The Actual Chance of a BDS

POSTED BY: ubergeek
UPDATED: Friday, August 25, 2006 04:12
VIEWED: 24294
PAGE 1 of 1

UBERGEEK

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:47 AM

Hi all, im new to these forums (although not a new browncoat) and I wanted to get the popular *real* option of the chance of a BDS. Not being optimistic or pessimistic, just, real.

My personal Opinion is: If we don't get even an announcement form Universal by January (by then they would have more than enough time to think on the idea and gather the DVD sale data and decide on whether or not to green light a sequel.) Then *I* am giving up on trying to get some from of video with our BDH (now by all means I wish that Joss would continue his story, which it seems he is doing with more comics which is great and Im all for that)

But frankly, even if we wrote Universal 100,000 hand written letters saying we want more Serenity, With out the hard cold numbers and money backing up Serenity I would be willing to stake *a lot* of money that they *wold never* make a BDS (wether or not it was a Direct to DVD or not). And because Universal and Joss have been VERRY MUM on the DVD sales #'s it does not look good.

Additionally I have come to the conclusion that we will never get a series 2 of Firefly. It has been proven 2 times now that the viewer base just isn't there.

Sorry if I have made any body mad. It's Just that i've been really depressed that for so long there has been *no* word what so ever about a sequel.

Just my rant

bye now

KANEMAN

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:52 AM

UBer, I agree 100%..I think the numbers are getting better every day. I would love to know the updated Serenity sales myself...Does anyone have them?

CAPTURE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:01 AM

Hi ubergeek,

I feel your frustration, not hearing any thing tends to get one's hope down, however, even if we never see any Firefly again, at least we are all trying to bring something back that we passionetly love, and more then that we are bringing our community of Firefly fans together. Some where out there we are being heard, and even though we may not be heard by the "right people" who can give us what we want, we are being heard. Don't forget it took quit some time between the series ending and the BDM to come out, so one year with out news of a BDS is really not a big damn deal.

Don't lose the faith ubergeek, we have each other, we have Joss, the potential is there!!!

And if that's not enough for you check out the fan made parody of Firefly "Mosiquito". It is utterly hilirious, and should hopefully put a smile on your face! And it also shows how hard we're all still working!

Welcome to FFF.net and welcome to our family,were glad you came! Hope you like it here
as much as we do!

XOXOXOXO

Capture

P.S. you can see "Mosquito" on youtube, I'll even find the link for you!

ain't had nothing
twixt my nethers...weren't run on batteries.
Yup...still single...

CAPTURE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:05 AM

Hi again ubergeek,

Here is that "Mosquito" link I promised!

Hope you enjoy it!

Capture

ain't had nothing
twixt my nethers...weren't run on batteries.
Yup...still single...

ZZETTA13

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:14 AM

UBERGEER,first of all welcome if you're new.

Second, you may be very right but the day I give up on getting any more Joss/verse will be the day I stop coming to FFF.net

Just an update around my home. We have become interested in a couple other tv series that are still in production. These shows are good. The acting is good and the situations are interesting. But at the same time they are no Firefly. This show was so good. The writting,action, special f/x and above all the acting can't be beat. The actors hitting their marks was so believable it blows my mind.There needs to be more.

Z,out

GUYWHOWANTSAFIREFLYOFHISOWN

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:21 AM

you can't give up hope, there WILL be more.

End of line.

LAUGHINGMUSE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ubergeek:
And because Universal and Joss have been VERRY MUM on the DVD sales #'s it does not look good.

I wonder if part of it doesn't stem from so many people who expect a second and third movie? They don't just want one. They expect it. Matrix got a trilogy. Star Wars got two trilogies. Many other movies got trilogies (whether or not they deserved them is material for several other threads.) So of course Serenity will get a trilogy. Right? Now give us the movie, dammit or we'll hold our breath!!!

Joss reportedly put a lot of personal and professional energy into Firefly: first into getting Fox to buy the series, then in shopping the series about town, then in getting Serenity greenlighted. From hints dropped throughout the official Serenity companion, and various interviews he's given the past year, I get the impression that he's a bit tired of fighting for Every. Last. Thing. Joss - any writer, actually - wants to be able to tell his stories the way he sees / hears them *without* having to prove his right to exist at every third step. Yet apparently he had to fight Fox to get the series on and keep it (relatively) free of alterations; and he had to reconfigure his story to fit into a two-hour epic-movie format as opposed to the longer, more richly detailed tales he seems to prefer to tell. When Joss got Universal to greenlight a Serenity feature film, he won. Sort of. Yes, he got to work with a cast he apparently enjoys, telling a story all of them apparently enjoy. But he still didn't get to tell his story. On top of that, he's been hearing demands for more-more-MORE for...what...at least a year now. When people thank you for telling your stories, and enthuse about them (and you), it feeds the soul. When people demand that you finish telling *your* stories to *their* satisfaction, it sours the thing a bit. Suddenly, you're not quite sharing the love any more. The one side demands - the other side provides. It becomes less of a shared labor of love and more of an obligation.

For my own part, the instant someone begins to expect something I'd otherwise give them freely - like my assistance with their web stuff, help cleaning up their house or running errands, or what have you - I suddenly begin to feel put upon. And cross. And rather vexed. (Okay, I turn into a petulant nelly.)

I don't know if that's how Joss feels about the situation; and I'm sure that if he got some kind of offer to produce a Firefly-universe audio-media somethingorothereth, he'd go for it. But possibly, Joss' and Universals' keeping mum on the DVD sales numbers is an attempt to stave off the waves of near-entitlement coming from a small portion of Firefly fandom.

Or maybe not. What do I know? I'm surmising like sixty. No fact above, just speculation and projection. Armchair quarterbacking. Pablum pop psychology. (Pablum Pop Psych. That looks like the name of a garage band...)

********************************************

That doom and gloom spewed forth, I think that it's possible that the studios could start taking the longer view and start using a "first season" as an initial marketing vehicle for a direct-to-DVD series. Or miniseries. I have no idea what changes in the production process might occur, if filming didn't have to adhere to the now-traditional yearly windows of August-to-April. I also don't know the profitability of broadcast versus DVD, so I have no idea how attractive such an additional venue might be to the studios. Still...I don't know that hopes for a movie, a miniseries, or a series are really set - one way or the other.

(Personally, I'm holding out hope for a miniseries or series. Movies are too short to tell everything properly; and comic books don't let all of them work together. Plus, if they're all working...vive la paycheque.)

A second series is possible. An audio series is possible. Comic books are, apparently, happening. This story may not continue immediately, it may only continue in comic book form, it may suddenly be taken into

KANEMAN

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:33 AM

I hope we don't come off as sounding like we are "demanding" anything of Joss. I would like to think he understands that we love his 'verse, are very thankful, and hope to have more in any form....

UBERGEEK

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:48 AM

To me it seems form interviews That Joss loves this verse. And it seemed that he would be close with Universal and would be constently checking to get updates on if it's going to happen. I would think (again form Joss's comments that I've read/seen) that if there was even a shimmer of hope he would mention it to his fans.

Oh, and I don't feel im entitled to Joss's story. If Joss comes out and says "You know what, The story is over. I feel happy with where it is an im not going to presue it any more" I would stop hoping for firefly. I would of course be bumbed that Firefly would be no more. But I would not get Irate and start saying "Joss took *my* story away form me" no I would just lett it pass. Cuase its Joss's story, and he is just sharing it.

This whole thing is a rant about how little info has been given to us. (not an angry rant mind you, just a kind "so, uh, whats going on?") I personly find It great that Joss is doing new comics. I love the fact that he still wants to coninue *his* story.

uh i think i covered it. but i'm going to re-read your poted again to see if there was anything i missed (nice posted btw LaughingMuse)

LAUGHINGMUSE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:49 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:
I hope we don't come off as sounding like we are "demanding" anything of Joss. I would like to think he understands that we love his 'verse, are very thankful, and hope to have more in any form....

From my own view, a very small percentage come off as demanding. I've seen people get publicly angry and cranky about Joss' decisions to do this or that - to the point that they type things like "I can't ever watch anything by Joss Whedon ever again because he killed/marooned/broke up thus-and-such character." If I had created something that I loved, and thought that others would love it too, I would be either saddened or outright pissed off to hear of comments like the above. (Keep in mind, I have no idea how Joss reacted /reacts when he hears about such things. I can only really know my own thoughts; and those only on alternate Wednesdays.)

On the other hand, I also think that he not only knows that there's a lot of love out here, but that he occasionally piles it up and rolls in it. I think that, as with nearly any other human, it sustains him to know that several someones get a real buzz out of a story he told.

---------------------------------
Mankind makes tools; we use them to augment our hands, arms and legs.
The computer augments the brain and this makes it very unpopular with totalitarians. - Charles J.C. Lyall

LAUGHINGMUSE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ubergeek:
To me it seems form interviews That Joss loves this verse. And it seemed that he would be close with Universal and would be constently checking to get updates on if it's going to happen. I would think (again form Joss's comments that I've read/seen) that if there was even a shimmer of hope he would mention it to his fans.

I do know that after I've worked on a trouble-prone project for a long time, I tend to get a bit tired of the fighting. I want to finish the project to a decent stopping point, rest, regroup, and then see if / how I'm going to resume the project. Joss might be resting when it comes to the Firefly series hopes, or he may simply be in 'stealth mode' to keep the pressure lighter on himself and any potential business partner(s). I have absotively no clue.

Quote:
Oh, and I don't feel im entitled to Joss's story. If Joss comes out and says "You know what, The story is over. I feel happy with where it is an im not going to presue it any more" I would stop hoping for firefly. I would of course be bumbed that Firefly would be no more. But I would not get Irate and start saying "Joss took *my* story away form me" no I would just lett it pass. Cuase its Joss's story, and he is just sharing it.

Your post didn't sound demanding, or outraged that you weren't being kept up-to-date, or anything extreme and possibly odd-glance-catching. (Thus far, no one in this thread has sounded anything other than in love with the 'verse, hopeful for more, and interested in any information that may happen to emerge...but not demanding or cranky.) I was just being a bit too general in my original reply. It's Lecturer's Disease. My teeth itch when various speculative fiction authors drop into that mode, yet I seem to inflict it on others readily enough.

Quote:
Originally posted by ubergeek:
(nice posted btw LaughingMuse)

Thanks! Apologies, though, for the length. (I've been AFK all weekend and am making up for lost time...)

---------------------------------
Mankind makes tools; we use them to augment our hands, arms and legs.
The computer augments the brain and this makes it very unpopular with totalitarians. - Charles J.C. Lyall

DARKFLY

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 8:09 AM

All these repy's made me almost cry realizing there maybe never a series or movie but we can't think like that we're Browncoats never give up...actually didn't the Browncoats try to win but failed even they were on the right side,that kinda sounds like us Browncoats.But we should never give up.

-------------------------------------------------------

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

DESKTOPHIPPIE

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 8:54 AM

Hi ubergeek, welcome to the board!

The guys here have already given you the facts, so I'm just adding my voice to darkfly's cheerful war cry. It was a loooong wait between the series and the movie, but the movie happened. We do the impossible, for we are mighty. Or more correctly Joss does the impossible since he's the mighty one. We know that Joss, the writers, the actors and the crew all fell in love with the verse. If any movie were going to get that impossible sequel it would be this one.

More animations available at http://desktophippie.googlepages.com

MICJWELCH

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 10:02 AM

Has anybody noticed the similarities between Star Trek and Firefly? Both were cancelled tv series that became movies. Star Trek has had - What? - Five series and going on eleven movies now? It took something like twelve years to get that first movie. For Firefly it took (I know someone will correct me if I'm wrong on this) I think two years. That first Star Trek movie SUCKED, and they overcame it. We have an awesome movie. I just had someone come up to me yesterday and tell me about how he saw Serenity. He only watched it because I won't shut up about it. He was not disappointed. The fan base will keep growing. I really feel that it is not a question of IF, but a question of WHEN.

Personally though, I don't want another movie. I'll take what I can get of course, but I would prefer either to continue the series or to have a mini-series. And I don't want to demand anything. I just want to give Joss Whedon a chance to finish what he started.

"We may experience some slight turbulence, and then... explode."

DARKFLY

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 11:53 AM

The only problem was the first Star Trek movie was very popular,not trying to put Serenity down but it didn't make that much money even though before it came out all the pre-screenings sold out in minutes or hours & it recieved excellent reviews especially in the UK every movie mag was giving it 5 stars apart from a few whic give it 4 stars.I think the reason it wasn't popular was actually partly Universal's fault they wanted to do something which no movie company does they tried to advertise by word of mouth instead of loads of advertising come on which option would get the most people into the cinema,it's pretty obvious.

-------------------------------------------------------

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

ZZETTA13

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 12:10 PM

There are some very good points made by all of the posts above. Like it was said Joss has been fighting for this show for a long time now. He may be getting tired. But we love the show as well so we're taking up the fight along with him. It's sad to think that a person can put so much of themselves into a work/project then be completely written off. It all came down to numbers. fox didn't have the viewer numbers and Universal didn't have the money numbers. Well I blame fox more that anyone. The viewer numbers were off not because ppl didn't like the show. It was only because they never found the show. It wasn't given a chance. Had there been a season two I think the Firefly series would have found it's audience and the viewer numbers would have increased by leaps and bounds. It makes me sad to know the cast and crew were given their death rites the night of their Holiday party.

Anyhoo now for a small victory. last night I was talking to my wife when my youngest son came in and said."Dad I'll watch some Firefly with you." I nearly dropped. We ended up watching the first dvd of the series and he loved it. Plans are to watch more tonight. We'll see what happens.

Z,out

DARKFLY

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 12:15 PM

That's the spirit but how old is your son cause not all the episodes are suitable for younger kids(like under 11).

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

CAUSAL

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 12:19 PM

My only frustration with the whole thing (and I'll not go in for doom and gloom in this thread) is that with only a couple of exceptions, the people that I've introduced Firefly to have loved it. They haven't become browncoat-wearing-fanatics like us, but they're definitely fans enough to go see a movie, were one offered. It's not the product that failed. It was the marketing.

*end transmission*

________________________________________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

CHRONICTHEHEDGEHOG

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 12:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Darkfly:
That's the spirit but how old is your son cause not all the episodes are suitable for younger kids(like under 11).

Really, you think so? I can't think of anything in the series that is particularily unsuitable for anyone.

-------------------------------------------------

I do not kill with my hand.
He who kills with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I kill with my heart.

DARKFLY

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 12:50 PM

I've edited this post cause it's got nothing to do with the orginal idea but if you want to talk about what's suitable & all that go to this link
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=23113&m=361252#361252

Remember it's only my view so you don't have to take it so seriously.

-------------------------------------------------------

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

CHRONICTHEHEDGEHOG

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 1:05 PM

I'm gonna start a new topic on 'is firefly suitable for kids' as it's way off topic. I'd be interested to hear your responses over there tho.

-------------------------------------------------

I do not kill with my hand.
He who kills with his hand has forgotten the face of his father.
I kill with my heart.

SIMONWHO

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 2:07 PM

I think we can agree our chances of a sequel reside mostly with Joss and how strong his desire is to continue the franchise.

Fortunately/unfortunately there is a clear signal that will tell us when he's given up - as the cast have said elsewhere, if nothing more is going to happen, they'll tell us the secrets of the show - what Book's past was, what Inara was running from, what was Nathan wearing under that dress... they'll tell us all. I hope they do it via a medium like a comic book or an approved novel but whichever way it comes, there's still hope until those secrets get spilled.

THEDUKE333

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:39 PM

Hello All,
I lurk every day, but i thought I'd weigh in now. I personally believe we wont be seeing any video form of Firefly/Serenity again. Comics for sure and possibly books in our verse (which I'll buy) but not a new series,mini-series or movie. I know this is not a popular theory and I will get flamed, but I dont think I'm alone in this belief.
Do I want to see more movies or a new series? It scares me how much I want that! But from every interview from the cast and from everything Joss has said, I believe it's over in video form.
From non-fans looking at Joss's resume Firefly was a failure. His directorial debut was so-so. Now not the quality, but being measured by the only thing that matters....money. I met Joss on set when i was an extra and then I saw him again at one of the browncoat screenings months later. He literally was 20 pounds lighter. Stress is fun and all but it was physically taking a toll on him. He has moved on and Wonder Women and Goners and X-men comics are plenty.
Until all of that is gone and someone comes to him and offers him a chance to do another movie, he isnt persuing this anymore (IMO) Which unfortunately is unlikely, because when the bean counters add up all the proceeds,I feel the movie will just come in the black.
Yes I'm bummed that crappy movies are getting sequels, but that just reminds me that the first one must have made money and the bean counters feel they can make more.
It has been a wonderful ride and i will also cherish how lucky I was. I do sleep better knowing that Joss Whedon is still alive and using that imagination of his. So I will just have to look forward to his next creation.

Sorry for being so long winded,

TheDuke333

KANEMAN

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 3:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Darkfly:
That's the spirit but how old is your son cause not all the episodes are suitable for younger kids(like under 11).

Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

I agree It's really the "whoring" thing. Most six year olds have seen Star Wars and understand about death in SCI-Fi movies..Problem is in FF the characters seem more "real". In my experience the same child who can watch Obiwan get lightsabered and not ask a question about it, does not see Mal kicking a guy through a moving engine the same way. Why is that?

DARKFLY

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:00 PM

I've edited this post cause it's got nothing to do with the orginal idea but if you want to talk about what's suitable & all that go to this link
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=23113&m=361252#361252

Remember it's only my view so you don't have to take it so seriously.

-------------------------------------------------
Go to http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697 for more info!

Things are about to get interesting...Define interesting...Oh GOD oh GOD we're all going to die.

ZZETTA13

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:11 PM

DARKFLY not to be alarmed, I know where you're coming from with the age thing and I agree, but my son(the youngest) is 19. His older brother is 21. I've just about got my older son and his girlfriend roped into watching the pilot eps with me. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Hopefuly when I set the hook it will be hook, line and sinker (in fishing terms). They'll want to watch the rest.

CASUAL and THEDUKE333 I agree with you guys. Well somewhat. CASUAL, yep there are many browncoats,Ok not exactly brown but beige maybe. These folk love Firefly/Serenity just not to the point of joining forums and participating in browncoat events (My wife being one). They would/could be interested in seeing a sequel or more FF.

THEDUKE333,some good points, but I hope you're wrong. Comics are one thing and I do pick some up from my friends bookshop. But lets hope for the return of work for the actors. Maybe that's living in a fantasy world but hey, what about the Star Wars, Star Trek, Aliens and all the other fandoms. Escapism has no limits. I'm wishing for a co-zillionare to step forward and tell these studios that he (or she) will bankroll our next round of FF. I'll bet said richie wouldn't loose any money.I'll even throw in the mudders milk free of charge. Now if I win the lotto,no worries. If someone sees Joss tell him to go ahead and send me Inara's phone number

Z

DINALT

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 4:16 PM

I think there's actually a very good chance of another series, as Fox at least must be aware of the huge sales in the DVD market.

But, the big question is whether the original cast will be available when the day comes.
As they all move onto other projects, or start breaking into the movie market, are they going to have time to commit to another 'x' amount of episodes. (And more importantly, as 'star' values rise, will the producers be able to afford them?).
That isn't to try and sound negative, but if (or when) Firefly's resurrected, will it ever be the same show as before?

It also depends greatly on whether Joss will have the time to be actively involved, or whether others will take the show over. Been the subject of another thread, but if you've ever watched Andromeda, the quality is good - up until the point RHW left. Then it just became another sci-fi series - had its good moments, but never really recaptured its energy properly.

I think as others have mentioned, Universal didn't publicise Serenity nearly enough. It was great that they payrolled the movie, but without great advertising to back it up, it was always going to be a 'must see' more for fans. It's gathering pace in the DVD market, but whether sales justify Universal making a sequel, only time will tell.
Personally, and this is only my opinion, I think it was a mistake making a movie. Serenity's a great film, as befits an excellent series, but condensing what could've been a whole series into 1 hour 54 minutes meant a lot of detail being left out.
Even in the extras on the DVD, I get the impression that Joss regretted this as well, particularly having to cut certain scenes to keep the movie flowing.
It was a real tragedy that Universal didn't (or couldn't) go with at least a 4 part mini series. I guess Fox have the rights nicely stitched up as regards that.

So to end on a positive, I think there's every chance of a new series. But whether it'll be the same as the show we know and love is in the lap of the gods. We may even end up with Firefly - The Next Generation, with none of the original cast at all!!!
I know that isn't a popular outlook (hell, it's not even an outlook I like), but it's just trying to be realistic. There's nothing I'd love more than another 120+ episodes with the original cast AND Joss at the helm, but I don't see that happening at the moment.

All we can do, as virtually everyone says, is spread the word, get more fans involved, and show the studios that Firefly's a very viable proposition.
And to do that, we'd probably need a head count of how many Firefly/Serenity fans there actually are. This is probably the biggest board in terms of members, but there must be many more fans out there who haven't joined.
I think I remember reading once (re: Star Trek being cancelled), that the studios used to view each fan letter received as counting as 100 people. I guess the rationale behind this was that many people can love a show, but few bother to write in. In that case, a rough calculation shows that there may be 2,100,000 fans, using the member count on here alone. My guess is it's much higher than that.
May be accurate, may not, but it does make you think. It's a shame there's no way of pooling all the Firefly sites members, removing duplicate members, and coming up with an overall figure.
If we could go to Fox/Universal and say we have 'x' number of fans still actively posting, it might make them sit up and listen.

11THHOUR

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:26 PM

If there's money to be made, a studio will make a production. It's true that the box office returns for Serenity were lower than hoped for. (There are several legitimate arguments regarding the promotion, or perhaps insufficiency thereof, which can be made in that regard... but that's another thread topic.) The thing is that there are now far more Firefly/Serenity fans now than there were last year when Serenity was released. Serenity itself created those new fans... plus the word of mouth of existing fans and very real Firefly and Serenity DVD sales that continue quite well on Amazon.

The reason why fans have a legitimate hope for sequels is that the cast all signed 3 picture contracts with Universal for Serenity. Their contracts all have a built-in clause for a trilogy.

