Do you think Wal-Mart is evil? by chrisisall

Yes. They are evil.

I can't begin to describe why I think they're evil, but Wal mart is evil.

If Wal-Mart is like all corporations, then all corporations are evil, but I don't think thats the case.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Friday, November 11, 2005 4:47 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:

I can't begin to describe why I think they're evil, but Wal mart is evil.

You're not just saying that because the Firefly dvd's you got there had a big scratch on 'em, are ya?

Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 5:13 AM

British, over here we call Wal-Mart ASDA...

My DVD's came from the net. I try not to spend money at ASDA.

But I'd bet money that if scratching FireFly DVD's would make ASDA/Wal-Mart money, they'd do it...
And impregnate the working one's with mind warping subliminal messages too...

How's that for a conspiracy theory?

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Friday, November 11, 2005 6:09 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Just a cold reality of capitalism. Ergo, capitalism is evil.

---------------------------------
Please don't think they give a shit.

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Friday, November 11, 2005 7:05 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Just a cold reality of capitalism. Ergo, capitalism is evil.

If Wal-Mart takes a big enough slam, ya think the American people might stand up against the corporate idea of how America should be used for profit, and that the elderly and infirmed (Useless Ones) should be driven back into the Earth?

Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 7:12 AM

KAYLEE4SIMON

Either way I love that store.

Keep shiny!

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Friday, November 11, 2005 7:19 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kaylee4Simon:
Either way I love that store.

Can you not see that Wal-Mart will have a sizeable hand in making Earth-that-was? Is convience and relativly low prices worth the destruction of our society, its' families and our planet (you know, in the long run, I mean...)?

Chrisisall, guilty of purchasing the odd dvd there his self

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Friday, November 11, 2005 8:17 AM

Okay, I probably deserved this, but I'm going to fight back.

Walmart is evil.

Walmart is not freemarket capitalism,

Walmart is monopolistic capitalism.

I don't support monopolistic capitalism. It might be evil. It's certainly not good. It's pretty close to totalitariam socialism, it lacks the potential check that democratic socialism might have, provided that it didn't cause a break down in the democracy, which it tends to.

Monopoly has infected our capitalist system and threatens to bring it to a neo-socialist society, where every service is totally controlled by one corporation, all of which with govt. ties. Walmart to the best of my knowledge doesn't yet work for govt. but it will, and govt. already works for it.

No, Walmart kills competition. This makes it the equivalent, back to our "capitalism is evolution" thread, walmart is the equivalent of a pandemic viral plague. Its RTL is forfeit :)

Kill it. Kill it soon and fast. Maybe torture it, send it to abu Ghraib.

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Friday, November 11, 2005 8:21 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Its RTL is forfeit :)

Kill it. Kill it soon and fast. Maybe torture it, send it to abu Ghraib.

Dreamtrove, thanks for the biggest LOL session I've had in a while...*wiping tears from his eyes*

Oh my...

Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 10:06 AM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

So. Did anyone actually read the memo, or is this just the normal (for around here)Pavlovian response to capitalism?

I notice no one is mentioning the recommendation for health education, to let their employees (many of whom have never had health insurance before)know there are better and cheaper options for health problems than the emergency room. Or the in-store clinics.

The "hire healthy employees" riff is actually part of overall suggestions for improving the health of employees, such as letting all employees do some physical work, providing store discounts for healthy foods, etc.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Friday, November 11, 2005 10:19 AM

Of course there were some constructive suggestions in it, but the underlying tone was similar to a memo about a machine in a factory that has useless or rusting parts, and how they should be oiled or replaced.
Like Signy would say, "Please don't think they give a shit."
Which, by the way, that memo clearly indicates IMO.

Just a monkey in the wrench Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 10:33 AM

EMBERS

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by Kaylee4Simon:
Either way I love that store.
Can you not see that Wal-Mart will have a sizeable hand in making Earth-that-was? Is convience and relativly low prices worth the destruction of our society, its' families and our planet (you know, in the long run, I mean...)?

