Jews build 'Museum of Tolerance' on 1,000s of Arab graves
POSTED BY: piratenews
UPDATED: Tuesday, February 23, 2010 20:59
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Simon Wiesenthal Centre in Los Angeles desecrates 1,000s of Arab Semite graves
Row over plan to build Jewish museum of tolerance on site of Muslim cemetery in Jerusalem
http://uruknet.info/index.php?p=m63171&hd=&size=1&l=e
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PLEASE don't skip this because PN Posted it.
This one makes some real good points
Row over plan to build Jewish museum of tolerance on site of Muslim cemetery
Rory McCarthy
11dyala-husseini-visits-a-m-001.jpg
Dyala Husseini visits a Muslim cemetery, where her ancestors are buried, near the construction site of a museum dedicated to tolerance. Photograph: Dan Balilty/AP
• Islamic groups say site contains thousands of graves
• Petition challenges court's decision to back project
February 11, 2010
A group of Palestinians descended from 15 of Jerusalem's oldest Arab families lodged a protest with the UN today in a fresh effort to prevent the construction of a "Museum of Tolerance" on the site of an ancient Muslim cemetery.
The project, run by the Simon Wiesenthal Centre in Los Angeles, has been dogged by controversy since its launch in 2004. Islamic groups and individual Palestinians complained that the site, in west Jerusalem, was the ancient cemetery of Ma'man Allah, also known as Mamilla, which housed thousands of graves dating back hundreds of years and where even today there are still many gravestones and tombs.
The Simon Wiesenthal Centre argued the site was adjacent to the cemetery and that construction would be on what is today a municipal car park.
After legal battles, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled in October 2008 that building could go ahead. But the Israel Antiquities Authority's chief excavator for the site, Gideon Suleimani, found the site was a cemetery in use for the past 1,000 years that "abounded with graves" and should not be open to construction without a full excavation, which never happened. He said his assessment was ignored by the court. Then late last year Frank Gehry, the celebrity architect working on the project, withdrew.
Some 60 Palestinians have signed a petition which was lodged today in Geneva with several UN bodies, including the high commissioner for human rights, the special rapporteur on freedom of religion and belief and Unesco, the United Nations Educational, Scientific and Cultural Organisation. "This construction project has resulted in the undignified disinterment and disposal of several hundred graves and human remains, the exact amount and whereabouts of which are currently unknown and threatens to erect a monument to 'Human Dignity' and 'Tolerance' atop thousands more graves," the petition says.
It describes the project as a violation of international human rights law and calls for a halt to construction, the reburial of all the remains and the preservation of the cemetery as a protected site.
"This tolerance museum to us is a museum of intolerance," said Dyala Husseini, who has ancestors from her family and her husband's family buried in the cemetery. "It is very inhumane, it is very humiliating and it ignores our existence as Palestinian families here in Jerusalem. Our families are here in Jerusalem and have been here for centuries," she said.
Jamal Nusseibeh said one of his ancestors, the former governor of Jerusalem Burhan al-Din al-Khazraji ibn Nusseibeh, was buried in the cemetery in 1432. "It is part of the rich fabric of Jerusalem which always has been a symbol of tolerance," he said. "The fact that anybody could wish to wipe out such a structural part of this fabric in order somehow to promote tolerance is very hard to understand."
Last month Rabbi Marvin Hier, the Simon Wiesenthal Centre's founder, said the project was on a "fantastic site in the heart of Jerusalem" and would bring "to Jerusalem and the people of Israel, a project of crucial significance to its future".
The centre has said the museum is being built on a car park next to the cemetery and that there was no protest about the construction of the car park 50 years ago. "Is it better to let this site remain a parking lot, or build a centre for human dignity there, which would teach young people mutual respect and social responsibility?" it said after the Israeli Supreme Court ruled in its favour.
The petition contains maps, photographs and other doc
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And just when I don't think they could possibly stoop any lower...
Propping up that government with my tax money and shitloads of weapons is another thing I got serious ISSUES with, especially since they're no friend of anyone, not even themselves.
Also pisses me off that their actions are the only factor besides government funding via informants, propping up them neo-nazi assholes, cause you gotta think after hearing the fifth, tenth, twentieth, case of this, some folks with less education and historical background knowledge start wondering to themselves whether the nazis had a point.
And that's almost the damned saddest thing of all, cause it was shit EXACTLY like what they do to Palestine which got the third reich so properly vilified - and yet, how many Palestinians have they killed, does anyone count, does anyone care ?
Cause it'd be interesting to compare the actual numbers, there.
But the REAL saddest thing of all of this, is that looked at in a long-view historical sense, say 80-120 years down the road, I can see Palestine doing it to some other people out of fear of this shit happening to THEM, just like Israel is doin to Palestine.
Maybe we can't stop it, but sure as shit we could stop fucking SUPPORTING it.
-F
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Very sad indeed.
Zionists = psychopath's
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I wonder if anyone has suggested an alternative site or do the Palestinians consider all of Israel "an ancient Muslim cemetery”.
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Quote:Yep.
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
stop it, but sure as shit we could stop fucking SUPPORTING it.
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
I wonder if anyone has suggested an alternative site or do the Palestinians consider all of Israel "an ancient Muslim cemetery”.
Well, I'm sure the Israeli government would love to make all of the Middle East a giant Muslim cemetery.
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Since this is Jerusalem, presumably 100s of graves are of Christians.
1,000s of Palestinians today are Christian Semites, a fact conveniently censored from all news reports of Israel's genocide of its own Semite citizens.
I'm sure this site was picked to specifically enrage the "Arabs", to keep the race-war alive. Without a war, there's no reason to send billions of taxdollars to Israel in foreign aid, which greatly profits the US Military Industrial Complex. Israel gets the latest US military weapons before the US military does.
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Here is an interesting effort
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/middle-east/2010/02/12/israel-fighting-dele
gitimisation-campaign
Israel fighting 'delegitimisation campaign'
By Clayton Swisher in
* Middle East
on February 12th, 2010
.
Share
As outrage grows in US campuses over Israeli policies towards Palestinians, Israel seems to be fighting back.
Harvard University's well-known law school, or HLS, was the intellectual training ground for US President Barack Obama (HLS 91'), who through his high marks became editor of the Harvard Law Review.
Obama might find it interesting to know the miles some HLS students have to travel to become expert in their field - only to be turned back.
Consider the case of 3rd year law student Hebah Ismail, who is putting the finishing touches on her studies with Harvard's International Human Rights Clinic.
Like Obama, Hebah entered Harvard law already a world traveller. The US citizen of Egyptian extraction landed at Tel Aviv's Ben Gurion recently to study land disputes facing the Arab Bedouin community.
But airport security officials weren't having it.
According to the Harvard paper, Hebah's laptop and cell phone were seized and searched. But that wasn't satisfying enough, so an ultimatum was delivered: log us into your email accounts, or you will be deported and banned from ever entering Israel.
Hebah refused and faced the consequences. She was put on a plane back to the States, unable to conduct her research.
Al Jazeera has reported about how Israeli authorities have been denying NGO workers access into Israel and the Palestinian territories.
Yesterday I wrote that Israel might not be prepared to counter the growing American campus outrage over its policies towards the Palestinians.
But connecting the dots, it is clear this is how they intend to fight back.
