What happened to music?
POSTED BY: kaneman
UPDATED: Saturday, September 5, 2026 17:18
VIEWED: 28195
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Came across this. It plays a clip of America's #1 hits starting in 1956 thru 2007 6 minutes long. I personally like the later stuff, however I get the point. Any thoughts?
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Can't do youtube at work, but this very topic is something I have been thinking about a lot recently.
Seems like the music and radio industries have had each other caught up in a death spiral for several years now. Music is promoted on radio, and conversely radio can only play what music is being made.
The music industry makes and promotes music of a few narrowly defined genres, and insists that its stars be young, charismatic, and live the rock-n-roll lifestyle. Less and less emphasis is placed on songwriting ability and voice talent. Further, if a musician is not the demographic they are looking for, they don't do the album. Lastly, the main fault of the music industry is price. It is just ridiculous that you can buy a movie on DVD cheaper than you can buy the soundtrack. I understand it takes about $0.10 to make a CD, and about $1.00 to make a DVD. Seeing as how the case and packaging can't be that much (maybe $.20) if there is a printing of at least 10,000 copies, why is it a CD from the store cost $14.00?!? Especially when a DVD only cost $7-15? Even with the artist getting a royalty, a CD should only be about $4-5. The music industry likes to complain about declining sales and piracy, but there would be a lot less of both if music were more of an impulse buy.
Meanwhile, the radio industry has been slowly digging its own grave for decades now. Marketing and programmed playlists kill creativity, enthusiasm, and variety. I was just listening to a report on NPR the other day where the subject was saying that basically Rock grew when FM stations were just starting out. With no one listening to them, the DJs were able to play whatever they liked, which happened to be early Rock (they mentioned Sgt Pepper specifically). It turns out there is still quite a bit of good music being made, but without exposure, the general populace never hears it, and it never catches on. Thus, radio is left with the same tired playlist year after year. Our local NPR just started a new station (89.3 the Current) last year that plays a huge variety of obscure rock aimed at youth. It often sounds like a university radio station, but for the first time in a long time, I have been discovering new music that I like. More radio stations should have an open playlist like this (and not just lip service saying that they do). They might find their audience growing instead of loosing people to XMRadio, ipods, etc.
Rant over. For now.
"I am your father, Luke. Give in to the Dark Side, you nob!" - Doug McKenzie
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Oh, I couldn't agree with you more! I'm so tired of hearing the same 10-12 songs over and over instead of something new and original. When will they get a clue???
My rant's over, too. 
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Quote:Hey, you’re preaching to the choir (
Originally posted by kaneman:
Came across this. It plays a clip of America's #1 hits starting in 1956 thru 2007 6 minutes long. I personally like the later stuff, however I get the point. Any thoughts?
). I’ve always thought that recent popular music has taken a huge dive for the worst, largely because of rap. I don’t even listen to the radio anymore, because there’s nothing but crap on. Neither MTV nor VH1 actually play music videos anymore, because all they have to play is crap.Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Looks like things went down the crapper in the mid 90's.
IMO, things went down hill when people started to let computers make the music for them instead of playing the instruments themselves 
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Good observation Kaneman. I agree with rap, it's like nails on a chalkboard. In the early 90's when rap was combined with dance music it was actually playable because instead of this monotone that most rappers these days use, they actually used different levels of tone, as close to singing as rappers can get, then something happened and suddenly rap was only cool if it was gansta and or dealt with bikin clad woman bumping and grinding all over them.
Even rock stations have gotten into the grind of playing top 10 lists, but fortunately for me I've found 2 stations that play quite alternative and different music (that top 40 stations only hear about months or years later) and because of these stations I've discovered a whole new realm of music. But even then I end up flipping through stations because on rare occasions all of them play songs or bands I hate. Thankfully I have a lot of songs on my computer that I can listen to on my headphones (which I am at the moment actually doing 
)
Remember when it was about music? wWhen MTV only had a few video's in it's vaults and played them over and over again and even then the video's were only secondary to the song? Remember when the only time you'd ever see a singer is in concert? When the music industry was just a means of getting songs out there and not the megamonster corporations they've become?
When does the revolution start?
Just a note: They're worried about piracy, I thought they WERE the pirates. Only way to explain their charging so much money for a cd that at most have a few good songs.
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You guys are making yourselves sound very old.
Everyone thinks music was great when they were young, and the new stuff is crap.
Next, you'll be chasing kids off your lawn.
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
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I really have not bought much music lately. I find I listen to most anything made from the 50's to the 80's. Also listen to some Rythum and Blues, which is not far removed from Rock.
They seemed to cover a lot in six minutes. I would have done a few changes, but they seemed to have covered about every style of Rock and Roll plus some POP thrown in. So as they used to say on American Band Stand. I give it only a 75. You can't dance to it.
I was surprised there was so much Rap at the end. Is it that popular? I would have thought there would be other styles of Rock out there at this time.
Traveler
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Damn kids and their rock music.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Quote:Is it that popular? It’s pretty much consumed the music industry like some kind of blinging, daddymacking, dusta-rhymin influenza. Of course, it’s not like I’m surprised. Any idiot with a pissed off look and a limp can do it.
Originally posted by traveler:
I was surprised there was so much Rap at the end. Is it that popular? I would have thought there would be other styles of Rock out there at this time.
Personally, I like actual music in my music. I think Billy Joel was probably the last true great musician.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Well, the only rap I can stand is the Fugees, and that's mid-late nineties, back when the bling-n-babes movement wasn't in full swing...
EDIT: Oh, and the rap Gorillaz do. 'Battlesong,' 'Clint Eastwood,' the stuff with Del (a.k.a 'DELTRON.')
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I see why I don't buy music anymore. It seems there is not much out there that is worth the effort or the cash. I would comment on Rap, but I actually don't listen to it. It gives me a headache is about all I can say.
Traveler
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While I agree the music industry ain't what it should be, I won't place the blame on Rap. It's the execs! (A particular style of rap drives me crazy, but historically, I've quite liked it...read that as a long, long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.)
I remember working at the college radio station where we had two rules: don't play anything off of any current top ten and don't play/say anything to get fined. We could bring in our own music. It was a blast looking for obscure music.
These days I don't listen to the radio. If I do, I stick to oldies, classic rock, or some such. I buy an album, when someone I know recommends it.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
You guys are making yourselves sound very old.
Everyone thinks music was great when they were young, and the new stuff is crap.
Next, you'll be chasing kids off your lawn.
What about me? I'm 22 and I agree with pretty much all of what has been said here. Though I do have a strange taste in music. I beleive the term is eclectic. Everything from Billy Holiday, to The Who, to Loreena McKennitt, to a band called Lordy that I think is Norewegian or some such. And of course everything in between. Minus "Gangsta" Rap and anything harder than the above mentioned Lordy. I like some of the shouty rock music but only if it actually contains music in it somewhere.
Also, I stopped listening to the radio when I was about 17. Yet every time I get on a car with someone who has the radio on, it sound pretty much the same as it did five years ago. I miss music. Where did it go?
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
You guys are making yourselves sound very old.
Everyone thinks music was great when they were young, and the new stuff is crap.
Next, you'll be chasing kids off your lawn.
How exactly is that? My only requirement is that bands/groups/etc actually play there music NOT by clicking play.
For that matter, I'm not saying that something isn't music b/c I don't like it. Hell, I absolutely HATE country music (except some Johnny Cash, gotta love Johnny Cash
), but it /is/ most certainly music.But, what does the rap/whatever people do. They take a track of real music, sample it, do whatever to it including messing with it, then (as has been said above) they put on a pissed off look and limp around /talking/, completely destroying the musical value of the original song.
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I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
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Quote:
Originally posted by SigmaNunki:Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
You guys are making yourselves sound very old.
Everyone thinks music was great when they were young, and the new stuff is crap.
Next, you'll be chasing kids off your lawn.
How exactly is that? My only requirement is that bands/groups/etc actually play there music NOT by clicking play.
For that matter, I'm not saying that something isn't music b/c I don't like it. Hell, I absolutely HATE country music (except some Johnny Cash, gotta love Johnny Cash
But, what does the rap/whatever people do. They take a track of real music, sample it, do whatever to it including messing with it, then (as has been said above) they put on a pissed off look and limp around /talking/, completely destroying the musical value of the original song.
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I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
They wreck your interpretation of musical value (and mine for that matter, I hate most Rap, too). But there are a LOT of people who really like it - it works for them. And in 10-15 years, they'll probably be complaining about whatever is popular then. And any music you like, I bet you we could find someone who hates it. It's just how it goes.
