GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

Alliance - Capitalist or Communist?

POSTED BY: CHRONICTHEHEDGEHOG
UPDATED: Saturday, August 13, 2005 02:24
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Friday, August 12, 2005 2:41 PM

BLUEBOMBER


Quote:

Originally posted by citizen:
If the plot lines had been allowed to continue, its likely that the twist of which you speak would have already happened. Would we have all seen it before the twist if we hadn't been starved of new FireFly episodes to watch?



Maybe. Maybe not. It's impossible to say at this juncture. And it's beside my point. I'm sure all this (or most of it anyway) will be revealed in the BDM (or possibly the sequels). All I'm saying is, for now, there's no way to say with accuracy whether or not Blue Sun and the Alliance are connected.

"Mwah ha ha ha...mine is an evil laugh. Now die."

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Saturday, August 13, 2005 1:32 AM

ECLIPTIC


There are no fundamental differences between a communist and facist form of government. Neither are what they were originally were. Both are as restrictive and detrimental to their society. Fascism is a word that the left wing political spectrum tries to slap to extremist right wing to make themselves feel better. When in reality extreme right wing would be out right anarchy.

What the "theory" is, is not what reality is.

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Saturday, August 13, 2005 2:24 AM

CITIZEN


Is that right?
Communism is socalist, by design:
Quote:

Communism is a movement based on the principle of communal ownership of all property that has been a major force in world politics since the early 20th century. Modern communism is associated with The Communist Manifesto of Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels, according to which the capitalist profit-based system of private ownership is replaced by a communist society in which the means of production are communally owned. This process, initiated by the revolutionary overthrow of the bourgeoisie (see Marxism), passes through a transitional period marked by the preparatory stage of socialism (see Leninism). ...
... In 1918 this party changed its named to the Communist Party, thus establishing the contemporary distinction between communism and socialism. ...
...The notion of communism, the idea of a society based on common ownership of property and wealth, stretches far back in Western thought long predating The Communist Manifesto. Some have even traced communist ideas back to ancient times, such as in Plato's The Republic. ...
According to the Marxist argument for communism, the main characteristic of human life is alienation; and communism is desirable because it entails the full realization of human freedom. Marx here follows G.W.F. Hegel in conceiving freedom not merely as an absence of constraints but as action having moral content. Not only does communism allow people to do what they want but it puts humans in such conditions and such relations with one another that they would not wish to have need for exploitation. Whereas for Hegel, the unfolding of this ethnical life in history is mainly driven by the realm of ideas, for Marx, communism emerged from material, especially the development of the means of production. ...
...In the popular slogan that was adopted by the communist movement, communism was a world in which 'each gave according to his abilities, and received according to his needs.'


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism

Maybe what I said about fascism was a little to simplified, but it is essentially a rightwing govermental style:
Quote:

Fascism was typified by attempts to impose state control over all aspects of life. Many scholars consider fascism to be part of, or in coalition with, extreme right politics. The definitional debates and arguments by academics over the nature of fascism, however, fill entire bookshelves. There are clearly elements of both left and right ideology in the development of Fascism. ...
"The State not only is authority which governs and molds individual wills with laws and values of spiritual life, but it is also power which makes its will prevail abroad... For the Fascist, everything is within the State and... neither individuals nor groups are outside the State... For Fascism, the State is an absolute, before which individuals or groups are only relative..."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facism

Fascism sets out to be Totalitarin, Communism sets out to be everyone working for the greater good. The two ideals are superficially similar, they are not the same. The fact that Communism breaks down in to a Totalitarin goverment not far removed from a fascist state is completly besides the point.

Quote:

The adoption of the name by the Italian Fascist Party reflected the previous involvement of a number of ideologues who intersected with radical left politics. While opposing communism and social democracy, fascism was influenced by the theories of Gabriele D'Annunzio (a former anarchist), Alceste de Ambris (influenced by anarcho-syndicalism), and former socialist Benito Mussolini.

So Fascism opposes communism, which is essentially the same as communism, so communism opposes itself?

Quote:

Originally posted by ecliptic:
You are typing about it without actually perceiving to know actually what you are typing about.


I'm not sure of your usage of the word perceiving here. Are you saying I'm talking, while knowing I don't know what I'm talking about?

Quote:

Originally posted by ecliptic:
There are no fundamental differences between a communist and facist form of government. Neither are what they were originally set out to be.


Communism never ends out as what it sets out to be... Fascism pretty much always ends up exactly where it started, a repressive state-is-all nation. What exactly is your basis for thinking otherwise?

Quote:

Originally posted be ecliptic:
Fascism is a word that the left wing political spectrum tries to slap to extremist right wing to make themselves feel better.


Yes us crazy leftys again. But lets hear something straight from the horses mouth shall we:
Quote:

Mussolini himself, writing in The Doctrine of Fascism
"Granted that the XIXth century was the century of socialism, liberalism, democracy, this does not mean that the XXth century must also be the century of socialism, liberalism, democracy. Political doctrines pass; nations remain. We are free to believe that this is the century of authority, a century tending to the 'right', a Fascist century."



Quote:

Originally posted by ecliptic:
When in reality extreme right wing would be out right anarchy.


And your basis for reasoning this is...?

Q: What do you have when you are holding two little green balls in your hand.
A: Kermit's undivided attention.

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