A new study flagged in this Israeli newspaper warns that Israel is facing a global delegitimisation campaign.
The prestigious Reut Institute, which issued the report, is headed by an erudite mover-and-shaker named Gidi Grinstein, a lawyer who also attended Harvard.
The Reut Study is comprehensive, and deserves reading in full. But I seriously doubt Grinstein (whom I've known for nearly a decade) would advocate deportation of visiting scholars and field researchers who refuse to let Israeli cybersleuths sign into their Harvard/Gmail acccounts.
On the positive side, at least US immigration officials welcomed Hebah home without incident.
Good thing she wasn't carrying Arabic flash cards.
Plus
http://reut-institute.org/en/Publication.aspx?PublicationId=3766
Eroding Israel’s Legitimacy in the International Arena
Israel is facing a dramatic assault on the very legitimacy of its existence as a Jewish and democratic state. The groups promoting this delegitimacy aim to isolate Israel and ultimately turn it into a pariah state. This issue of ReViews tracks this strategy and its components.
In recent years, Israel has faced a dramatic assault on the very legitimacy of its existence as a Jewish and democratic state. While the ideological framework for this delegitimacy was solidified after the first Durban Conference in 2001, the trend has been given a boost by the perceived lack of progress in the political process, coupled with Operation Cast Lead in Gaza.1
The groups making the fundamental delegitimacy of Israel among their main rallying cries represent a marginal phenomenon in Western politics. Although some of their activities are portrayed as protesting against Israeli policies, in fact they are frequently manipulated in order to blur the difference between valid criticism of Israeli policies and attempts to undermine Israel's right to exist. Thus, they are able to disproportionately impact Israel's international legitimacy.
The aim of these groups is to internationally isolate Israel and ultimately turn it into a pariah state through demonizing the country;2 promoting a policy of boycott, divestment and sanctions (BDS); and waging a legal stru
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
I wonder if anyone has suggested an alternative site or do the Palestinians consider all of Israel "an ancient Muslim cemetery”.
If it was Palestinians building on a Jewish site how do you think it would play out ?
http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1917&dat=19870721&id=2Q8hAAAAIBA
J&sjid=inIFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1893,5177678
Some of them freak out over Archaeologists digging to see what is there
People who have no respect for anyone else building a museum of tolerance is a very bad joke
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8472193.stm
Palestinian graves found damaged after settlers visit
Damaged gravestones at Awarta village
Food remnants were left on the tombstones
Damaged graves and racist graffiti have been found in the Palestinian village of Awarta in the northern West Bank after a Jewish group visited the area.
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
People who have no respect for anyone else building a museum of tolerance is a very bad joke
Don't agree with this, but I have supported ending aid to Israel since Bob Dole brought it up in his 1980 Presidential campaign. Not because I don't support Israel, but because they are perfectly capable of supporting themselves.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
People who have no respect for anyone else building a museum of tolerance is a very bad joke
Don't agree with this, but I have supported ending aid to Israel since Bob Dole brought it up in his 1980 Presidential campaign. Not because I don't support Israel, but because they are perfectly capable of supporting themselves.
Why do you support Israel?
( not being snarky, trying to see it from your side )
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:I conjure it's a "Holy Land" thing, Bethlehem & all.
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Why do you support Israel?
(Also not being snarky)
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:I conjure it's a "Holy Land" thing, Bethlehem & all.
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Why do you support Israel?
(Also not being snarky)
The laughing Chrisisall
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
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Quote:When was this??
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:When was this??
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
The laughing Chrisisall
2002, of course there was alot more to it that he is saying
http://electronicintifada.net/v2/article502.shtml
and only Israel maintains hostages were held and the church was desecrated...
quotes from the hostages:
In the early days of the standoff, the Israeli government repeatedly said that the Church clergy were being held as "hostages." However, in many subsequent telephone interviews, the Christian leaders insisted that they are there of their own free will, to both protect the church from Israeli fire and to render aid to the wounded. The Israeli government again attempted to dismiss these claims, saying that the clergy could not speak freely while inside the church. Again, more interviews proved these claims to be false.
"No, no, no. We are not hostages. We share everything we have with these people, and pray that they will be able to leave peacefully and go back to their homes." - Rev. Amjad Sabbar, Roman Catholic parish priest in the compound
"I wish to firmly state that the Friars and Sisters of the religious community in Bethlehem CANNOT BE CONSIDERED AS HOSTAGES. They have freely chosen to remain in that place, the custody of which has been entrusted to them by the Holy See and which constitutes their home. The other 200 Palestinians besieged inside the Basilica have taken refuge there by force in order to flee from the sweep and search by the Israeli army, just as had happened to the 5 Italian journalists during the first day of the siege. Up to now they have not committed any act of violence or abuse of power against the religious community." - Declaration by the Minister General of the Friars Minor
http://islam.about.com/library/weekly/aa042202a.htm
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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And I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that in retaliation, Israel then bombed a mosque in the Palestinian territories with white phosphorous.
Heck, you've gotta admit, they ARE consistent.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
And I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that in retaliation, Israel then bombed a mosque in the Palestinian territories with white phosphorous.
Heck, you've gotta admit, they ARE consistent.
Looking at some of the Jewish websites I wouldn't be surprised if they hit the Vatican with white phosphorus...
http://www.jcpa.org/jl/vp515.htm
As it was Israeli snipers killed 7, and wounded 40... including several guys trying to put out fires, and a retarded kid employed by the monks to ring the bells...
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
And I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that in retaliation, Israel then bombed a mosque in the Palestinian territories with white phosphorous.
Heck, you've gotta admit, they ARE consistent.
And even worse, they consider Palestinian childrens' big toes to be culinary delicacies. Use 'em for shish-kabob on their so-called holidays.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
do the Palestinians consider all of Israel "an ancient Muslim cemetery”.
I'm surprised the Muslims didn't claim their was a billion graves and then start some rent-a-crowd riot
or amp up the Propaganda with a Pallywood report
That's one of the worst things about the middle east, you couldn't throw a rock without it landing on some patch that some group of religious assholes have already laid claim to
PN is hardly unbiased
he is a proven to be an anti-Jewish hating A-hole
I don't pick sides, in hindsight back in the 50s when all this sh*t was starting to kick off I would bought up land and given the Jews and the Arabs they own separate little islands in the middle of nowhere
Then turned the area into a waste dump for toxic chemicals
That's the only productive thing that can ever happen this region
Western economies are in the shitter yet the Middle East still wants to bleed us all dry
Both these racist assholes will be butting heads for the next 200 years. We should give them nothing, stop giving the Jews money and guns, stop giving the Muslims money and aid.
These people will deliver nothing, the Afghans bankrupted the Soviets and the SandBox almost bankrupted the mighty Roman Empire
Don't give them money, guns, aid...give them nothing!
Everything they are given turns to cancer.
They don't deserve anything from us
Boycott the middle east
If you see it on the news switch it off because its just the SameOldShit everyday
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Car park = good
Museum of tolerance = bad
Got it.
Director: Bureau of Bigfoot Affairs
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Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:When was this??
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
The laughing Chrisisall
2002, of course there was alot more to it that he is saying
Chris, I'm not gonna waste breath replying to Gino- my opinion of him still holds ( "what he has to say is unimportant and we do not hear his words."). But what more do you have to say than men with machine guns hiding inside another faith's church? Aren't there international laws against that? Isn't that desecration of a holy place? Isn't it pretty much cowardly?
