What Is Your Favorite INSOMNIA Cure? by JEWELSTAITEFAN

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

I don't generally have a problem falling asleep, but I often wake up at stupid o'clock and have a hard time falling back to sleep.

In my experience, tho, there is usually PHYSICAL reason, so here are the major problems that I've had and how I overcome them:

Room too warm. = tuurn on celing fan or AC
Room too cold = hey, this is So Cal, but occasionaly drag out an extra light blanket for the bed
Stuffy nose and swollen tongue, allergies, persistent sinus infection = specially-formulated mupirocin/ steroid nose rinse, decongestant nose spray, anti-snoring mouth insert (you have no idea what a difference a $79 gizno makes!), scheduled for another sinus surgery
Acid reflux = zanatc and rolaids
All-over inflammation from eating too much of the food that I'm allergic to = stop beng so stupid
Ache all over, arthritis = sherry, aspirin or ibuprofen (I try not to take these too often because they really compromise my kidney function), switch over to the sofa where I can stack pillows agisnt the armrest, if it's really bad I kipe one of hubby's Lyrica
Uncomfortable mattress = still searching for that perfect mattress. They say that if you wake up and your back hurts, your mattress is either too hard/flat or sagging, but if your pressure points (shoulder/hips) hurt you don't have enough cushioning.

Being old seriously sucks. I used to be able to sleep anywhere, any time.

Other common causes of insomnia/poor sleep:

Staring into a computer, tablet, or phone screen within an hour of bedime
(the blue light tricks your body into thinking it's daytime)

Room too bright. Even light coming in under a door can bother some people, Turn off all lights, invest in "blackout" curtains of shades o a sleep mask.

Eating too much or too little before bed.

Exercising heavily before bed

Doing stimulating brain-work, or watching exciting film before bed.

Room too noisy. Not too can be done except foam earplugs.

Worry. Some people find that "journaling" ... thinking of all the things that worry you and writing them down ... before bed puts THOSE worries "to bed"

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:15 PM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Saw mention in another thread of INSOMNIA.

My favorites are:
Wine spritzer (cheap wine added to Squirt)
Wine
Mixed alcohol drinks - Kahlua & Cream, Amaretto & Orange Juice
Root Beer Float
Hot Chocolate
Hot Chocolate Bon Bon - add a shot of Amaretto, makes hot chocolate taste like chocolate covered cherries.

Geez. No wonder you aren't sleeping. Why don't you just gargle with corn syrup??

I'm willing to bet you are heading towards diabetic.

Try eating a banana or oatmeal or an english muffin or crackers and cheese or something that stabilizes blood sugar, along with a B-complex. You need to have energy for your NERVOUS SYSTEM so it can shut off... drinking booze lowers heart rate for a while, but the affect on sugar levels keeps you from hitting REM sleep so you screw up your sleep cycle MORE.

Your body also needs the signal from temperature changes that it's time to sleep. Take a hot shower or go for a walk, then lay naked with a fan on until you shiver.
Watching the fan spin is a good way to shut down your subconscious. Then again, I'm not entirely sure some of you have a conscious...

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:44 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Awww ... c'mon WISHY, not everyone is as smart as you. Have a heart.

I used to do something similar- when I woke up at stupid o'clock feeling like shit I tried to sedate myself back to sleep with food and booze. It wasn't until I retired and actually got enough time to track down the problem that I realized that the BIG problem was that my tongue was almost always swollen and that the only way to keep it from blocking my throat was a mouth insert. (I wasn't snoring, the problem wasn't my nose and I didn't have an issue inhaling, I couldn't EXhale.)

That's why I brought up all of these physical issues. Sometimes it's just one thing that's not obvious which can really REALLY interfere with a good night's sleep, but it takes persistent observation/ investigation/ experimentation ... like you did with the sulfate thing ... to get to the heart of wht's going on.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 1:09 PM

BRENDA

Reading, writing or watching a movie.

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 3:14 PM

WHOZIT

Hard work

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 3:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I don't generally have a problem falling asleep, but I often wake up at stupid o'clock and have a hard time falling back to sleep.

In my experience, tho, there is usually PHYSICAL reason, so here are the major problems that I've had and how I overcome them:

Room too warm. = tuurn on celing fan or AC
Room too cold = hey, this is So Cal, but occasionaly drag out an extra light blanket for the bed
Stuffy nose and swollen tongue, allergies, persistent sinus infection = specially-formulated mupirocin/ steroid nose rinse, decongestant nose spray, anti-snoring mouth insert (you have no idea what a difference a $79 gizno makes!), scheduled for another sinus surgery
Acid reflux = zanatc and rolaids
All-over inflammation from eating too much of the food that I'm allergic to = stop beng so stupid
Ache all over, arthritis = sherry, aspirin or ibuprofen (I try not to take these too often because they really compromise my kidney function), switch over to the sofa where I can stack pillows agisnt the armrest, if it's really bad I kipe one of hubby's Lyrica
Uncomfortable mattress = still searching for that perfect mattress. They say that if you wake up and your back hurts, your mattress is either too hard/flat or sagging, but if your pressure points (shoulder/hips) hurt you don't have enough cushioning.

Being old seriously sucks. I used to be able to sleep anywhere, any time.

Other common causes of insomnia/poor sleep:

Staring into a computer, tablet, or phone screen within an hour of bedime
(the blue light tricks your body into thinking it's daytime)

Room too bright. Even light coming in under a door can bother some people, Turn off all lights, invest in "blackout" curtains of shades o a sleep mask.

Eating too much or too little before bed.

Exercising heavily before bed

Doing stimulating brain-work, or watching exciting film before bed.

Room too noisy. Not too can be done except foam earplugs.

Worry. Some people find that "journaling" ... thinking of all the things that worry you and writing them down ... before bed puts THOSE worries "to bed"

Well, I have also helped many solve problems with restful sleep. I have worked most of my life on evenings or graveyard shifts.
Human bodies feel that cool, dry, quiet, and dark are condidions to go to sleep with. With those, the body wants to sleep.

Dark: black out the windows, light under the door, etc. a Cheap way to make a "sleep room" dark is get some discarded pool table felt - ask your local vendor of pool tables (operating them in bars) when their refelting schedule is. Wash them, useful for much more than dark curtains. No light gets through them.
Also, avoid seeing direct sunlight just before going to bed. Direct sunlight spurs the body to think it needs to wake up and stay alert for hours.

Cool: Put a fan aimed at your feet. Feet are the body's thermostat. Even with a blanket on, a fan aimed at the feet keeps things cool.
Quiet: This is a trick. Employing the concepts of Masking, utilize a White Noise or Pink Noise Generator, which can also be a fan running in the room. Or ocean waves, flowing river, rain sounds. Alternatively, putting some music on very low volume - so low you cannot hear it before you co to bed - then when you settle after about a half hour, it will be loud enough to cover up other sudden sounds. This also applies to livestock - most farmers have learned to have loud music blaring in any sleeping building, to prevent startling when humans enter or other noises occur.

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 6:55 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Cool: Put a fan aimed at your feet. Feet are the body's thermostat. Even with a blanket on, a fan aimed at the feet keeps things cool.

AHA!

I will NEVER tuck my blankets in because I need to stick my feet out. I once read a list of English words that don't exist, but should, and the one I remember to this day is "pedaeration: the process of cooling ones feet for sleep".

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 7:57 PM

I've suffered from insomnia since I was 6 years old. Pretty sure a psychologist would tell me it was abandonment issues when my old man moved out after the divorce when I was 5. It didn't matter who's house I was staying at... both of my brothers would fall asleep the second their heads hit the pillows and I would be up until 2 or 3 in the morning.

It got better once I was out on my own, but for years I think that was the beer. I wasn't a hard core drinker until my early 30's, but beer definitely did the trick.

Whozit's right though. Hard work is key. There were around 3 years I spent 30+ hours in the gym and barely drank or smoked at all and I never had problems sleeping.

I usually don't have any problems sleeping after work these days. I come home and eat about 3,000 - 4,000 calories to refuel in a 3 hour window before sleeping.

Like sigs though, I usually can't stay asleep very long. A rare 8 hour sleep between shifts is a blessing. Since I've finally learned that smoking a cigarette is the worst thing you can do if you wake up, I'm usually not up too long before I go back to sleep though.

Working nights for me is also better. I've spent half of my adult life doing it. I never have any problem waking up when the sun's already down or about to set, and I sleep a lot easier in the day than I do at night time.

Oh... and having the white noise of a fan helps too.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 9:37 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

"Or ocean waves, flowing river, rain sounds." There are two different kins of rain sound generators - those that randomly create rain-type noise, and those that loop a rain recording. The problem with the recording is that there are very distinct patterns - like a spot that goes ... driiiiiiiiiiip ... drip!drip! ... drip! ... that you'll key in on. And once you hear it, you can't unhear it. When it repeats, and repeats, and repeats, it's like nails on a chalkboard. It does the exact opposite of help you get to sleep!

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 10:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Or ocean waves, flowing river, rain sounds." There are two different kins of rain sound generators - those that randomly create rain-type noise, and those that loop a rain recording. The problem with the recording is that there are very distinct patterns - like a spot that goes ... driiiiiiiiiiip ... drip!drip! ... drip! ... that you'll key in on. And once you hear it, you can't unhear it. When it repeats, and repeats, and repeats, it's like nails on a chalkboard. It does the exact opposite of help you get to sleep!

Wow. I've never paid that much attention to it. The purpose is really to just cover up random sounds, like kids screaming, or a ball hitting the wall outside.
But then I prefer a fan.

Oh, and for guys: sex.

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 11:33 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

I have - need, actually, due to allergies - an air cleaner with - yes - a fan. Though the natural sound of rain in general it is one of my favorites sounds, and I find it relaxing.

As to sound generators, I genuinely can't remember where I was visiting where they had a 'noisemaker'. But that repetitive pattern drilled itself into my brain!

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 11:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
I have - need, actually, due to allergies - an air cleaner with - yes - a fan. Though the natural sound of rain in general it is one of my favorites sounds, and I find it relaxing.

As to sound generators, I genuinely can't remember where I was visiting where they had a 'noisemaker'. But that repetitive pattern drilled itself into my brain!

