GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

The intended ethnicity of the Tams?

POSTED BY: DEIGAMAN
UPDATED: Wednesday, July 29, 2009 14:49
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Tuesday, July 21, 2009 7:05 PM

DEIGAMAN


I just discovered the awesomeness of both Firefly and Serenity not too long ago. One thing that interested me was the mash-up of both Western and Eastern culture. As an American-born Asian, this is something that kinda struck a chord with me.

One thing that kept nagging at my head, though, was the lack of Asian main characters. I know, I know, you have to find the right actor for the right part, yadda yadda yadda. That's fine, I won't beat a dead horse. But I was wondering if anyone knew what the INTENDED ethnicity of the Tams were when Joss was developing the story? According to Wikipedia, Kaylee was originally intended to be Asian, hence the modern-Eastern style of clothing she usually sports. But I found nothing about Simon and River who, for one, have a Chinese last name, two, are both incredibly smart (cough cough) and, let's be frank, exist in a universe where there are a LOT of Asian-descended people, all walking around in the background.

Is there a comment somewhere I missed? Maybe in Whedon commentary? Both Sean Maher and Summer Glau have vaguely Asian features (especially Summer... my friend was confused when I complained about the lack of Asians in Firefly, and pointed to River as an example of the contrary)..

Maybe there was some mixing in the Tam family tree?


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Tuesday, July 21, 2009 9:39 PM

AGENTROUKA


I think there was some mixing in the family trees of many, many people in the 'verse.

Even today, many people have a fairly mixed ancestry. The more mobile we become, the greater our pool of partners to choose from, the more likely will people from different backgrounds get together to have children.

And the show is 500 years in the future, many decades of which were spent on big transport ships carrying humanity toward the new solar system. As far as I'm concerned, everyone on the show is a "mutt" of some sort.

I don't think Summer was specifically chosen for her ambiguious looks, but they certainly didn't hurt in playing up that multi-mix aspect of the show.



Also, that lack of Asians thing becomes weirder and weirder the more I think about it. Did Joss ever say anything about it?

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Tuesday, July 21, 2009 11:21 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


The "lack of Asians" thing is something I've thought about, since it didn't for some reason strike me as odd, despite the statistical probabilities.

In our current time, I often find, and am still quite amazed at the "genetic purity" or same-race coupling of many asians. Not that some asiaqns don't mate with non-asians, but when with others asians, it seems predominantly same-race (or sub-race, fairly defined as by country or region).
I do understand there is much historical resentment between Japanese and Koreans, Viets, Thais, Chinese, etc - largely due to the wars amongst the peoples of the Far East while they were largely secluded from the Mid-east and Yurp. But they seem to hold a multi-generational grudge longer than some.

Perhaps there is some arrogance among asians in the future, restraining them from diluting their genetic pool with mongols and occidentals and others of lower IQ.

Perhaps some factors like this cause Serenity to have no asaians.not because asians are not included, but because asians have not included others.

Remember, the 2 countries which are represented are China on Sihnon, and the "melting pot of immigrants" America on Londonium for everybody else.

I had assumed Inara was supposed to be of asian influence, being from Sihnon and RCs being based upon geishas.
Try thinking about this from the viewpoint of an asian currently in China, rather than anybody living anywhere outside SE Asia. Would the proud Chinese want to lower themselves to colluding with scoundrels, thieves, defeated browncoats like those on Serenity?

On the other hand, if there is intermixing 500 years from now, perhaps the asian appearance characteristics are not very strong anymore.
Remember how many centuries ago the Far East was "discovered" and regular trade routes were established for spices and silks?
Even in the last half century, many asians have difficulty escaping their homelands. Today many countries know what centuries of ethnic mixing of whites, hispanics, blacks, Indians, can produce in terms of appearance, but we have not yet had many centuries of widespread intermixing with asians to know what the result will look like.

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Wednesday, July 22, 2009 3:45 AM

NCBROWNCOAT


If you live around a military base or any big city there are lots of mixed race people.

One of my good friends and an excellent Browncoat is is Chinese/American (mainly Irish) due thanks the US Marine Corps and she is married to another mainly Irish American. Her two children are lovely but still show softened Asian features despite being two generations away.

Other prominent Asian/Caucasians are Ann Curry (Chinese) of the NBC Today Show and Jon Gosslin (Korean).



http://fireflyfaninnc.livejournal.com/








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Wednesday, July 22, 2009 3:34 PM

WHITESILENCE


I'm Asian American too, first generation Chinese to be specific and yes, this lack of major Asian characters bothers me a lot. In fact the only one with a speaking part is a prostitute in Heart of Gold.