Chrisisall, guilty of purchasing the odd dvd there his self

Walmart is exactly the same as Target, K-Mart, Costco, Sam's Club, and all the other big cut rate low prices mega marts ...
the only reason people are pointing the finger at Walmart is because they are ubiquitous...in the USA they are in every one horse town.

But in fact they are not shutting down competition...
used to be in those small towns you got over-priced goods from some little store that had no competition...those stores couldn't survive having a WalMart open, but they didn't deserve to.

Maybe that is harsh about a lot of places, but I saw the over-priced crapply shoes at the only shoe store in town (which closed after WalMart opened)
and the dreadful little dress shop with no selection (just out of date styles)
and the electronics stores that made you pay through the nose if you didn't want to have to drive over 100 miles to a bigger city.

it is too bad, but WalMart became big and successful because it was needed.

And their low wages? Well I'm not sure what jobs you thought were available in these small towns before, but that shoe store, dress shop, and electronics store were all paying minimum wage with no health insurance at all.

**********************************************
watch the R. Tam Session vids: http://www.hittarivertam.nu/
and buy the 'Serenity' comics published by Dark Horse,
and have you joined the Browncoats yet?
http://browncoats.serenitymovie.com/serenity/?fuseaction=tools.invlink
&u=embers&linkID=36

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Friday, November 11, 2005 10:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by embers:
And their low wages? Well I'm not sure what jobs you thought were available in these small towns before, but that shoe store, dress shop, and electronics store were all paying minimum wage with no health insurance at all.

Valid points, thanks for another view, one I'd not thought of.
I just feel that bigger means worse. Bigger government, bigger corperations, not too good for the average consumer. Short-term price savings can lead to long-term depression and unemployment worldwide. It's like global warming though, won't happen overnight, but giants need to be watched in case they grow too hungry.

Anyway, that's why I asked IF Wal-Mart is evil, I'm still formulating my opinion, with the help of y'all kind folk.

But if you read that memo, you'll be hard pressed to find any positive comments about workers, other than healthy=productive, I just don't feel the love....

Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 10:57 AM

Chris,

:)

Embers,

Walmart is decidedly different from other stores:

1. THey actively break laws to force competitors out of business, even if they must do so at a loss.

2. THey violate labor laws across the board and run by proxy slave labor camps in third world countries which are surrounded by cyclone fence and barbed wire, and men with machine guns.

3. They have exerted express power to alter content of the merchandise they sell, even when doing so is a violation of free speech.

They are categorically evil and unamerican.

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Friday, November 11, 2005 11:17 AM

Huh. I find myself leanin' toward the 'Evil' determination....

Chrisisall

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Friday, November 11, 2005 12:31 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Maybe that is harsh about a lot of places, but I saw the over-priced crapply shoes at the only shoe store in town (which closed after WalMart opened) and the dreadful little dress shop with no selection (just out of date styles)
and the electronics stores that made you pay through the nose if you didn't want to have to drive over 100 miles to a bigger city.

That's kind of assuming we only interact with Walmart as consumers. But Walmart has an impact on us as workers (and not just retail shop clerks), citizens, investors and even as animals. (yes, we are animals, and anything that affects the environment affects us.)

---------------------------------
Please don't think they give a shit.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:54 AM

FLETCH2

Wow!

The memo itself is extremely well thought through. They are trying to maximise their health care package to get most bang for buck. They seem to have got the message that prevention is better than a cure, I especially like the healthy eating option.

Your government doesn't provide universal healthcare leaving it to companies to do. Providing healthcare at all is not their core business and is a drain on their resources. I find nothing wrong in the idea that they should try and control this cost rather than just cutting the program once the going gets tough.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:15 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by embers:
But in fact they are not shutting down competition...
used to be in those small towns you got over-priced goods from some little store that had no competition...those stores couldn't survive having a WalMart open, but they didn't deserve to.

If a large monopoly moves into an area they can drop prices in the new store, in fact make a loss, in order to price out competition, since as a whole the company is still making a profit. A small independent store can't do that, can't afford to make a loss, so of course they close down.
Then up goes the prices when the competition has been stifled.