I have found that, in extreme cases, positioning an open blade fan (air fan, not inside some appliance or other equipment) in between the waking noise source and the sleepers head can chop up the sound, and diffuse it, much more effective.

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Saturday, March 2, 2019 11:49 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.

When I was a kid, and all we had for cooling was a box fan to 'breeze' on us, we used to sit on the upstream side and talk into it for each other, just so the downstream kid could hear the chopped up words.

It was a hoot!

So yes, I know what you mean about fans breaking up noise!

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 3:29 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!

hmmm... I think sex works for women too.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 7:38 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!

I wonder how much of that is your joints and how much of it is diet and possibly a light workout regimen, Sigs.

If you'd asked me 2 years ago about my body, I would have told you that I ruined it and there was no turning back.

I know I'll never be 20 again, and I know that you're older than I am, but the aches and pains are just a fraction for me what they were a few years ago and I'll be turning 40 this year. :)

My feet still bother me on occasion at work, but I've been putting in 9 hour shifts on the regular for 6 days straight on hard concrete, often times pulling pallets that weight thousands of pounds a lot more than I would be if I drove a forklift.

I'm not saying that you are, but I'm just saying that I know full well how easy it is to make all the excuses in the world for yourself. I was the king of doing that... In some ways I probably still am. If you haven't already, I think you owe it to yourself to try. You might be surprised how many miles you got left in those shoes.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 11:55 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!

I don't know your age. Have you ever tried Boost, or any of it's former names?

Quote:

hmmm... I think sex works for women too.

You mean sex puts you to sleep? During sex, or after climax? Or you mean just relaxes you?
I was under the impression that many women find sex invigorating, they like to start the day that way, it amps them up, gets them hyper.

I forgot to add massage. When I give a woman massage, I need to ask before I start what they want me to do if they fall asleep during: continue massage, stop massage and let them sleep, continue massage until finished - and what type of finish.

I now recall that hotel rooms are places for insomnia. Far too warm, cannot turn down the temp or open a window for fresh air. Far too much light coming in through flimsy curtains. Too much noise, from elevators, vending & ice machines, parties and copulations, traffic in Hall, loud TV next door, loud smokers outdoors, loud cars all night. And cigarette smoke if you can open the window.

Of course, BungBetty considers INSOMNIA an excellent reason to consume psychotropic drugs which cause homicidal ideation so you can murder your family and friends without knowing it, and wake up from your stupor in horror. Good call.

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 12:14 PM

Overeating.
I just noticed that my root beer float might be on the verge of Food Coma trick. Consuming huge portions of my spaghetti can put me into Food Coma. Or turkey dinners, possibly KFC. But Food Comas are not part of my intended diet plan, and I do not use them to induce sleep. My spaghetti is normally just a reward for me.

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 1:35 PM

THG

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Saw mention in another thread of INSOMNIA.

My favorites are:
Wine spritzer (cheap wine added to Squirt)
Wine
Mixed alcohol drinks - Kahlua & Cream, Amaretto & Orange Juice
Root Beer Float
Hot Chocolate
Hot Chocolate Bon Bon - add a shot of Amaretto, makes hot chocolate taste like chocolate covered cherries.

Some folk tell me they cannot handle dairy. Some say root beer wakes them up at night to pee. Some don't want alcohol.

So what other favorites are there?

The truth will set you free

T

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 1:51 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!

I wonder how much of that is your joints and how much of it is diet and possibly a light workout regimen, Sigs.

If you'd asked me 2 years ago about my body, I would have told you that I ruined it and there was no turning back.

I know I'll never be 20 again, and I know that you're older than I am, but the aches and pains are just a fraction for me what they were a few years ago and I'll be turning 40 this year. :)

My feet still bother me on occasion at work, but I've been putting in 9 hour shifts on the regular for 6 days straight on hard concrete, often times pulling pallets that weight thousands of pounds a lot more than I would be if I drove a forklift.

I'm not saying that you are, but I'm just saying that I know full well how easy it is to make all the excuses in the world for yourself. I was the king of doing that... In some ways I probably still am. If you haven't already, I think you owe it to yourself to try. You might be surprised how many miles you got left in those shoes.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

What do you consider a "light workout"? I take puppy-wuppy out for a walk every day, about a mile if the weather is conducive (altho lately it's been raining a lot, not that I'm complaining!). But I figure the walk is for the dog, not for me, so it means I walk fast from one interesting spot to another and then stand around for a half-minute or so while she hunts for lizards/ sniffs out all kinds of bird/dog/worm poop and/or marks her territory. (She is the marking-est dog I've ever owned) So I don't get to biuld up a rhythm. Walking used to be my favorite activity, but my knees feel so unstable I really worry about hyperextending them. Maybe that was from the Levaquin I was on a few months ago; it does weaken tendons.

I also do gardening, altho lately that's been weeding, which means bending over a lot. Does bending over and standing up count? It's kinda static ... not so much exercise, more like back strain.

Painting ... mostly standing with arms raised overhead. Cooking ... mostly standing.

*****

OK, I see a pattern here: A lot of static positions with joint strain.

What kind of workout do you recommend? Keep in mind, I have such bad arthritis
in my spine that doctor wanted to send me for surgical nerve decmpression right away, and so it wouldn't surprise me if many of my joint pains (thumbs, shoulder, hips, knees) were due to arthritis.