Afraid I can't actually help you with the Tam's ethnicity. Sorry.



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Wednesday, July 22, 2009 11:43 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by ncbrowncoat:
If you live around a military base or any big city there are lots of mixed race people.

One of my good friends and an excellent Browncoat is is Chinese/American (mainly Irish) due thanks the US Marine Corps and she is married to another mainly Irish American. Her two children are lovely but still show softened Asian features despite being two generations away.



I understand what you are saying, but this does not in any way address what I'm saying. We're contemplating the results of 500 years of WIDESPREAD racial intermixing, about 15-25 generations worth. That has not happened yet for us to see.

Yes, I've been in the Marine Corps, and I've been in large cities, but these aren't pertinent to my point.

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Thursday, July 23, 2009 10:31 AM

ZAROVE


WELL, specifically regarding th Tams, it may just be that they have some Asian Ancestry, but its three or four generations removed.

Suppose Mr. Yu Tam married a white woman, named Rachel Wellington. Their Children are of course Tams. Now if their son, Peter Tam, marries another mixed Asian/white woman, but whose Grandfather was a Veit, this means that the children are more white than Asian.

By the third or fourth generation of marrying mainly whites or other mixed races, we get our Tams, and they appear mostly white.

They still have Asian Ancestry though.

Of course this doesn't even factor in adoption as a possibility.

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Thursday, July 23, 2009 8:39 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by ZAROVE:
WELL, specifically regarding th Tams, it may just be that they have some Asian Ancestry, but its three or four generations removed.

Suppose Mr. Yu Tam married a white woman, named Rachel Wellington. Their Children are of course Tams. Now if their son, Peter Tam, marries another mixed Asian/white woman, but whose Grandfather was a Veit, this means that the children are more white than Asian.

By the third or fourth generation of marrying mainly whites or other mixed races, we get our Tams, and they appear mostly white.

They still have Asian Ancestry though.



Not sure if I understand.
Most "whites" or at least non-asians, particularly those of the "American" contingent of the exodus, are from mixed genetic sourcees. Are you saying one of these "mutts" will more greately dilute the asian features? That a more "pure bred" asian would not dominate the genetic material of the "mutts"? Two half-asian parents would produce a less-than-half asian offspring?
Is that what you're saying?


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Thursday, July 23, 2009 9:00 PM

AGENTROUKA


JSF,

but even if such a thing as a parallel/separate Asian society existed, that chooses to confine itself to Sihnon and not intermix with others... that still wouldn't explain the discrepancy of having lots and lots of non-speaking, clearly Asian background characters in the same low-level places where Mal and all the speaking non-Asian roles hang out.

Why wouldn't some of these poor Asians have been Independents, why couldn't they be part of Mal's crew or his business associates? And if the divide ran so deep, that even the poor kept themselves strictly seggregated along heritage lines, why wouldn't it have been mentioned on the show?

Honestly, I think there is no way to rationalize the weirdness of the lack of Asian speaking roles on the show.

The only reason people often ignore it is that the image of a space western, where Asians aren't necessarily expected to feature prominently, trumps the cultural implications of the show's premise, which would be... some Asians featuring prominently!

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Thursday, July 23, 2009 9:17 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
JSF,

but even if such a thing as a parallel/separate Asian society existed, that chooses to confine itself to Sihnon and not intermix with others... that still wouldn't explain the discrepancy of having lots and lots of non-speaking, clearly Asian background characters in the same low-level places where Mal and all the speaking non-Asian roles hang out.

Why wouldn't some of these poor Asians have been Independents, why couldn't they be part of Mal's crew or his business associates? And if the divide ran so deep, that even the poor kept themselves strictly seggregated along heritage lines, why wouldn't it have been mentioned on the show?

Honestly, I think there is no way to rationalize the weirdness of the lack of Asian speaking roles on the show.

The only reason people often ignore it is that the image of a space western, where Asians aren't necessarily expected to feature prominently, trumps the cultural implications of the show's premise, which would be... some Asians featuring prominently!


You mean like the Zen Western with asian David Carradine (Kung Fu)?

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Thursday, July 23, 2009 9:22 PM

ZAROVE


Actually, I intended Peter Tam to marry a woman whose Grandfather was a veit, and prodiced her mother. Her mother has half Asian and half white, and her Father white. This resulted in Jessica Thai Ly being only a Quarter veit. (But taking her mothers name, for legal reasons.) When she married Peter Tam, who was half Chinese, the resulting offspring where more white than Asian.

This is bcause Peter is half white and Jessica is 75 percent white. The offspring would be 3/8ths Asian.

Also, Im being general with whites, precicely because they are alreayd pretty mixed. Im not tryign to sound like some sort of Eugenisist, Im just not going into too many details. its bad enough I invented a family line, complete with names, for the Tams.


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Thursday, July 23, 2009 9:33 PM

AGENTROUKA


Quote:

Originally posted by jewelstaitefan:
Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
JSF,

but even if such a thing as a parallel/separate Asian society existed, that chooses to confine itself to Sihnon and not intermix with others... that still wouldn't explain the discrepancy of having lots and lots of non-speaking, clearly Asian background characters in the same low-level places where Mal and all the speaking non-Asian roles hang out.

Why wouldn't some of these poor Asians have been Independents, why couldn't they be part of Mal's crew or his business associates? And if the divide ran so deep, that even the poor kept themselves strictly seggregated along heritage lines, why wouldn't it have been mentioned on the show?

Honestly, I think there is no way to rationalize the weirdness of the lack of Asian speaking roles on the show.

The only reason people often ignore it is that the image of a space western, where Asians aren't necessarily expected to feature prominently, trumps the cultural implications of the show's premise, which would be... some Asians featuring prominently!


You mean like the Zen Western with asian David Carradine (Kung Fu)?



Well, Carradine wasn't Asian. So I guess it is a little bit like that. We have some Asian elements in the show's culture, but actual people of Asian descent are relegated to the background.

I wouldn't change anything about the show, I would just consider it more credible if they had given some of the prominent roles, crew or recurring business interest, or even villain of the week, to someone of actual Asian descent. Instead of "women sitting on train, holding chicken" or "man riding bike through Eavesdown Docks" roles.

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Thursday, July 23, 2009 9:44 PM

JEWELSTAITEFAN


Quote:

Originally posted by ZAROVE:
Actually, I intended Peter Tam to marry a woman whose Grandfather was a veit, and prodiced her mother. Her mother has half Asian and half white, and her Father white. This resulted in Jessica Thai Ly being only a Quarter veit. (But taking her mothers name, for legal reasons.) When she married Peter Tam, who was half Chinese, the resulting offspring where more white than Asian.

This is bcause Peter is half white and Jessica is 75 percent white. The offspring would be 3/8ths Asian.

Also, Im being general with whites, precicely because they are alreayd pretty mixed. Im not tryign to sound like some sort of Eugenisist, Im just not going into too many details. its bad enough I invented a family line, complete with names, for the Tams.



Thanks for the reply. I had missed that Jessica was 1/4 asian instead of half asian.
However, I have wondered if the asian genetics and features will be more dominant than the non-asian traits, or less dominant and resilient, or about the same. This is one reason I said we will need to wait until we've seen 500 years of widespreqd intermixing to know the difference. Those who've seen only a few generations of racial mixing between Hispanics, Africans, Scots, Germans, Scandanavians can note how much or little the traits caqn become muted, and which traits are most resilient.
I wasn't denying that pure or predominantly asian characters existed. But did you notice how many of the "background" asians seemed to be in groups, some apparently gang-like, and others merely congregating with fellow asians. Perhaps the political fallout from China being the other half of the exodus group created yet another social barrier for freely intermixing. Would Japan have been part of the Chinese side, or the American side? How about South Koreans? Taiwanese?

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Friday, July 24, 2009 1:36 AM

BIGWOLF18


perhaps there was no thought put into this at all, maybe it really was just the best actors for the parts. could you imagien it not having the actors it does and being just as good?

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Friday, July 24, 2009 1:57 AM

AGENTROUKA


Quote:

Originally posted by bigwolf18:
perhaps there was no thought put into this at all, maybe it really was just the best actors for the parts. could you imagien it not having the actors it does and being just as good?




Yes, I can imagine it.

I'd say it's not really possible to disregard race in certain casting decisions. If you cast for a movie set in China, you'll be casting actors of Chinese heritage, unless there's a very good reason for the characters not to be Chinese. If you make a movie dealing with American slavery, you're going to let race play a role in your casting choices, right?