Dreamtrove:
One little thing, a corporation taking control of the government isn't socialism, in any way shape or form, if anything it's the exact opposite. I'm not a socialist (i.e. I don't want a pure socialist society) but socialism isn't after corporate control of government.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:48 AM

FLETCH2

Not AGAIN!

If you get him started we'll get his same dumb ass reasoning as in the last 300,000 threads. Any system he doesn't like is a "socialist" system. Since none of us will ever live to see one I'm not willing to argue with him about it AGAIN.

Though I can't resist suggesting the word "oligarchy" could describe the kind of government you would get under megacorp control.....

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 3:56 AM

OPTIMUS1998

EVIL, EVIL, EVIL!!!!!!!!

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Can you not see that Wal-Mart will have a sizeable hand in making Earth-that-was? Is convience and relativly low prices worth the destruction of our society, its' families and our planet (you know, in the long run, I mean...)?

Chrisisall, guilty of purchasing the odd dvd there his self

what two Countires "spawned" the Alliance?
The US, & China.
and right now we(America) have a trade Deficit of $18.5 Billion with China ALONE (this is a full third of our entire trade deficit) . meaning, we are importing 18.5 Billion dollars more merchandise from china than we are selling to them. meanwhile we are running up record budget deficits, and borrowing the money from Whom??
CHINA in large part.
nearly EVERYTHING at walmart( save groceries) is made in china ( granted anymore this is not exclusive to them, more by now the industry standard)
so you see, the path we are on now, the birth of the alliance isn't because the 2 major world powers joined up for the hell of it, or following a war, but cuz they ended up owning our country. they simply did a "Hostile takeover" in corporate terms.
privately i've always thought that a company couldn;t get as large as wal-mart, as fast as they have, whithout some "Assistance"

and by assistance, i mean some one sold their soul.
there by making the company EVIL!!!!!

that and i think their security archways are rigged to steal a little of your soul each time you walk through.... ( ok, maybe that last part is a little fanciful and extreme, But Prove me Wrong!)

Wal-Mart: a Subdivision of Wolfram and Hart

-------------------------------------------------
Nothing like filming a major motion picture to make you feel better about your show being cancelled.
- Nathan Fillion
REDEMPTION!
- Adam Baldwin
Well played Clerks...
- Leonardo Leonardo(Clerks Cartoon)

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 5:26 AM

AJAXMINOAN

Since you guys opened the subject, I'll show you the Web art I created about this. I personally don't shop there because they choose to buy almost all their manufactured products from China. I'm not one of those people who think it's got to be American made; just not made in China.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 5:59 AM

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Chrisisall, guilty of purchasing the odd dvd there his self

You don't by chance reply to spam too do you?

As far as the memo goes my take was along the lines of FLETCH2’s - a well thought out, detailed assessment by a loyal group of employees looking to understand and address the company’s recent economic trends. In other words - these kinds of memos are not the place to look for corporate “love.” They are about the cold mechanics of keeping a business alive and profitable (certainly good for employees). “Reducing” employees to number groups and group trends are the only way for corporations their size to get a grip on how they are doing and how they might do in the future - it’s just not going to very warm and fuzzy. I guess I’m not sure what is expected or what was so vile - how would a corporate memo look that addressed these issues that also expressed employee love?

What stood out to me more was their concern over just how to deal with health care costs and coverage, both for themselves and for their employees. I see people outraged over gasoline prices but I hear almost nothing (ok, a small whimper) when it comes to the amazing rise of health care over the last 3 years. The memo seems pretty frank about their current position and even addresses critics’ statements, “...in other words, our critics are correct in some of their observations. Specifically, our coverage is expensive for low-income families, and Wal-Mart has a significant percentage of Associates and their children on public assistance.”
They go on to list 9 steps to address those problems, most of which address both reducing costs and helping increase employee health (God forbid the day should come when a sick employee helps the bottom line..).

Hmmm.. AJAXMINOAN: How about Mao-Mart, or Great Wall Mart ?

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.net

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 6:01 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AjaxMinoan:
I'm not one of those people who think it's got to be American made; just not made in China.

