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Originally posted by AURaptor:
And the objective would have never worked, even had they gotten the final stage.

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Originally posted by Hero:

Imagine if we could have secretly tapped their phones or tracked their bank money...we might have learned something.

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And were (sic) are all the liberals to say "Gotta hand it to Bush, he's doing a great job keeping people from blowing up parts of New York." Never mind, they're too busy imagining a way to claim this plot was phoney.

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Originally posted by Eric:
Both of those things can be done just as effectively with a warrant as without.

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Originally posted by Hero:

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Originally posted by Eric:
Both of those things can be done just as effectively with a warrant as without.

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I don't doubt it, in fact the bank tracking was with a warrant. Shame the programs arent "secret", which was the operative word in my comment. The liberals are big on making sure the enemy knows exactly what we are capable of...in the interests of protecting us from imagined infringment on our liberty they risk not so imagined loss of life.

H

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Originally posted by Hero:

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Originally posted by Eric:
Both of those things can be done just as effectively with a warrant as without.

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I don't doubt it, in fact the bank tracking was with a warrant. Shame the programs arent "secret", which was the operative word in my comment. The liberals are big on making sure the enemy knows exactly what we are capable of...in the interests of protecting us from imagined infringment on our liberty they risk not so imagined loss of life.

H

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Originally posted by Hero:
I don't doubt it, in fact the bank tracking was with a warrant. Shame the programs arent "secret", which was the operative word in my comment.

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The liberals are big on making sure the enemy knows exactly what we are capable of...in the interests of protecting us from imagined infringment on our liberty they risk not so imagined loss of life.

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Tapes Depict Proposal to Thwart Bomb Used in Trade Center Blast

By Ralph Blumenthal
THE NEW YORK TIMES
October 28, 1993 Page A1

Law-enforcement officials were told that terrorists were building a bomb that was eventually used to blow up the World Trade Center, and they planned to thwart the plotters by secretly substituting harmless powder for the explosives, an informer said after the blast.

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FBI Informant Edam Salem: "...we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the DA and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful great case!"

AUDIO DOWNLOADS:
http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3
http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

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The informer was to have helped the plotters build the bomb and supply the fake powder, but the plan was called off by an F.B.I. supervisor who had other ideas about how the informer, Emad Salem, should be used, the informer said.

The account, which is given in the transcript of hundreds of hours of tape recordings that Mr. Salem secretly made of his talks with law- enforcement agents, portrays the authorities as being in a far better position than previously known to foil the February 26th bombing of New York City's tallest towers.

The explosion left six people dead, more than a thousand people injured, and damages in excess of half-a-billion dollars. Four men are now on trial in Manhattan Federal Court (on charges of involvement) in that attack.

Mr. Salem, a 43-year-old former Egyptian Army officer, was used by the Government (of the United States) to penetrate a circle of Muslim extremists who are now charged in two bombing cases: the World Trade Center attack, and a foiled plot to destroy the United Nations, the Hudson River tunnels, and other New York City landmarks. He is the crucial witness in the
second bombing case, but his work for the Government was erratic, and for months before the World Trade Center blast, he was feuding with th F.B.I.

Supervisor `Messed It Up'

After the bombing, he resumed his undercover work. In an undated transcript of a conversation from that period, Mr. Salem recounts a talk he had had earlier with an agent about an unnamed F.B.I. supervisor who, he said, "came and messed it up." "He requested to meet me in the hotel,"
Mr. Salem says of the supervisor.

"He requested to make me to testify, and if he didn't push for that, we'll be going building the bomb with a phony powder, and grabbing the people who was involved in it. But since you, we didn't do that."

The transcript quotes Mr. Salem as saying that he wanted to complain to F.B.I. Headquarters in Washington about the Bureau's failure to stop the bombing, but was dissuaded by an agent identified as John Anticev.

Mr. Salem said Mr. Anticev had told him,

"He said, I don't think that the New York people would like the things out of the New York Office to go to Washington, D.C."

Another agent, identified as Nancy Floyd, does not dispute Mr. Salem's account, but rather, appears to agree with it, saying of the `New York people':

"Well, of course not, because they don't want to
get their butts chewed."

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FBI: But ah basically nothing has changed. I'm just telling you for my own sake that nothing, that this isn't a salary but you got paid regularly for good information. I mean the expenses were a little bit out of the ordinary and it was really questioned. Don't tell Nancy I told you this. (Nancy Floyd is another FBI agent who worked with Salem in his informant capacity. The second tape obtained by the SHADOW is of a telephone conversation between Salem and Floyd -Ed.)

SALEM: Well, I have to tell her of course.

FBI: Well then, if you have to, you have to.

SALEM: Yeah, I mean because the lady was being honest and I was being honest and everything was submitted with receipts and now it's questionable.

FBI: It's not questionable, it's like a little out of the' ordinary.

SALEM: Okay. I don't think it was. If that what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the DA and we was all informed about it and we know what the bomb start to be built. By who? By your confidential informant. What a wonderful great case! And then he put his head in the sand I said "Oh, no, no, that's not true, he is son of a bitch." (Deep breath) Okay. It's built with a different way in another place and that's it.

FBI: No, don't make any rash decisions. I'm just trying to be as honest with you as I can.

SALEM: Of course, I appreciate that.

AUDIO DOWNLOAD:
http://nwo.media.xs2.net/tape/emad%20salem.mp3
http://pdr.autono.net/WhoBombedWTC.html

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Results of the FBI's Bombing:

6 civilians killed
Over 1,000 injured
105 firefighters injured - 5 admitted to local hospitals
reinforced floors almost 30 inches think blasted away on 3 levels below grade, plus a concourse level floor, leaving a crater about 150 feet in diameter at it's largest point.
On the B1 level, the operations control center of the Port Authority Police Department (and the fire command station forthe complex) was heavily damaged and rendered out of service.
On the B2 level, various walls of elevator shafts and freshair plenums severely damaged, allowing smoke to enter and rise through the cores of both towers.
Numerous concrete walls destroyed or damaged.
200,000 cubic feet of water poured into the lowest grade from damaged refrigeration unit supplies (from the Hudson River), sewer lines, fresh domestic water lines, steam pipes, and condensate return. Water 1.5 feet deep across the B6 level.
124 parked cars destroyed, 102 damaged.
Partition walls blown out onto PATH train mezzanine.
Numerous telephone conduits collapsed from ceiling onto cars (but phone service was not cut, miraculously).
Fire alarm and public address systems out of service.
Elevators out of service.
Water cooled emergency generators shut down due to overheating when their water supply was cut. This disabled the emergency lighting.
Sprinklers & standpipes out of service.
2,500 tons of rubble removed.
Clean up effort involved 2,700 workers per day, plus a total of 160,000 gallons of cleaning fluid and 200,00 gallons of detergent.
Restoration cost: $250,000,000.

www.whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/OK/wtcbomb.html

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Originally posted by rue:
So now Bush is manipulating news releases of all the things he's 'saved' the US from. But people are mostly burned out and just ... don't ... care ...

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The Bush Gang perped the terrorist massacres on 9/11/2001, as uncontested in US District Courts, therefore they are presumed to have perped every other terrorist attack in USA.

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Originally posted by Phoenixship:
It makes me so sad to say this, but I find that I must now doubt everything my government tells me, especially where "Homeland Security" is involved.

It takes little effort to imagine this entire scenario was manufactured by President Cheney in an effort to make everyone go all supportive of the New World Order.

"SEE! SEE! We do need warrantless searches and re-education camps for liberals!?

"Why're you arguin' what's already been decided?"
Mal to Jayne, "Jaynestown"

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"Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, launched a stinging attack on President George Bush last night, denouncing him as the 'greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen'."
-Nigel Morris, The Independent UK, "Livingstone Says Bush is 'Greatest Threat to Life on Planet'," November 18, 2003

"'Al-Qaida', literally "THE DATABASE", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the (Jewish/Atheist Communist) Russians."
-Robin Cook, London Guardian, "Former Blair Minister Points Out Al-Qaeda CIA Ties," July 9, 2005

"'Al Qaeda' is NOT an organization. Al Qaeda is a way of working ... but this has the hallmark of that approach."
-Queen Tony BLiar, Fox News, "Cops: London Attacks Were Homicide Blasts," July 15, 2005

Terrorism.
The act of terrorizing, or state of being terrorized;
a mode of government by terror or intimidation.
-Webster Dictionary, 1913 (referring to the US/British Communist Revolution in Russia)

"It is necessary secretly - and urgently - to prepare the Terror. What we need is more Red terror. More and more and more. Put more force into the terror!"
—Vladimir Lenin, Jewish Bolshevik Communist dictator of Soviet Russia, letters to the Chairman of the Council of People's Commissars (Richard Grenier, The Washington Times, "Vladimir Lenin as Genghis Khan," October 8, 1996; Dr. Texe Marrs, The Power of Prophesy, "Gulag USA: Concentration Camps in America," December 2002; Dr. Texe Marrs PhD, Captain USAF Intelligence, Power of Prophesy, "Legacy of the Illuminati: Revolution of Blood," January 2001)
www.texemarrs.com

"RED TERROR"
-official newspaper of the Communist Party in Russia that genocided 60-million Russian citizens (Communism was invented in London, England, where Luciferian Masonic Jew Karl Marx wrote the Communist Manifesto for global (White European Khazarian AshkeNAZI Maranos fake) "Jewish" takeover of the world)

"Government control of Communications and Transportation."
—Communist Manifesto, 6th Plank, written by Jew Karl Marx in London, England (the table Marx wrote the Commie Manifesto is enshrined in the London Museum)

"You may say that the GOYIM will rise upon us, arms in hand, if they guess what is going on before the time comes; but in the West we have against this a maneuver of such appalling terror that the very stoutest hearts quail - the undergrounds, metropolitans, those subterranean corridors which, before the time comes, will be driven under all the capitals and from whence those capitals will be blown into the air with all their organizations and archives."
-Protocols of the Lerned Elders of Zion, 33rd Degree, Protocol 9, Paragraph 13 (published in 1905 in London and Russia and sold in Walmart, preparing for the US/British Communist Revolution that genocided 60-million Russians)
www.biblebelievers.org.au/przion1.htm

"The world is governed by very different personages from what is imagined by those who are not behind the scenes."
-British Prime Minister Benjamin Disraeli (aka Benjamin Israel), "the founder of modern Conservatism", member House of Lords and House of Commons, 1st Earl of Beaconsfield and member of the Conservative Party, who was "damped" (baptized) Jew, from his "novel", CONINGSBY

"Disraeli descended from Italian Sephardic Jews from both his maternal and paternal sides. His father was the literary critic and historian Isaac D'Israeli who, though Jewish, in 1817 had Benjamin baptised in the Church of England, following a dispute with their synagogue. The elder D'Israeli (Benjamin changed the spelling in the 1820s by dropping the foreign-looking apostrophe) himself was content to remain outside organized religion."
-Wikipedia, Benjamin Disraeli, 1st Earl of Beaconsfield
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Disraeli

"The Norman Jews were primarily moneylenders, because they could not own land nor participate in trades (except for medicine). Catholic doctrine held that moneylending for interest was a sin; therefore, Jews dominated this business. Toward the middle of the seventeenth century a considerable number of Marano merchants settled in London and formed there a secret congregation, at the head of which was Antonio Fernandez Carvajal. They conducted a large business with the Levant, East and West Indies, Canary Islands, and Brazil, and above all with the Netherlands, Spain, and Portugal. In the 1650s, Menasseh Ben Israel, a rabbi and leader of the Dutch Jewish community, approached Oliver Cromwell with the proposition that Jews should at long last be readmitted to England. The first Jewish Lord Mayor of London, Sir David Salomons, was elected in 1855. By 1882, 46,000 Jews lived in England and, by 1890, Jewish emancipation was complete in every walk of life. Since 1858, Parliament has never been without Jewish members."
-Wikipedia, History of the Jews in England (links to history of the Jewish Lords Rothschild-Bauer)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_England

Semite.
1 a : a member of any of a number of peoples of ancient southwestern Asia including the Akkadians, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and ARABS - b : a descendant of these peoples - 2 : a member of a modern people speaking a Semitic language.
—Merriam Webster Dictionary

"A 'Semite' is any person living in that area (of the Middle East), including Arabs and Christians. It's time we start talking about 'The Other AntiSemitism'. A Semite is not a Jew living in America or Europe."
—Ralph Nader (Arab-American from Lebannon), Independnet Reform Party presidential candidate in 2004, ex-Green Party presidential candidate in 2000, Arab-American Business conference, C-SPAN, 2003

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"This guy has been arrested AT LEAST THREE TIMES! How many people do you know have been arrested three times? Go ahead, do a quick count on your fingers. The answer? NONE! Yet, we are being asked on Tuesday to vote for a man who has been arrested THREE TIMES. For President of the United States! Are they kidding? The Republicans must take us all for idiots. The first arrest of George W. Bush was for theft at a hotel. The second arrest was for disorderly conduct at a football game. The third arrest, we've now learned, is for a very serious crime -- drunk driving. What's the next crime committed by George W. Bush that we will learn of? When will we learn it? Bush himself lied last night when asked about the night he spent in jail. 'I didn't spend time in jail,' he insisted. The officer told the local reporter that Bush, in fact, was handcuffed, taken to the station, and held in custody for at least an hour and a half. And don't tell us that the drunk driving and the 'drinking problem' was just a 'youthful indiscretion.' You were NOT a 'youth' when you were in your THIRTIES on the night you were arrested while careening off the road. The fact is, according to your own admission (if not in these words), you were a drunk and a bum 'til the age of 40, living off your rich daddy who spent his time bailing you out of trouble. For crying out loud -- if any Republican is reading this, I implore you: this man does not deserve to be placed in the highest and most respected office in the land! Bush voters, come to your senses! Please, save our nation this incredible, unfolding, never-ending embarrassment."
—Michael Moore, director of "Fahrenheit 9-11", MichaelMoore.com email, November 2000

"Are you, Mr. Bush, unable to read and write on an adult level? Are you an alcoholic and, if so, how will this affect your performance as Commander-in-Chief? You say that you have not committed any felonies since 1975. What felonies did you commit PRIOR to that date?"
—Michael Moore, letter to George Bush Jr., November 2000

Alex Jones: "What do we do if the military-industrial complex carries out a terror attack to blame it on [Arabs]?"
George Galloway: "Well that's another very real danger. There's no way we can legislate for that but we we must be on guard. We need a vigilant citizenry. We need a vigilant citizenry that are wise to all the tricks that these monkeys are up to."
-Infowars.com Radio, PrisonPlanet.com, "Galloway Wary Of Staged Terror Attack As Pretext For Iran Invasion," June 1, 2005 (Galloway is a member of British House of Commons, Respect Party (expelled from Labor Party for opposing Iraq War #3 that genocided 1.6-million Iraqis and genocided 60,000 US and British troops) AUDIO/VIDEO DOWNLOAD:
www.infowars.com/articles/world/galloway_wary_of_staged_terror_pretext
_iran_war.htm

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President Bush is quite simply a liar.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

I'm quite frankly tired of this 'Bush lied ' idiocy. He has done some things right, some things wrong, but has done a fairly good job over all, w/ what he's been delt.

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Originally posted by Causal:

I just don't see why we can't say, "Hooray, the FBI is doing its job!"

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Originally posted by chrisisall:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

I'm quite frankly tired of this 'