GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

It's now or never.... Right....?

POSTED BY: THESOMNAMBULIST
UPDATED: Monday, May 28, 2012 08:11
SHORT URL: http://bit.ly/KFVRqx
VIEWED: 6698
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Sunday, May 6, 2012 7:39 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST


So with Avengers seemingly breaking all records and making executives very happy and heavy in the wallet, surely this is now the best chance there is for Joss to revive Firefly; and/or produce a SERENITY sequel, no ?

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 8:10 AM

BYTEMITE


Omigosh I hope so.

But I guess it'll be okay either way.

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 9:16 AM

WHOZIT


I hope so, but think Marvel and Disney may keep him bizzy for awhile.

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 10:26 AM

JARHEAD


The only way it ever happens is if Joss makes enough money with his deal for the next Avengers movie to fund it himself like with Dr. Horrible.

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 10:46 AM

WISHIMAY

THIS machine kills fascists- Woody Guthrie


Well, give the guy five minutes to take a nap and a shower....
But yeah, I'm keeping my fingers and toes and whatever I can- crossed...

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 11:32 AM

ZZETTA13


Great thread !

So Joss showing the world that he is a bankable writer and director! We, Browncoats already knew that, didn’t we!

I totally agree with you on this THESOMNAMBULIST. With Nathan, Adam, Morena, Jewel, Christina, Mark, Alan and so many FF alums making good for themselves, I say Joss should strike, “while the iron is hot” ! Just a figure of speech of course, but folks know what I mean!

Anyway, I don’t mean at this very moment, but people now are seeing what we have known all along. I’m saying this and I haven’t even seen the movie yet. I know it’s great though, I’ve already heard through channels.

I’ve love to see me some more Firefly, tv, movies, or mini-series. Don’t make much matter!

Anyway, I’m glad that you posted this thread. I was thinking the same thing!

Z

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Sunday, May 6, 2012 12:09 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Well I only just learnt that Disney are involved with the Avengers. That opens up a lot of doors. It's allowed Tim Burton to make a number of personal projects from Nightmare Before Christmas to Frankenweenie. So there's no reason why they wouldn't oblige Joss with a few personal key projects too. Firefly among them...

I'm not sure on the legal side of things as regards rights, but could Disney maybe buy Firefly from Fox...?

This would also allow a tie-in with Disney/Pixar on maybe an animated adventure. Perhaps In the style of the Clone Wars. Joss could encourage Pixar to move towards a more mature style for a change and really embellish the whole Firefly Universe... Maybe focusing on the War... Or some other narrative from the verse. Point being there's scope for further ideas... and Pixar are going to have to venture beyond the buddy, buddy animated films if they hope to prevail within the 3d animated market. A more adult orientated animated tv show would allow them this.

However really. It's about Firefly the TV show. If Disney buy the rights and Joss is happy to work with them...

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Monday, May 7, 2012 3:19 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...


Quote:

Originally posted by THESOMNAMBULIST:
So with Avengers seemingly breaking all records and making executives very happy and heavy in the wallet, surely this is now the best chance there is for Joss to revive Firefly; and/or produce a SERENITY sequel, no ?



If ever there was a time then Yes, but I personally won't expect it from Joss or the actors, and I won't feel upset if it doesn't happen. Lives and careers change, what's important to fans is not the same as what's important to them (no matter what they say when someone interviews them). I feel like they gave us their all twice, 3 times is a bit much to expect, even selfish. But it doesn't have to be them- if Joss simply co-produced in association with a studio some spin off I'd be thrilled.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Monday, May 7, 2012 10:40 AM

ZEEK


Quote:

Originally posted by ZZETTA13:
Great thread !

So Joss showing the world that he is a bankable writer and director! We, Browncoats already knew that, didn’t we!

I totally agree with you on this THESOMNAMBULIST. With Nathan, Adam, Morena, Jewel, Christina, Mark, Alan and so many FF alums making good for themselves, I say Joss should strike, “while the iron is hot” ! Just a figure of speech of course, but folks know what I mean!

Anyway, I don’t mean at this very moment, but people now are seeing what we have known all along. I’m saying this and I haven’t even seen the movie yet. I know it’s great though, I’ve already heard through channels.

I’ve love to see me some more Firefly, tv, movies, or mini-series. Don’t make much matter!

Anyway, I’m glad that you posted this thread. I was thinking the same thing!