Or at least not made by slaves....

I feel like Ash in Evil Dead II;
"How do ya STOP IT??!!"

I can say 'boycott' Chrisisall

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 6:16 AM

I’m not a big fan of the Wal-Mart. I live on a cliff that over looks a valley that used to be pristine, until they constructed the Wal-Mart. Generally Wal-Mart is over crowded and getting in and out is a huge hassle. There’s only one Wal-Mart among the seemingly thousands that exist within a few miles of my house that I actually like.

As far as the anti-capitalist bent, Wal-Mart is what it is because the costumer base has willingly and happily made it that way. And while I’m not a fan of it, I can see why many people would be, since it provides very reasonably priced goods for people who might not be able to afford to purchase those goods otherwise. Furthermore, Wal-Mart is one of the largest employers of people in the US, and most of Wal-Mart employees are relatively uneducated and unskilled and are offered a much better job opportunity then would otherwise likely be readily available.

So I understand why I don’t like Wal-Mart. I’ve got a high-paying job and the money to shop elsewhere. I don’t understand why the anti-capitalists types don’t like it, unless their “working-class” rhetoric is bullshit, which I imagine it probably is.

-------------
Qui desiderat pacem praeparet bellum.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 6:29 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:

I don’t understand why the anti-capitalists types don’t like it, unless their “working-class” rhetoric is bullshit, which I imagine it probably is.

I guess I just feel wrong about shopping at a company that perpetuates the use of slave labour overseas. That would be my main beef with them.

Chrisisall, ex slave owner his self

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 6:30 AM

AJAXMINOAN

Quote:
Hmmm.. AJAXMINOAN: How about Mao-Mart, or Great Wall Mart ?

He he. I can't believe there was a time when I didn't want to buy Japanese stuff. Now I think they are some of the best trading partners you can have. I worked at a Toyota imports lot, and so much of the car's parts were made in America, or they were assembled here. You learn this from the import stickers on the doors. They make things of good quiality that last, resulting in less garbage. They also brought hybrid cars to the market, and they respect nature.
When you buy something made in China, you may as well throw it right into the garbage.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:09 AM

I believe the most reliable cars are in fact Japanese, and a Korean (I think) is way up there too.

Also those 'incredibly reliable' German cars, Audio and BMW, are mid to bottom on the reliability stakes... you just pay more for your (un)reliability...

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:40 AM

HAKEN

Likes to mess with stuffs.

There's a movie by Robert Greenwald titled "Wal-Mart: The High Cost of Low Price" that documents the effect that Wal-Mart has on the community. For more info, look here:

http://www.walmartmovie.com

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:52 AM

Fletch,

True. But it is open season on Walmart. :)

Citizen, yes it is. I think I explained how. It becomes connecting to govt. and an agent of top down control. The end result is the same: Order

A free market is chaos, with maybe a few artificial constraints to prevent chaos from reverting to order.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:03 AM

I agree.

Walmart is not only PNAC global

1. Walmart is socialist I'm sorry some people are too dumb to recognize the identical idea (socialism) in corporation form. I won't argue it either, it's too obvious, and I'm not defending my position re: socialism is evil. It kills. End of story.

2. Walmart is China. I will buy from China, I have no problem with it, if and only if the companies in question are abiding by fair free market and labor practices. If you by slave labor goods you support slavery.

3. I liked the Chairman Mart poster.

4. I'm a troll. I'm just bashing Walmart. I don't really care what throwback culture is doing to keep its workers alive long enough for maximum profit.

5. Walmart is very anti-capitalist. It got where it is by repeatedly breaking laws and being allowed to do so, probably by bribing politicians, but that's pure speculaiton.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Haken:
There's a movie by Robert Greenwald titled "Wal-Mart: The High Cost of Low Price" that documents the effect that Wal-Mart has on the community. For more info, look here:

http://www.walmartmovie.com

Thanks Haken, there's a lot of stats and info at that site besides info on the documentary.

Hey, how come I don't have a rapid response team with a jet?