Joss wants to tell more stories of the 'Verse, he has stated that he has hundreds of yet untold stories. The cast love playing their roles, and they genuinely enjoy working together. The fans of course will respond immediately to more incarnations of the 'Verse. Though Serenity did not make huge profits when it was released, and low numbers were the story for all movies released during that same time, Serenity did receive overwhelmingly great reviews and many awards.

So here's where it's at:

• Joss wants to do more.
• The cast want to do more.
• The fans are aching to have more.
• The production itself was widely acclaimed.

The ONLY thing missing from the above formula for green lighting a sequel is "Great box office returns". That's it. Just comes down to getting bigger audience numbers... connecting more with main stream audiences. A studio wants to make money. They are not going to say "no" to a profitable franchise. The thing is, Serenity's profits weren't that bad, and the movie has climbed into profit with the DVD sales. But the returns weren't in the blockbuster range, and Universal has to think how best to utilize their wonderful new acquisition: Joss Whedon.

Universal has a highly valuable resource in getting Joss under contract. They feel at this point that Joss working on a production that has a built-in familiarity with the public, like Wonder Woman, and is a far easier "sell" promotion-wise, is a great way to use his talents... profit-wise. Super hero movies, using highly established and popular characters, are practically guaranteed huge money makers. Can you blame Universal for wanting to turn their brilliant new acquisition loose on a super hero franchise that is tailor made for his sensibilities? Of course not. So Universal wants to direct his talents in that direction for a while... and make some big bucks. Well, good for them! ('course, it's frustrating for we who want more Serenity, NOW... )

Universal is most likely biding its time and seeing how things develop after the release of Serenity. If the fan base keeps growing, if the DVD sales stay strong, if the merchandise keeps selling, then there will be good reason for them to mount another production in the future. Again, they are a busines and they want to make money.

Once they see that the audience numbers justify another investment, Universal will be glad to press that green light.

11th Hour

P.S.
I personally would prefer some type of return to a series on TV, even if the seasons were shorter like the shows on HBO. Firefly/Serenity really bloom when they have the space and time to expand the stories and explore the characters. Remember, Universal owns the Sci-Fi Network so they do have a built-in way to distribute their television productions.

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

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UBERGEEK

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:41 PM

The problem with the reason that I think a new series won't be made is because Joss refuses to work with fox again. And I would bet that Fox has full controll of the rights and probbaly wont sell them.

And yes, It did take some time for Serenity to be made. But usualy (and im talking generalities here) Sequels are *announced* in the first year or a little after. In the terms of a movie, The more time Passes Is a bad thing. As Dinalt wrote, the actors wont allways beable to do a movie. They Might be doing other things.

Reading interviews from the Actors and Joss, it looks like they are loosing hope. And not because of the fan base, which is always growing. Because I think they are sick of waiting for the movie, and I think that Joss (as this has been said before) I getting sick of fighting just to tell his story.

I remember seeing an Interview with Adam Baldwin. He stated that the *earlyist* that they could start production of the film would be 2008. And even that date wouldnt be certain. Cause you would have to wait or the actors to all be avalable.

Its not a question of giving up hope. Its a question of math.

WHITEFALL

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 5:52 PM

Totally agree with 11th hour, but one thing i'd like to state, restate, cause it seems to be missing from the thread.

JOSS. IS. BUSY. AT THE MOMENT.

He is signed up to write Wonder Woman, and then he is doing a seperate project, Goners. That means, he cant do more firefly or serenity until he's finished those.

Quite frankly, I'm happy for him, happy for all of us. If wonder woman is a big success (and I really think it will be: it's got the male demographic from being a super hero wearing not much, it's got the women for being a woman super hero, it's got the fans of WW, it's got browncoats, and who knows, if word gets out it's being written by a feminist, we might even get some of the older folk), then Joss will be really cool. He'll be "Joss Whedon of Wonder Woman fame". Now I know we wanted him to have that from Serenity, but it was an unknown franchise, with unknown actors, and it was badly marketed. O, and here's another thing, I'm almost positive of:

Serenity DID break even, with about 25mil domestic, about 13mil world, and a ton more from DVDs, they did make their money back, and Uni is making profit. So a sequel isnt out the door. And they must understand that Serenity will make even more fans.

So, the way I see it, Joss is on a major project that markets itself (something Serenity couldnt do) plus maybe having a real marketing campaign, he'll raise in respectability, and that might even carry goners to success. If those work out, he'll have more freedom to do stuff, and frankly, if there is a serenity sequel, he could carry the ads better as "the writer/director of WW".

So that's my hopeful vision. It means waiting a few more years and all, but it's hopeful.

"But, these strong women characters?"

"Why aren't you asking 100 other guys why they don't write strong women characters?" -Joss Whedon

KANEMAN

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 6:10 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Whitefall:
Totally agree with 11th hour, but one thing i'd like to state, restate, cause it seems to be missing from the thread.

JOSS. IS. BUSY. AT THE MOMENT.

He is signed up to write Wonder Woman, and then he is doing a seperate project, Goners. That means, he cant do more firefly or serenity until he's finished those.

Quite frankly, I'm happy for him, happy for all of us. If wonder woman is a big success (and I really think it will be: it's got the male demographic from being a super hero wearing not much, it's got the women for being a woman super hero, it's got the fans of WW, it's got browncoats, and who knows, if word gets out it's being written by a feminist, we might even get some of the older folk), then Joss will be really cool. He'll be "Joss Whedon of Wonder Woman fame". Now I know we wanted him to have that from Serenity, but it was an unknown franchise, with unknown actors, and it was badly marketed. O, and here's another thing, I'm almost positive of:

Serenity DID break even, with about 25mil domestic, about 13mil world, and a ton more from DVDs, they did make their money back, and Uni is making profit. So a sequel isnt out the door. And they must understand that Serenity will make even more fans.

So, the way I see it, Joss is on a major project that markets itself (something Serenity couldnt do) plus maybe having a real marketing campaign, he'll raise in respectability, and that might even carry goners to success. If those work out, he'll have more freedom to do stuff, and frankly, if there is a serenity sequel, he could carry the ads better as "the writer/director of WW".

So that's my hopeful vision. It means waiting a few more years and all, but it's hopeful.

"But, these strong women characters?"

I hope you are right. I just have a bad feeling about Wonder Woman and the box office. I try to start a buzz amongst my guy friends and they could care less. These are the same guys who talked about upcoming titles Hulk, Superman, Batman, Daredevil etc, endlessly... One could look at Electra for a positive outcome for Joss. But even that was so-so. And to be honest I don't think doing a serious Super hero movie is what he is good at. I know he does a great job with women characters. But most of the beauty in his work lies in the witty and comical dialogue...that will not work in Wonder Woman. I only bring this up because I believe the future of FF in motion pictures relies on Joss not having another "flop"..It will be back to TV land. And the death of FireFly.

11THHOUR

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 6:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ubergeek:
The problem with the reason that I think a new series won't be made is because Joss refuses to work with fox again. And I would bet that Fox has full controll of the rights and probbaly wont sell them.

How do you know FOX wouldn't be willing to strike some deal? If the price was attractive enough, they could be persuaded to sell. Maybe Universal wouldn't have to buy the rights, some type of profit sharing with FOX could be worked out.

It's quite possible that something could be worked out. If FOX were totally unwilling to make deals, they never would have allowed Joss to shop the project around after Firefly was cancelled.

Quote:
And yes, It did take some time for Serenity to be made. But usualy (and im talking generalities here) Sequels are *announced* in the first year or a little after. In the terms of a movie, The more time Passes Is a bad thing. As Dinalt wrote, the actors wont allways beable to do a movie. They Might be doing other things.

It can get tricky to coordinate the schedules of several different actors. But actors are always moving from job to job, arrangements can be made. The thing is, these actors love playing these roles so they are highly motivated to rework their schedules. Roles like these come around so very rarely. The chance to play such memorable characters, written extraordinarily well, is worth the effort to make happen.

As for the timing of when sequels are announced... not sure just how much any "rules" apply to Firefly/Serenity. This also isn't your standard Hollywood franchise. The next incarnation of the 'Verse may very well likely not be the regular way studios do things.

Quote:
Reading interviews from the Actors and Joss, it looks like they are loosing hope. And not because of the fan base, which is always growing. Because I think they are sick of waiting for the movie, and I think that Joss (as this has been said before) I getting sick of fighting just to tell his story.

Joss has stated that the next time he is the one who will need to be approached. He wants to continue the 'Verse, and it's understandable that he doesn't want to keep fighting to the degree that he has. It would be too exhausting, and too much of an expense of physical and psychic energy over the long haul. Makes total sense for him to move to the position where he is the one to be approached. He's also allowing the audience and popularity of the 'Verse to speak for itself.

Quote:
I remember seeing an Interview with Adam Baldwin. He stated that the *earlyist* that they could start production of the film would be 2008. And even that date wouldnt be certain. Cause you would have to wait or the actors to all be avalable.

Isn't so much that a studio must "wait" for them to be available so much as "plan" for it. With enough lead-in time the actors can make adjustments to their schedules.

Who knows, it might be the case that many of the actors will have hit a period where the roles they're considering are just not that exciting to them. They could be thrilled to make time in their schedule to return to the roles, as Joss has said, "they were born to play".

Quote:
Its not a question of giving up hope. Its a question of math.

Things can be arranged... you just gotta be good at math.

11th Hour

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11THHOUR

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 6:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Whitefall:
Totally agree with 11th hour, but one thing i'd like to state, restate, cause it seems to be missing from the thread.

JOSS. IS. BUSY. AT THE MOMENT.

He is signed up to write Wonder Woman, and then he is doing a seperate project, Goners. That means, he cant do more firefly or serenity until he's finished those.

A valid point. But Joss has stated that the next Serenity movie would be directed by Tim Minear.

Joss doesn't have to be a fully hands on with the next incarnations of the 'Verse. He has outstanding people who have worked with him for years to take up some of the roles that he did. Joss would remain at the helm, guiding everything, but he wouldn't have to be as totally emersed as he was with Serenity.

11th Hour

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DINALT

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 7:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:
I hope you are right. I just have a bad feeling about Wonder Woman and the box office. I try to start a buzz amongst my guy friends and they could care less. These are the same guys who talked about upcoming titles Hulk, Superman, Batman, Daredevil etc, endlessly... One could look at Electra for a positive outcome for Joss. But even that was so-so. And to be honest I don't think doing a serious Super hero movie is what he is good at. I know he does a great job with women characters. But most of the beauty in his work lies in the witty and comical dialogue...that will not work in Wonder Woman. I only bring this up because I believe the future of FF in motion pictures relies on Joss not having another "flop"..It will be back to TV land. And the death of FireFly.

