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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My wages would go up too. I'm not worried about it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My wages would go up too. I'm not worried about it.

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My wages would go up too. I'm not worried about it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Originally posted by second:

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My wages would go up too. I'm not worried about it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Employers who knowingly hire people who are in the country illegally are not facing meaningful consequences. ICE says it is enforcing the law, but they are bullshitting you. One hundred raids on 7-Elevens, when there are 50 states, is not the same as meaningfully enforcing the law. It is closer to pretending to enforce. More like making a show for TV news so that ICE can avoid doing really significant enforcement, with thousands of raids every month, raids where the employer is the target, not the employees. Employers will soon get the message if thousands of them spend one night in jail before being bailed out. Best of all, Congress would not need to pass any new laws for Trump's signature.

In the past – and specifically during the Bush presidency – raids that harmed business interests provoked an outcry from employers that had come to rely on immigrant labor, especially in the agriculture and meatpacking industries, which had powerful lobbies in Congress. Although President Ronald Reagan had signed a law two decades earlier making it illegal for employers to knowingly hire or recruit people who are in the country illegally, large-scale enforcement actions weren't carried out in earnest until Bush. The industries saw the raids as a draconian response to what had become standard work practices, and they pressured lawmakers in the nation's capital to push back against such actions.

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
My wages would go up too. I'm not worried about it.

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Why would your wages go up? Why would someone pay you more for the same job? Wait - are you an illegal Mexican?

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Originally posted by WISHIMAY:

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Originally posted by second:
Literally, this is all Trump.

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The ONLY thing Trump is good at inspiring... is getting mad people to go for long walks

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Because wages in general would go up when your remove the sinkhole at the bottom keeping everything down.

You're talking to the wrong guy about the wrong things here, bud. I might not have ever gotten that college degree, but I aced all my Econ classes and I'll smoke you when it comes to anything regarding money.

You'd be better off sticking around your liberal arts safe spaces.

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

So what are you doing with that fancy econ knowledge you think you have, anyway? Stacking boxes?

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

I can't be arsed to teach you how money works, but I'll reply to this part.


What I'm not doing is making a monthly car payment and in-turn paying full coverage on my car. I bought it with cash for $2,000 ten years ago and with only $600 I've got it running almost perfect again, including 4 new tires and a windshield installed. Yearly car insurance payments are only barely over $300 per year.

What I'm also not doing is paying rent or a mortgage. That's easily $800 to $1,200 per month I'm not paying that you are.

Yep. I'm stacking boxes. 9 hour shifts of busting my hump and enjoying a body I haven't had since my mid 20's. Living a stress free life where for every 6 days I work I get 8 off to do whatever I want to. In the mean time I'm on course to have saved $500 every month this year.

How's your shitty 2 day weekends working out for you?

It must be awesome working so many hours at that great job you have to just turn around and pay somebody exorbitant interest rates for all the shit you bought that you didn't need.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
So... where are these goons now?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Seal the border, Mr Trump. Declare a national emergency and use all of the security forces at your disposal. And yank the foreign aid of those nations which haven't controlled transit thru their borders.

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You better run Siggy! They're coming for ya! Squeal!

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
So... where are these goons now?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I heard news that they have now Illegally crossed 3 borders by violence in Mexico, but I don't know where that puts them geographically.

Supposedly they are weeks away, so they will miss their deadline. Soros might need to fly some of them to the border to made their deadline.

Did you see that story about the American hitchhiker with Chris Hemsworth?

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Originally posted by second:

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Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

I can't be arsed to teach you how money works, but I'll reply to this part.


What I'm not doing is making a monthly car payment and in-turn paying full coverage on my car. I bought it with cash for $2,000 ten years ago and with only $600 I've got it running almost perfect again, including 4 new tires and a windshield installed. Yearly car insurance payments are only barely over $300 per year.

What I'm also not doing is paying rent or a mortgage. That's easily $800 to $1,200 per month I'm not paying that you are.

Yep. I'm stacking boxes. 9 hour shifts of busting my hump and enjoying a body I haven't had since my mid 20's. Living a stress free life where for every 6 days I work I get 8 off to do whatever I want to. In the mean time I'm on course to have saved $500 every month this year.

