HELP!- Where do i shoot mal? by PurplePebble

BLUE SUN ROOM

HELP!- Where do i shoot mal?

POSTED BY: PURPLEPEBBLE
UPDATED: Saturday, March 25, 2006 22:17
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VIEWED: 7768
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Monday, March 20, 2006 2:15 PM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Ok so this request is for help with a fic that hasn't strictly been posted yet, but it will be. I promise

Ok so for the question where do i shoot mal?

I had an idea, it turned into a fic, and now its turned into an argument.

I wish to have a character that isn't particularly familar with guns shoot mal. I thought for a wound that will not be fatel the shoulder might be a good idea. i wanted to stay away from stomach because it seems like everyone shoots mal in the stomach, and i dont want readers being all like, oh this is out of gas!

I told my partner this, and he disagrees completely. thinks the shoulder is too hard to hit for a novice, and ultimately more dangerouse, as well as what every one. does. he thinks the stomach is best, as ruled out legs and arms as too hard, and not dangerouse enough. the people that witness the shooting have to think mals dead.

At a later date mals injury has to be agrivated by him carrying someone to safty.

Ok so if anyones still with me i guess what i want to know is, is every one fed up of mal getting shot in the stomach? Is the shoulder to hard or overdone?

All ideas and comments welcome.

Ultimately- where do i shot mal?

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Monday, March 20, 2006 5:17 PM

NUCLEARDAY

well, not that I know anything at all about guns beyond videogames... but insofar as any part of the body being harder to hit than another:

Yes, it's easier to shoot someone in the stomach I'd imagine than aiming for a specific part. But if we're talking about a novice sort of wildly firing away, then that bullet can end up just about anywhere.

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

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Monday, March 20, 2006 5:37 PM

DRE

I've found that when people panic and shoot, they tend to jerk the gun. So I'd say the shoulders/arms are fair game (and helps with your future plan of Mal's carrying an all). More often though they tend to point downward and shoot, I think, so the upper leg/thighs are also acceptable.

It depends on what they were doing before the gun goes off. If they just kinda pick it up and shoot, go for an extremity. If they're pointing the gun at Mal and babbling, and they fire just in the heat of things, do the stomach.

And who cares if he's got shot there before? Only so many places you can shoot someone, and only so many that aren't 'strategically' targetted.

My two cents.

IKIYO.
DRE

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 2:54 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

hey guys, I thought it might help to have a little more information.

When he is shot, mal is being held in position. the person shooting him is being forced to do so. they do not want to but it is either them or mal, and he tells them to do it. so its a facing each other calm talking kinda shooting. it has to at less look lke a fatel wound, because if it doesnt the people doing the forcing just wont except it. oh and it happends to be his gun his shot with. (just to add insult to injury, litrially.)

well thats about all i can think of that may affect the outcome.

Thank so much for your replies, im still not convinced either way, so more are welcome.

but i am a little clearer. so thank you loads, and you all may have a protein cookie, hot out the oven and all warm too.

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:02 AM

NUCLEARDAY

hmm... that is a quandary, huh? If it's gotta come out believable as fatal then you'd obviously have to rule out the extremities. Gut shots, can be quite fatal (example that scene in Three Kings has a rather graphic explanation as to the why) but not always immediately so.

Shoulders are good, too. (Is the person being forced to shoot Mal trying specifically to get this result, or actually trying to kill him?)

Also, a good grazing scalp wound is always good for tons of blood. Lots of blood vessels up there tend to make it look worse than it actually is. (Though obviously getting headshot is a lot more likely to outright kill you, too.)

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:13 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Quote:
Originally posted by nuclearday:
hmm... that is a quandary, huh?

A quandary, yeah thats the polite way of labling it. Lol.

Hmm as for what the person shooting wants, they going to want to cause him the least pain/damage possiable. they do not want him dead, they are his friend.who's only reason for even holding his gun is because they have one pointed at there own sweet head.

I thought about the head, but it just seems a might to dangerouse, plus it doesnt really affect his ablity to carry someone.

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:15 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Arghhh i've gone all blue! whoops wrong button.

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:27 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Ahh, I see your problem ;p On the other hand, if the person shooting Mal a) doesn't want to be shooting him b)isn't too familiar with guns and c)is doing all this at gunpoint their ownself...

Might not make for the most accurate shot anyways. (Seen that in movies at least: shaky hands, closing their eyes before they pull the trigger, etc.) You're likely looking at somewhere in the torso then, at least. Wish I could be more help, though ;p

Along the lines of the shoulder, there's also the collarbone. Gonna hurt like a bitch I'd imagine, but it's also a nice solid round bone that could deflect some of the energy away from anything vital. Same for the ribs, which is partially what they're there for. Gonna likely hit something he's gonna need at some point, but might not necessarily kill him straight out.