Z



Cabin in the Woods might be the poison pill in all this. Avengers showed that Joss can be a success with a blockbuster, but Cabin in the Woods showed that his personal quirky creations don't really do much at the box office. Who knows how studio execs think? If it were me that would tell me not to just fund any old thing Joss wants to do.

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Monday, May 7, 2012 12:15 PM

WISHIMAY

THIS machine kills fascists- Woody Guthrie


Are you the self-appointed discordian for this site?
Do you have people that live with/near you and have you ever driven them to suicide??
Are you really that dedicated to playing devil's advocate?
Are you now or have you ever been a Fox exec?
Are you Joss's arch-nemisis?
Are you desperate for attention?
Dear Buddha, what is your problem?
I'm all for dissenting opinions, but not ON EVERYTHING!!!

TRY THE PROZAC, it's delicious!!!

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Monday, May 7, 2012 1:17 PM

BYTEMITE


Or Cabin in the Woods came out BEFORE Joss became a household name.

But to be fair, it's kind of a niche film.

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Monday, May 7, 2012 1:49 PM

ZZETTA13


There are roads filled with pot-holes, and I do think that it is flat, nearly impossible to miss every one of them. Sure Joss has had some clunkers, who hasn’t?

I think that most of us here were/are saddened by the lose of Firefly. Even though I didn’t catch the show when it originally aired, I do feel I would have found it at some point. The saddest part is that it wasn’t given a chance.

Maybe every whim of Mr. Whedon shouldn’t be funded with bucket loads of money. He’d likely say that himself. But Firefly was a “jewel”, and it’s still making tons of fans & tons of money, and that network would be lying if they said different.

I’d still like to see him do something with the materiel, a little stronger than a comic now & then!

Z

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Monday, May 7, 2012 4:59 PM

6IXSTRINGJACK

[/i]


Quote:

Originally posted by JARHEAD:
The only way it ever happens is if Joss makes enough money with his deal for the next Avengers movie to fund it himself like with Dr. Horrible.



F DR HORRIBLE!!!!!

It's just as bad as the title....

As much as my bro was right about Firefly, he was wrong about Dr. Horrible.....

Painful............

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Monday, May 7, 2012 5:21 PM

STORYMARK


The success of Avengers will certainly give Joss more clout, and a bit more power to get projects made. But we have to be realistic.

A) As much as we'd like to chalk this success up to Joss entirely - let's face it - it was a movie with Iron Man, Hulk, Thor and Captain America teaming up - it was virtually garunteed to be fairly big no matter who made it. And the vast majority of people coming out of it are going to talking about the Hulk smashing stuff, not Joss.

B) While he has become something akin to the anti-cheerleader around here, Zeek has a point - Joss just had a movie underperform a month ago - so it's not like Joss Whedon as a brand name is a blank check.

C) It doesn't even seem like something Joss wants to persue right now. He's all about launching Bellwether and getting his micro-budget films and web-series going.

D) Meanwhile - the cast are fairly busy.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, May 7, 2012 9:51 PM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Originally posted by Zeek:
Quote:

Cabin in the Woods might be the poison pill in all this. Avengers showed that Joss can be a success with a blockbuster, but Cabin in the Woods showed that his personal quirky creations don't really do much at the box office. Who knows how studio execs think? If it were me that would tell me not to just fund any old thing Joss wants to do.


Well you are right Zeek and it's a good point, however Hollywood doesn't always work that way.Often a director can be allowed a personal venture after just one flick. Steven Spielberg for one. He was given Jaws, it made a shed load and then it allowed him to get Close Encounters of the Third Kind made. He had to go to Columbia pictures rather Universal but he was still able to get it made. So it could work for Joss that way around.

However it is slight no doubt, and as Storymark said Joss is more interest in other things right now. So...

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 3:37 AM

LWAVES


Cabin In The Woods was always going to be a hard sell and it's no surprise to me that it underperformed, even though I really enjoyed it. Basically it's a horror movie which plugs itself as being different from all the other horror movies. How many times have we heard that before from other horror movies and they've turned out to be the same old stuff. It sounds like marketing. In this case it just happens to have a ring of truth about it. The trailer didn't help as a portion of horror fans are going to think they can figure it all out from that. Especially as trailers have been known to give too much away. Plus Joss only co-wrote and produced it, not directed it. That makes a big difference IMO as a lot of people won't see this as a Joss movie. Bringing up Spielberg again, it's kind of like the fact that he produced the Transformers movies (or at least the first one) yet you'd never consider them Spielberg movies.

