Just on Jubal by ShinySahara

FIREFLY EPISODE DISCUSSIONS

Just on Jubal

POSTED BY: SHINYSAHARA
UPDATED: Wednesday, December 15, 2010 01:15
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VIEWED: 6515
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Tuesday, September 29, 2009 10:58 AM

Forgive me if this has been discussed somewhere, (I only made a cursory glance at the archives) however, what's up with Jubal? He's an odd cat, know what I mean?
Licking Serenity,
"Am I a lion?" (I understand, he mis-heard Alliance, but he just carried on about being a lion and having a roar.)
"That's between me and my mind."
Perhaps it was meant to lend to the surrealness of the episode? (Is that a word? Can I use companion as a verb? :)
He was just an odd cat.

"Your mouth is talking. You might want to look to that."

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Tuesday, September 29, 2009 2:36 PM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Listen to the commentary for that episode, it's quite brilliant and may answer some of your questions.

[/sig]

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Tuesday, September 29, 2009 4:38 PM

ANOTHERSKY

Going into Riveresque mode here, I have a theory:

Jubal is...a question. To the audience.

Much like most of the uncannier features of this absurd Verse, Jubal is specifically onboard to make us, and the characters, think.

Most of the time, we're busy being funny, grubbing money, getting knocked down and dragged out in our petty thievin' coats of a dusty nature and brownish color. With a smile. Or occasionally the real possibility of tears.

This episode, down to the title(Objects in Space), is about stopping, taking a step back, and looking at the world like one might an abstract modernist painting...without preconceptions of what it's supposed to "be" or "mean" or "how it works".

The entire sequence with River at the beginning (remember the much-argued-over gun/stick? The leaves? The "comprehend" vs. "understand"?)
lets you know that you have now flown into the "giant Zen koan" region of space.

Quote:
Mal: And how are you the ship? Am I dreaming?
River(as the ship): We all are.

There ain't no pilot out, except what meanings you choose to make of things, and emotions, and events.

So where does this put MR. JUBAL EARLY, one very strange lion?
Someone made an excellent argument(link when I find it, was on Malcontents)that River and Jubal are episode foils--they're both very...considerative...of this abstract environment. Except that River is a very good person, and Jubal is very, very bad.

My point: River sees the essence of people, and Jubal only sees their function. Check out his gun (and woman) musings. Simon follows him along for the ride because arguably, he's the most "take it as it is" character onboard, who is also diametrically opposed to both Early's creepy actions and his POV.

Jubal could be a very condensed, scary embodiment of the questions of what we do with the info we gain from perception. (see the Operative for the masterpiece of this) And there are some very contradictory individual moral schemata
happening with lots of the characters, so while that really affects things under my theory, I think I'll stay away from that tussle for a while.

Going for a ride.

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Tuesday, September 29, 2009 4:41 PM

ANOTHERSKY

Uh...try the commentary first, this is just my mouth talking. :)

Going for a ride.

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Tuesday, September 29, 2009 6:26 PM

VETERAN

Don't squat with your spurs on.

If Objects in Space is a koan does the end of the show represent satori?

....."Well, here I am."

note: edited to change If Jubal is a koan to If Objects in Space.

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Wednesday, September 30, 2009 8:42 AM

ANOTHERSKY

Maybe. Satori is necessarily a very...open concept that is difficult to net, if that's what you're trying to do. Lol.

Jubal asks questions the whole darn time. His ordering and threatening is done in the language of a tea party, both satirical and utterly serious. Simon ends up matching it ("he's really very gentle ...and fuzzy", "well, my sister's a ship, we had a complicated childhood") which is weird and funny. Guess it can mean something, or not.

In one way like Ledger's Joker, Jubal's got that amoral universe behind the eyes scares you, bad. Like the endless vacuum of space that freaks Simon in Bushwhacked. But he is very much about convention,(whereas his sister--at least now--isn't) so I may retract my earlier statement that he takes things as they are. Maybe I want to say he remains most detatched and observes, generally, of the whole crew.

Yeah, I guess "Well, here I am" just restates the whole premise of the show in one infuriating line.

Your turn: what do you think?

Going for a ride.

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Wednesday, September 30, 2009 10:59 AM

SHINYSAHARA

Wow, Anothersky - what an awesome insight. As i was reading, I was getting the idea of watching the episode in the way that I would look at an Impressionist painting...not so much lineral story-flowey, but in spurts, know what I mean?

When I first saw it, I thought that Jubal was just...was not there. Was borderline schitzophrenic even, responding to questions or ideas that only he heard. As I watched it more times, that theory faded, but I still wondered what was up with him.

I wonder if I'll have another idea after I watch it with the commentary.

:)

"Your mouth is talking. You might want to look to that."

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Monday, October 12, 2009 1:47 PM

VETERAN

Don't squat with your spurs on.

Definitely requires rewatching. Not that I need an excuse.

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Sunday, November 21, 2010 10:46 AM

TOASTERPIMP

JUBAL'S Suit?

You know that totally awesome red space suit he's got?

I've got the uncanny feeling I've seen it somewhere before...in some movie, or TV show, or somewhere.

Any ideas? or am I just going nuts.

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Sunday, November 21, 2010 11:06 AM

TOASTERPIMP

Also, yeah, have watched the episode twice and feel like there are layers there that have yet to be explored.

A TV show you can really discuss- that leads you to new and iteresting reflection-that makes you think.

That's why it's so damn good.

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Wednesday, December 15, 2010 1:15 AM

TOADSMOOTHY

My take, only having watched the episode sans commentary, is that he was a psychotic nut-job who spent way too much time alone in space in his little space craft. It's gotta mess with your mind, right? Especially if you were cracked from childhood, torchuring the neighborhood dogs and such. I'm sure that "criminally insane" would cover his condition. Normal people can't really understand the workings of a mind like Jubal's anymore than we can fully understand River.

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