Similarly, I figure they certainly picked great actors, but I can't imagine for the life of me why the Chinese half of the verse's culture wasn't made part of the choice. I sincerely doubt that no good actors of Chinese descend were available at the time.

I'm not saying I don't love the actors they chose, but who says I couldn't have loved another actor in one of the roles. Why couldn't the bad cop in "The Message" have been of Asian descend? Or Atherton Wing? Or Nandi? Or Tracey? Or Sir Warrick Harrow? Patience?

I think it's a case of inconsistency. They wanted some Asian elements without fully committing to their own scenario. Is there a stigma attached to casting Asians that they wanted to avoid? I just don't understand.

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Friday, July 24, 2009 4:03 AM

NCBROWNCOAT


I would have liked to see more Asian actors too.

As to a separate society, the RPG book (I consider it almost canon since Joss gave his blessing to it) does mention that "Tongs" or Asian Miafia still exist and are very influential on some planets and moons so a parallel society may exist to some extent.

There is till a lot of prejudice in Asian society to "mixed race" children, not necessarily in the US or Europe but in the Asian countries themselves. A lot of Vietnamese/American children have emigrated to the US in the past 40 years because of the prejudice. And I remember a Pearl Buck story about 4 Korean/American orphans and the prejudice that they faced after the Korean War (I think it was called "Matthew, Mark, Luke and John").

The Asian characteristics seem to predominate in mixed race children for some genetic reason. The children of my Chinese/American friend are 3/4 white, yet they look remarkably Asian. The same of what I've seen of the Gosslin twins and sextuplets on TV.

I'm not sure what further mixing would look like and only time will tell. I do think that society, in the US at least, is mixing more and more as our prejudices go away and we judge each other by character and not by skin color (my ideal world).



http://fireflyfaninnc.livejournal.com/








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Saturday, July 25, 2009 8:34 AM

ZAROVE


Well, the genetic reason for that is likely because white features are actually a lack of features. Except the Characteristic "White nose" and hair and eye colour, whites have basically no predominate features that stand out. The reason whites have white skin is because of a lack of Melanin, for example.

White features are plain, and white white genetics are just as strong as Asian, they express themselves differently and on an internal basis, such as blood type. Appearancewise, whites simply have no remarkable Characteristics to pass along.

In fact, some theories that whites got their start by Albonis intermarrying each other simply because they where shunned from more coloured communities due to their appearance, though this thery is not universlly accpeted, and generlaly people think the white race came from the mild skies of Europe, with its cold, and damp environment makign plainer features adaptively more benificial.

Just as black skin is adaptively better for Africa.

Asian features ar emroe a mystery to me, as I dont understand what adaptive function they served for their environment, bu perhaos thats just me not seeing the obvious.


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Saturday, July 25, 2009 10:58 AM

KAOSIUM


Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
JSF,



Honestly, I think there is no way to rationalize the weirdness of the lack of Asian speaking roles on the show.



Sure there is, it's called demographics. Asians make up all of 4% of the American population. Probably less in Canada. This is the pool of actors most American shows have to pull from. As education is generally highly prized in Asian-American culture, the best and the brightest are busy becoming engineers and doctors, not actors.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:02 AM

AGENTROUKA


Quote:

Originally posted by Kaosium:
Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
JSF,



Honestly, I think there is no way to rationalize the weirdness of the lack of Asian speaking roles on the show.



Sure there is, it's called demographics. Asians make up all of 4% of the American population. Probably less in Canada. This is the pool of actors most American shows have to pull from. As education is generally highly prized in Asian-American culture, the best and the brightest are busy becoming engineers and doctors, not actors.



So you are honestly saying that NO qualified Asian actors would have been available to act in the show..? I don't find that credible.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:20 AM

KAOSIUM



So you are honestly saying that NO qualified Asian actors would have been available to act in the show..? I don't find that credible.


Not exactly, just none that were able to beat out the ones that eventually were cast. Kaylee was originally supposed to be Asian in origin, but Jewel Strait won the role instead. There's simply *not* that many Asian-American actors out there, mainly because Asian-Americans are the single richest and best educated demographic and go to the best schools and learn things that get them lots more promising work than acting. My brother is/was an 'actor.' He spent 20k dollars twenty years ago at a prestigious New York acting academy. His wife went there too. He never made much more than a dime off it. He uses that expertise now to produce and direct (and occasionally star if he can't cast someone else) plays for a local theater group with the aid of his wife. His *real* job is as a union journeymen painter, his wife works at a casino as a teller.