But the Avengers being so huge a success will give Joss a lot more clout. The impression I get is that he already had the respect but just needed to prove he could do it. Even if this did use an already existing audience with four major, establshed characters Joss still knocked it out of the park by making them work together. It could have been an almighty mess that even Michael Bay wouldn't wipe his arse with. Even so, it's still only one movie hit, he still needs to show that he can make more than one hit movie before any real power comes his way.

As for Firefly/Serenity?
I too hope that something will turn up but I'm also realistic. Too much time has gone by, the cast have grown older, moved on and whilst, like us, they look back very fondly on that time it won't be the same as it was then. Even if they got everybody back together it still wouldn't be the same show. It would be extremely hard, near impossible to recreate the magic that was there at the time. And the last thing any of us would want is a sub-par offering that tarnished the memories we have.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 4:47 AM

ZEEK


Quote:

Originally posted by lwaves:
Cabin In The Woods was always going to be a hard sell and it's no surprise to me that it underperformed, even though I really enjoyed it. Basically it's a horror movie which plugs itself as being different from all the other horror movies. How many times have we heard that before from other horror movies and they've turned out to be the same old stuff. It sounds like marketing. In this case it just happens to have a ring of truth about it. The trailer didn't help as a portion of horror fans are going to think they can figure it all out from that. Especially as trailers have been known to give too much away. Plus Joss only co-wrote and produced it, not directed it. That makes a big difference IMO as a lot of people won't see this as a Joss movie. Bringing up Spielberg again, it's kind of like the fact that he produced the Transformers movies (or at least the first one) yet you'd never consider them Spielberg movies.



I think this describes Serenity fairly closely. It's a niche movie that is difficult to market. Unless "from the maker of the Avengers" brings in about double the business that it would normally get then I don't see anything changing.

That being said I think reasonable budgets and reasonable expectations are where Joss is going. He said in one of the interviews posted here that Dr. Horrible made the biggest return percentagewise of anything he's done. If he can do a better job of keeping his quirky films down to quirky film budgets then he can do his own thing a lot more.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 6:02 AM

BYTEMITE


Well if you're going to be like THAT, then every genre is technically a niche market. Space western like Serenity, superhero movie like The Avengers.

What I meant with Cabin in the Woods is that it's a indy quirky horror/comedy deconstruction. And while the other aspects might not make it quite niche, I wouldn't call Shaun of the Dead or Zombieland niche for example, the indy part of it kinda does.

Serenity's not niche because the genre is pretty common and because it was distributed by a mainstream studio. Clearly it has lasting appeal because we're still here TALKING about it and because it's still bringing in new fans, so I don't think you can argue that the problem is that Firefly/Serenity wouldn't/doesn't appeal to a broad audience. The movie did not do well at the box office among mainstream audiences because of the then relatively unknown quality of Joss and the actors, meaning a lack of brand familiarity, not a lack of appeal.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 6:44 AM

SUASOR


After Avengers, Joss will be listened to much more intently, and a lot more thought and consideration will go into how any new Firefly projects are turned down.

Then again, Firefly TNG is a possibility, leaving open the chance of guest shots by some of the original cast.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 6:58 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Well if you're going to be like THAT, then every genre is technically a niche market. Space western like Serenity, superhero movie like The Avengers.

What I meant with Cabin in the Woods is that it's a indy quirky horror/comedy deconstruction. And while the other aspects might not make it quite niche, I wouldn't call Shaun of the Dead or Zombieland niche for example, the indy part of it kinda does.

Serenity's not niche because the genre is pretty common and because it was distributed by a mainstream studio. Clearly it has lasting appeal because we're still here TALKING about it and because it's still bringing in new fans, so I don't think you can argue that the problem is that Firefly/Serenity wouldn't/doesn't appeal to a broad audience. The movie did not do well at the box office among mainstream audiences because of the then relatively unknown quality of Joss and the actors, meaning a lack of brand familiarity, not a lack of appeal.



Well, when it comes down to it - genre films are niche - as very few appeal to ALL people (4 quadrant films - referring to men/women, young/old - being the industry term.

That in mind, Serenity is niche of niche - which is pretty much borne out by its performance. It developed a feircely loyal cult following - and is widely ignored by the rest of the world. Thats about as niche as you get.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 7:02 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Suasor:
After Avengers, Joss will be listened to much more intently, and a lot more thought and consideration will go into how any new Firefly projects are turned down.



This assumes any Firefly projects are being pitched - and there is zero indication of that happening any time soon.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 7:21 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Originally posted by lwaves:

Quote:

As for Firefly/Serenity?
I too hope that something will turn up but I'm also realistic. Too much time has gone by, the cast have grown older, moved on and whilst, like us, they look back very fondly on that time it won't be the same as it was then. Even if they got everybody back together it still wouldn't be the same show. It would be extremely hard, near impossible to recreate the magic that was there at the time. And the last thing any of us would want is a sub-par offering that tarnished the memories we have.



Yeah I think you've about nailed it Lwaves. It's very hard to argue against this sentiment really, but I just feel Joss is a different animal. I think he could make Firefly work ten years from when it stopped, I also think he's a clever enough fellow to even bring back Buffy and still make it smart and relevant. He has that tenacity.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 8:26 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by Suasor:
Then again, Firefly TNG is a possibility, leaving open the chance of guest shots by some of the original cast.



I don't see Whedon going that way at all. I think he is much more in love with the current character then he is with the 'Verse itself.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 8:41 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

and is widely ignored by the rest of the world. Thats about as niche as you get.


You're like retrospectively calling it a niche movie because it had a small devoted fanbase to start with and the fanbase didn't get much bigger afterward.

A niche is not a genre. When you're talking about niche you're generally talking about something a little more specific than "this is a sci-fi movie, sci-fi fans will go see it, therefore it is a sci-fi niche film." No. It's a sci-fi genre film. You get a broader crosssection of a market with a genre film than you do with a niche film. Niche means that the movie only a small group it appeals to within it's own genre market, like if you do a sci-fi robot pornography film. Only robot fetishists would be into that. THAT is niche.

Serenity was entirely able to attract people outside the series fandom and in the sci-fi genre fandom in general.

Therefore Serenity was a mainstream space western genre movie made out of a major motion picture studio that got a lot of critical acclaim but did mediocre at the box office because the cast and Joss were fairly unknown at the time. That's all. It's not niche.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 9:03 AM

STORYMARK



Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Quote:

and is widely ignored by the rest of the world. Thats about as niche as you get.


You're like retrospectively calling it a niche movie because it had a small devoted fanbase to start with and the fanbase didn't get much bigger afterward.



No, I was talking about the entire lifespan of the franchise.

Quote:

It wasn't JUST marketed to the fans, it wasn't just marketed to a niche.


Marketed to and actaul appeal are not the same. A lot of niche properties are marketed to a broad audience - because they want to break out of that niche - but not all succeed.


And even then - it wasn't marketed to everyone - it was marketed to sci-fi fans, and Joss fans (From the creator of Buffy - a show which, even at its peak - was NICHE).

Quote:

Serenity was a mainstream space western genre movie that got a lot of critical acclaim but did mediocre at the box office because the cast and Joss were fairly unknown at the time. That's all. It's not niche.



Im not sure which definition of "niche" you're going with, but as far as I can tell, there are 2 that apply to the film industry - and Firefly/Serenity fits either:

NICHE: a distinct segment of a market.

OR

pertaining to or intended for a market niche; having specific appeal:



In film industry terms - its about as niche as you get. Sorry.

It was intended for mainstream - but it never GOT THERE - because the mainstream rejected it. You can come up with all the rationalizations as to why that you like - it's still not a mainstream property.

It was successfull however, with a very specific section of the market. Niche by definition.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 9:33 AM

BYTEMITE


Quote:

And even then - it wasn't marketed to everyone - it was marketed to sci-fi fans, and Joss fans (From the creator of Buffy - a show which, even at its peak - was NICHE).

Im not sure which definition of "niche" you're going with, but as far as I can tell, there are 2 that apply to the film industry - and Firefly/Serenity fits either:

NICHE: a distinct segment of a market.

OR

pertaining to or intended for a market niche; having specific appeal

In film industry terms - its about as niche as you get. Sorry.

It was intended for mainstream - but it never GOT THERE - because the mainstream rejected it. You can come up with all the rationalizations as to why that you like - it's still not a mainstream property.

It was successfull however, with a very specific section of the market. Niche by definition.



When you're talking about a niche film, it doesn't have quite the same meaning...

Look, let's take this piece by piece.

Space Western Genre. This is not niche, even though it will mostly attract sci-fi or space western fans, other people might still go see it. For example, Star Wars movies, which are more of a Space/Opera fantasy, but anyway. Pop-culture phenomenon. You see what I mean.

Therefore being Space Western does not inherently make something niche. Rather this is the GENRE. Being any genre technically doesn't make something niche in this sense, because otherwise you can argue that everything is niche.

Serenity is very Space Western. I think we agree here.

Joss Whedon has a fandom which represents a small segment of the total number of sci-fi (and in the buffy series, supernatural comedy/horror) fans.

This is not niche either because Serenity wasn't just marketed to them. It was MEANT to appeal to a broader audience. Just because it failed doesn't mean it's niche, it means it was a mainstream movie with a pre-existing fanbase, the movie was marketed to the mainstream, but failed with the mainstream.

A niche film means something that was MEANT to have an appeal with only a small segment of a larger target demographic. But Serenity wasn't MEANT to appeal to JUST sci-fi/Joss Whedon/Firefly fans. The people going to see Serenity weren't JUST sci-fi/Joss Whedon/Firefly fans, the public in general could have gone to Serenity. (See: Me. Never heard of the series OR Joss when I saw it in the theatres, and I don't particularly consider myself a sci-fi fan)

A niche film would be more like robot pornography that only a very small group of sci-fi fans (and robot fetishists) would go see and no one else would go see it. Developed entirely with them in mind, and marketed directly to them.

It's just a mainstream movie that failed, guys. It's not niche.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 10:48 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
It's just a mainstream movie that failed, guys.



...and movies that fail do not get sequels.

Niche or not it does not matter. Serenity failed to deliver what the studio wanted. Unless Whedon gets enough money to go it on his own I doubt we will see another movie. Even if he does we may not see one.

The reason Joss may not want to let go is because he knows Firefly will never be what he wanted it to be. He had the cast he wanted, the crew, the set, ect, and it did not pan out. Making a second movie would force him to make choice he may not want to make simply because of real world realities, and other forms may not be good enough.


I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Tuesday, May 8, 2012 11:29 AM

BYTEMITE


True.

On the other hand I still think the movie failed because the actors and Joss lacked notoriety more than anything else. Joss at least should get same name cred now, and that MIGHT change the landscape.

But. It's also accurate that we don't know how much the actors still like the show, and if they're just being nice to the fans. Same with Joss.

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Friday, May 11, 2012 4:32 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.


Well, Joss has definitely proven to everyone that he can write and direct, not that we Browncoats didn't already know that. Couple his success with Avengers with Nathan's following from Castle, the fact that Morena is recognizable to many from her stint on V and her Homeland, and the backing of the browncoats and you have a solid base to work from.

I'd love to see this happen, but how busy will Joss be with large, lucrative offers? I imagine with two more Avengers movies signed his time will be limited at best.

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 12:41 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


I disagree Zeek. I think CITW was a good "welcome mat" for the main event - The Avengers. It was inventive and fun, sure it didn't set Box records, but it was entertaining enough. The Avengers will have studio execs sit up and take notice.


SGG

"Everyone in this town is being crazy, yes!?"

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 1:08 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Sleepy you have great enthusiasm and all-around general old-fashioned vision. That's how I view it, lol.

With the coin Joss has laid at Disney's bank vault (Avengers is expected to hit the $1B mark this weekend), they may throw him a bone. I'll go ya' one further - why not a joint venture, a la Hulu style, between Disney, Fox and Universal. Each contributes 1/3 of the bank for either a TV series, movie sequels or mini-series (sharing the profit in equal thirds, with the remaining 1% going to Joss - damn, I'm good!). Plus your animation idea, as an offshoot of the Firefly/Serenity franchise, would create a new revenue stream for the venture. All the execs gotta do is play nice.

Don't think for a moment that the execs are not thinking of the same exact thing - "we gotta strike while the iron is hot" scenario. They want to make money as well, and right now, they see dollar $ign$! KAaaa-CHING! My take is, it would be foolish of them NOT to cook up such a scenario - especially now that they see gold shooting out of Joss' arse.


SGG

"You're right Ugatti, I am a little more impressed with you"

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 1:25 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Yeah, what Z said - Great Thread. I was hoping that the Avengers would catch fire, for that very reason.

My fellow Browncoats, brace yourselves!




"I'm of a mind to make some woogie.............Bobby, phone book"

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 1:30 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


TRY THE PROZAC, it's delicious!!!

Ha!

SGG

"Connie, that's an oxymoron"
"Awww, lay off Connie Dr. Poole, he does the best he can."

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 3:28 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Oh, so we're being realistic now, are we? Okay, I'll bite.

A) Anyone could have made it? Guaranteed success? The vast majority?

Have we forgotten the rather disappointing failure of the third installment of the X-Men series not too long ago (2006)grossing $549M worldwide. Okay, it was the highest grossing of the 3 X-Men films, but I believe it was helped along by the groundwork laid by X-Men, and the superior X-Men: United ($407M), the second installment of the franchise, directed by Bryan Singer.

Why do I bring up X-Men? Because it is a Marvel franchise. Because it was directed by anybody - Bryan Singer (Usual Suspects, Superman Returns, and the upcoming Battlestar Galactica). Because Brett Ratner directed X-Men: Last Stand, the Rush Hour franchise and the more recent Tower Heist. Money isn't everything.....it's the only thing in Hollywood (apologies to Vince Lombardi). But there are more things that make a movie successful, IMHO. Is it widely accepted and is it critically acclaimed, these terms are not always mutually exclusive. Success is fickle. Look at the SpiderMan franchise, a can't miss phenomenom, until SpiderMan 3.

No my friend success is not guaranteed, remember Serenity, which got mixed reviews and barely broke even in the box office, Universal invested because of Joss' cult following behind Firefly. It is, to me, a magical combination, a marriage if you will, of the right script, the right cast and the right vehicle. The Avengers was written and directed by the right person at the right time, with the right cast, carefully produced and crafted by the folks that brought you the critically and financially successful Iron Man. Was Iron Man a perfect film, not on your life, but it struck a chord with moviegoers. And now, lightning has struck twice.

The Avengers has struck a chord with moviegoers of all ages, gender and religious belief. At the showing I went to I saw young and old, men and women alike leaving the theatre laughing, chuckling and smiling. There wasn't an empty seat to be had. It is my pleasure to inform you that Joss Whedon, the cast, the producers and company have hit the motherload. His script was brilliant, not perfect, just brilliant. The rest is, as they say, cake. I'm not sure who said it but, "it always begins with the story."

The vast majority, and there were truckloads, vote with their dollars. And, in some way, they do decide the fate of most movie franchises at the box office. Despite being panned, for the most part, the Twilight Saga continues along their merry way. Robocop 2&3! Alien Resurrection! Pirates of the Caribbean 5! All successful franchises? Who decides?
Is it moviegoers or the Hollywood execs. The vast majority, for the most part, don't care who directed a film as long as they had a good time. Then again, there is Serenity. The Alien franchise - Ridley Scott has filmed Prometheus, a prequel. Do you think it matters to people? You bet it does. And the people who make the decisions to greenlight a project care too (as long as it makes money), but make no mistake - they decide.

B) BTW, I'm sorry but Cabin in the Woods, as of May 10, has grossed over $53.2M worldwide ($38.8M domestically). How is that considered underperforming? As someone correctly stated, it is a niche film geared toward horror and Joss fans, with no known stars. It may not have set box office records, but apples and oranges! One thing is certain it has been well received by critics and audiences alike.

C) Jury's still out on that one. Of course, he has Air Bud on his mind.

D) I give you that one. But, in Hollywood, money talks. Besides this is not happening tomorrow.

Bottom line: Anyone who is at the helm of a Billion Dollar Cruise ship will be lighting cigars with the Big Boys, who will desperately be trying to whisk him away to work on a project at their studio. A billion dollars in 2 weeks is nothing to sneeze at; flops notwithstanding.


SGG


"I'll buy that for a dollar"

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 3:54 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Bytemite, you make a strong case. There are so many variables in this theme of this thread, one cannot throw a blanket over it and say "there, got it."

Joss may, or may not, pursue Firefly/Serenity. Everything we discuss here is speculative. To me there is broad appeal for the story of Firefly, mainly because, as you correctly state, "we're still here." That, in and of itself, says alot.

The question is will the success of The Avengers catapult Joss into the Spielberg stratosphere of influence in Hollywood. I say they will look at his track record, but a Billion dollars goes a long way in La La Land.


SGG

"Oh, and one more thing.........defend yourself"

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 3:59 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Sleepy, I think you're right.

"I could show you the door, but you gotta walk through it."

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 4:28 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


True that. The actors were not well known at the time, neither was the story. And despite Joss' success with BTVS, neither was Joss.

I had a conversation with a co-worker about the Avengers, which he loved, and I told him about CITW. I said it was the same director involved, as well as with Firefly/Serenity. He was somewhat surprised, only because he didn't know. He did say he was a Buffy fan, but he wasn't a devoted follower of Joss' work. It's my thinking that there are many like him who are casual fans that don't blog or post daily, read a ton of comic books or shamelessly follow the actors of a failed TV show.

He confessed to me that, although he had heard of Firefly, he never gave it a second thought. Now he wants to watch the episodes. Proper marketing can make or break a series or movie.