100% in agreement with you there. I hope it does work out, and Wonder Woman's a great success.
But I also get the feeling that it could be a box office disaster, as I've talked to people like you, who were totally psyched about other superhero movies - but couldn't care less about WW.
And maybe I'm the only one here, lol, but I'll stick my neck on the block and say Wonder Woman was never really superhero material in my book anyway. (I just know I'll get stick for that, lol, but just being honest - other female superheroes yes, Electra, Storm etc. were all believable).
But I always found WW to be way too Kitsch, and never really took it seriously. Maybe the comics were better, but the TV series was as corny as Buck Rogers imho.
Maybe the movie will change my mind, but there's only so much you can do with what you're given - even a supremely talented guy like Joss. I think the only way I'd take it seriously, is if it was a lot darker than the series, and she dressed in a full body costume (as opposed to just being a male fantasy figure).
Maybe it'll work out great, but at the back of my mind, I suspect WW's popularity had more to do with a great body in a skimpy outfit - much as most people remember Erin Grays tightfitting outfits in Buck Rogers, lol.
Unpopular thoughts maybe, but I wish they'd given Joss a different project to work on.

EMPXENU

Tuesday, August 15, 2006 7:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
Universal has a highly valuable resource in getting Joss under contract. They feel at this point that Joss working on a production that has a built-in familiarity with the public, like Wonder Woman, and is a far easier "sell" promotion-wise, is a great way to use his talents... profit-wise. Super hero movies, using highly established and popular characters, are practically guaranteed huge money makers. Can you blame Universal for wanting to turn their brilliant new acquisition loose on a super hero franchise that is tailor made for his sensibilities? Of course not. So Universal wants to direct his talents in that direction for a while... and make some big bucks. Well, good for them! ('course, it's frustrating for we who want more Serenity, NOW... )

Universal isn't making Wonder Woman. Warner Bros is, since Time Warner owns DC.

----
"As far as we can discern, the sole purpose of human existence is to kindle a light of meaning in the darkness of mere being" - Carl Jung

WINDSTRUCK

Thursday, August 17, 2006 7:21 AM

WB is making the Wonder Woman movie.
I would bet that Universal is indeed banking on WWs success and of Joss Whedon's successful silver screen adaptation of the heroine if ever they would think to make another Serenity Movie. Universal does have a contract with the actors for a possible trilogy.

If Joss succeeds in WW, there will be a bigger chance for a Serenity sequel. Joss will prove that he is "bankable". He'll also prove that he does not only make quality films (that we love), but makes money-making films as well.

Joss is writing mad for WW. And it is a hard write-up. The character is very limited and has been incarnate, re-incarnated, re-introduced, killed, revived so many times. Heck! That would be so hard to write.

I bet Joss is thinking the same way. He wants to get this one on the money, but with the best quality he could give it.

Wonder Woman is his good chance to get another good chance.

I dread that this movie will fail terribly because this might prove disastrous to the possibility of a SERENITY SEQUEL and to the TV/Movie career of Joss.

THE SEQUEL

Nathan was asked about firefly going back to TV in the sci-fi channel. He reponded, "Can they (sci-fi channel) afford it?"
That got me thinking. Was he talking about the rights to the show or the cost of the production? Maybe both.

I am ruling out the possibility of another TV series (although I'd want more).

I'd go for a movie sequel. As I stated above, I hope that Joss Whedon's Wonder Woman will be a super success, and we get another chance for a Serenity sequel. I want more Book and Wash in it.

Does it necessarily have to apply that in the sequel, Book and Wash will have to be gone?

POINT

If Joss proved succesful in his next venture into the silver screen, he will not need to fight for everything. The execs will be the one fighting to get him.

He might even gain back the pounds he lost.

AGENTRUSCO

Thursday, August 17, 2006 8:05 AM

So here's my two cents: I am obsessive with Firefly. I love the show. I love the comics that bridged. I love Serenity (though I won't lie that I was somewhat dissapointed.) I want things to continue. I want people to know about this thing. It is my main goal to recruit new browncoats. That said, I really don't much want this to become some huge deal. The very fact that Firefly is the underdog is what draws me to it. I've been a Lord of the Rings fan... but that's so commonplace now that the films are out. So I searched elsewhere. Firefly is the comunity we make it. We are the hangers-on, the hopeless hopers in a sense. And I'm fine with that.

Let's just leave it that I'm confused. I want more, but at the same time I'm content...

AgentRusco out.

______________________________
I cannot abide useless people.

UBERGEEK

Thursday, August 17, 2006 8:12 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Windstruck:

Nathan was asked about firefly going back to TV in the sci-fi channel. He reponded, "Can they (sci-fi channel) afford it?"
That got me thinking. Was he talking about the rights to the show or the cost of the production? Maybe both.

Now what im about to say I have no proof of (excpet the fact that I read it somewhere)

SciFi, in order to purchse *production* rights to Firefly would be in the millions. And making the Series is expensive as well. I read that the Serenity Piolt episode cost 8.9 million cashy money to make. and each episode after that was anywhere from 1-3 million. (again I cant back up these numbers. All i know is i read these, and just cant remeber where)

This would be one expencive show to make.

Now, A mini series would be possible for HBO or Showtime. But Joss said that people have to approch him if they want Firefly 2/Serenity 2 made. So, if we can prove (which would be damn near impossable, but hey we are known for doing the impossable) to HBO/Showtime that a seccond season of Firefly would be proffitable. Now how we would go about proving that it would be profitable, that is a chalange.

(forgive any horrendous spelling mistakes I have made. I am a very bad speller and usualy wright anything I am going to post in a Text Editor. but its 1:08 AM and im a little to lazy to do that right now)

Bye all

MICJWELCH

Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Windstruck:

Nathan was asked about firefly going back to TV in the sci-fi channel. He reponded, "Can they (sci-fi channel) afford it?"
That got me thinking. Was he talking about the rights to the show or the cost of the production? Maybe both.

I watch a few shows on the Sci-Fi channel quite often, and there is no way that production costs for Firefly would be more than the Stargate series that are on. There's some fancy stuff in there. And some big expensive sets. And I don't know that the actors would cost more than Richard Dean Anderson. So I would have to guess that it's the initial costs that would be the problem.

"We may experience some slight turbulence, and then... explode."

11THHOUR

Thursday, August 17, 2006 5:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by EmpXenu:
Universal isn't making Wonder Woman. Warner Bros is, since Time Warner owns DC.

Oops.

As I keep discovering, I get too emersed in work and continue to only absorb about half of what I read and hear...

Still, the part about Universal waiting until they see that the audience for the 'Verse is holding strong and growing, before they invest in any future incarnations of Serenity, still applies.

It's still Universal, right?

11th Hour

P.S.

I also still entertain the notion that the rights for Firefly may not have to be bought outright. Universal might be able to work some kind of licensing deal with 20th Century FOX, or profit sharing, or something. We're entering a period where studios are beginning to really rethink how to create and deliver entertainment, and how to come up with new business strategies.

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FERT1

Thursday, August 17, 2006 6:56 PM

I don't think the Firefly verse is dead. Joss loves it too much, and many fans are downright rabid about it. However, I think it will most likely be continued in book or graphic novel form.

I know this is not going to be a popular opinion, but I feel it is realistic. I don't think the numbers are there for a sequel or more episodes. Even a lot of Sci-Fi fans seem to just not get this show for some reason. I personally know people that have seen it and hated it. I cannot for the life of me fathom why, but that's reality. I think it's too clever for some people.

Don't get me wrong, I would be absoutely ecstatic to learn of a sequel or more episodes, but at this point, it doesn't seem very likely.

DINALT

Thursday, August 17, 2006 7:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Fert1:
I don't think the Firefly verse is dead. Joss loves it too much, and many fans are downright rabid about it. However, I think it will most likely be continued in book or graphic novel form.

I know this is not going to be a popular opinion, but I feel it is realistic. I don't think the numbers are there for a sequel or more episodes. Even a lot of Sci-Fi fans seem to just not get this show for some reason. I personally know people that have seen it and hated it. I cannot for the life of me fathom why, but that's reality. I think it's too clever for some people.

Don't get me wrong, I would be absoutely ecstatic to learn of a sequel or more episodes, but at this point, it doesn't seem very likely.

Not met anyone yet that hated it, but I guess everyone likes different things. I never really got into Star Wars *runs quickly before being mobbed*

It's difficult though when it comes to numbers justifying a new series/movie, because how many FF fans are there ?? Obviously there are the die hard fans who post here, but how many others are out there and never join a board or post ?
I think there are a lot more fans that nobody even knows exist, although they must be buying the DVDs at least if sales are anything to go by.

I think there's still a good chance of at least another movie, and hope there's a new series (although thinking logically, that doesn't look promising at the moment).
The only problem I have with the movies, is that they'll probably conclude the video side of FF.
With 2 characters already being killed off in Serenity, and Mal's actions probably putting him on the Alliances 'most wanted' list, I'm guessing the movies will more or less end it.
And with most of Serenitys safe houses cleaned out by the Operative, there isn't really anywhere for them to get support.

11THHOUR

Thursday, August 17, 2006 9:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Fert1:
I don't think the Firefly verse is dead. Joss loves it too much, and many fans are downright rabid about it. However, I think it will most likely be continued in book or graphic novel form.

I know this is not going to be a popular opinion, but I feel it is realistic. I don't think the numbers are there for a sequel or more episodes. Even a lot of Sci-Fi fans seem to just not get this show for some reason. I personally know people that have seen it and hated it. I cannot for the life of me fathom why, but that's reality. I think it's too clever for some people.

Don't get me wrong, I would be absoutely ecstatic to learn of a sequel or more episodes, but at this point, it doesn't seem very likely.

Very valid points.

However...

Being one of the veteran Browncoats, who helped do the impossible, I gotta say... "realistic" and "likely" weren't much a part of our vocabulary.

11th Hour

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PEULSAR5

Friday, August 18, 2006 9:21 AM

Both of you make very valid points.

I agree the 'verse will most likely continue on in print form of one kind or another. Earlier posters pointed out the numbers weren't there for a sequel and I agree it is highly unlikely there will be another big-screen movie made. However, since Browncoats have kept the BDM and even more amazingly the BDS in the top 50 on Amazon for the last several years, a film studio may see a direct-to-dvd movie as more financially viable option. Joss could certainly turn the reigns over to Tim Minnear, Marti Noxon or others he has worked with in the past that will stay true to his vision of the show. And we CERTAINLY would consume mass quantities.

ARBAS

Friday, August 18, 2006 10:23 AM

I see it taking maybe 5/6 years before anything happens. In that time we see Joss, Tim, Jane, the BDH etc etc making bigger and bigger names for themselves and money for the studios while the FF/Serenity fanbase maintains the 'verse through fanfiction, conventions, merchandise etc etc that's enough time for the series to move from genre cult status to classic TV status at that point maybe the money men will show some interest :D

EMPXENU

Friday, August 18, 2006 11:11 AM

I read this newspiece at IMDB and it gave me just a small bit of - perhaps unfounded but still - comfort:

"Universal Studios has discovered that sometimes it makes more sense to release a sequel to a modestly successful movie directly to DVD than distribute it first to theaters, the Los Angeles Daily News observed today (Thursday). The newspaper noted that the studio's 2000 film about cheerleaders, Bring It On, starring Kirsten Dunst, has already spawned two DVD-only sequels. Its latest, Bring It On: All or Nothing, reportedly sold 750,000 copies in its first week, generating $12 million in sales. In addition, it earned $3.8 million in rentals. The first sequel, Bring It On Again, sold 500,000 in its first week. Last December, it noted a sequel to American Pie, titled American Pie Presents: Band Camp, registered 1-million sales. Craig Kornblau, president of Universal Studios Home Entertainment, told the newspaper, "It's all about creating a line of product that is of theatrical level quality based on properties that have tremendous demand."