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
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*waves at twg*
Quote:
Originally posted by thatweirdgirl:
While I agree the music industry ain't what it should be, I won't place the blame on Rap. It's the execs!
I'd actually blame both.
Rap is so easy and mindless to do any "gangsta" can do it, which is rather problematic given the topic of most (if not all) rap for the past... while.
It's the execs fault as well b/c they promote it to the point where gangsta crap is pretty much glorified with obvious results. Which they in turn exploit.
This cycle continues.
*sigh*
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I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
They wreck your interpretation of musical value (and mine for that matter, I hate most Rap, too). But there are a LOT of people who really like it - it works for them. And in 10-15 years, they'll probably be complaining about whatever is popular then. And any music you like, I bet you we could find someone who hates it. It's just how it goes.
I'd hate to tell you this, but "my" interpretation of musical value is... long standing. Think all music that pre-dates computers long standing and then some.
Oh, and we are exactly NOT talking about whether people like rap or not. For that matter, whether people like something or not has exactly NOTHING to do with whether it is music or not.
Nice straw-man btw.
Btw, an old class-mate and I were talking one day about this type of stuff. The conclusion that we came to is that rap et al was NOT music, BUT could be considered a kind of art. Though similar, these two are most certainly NOT the same.
Sorry, but a computer is not an instrument. Just b/c it can MIMIC something does NOT mean it is that something.
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I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
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Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Damn kids and their rock music.
" Yeah, rock 'n roll's been goin' downhill ever since Buddy Holly died. " --- John Milner
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kayna:Quote:
to a band called Lordy that I think is Norewegian or some such.
If you mean Lordi it´s Finnish.
If you look at americas number one hits it seems that music died in mid 90s but the truth is there is still lots of good music, you just have to find it first. I personally like metal music and it seems that it´s getting pretty popular at least in Finland. Unfortunately the same thing that happened to punk and rap is happening to metal; many of the new bands are products of big labels and their only purpose is to make lots of money. Needless to say all those bands suck.NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Re Country Music: Alt country (eg Jason and the Scorchers) continues to be the most unappreciated popular music genre in the world today. And how anyone on a Firefly board can knock country music is a little mystifying - the soundtrack of our BDH's lives is heavier on the C&W than any other genre, including east asian ethnic.
I decided around the time I left scholol that anything that makes the charts (and ever has) by definition sucks. Most of it sucks like a whirlpool, some of it sucks like an open wardrobe. I don't mind listening to sucky music at times but the more copies it sells, the less interested I am. Anything that caters to a mass market has to have all the uniqueness (is there such a word?) vacuumed out.
What really pisses me off, however, is music that has been recorded for ipod. They have it so digitally compressed that its virtually unlistenable. Two recent albums that I've listened to that have done that are Arctic Monkeys (the first one, I haven't bothered with the second) and the Costellos. They sound like they had some potential but the albums are the musical equivilent of a hangnail. Not painful, just a dull, annoying ache.
Edit:- I'm 42: obviously I hate rap.
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There is a lot of unappreciated country music, but I think that is because a lot of popular country music tends to be very predictable, in both its lyrics and its melody. If you dig a little deeper, you’ll find very some very good music and some varieties like bluegrass, blues and traditional music which are widely underappreciated by modern audiences. I've never met anyone who claimed to hate country music that didn't make exceptions for certain types of country music or certain artists.
I’m not anti-Billboard. I happen to think that a lot of popular music is very good. One thing I found interesting was that in the midst of the declining popular music starting in about the 90s, there was a song that was top on the charts that was a collaboration between Carlos Santana and Rob Thomas called “Smooth,” which is a great song. It stands in stark contrast to the popular rap music with its complex Latin rhythms and melody and lyrics that are actually song to follow the melody. So a song is not necessarily bad because it is popular.
I tend to agree with people that it is rap that has destroyed popular music, but I think the roots of this go back much further. At some point, the emphasis on talent was exchanged for an emphasis on appearance. Someone like Bob Dylan or Janis Joplin, regardless of their obvious talent, would have trouble making it in the music business today as a solo artist next to people like Britney Spears, who has no talent apart from pretty eyes and boobs. Listen closely to Britney Spears – she has trouble holding a tune and she has no vibrato in her voice. She can’t sing, but she is on top (or she was). It’s not just rap music – popular music seems to be dominated by ostentatious displays that put actual talent in the back seat. And in that kind of environment, gangsta rap, with its central offensive flamboyancy, is obviously going to bubble to the top.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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"Re Country Music: Alt country (eg Jason and the Scorchers) continues to be the most unappreciated popular music genre in the world today. And how anyone on a Firefly board can knock country music is a little mystifying"
Well, I can't stand country. I do love Allison Krauss, though........I am the lucky one.....
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I would agree that it seems to take a downturn in the mid 90's. My point was not anti-rap. I do state I like the later stuff in my post. I just think the musical integrity is lost, that the masses are sheep and are being force fed some of this shit. The lyrics have gone in the toilet, and...Where are the musicians?
For the record...My favorite bands, musicians, or performers are.....
The used, The cure, Taking Back Sunday, The misfits, Allison Krauss, The outfield, R. Stones, B. Marley, Iron Maiden, Fleetwood Mac, and Motha fu*kin Bach..........Well, with a sprinkle of New Order....
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
You guys are making yourselves sound very old.
Everyone thinks music was great when they were young, and the new stuff is crap.
Next, you'll be chasing kids off your lawn.
LOL! But I'm only 24 and I agree with them entirely! I can't stand listening to the majority of the newer stuff. When I look at my music collection, it's mostly 1930s - 1970s. Sure I loved some of the 80s pop music; I grew up listening to it because of my older sister. But I agree that music started going downhill in the early 90s. I mostly hate rap. But I do enjoy some of eminem's music. It's entertaining and funny. Do I have any of his CDs? Nope. I like Kanye West, but then he uses a lot of actual music and his lyrics are very clever. I have both of his CDs. But he's about it for me when it comes to rap.
The newer artists that I've fallen in love with recently - I have to thank the online community for helping me find them. I've discovered a lot of artists from watching X-Files and Firefly fanvids: Keri Noble, Patty Griffin, K's Choice... Especially the first two. I ran out and bought ALL of their CDs. Not a bad song between the two of them.
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It's not just popular music, I listen to some pretty weird stuff (alternative - and mean the proper, real alternative, not that junk they play on the radio and call alternative) and there's been a huge downward spiral since about '95. Every now and again some decent song comes along, but most part it's awful, and even bands that used to be good start producing rubbish that for some reason sells more copies.
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Quote:
Originally posted by hughff:
Re Country Music: Alt country (eg Jason and the Scorchers) continues to be the most unappreciated popular music genre in the world today. And how anyone on a Firefly board can knock country music is a little mystifying - the soundtrack of our BDH's lives is heavier on the C&W than any other genre, including east asian ethnic.
It was actually my love for Firefly that kindled my new love for american roots/bluegrass/country music (Check out the soundtrack to the movie "Songcatcher"). Not the new stuff mind you (with the exception of Alison Krauss and Old Crow Medicine Show), but the classics: Johnny Cash, Dolly Parton, and Emmylou Harris. Also my love for Loreena McKinnet and Caroline LaVelle's celtic-inspired world music is another direct influence of Firefly on my musical tastes.
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Pretty much what has happened to music is the corporate radio station. Companies like Clear Channel have pretty much ruined the music business. There is some great music out there you just have to look harder than usual to find it. It is next to impossible to find a good independent radio station anymore. I mostly listen to NPR now in my car on the way to work and back just so I don't have to hear the same crappy Hinder or flavor of the month pop/hip hop song every rutting day.
Even 89.7 The River here in Omaha is starting to get on my nerves. For every decent rock tune they put out there are two crappy ones they have to play twice. My home town of Iowa City has the local university station that I would listen to everyday. Some of their music was crappy, but some was real good, and the best part was that 80% of the bands I have never heard of or listened to before.
I crave variety and musical talent, not the next Beyonce song that sounds like the last one. 
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As I see it, the industry quite simply wants to condition large amounts of people to enjoy mindless drivel, because then they can sell mindless drivel in huge quantities without having to look for any actual talent. Noticed in the last few years there hasn't been much in the way of manufactured "boy bands"? The reason for this is that the industry has re-focused their manufactured pap by misappropriating the term "R&B" so they can target a larger audience than the traditional 12-year old schoolgirl market.
Also wasn't rap/hip-hop a lot better back in the 80s and early 90s? Edgy, intelligent, funky stuff like Public Enemy and De La Soul, but now it's idiots like 50 Cent. I'm hoping that out there somewhere, there's some talented, charismatic black kid who's just come across his uncle's collection of James Brown, Edwin Starr, Parliament/Funkadelic and the like, and in a couple of years say what needs to be said and kick things into shape.
One thing the past few years - here in the UK at least - has been the phenomena of taking the entire instrumental portion of a hit record from a number of years ago, and replacing the vocals with some vacuous bimbo singing all the wrong words.
I wouldn't dismiss programmed music outhand, there has been some great music made using sampling and programming by those who take the time and effort, but then it is the technology that makes it easy just to knock out a half-arsed 4-4 beat and make do.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Redlava:
Pretty much what has happened to music is the corporate radio station. Companies like Clear Channel have pretty much ruined the music business. There is some great music out there you just have to look harder than usual to find it. It is next to impossible to find a good independent radio station anymore.
Exactly!
"I am your father, Luke. Give in to the Dark Side, you nob!" - Doug McKenzie
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Wow!! this is exactly what I was thinking the other day on the way to my softball game, only I thought it was because I was getting old.
The seek button on my truck has all the printing worn off it from over use. What does that have to say about the music industry? In fact, why do you think the car manufacturers are putting those buttons on the steering wheel anyway.
Most people that have posted here, young and ... older, have said they lean towards the older music. That's where my seek button pauses now, on The Eagles, CCR, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Jimmy Buffet and most definitely Billy Joel. I think it's because while it may not have always been 'good' music, it was at the very least music.
Take a look at American Idol or Canadian Idol. Watch to see what songs the kids are picking to sing. Watch to see where the industry wants them to sing and how to look, THAT'S whats happened to music.
I'm not a big fan of Country music or Rap, but I do like some of each. I liked Wil Smith, Fugees and even the Humpty Hump. But angry Gansta Rap??? C'mon.
I'm finding I like Norah Jones, and any artist that breaks the mold and sings something different.
K-OS is a great new sound. Harkens back to the hip-hop, funk sounds. Put The Crab In The Bucket was his first hit.
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Quote:Norah Jones won 5 Grammies almost right out the door singing tunes more reminiscent of the 1950s then 2007. What that says to me is that people are really pining for real music song with a beautiful voice, but something is making this current crap more profitable. I don’t know what it is.
Originally posted by safeat2nd:
I'm finding I like Norah Jones, and any artist that breaks the mold and sings something different.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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My main dislike is "artists" that don't actually sing. "Singing" means using one's voice as an instrument, acheiving different vocal effects through tone, modulation, pace (yes, rap qualifies). There are too many "singers" these days that just yell in time (sometimes) to the music.
Strangely enough, I've come to love Japanese rap. I think it's cause the language is better suited to short, sharp, clearly-defined syllables than English is.
The other thing is that music (like all art) needs to have some emotional core, even if it's just exhuberance (yeah, I'll even listen to pop music, as long as it makes me feel something). As someone once said WRT the new Battlestar Galactica: It's a mistake to think that "drama/emotion" has to mean "always serious."
This is why I can't stand my mom's shmaltzy "folk music" (one guy warbling a tune that was old when mom was a child, usually religious, talking about how great God is, carefully free of anything emotional or potentially new, unexpected, or offensive).
Of course, I also like my music from all over the world, in as many languages as I can find it, which is a problem when the local charts don't include anything from outside NorAm.
Some examples from my current playlist (on this machine; I have other music elsewhere):
"Broken Road" (by Rascal Flatts)
"Une Monde Sans Danger" (extended French theme song to Code Lyoko)
"Pride" (by High and Mighty Color, the theme song from Gundam Seed Destiny. Features a pop ballad backed by rap)
"You Mai You Lai" (by. . . by all means. I heard it in an AMV)
"5. Marz" (by Megaherz)
"Nothing Else Matters" (as performed by Gregorian Monks, an English ballad turned into a Latin chant)
"Baila Morena" (by Zucchero)
"Tu Hai Kahan" (by Junaid Jamshed)
"Ding Dong" (by Yuki Hsu. Mandarin pop)
"Rithill Aill" (by Karen Matheson)
"St. Elmo's Fire" (by John Parr)
"Wayward Son" (by the Eagles)
"A Place in Time" (extended version of the theme from The 4400)
"John The Revelator" (by Depeche Mode)
"Dangerous" (by Hilary Duff)
"What if I Stumble" (by DC Talk)
"Rise" (extended version of the theme from Ghost in the Shell: SAC: 2nd Gig. Japanese/Russian fusion, composed by Yoko Kanno and performed by Origa)
"Warriors" (by Freedom Call)
"Metal Invasion" (by Freedom Call)
"Holy Knight" (by Freedom Call)
"Hero Nation" (by Freedom Call)
"Could It Be" (by Christie Carlson Romano --the Kim/Ron love theme from Kim Possible)
"Listen To Your Heart" (the slow version, by Dht)
"Fields of Hope" (the Japanese version, performed by Lacus Clyne [played by Tanaka Rie] in Gundam Seed Destiny)
"Emotion" (performed in Japanese by Lacus Clyne and Meer Campbell)
"Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego" (the theme by Rockapella)
"Don't Download This Song" (by Weird Al)
"Shounen Heart" (the second opening from Eureka 7. Rappish jazz/pop)
"Rewrite" (by Asian Kung-Fu Generation, from Fullmetal Alchemist)
"Go" (by Amy Diamond)
"Shooting Star" (by Amy Diamond)
"Welcome to the City" (by Amy Diamond)
"Champion" (by Amy Diamond)
"First Day of my Life" (by Mel C --formerly Sporty Spice)
"Next Best Superstar" (by Mel C)
"D-Technolife" (by UVERworld, from Bleach)
"Ghost Riders in the Sky" (covered by Spiderbait, from Ghost Rider)
"Remember the Name" (by Fort Minor)
"I Still Believe" (by Hayden Panettiere --who plays Claire on Heroes)
"Moon on the Water" (by Maho & Koyuki, from Beck: Mongolian Chop Squad)
"Not Ready to Make Nice" (by the Dixie Chicks)
(I just realized; all my Evanescence and Within Temptation are on the other computer. 
)
-----
We applied the cortical electrodes but were unable to get a neural reaction from either patient.
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The execs and the corporate stations are messing with our music.
Over on Tash's site, www.strangefinger.com, we created a music board so we could share good music. Shall we share some of our finds here? A couple of years ago I had Fisher ( http://www.fishertheband.com/index.html) handed to me. Not my first choice (I like rock), but I love the leads voice. Very nice.
Who's next?
---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
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TWG, I had heard their song Dirty Girl before. Not a bad group.
You know what I think is missing from today's music? Where's the story tellers gone?
Anywho, here's two Canadian groups for those who like music from around the world.
http://www.k-osmusic.com/home.asp Kinda a Rap, Hip-Hop, Disco blend.
http://www.greatbigsea.com/themusic/rantroar.aspx What I call "down east" music, or "down home". Definite Keltic flair to it.
_______________________________________________________________
"Got a headful of lightning
And a heart full of rain
And I know that I said
I'd never do it again
Oh and I love you sweet baby but I always take the long way home."
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I don't know too much about the music industry and it's intricacies (other than most pop music sucks nowadays), which is why I normally steer clear of discussions like this.
But what I do know is that I consider iTunes to be something of both a blessing and a curse. A curse in that some stuff isn't available for dumb reasons, but a blessing in that I can discover something I normally wouldn't have and feel like I uncovered buried treasure.
Yesterday, I was checking iTunes to see if there was anything new that warranted me getting a 20 dollar card to purchase. I see a tab that has "Knocked Up' on it. I click on it and discover that it's actually called "Strange Weirdos - Music from and inspired by "Knocked Up" by Loudon Wainwright III. So it's a soundtrack/latest album from the guy who not only had a small part in the movie (as the OB-GYN they finally settle on), as well as Judd's good luck charm (he was the father in UNDECLARED and the minister that marries Andy and Trish in THE 40 YEAR OLD VIRGIN), but who also did some of the music in the movie.