Seeing as how I'm hooked now, I'll be awaiting your fic to see how this ends up playing out ;p

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:45 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

ah now thats an idea i like. the collarbone taking the brunt of the shot. close enough to chest to look deadly, and with lots of the pain. Resulting in a immediate pass-out, but then the ablity to still get up and stumbleto where ever need be.

hmm but then again wouldnt a bulliet just smash it to pieces, i dont want permanant damage.
oh *sigh* i think im just causing myself problems now.

I think im going to have to have the person aim in one place but the bulliet end up somewhere else thats for sure.

woohoo i have someone interested already, and i haven't even posted yet. well thats good news. I'm going to try and get the first chapter up in the next week or two. however this shootingness doesnt happen untill a loooooong way in. I'm just trying to get it straight in my head now, so i know where the whole thing is going. (if that makes any sense)

thanks for your help, and being a sounding board nuclearday

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:48 AM

ARCADIA

Is the shooter trying to kill Mal, or trying to make it LOOK like s/he is killing Mal?

If you don't want to go with the stomach, the thigh is actually a good option. There are lots of big, giant arteries in the thigh that bleed heavily when they're sliced or shot. The femoral artery is the biggest, but you would want to his the lesser arteries around the femoral artery. You really don't want to slice the femoral itself, you could bleed to death very, very quickly (we're talking minutes). So, if the people are sadistic, or former soldiers (slicing of the femoral artery is a fairly common way that soldiers die) then they will know that Mal is a goner when the buller hits his leg, and might be satisfied. Personally, this would be my pick, because once it is patched up you don't have to deal with overly lengthy recovery.

The shoulder... it works, but in order for it to be believably fatel, Mal needs to be shot in the right shoulder, which could be too tricky for an inexperienced shooter. Also, if the bullet doesn't go straight through, then having it so close to the heart is very, very dangerous, as it could end up moving down and opening the aorta. And if that happened -- bye, bye Mal. Of course, if the wound was too high on the right shoulder, to the point where it wouldn't be all too dangerous, it wouldn't look too fatal.

I don't think you need to worry about the "aggrivating the wound while be carried" thing. The wound.... well, I think it would be pretty aggrivating no matter where it is.

http://snipurl.com/nww2 <-- This is a sight designed to help Sentinal fans beat up there favorite characters. I stumbled across it last year when my now-rooommate introducted me to stargate. Now, there is a fandom that like to beat people up. They have pretty specific info here on what could happen if you were shot in the chest, near the heart, or by the shoulder/collar bone, and, if you scroll down, the abdomen, as well as great info on toher traumatic injuries, espeically injuries tot he lungs.

You may be interested in the book "Body Truama: A Writer's Guide to Wounds and Injuries" by David W. Page ( http://snipurl.com/nww1). Seriously, this is one of the most interesting books I've ever read.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Objects in Space"
River: It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think...

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 4:04 AM

CAUSAL

Quote:
Originally posted by PurplePebble:
hey guys, I thought it might help to have a little more information.

When he is shot, mal is being held in position. the person shooting him is being forced to do so. they do not want to but it is either them or mal, and he tells them to do it. so its a facing each other calm talking kinda shooting. it has to at less look lke a fatel wound, because if it doesnt the people doing the forcing just wont except it. oh and it happends to be his gun his shot with. (just to add insult to injury, litrially.)

well thats about all i can think of that may affect the outcome.

Thank so much for your replies, im still not convinced either way, so more are welcome. but i am a little clearer. so thank you loads, and you all may have a protein cookie, hot out the oven and all warm too.

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

When I learned to shoot a handgun in the military, my rounds were all going above and to the right of the target. No matter how carefully I aimed at the center of the bullseye, it went above and to the right. The rangemaster told me that I was pulling the trigger too hard, too all-at-once, and with too much of my finger. So when I engaged the target, my trigger finger was actually pulling the barrel of the gun off target. Why do I mention all this? Well, if Mal is being held in place and the shooter is a novice, they could actually be aiming for the center of his chest and hit his shoulder, just from not knowing how to shoot properly.

________________________________________________________________________
I wish I had a magical wish-granting plank.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 4:14 AM

RHODRI

Shoot him in the back...and miss by aiming too low!!

There's many a one that's taken a round to the rump!

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 4:29 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Wow, ideas coming thick and fast now. I love this site.

that web site is amazingly coool, in the disgusting'est kind of way. loads of information, and im defernately filing it for future referance. thankies Arcadia.

now im thinking the thigh might be a good idea. the shooter could be pleased because they naturaly think (like i would have done) its not that bad, and the real bad guys could, in great detail explain how bad it actually is. Then again the shooter isn't as thick as me, and has quite a bit of anatonomy knowledge.

so that kind of brings me back to the shoulder thing, and the bad aiming. which thanks to causal usefull info, seems possiable.
weather it would look fatel enough, is annother mater.