----
"As far as we can discern, the sole purpose of human existence is to kindle a light of meaning in the darkness of mere being" - Carl Jung

ESTHER

Friday, August 18, 2006 11:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11th Hour:

Being one of the veteran Browncoats, who helped do the impossible, I gotta say... "realistic" and "likely" weren't much a part of our vocabulary.

OK, you veteran, I only joined this month, SO WHAT CAN WE DO NOW? What did you do then? And how can we go further? Whom to address? Is buying the DVD sets and giving them to friends enough? I could also give the money directly to a fund ... is there any? Like "fans buy a TV series"? I mean, 3 Million US$ for one episode - with 50.000 fans that would make 60 bucks each (don't know, how many fans are there, but a DVD set in Germany costs abour 60 $). And someone paid over 3.000 $ for the Sereinity script (well, of course he got something of value for his money, but still ...)

Aaaaah, just feeling so helpless!

It's fascinating, though, how as a fan you can just re-enact Mals frustration as a Browncoat and all. I guess, that's somewhat part of the connection between the fans and the 'Verse ...

Esther

Love my captain!

DINALT

Friday, August 18, 2006 2:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Esther:
Quote:
Originally posted by 11th Hour:

Being one of the veteran Browncoats, who helped do the impossible, I gotta say... "realistic" and "likely" weren't much a part of our vocabulary.

OK, you veteran, I only joined this month, SO WHAT CAN WE DO NOW? What did you do then? And how can we go further? Whom to address? Is buying the DVD sets and giving them to friends enough? I could also give the money directly to a fund ... is there any? Like "fans buy a TV series"? I mean, 3 Million US$ for one episode - with 50.000 fans that would make 60 bucks each (don't know, how many fans are there, but a DVD set in Germany costs abour 60 $). And someone paid over 3.000 $ for the Sereinity script (well, of course he got something of value for his money, but still ...)

Aaaaah, just feeling so helpless!

It's fascinating, though, how as a fan you can just re-enact Mals frustration as a Browncoat and all. I guess, that's somewhat part of the connection between the fans and the 'Verse ...

Esther

Love my captain!

That's more or less exactly how I feel. It would be nice to have some kind of cohesive campaign, rather than just wishful thinking.
And that isn't being negative, but it would be nice to have a concerted campaign, rather than just keep buying everything that's out there.

The problem with that, least imho, is how many fans can afford to keep buying DVD sets they already have ?

I know affordability doesn't come into a fans normal vocabulary, but are Fox showing any signs of relenting and resurrecting the series from DVD sales ?
I know it's a good way of letting Fox know that fans are still out there, but do we know Fox really care ?
We know Universal released Serenity, but the film hardly set the box office on fire. This is at least partly due to Universals marketing, but it did receive great reviews from the press - and still failed to do much.

So I'm guessing that if we want it back at all, we've got to be looking at something like "fans buy a TV series"?, as you suggested in your post. And the big question is how many fans can afford $60+ per episode at least.
I know this site's been mentioned in a few threads, and got a fairly lukewarm reception:

http://www.fireflyseason2.com/index.asp

But at least they're trying to see how much interest is out there, and that's really what we all should be doing.
I use that site purely as an illustrative example, but if we really want FF back on screen, then I think it's going to take money. And the beauty of that site is it's like a pledge bank - there's no commitment unless they're successful.

As I've kept saying, I'd love a new series or movie, but the series doesn't look likely unless a miracle happens. The movie may happen, but that's entirely down to Universal.
I really don't think Fox are going to resurrect FF, or they'd be showing some signs of doing so by now - particularly after Serenity.
So the only thing that DVD sales are doing is lining Fox's pockets at the moment.
Let's get thinking and get a real campaign together, where we know our money WILL bring back FF, rather than hoping.

Damn, just re-read the post, and it comes across kinda strong. Apologies for that folks, but I think it's going to take something strong to win this time 'round.

JOLLY

Friday, August 18, 2006 4:57 PM

Quote:

Last December, it noted a sequel to American Pie, titled American Pie Presents: Band Camp, registered 1-million sales.

Band Camp had an estimated budget of $7 mil. The original Bring It On had an estimated budget of $10 mil; this suggests to me that the budget of the sequels are somewhat below this figure. I suspect that for the time being, direct-to-DVD releases will be based on fairly low budget productions, where modest sales can recoup costs.

Could Serenity 2 be released under this framework? I honestly don't know. Presumably existing sets could be used, which would reduce the production costs below the $39 m figure for the BDM.

The problem with these kinds of discussions is that there is too much of the business side we simply don't know to engage in meaningful speculation. And as a fan, I don't really see why I should know it. I saw the movie twice in the theatres, bought the DVDs, bought some of the other merchandise. I've voted with my dollars for more of the product. The problem is that there are not enough other like-minded people.

I don't really believe a letter to an executive will make any difference. I don't know if the sales of the DVDs of the movie or the series are close to some critical value, so that I should buy copies I don't need to pull the trigger. I've encouraged everyone I know to watch the show...the majority enjoyed it, and then moved on. I'm moving on...BUT, if there is a new series, I'll be there from the start, and if there is a new movie, I'll be there on opening night.

WINDSTRUCK

Friday, August 18, 2006 5:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jolly:
Quote:

Last December, it noted a sequel to American Pie, titled American Pie Presents: Band Camp, registered 1-million sales.

Band Camp had an estimated budget of $7 mil. The original Bring It On had an estimated budget of $10 mil; this suggests to me that the budget of the sequels are somewhat below this figure. I suspect that for the time being, direct-to-DVD releases will be based on fairly low budget productions, where modest sales can recoup costs.

Could Serenity 2 be released under this framework? I honestly don't know. Presumably existing sets could be used, which would reduce the production costs below the $39 m figure for the BDM.

Fair points.
These movies aren't laiden with special effects as compared to Serenity, so it should have a lower budget.

I believe it is possible to make a direct to DVD Serenity movie. The making of the 2hour long pilot for Firefly did cost around 3 million. How about spending twice that much on a direct to DVD movie? Ok, the sfx will be lesser in quality but it would look like the ones in the series.

If I were to choose between a Direct to DVD movie and a mini-series, I'll take the mini-series anytime.

So what will it take for a mini-series? (By that way, would it still be considered a sequel?)
One should get the rights to the series off FOX's hand. Isn't there some sort of an "EXPIRATION DATE" to this?
Once this is done. A mini-series will be much easier to come by. Even a season2 is might possible.

I know some are thinking of an ACTION SCENE (buy a tv series scenario) here, but I'm taking the sit, chat, respond to blogs and wait scenario.

It took 2 years to get it to the silver screen. One can wait another 2 years for a mini-series or a sequel, or a season2, or even a direct to dvd sale.

I'll give everything to Joss; all the time in the world. Finish the Wondy movie. Finish Goners. Bolden the X in X-men. Buff up Buffy. Clip wings to Angelus. And then once again do the impossible, come out of the woods, aim to misbehave, and man the helm of Serenity.

11THHOUR

Friday, August 18, 2006 6:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Esther:
OK, you veteran, I only joined this month, SO WHAT CAN WE DO NOW? What did you do then? And how can we go further? Whom to address? Is buying the DVD sets and giving them to friends enough? I could also give the money directly to a fund ... is there any? Like "fans buy a TV series"? I mean, 3 Million US$ for one episode - with 50.000 fans that would make 60 bucks each (don't know, how many fans are there, but a DVD set in Germany costs abour 60 $). And someone paid over 3.000 $ for the Sereinity script (well, of course he got something of value for his money, but still ...)

Okay... in the order of your post:

First, my handle is 11th Hour, not "you veteran"... okay?

Welcome to the board!

YOU CAN DO A LOT.
We did a lot:
• Letter and postcard campaigns
• Newspaper ads
• Spreading the word via message boards
• Getting everyone we know, and their pets, to watch Firefly
• DVD buying campaigns
• Fan tables at Sci-Fi conventions
• Guerilla marketing with posters and flyers
• Wearing Firefly inspired clothing out in the world
• Bumper stickers, window decals, tattoos even
• and much more...
We are going further. Endeavors are happening right now.
Addressing the goal of growing and invigorating the fan base is the priority.
Buying the DVD sets yourself to give to friends gets very expensive. The better way is to create enough interest and motivation for people to purchase their own DVD sets. There is a campaign happening RIGHT NOW "Firefly Fortnight" which is geared to doing just that.
As for giving money to a fund, that is something that could be very helpful for the more ambitious, and expensive, promotional activities.
Regarding the "Fans buy a TV series", this fan financed movie/episode idea has been bouncing around for a while. At this particular point, it isn't a workable plan for a variety of reasons. The eventual consensus finally arrived at the conclusion that a studio, not a huge group of fans, needs to back the production.

Quote:
Aaaaah, just feeling so helpless!

The way to help relieve the helpless feeling is to start involving yourself with guerilla marketing. I've listed some of the things we fans did before, and these strategies still apply now. But we also need to come up with some new and surprising ideas to shake things up.

However, we must always keep in mind that any promotional ideas need to stay respectful and with a positive, supportive tone when it comes to Universal. Sometimes fans' frustration can prompt marketing tactics which get too aggressive, or even irritated, at Universal because they are the ones with the keys to Serenity right now. Not saying this to you personally, I always try to reinforce this notion to the fans because from time to time promotional ideas are suggested by fans which would actually do harm to our endeavors.

On a side note, I am working with a great team of Browncoats now on various Firefly/Serenity promotional ideas. We're getting ready to launch a new website which is dedicated to spreading the word of the 'Verse and increasing the fan base. More news on this in the very near future...

You can also participate in "Firefly Fortnight", and there's a link to the thread, next to the banner below, with all the info on this campaign. "Firefly Fortnight" already has had a measureable effect! When we launched the endeavor the sales of the Firefly DVD jumped up the chart on Amazon! Since the sales had been holding at a steady line for a while, and then suddenly went up right when the campaign started, and there were no other things going on at the time to promote FF, it can be reasonably assumed that "Firefly Fortnight" had something to with that sales increase.)

You can also download my guerilla marketing posters and spread the word that way. You can make the posters big, or make use of the handy "mini" posters... they are incredibly useful marketing tools... read the website for ideas!

http://the11thour.home.att.net

There's also a nice website with a great list

KAELE

Friday, August 18, 2006 6:10 PM

Quote:

That's more or less exactly how I feel. It would be nice to have some kind of cohesive campaign, rather than just wishful thinking.
And that isn't being negative, but it would be nice to have a concerted campaign, rather than just keep buying everything that's out there.
]

(First of all, LOVE the Liberator. Dr. Who and Blake's 7 are where I first cut my scifi teeth, thanks to mom! LOL)

That's just it exactly. We're trying with the Browncoat Army and the Summer Campaign, but I'd love to actually find someone who can answer our questions: What needs to be done? What would make the people responsible take notice?