Now, I had heard that he's a singer that acts, as opposed to an actor who sings, but I appreciated him more for his acting talent than his singing and songwriting. And the main reason I got the album was because of the association with KNOCKED UP (which BTW is an amazing comedy and the first true movie of the summer), and I recognized the score and the song from the end of the movie "Daughter". Well, I listen to the whole album today, and it's the best full album I've loved since "LOVE" by The Beatles. The album both works as a greek chorus of the film that perfectly tells the story of the movie and complements the film. And it also works as a stand-alone album from Loudon that showcases his funny and poetically insightful songwriting and his wise, romantic and melancholic singing voice.
It's just an incredibly beautiful album (I almost hesitate to call it a soundtrack because only a few of the tracks are in the actual movie) that I'm glad I discovered by accident.
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that if one can discover these little gems amidst the American Idol rejects and the disposable rappers and corporately manufactured dreck, and for those gems to be available to everyone, then the industry must be doing something right, even if it's by accident.
**************************************************
"Have you ever fired two guns whilst jumping through the air?"
"No."
"Have you ever fired ONE gun whilst jumping through the air?"
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Is it weird that I'm 16, and yet with the exception of Kenny Loggins in 84(?) and Guns n Roses in 88, I actually know, and prefer more of the songs from before 1980 than from after it?
I much prefer music from the 70s, 80s and early 90s, being that most of my favourite bands are now either old, split up or dead.
Though I can't believe that not even Nirvana were in it.
Someone should do one for the English charts.
I kissed a frog once, and it turned into an investment banker.
It was horrific.
98% of teens have smoked pot, if you are one of the 2% that haven't, copy this into your signature
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I think I'm going to be going out on a limb here, by saying that I don't, in fact, have a definite predisposition towards older music. Sure there's lots of older stuff I like, even love, but, the stuff i really go for are the gems among the new stuff. So maybe you have to look to find them, but hey, means the tickets for the gigs are cheaper.
The old stuff is what gives the new stuff I like depth, gives it a background and context, but I don't believe that it's inherently better, and I don't believe that the music industry is in 'decline,' it is after all an industry, it's principle concern is making money. Not sure why that seems so offensive to some. You want to listen to some really good, inventive music, get out and find it, whole worlds just waiting, and the discoveries are all the sweeter for having needed some effort.
They may think their sins are original, but for the most part they are petty and repetitive.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Oddsbodskins:
I think I'm going to be going out on a limb here, by saying that I don't, in fact, have a definite predisposition towards older music. Sure there's lots of older stuff I like, even love, but, the stuff i really go for are the gems among the new stuff. So maybe you have to look to find them, but hey, means the tickets for the gigs are cheaper.
The old stuff is what gives the new stuff I like depth, gives it a background and context, but I don't believe that it's inherently better, and I don't believe that the music industry is in 'decline,' it is after all an industry, it's principle concern is making money. Not sure why that seems so offensive to some. You want to listen to some really good, inventive music, get out and find it, whole worlds just waiting, and the discoveries are all the sweeter for having needed some effort.
Agreed.
"A witty saying proves nothing." Voltaire
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I don’t think anyone was saying that the music industry is in decline. I think we are talking about the quality of the music is declining. The industry is obviously doing very well, but it’s doing very well with music that doesn’t seem to have nearly the quality of music from the past. And you’re right there is a lot of popular music that is very good. I made that point earlier. The point that is puzzling is that this music that is good doesn’t seem to have as much popularity as the music that isn’t really that good. I don’t know how to quantify that. I’m not music critic or musician, but like most people I do listen. It’s just an impression that I get from listening to the radio and watching what songs and artists seem to be the most popular. Now maybe I’m just getting old as someone suggested earlier. I have no doubt that could be part of it, but I don’t find myself shaking my finger at young people for their choice of music, because quite frequently, even many younger people seem to agree with me. I think there really is something tangible behind the observation that the quality of popular music is declining, in general.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Well I'd agree with you that the vast majority of music which is successful is shite, there are some bands which are both good and popular, few and far between admittedly, but do you think perhaps the past might be getting painted in a rather selective way, I mean, not every heavy rock band was a Zeppelin, not every solo singer was a Dylan, perhaps ability did make it easier to get to the top, but I'm thinking maybe not so much as we're all supposing.
As for the distinction between the music industry and the music it's creating, mere semantics 
No you're right, i should have recognised the distinction, was in a bit of a rush to be going out, just wanted to make the point more for everyone blaming the execs, nobody made making brilliant music part of their job description, just making money, can't really hold them to account for it.
Perhaps the declining taste of the masses has a lot to do with the masses not taking music quite as seriously as some do, and not having the time or inclination to make a point of tracking down the best music about. The masses have enough time and inclination to listen to what's readily available, and if the industry recognizes this, and recognizes that it can make some shortcuts with what's available, well, as we've both agreed, it is after all an industry. So maybe it leaves a few of us feeling rather disgruntled, the masses are happy, the industries happy, how often can that be said of any kind of business?
They may think their sins are original, but for the most part they are petty and repetitive.
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Quote:
Originally posted by traveler:
I would comment on Rap, but I actually don't listen to it. It gives me a headache is about all I can say.
Me too! It's just noise--offensive noise. I had to omit BET and MTV channels from my cable because I couldn't even flip by w/o seeing some barely dressed girl wiggling her butt at a guy. I have young kids and I don't want them seeing that crap.
I gave up listening to the radio because of too much talk and adds. I have an mp3/CD player in my car. Mostly I listen to soundtracks (like Firefly, LOTR etc.) Occasionally I buy something current like Chris Daughtry.
Quote:
Originally posted by Cybersnark:
My main dislike is "artists" that don't actually sing. "Singing" means using one's voice as an instrument, acheiving different vocal effects through tone, modulation, pace (yes, rap qualifies). There are too many "singers" these days that just yell in time (sometimes) to the music.
I think there are too many artists today who look pretty but have little actual singing talent. Video really did kill the radio star.
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It's been dying for almost 100 years now
Elvis was the Start maybe while Pop and Punk and Rap was the trash, Rap isn't even music.
So get educated about Kanye-oids ?
Montreal's Concordia University To Offer Entire Course on Kanye West
https://hypebeast.com/2022/3/montreal-canada-concordia-university-offe
ring-entire-kanye-west-course-news
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This thread is from a few months before my time here.
For some years now, I've heard many of all ages lament at the preponderance of Ghetto, as bad as it gets.
Even the Super Bowl decided to go Ghetto this year.
No, rap is not music. Those are mutually exclusive terms.
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Quote:Lately Adele has been doing exclusive concerts on TV, filling whole nights on like Sundays. Maybe she wants to show off her svelte figure.
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
This thread is from a few months before my time here.
For some years now, I've heard many of all ages lament at the preponderance of Ghetto, as bad as it gets.
Even the Super Bowl decided to go Ghetto this year.
No, rap is not music. Those are mutually exclusive terms.
But with the relative dearth of music available lately, even her decade old tunes are a welcome respite from the noise. I'm not sure if these would have been quite so comparably spectacular a half decade or more ago.
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That's not true. Rap IS music.
It's not music that you care for, and just like any genre there is a LOT of objectively bad rap music.
If you want to find good Rap, you need to look at independent labels. All the big labels shovel out is awful messages of drugs, murder, men abusing women and women controlling men with sex.
It's not all like that.
Quote:
They separate us from our neighbors and they call it social distancing
It's actually a bigger plan, it's called social conditioning
They took away our privacy there's always someone listening
They're rigging the elections, planning riots for the citizens
The government has always lied, it's history repeating
But the problem is the schools dumb you down so you believe 'em
If you try to speak the truth inside a Tweet then they delete it
Whole administration's Satanists who claim they praising Jesus
Every year there's a new name for enemies that we're facing, it's
Al-Qaeda, then ISIS, and now American patriots
Who woulda thought those who love the country the most
Would be hated on by folks who call America home
Both political parties are equally just as evil
They been working for themselves, don't give a damn 'bout the people
Black, white, yellow, brown, humanity needs you
'Cause united we stand, divided they will defeat you
The man on the news says the problem is me
I'm just a small-town boy with big American dreams
The world's going crazy and they lying to us
Don't know who to believe, so in God we trust
Y'all missing what was written in them pages
That was history they wrote, now you wanna change it
You racist, you hate this
Why you want us all to be locked up in cages?
I can't stand the left, everything they say's depressing
Ship 'em to the Middle East, they can learn oppression
Believe me, I mean this quite literal
I love liberty but I hate white liberals
Wear a mask, stay home, complain and moan
Talk about privilege on your phone in your Range Rove
Starbucks mango foo-foo whatever
The cloth I'm cut from can handle any weather
You just paper in the rain, we ain't the same
Stand for the flag, only kneel when I pray
I just pray we go back to the old days
Land of the free, home of the brave
The man on the news says the problem is me
I'm just a small-town boy with big American dreams
The world's going crazy and they lying to us
Don't know who to believe, so in God we trust
Yeah
Uh
I see through all the illusions
Refuse to hear the rumors or accept that we are losing
Easy to get caught up, consumed by the consumer
Truth is so diluted people starve off they confusion
Comfort is the killer, your dreams execution
Cool persecution if I make a contribution
Home of the brave look like a mental institution
And there will be revolution if we can't find resolution
And a threat is a promise, stand up, pay homage
They tell lies, I'm being honest, test of time is upon us
I know that God got us so I'm fighting in His honor
Hear the cries of the crusaders as we strapping up our armor
Either set sail to higher ground or drown in they drama
If I die for what I love then my death'll be nirvana
We fighting for our freedom, don't believe what they been feeding
Be the change you wanna see, the warrior that we're needing
The man on the news says the problem is me
I'm just a small-town boy with big American dreams
The world's going crazy and they lying to us
Don't know who to believe, so in God we trust
We don't trust the news, the government, or pharma
We just want freedom, do you have that to offer
We don't want the lies, the politics, or the drama
We just want the life that was promised by our fathers
We don't trust the news, the government, or pharma
We just want freedom, do you have that to offer
We don't want the lies, the politics, or the drama
We just want the life that was promised by oNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Thanks for posting the lyrics.
Silly Percussion Poems with Curse Profanity words that's what to call Rap although I guess there is a way to do it 'well' lyrics that are not mindless, when they use electronic tones to Chords it falls into the genre of hiphop. Rap was not the first to do word and sound and politics and rythm, you had rhythmically Yodeling, other vocal sounds from Asia and Latin America and Africa and the North American Indian culture, Flyting is a ritual, poetic exchange of insults. The people in that vid I guess its 'Rap' but it could be called something else, they play Instruments, they can harmonize Vocals, tune a guitar by ear guitar, real Rap does not to even be in Harmony, have any melodic scale or play a single chord. I always liked the old jazz, swing, blues Scat singing but its not Rap and I guess Rap has its own skills, there is skill to spinning old vinyl records in the hood the Beatboxing, make the beat with Turntablism, Jamaica Disco jungle dancehall sounds, producing a sound that is Ghetto house. Rap is more raw but I'm not sure what to call mumble rap it is far far worse than any bad Punk or Heavy Metal, maybe Mumble-Rap since it is not Rapping is a type of noise? Pop music itself has become very on the grid, formula and sterile, Rap and pop have become the same for me I might tolerate pop more than Rap because once in a while in pop you find people who can sing without auto-tune or you find people who know their instrument.
Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:
Any thoughts?
R-Kelly is a pedophile, Britney is messed in the head, a lot of the modern ones are not making music, no melody, no harmony, soemtimes they will not even use three or four notes together 'chords' and the so called musicians themselves and are tone deaf.
Back in the day people even if they played simple chord and melody they at least had to be able to sing with a song, clap in time, keep the beat or sing in tune without the aid of machines or they learned an instrument.
Modern music is beyond fake.
but there are nice moments among the noise and crowds
Man plays Matisyahu song not realizing Matisyahu is listening to him
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
Thanks for posting the lyrics.
You're welcome.
Quote:
Silly Percussion Poems with Curse Profanity words that's what to call Rap although I guess there is a way to do it 'well' lyrics that are not mindless, when they use electronic tones to Chords it falls into the genre of hiphop. Rap was not the first to do word and sound and politics and rythm, you had rhythmically Yodeling, other vocal sounds from Asia and Latin America and Africa and the North American Indian culture, Flyting is a ritual, poetic exchange of insults. The people in that vid I guess its 'Rap' but it could be called something else, they play Instruments, they can harmonize Vocals, tune a guitar by ear guitar, real Rap does not to even be in Harmony, have any melodic scale or play a single chord. I always liked the old jazz, swing, blues Scat singing but its not Rap and I guess Rap has its own skills, there is skill to spinning old vinyl records in the hood the Beatboxing, make the beat with Turntablism, Jamaica Disco jungle dancehall sounds, producing a sound that is Ghetto house. Rap is more raw but I'm not sure what to call mumble rap it is far far worse than any bad Punk or Heavy Metal, maybe Mumble-Rap since it is not Rapping is a type of noise? Pop music itself has become very on the grid, formula and sterile, Rap and pop have become the same for me I might tolerate pop more than Rap because once in a while in pop you find people who can sing without auto-tune or you find people who know their instrument.
There was always good rap music, but that's not what anybody ever hears on the radio. Just like Pop Rock music is usually trash that nobody remembers 3 years later, Pop Rap is a bunch of mindless bullshit. Unfortunately though, the messaging in the crap Pop Rap is usually really bad for society if the kids grow up trying to emulate it.
Tom MacDonald has some really good stuff. That is my favorite song by him though.
"No Lives Matter" is his second best, IMO. Then probably "Snowflake".
--------------------------------------------------
Falsus in unum, falsus in omnibus
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Music has been dead for years some could say
To learn a complex pop song these days someone might teach you 4 Chords...getting technical.
Root described by a Roman numeral 'I' then 'vi' or 6th and ii also known as 2nd chord and a Rome letter V or 5 used to be trendy sequence, from the musical note 'C' that is C - minor a then minor at 440 hz or 880 hz then chord/note d and 'G Major'
a sequence of chords can go in fashion or out of fashion, now another sequence is trendy or 'cool'.
sometimes they won't even use Melody or Chords, just a bass and mumble rap and some beat and its called 'music'
Other times they might just use 2 Chords
Some hip-hop guy named 'Drake' might have used 1 power chord through an entire song, I'm not sure since most songs I will switch off or change the radio after 2-3 seconds
Some have even tried to copyright the minor scale to get music pulled from the internet, Ed Sheeran won a copyright trial, Musicians supported the win
4 Chord song never been so relevant
if you are tone deaf you might not understand the vid but there are chord changes and each chord is the same for every song, every song sounds the same because it is.
It has all been done in pop already.
The scanning bots and Record Companies and machines scanning the web for scale and chord do not care
a new song gets coins sucked away by web robots acting as lawyer, demonetized and banned, the machine wants to take the money then give it to a record company that wants to control all 'pop', selling false lies, incorrectly claiming they invented chords or the minor scale.
What is the minor scale - Natural Minor its like the Major
Do Re Mi Fa So La Ti do
but you drop 3 notes by half a tone
Do Rema Fa Solaytay do
On guitar or Bass you Do Not need perfect pitch, tune up the instrument and play the formula, using whole steps and half steps, a Whole is two frets of the Guitar / Bass, a Half is a jump to the next Fret,
Whole step, half step, whole step, whole step, half step, whole step, whole step, sometimes abbreviated to W W H W W W H.
On a piano to play Natural minor you start on 'A' and play all white keys
People can also learn with zero musical theory and just being good listeners, observing others.
they say Major is happy and Minor invokes other moods/emotions like sadness, romance, melancholy, loss, reflection, it can also be spooky or blue or country or wistfulness...these notes and chords have been around thousands of years, the record company did not invent them.
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'Punk' is another of those genres, I think it is missing the pure music, what makes something sound smooth or harmonious
I used to listen to it, find the music kinda 'Loud' now
but Punk usually had very good lyrics, if for example a band like Pussy Riot a Russian feminist protest and performance art group learned how to play correctly they might have lost that edge
going back to 'Pop' and accused of awful things by a family member.
Ricky Martin and husband Jwan 'had an OPEN marriage'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-12271621/Ricky-Martin-hu
sband-Jwan-OPEN-marriage.html
Latin pop reggaeton disc-dance club music
Does not play any Instrument(s) ?
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I have been enjoying something called throat trumpeting. Does this differ from shouting?
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Quote:I think I used the wrong term.
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
I have been enjoying something called throat trumpeting. Does this differ from shouting?
"Mouth trumpeting" is what I heard, as described by Naomi Gomez, and she is the first I heard really belt it out.
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You can also mean this JSF. Throat singing
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Hate to Love: Nickelback - Documentary Trailer
Quote:
Originally posted by Brenda:
You can also mean this JSF. Throat singing
I think he means Trumpet like Black Face Louis Armstrong in Japan
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Improvisation of Mongolian Throat singing
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Music Amy Hanaialii Gilliom, the Hawaiian tradition of female falsetto
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Oliver Anthony’s ‘powerful’ Rich Men North of Richmond song goes viral on TikTok
https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2023/08/11/oliver-anthonys-powerful-rich-me
n-north-of-richmond-song-goes-viral-on-tiktok/
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Auto Tune
C'Mon Man
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Why does Joe Biden*'s chin look like floppy camel toe these days?
I think his skin suit is failing him.
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
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Artificial intelligence to bring Elvis Presley to London stage with 'never seen before' performances
https://news.sky.com/story/artificial-intelligence-to-bring-elvis-pres
ley-to-london-stage-with-never-seen-before-performances-13041602
and music changed music?
maybe not so much
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
Artificial intelligence to bring Elvis Presley to London stage with 'never seen before' performances
--------------------------------------------------
Political correctness is just tyranny, with a smiley face.
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P Diddy Makes An Apology Video For Smacking His Woman Around After Disturbing Video Is Released
https://vidmax.com/video/227748-p-diddy-makes-an-apology-video-for-sma
cking-his-woman-around-after-disturbing-video-is-released
away from the drama
'Jazz'
myths of improvisation
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
P Diddy Makes An Apology Video For Smacking His Woman Around After Disturbing Video Is Released
https://vidmax.com/video/227748-p-diddy-makes-an-apology-video-for-sma
cking-his-woman-around-after-disturbing-video-is-released
That's nice.
No apology yet for the pedophilia though, huh?
--------------------------------------------------
Trump will be fine.
He will also be your next President.
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is it getting better though from years of 'Crazy Frog'...and a bad video of a woman dancing with bad jazz?
Orphic Oxtra - Iceland Turkish Jeiwsh nonsense? also known for Kebab diskó
13 members of an out-of-tune Balkan-style band
All the members of Orphic Oxtra have trouble staying in tune or tuning the instrument?
Árni Guðjónsson on Tuba/Piano
Bergrún Snæbjörnsdóttir on Alt horn
Finnur Karlsson on Bariton horn
Gunnar Gunnsteinsson on Bass
Halldór Smárason on Piano/Harmonica
Halldór Sveinsson on Violin
Haukur Þór Harðarson on Basuna
Helgi Rúnar Heiðarsson on Saxophone
María Ösp Ómarsdóttir on Flute
Sigrún Jónsdóttir on Klarinet
Óskar Kjartansson on Drums
Ragnhildur Gunnarsdóttir on Trumpet
Jóhannes Þorleiksson on Trumpet
Rick suffers through the Top 10s
Are These REALLY the Top 10 Songs in the WORLD?
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
Rick suffers through the Top 10s
Are These REALLY the Top 10 Songs in the WORLD?
Rick Beato is great.
LOL... It's great watching these guys suffer through a top pop list. This "music" is awful. They're a lot more generous to some of these "artists" than I would be.
You ever watch his video on "The Most COMPLEX Pop Song of All Time"?
I love how he adds his own back story into some of his videos, and how him and his jazz band buddies blew the gig because they couldn't figure it out in time.
That is one of the first songs I remember hearing on the radio when I was a little kid. I always knew there was something special about it, but it wasn't until I saw Beato's video almost 40 years later than I knew why.
Channels like Rick's are gold and make up for all the trash that people put up everyday. They justify the existence of YouTube.
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I wasn't familiar with that song 'Never Gonna Let You Go'
but Yeah I remember that vid, Rick he's a skilled jazz guy and educated and before he was an audio engineer he was a good player so assumed a 'pop song' would be normal and easy. I wasn't familiar with the song but great song, its not really my groove or style or tempo or chords or energy...too romantic maybe or emo but I respect it and I think its probably a lyrics piece and melody from the heart. I haven't played in a while but with notes I could probably chance playing it on something bass or piano but I would do it with notes, not something you just go and wing-it easily. I'm not that good on guitar and Rick is a far better player than me. Logically you'd take it in blocks verse, chorus, solo, bridge, verse, chorus or something...in most songs there is a simple code or pattern, even if it seems complex you might figure out oh its Modal Funky Mixolydian or Phrygian Latin...but not this... but it has so many changes I don't know what it was like G Major or starts in F sharp minor or then it goes to a type of G progression and then a different B flat Major progression then another change. It looked like a nighmare to learn quick, everytime you think you've figured it out it jumps somewhere like a Classical song doing weird key changes but there is no logic to it that you can easily see or I can not see anyway. Maybe he or she who wrote the song had some Latin or Brazilian or Jewish or Folk song Rock logic but I could not see a pattern, I was a little lost following Rick who he himself still seemed kinda lost??? its not like it drop to the Fifth and changes Key major to Minor or jump to the Fourth or up to the Fifth, there are like single tone and half tone changes. Is that a Super Mario video game Cadence?...no its not going where you expect, its another change. You would probably have to tape some stick note paper to the side of a mic or piano that you could take a quick glance at. Most pop songs are simple 3 Chord tricks or even 2 and the changes within are simple but that song travels to all kinds of places. With all the weird Chord changes Sus, inversion, it seems almost more complicated like a complex Classical Music or Jazz piece but even those simple Cadence, 'Baroque' can have a standard logic to them, easy Jazz standard 2 V 1? I would think the guy or girl just wrote out melody and lyrics and then people with an ear figured out how to put Chords to it which is why it goes almost 'Everywhere'. I wonder if it does have a true pattern somewhere if the notes were wrote out does something, a visible pattern of notes jump out at you, I'm thinking no and it was a piece of his emotions inside broadcast and then recorded.
Great story of them trying to do it on the fly without much practice, 'pride comes before a fall' haughtiness and hubris and humor... I will definitely watch the vid again. I've no intention of ever 'Learning It' if Rick Beato can't play it. It's strange that with all the odd changes the song never really soounds 'out' maybe there is like some kind of bossa trick or pattern to it but hidden inside?
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I looked it up, husband and wife team of Cynthia Weil and Barry Mann are given credits, they are NYC and not Latin but 'Artists' and ...I dunno....maybe 2 people made a song more crazy? they were probably arguing over the few days that they wrote it which way it would go and this perhaps would explain why it got so Schizo with the crazy changes.
watching some of the vid now, the Song is even crazier than I remember
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and yes it has gone more 'simple'
Popular songs are simpler and more repetitive than they used to be
https://www.science.org/content/article/popular-songs-are-simpler-and-
more-repetitive-they-used-be
interesting one here for non-musicians or people who can't read, and its interesting how it goes in different directions like down or sideways
Lego style
'Sound Blocks'
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
I wasn't familiar with that song 'Never Gonna Let You Go'
but Yeah I remember that vid, Rick he's a skilled jazz guy and educated and before he was an audio engineer he was a good player so assumed a 'pop song' would be normal and easy. I wasn't familiar with the song but great song, its not really my groove or style or tempo or chords or energy...too romantic maybe or emo but I respect it and I think its probably a lyrics piece and melody from the heart.
Haha... Yeah... I don't think Emo was a thing back in the early 1980s. I don't imagine this one would have gotten much play on MTV either, had MTV even been a thing when it came out in 1983. This was more "Adult Contemporary" than anything else, and that probably wasn't even in the Lexicon back in 1983 either. I think it was songs like this from around that time that ended up becoming "Adult Contemporary". I'd hear this on the same radio stations that had Chicago and Bread... whatever my mom listened to at the time. I didn't even know until Beato's video about it that it was by Sergio Mendes. I think in the back of my mind I always thought it was Michael McDonald.
Quote:
I haven't played in a while but with notes I could probably chance playing it on something bass or piano but I would do it with notes, not something you just go and wing-it easily. I'm not that good on guitar and Rick is a far better player than me. Logically you'd take it in blocks verse, chorus, solo, bridge, verse, chorus or something...in most songs there is a simple code or pattern, even if it seems complex you might figure out oh its Modal Funky Mixolydian or Phrygian Latin...but not this... but it has so many changes I don't know what it was like G Major or starts in F sharp minor or then it goes to a type of G progression and then a different B flat Major progression then another change. It looked like a nighmare to learn quick, everytime you think you've figured it out it jumps somewhere like a Classical song doing weird key changes but there is no logic to it that you can easily see or I can not see anyway. Maybe he or she who wrote the song had some Latin or Brazilian or Jewish or Folk song Rock logic but I could not see a pattern, I was a little lost following Rick who he himself still seemed kinda lost??? its not like it drop to the Fifth and changes Key major to Minor or jump to the Fourth or up to the Fifth, there are like single tone and half tone changes. Is that a Super Mario video game Cadence?...no its not going where you expect, its another change. You would probably have to tape some stick note paper to the side of a mic or piano that you could take a quick glance at. Most pop songs are simple 3 Chord tricks or even 2 and the changes within are simple but that song travels to all kinds of places. With all the weird Chord changes Sus, inversion, it seems almost more complicated like a complex Classical Music or Jazz piece but even those simple Cadence, 'Baroque' can have a standard logic to them, easy Jazz standard 2 V 1? I would think the guy or girl just wrote out melody and lyrics and then people with an ear figured out how to put Chords to it which is why it goes almost 'Everywhere'. I wonder if it does have a true pattern somewhere if the notes were wrote out does something, a visible pattern of notes jump out at you, I'm thinking no and it was a piece of his emotions inside broadcast and then recorded.