Also, that Levaquin ... will take another four months or so until tendons regain former strength. But I'm thinking if I can stabilize my knees and hips by strengthening the muscles that connect to them (sort of tighten everything up without rupturing anything) then that'll be all to the good.

I'm thinking maybe partial squats and wall pushups. Maybe some wall planks. What do you think? Any other suggestions???

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:01 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:

"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!- SIGNY

I don't know your age. Have you ever tried Boost, or any of it's former names?- JSF

I have such a long list of known food allergies (and probably a longer list of unknown food sensitivities) that I try to stay away from multi-ingredient synthetic foods. Even then, I can't seem to get thru a day without eating or drinking something that's on my "bad" list (usually coffee, beef, tomato, or potato. I like to joke that the typical burger ... wheat bun, tomato, lettuce, and beef ... is like the tetrafecta of foods I can't eat.

) My reaction to foods isn't just that my tongue swells up (which is a typical allergic reaction) but SOME foods make my joints hurt (which is another thing altogether). I noticed that with eggplant (same family as tomato/potato, known allergen), ripe olives, and olive oil. I think I'm like WISHY that way ... I have to bird-dog all of the foods that make me hurt.

Quote:
hmmm... I think sex works for women too.- SIGNY

You mean sex puts you to sleep? During sex, or after climax? Or you mean just relaxes you?
I was under the impression that many women find sex invigorating, they like to start the day that way, it amps them up, gets them hyper.

Maybe I'm weird. After sex, I'm relaxed.

Quote:
I forgot to add massage. When I give a woman massage, I need to ask before I start what they want me to do if they fall asleep during: continue massage, stop massage and let them sleep, continue massage until finished - and what type of finish.

Massage therapy ... that's a thought. And what a nice thought that is!!!!!

When I was in physcial therapy the therpist did one thing that made me feel instantly better: H said "your spine is really stiff" and had me lie face down and leaned pretty hard on my spine around my shoulder blades. Maybe a chiropractor would do something simiar, but I'm worried about all of the OTHER sstuff that they do. Don't need any radical pinal adjustment, just some limbering up!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
"hard work"

Great idea!

alas, my joints give out well before my muscles. At this point, hard work doesn't leave me feeling righteously tired, just terribly stiff and achy enough to wake me up!

I wonder how much of that is your joints and how much of it is diet and possibly a light workout regimen, Sigs.

If you'd asked me 2 years ago about my body, I would have told you that I ruined it and there was no turning back.

I know I'll never be 20 again, and I know that you're older than I am, but the aches and pains are just a fraction for me what they were a few years ago and I'll be turning 40 this year. :)

My feet still bother me on occasion at work, but I've been putting in 9 hour shifts on the regular for 6 days straight on hard concrete, often times pulling pallets that weight thousands of pounds a lot more than I would be if I drove a forklift.

I'm not saying that you are, but I'm just saying that I know full well how easy it is to make all the excuses in the world for yourself. I was the king of doing that... In some ways I probably still am. If you haven't already, I think you owe it to yourself to try. You might be surprised how many miles you got left in those shoes.

Do Right, Be Right. :)
What do you consider a "light workout"? I take puppy-wuppy out for a walk every day, about a mile if the weather is conducive (altho lately it's been raining a lot, not that I'm complaining!). But I figure the walk is for the dog, not for me, so it means I walk fast from one interesting spot to another and then stand around for a half-minute or so while she hunts for lizards/ sniffs out all kinds of bird/dog/worm poop and/or marks her territory. (She is the marking-est dog I've ever owned) So I don't get to biuld up a rhythm. Walking used to be my favorite activity, but my knees feel so unstable I really worry about hyperextending them. Maybe that was from the Levaquin I was on a few months ago; it does weaken tendons.

I also do gardening, altho lately that's been weeding, which means bending over a lot. Does bending over and standing up count? It's kinda static ... not so much exercise, more like back strain.

Painting ... mostly standing with arms raised overhead. Cooking ... mostly standing.

*****

OK, I see a pattern here: A lot of static positions with joint strain.

What kind of workout do you recommend?

Getting a rhythm while walking your dog.
I assume you are on a leash. Try this. Do your normal routine around the block, or half the normal circuit. When back to your house, or when backtracking the exact route from its furthest point, pull in the leash tighter so puppy knows to keep pace with you, and then speed walk or brisk walk the ground you just covered - there should be no excuse for puppy to stop, after just exploring the whole route. Puppy needs exercise too, not just jumping from one spot to the next. Puppy needs to expend more energy at a continued pace, like keeping up to your fast walking rhythm. May take a few days for puppy to learn this new process.
Sounds like you don't want to jog, even when you get puppy trained to this routine.
For puppy to burn more energy outside, you can set up an exercise area. Take 2 of those screw-in ground anchors (I've bought at Dollar Tree), connect between them the insulated or wrapped long cable, and then one end of another long cable can slide along this fixed cable. The other end of this moving cable attaches to puppy collar. Extending another cable length to moving cable increases the range. Dogs can only go one way around a tree, so this will wrap them up until they learn. Dogs can burn up some energy like this, so less destructive indoors.

For you, calisthenics or yoga might help. Do you have access to a swimming pool? I have great water workouts, and they don't require a lot of time.

Have you tried Boost?

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:34 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

This thread is turning into a "fix Signy's medical issues" ... sorry about that! But I really do appreicate the suggestions!

About Boost ... too many ingredients to wonder about. What I found is that (if I can stick to it) that not eating for 12-16 hours per day helps whatever is bothering me to "wsh out" of my system. Like I said: hard to stick to, but seems to reduce inflammaiton.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 2:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
This thread is turning into a "fix Signy's medical issues" ... sorry about that! But I really do appreicate the suggestions!

About Boost ... too many ingredients to wonder about. What I found is that (if I can stick to it) that not eating for 12-16 hours per day helps whatever is bothering me to "wsh out" of my system. Like I said: hard to stick to, but seems to reduce inflammaiton.

This thread already had numerous helpers exchanging advice on different topics, so don't feel special.
Edit: I'm sorry, that was the thread which spurred this thread. Same frame of mind, tho.

Boost is primarily 26 Vitamins and Minerals without a bunch of garbage. For instance, try finding something with 25% USRDA of those, but no more than 25% Riboflavin. It provides nutrients for rebuilding muscle, skin, tendons, joints, injuries and traumas, whatever the body needs. Lately, when I have a lot of shovelling to do, or any other exertion, I'll take one Boost to prevent or reduce soreness the following day.
Only try the version labelled "original" or such. Now that Nestle bought it, they make other versions with garbage and poison in. The one labelled "original" seems to only have Stevia Extract added since the formula from the 1970s.

I have not found it helpful for something like a cold.

I had a co-worker who swore by Ginko Baloba and Glucosamine Condroitin, for his joint soreness. But he was almost always wrong about everything, so I have not pursued those avenues myself.
My father had his hip joint replaced, or both of them, but he was always overweight. Others on that side of the family have had knees and such replaced. That is the reason I've considered joint treatments, for my future.

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 8:15 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
What do you consider a "light workout"?

Hehe... That's a loaded question.

23 year old me would consider what I do at work now a light workout.

Quote:
I take puppy-wuppy out for a walk every day, about a mile if the weather is conducive (altho lately it's been raining a lot, not that I'm complaining!). But I figure the walk is for the dog, not for me, so it means I walk fast from one interesting spot to another and then stand around for a half-minute or so while she hunts for lizards/ sniffs out all kinds of bird/dog/worm poop and/or marks her territory. (She is the marking-est dog I've ever owned) So I don't get to biuld up a rhythm. Walking used to be my favorite activity, but my knees feel so unstable I really worry about hyperextending them. Maybe that was from the Levaquin I was on a few months ago; it does weaken tendons.

I also do gardening, altho lately that's been weeding, which means bending over a lot. Does bending over and standing up count? It's kinda static ... not so much exercise, more like back strain.

Painting ... mostly standing with arms raised overhead. Cooking ... mostly standing.

Do keep in mind that I'm not a personal trainer, and kind of like doing tax returns, I know what works for me but I'm not in the know on tax stuff for other people, like the pro's and cons of married filing jointly vs. separately. :)

From personal experience, I can say that there can be positives and negatives to thinking as work you already do as a workout. I've turned my job into an amazing workout that doesn't even feel like that's really what I'm doing because I accomplish so many small goals and tasks in a night. I didn't get there overnight though, and I was much slower at the job when I started. Not only due to all of the various aches and pains we've talked about in the garden thread, but because I was so damn out of shape.

But... while I think incorporating a good workout in work you're already doing is a good idea, if it's the only workout you're getting and it's not something that really gets the blood flowing and your breath heavy, and you're not doing it in a way where you're minimizing the chances you could injure yourself, it's not really a suitable workout.

Another personal example, is doing my own work around the house when I was unemployed and I was drinking and severely out of shape. Any work requiring the use of hand tools would end up with me in agony because of the grip. I'd mow that damn huge lawn as fast as if I was still in my 20's even on a hot day and I remember one day where I almost passed out in the hot sun... or the time I almost fell down the stairs when I nearly fainted from painting during early spring with all of my windows closed because the heat was still on. (I wasn't drinking heavily back then... I was just being stupid).

You can really hurt yourself if you're not supplementing with a proper diet and regular physical activities. From what we've already talked about, I'd say that you're diet is good. :)

Quote:
OK, I see a pattern here: A lot of static positions with joint strain.

Yeah. That's what I was thinking. For the last 5 or so years of my life before working this job, that made up a majority of my "workouts" and I was in constant pain.

Quote:
What kind of workout do you recommend? Keep in mind, I have such bad arthritis
in my spine that doctor wanted to send me for surgical nerve decmpression right away, and so it wouldn't surprise me if many of my joint pains (thumbs, shoulder, hips, knees) were due to arthritis.

Also, that Levaquin ... will take another four months or so until tendons regain former strength. But I'm thinking if I can stabilize my knees and hips by strengthening the muscles that connect to them (sort of tighten everything up without rupturing anything) then that'll be all to the good.

I'm thinking maybe partial squats and wall pushups. Maybe some wall planks. What do you think? Any other suggestions???