Acting is a terribly risky profession, it's hard to make a living doing it full-time. It's not the sort of thing someone getting straight A's with the chance to go to Berkeley or MIT is going to get into. Seriously, stop and think about it, how many top Asian-American actors can you think of? With that kind of cultural imperatives and that tiny proportion of the population it's tough to find Asian-American actors.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 11:57 AM

AGENTROUKA


Even if there are fewer Asian-American actors out there than any other group, I STILL find it unlikely that not enough would have been available and good enough to gain at least some of the guest roles, like I described in my earlier post. The premise of the show warrants giving Asian actors some preference for a certain percentage of the speaking roles. Yet there is exactly one speaking Asian role in the whole of the show.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 12:03 PM

KAOSIUM


Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Even if there are fewer Asian-American actors out there than any other group, I STILL find it unlikely that not enough would have been available and good enough to gain at least some of the guest roles, like I described in my earlier post. The premise of the show warrants giving Asian actors some preference for a certain percentage of the speaking roles. Yet there is exactly one speaking Asian role in the whole of the show.



Joss obviously intended to feature Asians more prominently, but he can't wave his magic wand and create actors available and willing to do TV with the amount of talent necessary to be in a Whedenesque show. He only got fourteen episodes in which to do anything, so it's not a huge sample. Maybe as things developed he would have been able to attract the right actors, but apparently he was unable in the short span he produced the show. I think it's weird to condemn him for trying.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 12:06 PM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...


Hard to believe there wasn't one qualified Asian actor for the cast... if Joss was really looking for one he would have found one.

I think more likely he was trying to avoid the multi-culture Star Trek bridge look for Serenity. And of course, no telling who we would have seen in seasons/eps to come.

Talk about ironical though, Maurissa Tancharoen, is an Asian actress/writer married to Joss Whedon's brother, and:

"She co-wrote Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Blog and appeared onscreen as Groupie #1; she appears on the DVD audio track "Commentary! The Musical," in which she sings about the scarcity of non-stereotyped roles in television and film for actors of Asian origin."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurissa_Tancharoen

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 12:20 PM

KAOSIUM


Quote:

Originally posted by pizmobeach:
Hard to believe there wasn't one qualified Asian actor for the cast... if Joss was really looking for one he would have found one.



Ironically enough, he *was* looking for one, to play the part of Kaylee, he just found Jewel Strait played it best. None of the roles are ethnically specific, as yourself who you would have replaced with an Asian actor and which Asian actor would you choose? Let's say he cast Yunjin Kim (from "Lost") instead, despite the fact she was about a decade older than the character, do you think the show would have been as good, and Kaylee as compelling?

He gave the roles to the actors who earned them, there's nothing wrong with that.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 1:31 PM

AGENTROUKA


Quote:

Originally posted by Kaosium:
Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Even if there are fewer Asian-American actors out there than any other group, I STILL find it unlikely that not enough would have been available and good enough to gain at least some of the guest roles, like I described in my earlier post. The premise of the show warrants giving Asian actors some preference for a certain percentage of the speaking roles. Yet there is exactly one speaking Asian role in the whole of the show.



Joss obviously intended to feature Asians more prominently, but he can't wave his magic wand and create actors available and willing to do TV with the amount of talent necessary to be in a Whedenesque show. He only got fourteen episodes in which to do anything, so it's not a huge sample. Maybe as things developed he would have been able to attract the right actors, but apparently he was unable in the short span he produced the show. I think it's weird to condemn him for trying.



You have exactly one example of Joss trying, which is Kaylee. She's a member of the crew, a vastly important role, so there the talent thing might fly. But, say, Atherton Wing? The guy was horrible. He could have been replaced by anyone else. A broomstick, seriously. You can't tell me there wasn't one available Asian actor with the talent of a broomstick.

Even though you keep saying it, I am not at all convinced that actually trying to find Asian actors and actresses would have resulted in a show with exactly one Asian speaking role, as it did.

I think it's more likely that there is a casting bias at work. Not necessarily by Joss. But it's the far more likely explanation compared to "every Asian actor auditioning for speaking roles on the show was less talented than the non-Asians, to an extent that even a preference for Asian actors couldn't overcome".

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 2:46 PM

KAOSIUM


Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Quote:

Originally posted by Kaosium:
Quote:

Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Even if there are fewer Asian-American actors out there than any other group, I STILL find it unlikely that not enough would have been available and good enough to gain at least some of the guest roles, like I described in my earlier post. The premise of the show warrants giving Asian actors some preference for a certain percentage of the speaking roles. Yet there is exactly one speaking Asian role in the whole of the show.



Joss obviously intended to feature Asians more prominently, but he can't wave his magic wand and create actors available and willing to do TV with the amount of talent necessary to be in a Whedenesque show. He only got fourteen episodes in which to do anything, so it's not a huge sample. Maybe as things developed he would have been able to attract the right actors, but apparently he was unable in the short span he produced the show. I think it's weird to condemn him for trying.



You have exactly one example of Joss trying, which is Kaylee. She's a member of the crew, a vastly important role, so there the talent thing might fly. But, say, Atherton Wing? The guy was horrible. He could have been replaced by anyone else. A broomstick, seriously. You can't tell me there wasn't one available Asian actor with the talent of a broomstick.

Even though you keep saying it, I am not at all convinced that actually trying to find Asian actors and actresses would have resulted in a show with exactly one Asian speaking role, as it did.

I think it's more likely that there is a casting bias at work. Not necessarily by Joss. But it's the far more likely explanation compared to "every Asian actor auditioning for speaking roles on the show was less talented than the non-Asians, to an extent that even a preference for Asian actors couldn't overcome".




He 'tried' by creating a world with a heavily Asian influence that included the unprecedented practice of regularly having dialogue in Chinese. He wanted an Asian young woman initially, just none auditioned that were as good for the role as Jewel Strait.

One thing to keep in mind, something I've learned through my brother casting plays and musicals is you don't always get who you want to audition. In my brother's case he's perpetually short of adult men. He always has a plethora of teen-aged girls at auditions, but has had to cast me for minor roles as he never gets as many adult men as he needs. I'm not an actor and cannot sing, but I can remember the few lines I might get and can at least 'sing' the talky "Rock Island" from "The Music Man." He'd be happier if he had a real actor, but not enough talented ones audition.

Point being, with a tiny minority like Asian-American actors, and the mass of parts being considered from TV, the movies and theater, it's not unlikely he just didn't get any to audition or the ones he contacted declined in favor of something else.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 3:08 PM

KAOSIUM


Incidentally, I thought of one replacement that might have worked: Ken Leung (from "Lost") in Wash's role as the wisecracking pilot. He has the talent and they wouldn't have had to use all those weird camera angles and odd blocking to try to hide the fact Alan Tudyk is no "little man" at six feet tall.

However, Ken was in two movies in 2002, he might well not have been available. At that point in his life he might not have wanted to commit himself to a TV series, hoping to garner more movie roles instead.

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Saturday, July 25, 2009 4:20 PM

KAOSIUM


While looking around for information about this subject I came across a thread on another board where they're discussing this very thing. As to the original subject of this thread someone notes the part of Simon was open to Asians, though Summer had been pre-cast as River. As some think Summer has vaguely Asian features it was thought that would work. Thus with the name and the fact both Sean and Summer (as well as Gabriel) look as though they might have Asian ancestors, I think it not unlikely that was intended.

Another poster notes that he's done a dozen different shows and including auditions has run into only two East Asian actors. It reminded me that I've participated in about the same number of productions with my brother (usually stage crew, set-building and bartending) and have seen exactly zero Asians audition for a show. That's hundreds of potential roles; we had a cast of about fifty for "The Music Man," about the same for "Annie" and almost as many for "Jesus Christ Superstar." Our area, due to having one of the largest and most prestigious universities in the US, has a larger than normal percentage of Asians and Asian Americans. Yet not once has one come to an audition which are advertised at all the local colleges and on the local community theater websites. My brother cast a young black man as Harold Hill, he does not cast racially at all.


[url] http://trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=86034&page=2[/url]

Here's that thread, it doesn't prove anything as they're just posters like us, but there doesn't seem any reason to totally discount that information and it is interesting how it pertains to this debate.

In truth, if you want to see more Asians on screen then your best bet would be to go up to Berkeley and try to convince the best and the brightest to drop their engineering and pre-med courses in favor of Drama. They'll probably look at you a little funny though.

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Wednesday, July 29, 2009 2:49 PM

ZAROVE


WELL that, and even in integrated America you can still end up, in real life, with a unirace group by chance.

An in-show explanation for the lack of Asians may be just dumb luck.


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