If only I knew exactly HOW to direct efforts, we could be more precise in what we're doing. We're tossing our cash their way and yet it seems there's not even a whisper of a continuation. (Ok, ONE whisper I've seen online.)

And let's be frank, much as we love our BDHs, White Noisier and that Mammoth Sci Fi Channel movie were not anywhere near what we know those actors capable of. (and from my opinion, it looks like Waitress may not even go into wide release.) Adam Baldwin's been acting for a VERY long time and done movies and television. Of any of the actors from the show he has the most on screen experience. If he signed on to do Firefly once, he's likely to do it again. One thing we can be grateful of for the time being is that our BDH aren't A-list actors yet and won't be commanding the huge paychecks for a little while longer. (Don't take that the wrong way, I love them all and love their work!)

Will a sequel or season 2 happen? I wish I knew. I'm no sort of expert on the movie industry nor am I connected to it in any way. Wish I were so I could figure this problem out! But we are trying and we're gonna keep on trying. Eventually someone will notice and it'll fall in the right lap.

If wishes were fishes... I'd wish I could crawl inside a Fox exec's head and find out what needs to be done to get our series back on the air. Nothing on TV today compares to Firefly, but I'm finding myself having to settle.

I don't like that feeling.

~Kaele

Join the fight.
Become a part of the Browncoat Army.
[url] http://forum.serenityday.org

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME

DINALT

Friday, August 18, 2006 8:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kaele:

That's more or less exactly how I feel. It would be nice to have some kind of cohesive campaign, rather than just wishful thinking.
And that isn't being negative, but it would be nice to have a concerted campaign, rather than just keep buying everything that's out there.
]

(First of all, LOVE the Liberator. Dr. Who and Blake's 7 are where I first cut my scifi teeth, thanks to mom! LOL)

That's just it exactly. We're trying with the Browncoat Army and the Summer Campaign, but I'd love to actually find someone who can answer our questions: What needs to be done? What would make the people responsible take notice?

If only I knew exactly HOW to direct efforts, we could be more precise in what we're doing. We're tossing our cash their way and yet it seems there's not even a whisper of a continuation. (Ok, ONE whisper I've seen online.)

And let's be frank, much as we love our BDHs, White Noisier and that Mammoth Sci Fi Channel movie were not anywhere near what we know those actors capable of. (and from my opinion, it looks like Waitress may not even go into wide release.) Adam Baldwin's been acting for a VERY long time and done movies and television. Of any of the actors from the show he has the most on screen experience. If he signed on to do Firefly once, he's likely to do it again. One thing we can be grateful of for the time being is that our BDH aren't A-list actors yet and won't be commanding the huge paychecks for a little while longer. (Don't take that the wrong way, I love them all and love their work!)

Will a sequel or season 2 happen? I wish I knew. I'm no sort of expert on the movie industry nor am I connected to it in any way. Wish I were so I could figure this problem out! But we are trying and we're gonna keep on trying. Eventually someone will notice and it'll fall in the right lap.

If wishes were fishes... I'd wish I could crawl inside a Fox exec's head and find out what needs to be done to get our series back on the air. Nothing on TV today compares to Firefly, but I'm finding myself having to settle.

I don't like that feeling.

~Kaele

Join the fight.
Become a part of the Browncoat Army.
[url] http://forum.serenityday.org

Seems some of us are starting to think alike - and I agree about the Liberator, lol. I cut my teeth on that when I was 7 (probably too young to grasp it entirely at that age, but did instil a love of all things Sci-Fi).

And I agree that I hate the feeling of having to settle with second class sci-fi now. I guess Firefly spoiled us somewhat, as it makes anything else seem pretty lame by comparison.

I think there are a lot of damn good ideas out there for helping bring FF back, but the problem is a lack of cohesion at the moment. And I don't mean any disrespect by that - but for any new (or old) fans who want more information on what to do, there's a confusing array of threads.

That's why I started a thread about combining these threads, or making a seperate area available for promoting FF/Serenity - and for that alone.
Even on this one board (albeit probably the biggest FF board going), there are a multitude of threads relating to FF promotion or how the series could be bought back.

And that's where it all gets confusing, because someone needs to grab the reins and take a hold of it.
Heck, I know zip about the movie/tv industry, other than what shows I like, so we do need to get a concerted campaign of sorts going - even if this is a cross forum campaign (just google Firefly and see the results).
There's probably no shortage of fans - it's just how to best direct our efforts towards a common goal.

I don't have all the answers (or arguably any of them, lol), but let's put our heads together collectively and see what we can come up with.

This type of thread (The Actual Chance of a BDS) is great, but really everyone here probably wants another series, so most will reply very optimist

11THHOUR

Friday, August 18, 2006 10:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dinalt:
I think there are a lot of damn good ideas out there for helping bring FF back, but the problem is a lack of cohesion at the moment. And I don't mean any disrespect by that - but for any new (or old) fans who want more information on what to do, there's a confusing array of threads.

Yes, this is an issue I've already addressed. I've been in communication with Haken to establish an "anchored" area to organize the fan promotional efforts.

The area will be ready soon, a nice, highly visible panel on the home page. Discussions can be centralized, along with marketing ideas and resources, and links to sites related to the endeavors. The area will also be a great place to brainstorm promotion ideas and for fans to network.

We will be able to better focus our energies and channel all this positive enthusiasm much better.

11th Hour

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

Firefly/Serenity Guerilla Marketing Posters ~ http://the11thhour.home.att.net
Serenity Inspired Cafe Press Shop ~ http://www.cafepress.com/11thhourart

Get the full scoop: http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

DINALT

Friday, August 18, 2006 10:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
Quote:
Originally posted by Dinalt:
I think there are a lot of damn good ideas out there for helping bring FF back, but the problem is a lack of cohesion at the moment. And I don't mean any disrespect by that - but for any new (or old) fans who want more information on what to do, there's a confusing array of threads.

Yes, this is an issue I've already addressed. I've been in communication with Haken to establish an "anchored" area to organize the fan promotional efforts.

The area will be ready soon, a nice, highly visible panel on the home page. Discussions can be centralized, along with marketing ideas and resources, and links to sites related to the endeavors. The area will also be a great place to brainstorm promotion ideas and for fans to network.

We will be able to better focus our energies and channel all this positive enthusiasm much better.

11th Hour

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

Firefly/Serenity Guerilla Marketing Posters ~ http://the11thhour.home.att.net
Serenity Inspired Cafe Press Shop ~ http://www.cafepress.com/11thhourart

Get the full scoop: http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

Great stuff 11thhour. Thanks for the excellent news - should take our chances up a notch or 2.

EVILDINOSAUR

Friday, August 18, 2006 10:39 PM

I'd say the chances are pretty slim. I don't think the movie did as well as we all were hoping. Personally, though the movie was great, I think I still preferred the feel of the show anyway. I still have some hope, but not much. Also if there is a sequel it's gonna be a long way off, Joss is occupied at the moment and so we won't be seeing a sequel anytime soon even if it does happen.

"Haha, mine is an evil laugh."

OUT2THEBLACK

Saturday, August 19, 2006 3:25 AM

" I'm thinking we'll rise Again . "

11th Hour , I want you to know , that for several years now , you have been , and continue to be , a lovely , lovely , Source of Inspiration to me .

I have enjoyed all of your efforts and creations in regard to our beloved 'verse .

I admire your art and find it enthralling . I have admired , and continue to admire , your perseverance and determination in being a supporter not only of the Firefly 'verse , but of your fellow Browncoats . I've enjoyed seeing you in 'Done the Impossible' , so that there's a face to go with your screen name . I think it very fitting , and only appropriate , that you be seen there for years to come , and that you receive all the credit that you are due , for the work that you've done for us .

In past years I've enjoyed a number of quality TV shows , most of which were treated in some way or another , in a fashion similar to Firefly .
Misunderstood , mistreated , mishandled , by network decision-makers who 'just don't get it' . Happens all the time .

A number of sci-fi shows have been meaningful over the years , and I was sickened when 'Earth2' was canceled . It was a beautiful show , with characters that I cared about . There have also been some dramatic series' that I made the mistake of caring for a lot .

Quality television is just usually not truly appreciated by the majority of viewers OR network executives . But Firefly struck a chord with me , that resonates with every fiber of who I am . That's why I was compelled to write the postcard when the fate of Firefly was being determined . Ultimately , maybe it didn't turn the tide at that particular time , but I'm sure that it did not go entirely unnoticed , either .

We're the Browncoats ! Each of us will do ALL that we can !

We'll choose our battles wisely . We will reach the 'tipping point' . We will achieve our 'critical mass' . And when we get what we're after , those who are speaking most negatively NOW will say , " I never doubted , I always KNEW we would get it done ! "

Those who have led will continue to lead , those who follow , will follow ; now if those of you who want to be "realistic" will Choose A Task or Stand Aside , we'll get done what we've come to do .

DINALT

Saturday, August 19, 2006 11:59 AM

Another chance to freely promote the 'verse - as long as this is legit. I've checked it out, and it seems legit, but if anyone has information to the contrary, for gods sake let me know and I'll edit it out.

A lower res (and missing most of the extras) version of Done The Impossible has been released under a Creative Commons License.
See: http://www.legaltorrents.com/about_done_the_impossible.htm

Could be a good way to spread at least some of the enthusiasm, as it doesn't cost a bean and might encourage more fans - just send them the link, and get them to download it.

More information here:

http://www.legaltorrents.com/index.htm

As I say though, if anyone knows it's not legit, please post immediately and I'll edit it out. The last thing I want to do is push anything illegal, but it looks on the level.

11THHOUR

Saturday, August 19, 2006 7:09 PM

Out2theBlack ~

Such a thoughtful and beautiful post, thank you sincerely.

Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:
" I'm thinking we'll rise Again . "

11th Hour , I want you to know , that for several years now , you have been , and continue to be , a lovely , lovely , Source of Inspiration to me .

I have enjoyed all of your efforts and creations in regard to our beloved 'verse .

So glad to hear this, and very kind of you to say. Firefly is a constant inspiration for me as an artist. When I create the art for Firefly it's an expression of my connection with it, and I always hope that the feelings come through and reach other fans. My art really is meant to be a shared experience. It's just about impossible to separate the fans from Firefly in my mind. We are connected with that show on what can be called a spiritual level.

Many people might deride the passion the fans feel for Firefly... after all it's "only a TV show". But of course that's the most simplistic of descriptions. Television is just the medium that delivered these amazing characters and stories. History is filled with ages of people who were passionate for the stories of their time. These stories reach the level of art, and somehow touch a meaningful place in people. It doesn't happen often, but it is real and cannot be denied... although explaining it to someone who has no knowledge of the work risks putting one squarely in the "fanatic" role. Well, love is like that. One does have to experience it personally to finally "get it". Sure we're fans in the fanatic sense, but so long as the experience and activities are positive and uplifting, it's a very enjoyable thing indeed to be a fan.

Quote:
I admire your art and find it enthralling . I have admired , and continue to admire , your perseverance and determination in being a supporter not only of the Firefly 'verse , but of your fellow Browncoats . I've enjoyed seeing you in 'Done the Impossible' , so that there's a face to go with your screen name . I think it very fitting , and only appropriate , that you be seen there for years to come , and that you receive all the credit that you are due , for the work that you've done for us .

I'm very honored to be in "Done the Impossible", though I wasn't feeling at all very well at the time. My segments were made during Dragon*Con last year and I had developed a bad toothache literally while at the show. (Discovered later at the dentist that I had a cracked a molar... ack... ) Anyway, I was running on very little sleep and a lot of pain, so to say I wasn't tip top is to put it mildly. But it was necessary to participate at that time, or not be in DIT at all as interview opportunities were running out... so I trudged on through and joined in the fun. I sorta wish though that a caption would come up when I appear to explain why I look so totally trashed!

Thanks too for the compliments on my perseverance... sometimes even I get a bit worn down and ask myself why I continue to fight. Then I'll listen to the Ballad of Serenity, or watch an episode of Firefly, and the flame gets fed again. I fell in love, fiercely in love, with Firefly. I'm connected to it on a level that even I can't fully explain. I'll keep fighting until Joss says he no longer cares to continue the 'Verse, or until I can't fight anymore.

Quote:
In past years I've enjoyed a number of quality TV shows , most of which were treated in some way or another , in a fashion similar to Firefly .
Misunderstood , mistreated , mishandled , by network decision-makers who 'just don't get it' . Happens all the time .

Yes, happens to TV shows, and it happens to people. That may play a part in at least some of my personal identification with Firefly...

Quote:
A number of sci-fi shows have been meaningful over the years , and I was sickened when 'Earth2' was canceled . It was a beautiful show , with characters that I cared about . There have also been some dramatic series' that I made the mistake of caring for a lot .

Quality television

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME

YLESS

Sunday, August 20, 2006 3:20 AM

Sorry, I'm new here so was just wondering, what do BDS and BDM stand for (I did search but unless I'm completely blind couldn't find any sort of official search system).

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 3:40 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by YLess:
Sorry, I'm new here so was just wondering, what do BDS and BDM stand for (I did search but unless I'm completely blind couldn't find any sort of official search system).

No need to be sorry, YLess. If you're new how could you know?

BDS stands for Big Damn Series
BDM stands for Big Damn Movie

as in Big Damn Heroes... it's from "Safe" the episode where the crew saves River and Simon from the villagers.

There is no official search engine here at FFF.net, but you can google to look for stuff by typing in your google search box Fireflyfans.net + "whatever you're looking for". It works very well.

ETA: Please see Ubergeek's post below for the correct way to search this site with google.

Now, since you're new.. you've also just become a Browncoat. I'm the supply clerk around here.. I've got your 'coat right here.

*hands YLess a browncoat from the storeroom*

Looks like it fits! Good.

How'd you come to like Firefly/Serenity and join us here, YLess? We do love to hear the stories of how folks found the 'verse.

And make yourself to home, talk often and we're happy you're here.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

UBERGEEK

Sunday, August 20, 2006 4:34 AM

A better and more percise way to search this site with google is, in the search box type:

site:fireflyfans.net your search here

site:fireflyfans.net means that google only searches displays results form that url

if you just type in fireflyfans.net you will get everything from this site *and* any other site that has the words fireflyfans.net

just so you know

welcome to the boards.

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 4:40 AM

Thank you Ubergeek, I've been doing that wrong... I'll edit my post accordingly.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

SEAOTTER

Sunday, August 20, 2006 5:27 AM

There's an article I've seen in occasional searches -- and the use of the term 'closure' makes me twitchy.

(if this has already been discussed, apologies, I'm new here and couldn't find reference to it)

http://www.ew.com/ew/report/0,6115,1141343_1_0_,00.html

Does anyone know if this is still accurate?

Thanks.

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 5:50 AM

No, SeaOtter it's not.. please read this thread to see Joss' response to the EW article.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=15704&newsid=0

Also, welcome to the 'verse, we're glad you're here.

How did you find out about Firefly/Serenity? I'm guessin' since you're here and twitchy about "closure" you're lovin' the series and movie as much as all of us here.

I'm the keeper of the browncoats and the unofficial greeter. Since you're a new Browncoat.. you need your browncoat..

*hands SeaOtter a browncoat that fits very nicely*

There you are. Folks will probably come along and offer you food and drink.. we'd like you to feel at home, cuz you are at home.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

SEAOTTER

Sunday, August 20, 2006 6:08 AM

Thanks so much -- it's pretty cunning, this coat.

Started watching Firefly when it was on TV, was heartbroken when it was cancelled. Went back to school and didn't even know about Serenity until I saw the reviews in the paper. Went to see it, bullied (delicately) everyone I knew into seeing it, bought it, bought the series, started buying shirts on cafepress, saw the article I posted above, was heartbroken, wanted it universally denied / squished, did a google search on firefly forums, looked at a bunch, liked the thoughtful tone of this one.

Or did you mean philosophically?

Now I just gotta find me a nice banner for my sig. Thanks so much for the link.

Got one!

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 6:44 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SeaOtter:
Thanks so much -- it's pretty cunning, this coat.

Started watching Firefly when it was on TV, was heartbroken when it was cancelled. Went back to school and didn't even know about Serenity until I saw the reviews in the paper. Went to see it, bullied (delicately) everyone I knew into seeing it, bought it, bought the series, started buying shirts on cafepress, saw the article I posted above, was heartbroken, wanted it universally denied / squished, did a google search on firefly forums, looked at a bunch, liked the thoughtful tone of this one.

Or did you mean philosophically?

No, I meant it literally.

Quote:
Now I just gotta find me a nice banner for my sig. Thanks so much for the link.

You're welcome.

'Course you can go here http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697&newsid=0 and use the shiny banner I'm using or the smaller version ( find it on the thread) made by 11th Hour. That'd be mighty nice of you to help us promote the Firefly Fortnight campaign.

Or....

Here's the banner thread from our Summer of Serenity banner making spree.. there are some mighty fine banners to be had here too.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=22122

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

YLESS

Sunday, August 20, 2006 1:59 PM

Cheers.

*Puts on the coat with pride*

I must admit that until a few months ago I'd never heard of Firefly until one of my house mates bought the DVD box set (he'd never seen it either) and I watched it and loved it. I then subsequently found out about the movie but instead of doing my usual thing of adding it to my list of movies I want to see but probably never will or at least not soon I went out and bought the box set and film.

Then, after watching the series twice concurrently (with my brother and with the rest of my family who were a few episodes behind him (I got all them into it, even to the point where my mum (who's not a huge program watcher) can site examples from the series in conversations (my jaw nearly hit the floor when she started going on about a young Simon asking for a dedicated source box in relation to a conversation about the internet and new technologies))) I came here. (I also ramble alot). I had wanted to write a fanfic (which I've never done before for anything else and I've been a fan of cult for a long time. I came to this specific site via Google as it looked respectable, don't know if I was right yet :p.

Anyway, thanks for the clarification.

Aftermath: The Renegade
[url= http://www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=12456]Prologue.]
[url= http://www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=12503]Chapter 1 - The Moon of Talgos.[/url]

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 2:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by YLess:
I came to this specific site via Google as it looked respectable, don't know if I was right yet :p.

Anyway, thanks for the clarification.

Aftermath: The Renegade
[url= http://www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=12456]Prologue.]
[url= http://www.fireflyfans.net/sunroomitem.asp?i=12503]Chapter 1 - The Moon of Talgos.[/url]

Well, we're respectable all right.

We're also ornery and like any family full of talk and fun!

'Course like any family we also got our own troubles ( trolls) but like the door to the upstairs that squeaks because it's old, you soon learn to ignore those things and enjoy the folks that make it a home with you.

I hope you come to love this place as much as I do.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

HERA

Sunday, August 20, 2006 4:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Esther:
Quote:
Originally posted by 11th Hour:

Being one of the veteran Browncoats, who helped do the impossible, I gotta say... "realistic" and "likely" weren't much a part of our vocabulary.

It's fascinating, though, how as a fan you can just re-enact Mals frustration as a Browncoat and all. I guess, that's somewhat part of the connection between the fans and the 'Verse ...

Esther

Hey there Esther,

I think when 11th used the words "realistic" and "likely", she was inferring that Browncoats back then didn't allow the lack of those two things to deter them from their course. They went forward with their endeavors, against all odds.

Just to mention another iron in the fire, we're developing a Firefly myspace page that will soon host the winners of the Firefly episode trailer contest (July 1 -- August 31st).

http://www.myspace.com/fff_firefly

You should check out the trailer thread -- we've had great submissions (30 so far), with more to come.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=2&t=22792&m=353015#353015

We launched the contest so that we could have GOOD marketing materials for the series (since the ones FOX did were so off-target and badly made). We'll post these vids to the Firefly myspace page in order to bring new fans to the verse.

How you can help is get a myspace account, join Firefly as a friend (how weird it THAT? but oddly comforting), then troll myspace looking for sci-fi fans who DON'T mention Firefly on their page. And invite them to be a Firefly friend. This makes them curious, they watch the trailers, think they're interesting, rent the DVDs, fall in love, buy the DVDs, find out about the movie, buy that DVD. Another Browncoat is made. Another fan. More DVD sales. More eyeballs for the sequel.

It's crazy, but it just might work.

-Hera

"Wanna?" – Mal to Kaylee, Out of Gas

FOLLOWMAL

Sunday, August 20, 2006 4:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hera:
This makes them curious, they watch the trailers, think they're interesting, rent the DVDs, fall in love, buy the DVDs, find out about the movie, buy that DVD. Another Browncoat is made. Another fan. More DVD sales. More eyeballs for the sequel.

It's crazy, but it just might work.

-Hera

"Wanna?" – Mal to Kaylee, Out of Gas

This makes me grin. From ear to ear.

This is gonna be so shiny!!

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

BAD2VERSE

Sunday, August 20, 2006 6:59 PM

Every time I see some No-nothing show on TV, I find myself thinking "That's money that could have been spent making another episode of "Firefly".

If a Cable channel is so desperate they show giant spiders and metal machines (that are OBVIOUSLY the worst special effects of the 21st century), then SURELY they could throw a little money Firefly's way...

The Stargate channel... uhhh, Sorry, the Sci-Fi channel... could do away with MUCH of the other "crap" they host and pick up the rights to Firefly... Of course, even BattleStar says their paper is "Cube shaped" as a protest to all the "Corners they had to cut" with their original budget, and even THEIR first season was "Iffy".. then it started winning awards and now appears to be safe... When something has an OBVIOUS following (And more every day), you give it a little more than was given to Firefly to make it work...

Look at the awards Firefly has racked up... And it's STILL making money! and I'd MUCH rather watch Firefly than "Wrasslin" (What's Wrasslin got to do with the Sci-fi channel? I dunno, but they're showing it..)

Sorry, Whew, went off on a bit of a rant there.. but, well, you know how it is. Almost no one even knew what Firefly was until Serenity came out.. THEN everyone was saying, "They should make that into a series!".. I want to scream every time I hear that.. I bet I've sold more Copies of the Boxed set series FOR Fox than their own commercials have sold.

We can't give up hope.. took, what, 25 years for BattleStar to come back? But it happened (Dunno if I could wait 25 years for more Firefly, and hopefully we won't have to).