Partial squats and wall pushups and planks are a good idea. Just make sure that you've got something to break your fall in any worst case scenario. Maybe until you've built up to trusting your body, make sure you're husband or daughter know what you're doing when you're doing it.

If you can afford it, an elliptical machine might be a good idea. I own a crappy one that I don't like, but a company named "Life Cycle" had 4 of them at my favorite gym many years ago. I heard that they cost about $2,500 new though. It simulates running, but without the hard pounding of the joints by running on the ground.

My grandma always used to do Sit and Be Fit every morning before she had the hip surgery (There's no reason she can't now, but it's a problem of motivation I've been working on and another story altogether).

https://www.sitandbefit.org/

Loads of low impact activity that you can do from a chair or in bed in the morning before you start your day. Look up "Sit and Be Fit" on youtube. I do believe they have a lot of workouts posted up there. :)

Also, I'm unaware of what Levaquin is or what it's for. I know that certain newer drugs can play hell on your body though. My brother and his fiencee came back from a friend's wedding in India with some horiffic illness and both had to take some newfangled treatment where they couldn't do nearly anything physical for about three months because a common side effect of the drug was things like snapping your Achilles tendon.

Don't mean to sound like a drug commercial, but I'd consult with your doctor before doing anything while on the effects of Levaquin. I can't imagine that sit and be fit would hurt, but better safe then sorry.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Sunday, March 3, 2019 11:01 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Why SIX, thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

Sit and be Fit ... I'll definitely look into that.

It sounds like your brother and his fiance were on Levaquin, which does specifically list ruptured Achilles tendons as a side effect. Levaquin is an antibiotic, and I was taking it because my sinuses were infected with pseudomonas and staph aureus (and aspergillus and some other fungus that I forget). The Levaquin was for the pseudomonas, which thankfully is gone.

I started feeling so horrible on it that I quit two days early, and when I told my Dr that I was hurting EVERYWHERE she said, firmly, more than once "It could have been there Levaquin". I will definitely ask Dr if sit and be Fit is ok for me.

Thanks again for such a kind and caring post

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Monday, March 4, 2019 1:15 AM

Also, a Breathing Workout. Saying breathing exercise confuses people, like meditation. Breathing Workout includes a lot of Deep breathing, and repetitive deep breathing can make you sleep.

If you want details, I can describe some of them. I've done that well enough on message boards that others gave feedback making clear that they did it all correctly, and they were amazed at the results.

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Monday, March 4, 2019 4:26 AM

SHINYGOODGUY

I always felt that a good round of SEX made me sleepy.

SGG

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Saw mention in another thread of INSOMNIA.

My favorites are:
Wine spritzer (cheap wine added to Squirt)
Wine
Mixed alcohol drinks - Kahlua & Cream, Amaretto & Orange Juice
Root Beer Float
Hot Chocolate
Hot Chocolate Bon Bon - add a shot of Amaretto, makes hot chocolate taste like chocolate covered cherries.

Some folk tell me they cannot handle dairy. Some say root beer wakes them up at night to pee. Some don't want alcohol.

So what other favorites are there?

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Monday, March 4, 2019 8:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Why SIX, thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

Sit and be Fit ... I'll definitely look into that.

It sounds like your brother and his fiance were on Levaquin, which does specifically list ruptured Achilles tendons as a side effect. Levaquin is an antibiotic, and I was taking it because my sinuses were infected with pseudomonas and staph aureus (and aspergillus and some other fungus that I forget). The Levaquin was for the pseudomonas, which thankfully is gone.

I started feeling so horrible on it that I quit two days early, and when I told my Dr that I was hurting EVERYWHERE she said, firmly, more than once "It could have been there Levaquin". I will definitely ask Dr if sit and be Fit is ok for me.

Thanks again for such a kind and caring post

No problem, Sigs.

Can't say that I've made many friends online. I've developed some good working relationships with a few people over the years, sometimes from different countries, involving some project work that I've done, but it's not like I've cracked open a beer (or these days, had a coffee) with any of them.

I'd reckon that you and Brenda come about as close to friends that I've ever made on these here internets. :)

Do take it easy until your doctor gives you the go ahead if that's the same drug my bro and his fiencee were on. They were only in their mid 20's and were warned about it.

Sit and be fit should be great for you. My grandma loved it and did it every day. Besides talking to me on the phone, you'd think that it was the highlight of her normal day to day before the hip surgery.

She's really overweight though. If you're not, that might be a good starting point for you to just start to feel better and aleviate some of those aches and pains and who knows? You might start feeling up to doing something that is a little more intense.

Like I said, I'm not a personal trainer, but I have had a lot of experience with working out in the good old days. If you have any questions, I could probably give you some advice on that, or at least point you in the right direction.

You might also look into buying a book called "Body For Life". I read it back in my early 20's and it's the only book on fitness that I feel like was worth the read. One thing that stuck with me was how he broke down different ages (like teens, 20's, 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, etc.). I really would like to read it again, but I borrowed that out to a few people years back and whoever I gave it to last never returned it. Keep hoping that I'll run into it when I take a trip to Goodwill.

The book was about fitness, for sure, but it was also about just good life decisions and little "life hacks" before the term "life hacks" was even in the collective vernacular.

