unification of independent planets by tomerai

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS

unification of independent planets

POSTED BY: TOMERAI
UPDATED: Monday, August 9, 2004 21:39
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Saturday, August 07, 2004 2:06 AM

my guess would be that the Alliance and the process of 'unification' into it, would be much like what has happened to any Empire, super power or Imperial nation.

Look at the previous Empires like British, or the Roman or the Spanish. The Romans went on a quest to gather power and slaves. The areas close to the heart were filled with riches and support, the heart of Rome was a powerful place. However the destiny of Empires is that they must continue going outward, trying their conquest 'else the concept of Empire will cease to exist. The trouble is by Empires expanding they expand into other areas and have to rule them, they start battles with others at times, they get streched or become too big or go out on more than one front the borders begin to crumble, the heart of Rome might have been rich and powerful but control over areas near Wales in England, North Africa or Germanic araes quickly gave way and the Empire started to lose power and of course bad management from within and everything starts to buckle.

I suspect the Allaince might be somewhat like this, the core is rich and has lots of high tech equipment ( I have wrote about the core in another post and I suspect that it is our own solar system - Earth -Jupiter- Saturn) the core is wealthy. The Beyond the middle core however things aren't so good, even areas that are with the alliance seem to be poor backwater settlements filled with poverty ( recall that bar room brawl in that 'yokel' town? ). I also suspect that within the core things aren't so smooth, there seem to be a conflcit of intrests between the elite hierarchy and allaince leaders. There might be other problems with the core itself, greedy rulers, tyrant leaders, and perhaps a growing underground movement that provided Mala & Simon with some of the equipment too pull of the Ariel job. Inara - the posh hooker who supported unification might not be so pro-allaince anymore, Inara who was used to a rich life in the core also seems to be against what is currently happening.

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Saturday, August 07, 2004 7:01 AM

PURPLEBELLY

It gets reconstructed by Halliburton

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Saturday, August 07, 2004 7:17 AM

JAYNEZTOWN

Quote:
Originally posted by PurpleBelly: It gets reconstructed by Halliburton

A frightening thought

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Saturday, August 07, 2004 1:28 PM

LTNOWIS

Well, the problem is that we don't really know how the alliance government works. If they do things by representational democracy, than they'd install a provisional government once things got calmed down and they no longer needed direct military rule. Then there would be elections of planetary officials, and everything would be set. Kind of like in Iraq. However, they probably aren't that nice, and leave a military governor for a few years, or possibly indefinitely. First he/she'd keep a strong military presence. Than the governor, moff, overlord, or whatever would usually back off and leave things to the locals and only intervene if there was a problem, like we saw in the Train Job. Of course, alliance officials in other areas might be more authoritarian, banning local holidays and traditions, like we heard about in Dead or alive. The whole process would be filled with at least some propaganda about it all being for the best and how they would be respected and cherished and whatnot. During the actual war they'd probably give everyone the option of joining the military, if they were short on troops, or helping build bases, factories, or whatever war installations they needed. They might extend the offer to Independent POWs, the way the Nazis did to the Russians, but that would work better on Independent conscripts, not those fighting for freedom.

In response to Jayneztown, I'd say that his picture of the alliance is probably pretty accurate. Except I think that even in Core worlds it'd be like in China, where they have big wealthy cities with cool floating trains(really) that still have a lot of dirt-cheap laborers from the countryside, beggars, pickpockets, and drug dealers. Edited for grammar and spelling.

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Monday, August 09, 2004 6:06 AM

BROWNCOAT1

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

From what we have seen in the series, and comments made by Mal, Zoe and others, it seems that the Core worlds and border planets are as different as night and day.

The Core planets seem to be the "civilized" planets, w/ a wealth of technology, modern medicine, and a stable economy and governing structure. The border planets, much like the western frontier lands of the U.S. in the mid to late 1800s, are far removed from the technology the Core worlds enjoy. Medicine, technology, and creature comforts seem to be scarce or even nonexistant.