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Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:I conjure it's a "Holy Land" thing, Bethlehem & all.
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Why do you support Israel?
(Also not being snarky)
The laughing Chrisisall
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
I take it you hold the Palestinian authorities responsible for what happens on their turf then. Do you hold the U.S. government responsible for 9/11 as well? After all, it was on land that WE administered, right?
For the record, I'd think that hiding out in a church is pretty cowardly. Almost as cowardly as bombing one.
Mike
Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:I conjure it's a "Holy Land" thing, Bethlehem & all.
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Why do you support Israel?
(Also not being snarky)
The laughing Chrisisall
Last I heard, after Palestinian militants with machine guns seized the Church of the Nativity, and held the monks there hostage, Bethleham was in the West Bank, in the area administered by the Palestinian Authority.
I take it you hold the Palestinian authorities responsible for what happens on their turf then.
I meant no assignment of responsibility. Gino asked why Chris supported Israel. Chris replied that it was because of the Holy Land thing, and mentioned Bethleham. I wished to point out that Bethleham is in the West Bank, not in the nation of Israel, on real estate that is not part of a state of Palestine, since there is no such, but is administered by the Palestinian Authority.
I would suggest that, a long time ago, in a philosophy class I took, they defined a political state as "a legitimate monopoly on the use of force and violence." By that standard, if there had been a state of Palestine then, it would have been responsible.
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Thanks for clarifying. I wasn't sure what you were getting at. Much better now, though.
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Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Car park = good
Museum of tolerance = bad
Got it.
The car park is owned by Israeli jews, so it must be good.
Plus they earn a tidy profit using inside info to sell it to jews in USA.
Win win!
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Quote:
Originally posted by piratenews:
The car park is owned by Israeli jews, so it must be good.
Plus they earn a tidy profit using inside info to sell it to jews in USA.
Win win!
Inside info on a car park ?
Director: Bureau of Bigfoot Affairs
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Quote:
Originally posted by participant:Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
do the Palestinians consider all of Israel "an ancient Muslim cemetery”.
I'm surprised the Muslims didn't claim their was a billion graves and then start some rent-a-crowd riot
or amp up the Propaganda with a Pallywood report
That's one of the worst things about the middle east, you couldn't throw a rock without it landing on some patch that some group of religious assholes have already laid claim to
PN is hardly unbiased
he is a proven to be an anti-Jewish hating A-hole
I don't pick sides, in hindsight back in the 50s when all this sh*t was starting to kick off I would bought up land and given the Jews and the Arabs they own separate little islands in the middle of nowhere
Then turned the area into a waste dump for toxic chemicals
That's the only productive thing that can ever happen this region
Western economies are in the shitter yet the Middle East still wants to bleed us all dry
Both these racist assholes will be butting heads for the next 200 years. We should give them nothing, stop giving the Jews money and guns, stop giving the Muslims money and aid.
These people will deliver nothing, the Afghans bankrupted the Soviets and the SandBox almost bankrupted the mighty Roman Empire
Don't give them money, guns, aid...give them nothing!
Everything they are given turns to cancer.
They don't deserve anything from us
Boycott the middle east
If you see it on the news switch it off because its just the SameOldShit everyday
I agree somewhat with your solution, cut them all off until a reasonable solution is hammered out...
But your video...
I don't think it actually is a 60 minutes segment, cant find any part of it on their website ?
http://www.cbsnews.com/1770-5_162-0.html?query=pallywood&tag=srch&sear
chtype=cbsSearch
Kind of the same sort of fraud you are complaining about isn't it ? I mean why try to look like a respected news program when you are not...
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Car park = good
Museum of tolerance = bad
Got it.
Director: Bureau of Bigfoot Affairs
They say they did protest the building of the carpark to the extent they were allowed to back in the day...
Protest there is still a rough thing
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/02/20102810542115493
2.html
" Rights group targeted
In a separate incident, Israeli military officials raided offices of Stop the Wall, a human-rights group that campaigns against the construction of the West Bank separation barrier. "
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Well Chris,
The Vatican, the monks, the Palestinians and myself are all claiming the Palestinians went into the church to get sanctuary, which was given; in order to escape the gun wielding Israeli army mob that was pursuing them. Additionally the same sources say all the deaths, and all the damage to the church was caused by the Israelis in this incident.
NewOldBrown Toilet Paper, and a Jewish website I posted ( toilet paper offered nothing at all to back its position as usual ) contends my position to be a " tissue of lies " ( lol )
You tell me who is " full of shit " ( lmao )
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2010/02/20102914392027796
2.html
Israel denies NGOs work permits
The Israeli interior ministry has stopped issuing work permits to foreigners working for international non-governmental organisations (NGOs).
In the last few weeks, NGO staff have been given tourist visas instead, making it virtually impossible for them to carry out their work.
The new Israeli policy affects 120 international NGOs, many of which provide vital developmental and humanitarian aid to Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza.
Many NGO members have said that Israel's actions are illegal because the country is obligated under Geneva and humanitarian law to issue them visas and let them work freely there.
So first drive the press out, then the aid workers, hmmmm what next
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
So first drive the press out, then the aid workers, hmmmm what next?
If history is any guide, next they fire up the ovens and start up the "showers", or send 'em to work in the killing fields.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Littlebird:
Very sad indeed.
Zionists = psychopath's
Really relevant commentary and news , at this link :
http://www.alanhart.net/
Zionism Unmasked: A Fairy Tale That’s Become a Terrifying Nightmare
by Alan Hart / February 12th, 2010
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Quote:
Originally posted by out2theblack:Quote:
Originally posted by Littlebird:
Very sad indeed.
Zionists = psychopath's
Really relevant commentary and news , at this link :
http://www.alanhart.net/
Zionism Unmasked: A Fairy Tale That’s Become a Terrifying Nightmare
by Alan Hart / February 12th, 2010
The crazy thing I think the agenda is being driven by an minority even in Jewish Israel. I have read many articles about how they oppose Israeli policy but their voices are squashed as well.
Of the five Jewish folk I know ( 2 couples and a single guy ) 3 oppose what Israel is doing and feel it puts their religion in a bad light across the world, one doesn't want to talk about it at all, and the single guy ( moved here from the Ukraine ) and is Israel right or wrong, and kill all the arabs and blacks, etc... Worked with this guy for a while, 2 guys from Jamacia, a guy from India and 3 other white guys on the crew including a guy from Serbia... This guy went on and on, black this, arab that... and then it was the serbian who told him to shut the hell up or he was going to gut him then and there...
The Ukrainian Jewish guy was moved to another job the next day and I haven't heard from him since.
Both couples were second generation Canadians, and the one who didn't want to talk about it was the wife who converted before she married. Maybe that makes a difference ?
Anyway Interesting website, thanks
" What is a Zionist today?
Short answer: One, not necessarily a Jew, who (to quote Balfour) supports the Zionist state of Israel “right or wrong” and who cannot or will not admit that a terrible wrong was done to the Palestinians by Zionism – a wrong that must be acknowledged and then corrected on terms acceptable to the Palestinians if there is ever to be peace and the countdown to catastrophe for all is to be stopped. The Arab word for the catastrophe of the original dispossession of the Palestinians is Nakba. In my view, Zionism’s Nakba denial is as obscene and as evil as denial of the Nazi holocaust. "
very on point
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Mind you, are some of these " settlements " acting outside of government control, or does the Israeli gov just turn a blind eye ?