How's your shitty 2 day weekends working out for you?

It must be awesome working so many hours at that great job you have to just turn around and pay somebody exorbitant interest rates for all the shit you bought that you didn't need.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Your Money or Your Life
www.amazon.com/Your-Money-Life-Transforming-Relationship/dp/0143115766

Typical work day: Breakfast, if there's time. Grab commuter mug and briefcase (or lunch box). Hop in the car for the daily punishment called rush hour or get on a bus or train packed crushingly tight. On the job from nine to five (or longer). Deal with the boss. Deal with the coworker sent by the devil to rub you the wrong way. Deal with suppliers. Deal with clients/customers/patients. E-mails pile up. Act busy. Scroll through social media feeds. Hide mistakes. Smile when handed impossible deadlines. Give a sigh of relief when the ax known as "restructuring" or "downsizing"—or just plain getting laid off—falls on other heads. Shoulder the added workload. Watch the clock. Argue with your conscience but agree with the boss. Smile again. Five o'clock. Back in the car or on the bus or train for the evening commute. Home. Act human with your partner, kids, or roommates. Cook. Post a picture of your dinner online. Eat. Watch an episode of your favorite show. Answer one last e-mail. Bed. Eight hours of blessed oblivion—if we're lucky.

And they call this making a living? Think about it. How many people have you seen who are more alive at the end of the workday than they were at the beginning? Do we come home from our "making a living" activity with more life? Do we bound through the door, refreshed and energized, ready for a great evening with family and friends? Where's all the life we supposedly made at work? For many of us, isn't the truth of it closer to "making a dying"? Aren't we killing ourselves—our health, our relationships, our sense of joy and wonder— for our jobs? We are sacrificing our lives for money, but it's happening so slowly that we barely notice. Graying temples and thickening middles along with dubious signs of progress like a corner office, a company car, or tenure are the only landmarks of the passage of time. Eventually we may have all the necessities, niceties, and even luxuries we could ever want, but inertia itself keeps us locked into the nine-to-five pattern. After all, if we didn't work, what would we do with our time? The dreams we had of finding meaning and fulfillment through our jobs have faded into the reality of professional politics, burnout, boredom, and intense competition. That sense of wonder we had as children, that sense of mission we had in college, those times when love connected our hearts to all beings great and small are forgotten—all filed under "We were so young."

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Shit rolls downhill

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
I just noticed that when Trolls make posts like right before 6ix's, it's like dropping a turd in the thread.
So I might refer to these posts of theirs as Troll Turds.

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The rest of us know what is and isn't real.

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Siggy doesn't live on this continent.

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Traveling at a sluggish pace of 10 miles per day, the migrant caravan probably wouldn't arrive at the nearest US border crossing at McAllen, Texas until February, according to one observer, who debunked claims widely circulated by the media that the caravan would arrive before the Nov. 6 midterm election.

But as it turns out, the organizations that have been aiding the caravan since it first formed in Honduras nearly three weeks ago have already accounted for this. And to help ensure that images of border patrol agents arresting families and separating small children from their parents are flashing across cable news in the days and hours before the polls open, these groups are employing a new tactic: Busing.

That's right. As Fox News report on Tuesday showed, migrants traveling with the caravan are being loaded on to chartered buses and transported to the next stop on the trail to the US, having refused Mexico's offer of asylum, shelter and jobs

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should they opt to stay in the country. Fox News reporter Griff Jenkins revealed that multiple professional buses have lined up to board the migrants, as footage from the report showed.

As more than 5,000 troops mass on the border and a second caravan crosses into Mexico from Guatemala, Jenkins exposed more than 11 buses carrying some of the migrants organized in the state of Oaxaca. While the buses can't carry every member of the caravan - that would require more than 80 buses, by Fox's count, they can speed members closer to their next stop. Meanwhile, two more caravans in Guatemala and El Salvador.

"Something new that’s developing here," Jenkins said as he wandered the bus loading zone. "We’ve seen the 5,000 strong caravan walking to the border but now they’re waiting for a ride to the border. This is the first time I have seen an organized bus operation from the state of Oaxaca actually getting volunteer buses to put people … on them and take them to their next location."

