REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Sigh -

POSTED BY: SEVENPERCENT
UPDATED: Monday, April 10, 2006 22:28
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Saturday, April 8, 2006 6:15 PM

SEVENPERCENT


In arguing an issue in another post, I made this statement:
Quote:

The administration thumbed its nose at the 9/11 commission's report and went on about its merry dance. Now they're gearing up for Iran.

Think about the saying "you're not paranoid if they're really out to get you." The fundie nutbags don't look nuts to the Islamic world because instead of protecting ourselves, we're threatening the Joe Muslim. I mean, seriously, some of you, think about what you are saying - we're going to attack a village to get to the rebels, or terrorists, or whatever - do you honestly think the villagers are thinking, 'sure, blow up my house by mistake, or gun down my wife, I'll get a new one'? - no, they think, maybe there's something to this America is the devil stuff.

People who aren't angry or aren't successful eventually give up and go home; if nothing else try to make a deal. People who are mad as hell and have minor successes will keep going until you have to kill them. I know which way I'd rather have the US acting. Instead, we get War Is Peace.



So, I'm stalking the net as usual when I come upon this little gem:
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/article356679.ece

I really hope this isn't true. Seriously, Bush is going to get us all killed, and I think sooner rather than later. Maybe there is some truth to the story that he's some sort of Armaggeddonist that thinks he needs to bring about the end of the world. I mean, is he trying to push the world into a nuclear war?

From the article (and backing up my previous statements in the other thread):
Quote:

"there is a growing conviction among members of the United States military, and in the international community, that President Bush's ultimate goal in the nuclear confrontation with Iran is regime change".

One former senior intelligence official is quoted as saying that Mr Bush and others in the White House have come to view Iran's president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, as a potential "Adolf Hitler". According to a senior Pentagon adviser on the "war on terror", "this White House believes that the only way to solve the problem is to change the power structure in Iran, and that means war". The danger, he adds, is that "it also reinforces the belief inside Iran that the only way to defend the country is to have a nuclear capability".





------------------------------------------
He looked bigger when I couldn't see him.

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Saturday, April 8, 2006 7:45 PM

GINOBIFFARONI


A similar report was posted on Aljazerra

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/88EA1C9A-8C9F-4A99-BA87-57A97A2
2DE7F.htm


With the addition:

" The report also says the US military is considering the use of a nuclear weapon to destroy Iran's main centrifuge plant at Natanz "

and the observation

"Regardless of how bad Bush's poll numbers are, Americans love a display of firepower"

John Pike,
globalsecurity.org

Now, if any country was able to justify the pre-emptive first strike doctrine Bush has forwarded.....

Well, if I was Iran, I'd build as many nukes as I could and plan to use them.



" Over and in, last call for sin
While everyone's lost, the battle is won
With all these things that I've done "

The Killers

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/killers/allthesethingsthativedone.html


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Sunday, April 9, 2006 3:57 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


I find it interesting that some folks look past the initial threat, and then worry over any such reprisals in the event we DO something about the threat of Iran.

Here's my 2 cents. The war in Iraq hasn't been the PR boon that the Bush folks thought they'd have. Granted, they said all the right things, that this wouldn't be easy, and that it would take years to achieve, but I doubt very many Americans really heard/ believed any of that stuff. We expected a short war / victory over Saddam's forces, with a relatively easy post war stint. The first part , we got. The second part, .... no pick-nic, to be sure.

But Iran is a horse of a different color. While the Ayatollas froth at the mouth and send $$ to Hamas,Iran's not really done the sort of stuff which Iraq had done. ( Remember, Iraq had attacked 4 of its neighbors - Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and lobbed Scuds @ Israel ) In short, we see Iran as being a problem, and the nuclear 'power' issue isn't looking good, but as for large scale military action?? I just don't see it. There's no real selling point here for the American public to rally around. Our troops being in Iraq isn't sitting too well w/ a large segment of our public as it is. There simply isn't the will which would allow for another war in Iran. Not by a mile.

That the military might have drawn up plans to attack a potential threat shouldn't be seen as alarming. It IS what they do for a living. And , should there be a need for such an event, it's best for their folks to have done their homework before hand, instead of going into a situation totally blind ( like happened when Pres Carter did when he sent in that ill - fated rescue team to save the hostages )

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Sunday, April 9, 2006 10:40 AM

OLDENGLANDDRY


The U.S. military is already too overstretched in Afghanistan and Iraq to fight another ground war in Iran too. The only options to facilitate "Regime change" are negotiation, coup, airstrike or Nukes.

Lets hope the Airstrikes work because the first two will have been already ruled out.

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Sunday, April 9, 2006 1:50 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!


Pretty much.

I see the question as not "if" but "when" and "how". The admin has already decided, just like they decided on Iraq.


Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.

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Monday, April 10, 2006 2:51 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

rue wrote:
Sunday, April 09, 2006 13:50
Pretty much.

I see the question as not "if" but "when" and "how". The admin has already decided, just like they decided on Iraq.


Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.



Pretty much? Pretty much what? The 2 previous post both basically said that W and the US were NOT likely to 'nuke' Iran. You're nuts if you think any decission has been made. W doesn't have the clout in or outside of the US to go after Iran. If anything is going to happen, look for either

a) Israel to carry this job out on their own ...

or more likely

b) NATO to make some sort of conserted effort, w/ the very last resort being air strikes.

The US will not take the lead on this one.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Monday, April 10, 2006 9:51 PM

CITIZEN


No, they'll tell others to do it for them.



More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No beast so fierce but knows some touch of pity. But I know none, and therefore am no beast.

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Monday, April 10, 2006 10:28 PM

FREERADICAL42


Well this is all a fine bit of cynicism.

Iran is not the country that Iraq was. The people there see themselves as being members of something close to a democracy and they really don't think they deserve all of the heat that the US gave them, especially not the "Axis of Evil" thing; they've moved on from the Cold War.

I think we should be appealing to thee educated, freethinking people to overthrow their own insane president and ayatollahs- either democratically or by the sword. If our help is needed, well, so be it, but Iran is a state for its people.

"See, morbid and creepifying, I got no problem with, long as she does it quiet-like."

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