OTHER SCIENCE FICTION SERIES

Latest BSG Episode (3/4/07)

POSTED BY: JPSTARGAZER
UPDATED: Friday, March 9, 2007 19:15
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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:03 PM

JPSTARGAZER


Wow. Just wow. I'll come back later with something to say, I just need to figure this one out.



"All I got is a red guitar, three chords, and the truth...the rest is up to you"
--Bono

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:10 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Quote:

Originally posted by jpstargazer:
Wow. Just wow. I'll come back later with something to say, I just need to figure this one out.



"All I got is a red guitar, three chords, and the truth...the rest is up to you"
--Bono




I just logged on out of sadness

You ever want to talk about something and really have nothing to say ?

sad


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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:18 PM

DERANGEDMILK


Well I've got plenty to say.

A) WOW! Incredibly powerful.

B) The not-Leoben guy said he was going to show Starbuck the place between life and death not actually death. Starbuck may be gone for awhile but not for good. If I remember right in the original series didn't Starbuck go missing for awhile and then returned after having lived stranded on a planet with a centaurion for awhile? Well, they didn't show Starbuck gripping that ejection lever for nothing and I'm guessing she really didn't dream up that ship....


2008: THE RETURN OF STARBUCK!!!!!!!!
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:19 PM

OZZYSUN


All I could say was Wow....
This epi made up for all the shitty ones.
Wow....

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:33 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


Wait until next week when Lee slaps her picture up next to Kats.....




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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:39 PM

DERANGEDMILK


Quote:

Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Wait until next week when Lee slaps her picture up next to Kats.....



Oh, I'm sure he will and it will be a very sad moment, however Lee, Adama and everyone else in the fleet thinking she died doesn't change the fact that she didn't!
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:44 PM

FINN MAC CUMHAL


I’ve been wondering how and if they were going to deal with this. If you’re a savvy fan of Battlestar Galactica, you’ll have noticed how the new BSG seems to eerily match the old in the general storyline, to the degree that it can. Of course the old BSG was very abridged, so there’s a limited amount of material to draw upon and it has pretty much already told all the old storyline, from Caprica, Pegasus, food shortage etc, etc.

But one major point from the original story that had not been addressed was the fate of Starbuck, which savvy fans will remember was told in a special made-for-tv-movie following the cancellation of Galactica-1980. Benedict didn’t return for Galactica 1980, because he was involved in the A-team, so they made up a story that Starbuck had been lost in space and presumed dead. Later when the special came out, it told how Starbuck had crash-landed on a deserted planet out of communication range of the Galactica while chasing down a Cylon Raider. On the planet alone with a Cylon, he and the Cylon befriended, reluctantly at first, but then they became close confidants.

So I’ve always wondered how Starbuck would end in the new series, and now we know. It is eerily similar to the old. In many ways, the old Battlestar Galactica is like a myth told years or centuries later, after it has been embellished and aggrandized with parables and analogies. And the new BSG is like the real story, less heroic, more gritty, more real, but still the same story.



Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 7:10 PM

DERANGEDMILK


I JUST SAID THAT!!!!! lol
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 7:21 PM

FINN MAC CUMHAL


Quote:

Originally posted by derangedmilk:
I JUST SAID THAT!!!!! lol

Yeah, you did. I just now read your post. But Starbuck doesn’t return. The story was told by Zee, a child prodigy on board the Galactica, who years later relates to an elderly Commander Adama the fate of Starbuck through a dream. Whether Starbuck dies is not known, but he never returns to Galactica.




Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 7:26 PM

DERANGEDMILK


Oh okay. I forgot about Zee the brain-child-fleet-leading-mutant-genius. But they got cancelled not long after that right? Perhaps they were planning a return eventually?
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 7:38 PM

FINN MAC CUMHAL


Quote:

Originally posted by derangedmilk:
Oh okay. I forgot about Zee the brain-child-fleet-leading-mutant-genius. But they got cancelled not long after that right? Perhaps they were planning a return eventually?

The episode about Starbuck being stranded was the final episode of the series. The episode was called “The Return of Starbuck.” It could be that they had managed to get Benedict to agree to another season in the hope that it would save the show, and they were going to bring Starbuck back in a second season of Galactica 1980. I don’t know. Except for the title, nothing in the episode itself suggested that Starbuck was rescued.

In the new series, it’s possible Starbuck might return. I find it rather shocking that Starbuck is gone, but then it did kind of seem as if they were running out of ways to make her look dysfunctionally heroic. I don’t know how they will deal with this in the new series.



Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.

Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.

-- Cicero

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 7:47 PM

DERANGEDMILK


Well I for one am hoping she comes back and not as a Cylon. I can't imagine the series without her. Maybe for the rest of the season but not much longer than that. I'm thinking she'll either end up down on the planet with that raider and highjack it to get back to the fleet or get picked up by it ("Leoben is coming for you") and brought to the Cylons where god knows what will happen.
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

Vote for Firefly at http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/index.html

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 9:48 PM

SINGATE


This is easily the best episode in about a month. We all knew Kara suffered some abuse at the hands of her mother but the extent of it was pretty fucked up. I was hoping she had put a bullet to her mother, thus causing the guilt trip. Not quite sure I understand the whole "I've made peace with my mother so now I can die" angle. Her death just seems pointless. Hopefully there will be further explanation when and if she comes back.

If they do go along with the original show there may be some reference to the Lords of Light. I seem to remember an episode in the original where everyone thought Starbuck was dead...or was it Apollo? Anyway, when her cockpit filled with white light that was the first thing I thought of.

The giant storm Starbuck flew into had me rethinking the Eye of Jupiter because it reminded me of the great red spot on our Jupiter.



_________________________________________________

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Sunday, March 4, 2007 10:33 PM

SHAMELESS


Can't read any responses - all I have to say is that 1. I'm finally caught up with the series! GLEE! and 2. I missed tonight's episode because of work, and will be seeing it on March 6th at 11 pm. If Starbuck or Apollo has died, I will smash things.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 6:31 AM

GRIZWALD


Argh! Waiting on iTunes to upload the episode. You guys are killing me here.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 7:48 AM

CYBERSNARK


Sad now.

-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 8:17 AM

MAL4PREZ


My theories, and I know nothing of the 1980 BSG, so could be way off with all this:

1) Starbuck is one of the five. Has to be! She's some weird sort of cylon that grew up from a little girl, which is why her mother hated her so much and treated her like crap. Because her mother knew...

Or not. It does seem so obvious that maybe they're trying to mislead us with that.

2) Either way, the storm was the eye of Jupiter, and Starbuck needed to go down there to learn some truth that's important for helping them the humans find earth or the cylons find God or something like that. The storm lives over some technological something, possibly cylon created, possibly left by the 13th tribe, that makes it safe for her to go down there...

Or, maybe it's the place she'll be "reborn," if theory #1 is true, and she'll learn all sorts of cool things by being dead for a while and she'll hang out with the cylons and do lots of God talking.

If I was BSG ficcer, I'd be all over this LOL!



-----------------------------------------------
I'm the president. I don't need to listen.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 11:24 AM

TENNESSEEMIKE


Friends-

First a brief hello. long time lurker here. Found the 'verse with the BDM. Firefly followed

This January, I finally bit the bullet and got into BSG. Now they kill (or at least disappear) Starbuck.

So last night I realized the problem- I am the TV character angel of death. Once I take an interest in the character, time for the Actor to shop the Resume.

Favorite Characters from Firefly: Wash and Book- Gone

Favorite Characters from BSG: Starbuck and Billy- Gone

Favorite Characters from the Sopranos: Big Pussy and Drea- Gone

Deadwood- Cancelled at the end of the 3rd season- The season I started watching

Rome- Cancelled at the end of this season- The season I start watching it.

So I am now available to pick up new shows in an attempt to get rid of them as well. I think I will start with American Idol....

Cheers,

TM

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Monday, March 5, 2007 11:33 AM

STEGASAURUS


Did anyone else notice the change in terminology by Col. Tigh?

He called the wierd cylon shuttle a "Raider" and called why I always assumed was a raider (since I have the little ship on my desk) a "Bandit".

Not sure if it was bad editing or if maybe I mis-heard the discussion.

And someone mentioned earlier, Lee saw the cylon ship just before the big ka-blooey.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 11:46 AM

CAUSAL


Quote:

Originally posted by Stegasaurus:
Did anyone else notice the change in terminology by Col. Tigh?

He called the wierd cylon shuttle a "Raider" and called why I always assumed was a raider (since I have the little ship on my desk) a "Bandit".



The Cylon fighters are called "raiders."

The Cylon transport thingies are called "heavy raiders."

"Bandit" and "bogey" are fighter pilot terms dating back (I believe) to the second world war. When a pilot picks up an aircraft visually or on radar but can't ID it, it's a "bogey." When the bogey is identified as an enemy fighter it's called a "bandit."

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Monday, March 5, 2007 11:50 AM

CAUSAL


Good discussion thus far.

My $0.02--until I see a Starbuck funeral, I'm going to assume that she's alive and coming back, because of the language of film-making (and I realize I'm meta-gaming this, but meh). If they'd given Kara a funeral, I would have seen that as the producers saying, "Look, the character is dead and her arc is over." But they didn't do that. They left it very open-ended. I need to go back and look again, but if I remember correctly, in the last few cuts between Starbuck and the flashback the camera was very tight on Starbuck's face. We can't really tell if she's still in the cockpit or not. I'll have to take a look at the CGI when her Viper starts burning up to see if she's in there--but my money's on no. It does seem to fit in with the "Leoben's coming for you soon" thing, and as has been mentioned, Lee did see the heavy raider.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 12:07 PM

STEGASAURUS


Quote:

Originally posted by Causal:
Quote:

Originally posted by Stegasaurus:
Did anyone else notice the change in terminology by Col. Tigh?

He called the wierd cylon shuttle a "Raider" and called why I always assumed was a raider (since I have the little ship on my desk) a "Bandit".



The Cylon fighters are called "raiders."

The Cylon transport thingies are called "heavy raiders."

"Bandit" and "bogey" are fighter pilot terms dating back (I believe) to the second world war. When a pilot picks up an aircraft on radar visual but can't ID it, it's a "bogey." When the bogey is identified as an enemy fighter it's called a "bandit."

________________________________________________________________________
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Captain, FFF.net Grammar Police



Thank you for that clarification, Casual. I'll admit I was falling asleep due to fatigue, so I probably only heard half of Tigh's dialogue.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 12:17 PM

REGINAROADIE


Well, if she is still alive (and that's a big if since they've built up her death for a while, and to suddenly do it and then back off with a flimsy "Oh wait, she's not really dead." reveal would really undermine all they've done with the character), then I hope they have a fresh way to bring her back.

If she is dead dead, then that was a really crappy way to kill off a great character. Marc Bernadin over at EW.com put it perfectly.

"I'm all for Kara's having a destiny (and I love the way the producers tied that mandala painting in her old apartment into the Temple of the Five and now into that storm system). I just don't understand what her destiny is, other than to disregard orders and commit suicide by flying into a storm. I'm all for heroic sacrifice, provided I understand what the sacrifice is for. And here, I don't."

If just seems like "Oh, let's kill her by confronting her issues with death with some spiritual mumbo jumbo and flashbacks as she follows a phantom Raider into some clouds and have her blow up without resolving any overarching thing. That'll really make the audience happy."

**************************************************
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Monday, March 5, 2007 12:37 PM

CAUSAL


Quote:

Originally posted by reginaroadie:
"I'm all for Kara's having a destiny (and I love the way the producers tied that mandala painting in her old apartment into the Temple of the Five and now into that storm system). I just don't understand what her destiny is, other than to disregard orders and commit suicide by flying into a storm. I'm all for heroic sacrifice, provided I understand what the sacrifice is for. And here, I don't."

If just seems like "Oh, let's kill her by confronting her issues with death with some spiritual mumbo jumbo and flashbacks as she follows a phantom Raider into some clouds and have her blow up without resolving any overarching thing. That'll really make the audience happy."



Right, this is why I don't think Kara's dead. They've been playing up the painting in her apartment since early season 2, been working with the abuse thing since early season 2, been working with the Leoben thing since mid-season 2. It doesn't make much sense to just kill her off like that; I'm thinking this has all got something to do with Leoben--maybe he's gone rogue, like D'Anna did.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 1:33 PM

CHINDI


powerful show.. and no way is she dead.. I just don't buy that. MAYBE she is one of the 5.. but not gone forever. Tho she is gone the rest of THIS season from what I hear....

slapping the photo up will be emotional. Lee will be emotional as is Papadama (she was like a daughter after all...) but I reckon she will be back next season somewhere.. the whole destiny thing means there is more out there to be determined..

as for TennesseeMike...LOL Love that you are a show killer.. yes please.. American Idol, Deal or no Deal, Survivor and I will get a list together for you to kill off.... lol.. please stay away from Heroes, and MAYBE Jericho (jury still out)and, uhm, maybe you should just catch reruns of BSG.. . just to be sure...



Chindi

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Monday, March 5, 2007 1:50 PM

DARKJESTER


Just a quick thought - remember the tagline they were promoting earlier? It was something similar to "One will die, one will find they are a Cylon, and one will find Earth". What if all three are pointing to Kara?

MAL "You only gotta scare him."
JAYNE "Pain is scary..."

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Monday, March 5, 2007 2:41 PM

KHYRON


Quote:

Originally posted by Causal:
I need to go back and look again, but if I remember correctly, in the last few cuts between Starbuck and the flashback the camera was very tight on Starbuck's face. We can't really tell if she's still in the cockpit or not. I'll have to take a look at the CGI when her Viper starts burning up to see if she's in there--but my money's on no.

I checked it and she's still in the cockpit. Besides, so what if she ejected? If the atmosphere can crush her viper it can crush her too. She seems pretty dead.

The only way she can come back is as a cylon.



The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 5:25 PM

THUNDAR


Lets see... My theory.
She is rescued by that Raider and taken to a Base star.
On the Base star she is kept under and healed until she's ready to awake.
They put her in a ressurection vat. She wakes up, in the vat, seeing the Cylons around her welcoming her home.
She is then told she is in fact a Cylon and she is one of the final five.
They Frak with her mind until she herslf believes and tells all about the Fleet.

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Monday, March 5, 2007 7:16 PM

JPSTARGAZER


I think she has to come back. There was the whole thing about the goddess of rebirth. When you realize that she died (allegedly) in a huge ball of fire, I think that's too much of a coincidence not to imply a Phoenix-esque return. Just my thought.

Looks like we'll get the Baltar trial next week too.



"All I got is a red guitar, three chords, and the truth...the rest is up to you"
--Bono

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Monday, March 5, 2007 8:05 PM

PEULSAR5

We sniff the air, we don't kiss the dirt.


Quote:

Originally posted by mal4prez:
My theories, and I know nothing of the 1980 BSG, so could be way off with all this:

1) Starbuck is one of the five. Has to be! She's some weird sort of cylon that grew up from a little girl, which is why her mother hated her so much and treated her like crap. Because her mother knew...

Or not. It does seem so obvious that maybe they're trying to mislead us with that.

2) Either way, the storm was the eye of Jupiter, and Starbuck needed to go down there to learn some truth that's important for helping them the humans find earth or the cylons find God or something like that. The storm lives over some technological something, possibly cylon created, possibly left by the 13th tribe, that makes it safe for her to go down there...

Or, maybe it's the place she'll be "reborn," if theory #1 is true, and she'll learn all sorts of cool things by being dead for a while and she'll hang out with the cylons and do lots of God talking.

If I was BSG ficcer, I'd be all over this LOL!


-----------------------------------------------
I'm the president. I don't need to listen.




Try this: Starbuck is 1/2 Cylon like Helo and Sharon's baby. They never really discussed who her father was, and it might explain part of her mother's bitterness.

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Tuesday, March 6, 2007 5:28 AM

MAL4PREZ


Quote:

Originally posted by Peulsar5:
Try this: Starbuck is 1/2 Cylon like Helo and Sharon's baby. They never really discussed who her father was, and it might explain part of her mother's bitterness.

Works for me! Maybe her father the cylon is one of the five and it's really someone on the ship... Oh, the possibilities...

And yes, I'm now laughing at my own silly imagination!

But as someone was saying above, they've done too much work setting all this up to have her really just dead and gone. My question is: how long do we have to wait till we see that she's alive? I guess the last episode of the season, cause they'll wait long enough to make us doubt.


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Tuesday, March 6, 2007 5:33 AM

ARCADIA


They have discuessed who her father way -- a famous painist (see 2x02 "Valley of Darkness").

I am still in shock from this episode. After I watched it I spent a few hours convincing myself she wasn't dead. After listening to the podcast, though, I am pretty sure that she is.

RDM and David Eick keep hinting that her death will have further reaching consequences than are obvious now. BAsically, they say it wasn't her special destiny to die, exactly, but to die in this particular way, at this particular time...?

I just can't believe it. She was -- is my favorite character.

The most frustrating thing is that I just can't hate the episode they killed her in. Katee Sackhoff shined. Every scene she had she sold. And she was filled so beauitfully. The lighting in the scene where she and Lee talked sitting next to her viper? Amazing. The scenes of her in the cockpit? Wow. The special effects rocked my socks.

But really, it was the emotional journey of the character. Katee Sackhoff was amazing. And so was Jamie Bamber. The Lee character has really come into his own this season. Through seasons one and two I found him pretty annoying. But now, he's one of the most sympathetic characters on the show.

And Adama smashing the boat! Oh god... a hilarious aside from the podcast: That moment wasn't scripted. EJO was caught up in the moment and destroyed the boat. The hilarious part is, it wasn't a prop. It was a museam quality boat worth hundreds of thousands of dollars! Fortunately, it was insured, but sitll... haha, Eddie.

Arcadia (aka Greyfable and/or Katie)
www.stillflying.net -- picking up Firefly were Joss left off. We will hold 'til he gets back.

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Tuesday, March 6, 2007 7:18 AM

OZZYSUN


My wife purchased for me the complete BSG original series, in the cool cylon head. I remember watching an episode recently where Starbuck crash's on the planet, befriends the cylon, builds the hybrid viper/cylon ship and he himself flys back to galactica. I also remember the 1980's one where he sends the kid back to Galactica because theres only room enough for one person on the ship.

That being said I don't think thats what is happening here.
I love the post about the cylons rescuing her, healing her then having her wake up in a Cylonesque res chamber just to frak with her. I don't think she would give up fleet secrets but man that would be sooooooo evil.....

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Tuesday, March 6, 2007 7:51 AM

STEGASAURUS


Quote:

Arcadia wrote:
Tuesday, March 06, 2007 05:33

And Adama smashing the boat! Oh god... a hilarious aside from the podcast: That moment wasn't scripted. EJO was caught up in the moment and destroyed the boat. The hilarious part is, it wasn't a prop. It was a museam quality boat worth hundreds of thousands of dollars! Fortunately, it was insured, but sitll... haha, Eddie.



I usually watch BSG in bed, since I have to work early on Mondays. When that part came up, and he smashed that boat, I looked at my wife and said, "Wouldn't that be hilarious if that wasn't a prop? Someone's like, 'WTF?!?! I spent HOURS on that FRACKING THING!! What's HE DOING?!?!' Someone's gonna be paying out the arse..." And then we just laughed.

So funny that it appears I was right..lol

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Thursday, March 8, 2007 10:32 PM

CALFEEMAN


For those of u who haven't heard...Katee Sackhoff did a interview about all the rumors about starbuck to answer some questions including "her death". The battlestar galactica myspace has the link to it in there newest blog.

This is the myspace page http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&frien
did=120285373


This is the link to the blog
http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=120285
373&blogID=238621350&MyToken=fb980293-f1f6-44b6-9265-e62f489b2d28


Hope this helps people understand what happened.

Calfeeman Strikes Again!!!!!!!!
Pilot of the Mao Huoche

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Friday, March 9, 2007 1:12 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


I don't want to read this thread cause I still haven't seen the episode, but damnit! Frackin' Digg ruined it for me. They killed my baby Starbuck.....

Come here you mother frackers!!!!!

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Friday, March 9, 2007 1:39 AM

CALHOUN


She'll be back... I guarantee it.

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Friday, March 9, 2007 1:51 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK


Hehe.... yeah, the Digg headline said that too. One can only hope.

Maybe she's..... no, it couldn't be true.

"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack

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Friday, March 9, 2007 4:22 AM

ISROUSRO


Neat trip to the BSG studio, with a little bit of the badger.

http://garfieldridge.typepad.com/garfieldridge/2007/03/two_days_of_coo
.html


passoniatetly indifferent

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Friday, March 9, 2007 4:57 AM

DERANGEDMILK


Thanks for the links Calfeeman!!!!!
-e

"Storms getting worse."
"We'll pass through it soon enough."

Vote for Firefly at http://richlabonte.net/tvvote/index.html

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Friday, March 9, 2007 7:15 PM

CALHOUN


What a classic! Edward Olmos add-libbing and smashing that very expensive old sailing ship model.. his face must have been red.

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