I envy you for having all that knowledge about music. At least 10% of the words you used there went over my head, actually.
I was never in band or chior, and my last music class would have been back around 3rd grade, learning how to annoy my parents with a recorder. (A cheap plastic abomination of a flute like thing, if that's not what they called them where you hail from).
By the time I tried picking up a guitar, I was already in my early to mid 20's. All I used was tabs to
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
I looked it up, husband and wife team of Cynthia Weil and Barry Mann are given credits, they are NYC and not Latin but 'Artists' and ...I dunno....maybe 2 people made a song more crazy? they were probably arguing over the few days that they wrote it which way it would go and this perhaps would explain why it got so Schizo with the crazy changes.
watching some of the vid now, the Song is even crazier than I remember
lol... this made me laugh.
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Trump will be fine.
He will also be your next President.
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It's been bothering me all day and into the night that there is another song that makes me think of Never Gonna Let You Go and vice versa, but I just couldn't dredge that up out of the depths of my memory...
I finally remembered what it was.
Christopher Cross - Best That You Can Do
Check out the intro to both right after each other. (They're both 14 seconds long)
I told you that I've got zero musical training, and I couldn't tell you what even a basic note was just by hearing it, but there are some real similarities here. There has to be some chord overlap between them. The break between the Chorus and Verse in both of the songs seem real familiar between the two as well. (1:13 on Cross / 1:35 on Mendez)
What I can tell though is that Best That You Can Do would be the "easy" version of Never Gonna Let You Go. My guess after a few listens to both of them is that there are about half as many chords in Christopher Crosses' song.
One might think that Cross "sampled" Mendez's song, but Best That You Can Do came out in 1981 and had Never Gonna Let You Go beat by 2 years. Maybe somebody was really digging what Cross was putting out and made it more complex?
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Quote:
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
I told you that I've got zero musical training, and I couldn't tell you what even a basic note was just by hearing it, but there are some real similarities here.
You don't really need training, you have enough tools and experience to get going and say why they are similar
Rick Beato, the 'Wings of Pegasus' social media discussions you are already getting free training on the level of the college and university
Vocal you probably have some trained instinct hearing you don't know, pitch, tone, you know lyrics you sing you remember lines so you should be able to step outside yourself and do your own analysis
You know chords so you should have some kind of harmony, tempo, melodic tone, timing, know what blends with the bass and drum and your voice and 'sounds right'
Are you asking me to do some analysis...my ears will be different to yours just as we have different experiences of smell or touch and sights and taste for foods
Me I can layer like a DJ I don't sing, I can hold rhythm, play bass, piano chord or vamp, strum or pick something simple on guitar and loop it, I can play rhythm within rhythm a slow long line above or double time, triplets, or swing it or eights, a sixteenth fill underneath while holding a steady bear through the bars, your recorder I never played one but I have no fear to give one a go I seen one before I think the fingering is tricky with holes underneath but I would not fear a penny whistle or Native American Flute I can kind of read notes but slow.
I don't know many chords just tricks to make it seem like I play and I don't sing like you
People have different ears
RICK vid again
'I Admit... I Got Owned'
Rick Beato
Les Hall
maybe he rushed it got a little confused and played it the old J.S Bach way
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Ok I'll give it a go they have a similar wall of sound, a style, music is audio engineered almost in a fashionable way during a period of time a certain way as styles get into fashion or music...the point is to be popular to make money.
There's enough that makes very unique that makes songs not like each other, makes them very different
Passive Listening
Most songs start on the Root note or Tonic chord, your Solfège 'Do' note 'Do-re-mi'
I believe none of these songs begin on the Root note which adds to a feeling of exploration, uncertainty, dreamy, love, melancholic
MaJor is Do mi+ so played together on piano happyish
minor is Do -ma so played together makes it 'sad'
You can minor a scale, by moving along the Major and changing 'La' to your root note
LA TI do' re' mi' fa' so la' ...or maybe I should remove the caps and ' Apostrophe (’) symbol?
an inversion is taken from scales, you take a note from a chord and move it up or down to the Octave Above or Below
do re mi fa so la ti > up to next octave DO Re MI FA SO LA TI DO
on piano notes this is cdefagbCDEFAGB-
you take a note and put it one the bottom ... do mi so ...or ...DO MI SO
becomes 'mi so DO' its the same chord but a slightly different flavor
or you can go 'so DO MI' again same chord different inversion
ACE minor becomes
e A C
or
CEG Major becomes
e g C an inversion
The 'sus' chord removes the 'Third' which is a fancy name the Major/Minor note making the chord very mysterious
Quote:
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
What I can tell though is that Best That You Can Do would be the "easy" version of Never Gonna Let You Go. My guess after a few listens to both of them is that there are about half as many chords in Christopher Crosses' song.
So it seems you already well enough to explain the differences
if you really want to learn there is an archive of questions about theory and intervals and hearing and melodic writing
https://music.stackexchange.com/questions/99451/how-can-you-tell-if-a-
note-is-major-or-minor
These tunes are similar
However they are both Easy Listening Pop Rock with some minor jazz chords
maybe they hired the same audio engineering producer building in Calfornia or NYC and used the same tapes and cables and microphones?
maybe one of Rick Beato's friends set up the mics for both bands?...I don't think so but an Audio Engineer can find a 'New Sound' then every other studio guy will try copy that new hip and cool sound that is hot and selling
They both have Similar minor chords, similar Tempo 64, 70, 68 bpm ish but the tempo might be disguised with a lack of picking or lack of vamps or lacking fills, the true drum guitar beat is probably 136 ? The grove is somewhat like each other the Drum is Straight 4 on floor, but there is rhythm on the beat then maybe a little Funky or Latin off beat...Sergio if I remember feels more Latin off beat with melodic fill, maybe some type of Funky Rock fill, anticipation of the beat but they are 4/4 but both are Slow Sets, very Similar Chords, very similar straight 4 on floor with major sevenths maybe? seems like its D Major progression not far from 'G' then maybe similar sus or inversion or it goes to D minor F sharp to F and B to B flat...it could be A Major but then you have a B flat?
It sounds like there is a similar progression some where I'm not sure what it is E to A Major to D minor
and G natural..so is it 'modal' does it want to be Phrygian or Mixolydian does it have a tonal center? I would imagine some of the chords in both songs are exactly the same but not all will be the same.
the other second tune, I'm not sure if the song wants to be a D minor or is B-flat major, 'Never Gonna Let You Go' has too many strange chords for me to say 'That's It'
First song has 12 chords, its can be done
...Sergio has ...
I lost count at Rick Be
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Most people trying to figure it out in studio, go back to piano even a digital grpahic one on your screen because all of Western music is layered and wrote and laid out there on piano, even strange exotic Eastern chords and strange overseas melody can be found there.