I agree that planets or moons that are brought into the Alliance are nothing more than an expanding of the Alliance empire. The Alliance wants the territory to send settlers to ease the overcrowding of Core planets, and the taxes & resources they gather from those worlds is beneficial to the Alliance.

If what Mal has said in the series can be taken at face value, the Alliance does not equip settlers very well for the harsh enviroment that they will encounter on a new world, and don't much care for their welfare once they arrive.

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."

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Monday, August 09, 2004 8:07 AM

CYBERSNARK

I'd imagine that, for an outlier world, being part of the Alliance is like owning a cat.

The border world provides money, food, and services to the Alliance, and the Alliance. . . lets them.

:wink:

----- We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Monday, August 09, 2004 9:25 AM

LTNOWIS

So do you think there were any advanced/core worlds on the Independents side? They must have had some industry, or they wouldn't have lasted as long as they did. Also, the core worlds probably have issues of their own, even if they're not as dire as on border planets. Wash said his world was polluted. So while they're wealthy and everything works, I don't think it's like Mal said, where everyone's happy and successful.

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Monday, August 09, 2004 11:40 AM

EARLYWASLATE

Likely the browncoats had some industry, however, I would also bet that you had your war profiteers like Niska selling to both sides, but mostly the Independents.

My guess is that the core worlds aren't so different from any major 1st world city. You have areas that are crisp, and clean. Upper/middle class areas, and tourist areas. But you also areas that you avoid becuase they're not so good or safe. IIRC Simon's dad yelled at him for being in a "brown out district" (??) or something like that on his home planet.

For there to be enough people to be desperate enough to move out from the core worlds to settle an undeveloped moon, tells me not all is shiny in the core. You likely still have your disenfranchised, poor, unlucky, and certianly criminal elements.

Also, I don't think it is the the Earth solar system, simply because thay are always talking about "earth that was." I suppose it could simply be a dead world in the core, so polluted that it can't be terraformed. Now THAT would be ironic.

"Does that seem right to you?"

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Monday, August 09, 2004 3:49 PM

PEACE

Quote:
Originally posted by EARLYWASLATE: snip

Also, I don't think it is the the Earth solar system, simply because thay are always talking about "earth that was." I suppose it could simply be a dead world in the core, so polluted that it can't be terraformed. Now THAT would be ironic.

"Does that seem right to you?"

It's made pretty clear in HoG and other episodes that Earth was laid waste by pollution and eco-destruction, and humanity had to flee to other worlds. In the background of the party in Heart of Gold you can see a shadow puppet play of the exodus from Earth.

I see the Alliance as partaking of some aspects of a tributary empire-- it takes your taxes and resources, garrisons a few points it considers important, but otherwise it doesn't give a damn if people, especially on the outer worlds, live or die. This structure rather makes sense for a star empire-- with a multitude of worlds it would be difficult in any case to garrison or supply every locale equally. And the Alliance leadership, apparently, is not gifted with an over-abundance of social conscience in any case.

Oh, bugger! Now I have to wait for someone to wake up!

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Monday, August 09, 2004 9:39 PM

JAYNEZTOWN

Quote:
Originally posted by Peace: Quote:
Originally posted by EARLYWASLATE: snip

Also, I don't think it is the the Earth solar system, simply because thay are always talking about "earth that was." I suppose it could simply be a dead world in the core, so polluted that it can't be terraformed. Now THAT would be ironic.

"Does that seem right to you?"

It's made pretty clear in HoG and other episodes that Earth was laid waste by pollution and eco-destruction, and humanity had to flee to other worlds. In the background of the party in Heart of Gold you can see a shadow puppet play of the exodus from Earth.

I see the Alliance as partaking of some aspects of a tributary empire-- it takes your taxes and resources, garrisons a few points it considers important, but otherwise it doesn't give a damn if people, especially on the outer worlds, live or die. This structure rather makes sense for a star empire-- with a multitude of worlds it would be difficult in any case to garrison or supply every locale equally. And the Alliance leadership, apparently, is not gifted with an over-abundance of social conscience in any case.

Oh, bugger! Now I have to wait for someone to wake up!

good points there, I'll have to watch that Heart o' Gold episode again

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