Let me know how it goes. :)

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, March 5, 2019 11:21 AM

... stay crunchy...

Alex, I'll take Things Putin might say to Donald Trump for $100...

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Why thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

6Dude, you're being recruited - careful you don't step in it.

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Tuesday, March 5, 2019 12:42 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

SIX, I forgot to add that Levaquin and other fluoroquinolones have a "black box" warning about tendon rupture. This is because of collagen-related weakening, which can also cause retinal detachment and aortic anuerysm ruture. AFA that anuerysm rupture, there's a six-month window (IIRC) when to be on the lookout, after that you're OK.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Tuesday, March 5, 2019 12:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Alex, I'll take Things Putin might say to Donald Trump for $100...

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Why thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

6Dude, you're being recruited - careful you don't step in it.

I've known Sigs longer than almost anybody who still posts here.

If she's Russian, then they certainly have spent a lot of time and money making her post on a fansite of a show that nobody cares about anymore in 2019 and they should probably be doing something more productive with their money.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Tuesday, March 5, 2019 10:01 PM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

If she's Russian,

6ix, you idiot, she even admitted her family is Eastern Bloc years ago (back when you were drunk all the time). Her policies twist in step with the Russian Trolls online elsewhere, and you think because she's nice to you she couldn't POSSIBLY have an agenda, for WHATEVER STUPID ASS REASON???

Maybe this place is a case study in what types of people can be manipulated.

Found a winner.

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Tuesday, March 5, 2019 10:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

If she's Russian,

6ix, you idiot, she even admitted her family is Eastern Bloc years ago (back when you were drunk all the time). Her policies twist in step with the Russian Trolls online elsewhere, and you think because she's nice to you she couldn't POSSIBLY have an agenda, for WHATEVER STUPID ASS REASON???

Maybe this place is a case study in what types of people can be manipulated.

Found a winner.

I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?

Racist.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 12:24 AM

WISHIMAY

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?

That's because Russians all have Vodka-Induced Dementia Disorders

Never met a ONE who could think straight for five minutes. Wait, I think we found your people!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6772487/Russia-threaten-enemi
es-West-war-prevent-invading-say-Putin-chief.html

Russia thinks they have something we want. It's HILARIOUS. NOBODY wants fucking Russia. You'd have to chop it up into 6 different countries to even make it manageable, let alone the manpower necessary to keep making all those boots to apply pressure on all those subservient inebriated necks....

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 12:33 AM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

I've been trying to figure out if you're really that deluded, or if - since it's obvious you can't manage a single sentence of intelligent conversation - you're acting like a complete nut job since it's the only way you can get any attention at all.

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 1:21 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

these are WISHY's cries of desperation from the hell that is her life. Don't be mad at her, feel sorry for her.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 1:27 AM

Yes. We should all feel pity for Wishy and her inbred, pilled up family that eats a steady diet of fast food with a side of self pity and overall contempt for everybody else.

I used to feel sorry for her, and I've even tried fixing things with her in the past, but she never does anything to improve herself and is full of nothing but excuses and hate. The best that I can do is just ignore the fact that she exists at all these days.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 1:36 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Well, ok, ignoring her works too.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 6:41 AM

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?

I'm not an ultra-liberal, but I am definitely in favor of people from anywhere who don't lie like dogs.

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 6:48 AM

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Alex, I'll take Things Putin might say to Donald Trump for $100...

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Why thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

6Dude, you're being recruited - careful you don't step in it.

I've known Sigs longer than almost anybody who still posts here.

If she's Russian, then they certainly have spent a lot of time and money making her post on a fansite of a show that nobody cares about anymore in 2019 and they should probably be doing something more productive with their money.

That broken logic of SIGGY's has been debunked into the ground. You don't have to be Russian to troll like one, godd*mn. You do have to be pretty blind not to see the similarities and pattens, or just uniformed. You're just the kind of rube they'd zero in on. "Say nice things and they eat our of hand. Stupid Americans - they all want friend to listen to."
And I've probably known her even longer. I remember when she and Rue/Kiki went at it hammer and tongs with AU and other conservatives/Bush/GOP fans on this board. It was brutal and ugly and the hey day of the RWED mosh pit. But now? Meow... Now they spew the same talking points, even the same ones from Fux News. Crazy, right? The complete change is pretty astonishing. That's not like going to Burger King after having been a Micky D's fan. That's a whole new person, a complete 180 ethically. What do you suppose would explain that? Worth thinking about.

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 8:24 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?

I'm not an ultra-liberal, but I am definitely in favor of people from anywhere who don't lie like dogs.

So because Rachel Maddow doesn't like Russians, you are claiming that an entire people, and immigrants from that country (and surrounding countries) are all liars?

I dunno buddy. That' sounds extremely racist to me.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 10:05 AM

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?

I'm not an ultra-liberal, but I am definitely in favor of people from anywhere who don't lie like dogs.

So because Rachel Maddow doesn't like Russians, you are claiming that an entire people, and immigrants from that country (and surrounding countries) are all liars?

I dunno buddy. That' sounds extremely racist to me.

Do Stupid, Be Stupid. :)

Keep bringing the Stupid, Jack! It's your super power! Sorry I bothered you.

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 2:20 PM

If it's not racist for you or Wishy to claim that Sigs is a liar simply because her family came from Russia or the Eastern Bloc, what is it then?

To be honest, no, I did not know this about her. Wishy was right about that. I must have missed that in my drunken days. So what? It doesn't change my opinion about her one iota.

I'm not the conspiracy theorist here that thinks that she's been posting here the last 17 years just in an effort to corrupt the minds of the 8 to 10 people who still post here in 2019.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Wednesday, March 6, 2019 7:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?
I'm not an ultra-liberal.

Hahahaha! The ultra-liberal denies he is Ultra-liberal. So ashamed of himself.

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Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:15 AM

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
If it's not racist for you or Wishy to claim that Sigs is a liar simply because her family came from Russia or the Eastern Bloc, what is it then?

You are definitely the dumbest person ever to post on this forum. Again.

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Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:17 AM

... stay crunchy...

Quote:
Originally posted by JEWELSTAITEFAN:
Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
I thought you ultra-liberals were all in favor of immigrants.

Not if they come from Russia or the Eastern Bloc though, huh?
I'm not an ultra-liberal.
Hahahaha! The ultra-liberal denies he is Ultra-liberal. So ashamed of himself.

Now that you mention it, last Monday I had a conversation with an African American. Guess that makes me Ultra Liberal in your book... right?

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Thursday, March 7, 2019 7:50 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:
Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
If it's not racist for you or Wishy to claim that Sigs is a liar simply because her family came from Russia or the Eastern Bloc, what is it then?

You are definitely the dumbest person ever to post on this forum. Again.

You keep saying that, but you don't explain yourself.

Really good at throwing out insults. Never good at coming up with any coherent thoughts of your own though.

Still hoping for a sign of life up in that cavernous void between your ears.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:21 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:

Alex, I'll take Things Putin might say to Donald Trump for $100...

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Why thank you for such a kind and thoughtful post. I feel like I just talked with a friend.

Only you

would try to twist genuine gratitide into something nefarious. But that's YOU: constantly misrepresenting my motives and meaning, telling everyone what I "really" mean when I don't mean hat at all. (ie LYING) At this point, everyone should know that you're nothing but a weasely little liar.

Quote:
I've known Sigs longer than almost anybody who still posts here.
No, you don't. You don't know me at all because you CLEARLY portray me as some make=believe character that has no relation to reality.

Quote:
If she's Russian, then they certainly have spent a lot of time and money making her post on a fansite of a show that nobody cares about anymore in 2019 and they should probably be doing something more productive with their money.- SIX

That broken logic of SIGGY's has been debunked into the ground.- GSTRING
It has??? Not that I recall! So, be a sport, son .. why don't you repeat that "debunking" here? Or maybe ... you're just LYING, again!

Quote:
And I've probably known her even longer. I remember when she and Rue/Kiki went at it hammer and tongs with AU and other conservatives/Bush/GOP fans on this board. It was brutal and ugly and the hey day of the RWED mosh pit. But now? Meow...
Son, I learned not to be a jackass. HAVE YOU? heh heh heh

But if you go back and read my posts you'll see the same ideas: anti-corporation, anti-war, anti-deep-state. Doesn't matter if its Cheney or Obama or Clinton (either one) or Bush.

Quote:
Now they spew the same talking points, even the same ones from Fux News.
a) How would you know? You don't even listen to Fox News
b) How would I know? I don't listen either.
But it sure would be helpful if you would list the points where Fox News and I gree, just to let me know where you think I stand.

Quote:
The complete change is pretty astonishing.
It's not a "complete change". I stand by my previous opinions.

I'm an equal-opportunity criticizer, GSTRING. When Bill Clinton was doing all the pro-transnational shit that he was doing, I criticized him. That's why I never voted for him for a second term. When GWb was doing all the shit that HE was doing, I criticized him, too. And when Obama did all the shit that HE was doing, he came in for criticism too. In the past (before Obama) I gave democrats more of a chance to prove themselves. That was because the democratic party housed people like Kucinich and Kaptar and Feingold. But no more: Democratic politicians in general, and the Democratic Party in particular, have become as corrupt as the GOP.

I also stayed mum about where I disagreed with you liberaloids. When I started criticizing liberals is when MAGONSDAUGHTER and ...oh gosh, that elderly lady who went to clean up herons and egrets after the Deepwater Horizon blowout ... drifted away. And the remainder? The hard-core jackoffs like you, REAVERBOT, SECOND, KRAPO, and THUGR? Well, you've just demonstrated a real nazi-like streak in your personas. You're not liberals at all, just jack-booted SJW authoritarians. SECOND has the added flavor of being twisted by some deep seated victimization.

I think the people I was most attuned to were FREM, BYTE, JONGSSTRAW, and DREAMTROVE. They were iconoclastic, always brought new ideas to the board. Not like you; you live in a bubble of your own making.

My ETHICS have stayed the same. I'm pretty sure you just don't understand them.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

"The messy American environment, where most people don't agree, is perfect for people like me. I CAN DO AS I PLEASE." - SECOND

America is an oligarchy http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=57876 .

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Thursday, March 7, 2019 8:46 AM