You can probably teach a kid to '12 Bar Blues' on bass easy quick just 3 chords
1 - 4 - 5
the root notes Do Fa So with a 'blue note' in between
What's different that will have you lost strarting...maybe learning advanced chords or a Latin beat maybe but its becoming common ish in Texas Calfornia NYC that funky influence, jazz minor chord...an exotic scale but not as 'exotic' as it used to be. People from the Balkans play odd time very well, better than players in Britain or Aus or Canada or the USA, odd time is becoming a thing but it feels fake, it should be like a folk song or dance, you should still feel a swing or tap your foot or the melody something that grooves not an extra electronic beat forced into a machine
there is pro rock and progressive pop Nine Inch Nails, Zappa, Pink Floyd, Tool with their ass jokes, Alice in Chains, Genesis were deep into their new sound, progressive rock ...Björk she is very interesting but she's a bit oddish in a strange way and I'm a little ignorant of her sound and never played any of her stuff
Musical Themes, Video Game Hooks or Film Scores they can have an odd time signature or strange scale
Jazz or Swing Brubeck's Take Five
The reason I go back on piano is most guitarists I know can't tell me what they are playing they know its some type of G or E flat or C or A minor but can't really tell me unless they are trained, they know some lines and progressions without theory and don't know if its 'Sus' or an inversion not really sure on rhythm, they have an idea on harmony and timing and they know the idea they have it fits the song and sounds nice so that's where we try figure it out with bass or piano.
someone told me watch out for 'Shred' the stuff he teaches and says might be 'evil' or is it just music
Hungary Minor? or is it Romania
I AM DRACULA | Vampire Scale
Most hiphop is a few seconds of Clyde Stubblefield or John Bonham copied and looped
and because you showed me this guy
Wings of Pegasus again
analyses Elvis Presley's guitar playing
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Top 50 Rip Off Songs
https://www.watchmojo.com/video/id/59164
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Music is dead maybe or not....maybe but you still have spectacle and skill on you-tube style social media channels
Video games is where art is ...just... surviving now but under commercial need for sales.
High Art and Low Art debate
and Do you have to be financially successful to be 'Art'?
I also think 'Modern Jazz' started to suck, it became a style about nothing, play as many notes as possible as many tones, slow miserable song and boring solos, very formula smokey bar cafe, a style that climbed up its own AssholeOfFilth and yet some ask is jazz unpopular? jazz was originally dirty street music, white and blacks in dance halls, based on blues that was looked down upon then it became 'elite' and lost something?
Jazz tries to climb up its own ass and becomes so cliché it forgets it was like an old Country Blues Harmony song and it was the peoples folk music for a while
ask why people today only want oldies the people like only "old" styles of swing or blues or jazz?
Solos can get tiresome and people who like harmony and chords don't like the sound of dissonance also some Jazz people are terribly over rated as musicians.
Music possibly died with the teens buying simple pop and then people taking a brand like jazz too serious, it dies in every culture, with the death of the Baroque era, Max Steiner, Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, the Classical Music Greats, Ennio Morricone, Leonard Bernstein, Ryuichi Sakamoto, Miklós Rózsa, Vangelis, Funky man Prince, the Early Rockers, some of the playing and composition is simple even for Classical style but it grabs, it sets a mood and Hollywood and Tv written music is 'catchy' so then when music forgets its job is to make people tap their foot to set a mood and entertain...although I can forgive the perfectionists like Prince or Leonard Bernstein having their hissy fits trying to get the people to play right temp and correct note.
California is now dead culturally, anyone on the net can see how crazy Commiefornia has become and won't move there just to meet other artists.
yeah sometimes music takes itself too serious but we should appreciate talents and composers and skill
and I do appreciate crazy works of a video game guy or a pop guy or a rock and roll or blues guy or written by a virtuoso like Niccolò Paganini
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Music is not dead. Different genres evolve into other things. You may have to go looking for say something like Punk but it is still around. Rock and roll evolved out of R&B and blues music.
And also for other styles of music you can find reels and jigs that still are played and danced to in Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, Newfoundland and New Brunswick. These were brought over by the Scots, Irish and even English immigrants to those parts of Canada. That music hasn't changed in over 100years. And you'll still find that style of music being played in Scotland, Ireland and yes England to this day.
In the deep South in the US, you can find reels and jigs that were brought there by settlers and are still played today with no changes to the music. And someone from the past would recognize it.
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A previously unknown piece of music composed by Mozart when he was probably in his early teens has been uncovered at a library in Germany
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2024/sep/19/previously-unknown-mozar
t-music-discovered-in-german-library
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Quote:
Originally posted by SAVEWASH:
Oh, I couldn't agree with you more! I'm so tired of hearing the same 10-12 songs over and over instead of something new and original. When will they get a clue???
My rant's over, too.
"We need to keep our heads so we can ... keep our heads."
They ask you when you come across things are posted, to give it a thumbs up if you find it helpful.
So, thumbs up. And I gotta say, I love your Avatar.
T
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and today the humor is gone but can be saved?
Country Sounds on the Violin
Billy Joel - My Life
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3 Men Claim P Diddy Drugged Their Drinks And When They Woke Up, They Were Being Raped By Him
https://vidmax.com/video/230548-3-men-claim-p-diddy-drugged-their-drin
ks-and-when-they-woke-up-they-were-being-raped-by-him-sometimes-others-joined-in-recorded-incidents
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culturally LA, Commiefornia, Hollywood California seems finished, not sure how anyone can be taken serious writing songs about that Burning Degenerate Cartoonish Land of Hellfire
and now a board game video gamer community?
Die Together
Devote your heart
For all mankind
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Music: Melody Hunters
https://time.com/archive/6758060/music-melody-hunters/
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when bunches of old guys play better than ever
The Cure
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We have always used music to express our love – we can now use AI too
https://theconversation.com/we-have-always-used-music-to-express-our-l
ove-we-can-now-use-ai-too-249523
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What is Suno: Everything you need to know about this AI music generator
https://www.techradar.com/computing/artificial-intelligence/what-is-su
no-everything-you-need-to-know-about-this-ai-music-generator
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Kristen Bell the star
me
I think Vocalists also ruined music for me, X-factor, Broadway, Pop, Rap as 'vocalists', the musicals, music tv dramas, the stageshow...some times I can like or tolerate whatever Rock, Hip Hop if there is some kind of poem phrasing or 'content' within lyrics
I understand she is a singer a kids show Raggedy Ann, Broadway, she was hanging out with the 'Frozen' cast and all the kids sing that one
I guess its 'good'
but
most of the time singing about nothing
do it Luciano Pavarotti, Renata Tebaldi, Claudio Villa, Anna Netrebko, Renée Fleming, Montserrat Caballé, Andrea Bocelli or don't do it at all
I will confess most musicals I dislike...if there is an element of horror or cultural drama or scifi or 'history' I might enjoy but sitting through a musical is kind of painful for me
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High Society King Oliver 1923
How Jazz went from the Street to the Elite
Jesse Welles
Red
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
I will confess most musicals I dislike...if there is an element of horror or cultural drama or scifi or 'history' I might enjoy but sitting through a musical is kind of painful for me
Musicals are just awful. Completely unwatchable.
To this day I've never even seen the full South Park movie in one sitting because I just can't.
The only musical I think I could sit through today is Little Shop of Horrors, and that's only because of the nostalgia of watching that on a tape I recorded with my brothers countless times as a kid. I doubt very much I could sit through the whole thing today if I'd never seen it as a child.
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"I don't find this stuff amusing anymore." ~Paul Simon
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the dying form of Jazz and how an Iceland girl Chinese ethnic mix learned it all and Laufey studies in Boston Berklee and takes over and dominates 'The Jazz'
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For a while they only blocked certain exact notes
Royalty didn't exist with the vocal? Free Acapella
very old?
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Rollins punk, fronted the California hardcore band Black Flag
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Elephants joyfully react to didgeridoo performance - ABQ BioPark Zoo
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that 'Rap' person Sean John Combs better known by his current stage name Diddy, and his former stage names Puff Daddy and P. Diddy, music producer Rodney "Lil Rod" Jones, who was already suing Combs for sexual assault, filed a lawsuit against Combs and his son Justin, alleging that they engaged in a "massive" cover-up of their involvement in the shooting of a 30-year-old man at a "writers and producers camp" that was held at Combs's Chalice Recording Studio in Los Angeles in September 2022. Lil Rod has accused Paul of being Combs's "drug mule" in court documents. Combs was arrested and indicted in the Southern District of New York on September 16, 2024, on charges of racketeering, sex trafficking by force, and transportation for purposes of prostitution.
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Ennio
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What happened to the guitar industry
Tariffs Will Kill?
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Black Nazi Rappers happened
some of the B's angry with some of the J's
Kanye West claims he 'became a Nazi because he couldn't see his children'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-14691077/Kanye-West-Nazi
-Kim-Kardashian-Bianca-Censori-song.html
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most shout, roar, screech or rap and for the ones who can play in tune,
the trainwreck called Eurovision happened
Is Eurovision rigged? The hidden math behind the semi-finals
https://cybernews.com/entertainment/eurovision-voting-rigged-math/
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Why All Pop Music Sounds the Same
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This Street Busker Doesn't Like To Be Effed With
https://vidmax.com/video/233251-this-street-busker-doesn-t-like-to-be-
effed-with
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