Israeli settlers disobey the order to stop building
At least 29 Israeli settlements in the West Bank are violating a government-ordered pause in building activity, the Israeli Defence Ministry has said.
The information was released in response to a question asked in Israel's parliament, the Knesset.
A pressure group says there are at least four more settlements disregarding the government order.
The group, Peace Now, says Jewish settlers are working during the night and on the sabbath to avoid notice.
Peace Now says building work is continuing in at least 33 settlements in violation of an order to stop made by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu in November.
Stalled talks
The Israeli newspaper Haaretz said they have learned the government was looking at ways to enforce the no-building rule.
In November, the government of Benjamin Netanyahu ordered a 10-month cessation of building new settlements.
According to Peace Now, building on existing settlements has continued.
The information was released by the defence ministry following a question asked by Haim Oron of the left-wing Meretz party.
US attempts to revive peace talks have stalled over the Jewish settlement issue.
Palestinians say they will not return to peace talks unless Israel stops settlement building in the West Bank.
Israel has a long-standing commitment under an existing peace plan to stop settlement growth.
But the Israeli government has temporarily curbed construction as a goodwill gesture, though not in East Jerusalem.
All settlements in the the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, are considered illegal under international law, although Israel disputes this.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8516223.stm
the expression even paranoids have enemys comes to mind
perhaps even extremists have wingnuts ?
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Thank's Gino and all for your posts on this thread.
Operation Cast Lead was a real eye opener for me. What I have learned since then about the Zionists and their occupation of the land has shocked and appalled me. That, added to fact that the US sends them outrageous amounts of money, and then the nukes they have, truly disgusts and scares me.
Israeli Women Soldiers Break the Silence
by Ira Chernus
Common Dreams, February 1, 2010
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/02/01-3
What's it like to be a woman serving in the Israeli occupation force in the West Bank? Is a woman's experience as an occupier any different than a man's? Yes indeed, say some women who have just broken their silence and offered a glimpse into the grim reality of the occupation.
"A female combat soldier needs to prove more," one explains. "A female soldier who beats up others is a serious fighter...When I arrived there was another female [who] was there before me...Everyone spoke of how impressive she is because she humiliates Arabs without any problem. That was the indicator. You have to see her, the way
she humiliates, the way she slaps them, wow, she really slapped that guy."
This "impressive" woman is not a rare exception. "We discovered that the girls try to be even more violent and brutal than the boys, just to become one of the guys," says Dana Golan, director of Breaking the Silence, the Israeli organization that has just released a report with testimony from some 50 Israeli women who are veterans
of the occupation.
The report "indicates how violence was deeply rooted in the daily routine," according to an article in Yediot Aharonot < http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3841480,00.html>, one of Israel's most widely-read newspapers, full of disturbing quotes from the women. One who served at the Erez crossing between Israel and Gaza
explained that "there was a procedure in which before you release a Palestinian back into the Strip -- you take him inside the tent and beat him. ... together with the commanders."
For Israelis who care to pay attention, another revelation of routine violence, sanctioned and sometimes even led by officers, hardly comes as news. Breaking the Silence has been offering the Israeli public such eyewitness testimony from Israeli soldiers since 2004. What is news is the first insight into the distinctive experience
of women:
"The female soldiers repeatedly mention the particular difficulties they had as women, who had to prove that to were ‘fighters' in the midst of the goading male soldiers on the one hand, and the Palestinians, who have a hard time handling women in uniform on the other hand."
One woman recalled an incident several years ago when a Palestinian man laughed at her, because (or so she thought) she was a woman in uniform. She had to "salvage her self-respect," she says. So she moved close to the man, "as if I was about to kiss him. I told him, 'Come, come, what are you afraid of? Come to me!' And I hit him
in the balls. I told him, 'Why aren't you laughing?' He was in shock, and then he realized ... not to laugh."
"It shouldn't reach such a situation," the woman says now. "The system is deeply flawed. The entire administration, the way things are run, it's not right."
Palestinian women have a distinctive experience, too. "Was there abuse of women?", an interviewer asked. "Yes," a woman soldier replied. "Slaps, that kind of thing. Mainly slaps. ... It was mainly the female combat soldiers who beat people. ... But also men, they had no problem slapping a woman around. If she screamed, they'd say,
'Shut it,' with another slap. A routine of violence. There were also those who didn't take part, but everyone knew it happened."
Sometimes, as the Breaking the Silence report indicates, the level of brutality grows beyond comprehension: a five year old child beaten; a nine year old who "posed no danger" shot to death; another child with both arms and both legs intentionally broken. The Yediot Aharonoth article offers a series of such horrifying incide
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Thank you Littlebird
that is really interesting, how women are subtly encouraged to become quite aggressive...
While in other militarys that mindset doesn't seem to exist
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8511010.stm
Women at war: Sexual violence in the US military
Helena Merriman reports on a woman whose experience of sexual assault, while serving in the US Air Force in Afghanistan, turned her into a campaigner for the welfare of service women.
Marti Ribeiro was born into a military family.
Her grandfather and father were both in the Air Force - and all her life she had wanted to join the armed forces.
I put my weapon down and walked away to smoke a cigarette and that was when I was attacked
Marti Ribeiro
After she finished school she joined the Air Force Reserves and a few years later, in March 2003, she was deployed to Iraq.
While she loved her job as a public affairs specialist, from the time she arrived she was routinely harassed and called Air Force Barbie.
"I had no idea how difficult it would be," she told the BBC World Service.
"My father, who is a retired military colonel, thought the world of me for joining the military.
WOMEN AT WAR
The conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan are the first in which tens of thousands of women have fought alongside men for prolonged periods. This week the BBC World Service is taking an in-depth look at women's stories from the front line.
"I never saw the personality traits in him that I saw in the military - I never saw what I was getting into."
In 2006 she was in Afghanistan.
"You're supposed to carry your weapon at all times in a combat zone," she said.
"But I put my weapon down and walked away to smoke a cigarette and that was when I was attacked."
She was then dragged behind some power generators and raped.
"If I had kept my weapon maybe I would have been able to prevent it," she says.
"But if I had used it I would probably have ended up in jail."
She went to the authorities but they told her that if she filed a claim, she would be charged with dereliction of duty for leaving her weapon unattended in a combat zone - an offence for which you can be court-martialled.
So she kept quiet and the man who attacked her went unpunished.
"It would be my word over his and they are not going to take my word over his," she said.
When she returned from Afghanistan, she did not talk to anyone about what happened. She says she felt it was all her fault.
'Heartbreaking' phone calls
Congressional leaders, who have been holding hearings this month on sexual assault in the armed forces, say that more needs to be done to tackle what recent studies indicate is a widespread problem.
Once you have been raped in the military you are most likely to be raped over and over
Congresswoman Loretta Sanchez
In 2003, in a survey of female veterans conducted by the University of Iowa, funded by the US Department of Defense, 30% of the 500 female veterans interviewed reported an attempted or completed rape.
Equally worryingly, the Department of Defense estimated in its 2009 annual report on sexual assault, that around 90% of rapes in the military are never reported.