I know Joss is tired of Fighting for Firefly, but when you can't run any longer, you crawl, and when you can't do that.. well, you know the rest. WE aren't giving up.. I gots LOTS of fight left in ME! If Joss can't crawl any more, *We'll* carry him.

________________________
..but eatin people alive, where does THAT get fun?

11THHOUR

Sunday, August 20, 2006 7:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bad2verse:

I know Joss is tired of Fighting for Firefly, but when you can't run any longer, you crawl, and when you can't do that.. well, you know the rest. WE aren't giving up.. I gots LOTS of fight left in ME! If Joss can't crawl any more, *We'll* carry him.

That's one of the most beautiful gorram things I've read on this board.

11th Hour

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

Firefly/Serenity Guerilla Marketing Posters ~ http://the11thhour.home.att.net
Serenity Inspired Cafe Press Shop ~ http://www.cafepress.com/11thhourart

Get the full scoop: http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

DINALT

Sunday, August 20, 2006 8:30 PM

Being still new here, it shows there's a lot I've got to learn about the Browncoat movement.

Just had to post and say how beautiful your posters are 11th Hour. To my shame (blame it on being new, lol), I didn't even realise these existed.
They truly are excellent, and I hope anyone else new to the FF scene checks them out as well.

Totally off topic, but guess I'll be ordering from Cafe Press as well - great way to promote FF/Serenity as well as looking good.

Sorry folks, just had to post after seeing some great art.

JOLLY

Sunday, August 20, 2006 8:47 PM

Quote:

We can't give up hope.. took, what, 25 years for BattleStar to come back? But it happened (Dunno if I could wait 25 years for more Firefly, and hopefully we won't have to).

Firefly 2030? Following Richard Hatch, Nathan will have a reoccuring role as...Niska! Sean Maher will get to play one of the Blue Hands. And Suri Cruise-Holmes will be cast in the role of River...

BAD2VERSE

Sunday, August 20, 2006 8:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
Quote:
Originally posted by bad2verse:

I know Joss is tired of Fighting for Firefly, but when you can't run any longer, you crawl, and when you can't do that.. well, you know the rest. WE aren't giving up.. I gots LOTS of fight left in ME! If Joss can't crawl any more, *We'll* carry him.

That's one of the most beautiful gorram things I've read on this board.

11th Hour

>>>}———————————————)))======<[]>======(((———————————————{<<<

I know how it is to do "Big Things", you get tired, you lose your momentum when things aren't going smoothly, even when you have a lot of people behind you... I'd rather they get up here Beside me and give me a little help... I expect Joss thinks that from time to time, I know *I* do.

I know we ALL want to do all we can to bring the series back in one form or another, So we need to find out what we can DO to help Joss make that happen..

Letter writing campaigns are great and all.. but when a sudden flood of letters comes into a network, they look through a few, yawn, and think, "Another Website doing a letter writing campaign.. coupla hundred people, no big deal", and they file it in the circular file (Trash can) and go back to sleep...

Support has to be long lasting, and unique in some way...

We're adults, Many of us have college degrees (I can just tell ;) and we know how to network... ALL of us know someone, and that someone knows someone else that could help make things happen with the series.. a Friend of mine has a Sister in the movie business in Hollywood.. I've gotten him hooked on the Series and movie... and told him to hook his sister up with a copy..

Now THERE is someone the networks may listen to.. and if not her, then maybe a friend of one of YOUR friends... when people in the network business start hearing something a time or two from people they know, they tend to look at it a bit more closely... So we find out who they listen to and we get in THEIR ear(s). These are just people, no different from you and me, and they have friends they listen to.

Of course it'd help if we had one Mal's brilliant and genius plans, or at least if Joss had one that we could take up... The numbers are obvious, the people that would Actually do Something are obviously here.. we just need a direction, and some way to smooth the road out in FRONT of Joss.

For that, we need to know what the stumbling blocks are... we tackle those one at a time until they are gone (or manageable), and then we see what happens.

It'd help if Joss would tell us what the stumbling blocks are, but there's obviously plenty of smart people here that have an idea or two about what they are, and WE could work on removing those.

The road's smoother when your friends know you're coming by and they fill in the potholes on their little stretch of the road before you get there....

Sorry, Went off on Another Rant/tangent... I'm bad for that ;)

________________________
..but eatin people alive, where does THAT get fun?

MICJWELCH

Monday, August 21, 2006 3:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bad2verse:
Every time I see some No-nothing show on TV, I find myself thinking "That's money that could have been spent making another episode of "Firefly".

I couldn't help but think that when I saw the trailer for "Snakes On A Plane." I thought we were past the horror-movie-on-an-airplane stage...

"We may experience some slight turbulence, and then... explode."

BAD2VERSE

Monday, August 21, 2006 4:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by micjwelch:
Quote:
Originally posted by bad2verse:
Every time I see some No-nothing show on TV, I find myself thinking "That's money that could have been spent making another episode of "Firefly".

I couldn't help but think that when I saw the trailer for "Snakes On A Plane." I thought we were past the horror-movie-on-an-airplane stage...

I thought so also, I guess we aren't though ;)

While we're in "Thinking mode", We also need to think about friends that know people who own larger businesses that advertise nationally (or globally), my brother is on the team that makes decisions about "Commercial times" for a large international business... He's a firefly fan also.. and I've asked him if he would/could be willing to at least ASK some networks (Unnamed) about the possibility of a new Firefly season, just to see what response he gets... I figure if advertisers (That WANT to KNOW the Program schedule line-up, of course) start asking about a second season, it may carry more weight than individuals simply writing to ask about it.

Again "Networking"... we all know "Someone", and those "Someones" know someone, and "the advertisers asking about the show" angle may be one of the better ways to get execs thinking "There's marketing support for it".

SURELY they aren't afraid of making money...

Of course, Execs in ANY company are busy, and they get their info from sound bytes and snippets.. even my Brother said "I thought the creator was tired of the show"(?) I replied that it was a magazine article that took some of Joss' comments out of context, and that I'd heard he WAS interested in the show, but was working on another show right now.

Joss' comments are witty and sometimes a bit sarcastic, and many people (especially people that are rushing a deadline to fill space) don't get him... Joss seems to give these interviewers credit for more brains (and thinking time) than they may actually have... so it might help if he was a bit plainer with them.

I've had (An Un-named men's fitness magazine) Butcher some of my Comments also.. you have to say EXACTLY what you want them to pass on, and repeat the main points several times, PLAINLY... they usually aren't as interested in the "story" as they are in finishing the story to meet a deadline.

It'd also help if we knew exactly what the obstacles were that could be expected when Joss has time to think about Firefly seriously again, so we could work on removing them while Joss is busy with his current project.

None of this can happen overnight anyway, so we have time to work on it before Joss looks at it again seriously.. and when he DOES look at it again, I'd like him to see a smooth(er) road laid out in front of him.

________________________
..but eatin people alive, where does THAT get fun?

ELDUSTO

Monday, August 21, 2006 8:39 PM

Sorry, but I'm new and some of the acronyms you guys use I can't figure out. What's "BDS" stand for?

FOLLOWMAL

Monday, August 21, 2006 8:46 PM

Hi, ElDusto, welcome to the site!

BDS stands for Big Damn Series.

It's a play on the line "Big Damn Heroes." from the ep "Safe".

Since you're new, you need your browncoat. I'm sort of the unofficial greeter around here.

*hands ElDusto a browncoat*

There you are. Make yourself to home and talk often, as you can see on this thread alone, we love to talk.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

SEAOTTER

Monday, August 21, 2006 9:09 PM

(laughing) I thought it meant Big Damn Sequel.

Since we've already had the Big Damn Movie, what the acronym for the next one?

SEAOTTER

Monday, August 21, 2006 9:09 PM

(this was a duplicate post - I had gotten an error message after I posted the one above)

We need a "Delete this post" option for the poster.

ELDUSTO

Monday, August 21, 2006 9:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by FollowMal:
Hi, ElDusto, welcome to the site!

BDS stands for Big Damn Series.

It's a play on the line "Big Damn Heroes." from the ep "Safe".

Since you're new, you need your browncoat. I'm sort of the unofficial greeter around here.

*hands ElDusto a browncoat*

There you are. Make yourself to home and talk often, as you can see on this thread alone, we love to talk.

Thanks for clearing that up. I figured the B & D stood for "Big Damn", the "S" eluded me.
*Takes browncoat and wears it with pride*
I've been here for alittle over a week and posting randomly here and there, but I never made a Hi, I'm new thread.

FOLLOWMAL

Monday, August 21, 2006 10:40 PM

I usually just type BDSequel.

LOL

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

MONKSDAD

Monday, August 21, 2006 10:56 PM

Isnt it odd that more and more official merch has been trickling out from universal? I wonder if they are testing the water for a bds? just a thought.

"And I think calling him that is an insult to the psychotic lowlife community."

ELDUSTO

Monday, August 21, 2006 11:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by monksdad:
Isnt it odd that more and more official merch has been trickling out from universal? I wonder if they are testing the water for a bds? just a thought.

"And I think calling him that is an insult to the psychotic lowlife community."

Yeah, they might be feeling out the fan base or milking it.

FOLLOWMAL

Monday, August 21, 2006 11:56 PM

Not a bad thought, Monksdad.. not a bad thought at all. Hmmmm.. so if we have a particularly good run on all this new merchandise that could help.

Also, we're still lookin' at the need for multiplying the fanbase. That is what we need more than anything else.. new folks. Not us same folks buying, but new folks buying and making recruits in their turn.

The 'verse needs to be part of culture, not just genre stuff... it needs to become an ordinary thing for many folks to know what it is.

I hope we can make that happen. I believe we can make that happen.

"You hold. Hold 'til I get back." Mal

http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=19&t=22697

ADAPA

Tuesday, August 22, 2006 9:44 PM

This is gonna sound wacky but the thought has been running threw my mind all day. But let me start at the beginning, for those of you who have not seen the Stargate SG-1's 200th ep spoilers follow.

At the beginning of the SG-1 200th show which is about making a sci-fi movie, Carter says something like, "yeah, after 3 shows, they want a movie?" this was a clear reference to Firefly. The usual comedic show followed. Then towards the end the central character received a phone call, the movie had been canceled. Sad faces all around then he said "they decided to make a series instead"

Now, what could the writers of SG-1 possably know about firefly's return. The logic against this is significant but....

OUT2THEBLACK

Friday, August 25, 2006 4:12 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:

Out2theBlack ~

Such a thoughtful and beautiful post, thank you sincerely.

Quote:

No thanks required . The kudos should belong to you . But thanks for the compliments , and your thoughtful comments .

I want to add a couple of things here to give this thread a bump and inspire any 'Coats who are growing weary from the wait .

" Discontent is the first step in the progress of a man or a nation." - ( Oscar Wilde , 1854-1900 )

" Restlessness and discontent are the necessities of progress. " - ( Thomas Alva Edison , 1847-1931 )

" Show me a thoroughly satisfied man - and I will show you a failure. " - ( Edison )

" Try Not. DO or Do Not. There is no Try." - Yoda

" Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. "
- Margaret Mead , ( 1901-1978 )

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