The buses are just the latest example of the support the migrants have received from local townspeople and organizations from within Mexico, as the country's police and military have largely stood aside despite President Trump's demands that the Mexican government do something to slow or stop the caravan.

That’s very significant now because these towns continue to help them. When we began this way back a week or so – Mexican police were trying to dissuade them from going across the Guatemala-Mexico border. At least some of the towns are assisting them to make their way.

It's unclear who's paying for the buses or when more would be coming (but Jenkins believes more are on their way). However, the motivation behind the campaign should be obvious to anyone who has been paying attention since the first caravan formed. Getting the migrants to the border, where Trump's beefed-up border presence is waiting, is clearly a key component of the Democrats' election strategy (and has taken on increased importance since the Democrats attempts to make the vote about health care have largely foundered). Their logic probably looks something like this. Step 1. Get the migrants to the border in the days before the vote. Step 2. Replay the outrage blitz that followed Trump's order to separate migrant children from their families earlier this year. Step 3. Convince moderates that they would be committing an inhumane act by supporting Republicans. Step 4. (hopefully) victory.

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In a report based on an interview with Axios set to air on its new show, "Axios on HBO," the organization's reporter said such an order would be "the most dramatic move yet" in Trump's crackdown on illegal immigration, targeting so-called "anchor babies." It will almost certainly set off another stand-off with the courts, as Trump's authority to impose such a change via executive order is up for debate.

Trump said in an interview that he has run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed with the highly controversial move, which certainly will face legal challenges.

"It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump said, declaring he can do it by executive order.
When told says that's very much in dispute, Trump replied: "You can definitely do it with an Act of Congress. But now they're saying I can do it just with an executive order."
"We're the only country in the world where a person comes in and has a baby, and the baby is essentially a citizen of the United States ... with all of those benefits," Trump continued. "It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it has to end."
"It's in the process. It'll happen ... with an executive order."

* * *

Trump said he was surprised that Axios had caught wind of his plan.

"I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one. "

Axios later clarified that it had been working to confirm the story for weeks before the interview.

While any attempt to remove birthright citizenship would undoubtedly set off a constitutional challenge...

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

...Legal scholars are divided on the subject.

John Eastman, a constitutional scholar and director of Chapman University's Center for Constitutional Jurisprudence, told "Axios on HBO" that the Constitution has been misapplied over the past 40 or so years. He says the line "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" originally referred to people with full, political allegiance to the U.S. - green card holders and citizens.

Adding weight to Trump's argument, birthright citizenship wasn't applied to the children of immigrants until the 1960s...

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Between 1980 and 2006, the number of births to unauthorized immigrants - which opponents of birthright citizenship call "anchor babies" - skyrocketed to a peak of 370,000, according to a 2016 study by Pew Research. It then declined slightly during and following the Great Recession.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that children born to immigrants who are legal permanent residents have citizenship. But those who claim the 14th Amendment should not apply to everyone point to the fact that there has been no ruling on a case specifically involving undocumented immigrants or those with temporary legal status.

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Axios' four-part documentary news series will debut on HBO this Sunday at 6:30 pm.

Watch a clip from Axios' interview with Trump below:

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Lindsey Graham To Introduce Bill Ending Birthright Citizenship

With one week left before the Nov. 6 midterm vote, President Trump and his allies in Congress have managed to establish immigration policy as the de facto dominant issue with the revelation that Trump is planning an executive order to eliminate birthright citizenship in the US. But in the event that Trump's order is challenged and overturned by the federal courts (which is extremely possible despite the confirmations of Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh), South Carolina Sen. Lindsey Graham, a former adversary turned staunch Congressional ally, said Tuesday that he would introduce legislation to eliminate what he described as an "absurd" policy.

First, Graham - who is rumored to be on Trump's shortlist of candidates for a cabinet role after a post-election cleanout - applauded Trump for his decision (which he made public in an Axios interview published Tuesday morning)...

...then followed this up by declaring that he has always supported eliminating birthright citizenship, noting that the US is "one of only two countries in the world" that establishes citizenship by birth (though the accurate number is closer to 30). He argued that the policy is a magnet for illegal immigration and is "out of the mainstream" for the developed world and "needs to come to an end."

To help eliminate birthright, Graham said he would introduce legislation "along the same lines" as the executive order.

While some have speculated that eliminating birthright would require amending the constitution, Trump has insisted that this isn't the case, and given the conservative majority on the Supreme Court, many legal experts believe an act of Congress would more than suffice (though the court could also choose to uphold an executive order and toss out any lower court ruling as well).

As Trump deploys thousands of additional troops to the border to brace for the arrival of two caravans of migrants (who almost certainly won't arrive before the vote, but instead will most likely reach the US months later) it's becoming increasingly clear that immigration has become the dominant issue of this election cycle - which bodes well for Republicans, since Trump's hardline immigration policies have been credited for helping distinguish his campaign from the other Republicans seeking the nomination. Meanwhile, Democrats have sought to make health care the defining issue of the election cycle, to mixed results (of course, their efforts were complicated by preliminary data showing that ObamaCare premiums are set to fall next year for the first time since the law came into effect in 2014).

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Ending birthright citizenship is part of MY plan to reform immigration

1) Make English the official language of the USA
2) End birthright citizenship
3) Stop fucking around in other nations' politics and economies
4) Reduce the number of visa/immigration categories, end chained migration, eliminate the H2B visas, and straighten out the citizenship process.
5) Require all long-term (20+ years) illegal immigrants to apply for USA citizenship, give them five years to make the grade, and kick them out if they fail. Kick everyone else out

And before anyone says that I "hate immigrants "... I married one.

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

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All your ideas require 3/4 of the States ...- SECOND

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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All your ideas require 3/4 of the States ...- SECOND

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Bullshit, and you know it.

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

That's right. As Fox News report on Tuesday showed, immigrants traveling with the caravan are being loaded on to chartered buses and transported to the next stop on the trail to the US, having refused Mexico's offer of asylum, shelter and jobs... - Fox News reporter Griff Jenkins revealed that multiple professional buses have lined up to board the migrants, as footage from the report showed.

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Why would any Democrat/Soros/Liberal Boogey person want to hurry these immigrants to the border before the election? How does that serve Dem politics?

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Trump Plans To End Birthright Citizenship For Children Of Illegal Immigrants: Axios
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-10-30/trump-plans-end-birthright-c
itizenship-children-illegal-immigrants-axios

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In a report based on an interview with Axios set to air on its new show, "Axios on HBO," the organization's reporter said such an order would be "the most dramatic move yet" in Trump's crackdown on illegal immigration, targeting so-called "anchor babies." It will almost certainly set off another stand-off with the courts, as Trump's authority to impose such a change via executive order is up for debate.

Trump said in an interview that he has run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed with the highly controversial move, which certainly will face legal challenges.

"It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump said, declaring he can do it by executive order.
When told says that's very much in dispute, Trump replied: "You can definitely do it with an Act of Congress. But now they're saying I can do it just with an executive order."
"We're the only country in the world where a person comes in and has a baby, and the baby is essentially a citizen of the United States ... with all of those benefits," Trump continued. "It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it has to end."
"It's in the process. It'll happen ... with an executive order."

* * *

Trump said he was surprised that Axios had caught wind of his plan.

"I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one. "

Axios later clarified that it had been working to confirm the story for weeks before the interview.

While any attempt to remove birthright citizenship would undoubtedly set off a constitutional challenge...

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

...Legal scholars are divided on the subject.

John Eastman, a constitutional scholar and director of Chapman University's Center for Constitutional Jurisprudence, told "Axios on HBO" that the Constitution has been misapplied over the past 40 or so years. He says the line "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" originally referred to people with full, political allegiance to the U.S. - green card holders and citizens.

Adding weight to Trump's argument, birthright citizenship wasn't applied to the children of immigrants until the 1960s...

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So, the USA government was "mis-interpreting" the 14th Amendment for about a hundred years???

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Between 1980 and 2006, the number of births to unauthorized immigrants - which opponents of birthright citizenship call "anchor babies" - skyrocketed to a peak of 370,000, according to a 2016 study by Pew Research. It then declined slightly during and following the Great Recession.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that children born to immigrants who are legal permanent residents have citizenship. But those who claim the 14th Amendment should not apply to everyone point to the fact that there has been no ruling on a case specifically involving undocumented immigrants or those with temporary legal status.

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Well, time for a ruling, I guess! Altho I suspect that if Trump attempts this thru an Executive Order, any ruling would probably be about the procedure and not about this issue.

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Axios' four-part documentary news series will debut on HBO this Sunday at 6:30 pm.

Watch a clip from Axios' interview with Trump below:

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GO FOR IT, MR TRUMP!

The worst that can happen is that your EO gets stalled in court.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

It's a little like SECOND's blast of "brilliance" on using our tax laws to apprehend employers who illegally categorize employees as "contractors". Or using our laws - which demand valid Social Security numbers - for each employee. Yes, our laws could be improved, but the biggest problem with our immigration laws is lack of enforcement.

A recent study has "upped" the estimate of illegal immigrants in the USA from 12 to 22 million.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
That was already addressed. Please re-read previous post.

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Enforcement is all Trump's job.- SECOND

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All your ideas require 3/4 of the States ...- SECOND

Bullshit, and you know it.- SECOND

You are repeating what Trump said. - SECOND

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That was already addressed. Please re-read previous post. - SIGNY

Um, no - you're last post was, "Bullshit, and you know it." Scrolling up you didn't post anything to address those questions either, so nothing on this page.

Try again? "Why would any Democrat/Soros/Liberal Boogey person want to hurry these immigrants to the border before the election? How does that serve Dem politics?"- GSTRING

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But as it turns out, the organizations that have been aiding the caravan since it first formed in Honduras nearly three weeks ago have already accounted for this. And to help ensure that images of border patrol agents arresting families and separating small children from their parents are flashing across cable news in the days and hours before the polls open, these groups are employing a new tactic: Busing.

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Trump Plans To End Birthright Citizenship For Children Of Illegal Immigrants: Axios
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-10-30/trump-plans-end-birthright-c
itizenship-children-illegal-immigrants-axios

Quote:

---

In a report based on an interview with Axios set to air on its new show, "Axios on HBO," the organization's reporter said such an order would be "the most dramatic move yet" in Trump's crackdown on illegal immigration, targeting so-called "anchor babies." It will almost certainly set off another stand-off with the courts, as Trump's authority to impose such a change via executive order is up for debate.

Trump said in an interview that he has run the idea of ending birthright citizenship by his counsel and plans to proceed with the highly controversial move, which certainly will face legal challenges.

"It was always told to me that you needed a constitutional amendment. Guess what? You don't," Trump said, declaring he can do it by executive order.
When told says that's very much in dispute, Trump replied: "You can definitely do it with an Act of Congress. But now they're saying I can do it just with an executive order."
"We're the only country in the world where a person comes in and has a baby, and the baby is essentially a citizen of the United States ... with all of those benefits," Trump continued. "It's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. And it has to end."
"It's in the process. It'll happen ... with an executive order."

* * *

Trump said he was surprised that Axios had caught wind of his plan.

"I didn't think anybody knew that but me. I thought I was the only one. "

Axios later clarified that it had been working to confirm the story for weeks before the interview.

While any attempt to remove birthright citizenship would undoubtedly set off a constitutional challenge...

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."

...Legal scholars are divided on the subject.

John Eastman, a constitutional scholar and director of Chapman University's Center for Constitutional Jurisprudence, told "Axios on HBO" that the Constitution has been misapplied over the past 40 or so years. He says the line "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" originally referred to people with full, political allegiance to the U.S. - green card holders and citizens.

Adding weight to Trump's argument, birthright citizenship wasn't applied to the children of immigrants until the 1960s...

---

So, the USA government was "mis-interpreting" the 14th Amendment for about a hundred years???

Quote:

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Between 1980 and 2006, the number of births to unauthorized immigrants - which opponents of birthright citizenship call "anchor babies" - skyrocketed to a peak of 370,000, according to a 2016 study by Pew Research. It then declined slightly during and following the Great Recession.

The Supreme Court has already ruled that children born to immigrants who are legal permanent residents have citizenship. But those who claim the 14th Amendment should not apply to everyone point to the fact that there has been no ruling on a case specifically involving undocumented immigrants or those with temporary legal status.

---

Well, time for a ruling, I guess! Altho I suspect that if Trump attempts this thru an Executive Order, any ruling would probably be about the procedure and not about this issue.

Quote:

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Axios' four-part documentary news series will debut on HBO this Sunday at 6:30 pm.

Watch a clip from Axios' interview with Trump below:

---

GO FOR IT, MR TRUMP!

The worst that can happen is that your EO gets stalled in court.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

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Enforcement is all Trump's job.- SECOND

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Enforcement is ANY President's job. Our immigration laws have been so poorly enforced that Reagan had to cave in and offer amnesty. Now, when Trump TRIES to enforce the laws, sanctuary states/ liberaloids bitch and whine about it. Just look at GSTRING.

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All your ideas require 3/4 of the States ...- SECOND

Bullshit, and you know it.- SECOND

You are repeating what Trump said. - SECOND

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Bullshit, and you know it. I posted five separate ideas. At least three of them are within Trump's authority. You're turning into as big a liar as GSTRING.

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
That's right. As Fox News report on Tuesday showed, immigrants traveling with the caravan are being loaded on to chartered buses and transported to the next stop on the trail to the US, having refused Mexico's offer of asylum, shelter and jobs... - Fox News reporter Griff Jenkins revealed that multiple professional buses have lined up to board the migrants, as footage from the report showed.

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Fox Nooz also said they had small pox - not exactly a source that can be trusted.

Why would any Democrat/Soros/Liberal Boogey person want to hurry these immigrants to the border before the election? How does that serve Dem politics?

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Quote:

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Why would any Democrat/Soros/Liberal Boogey person want to hurry these immigrants to the border before the election? How does that serve Dem politics?

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That was already addressed. Please re-read previous post.

Now, I'm not sure which party this "caravan" serves best. The Dem base is about as fired up as it can be; but the Repub base - which might not be as "fired up" as Dems - might actually be activated by this issue.

The most effect would be on that very large group that isn't registered with either Dems or Repubs. They're called "independents" but because here in CA we have an "Independent" party we call them "no party preference". Generally speaking, that middle group leans right rather than left, but with effective advertising/ propaganda the caravan issue MIGHT be turned in favor of Dems.

******

Just a couple of comments: GSTRING, you're all spittle-y about Dems not being for "open borders". For the sake or argument, let me grant that Dems are, in theory, for border control. However, if they're against ENFORCING border control and immigration laws ... they don't want to "apprehend" illegal immigrants, they don't want to differentiate between illegal immigrants and citizens for government benefits, they don't believe in deporting illegal immigrants, and they want to "abolish ICE" ... then, in effect, they ARE for "open borders".

It's a little like SECOND's blast of "brilliance" on using our tax laws to apprehend employers who illegally categorize employees as "contractors". Or using our laws - which demand valid Social Security numbers - for each employee. Yes, our laws could be improved, but the biggest problem with our immigration laws is lack of enforcement.


*****

I think it's interesting that the same issue that is driving Merkel out of power and causing the EU to fray ... and possibly to even break up ... is the same issue that's driving a wedge between Democrats and Republicans, and that is IMMIGRATION. A recent study has "upped" the estimate of illegal immigrants in the USA from 12 to 22 million. That is the level which is causing significant social and economic disruption in European nations, there's no reason to think that it isn't a problem here too. Like the EU, some states here are far more affected than others.

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Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:

Do you find it curious that second seems to have arrived at plans which will have no apparent effect on Vicious Violent Criminal Illegal Aliens who have no interest in gainful employment, other than to increase Violent Crimes?
Without the rampant Criminal activity from Illegal Aliens, the issue might fall below the Radar of most voters.

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Signym, I think you and I could come up with some theories to explain why Obama did not deport those 11 to 22 million illegal aliens that are bothering you. Maybe Obama doesn't like you. But what is the explanation for Trump not deporting them, since illegal aliens are his bête noire? One possibility: he isn't ever going to do it. It is something he says only to get Signym's vote.

Trump himself didn’t even bring up the subject of birthright citizenship. It turns out that Jonathan Swan of Axios was interviewing Trump and decided to bring up the subject out of nowhere. Why? God knows. But after Trump blathered about it for a bit without actually committing to anything, Swan asked when it would happen. “It’s in the process,” Trump said. “It’ll happen.”