Congresswoman Loretta Sanchez, who sits on the Military Personnel Subcommittee, successfully lobbied last year for the development of a Sexual Assault Database to encourage accountability within the Armed Forces.
"There are plenty of phone calls that come into my office of alleged assault of women by our military men," she says.
"They are heartbreaking. Some women don't want to go public with it, some have gone public with it and they've been drilled out of the military.
"I'm told that the statistics are that once you have been raped in the military you are most likely to be raped over and over."
She says that not enough prosecutions are happening and that while the Pentagon is taking it more seriously, big changes still need to be made.
"Why is it that when a woman alleges rape, the outcome shows that the man who supposedly did this was
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I found this interesting...
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,677996,00.html
Israel's Conscience
High Court in Tel Aviv Flexes its Liberal Muscles
By Christoph Schult
On many issues, from human rights to social mores, Israel's high court is well out in front of society at large. Israeli politicians now want to clip the court's wings.
continues
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Interesting article. The Israeli High Court sounds fair and balanced. I was starting to get my hopes up and then read this part ...
"Israeli politicians, particularly the conservatives, feel that the court is too independent. To address this concern, the administration of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu plans to propose a law that would limit the power of the judges on Jerusalem's high court in an important way: The court would no longer have the power to invalidate laws enacted by the parliament. The government also wants to supervise the selection of judges more strictly in the future"
Also interesting is the fact that Israel does not even have a constitution.
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I really wish some of the pro Israel crowd would join into this discussion...
or even better someone living there.
There always seems to be people who are very pro Israel but don't want to talk about it, or against Israel but refuse to say why...
The way this thread is going ( to its credit ) is non racist ( none of PNs usual rant), but a clear look at policys and goings on. I think that is important, I also think there is another side of the coin, so here is hoping someone will speak up...
Like the Iran thread, these issues are going to decide alot the next couple of years.. we should know all we can
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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The only purpose of "equal rights" is the Communist overthrow of society, destruction of the family, doubling of taxation to the banksters, with eventual genocide of the indigenous population. This is according to trillionaire Rabbi David Rockefeller and kosher CIA agent Playboy Bunny Gloria Steinham.
Israel has always been a Communist dictatorship. Mandatory military draft of both men and women is destroying that nation, which will probably cease to exist very soon, since its jewish citizens are fleeing its own govt due to the draft (white slavery), or be forced to genocide their own citizens who are Arab Semites. Where does that get fun? The Israeli govt was founded and run by terrorist bombers, so what do you expect?
Kosher Hollywood funds predictive programming (brainwashing) to show "equal rights" in the military and in the future. No society can survive that myth. MEN CANNOT GIVE BIRTH TO BABIES NOR NURSE BABIES. WOMEN CANNOT RAISE SANE CHILDREN ON THEIR OWN. WOMEN CANNOT DO COMBAT AND FIGHT TO THE DEATH ON A DAILY BASIS. The workplace is often a combat situation, if only in metaphor.
GENOCIDE OF 55-MILLION BABIES IN USA IS NOT SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT, AND RESULTS IN AN INSANE LAWLESS SOCIETY THAT IS GUARANTEED TO COLLAPSE.
Endless wars to profit the jews RESULTS IN INSANE SOLDIERS WHO RAPE AND KILL EVEN AFTER RETURN TO CIVILIAN LIFE.
This insanity must stop, if a nation is to have true sustainable development. This requires eliminating "jews" from power as slavemasters (criminal warlords), and rewriting the scipts of "entertainment", mostly replaced with educational documentary programs that do NOT censor Truth and do NOT speak at a 4th grade level.
Sadly, scifi is one of the worst offenders of this brain damage, and must be replaced with -- dare I speak the word -- SCIENCE.
If these changes are not made, 90% of the world population will be genocided to profit the bankster jews. Israel is their wargame for the rest of the planet...
Quote:
The Complete Guide to Killing Non-Jews - by Rabbi Od Yosef Hai Yeshiva, 9 Nov 2009
http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/2009/11/19/updated-version-of-the-com
plete-guide-to-killing-non-jews/
British court indicts Israeli minister for warcrimes in Gaza
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.asp?b=18&t=41155
Israeli Law of Return only allows citizenship for jews
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return
The Life of an American Jew in Racist Marxist Israel Where Christianity Is a Felony
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/israel.htm
Semite.
1 a : a member of any of a number of peoples of ancient southwestern Asia including the Akkadians, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and ARABS - b : a descendant of these peoples - 2 : a member of a modern people speaking a Semitic language.
—Merriam Webster Dictionary
"A 'Semite' is any person living in that area, including Arabs and Christians. It's time we start talking about 'The Other AntiSemitism'. A Semite is not a Jew living in America or Europe."
—Ralph Nader (Arab-American from Lebannon), Indy presidential candidate 2008, Reform Party presidential nominee in 2004, Green Party presidential nominee in 2000, Arab-American Business conference, C-SPAN, 2003
“Just the Jews are humans, the Non-Jews are no humans, but cattle.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Kerithuth 6b page 78, Jebhammoth 61a (goyim = human cattle)
“The Non-Jews have been created to serve the Jews as slaves.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Midrasch Talpioth 225
“The birth-rate of the Non-Jews has to be suppressed massively.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Zohar II, 4b
“Jews always have to try to deceive Non-Jews.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Zohar I, 168a
“Every Jew is allowed to use lies and perjury to bring a Non-Jew to ruin.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Babha Kama 113a
“The possessions of the goyim are like an ownerless desert, and everybody (every Jew) who seizes it, has acquired it.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, IV/3/54b
“When the Messiah comes, all will be slaves of the Jews.”
-Jewish Babylonian Talmud, Erubin 43b
"Once we squ
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Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
The way this thread is going ( to its credit ) is non racist ( none of PNs usual rant),
Ya just HAD to provoke him....
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
The way this thread is going ( to its credit ) is non racist ( none of PNs usual rant),
Ya just HAD to provoke him....
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
I know....
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Dorit Beinisch .. Israeli Supreme Court President.
I can understand why the Government of Netanyahu wants to make changes in their High Court. This woman sounds like a real human being with feelings and everything.
Here is a little excerpt, the wiki article goes deeper.
Views and opinions
Beinisch has focused on government corruption and to ensuring that government institutions adhere to the law, with a particular emphasis placed on the IDF, the police and general security services. Among her many notable rulings as a Supreme Court Justice is a decision holding that parents cannot use corporal punishment. Even mild spanking, wrote Beinisch in 2000, “infringes on [the child’s] rights as a human being. It damages his body, his feelings, his dignity and his proper development,” and is therefore “forbidden today in our society.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorit_Beinisch
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Quote:
Originally posted by Littlebird:
Dorit Beinisch .. Israeli Supreme Court President.
I can understand why the Government of Netanyahu wants to make changes in their High Court. This woman sounds like a real human being with feelings and everything.
Here is a little excerpt, the wiki article goes deeper.
Views and opinions
Beinisch has focused on government corruption and to ensuring that government institutions adhere to the law, with a particular emphasis placed on the IDF, the police and general security services. Among her many notable rulings as a Supreme Court Justice is a decision holding that parents cannot use corporal punishment. Even mild spanking, wrote Beinisch in 2000, “infringes on [the child’s] rights as a human being. It damages his body, his feelings, his dignity and his proper development,” and is therefore “forbidden today in our society.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorit_Beinisch
I read a little about her too...