Chrisisall, checking Wal-Mart online for reasonably priced jets

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:21 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
4. I'm a troll. I'm just bashing Walmart.

I knew it.
You're being paid the big bucks by all those little Mom-and-Pop stores to incite unrest concerning our friends running Wal-mart!!!

Chrisisall

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
I guess I just feel wrong about shopping at a company that perpetuates the use of slave labour overseas. That would be my main beef with them.

And that’s the beauty of a free market. Although I don’t think your claim is very fair and a little bit sophomoric, I’ll defend your right not to shop where you wish.

I, like most liberal capitalists, don’t care much for the socialists and quasi-feudal economic systems of some countries, but I also know that blaming it all on Wal-Mart is about as smart as blaming the fishmarket because the oceans are being over-fished. Although, I’m sure that there are probably people in the Wal-Mart’s upper crust that couldn’t care less about the stifling of civil liberties in the countries where their suppliers receive their goods, it doesn’t make them responsible for slavery. I think it is just more complicated.

On a less “social activist” note, when I was growing up Wal-Mart was a cultural Mecca to me. We would often go to Wal-Mart and just look around at all the fishing tackle, sports equipment, or whatever I happen to be involved with at the time. One of my fondest memories is of my grandfather taking me to the Wal-Mart ‘eatery’ to eat fries and drink Coke. It was a place to go where you could meet friends, like the soda shops of the 50’s or the city square even years earlier. And I read somewhere where more then half the couples in the town I lived in met at Wal-Mart.

-------------
Qui desiderat pacem praeparet bellum.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:32 AM

Actually Chris, it's a grudge. I was nearly murdered in back of Walmart at the employees. So it's vengeance, plain and simple.

Actually that's a true story. It's funny in the right lot. I was with a couple of friends and we went ot visit a friend of one of my friends who had just moved in. The local Walmart employees decided we were coniving to steal their wimin, and so decided the proper solution was to kill us with hunting knives a la "Deliverance."

For reference, here's a picture of one of the 'wimin' in kweschun:

Employee

And no, it's not the basis of my walmart opinion, but it sure didn't help their case any. :)

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:34 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
when I was growing up Wal-Mart was a cultural Mecca to me. We would often go to Wal-Mart and just look around at all the fishing tackle, sports equipment, or whatever I happen to be involved with at the time. One of my fondest memories is of my grandfather taking me to the Wal-Mart ‘eatery’ to eat fries and drink Coke. It was a place to go where you could meet friends, like the soda shops of the 50’s or the city square even years earlier. And I read somewhere where more then half the couples in the town I lived in met at Wal-Mart.

Ah, the time when the original owners were running the show. Before it turned to the Dark side.

Chrisisall, a small town boy his self

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:37 AM

Okay, trying again:

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:43 AM

Ack.

My apologies.

I didn't think it would litterally inline post the pic like that, I thought it would keep the litteral URL so those that dared would have to copy and paste.

Now I must do penance

This is what none of them looked like:

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 9:49 AM

Uh...
I don't know what to say....
Both pictures floored me- for widely different reasons.

Chrisisall*cartoon sparks whirring around head*

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 10:09 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by pizmobeach:
“Reducing” employees to number groups and group trends are the only way for corporations their size to get a grip on how they are doing and how they might do in the future - it’s just not going to very warm and fuzzy.

And God forbid the people running the company get up off their warm leather chairs long enough to actually SEE their stores and how they run and meet the people who work good portions of their lives for them. Warm and fuzzy isn't part of the oversized corporate/computerized culture, where hands-on is only at its' lowest level.
Maybe the size of the corp is it's problem.

Like Steven Segal said in On Deadly Ground (I know, but he said it so well in that movie), "How much is enough?"

Chrisisall sans ponytail

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 11:09 AM

Size does matter.

Naturally in competition, monopolies are bad. But in general, capitalist enterprises which are specialized always tend to fair better in the truly long term, which I guess lends hope.

Basically, what I see when I see Walmart is the old Soviet GUM store. I would concede that in some ways it's worse than its socialist equivalent because of the labor law abuses, but overall it's at least just as bad as the GUM for the same reasons. In a way, it IS the GUM, just the Chinese GUM for America. And Europe. I'm going to stick with my initial kill it quick plan.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 11:12 AM

I agree with chris that Wal-Mart has lost its personal appeal, which I think was pivotal in giving it the edge over major competitors like K-Mart. Wal-Mart had somewhat of a wholesome down-home American-made appeal to it. To a large extent that appearance is being peeled away for a lot of reasons. Part of it is just the bureaucracy of large corporations which tend to be very impersonal and part of it is a politically correct response to attacks, which almost seem political in nature. I think some of it comes from anti-Americanism or resentment of American Capitalism, which often takes the shape of questionable accusations of some kind of American imperialism endemic in American cultural aspects like fast food and super department stores. Wal-Mart seems to be trying to please everyone and that degree acquiescence might be the nail in its coffin. A recent bit of bad publicity traveling around here has a lot of people not very happy with Wal-Mart. Whatever the root causes, Wal-Mart has definitely lost its small-town appeal from my vantage.

-------------
Qui desiderat pacem praeparet bellum.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 12:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dreamtrove:
1. Walmart is socialist I'm sorry some people are too dumb to recognize the identical idea (socialism) in corporation form. I won't argue it either, it's too obvious, and I'm not defending my position re: socialism is evil. It kills. End of story.

Whatever, thanks for the insult, I underlined it so you couldn't tell me you weren't going for the insult.
As for Wal-Mart being Socialist, it's obvious alright:
You don't like Wal-Mart, you don't like Socialism, ergo Wal-Mart is socialist.
Capitalism is evil for the exact same criteria you give for socialism being evil.
I don't think either are evil per-se, and I know Wal-Mart isn't socialist, not unless you redefine socialism to "anything evil".

But whatever, I haven't the energy to get into another flame war with you.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:45 PM

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
I agree with chris that Wal-Mart has lost its personal appeal, which I think was pivotal in giving it the edge over major competitors like K-Mart.

I doubt that the people who benefit most from Wal-Mart's end focus - lower prices for everyday doodads - see it the same way or even have a clue about their "practices" overseas. They just want one place with a lot of cheap stuff and damn the torpedoes.

Speaking of walking a mile in someone else's shoes, how about figuring out how to get clothes and basic living goods for your 3 kids on $1500 a month, combined take home. Hello Wal-Mart. Isn't there something just a little admirable in their business plan of trying to meet the needs of the lower income?

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.net

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 1:55 PM

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
And God forbid the people running the company get up off their warm leather chairs long enough to actually SEE their stores and how they run and meet the people who work good portions of their lives for them. Warm and fuzzy isn't part of the oversized corporate/computerized culture, where hands-on is only at its' lowest level.

I read where Ken Lay was actually pretty good at walking amongst Enron's employees and chatting and pressing the flesh and being the nice guy, well liked even. *Insert recent history here*
Also, I seriously doubt you really believe that all exec types do is warm their leather chairs. If so, please re-read ALL of the memo again - there'a lot of time and hard work in there.
"Hello Real World - Goodbye Expectations!" Euripides, from "The Daily Theogonist."

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by pizmobeach:
I doubt that the people who benefit most from Wal-Mart's end focus - lower prices for everyday doodads - see it the same way or even have a clue about their "practices" overseas. They just want one place with a lot of cheap stuff and damn the torpedoes.

Speaking of walking a mile in someone else's shoes, how about figuring out how to get clothes and basic living goods for your 3 kids on $1500 a month, combined take home. Hello Wal-Mart. Isn't there something just a little admirable in their business plan of trying to meet the needs of the lower income?

I’m not disagreeing with you. I certainly see the value in it. In fact, I see Wal-Mart as an example of how capitalism provides opportunity for the lower income as well as the higher income. It is an example of functional capitalism. The kind of thing the Marx claimed could never exist. And I think you’re right, that those who do shop there, particularly those with low incomes, probably don’t pay as much attention to the politics as those who don’t shop there. Nonetheless, if the image of Wal-Mart becomes too impersonal or they get an image of being “anti-Christmas,” people will begin to stop shopping there. Having cheap goods will only keep your store in business until your competitors lowers their prices, then you need something else. A good example is K-mart, which has been put out of business all the over the country by Wal-Mart, yet you can generally get merchandize cheaper at K-Mart. When one buys cheap merchandize, one wishes to feel that the seller has their best interests at heart, because otherwise the “you get what you pay for” axiom comes into play. It was service and friendliness that gave Wal-Mart the advantage over K-Mar, not prices. It’s not all just about money; there is some psychology to it. People may not necessarily care about the politics, but if Wal-Mart, through some politically correct policy, begins to distance itself from the culture of the people it is serving, those people may began to view Wal-Mart as impersonal or foreign. And this something Wal-Mart would do well to avoid.

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Qui desiderat pacem praeparet bellum.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:21 PM

Oh, Citizen, don't be an ass. I told you why walmart is socialist.

It is majorly f^&king offensively insulting that you say " oh DT hates socialism and Walmart and that's why he lies"

Well, I said exactly why I hate walmart because it has all these features of the other thing I hate, socialism, like being part of a big commie plot.

The insult was meant for fletch, not you.

Nothing personal fletch, just the same I just said here. Walmart:socialism parallel is totally valid, via four things 1) the top down angle 2) the no competitition angle,. 3) the Soviet GUM store angle and 4) the communist china angle.

You people already know someone else posted 'bin laden is a socialist' and I shot it down. I'll shoot down any generic 'evil' is a socialist. The label only belongs on socialist evils.

I still don't get why people stick to an ideology that seems clearly responsible for most of the world's genocide. Even today.

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 3:06 PM

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
A good example is K-mart, which has been put out of business all the over the country by Wal-Mart, yet you can generally get merchandize cheaper at K-Mart.

I would peg K-Mart's failure with their confusing marketing strategy. Instead of going "rock bottom" like Wal-Mart, they went middling faux upscale with Martha Stewart Linens. That moved them away from low income families to the realm that Target owns (Target has Robert Graves' designed toasters for God sakes! How'd they pull that off?!). K-Mart may be cheaper, but that's not the public's perception by their own doing.

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
When one buys cheap merchandize, one wishes to feel that the seller has their best interests at heart, because otherwise the “you get what you pay for” axiom comes into play.

I politely beg to differ. When one buys cheap merchandise one wants the cheapest friggin' price - period. They'll sort out "quality" once they get it home. If there was "do the right thing" surcharge at the cash register of 10% ("S'cuze me ma'am, this coffee maker was made by Chinese prisoners, would you like to donate an extra $2 dollars to help prevent the US from importing cheap goods made by unfree citizens of foreign countries?") how many would pay it?
"Naw, pass for now, just give me the toaster."
"Sorry, management makes me ask."

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 3:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dreamtrove:
I told you why walmart is socialist.

I'm not really sure you have, I haven't seen a clear reasoning of Socialism wants this, and so does Wal-Mart.
All corporations want a monopoly, it's good for business. Microsoft, the one or two car companies left in the world (you can literally count them on your fingers) are symptoms of this.
What company wouldn't want to charge what it likes safe in the knowledge that the customers won't go anywhere else, because they can't.
This is where capitalism leads, it's not a part of some Socialist Commie pinko plot, It's where capitalism takes us, and I can give you reason after reason why this is so.
Say Socialism is an unworkable system, by all means, it's true. But to say it's evil, and too start apportioning blame to Socialism for things that have nothing to do with it?
Capitalism is also unworkable as a system. Neither Socialism or Capitalism has ever been implemented, you will not find a state that is or was pure Socialist nor pure Capitalist.

Quote:
It is majorly f^&king offensively insulting that you say " oh DT hates socialism and Walmart and that's why he lies"

I never said you lied, I'm sure you believe everything you're saying, ergo not lying. I also think your logic is flawed on this issue.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you Beeeer Milkshakes!

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Saturday, November 12, 2005 3:30 PM