Despite the fact that Fox has moved and changed the time slot of Fringe, it is still one of it's strongest programs on TV today. It's a combination of marketing, brilliant writing and strong characters. It is the program Fox could not kill.


SGG

"Well, it ain't Ozzie and Harriet. Turn left here dear."

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 4:59 AM

BYTEMITE


The movie rights and that part of the franchise are back in Fox studios' hands. The more hands are in the pie, the harder it'll be to negotiate, so that's probably a good thing it's all under one roof again.

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 5:11 AM

THESOMNAMBULIST


Shiny that was HUGELY entertaining! A better stream of posts I have not seen. It ran like a stand up performance. You had me laughing and applauding at your vision.

Brilliant!

Cheers

°...Well here I am.°

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Saturday, May 12, 2012 8:40 PM

FIREFLYPASSENGER


I love the fact that just by the thread title I knew what it was about.

Joss is juggling a lot. I'm a believer that if Joss can Joss will.
However someone, in a suit needs to ask him to make more.
Unless of course Joss suits up and makes it happen.

I believe Joss has a lot to give and I'm here for the long haul.

Keep flyin'

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Thursday, May 17, 2012 9:05 AM

SHINYGOODGUY


Quote:

Originally posted by THESOMNAMBULIST:
Shiny that was HUGELY entertaining! A better stream of posts I have not seen. It ran like a stand up performance. You had me laughing and applauding at your vision.

Brilliant!

Cheers

°...Well here I am.°



Thanks Sleepy, I was inspired. The Avengers not only entertained me, but with each passing moment, each sight gag
and each killer line of dialoque I kept thinking "we're going to get Firefly back" - that is very motivational. I was on a roll wasn't I (ooops! there goes my head).


SGG over and out

"Well, let's see what's in the paper. There are the Maitlands, they look nice and stupid"

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Thursday, May 17, 2012 9:28 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by SHINYGOODGUY:

Why do I bring up X-Men? Because it is a Marvel franchise. Because it was directed by anybody - Bryan Singer (Usual Suspects, Superman Returns, and the upcoming Battlestar Galactica). Because Brett Ratner directed X-Men: Last Stand, the Rush Hour franchise and the more recent Tower Heist. Money isn't everything.....it's the only thing in Hollywood (apologies to Vince Lombardi). But there are more things that make a movie successful, IMHO. Is it widely accepted and is it critically acclaimed, these terms are not always mutually exclusive. Success is fickle. Look at the SpiderMan franchise, a can't miss phenomenom, until SpiderMan 3.



The thing is, as much as X3 and Spidey 3 were maligned - they are the highest grossing insallmewnts of each series.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Saturday, May 19, 2012 6:38 AM

ZZETTA13


Comiccon 2011-Buffyfest panel, Joss Whedon says he’s still interested in making more Firefly/Serenity films,movies, tv. It’s a bit long but if your looking for the Firefly parts you can slip to around the 16:20 minute mark, 24 minutes & 26:24 minutes mark, just to get you there.


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Sunday, May 27, 2012 8:11 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


The thing is, as much as X3 and Spidey 3 were maligned - they are the highest grossing insallmewnts of each series.


True that! There is no mistaking the numbers, but it is my view that each was successfully buoyed by the 2 preceding films. Plus usually people flock to the final chapter to see how it all ends, including me - I was there, in line, for X-Men 3 like everyone else; as well as Spiderman 3. I'm a comic book geek from the old school (Spidey, X-Men, Thor among my favs).


SGG

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Sunday, May 27, 2012 9:10 PM

SHINYGOODGUY


Thanks for posting that Z, I thought I heard him say that he now has license to proceed with the characters. I take that to mean that he can go forward with Firefly (as I originally understood the contract with Fox, it was for 10 years so it may be that it reverts back to him after that period).

I hope that is the case, because now with his success with the Avengers he may very well have a little pull in Hollywood, or, at the very least, exposure to the point of getting his foot in the door to have his pitch heard.
He is now carving out his niche in La La Land.

Plus the fact that he stated he wants to do more with it. Imagine, he loved Dollhouse so much, how much more does he love Firefly/Serenity.

It's been 7 years since the release of Serenity yet you heard the reaction when Joss mentioned a sequel, and the look on his face at the audience's response. Priceless!


SGG

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Monday, May 28, 2012 2:09 AM

ZZETTA13


You’re welcomed SGG! I actually found that You-Tube vid while looking up interviews for The Avengers. As you know, it was before the block-buster movie came out. I think Joss at that time knew he had a hit of his hands, but was still unsure of how big a success it would be.

If Disney is funding Tim Burton’s pet projects why shouldn’t they allow Joss a shot at a sequel, or even prequel to Serenity? It wouldn’t even have to be anytime soon. He could get started on the next Avengers while lining up the Firefly cast for a mini series reboot on tv. Maybe even a three night event like the History Channel will be doing tonight with “Hatfields & McCoys”.

Also, being allowed his own project or two, he could invite a couple of big name stars aboard such as Robert Downey, Jr., Scarlett Johansson & Samuel L. Jackson (as Jayne’s, Saffron’s & Book’s younger siblings respectively). Any one of them, or all of them together. Can you imagine the punch power that would have?

There are all kinds of scenarios that would allow Firefly to continue. The browncoat population remaining firm and holding together has never let Joss down, and we will be there when he’s ready to begin his space western again!

Z, still holdin.

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Monday, May 28, 2012 7:44 AM

FIREFLYPASSENGER


a
Quote:

Originally posted by THESOMNAMBULIST:
Originally posted by lwaves:

Quote:

As for Firefly/Serenity?
I too hope that something will turn up but I'm also realistic. Too much time has gone by, the cast have grown older, moved on and whilst, like us, they look back very fondly on that time it won't be the same as it was then. Even if they got everybody back together it still wouldn't be the same show. It would be extremely hard, near impossible to recreate the magic that was there at the time. And the last thing any of us would want is a sub-par offering that tarnished the memories we have.



Yeah I think you've about nailed it Lwaves. It's very hard to argue against this sentiment really, but I just feel Joss is a different animal. I think he could make Firefly work ten years from when it stopped, I also think he's a clever enough fellow to even bring back Buffy and still make it smart and relevant. He has that tenacity.



TheSomnambulist I agree with you, Joss is a different animal. He can make the impossible happen if you just let him.

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Monday, May 28, 2012 7:53 AM

FIREFLYPASSENGER


Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
True.

On the other hand I still think the movie failed because the actors and Joss lacked notoriety more than anything else. Joss at least should get same name cred now, and that MIGHT change the landscape.

But. It's also accurate that we don't know how much the actors still like the show, and if they're just being nice to the fans. Same with Joss.



I think the actors will do what Joss says. Also the actors love to hang out when they can so to get to work with friends on a project you enjoyed is nice.

I always thought everyone needed time to become known. The marketing for Firefly and Serenity should have introduced you to the characters.

I am still disappointed we never got a billboard of our crew or the bus posters I see everywhere announcing upcoming movies. I was waiting to see our crews faces on those billboards and busses.

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Monday, May 28, 2012 8:04 AM

FIREFLYPASSENGER


Quote:

Originally posted by ZZETTA13:
You’re welcomed SGG! I actually found that You-Tube vid while looking up interviews for The Avengers. As you know, it was before the block-buster movie came out. I think Joss at that time knew he had a hit of his hands, but was still unsure of how big a success it would be.

If Disney is funding Tim Burton’s pet projects why shouldn’t they allow Joss a shot at a sequel, or even prequel to Serenity? It wouldn’t even have to be anytime soon. He could get started on the next Avengers while lining up the Firefly cast for a mini series reboot on tv. Maybe even a three night event like the History Channel will be doing tonight with “Hatfields & McCoys”.

Also, being allowed his own project or two, he could invite a couple of big name stars aboard such as Robert Downey, Jr., Scarlett Johansson & Samuel L. Jackson (as Jayne’s, Saffron’s & Book’s younger siblings respectively). Any one of them, or all of them together. Can you imagine the punch power that would have?

There are all kinds of scenarios that would allow Firefly to continue. The browncoat population remaining firm and holding together has never let Joss down, and we will be there when he’s ready to begin his space western again!

Z, still holdin.



It is truly a testament to Firefly that 10 years later we are still holding! I love it!

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Monday, May 28, 2012 8:11 AM

FIREFLYPASSENGER


Have you seen the numbers on Box Office Mojo?
http://boxofficemojo.com/alltime/world/

As of this post Avengers has $523,563,000 That is 10 million away from third place domestic and $23 million from third all time international.

FOR THE RECORD: I believe that if Avengers last long enough in theaters it can become #1 for both domestic and International. Avatar was in theaters for 34 weeks. We'll see what the final numbers are but I truly believe The Avengers has farther to go than third place.

I am just so very happy for Joss Whedon!

*Happydance*

Rosie aka Fireflypassenger

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