On the plus side, if Netanyahu sacks her, maybe she would consider moving the the Hague...
She would be nearly ideal for the international criminal court, as a judge, or as a lead prosecutor...
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
The crazy thing I think the agenda is being driven by an minority even in Jewish Israel. I have read many articles about how they oppose Israeli policy but their voices are squashed as well.
That's one thing that seriously pissed me off too, not just at the damn Likud, but also at the people on the other side building bombs - cause it makes no logical sense to blow up folk with no stake in policy, no voice to change it, and thus little responsibility for it - who mostly oppose it in the first damned place.
But yeah, there's folks on either side that are exactly the same, point the finger and scream, and send fools to die to obtain and maintain power, so upsetting the status quo and removing the external "threat" that keeps them in power is the last thing they wanna do.
So both the bombers and the IDF slobs lobbing artillery at em are both in the same position, being sacrificed to wind up an enemy neither side really WANTS to defeat.
Were I Palestinian, THOSE assholes would get their throats cut in a hurry, being technically on "my" side or not, and followed up with a page from ole pufferfish...
Kim Jong may be a nasty little prick, but the man is NOT stupid, he got hisself a nuke, and he aimed it at Washington D.C. - which means instead of sending hordes of cannon fodder to die for political points, those on capitol hill making the decision to fuck with him will be the first ones sent to hell - and golly gee, look how FAST that bullshit sabre rattling STOPPED, ehe ?
If they wanna blow someone up about Israels policies, they oughta start with the fuckers making and approving those policies, not the shitheads carrying them out!
And that's the weak link too, cause Palestines decentralized and ad-hoc leadership, such as it is, is not as vulnerable to that tactic in reverse, cause of the high turnover due to casualties and the need for distributed authority for that very reason.
-F
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
The crazy thing I think the agenda is being driven by an minority even in Jewish Israel. I have read many articles about how they oppose Israeli policy but their voices are squashed as well.
That's one thing that seriously pissed me off too, not just at the damn Likud, but also at the people on the other side building bombs - cause it makes no logical sense to blow up folk with no stake in policy, no voice to change it, and thus little responsibility for it - who mostly oppose it in the first damned place.
But yeah, there's folks on either side that are exactly the same, point the finger and scream, and send fools to die to obtain and maintain power, so upsetting the status quo and removing the external "threat" that keeps them in power is the last thing they wanna do.
So both the bombers and the IDF slobs lobbing artillery at em are both in the same position, being sacrificed to wind up an enemy neither side really WANTS to defeat.
Were I Palestinian, THOSE assholes would get their throats cut in a hurry, being technically on "my" side or not, and followed up with a page from ole pufferfish...
Kim Jong may be a nasty little prick, but the man is NOT stupid, he got hisself a nuke, and he aimed it at Washington D.C. - which means instead of sending hordes of cannon fodder to die for political points, those on capitol hill making the decision to fuck with him will be the first ones sent to hell - and golly gee, look how FAST that bullshit sabre rattling STOPPED, ehe ?
If they wanna blow someone up about Israels policies, they oughta start with the fuckers making and approving those policies, not the shitheads carrying them out!
And that's the weak link too, cause Palestines decentralized and ad-hoc leadership, such as it is, is not as vulnerable to that tactic in reverse, cause of the high turnover due to casualties and the need for distributed authority for that very reason.
-F
Still ultimately responsible Frem, they pay the taxes, serve in their conscripted army, and fail to force change where that change is in their primary interest...
Between Gulf war 1, the Sanctions, and Gulf War 2... what maybe a million and a half Iraqs, maybe more went down so the US could say they got Saddam right ?
The leadership thing is a great point, the decentralized structure they created now gives them nobody to negotiate with, no one leadership fiqure the could come to a compromise with... Arfat was the closest hope, but he is gone...
And you see the US trying to do the same with the Taliban...
bad tactics, unless you want a forever war
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Still ultimately responsible Frem, they pay the taxes, serve in their conscripted army, and fail to force change where that change is in their primary interest...
Yeah, well, problem with that is that enough damned fools are still willing to kill em on orders of that government if they refuse to comply.
We got THAT problem right here, too.
End result of refusing to "play ball", is either thrown under the jail, if you meekly comply, or getting very dead if you don't - and if they start running out of jails, they'll just get the idiots still listenin to em to build more, like we do here.
Gettin incarcerated or dead doesn't help anyone, in fact often enough it provides just one more fucking excuse to crush internal dissent all the harder, so the only option left is slipping sand in the gears when no one is lookin, till the machine starts to fall apart.
Watchin those loose gears rattle is about all the satisfaction I have at the moment, but it's pretty satisfyin knowin that there's TEN TIMES more where that came from than when I started this...
They'd be well-advised to do the same.
-F
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:Quote:
Originally posted by GinoBiffaroni:
Still ultimately responsible Frem, they pay the taxes, serve in their conscripted army, and fail to force change where that change is in their primary interest...
Yeah, well, problem with that is that enough damned fools are still willing to kill em on orders of that government if they refuse to comply.
We got THAT problem right here, too.
End result of refusing to "play ball", is either thrown under the jail, if you meekly comply, or getting very dead if you don't - and if they start running out of jails, they'll just get the idiots still listenin to em to build more, like we do here.
Gettin incarcerated or dead doesn't help anyone, in fact often enough it provides just one more fucking excuse to crush internal dissent all the harder, so the only option left is slipping sand in the gears when no one is lookin, till the machine starts to fall apart.
Watchin those loose gears rattle is about all the satisfaction I have at the moment, but it's pretty satisfyin knowin that there's TEN TIMES more where that came from than when I started this...
They'd be well-advised to do the same.
-F
Crushing Internal Dissent is good my friend,
let them squeeze, and rant, and push
it exposes them for what they are, and without that pressure they could go on forever with their bullshit unnoticed
exposing them on the outside cuts them off from support
and crushing dissent on the inside, if you force them to squeeze tight enough starts revolutions
France
Russia
Cuba
Iran
Look at any of them, people under the yoke eventually push back... it can be ugly, and many of the oppressors don't fair well in the process
But who am I to judge
But every revolution needs a spark, and here is hoping for sparks
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Israel makes life very hard for Palestinians, says ICRC
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8519921.stm
Israeli restrictions make normal life "close to impossible" for many West Bank Palestinians, the International Committee of the Red Cross has said.
Some Palestinians are often unable to reach a hospital or visit relatives, while 50% live in poverty, it said.
They are also frequently harassed by Jewish settlers, the organisation said.
An Israeli foreign ministry spokesman said the ICRC had ignored statements by the Palestinian Authority that West Bank residents lived a "normal life".
Whilst the economy has shown some signs of growth, the ICRC statement said restrictions linked to Israeli settlements had deprived many Palestinian farmers of their land.
We reiterate our call on Israel to do more to protect Palestinians in the West Bank against settler violence
Beatrice Megevand-Roggo
ICRC
Israeli settlers 'still building'
It said attacks and harassment by settlers prevented many farmers from cultivating their own land, and some 10,000 Palestinian olive trees had been cut down or burned in the past three years.
"The ICRC has repeatedly called for action to be taken to allow Palestinians to live their lives in dignity," said ICRC head of operations in the Middle East, Beatrice Megevand-Roggo.