Everyone on the planet knows that this is Trumpspeak for “No one is working on it and I haven’t thought about it for a long time.”

But it didn’t matter. Nor did it matter that everyone knows Trump can’t overturn birthright citizenship with an executive order anyway. Signym jumps on the idea as exactly what is needed to MAGA.

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Originally posted by second:

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The roots of the problem: The breakdown of the employer-employee relationship that creates loopholes for abuse of workers and taxpayers.

Contractors who pay immigrants under the table to deliberately skirt immigration and employment laws are engaged in “misclassification” or “payroll fraud.” It involves employers pretending their workers are “independent subcontractors” when in reality they are employees who should be compensated accordingly and given benefits such as accident insurance and a retirement plan.

It’s been going on for decades and is the way most undocumented workers are paid. It’s cheating plain and simple. This misclassification not only allows those bosses to avoid immigration laws but also gives them a competitive advantage because their overall costs are at least 25 percent lower than firms following the law.

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Originally posted by second:
I am not worried about criminal activity from illegal aliens because I am not a coward like Trump voters.

-Sent from my iPhone in the comfort of my plantation in the middle of my lily white upper class 1% violent-crime-free neighborhood

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SECOND, you started out having a reasonable conversation, but then you veered into outright lying and then into arguing - once again - with the voices in your head. When you feel like responding to WHAT I POST let me know.

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Signym, I think you and I could come up with some theories to explain why Obama did not deport those 11 to 22 million illegal aliens that are bothering you. Maybe Obama doesn't like you. But what is the explanation for Trump not deporting them, since illegal aliens are his bête noire? One possibility: he isn't ever going to do it. It is something he says only to get Signym's vote.

Trump himself didn’t even bring up the subject of birthright citizenship. It turns out that Jonathan Swan of Axios was interviewing Trump and decided to bring up the subject out of nowhere. Why? God knows. But after Trump blathered about it for a bit without actually committing to anything, Swan asked when it would happen. “It’s in the process,” Trump said. “It’ll happen.”

Everyone on the planet knows that this is Trumpspeak for “No one is working on it and I haven’t thought about it for a long time.”

But it didn’t matter. Nor did it matter that everyone knows Trump can’t overturn birthright citizenship with an executive order anyway. Signym jumps on the idea as exactly what is needed to MAGA.

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"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

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A range of studies from political scientists, economists, and pollsters have found that it was racial resentment and cultural anxiety — not economic anxiety — on the part of white voters that got Donald Trump into the Oval Office. In his new book, “Identity Crisis: The 2016 Presidential Campaign and The Battle for the Meaning of America,” John Sides marshals extensive evidence to show that it was white identity, anti-immigrant, and anti-Muslim sentiment that best predicted support for Donald Trump, while economic anxiety played a much smaller role.

https://theintercept.com/2018/11/01/the-midterms-are-days-away-what-wi
ll-drive-trump-voters-race-or-class/

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You don't read well:

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But as it turns out, the organizations that have been aiding the caravan since it first formed in Honduras nearly three weeks ago have already accounted for this. And to help ensure that images of border patrol agents arresting families and separating small children from their parents are flashing across cable news in the days and hours before the polls open, these groups are employing a new tactic: Busing.

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Originally posted by second:Signym, what happens after the election is the test of whether or not Trump is pandering to your fears of illegal aliens in order to get your vote. If Trump does not write that executive order overturning birthright citizenship, then he is a complete pandering fraud. If he does not deport millions of illegal aliens, he is a complete fraud. If he does not shutdown the government to get funding for his Texas/Mexico Wall, he is a complete fraud. Trump has to stop talking and start doing these three things or else he was always pandering to your fears of illegal aliens.

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:

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Originally posted by second:Signym, what happens after the election is the test of whether or not Trump is pandering to your fears of illegal aliens in order to get your vote. If Trump does not write that executive order overturning birthright citizenship, then he is a complete pandering fraud. If he does not deport millions of illegal aliens, he is a complete fraud. If he does not shutdown the government to get funding for his Texas/Mexico Wall, he is a complete fraud. Trump has to stop talking and start doing these three things or else he was always pandering to your fears of illegal aliens.

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There's another option: SIGGY is a complete fraud and knows everything we know but chooses to back him all the same. The only question is: why?

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