"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:16 AM

ROB150185

Purplepebble:

I suggest you watch "The Negotiator."

Anyone see where I'm going with this?

I'll be in my bunk...

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:28 AM

GWEK

Some of it depends on who's holding Mal and judging the shot. If they have any combat or medical skills whatsoever, it's going to have to be a shot to the head or trunk of the body (no arms, legs... I don't think shoulder is believably fatal).

One possibility would be to have the shooter fire once, hit the shoulder or leg, and the other folks are like "Um, no, not good enough" then Mal or someone leans in and tells the other person where to shoot to make it look fatal (I'm sort of assuming that the shooter might be one of the crew).

www.stillflying.net: "Here's how it might have been..."

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:51 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Quote:
Originally posted by Rob150185:
Purplepebble:

I suggest you watch "The Negotiator."

Anyone see where I'm going with this?

Genius, one of my favourite movies, and i didnt even think about.

I hang my head in shame.

so thats a thigh vote.

~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~
"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 5:59 AM

ROB150185

Anytime matey!

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 6:00 AM

SCHOONER

This may be too far out for yur story, but there have been cases where a shot to the chest was deflected by something the victim was wearing (a medallion, a cross) just enough so it did not penetrate to the heart. Instead it entered the victim and sort of skidded along the rib, exiting out the side toward the back. Entry and exit wounds, lots of blood and pain, and immediate unconsciousness.

The downside to this is that it would be one hell of a lucky shot (impossible to do deliberately), and it may be a more serious wound than you need for your narrative.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 6:56 AM

KAYNA

I love my captain

I don't have any usefull sugestions for you, sorry. I just wanted to say that now you have to post this story so I can read it. I'm intrigued. I need to know what's going on. You must write.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Op: You're fighting a war you've already lost.
Mal: Yeah, well I'm known for that.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 7:16 AM

HOTPOINT

One thing you might like to consider is having the weapon loaded with armour-piercing rather than conventional loads.

An armour-piercing round would be less likely to cause serious internal injuries as it goes through and won't fragment when it hits. It would still leave a nice bloody entrance wound (and a nice neat exit wound because it will just punch right through).

A normal bullet would expand and fragment a bit so it would cause more damage on the inside.

...................................
Hurrah, hurrah, when things are at their worst
With cries of “Death or Glory” comes the mighty Twenty-First

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 7:35 AM

PURPLEPEBBLE

Quote:
Originally posted by Kayna:
I don't have any usefull sugestions for you, sorry. I just wanted to say that now you have to post this story so I can read it. I'm intrigued. I need to know what's going on. You must write.

aww your sweet, i will post. im just working on fnishing the first chapter at the moment, but hey if ya really wana read something by me, try here
: http://www.fanfiction.net/~purplepebble
Its not firefly based im afraid, (I was going through a 'Mummy' phase) but it is some of my work.

As for the Bullet ideas from hotpoint, well now i hadn't even thought about that, you guys keep on come up with new things its great.

~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~x~
"Why did you leave?".... "Why didn't you ask me not too?"

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 8:25 AM

MALICE

You could also pull a 24 and have him get shot in the neck like they did Tony Almeda. Shot was a through and through close enough in that it looked fatal, wide enough that it missed the carotid artery but serious enough to scare everyone about whether he would make it or not. This also fits in with a person who isn't very good with weapons as they tend to jerk the gun when fired thus sending an aimed shot higher.

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Tuesday, March 21, 2006 3:00 PM

BROWNCOAT2006

I know I know, Im being way to versey... lol, the collar bone idea hit me with something elles... you know how Mal got his ear re-attached? Well, why not do something that re-generats or solidifys crushed bone? some medical trick in Simons bag.. blah blah blah etc. ad naudium... This is the verse after all, you can make up some medical device that would save him from something that could BECOME fatel in our world...

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Wednesday, March 22, 2006 8:18 AM

NUCLEARDAY

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat2006:
I know I know, Im being way to versey... lol, the collar bone idea hit me with something elles... you know how Mal got his ear re-attached? Well, why not do something that re-generats or solidifys crushed bone? some medical trick in Simons bag.. blah blah blah etc. ad naudium... This is the verse after all, you can make up some medical device that would save him from something that could BECOME fatel in our world...

That's a good point as well. One of the nice things about a sci-fi setting, is it's more possible to have your protagonists live through worse injuries. Simon's a mighty fine doctor, after all. I'd worry less about the long-term effects the wound. Likely safe to say that if Mal can live through it, the good Doctor should be able to patch him up.

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

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Saturday, March 25, 2006 10:17 PM

SERENITY28

i also think the neck would be a good bet, poor tony

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