

I read the link, they ruled that out for miscarriages but didn't detail the other dxs.

And what about conditions Not expected to be associated with vaccines?

Did they go up too? Stay the same? Go down? You need some sort of internal control to understand the data.

Because if you're looking for something and filtering the data, you might find an artifact of your process, not the real deal.

So, interesting but I would like to see the data.

The truth is out there. You just need to find it.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:

I'm all about going to original data. First of all the link provided from Jack's story isn't an up-to-date one. But hey, if I couldn't find the real link, that would be pretty pathetic.

But at the real link, sadly, I'm not and will not become an 'authorized user'. Well, darn. So much for an interesting traipse through the numbers.

I agree, Signy. Without more information, the story is uninterpretable.



I also question the time period of their baseline, btw. That's another thing that could easily mask the facts.

Anyway Signy, I think you make good points, and I wanted to follow up because 2 things caught my eye without even thinking about it:

1) As reported, they restricted their data to outpatients only. Why would they do that? Because if the military health system did what the civilian health system did, ALL non-critical care was made outpatient - to keep inpatient facilities with COVID-19 patients from becoming miasmas where COVID-19 rampantly spreads to everyone who's there for any reason.
If I was looking at the data I'd probably keep inpatient and outpatient data separate - because one doesn't want to lose granularity unless it's non-informative - but also look at the sum of inpatient+outpatient, to literally account for any change in admitting practices.

2) They used a 5-year average. Why would they do that? (Unless maybe it was a handy tool in the database itself and they were being too lazy to do anything else.)
Because my experience when looking at enormous data sets to validate them is that one needs to literally look at it graphically several ways in order to let the data speak. And, as I've read in many statistical books and found by experience, there's no easy way to figure out ahead of time what will make a pattern clearest.
So I would have taken perhaps 10 or even 15 years of data of a sampling of individual diagnoses, graphed them across the years, and looked for patterns ... like high variability year to year, or overall low levels with occasional random spikes. Unless you know what 'normal' data looks like, you can't set such narrow parameters and then conclude something is 'different'.
Also, when it comes to validating large data sets one needs to look for internal validation of data (for example flu deaths can never exceed flu diagnoses), as well as statistical correlations. (BTW this also goes for validating votes, which, except for Mitofsky refuting the validity of Bush vote data, has never been done.)


I've looked at too many original cooked 'research' papers - the latest example was the study in Brazil involving tens of thousands of people that 'proved' ivermectin worked that was so deeply flawed it was invalid - to automatically trust anyone who claims to have data on their side. And, by the reporting on this one, there are too many questions I'd need to see answered before I thought the results were meaningful.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 5:05 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER


Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Sorry you are ill, Signy. Hope the chemo does the trick and you get through it as well as can be expected. I can understand why you are laying low.

My own covid experience, seeing as though anecdotal appears to mean something here. Son got COVID on new years eve, same as everyone who partied on that night. He tested postive and I tested negative. He is twice vaxed with pfizer and I was twice vaxed with AZ. When he was just started to be symptomatic, I got myself the booster, not quite ethical as I was pretty sure he had it but I double masked and was in and out in a flash. I knew that AZ was not effective against omicron, particularly as time goes on.

Son got it mildly, a summer cold, with a residual cough afterwards. We kept our distance in the house and I didn't develop any symptoms. It's an interesting one. Summer here, easy to keep the air circulating and be outside most of the time, but not sure that booster would have worked its magic in that timeframe.



This sounds like any joke I've heard about Branch Covidians.

You seriously double masked?



Good for you. I think that's the key to finally getting over this. Everyone who is afraid can just wear two masks for the rest of their lives and the rest of the world can just go on living.

--------------------------------------------------

Vaccinated People: "You need to get muh vaccination shots that don't work because I got muh vaccination shots that don't work and I'm afraid of people that didn't get muh vaccination shots that don't work because muh vaccination shots that don't work don't work."


Yep, you don't get much do you? Double masking was to protect others when I thought I might have been contagious. People who are vulnerable, like Signy.

Interesting to see what has happened here, gone from little COVID to the Omicron spreading like wildfire. The health care system near collapse demonstrating that Omicron still impacts those at high risk and the unvaccinated. If I'm fearful, it's that I or someone may need an ambulance or a hospital bed - non covid related - and won't be able to access them due to the high numbers taking up beds/ ambulances/icu space.

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Friday, January 28, 2022 5:41 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


You live in a pretty scary reality, Mags.

Life must have been terrifying for you the last two years.

You have my pity.

--------------------------------------------------

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Wednesday, February 16, 2022 1:10 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:
Study finds Omicron infection effectively induces immunity against itself and enhances protection against other variants in vaccinated individuals


https://www.news-medical.net/news/20220120/Study-finds-Omicron-infecti
on-effectively-induces-immunity-against-itself-and-enhances-protection-against-other-variants-in-vaccinated-individuals.aspx

Study in humanized mice experimentally infected with various strains of Covid finds that


Quote:
Sera from mice infected with Delta had the largest cross-variant neutralization, effectively neutralizing all strains except Beta. While Omicron-infected sera efficiently neutralized Omicron, it only had a minimal cross-neutralization effect on other strains. Sera from WA1-infected mice protected against WA1, Alpha, and Delta, but not against Beta and Omicron. Sera from vaccinated people with confirmed Omicron breakthrough infection, in particular, exhibited the highest level of protection against all strains, including Omicron.

Based on the study findings, while the Omicron variant is immunogenic, infection with this variant in uninfected and unvaccinated individuals may not elicit effective cross-neutralizing antibodies against other variants. However, Omicron infection promotes immunity against itself in vaccinated individuals and improves protection against other variants. This suggests that Omicron- and Delta-based immunogens should be included in future multivalent vaccination regimens to provide widespread protection against all variants.


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Wednesday, February 16, 2022 1:21 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.




Vaccination + infection = best immunity

But, it still might no be durable, or protect against the NEXT variant.

Quote:
If you’re vaccinated, an infection might not make you super sick, but don’t count on it making you super immune, either.
By Katherine J. Wu

January 5, 2022

...No combinations of vaccines or viruses can confer invulnerability to future tussles with SARS-CoV-2. Whether acquired from an injection or an infection, immunity will always work in degrees, not absolutes.

Immunity is, in many ways, a game of repetition. The more frequently, and more intensely, immune cells are exposed to a threat, the more resolutely they’ll commit to fighting it, and the longer they’ll store away any microbial information they glean. Time and viral mutations pare down those protections; vaccines and sickness build them back up. That’s part of why we almost always dose people with vaccines multiple times.

In the same vein, a single SARS-CoV-2 infection isn’t enough to keep someone safe long-term. But layered on top of vaccination, an infection can coax out “almost what you would call a boosted response,” Ai-ris Yonekura Collier, a physician and vaccine researcher at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center, in Boston, told me.

Immunized bodies will reawaken veteran immune cells: Bs to spill out fresh virus-quashing antibodies and killer Ts to detonate infected cells. It’s a version of what some immunologists, including Shane Crotty of the La Jolla Institute for Immunology, in California, have been calling “hybrid immunity”—the one-two punch of infection and vaccination, one of the most comprehensive educations on the coronavirus that a person can reasonably get. ...

Post-vaccination infections might, in theory, influence immunity in ways our vaccines can’t. While nearly all of the world’s COVID vaccines center on SARS-CoV-2’s spike protein, fighting the actual virus gives the body more information about its anatomy.

Bona fide microbes can also draw airway-specific defenses to the nose and mouth, the virus’s natural point of entry—something in-the-arm injections aren’t great at doing. “If those are maintained, that’s what’s going to offer a lot of protection against subsequent infections,” Jennifer Gommerman, an immunologist at the University of Toronto, told me. (Gommerman also thinks that [o] vaccines spritzed up the nose might be a good move in the future.) And since our current vaccines are still based on an old, ancestral version of SARS-CoV-2, a post-vax collision with the highly mutated Omicron offers intel that’s more up-to-date. By rousing immune cells that haven’t responded to previous variants, an Omicron infection could effectively “broaden your immune response,” Rishi Goel, an immunologist at the University of Pennsylvania, told me.

The problem, though, is that none of this is assured, especially when factoring in the thorny variable of time. ...

A bevy of other factors, too, can influence the magnitude of protection that’s tickled out by a breakthrough: age and health status; vaccine brand, dosing, and timing; the genetic makeup of the variant. (Most people have no way of knowing for certain whether they caught Delta, Omicron, or another SARS-CoV-2 flavor.) And while each dose of a particular vaccine offers essentially identical amounts of immunity-titillating stuff, actual infections don’t serve up the same dose to every person they hit. “The amount of heterogeneity in people’s immune responses is just incredible,” Taia Wang, an immunologist at Stanford, told me. Some recently infected people might experience only a modest bump in protection—which might not be enough to meaningfully stave off another infection in the not-so-distant future.


https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2022/01/do-post-vaccinatio
n-infections-improve-immunity/621172/

I've tried to tease out the salient points but you can find the whole article at the link.


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Monday, March 14, 2022 10:27 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


So every now and then I wander over to Divoc-91 to see how things are going. For sure, the numbers aren't pristine because they're affected by thngs like the availability of tests and changes in policy on dying OF v dying WITH Covid. (But to be sure, since I knew ppl personally who died OF Covid, that certainly happened)

Anyway, the # of confirmed new cases of Covid reached its third (Omicron) peak at about 250 per 100,000 per day, compared to the previous (Delta) peak of about 50 per 100,000 per day. Confirmed new cases has since dropped off to about 10, altho it's hard to estimate such low numbers on that chart.

The number of (Omicron) deaths peaked at 0.8 per 100,000 per day, compared to the previous (Delta) peak of 0.65 per 100,000 per day.

You wuld think by now, after the Omicron variant has come and gone, there would be a definitive answer to whether Omicron protects against other variants, but a quick run-thru of online search results doesn't turn up a definitive answer. Unfortunately DuckDuck has recently gone the google route and is downranking (if not banning altogether) any sites it considers "misinformation".

There is a new variant out there called "Deltacron" which is a recombinant version of the two latest variants, but the word is that it appears to be mild, lie Omicron.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Monday, March 14, 2022 10:57 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Just like when BLM and Antifa were burning down the cities and not being required to mask up while they do so, now we've got Russia dominating the headlines and nobody is thinking about Covid again.

This is all a game and we're all being played.

The "variants" were just a primer to much darker days ahead. I have no doubt that we're going to be subjected to fake pandemics the rest of our lives. Our government loves an obedient People, and what better way to ensure compliance than to recruit have of the People to police the other half.

For two full years they were all too happy to do it.



--------------------------------------------------

Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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Friday, May 13, 2022 9:59 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Look at that. Even CNN using the term "social experiment" now when referring to the overreaction of our "leaders" to Covid.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/12/opinions/democrats-problem-parent-voter
s-education-midterms-ham/index.html

Quote:
Much of blue America, which kept schools remote or hybrid for the 2020-2021 school year, conducted an unprecedented "social experiment" on children, resorting to lengthy school closures for millions of children -- a tactic not used during other national emergencies or previous pandemics.

Now, the results are in from the "social experiment" and they are very, very bad, and the people who supported closures are finally ready to talk about it.

"Remote learning was a failure," wrote David Leonhardt of The New York Times, describing the consensus of researchers and the findings of a new study out of Harvard's Center for Education Policy Research, which compared pre-pandemic scores on a particular national test (MAP) in 49 states and Washington, DC, to pandemic-era scores in high- and low-income districts, in-person, hybrid and virtual learning.





Hmmmm... Where have we heard that term here before?

Oh right. Me.



I haven't managed to find the earliest point in time that I said the whole Covid thing was a grand social experiment, but I did find two instances so far where I said it, with the earliest one referencing that I had said it at least one time prior to that.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=64946

March 21, 2022: OP from thread "You are Hackable Animals"

Quote:
http : // youtu.be / 3epIv8FN7lQ

This Nazi fuck pretending to be Jewish, advisor to Nazi fuck Klaus Schwab, knows more about you than you know about yourself.

2 years of Covid being a grand social experiment, just as I said while he was going around talking about this, confirmed.

This explains Ted.

There is no war in the Ukraine.



December 23, 2020:

Quote:
I know you didn't buy into the WMDs. That's why you're a fucking hypocrite now.

It's a grand social experiment. I said so since day one.

Mass hysteria, inflicted upon us by the Legacy Media.

You're a tool.





Shame on CNN for taking so long to admit it, and double shame on them for hiding it under one of their "Opinion" columns so they can keep their Lefitist audience happy at the same time.

But if you think the true results of what you did for two years are in yet, you've got another thing coming.

The 5 year old's and below are going to make Generation Zed look like the model of sane society after the psychological horror you inflicted on them during their prime developmental years.

--------------------------------------------------

Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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Friday, May 13, 2022 11:04 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


SIX, just because they weaponized the Covid pandemic doesn't mean it didn't exist.

"Never let a good crisis go to waste" presumes there is one to begin with.

I realize that some "crises" (SADDAM WMD! TRUMP COLLUSION! ASSAD WAR CRIMES! RUSSIA WAR CRIMES!) are complete fabrications.

Others are exaggerated (SYSTEMIC RACISM! TRANSPHOBIA!)

Others are real, but the policy responses are malevolant (SARS, GLOBAL CLIMATE SHIFT)

And other crises??? (Border control, de-industrialization, warmongering, indebtedness, wholesale shredding of the Bill of Rights) ... well... *crickets*

But you have to be able to mentally separate the event from the (political) uses to which it is put. Denying a problem just because you don't like the response is just like being a Dem denying the border problem (for example) bc it doesn't fit their narrative.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Friday, May 13, 2022 7:05 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Sigs... their numbers were complete fabrications. They're going around telling everyone yesterday that a million Americans have died of covid yesterday.

Complete and utter bullshit.

Nobody has died of the flu in the last two years. So, so many other deaths that were due to other causes were counted as Covid deaths.

My guess is that 200 people died of covid.

Worldwide.



And most American sheep as well as the sheep all around the world allowed them to do this to us.

Shame on nearly everyone.

--------------------------------------------------

Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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Friday, May 13, 2022 8:25 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


I did hear news (surely verified by Ministry of Truth) that Sith Lord Darth Obiden is celebrating One Million Deaths from COVID.
We all know these are Deaths From Covid because they are called Covid Deaths. Surely anybody who believes that Information Technology is actually Technology can understand this simple fact.

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Friday, May 13, 2022 11:01 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Whatever.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake


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Friday, May 13, 2022 11:04 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Whatever.


They shouldn't have lied about a single case.

But they did.

And now there's no reason other than fear to believe anything they ever say about health again.

Ever.

--------------------------------------------------

Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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Saturday, May 14, 2022 5:41 AM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
I did hear news (surely verified by Ministry of Truth) that Sith Lord Darth Obiden is celebrating One Million Deaths from COVID.
We all know these are Deaths From Covid because they are called Covid Deaths. Surely anybody who believes that Information Technology is actually Technology can understand this simple fact.
It shouldn't be too surprising that this celebration comes amid the gearing up for Election 2022, the Primaries.
This timeline has been obvious for almost 2 years, since the Meatpuppet was actually given the nomination.

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