"We reiterate our call on Israel to do more to protect Palestinians in the West Bank against settler violence, to safeguard their land and crops, to allow families to repair their houses and to assure that all Palestinians can get to hospital or to school without delay."
Israeli foreign ministry spokesman Yigal Palmor said the report ignored official PA figures which showed the economic situation had "improved remarkably" over the past year.
He also referred to comments by PA President Mahmoud Abbas to the Washington Post in May 2009, where he said "in the West Bank, we have a good reality, the people are living a normal life".
In November, the Israeli government of Benjamin Netanyahu ordered a 10-month cessation of building new settlements in the West Bank, a precondition for peace talks demanded by the Palestinians.
But, according to information released by the Israeli government, around 30 settlements are still being developed in defiance of the order.
US attempts to revive peace talks have stalled over the Jewish settlement issue.
Palestinians say they will not return to peace talks unless Israel stops settlement building in the West Bank.
Israel has a long-standing commitment under an existing peace plan to stop settlement growth.
All settlements in the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, are considered illegal under international law, although Israel disputes this.
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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I wonder if they catch any of these folk, if terrorism charges would be laid ?
http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/2010/02/201021614324286713.html
'With friends like these ...'
By Ibrahim Hewitt
Allegations that the Israeli secret service, Mossad, was behind the killing of Hamas commander Mahmoud al-Mabhouh in Dubai are gaining strength.
The accusation originated with Hamas after the 49-year-old was found dead in a hotel in Dubai last month.
Israel, unsurprisingly, has neither confirmed nor denied that Mossad operatives carried out the killing.
The Times newspaper, however, has reported Ehud Olmert, the former Israeli prime minister, alluding to "Mossad ... waging a covert war of assassinations across the Middle East, targeting Hamas and Iranian officials".
Foreign passports
Dubai's chief of police has now said that 11 people were involved in the operation and they all used European - including six British - passports to get into and out of the Emirate.
It is known that Mossad uses foreign passports "regularly" because Israeli passports raise "red flags" when its operatives are travelling.
An Israeli passport is still unacceptable in most of the Arab capitals and a visa is unlikely to be granted to holders of Israeli passports seeking to enter Dubai - one exception was for an Israeli tennis player taking part in a Dubai tournament last year.
If Mossad's involvement is proven to be true, it is yet another example of Israel's disregard for the sovereignty of other nations - including supposed "strategic allies" like Britain.
There is no record of US passports ever being used in such operations - Israel tends to spy on its main benefactor instead.
In 1996, when Khaled Meshaal, the head of Hamas' political bureau, was the target of an assassination attempt in Amman, the Mossad team responsible was captured and they had used genuine Canadian passports to enter Jordan.
'Stategic allies'
What is doubly interesting about that attempt on Meshaal's life is that it took place during Binyamin Netanyahu's first term as Israeli prime minister.
Assassinations tailed off in the intervening years but have now resurfaced as a serious tactic against Israel's opponents, again while Netanyahu is at the helm of Israel's government.
The trail to find those responsible for al-Mabhouh's killing could therefore lead all the way to Netanyahu himself.
If that is the case, then it surely raises questions about Britain's relationship with the country called a "strategic ally" by David Miliband, the UK's foreign secretary, when he raised the possibility of changing Britain's universal jurisdiction obligations to make it possible for Israelis suspected of committing war crimes to enter the UK.
The foreign office says that it is "in contact with the Dubai authorities" about the identity of the six British passport holders.
A former Mossad agent quoted in The Times claims that passports used in such operations include those belonging to real dual nationality holders while others are "acquired".
Passports 'forged'
According to the Daily Telegraph newspaper British government "sources" believe that the passports were forged and were used by "Mossad agents".
In a bizarre twist, reports are coming from the Middle East about Hamas claims that two men belonging to the Palestinian Authority's security agencies have been captured by Jordan and sent to Dubai in connection with this murder.
The PA has made a counter-claim that the two are actually Hamas members.
The world of espionage has always been murky and it may well be that we will never know what really happened in the hotel room where Mahmoud al-Mabhouh was murdered.
However, there surely is sufficient doubt for the British government to review its dealings with the Israeli government, "strategic ally" or not.
With friends like these, who needs enemies?
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn
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What's it going to take to bring the settlement issue under control?
Looks like they are trying to turn the West Bank into another Gaza. If they can't get what they want they turn into the worst of bullies. Kinda reminds me of another country.
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BTW, I'm not ignoring this topic b/c I don't care or agree. But some things are just too painful and frustrating to dwell on.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
BTW, I'm not ignoring this topic b/c I don't care or agree. But some things are just too painful and frustrating to dwell on.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
But would you agree that this is the number one issue challenging world peace ?
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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What SignyM told me many years ago is that people don't fight b/c they are 'different' from each other. They fight for control of real things like land, water, oil, or other natural resources, or control of economic (human) resources. It took a long time for that to filter through, but it's a truism that I've come to accept b/c I've tested it out over the last two decades and always found it to be the case. Even the 'ideal' of 'freedom' is about who has real control in the real world.
Recent studies have shown that even religious terrorists are motivated by real world issues like economic opportunity.
That said, Palestine is probably one of the bigger sparks of dispute, but not the only one.
And ultimately, the driving force of world involvement in the conflict in the MidEast is about control of MidEast oil and MidEast shipping.
What drives me personally up the wall about Palestine, and what makes it so frustrating and painful for me, is the blatant unfairness of it, the hypocrisy of Israel, and the US's blindly insane support of Israel, no matter what. But that's an emotional response caused by personal issues which rage at that sort of thing.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Well said,
that is why I think this thread, and the Iran thread are so important...
I posted earlier
http://blogs.aljazeera.net/middle-east/2010/02/12/israel-fighting-dele
gitimisation-campaign
Israel fighting 'delegitimisation campaign'
As outrage grows in US campuses over Israeli policies towards Palestinians, Israel seems to be fighting back.
continues
If we debate the facts in our own forums, it limits our leaders ability to make up our minds for us... if the involved partys really want our support, ( or not ) they need to take notice of our collective opinions, and not simply bribe our leaders.
The posts about the Israeli supreme court were particularly of interest...
I only wish the pro Israel lobby was to be heard from ( the rational lobby I mean, Participant left after I pointed out he posted a fake 60 minutes story, and NewOld seems to be the Jewish equivalent of a holocaust denier, and the Palestinians do not exist )
I can understand this being a frustrating and painful subject, I avoided posting alot of pictures because of that...
I'll keep posting on this thread, more because I feel the frustration too, and want to do something... My local MP says he agrees with my position, but his party feels... makes me want to scream.
sigh...
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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I understand the frustration this subject produces. Also, the anger, rage and sense of hopelessness.
I will keep adding to this thread also. Reasoned debate and continuing to look for solutions may be our only hope.
Here is an article about just such a debate and how it changed a few minds.
"That "Special Relationship" is hereby up for discussion. Pass the word."
http://www.paltelegraph.com/opinions/views/4212-questioning-our-specia
l-relationship-with-Israel
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In exploring some of the Israeli High Court rulings I found this. Interesting.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/30/AR2009
073003809.html?sid=ST2009073100107
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http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8523588.stm
Highlights
The international police agency Interpol - which has issued arrest notices for all 11 suspects although it admitted their true identities were unclear - issues red notices to seek the arrest of wanted persons with a view to extraditing them.
Diplomatic tensions have been building between Britain and Israel after it emerged on Monday that six of the passports used by the 11 suspected assassins were British.
They were clones of passports belonging to men who have dual British and Israeli citizenship.
I think if I could I would do away with Dual Citizenships... just seems like you should pick one or the other
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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Man, they got a LONG history of that kinda bullshit, the whole blowup with New Zealand a while ago is also typical of the way they do business.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Israel_%E2%80%93_New_Zealand_spy_sca
ndal
With "friends" like these....
-F
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Man, they got a LONG history of that kinda bullshit, the whole blowup with New Zealand a while ago is also typical of the way they do business.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Israel_%E2%80%93_New_Zealand_spy_sca
ndal
With "friends" like these....
-F
I am still amazed about the lack of fallout over the Pollard affair...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Pollard
1. It didn't dent the financial / military support given by the US
2. After Israel sold their guy out, people still work for them
Even the Soviets wouldn't have done that.....
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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I wonder if they have some sort of bet how far they can go ?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8527532.stm
Israel adds West Bank shrines to heritage list
Jewish settler prays at the Tomb of the Patriarchs (file)
The Tomb of the Patriarchs in Hebron has been a flashpoint for decades
Israel's prime minister has announced a controversial plan to add two major religious sites in the West Bank to the country's national heritage list.
Benjamin Netanyahu told his cabinet the Tomb of the Patriarchs in Hebron and Rachel's Tomb in Bethlehem would now be included in the $107m restoration plan.
Israeli media said the two sites had been included on the list only after pressure from nationalist ministers.
The Palestinian Authority warned the decision would "wreck" peace efforts.
Negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians have been frozen for more than a year, with the PA refusing to participate until Israel halts settlement building in the West Bank and East Jerusalem.
Israel has scaled back construction in the West Bank, but it does not consider areas within the Jerusalem municipality to be settlements.
'Violation'
Addressing a cabinet meeting, Mr Netanyahu unveiled the two additions to the national heritage list.
He said the Tomb of the Patriarchs and Rachel's Tomb had to be preserved because they showed Israel's ancient ties to the land.
The purpose of the list... is to single out sites that are of great importance to the Jewish people
Mark Regev
Israeli government spokesman
"Our existence here doesn't just depend on the might of the military or our economic and technological strength," he added. "It is anchored first and foremost in our national and emotional legacy."
The Tomb of the Patriarchs - which Muslims call the al-Ibrahimi mosque - is where the Bible says Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were buried along with three of their wives.
It has been a flashpoint for decades, with 500 Jewish settlers living in enclaves near the disputed site, surrounded by 170,000 Palestinians.
The Tomb of Rachel - a shrine to the Biblical matriarch holy to Jews, Christians, and Muslims - has also been a source of controversy.
Israel's West Bank barrier juts far into Bethlehem so that the tomb is located on the Israeli side, ostensibly for security reasons. However, Palestinians say it impedes their access and represents an illegal land grab.
Rachel's Tomb (file)
Palestinians have complained they are denied access to Rachel's Tomb
Jewish settlers and nationalists, who oppose giving up control of any of the West Bank, said they were pleased with Mr Netanyahu's announcement and that they would press for additional biblical sites to be added to the list.
A spokesman for the Palestinian Authority condemned the decision, particularly the designation of the Tomb of the Patriarchs, and warned it could take the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in a dangerous direction.
"We believe that this particular violation is very dangerous because it might add to the religious nature of the conflict," Ghassan Khatib told the Associated Press.
But Israeli government spokesman Mark Regev said the list was not meant to draw borders ahead of a final status agreement.
"The purpose of the list... is to single out sites that are of great importance to the Jewish people," he said.
Close to 500,000 Jews live in more than 100 settlements built since Israel's 1967 occupation of the West Bank and Arab East Jerusalem. They are illegal under international law, though Israel disputes this.
Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists
Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"
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They are trying to silence the rulings they don't like in their own supreme court, and now they are going after human rights workers. Wonder what's next?
http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100222/FOREIGN/
702219878&SearchID=7338274960347
Israel’s new ‘attack on freedom of speech’
Jonathan Cook, Foreign Correspondent
* Last Updated: February 21. 2010 11:01PM UAE / February 21. 2010 7:01PM GMT
Right-wing activists protest against the New Israel Fund’s alleged role in the Goldstone war crimes report. Gali Tibbon / AFP
NAZARETH // The Israeli government and its right-wing supporters have been waging a “McCarthyite” campaign against human-rights groups by blaming them for the barrage of international criticism that has followed Israel’s attack on Gaza a year ago, critics say.
In a sign of the growing backlash against the human-rights community, the cabinet backed a bill last week that, if passed, will jail senior officials from the country’s peace-related organisations should they fail to meet tough new registration conditions.
The measure is a response to claims by right-wing lobbyists that Israel’s human-rights advocates supplied much of the damaging evidence of war crimes cited by Judge Richard Goldstone in his UN-commissioned report into Israel’s Operation Cast Lead.
Human-rights groups funded by foreign donors, such as the European Union, would be required to register as political bodies and meet other demands for “transparency”.
Popular support for the clampdown was revealed in a poll published last week showing that 57 per cent of Israeli Jews believed “national-security” issues should trump human rights.
In a related move, right-wing groups have launched a campaign of vilification against Naomi Chazan, the Israeli head of an American Jewish donor body called the New Israel Fund (NIF) that channels money to Israeli social justice groups. The NIF is accused of funding the Israeli organisations Mr Goldstone consulted for his report.
Billboard posters around Tel Aviv and Jerusalem, and a newspaper advertising campaign, show a caricature of Ms Chazan with a horn growing from her forehead under the title “Naomi-Goldstone-Chazan”.
“We are seeing the evaporation of the last freedoms of speech and organisation in Israel,” said Amal Jamal, head of politics at Tel Aviv University and the director of Ilam, a media-rights organisation that would be targeted by the new legislation. The Israeli political system, he added, was being transformed into a “totalitarian democracy”.
Leading the charge against human-rights groups – most of which are officially described as “non-governmental organisations” – has been a self-styled “watchdog group” known as NGO Monitor. Its activities have won support from the government following the international censure faced by Israel for its attack on Gaza.
The bill, approved by a ministerial committee last week, is the product of a conference staged in the parliament in December by Gerald Steinberg, NGO Monitor’s director, and a settler-backed organisation known as the Institute of Zionist Strategies.
A professor at Bar Ilan University, Prof Steinberg presented a report to MPs and ministers that referred to peace groups as “Trojan horses” and argued for imposing constraints on funding from European governments and the NIF.
In a statement at the time, Prof Steinberg said: “For over a decade European governments have been manipulating Israeli politics and promoting demonisation by funding a narrow group of favored non-governmental organisations.”
He has reserved special criticism for advocacy groups for the country’s Arab minority and for Jewish groups opposing the occupation, accusing both of promoting an image of Israel as an “apartheid” state that carries out “war crimes” and “ethnic cleansing”.
According to his report, 16 Israeli peace NGOs received US$8 million (Dh29m) in European funding in the previous three years.
Pressure has been building in the government for action. This month Yuli Edelstein, the diaspora affair
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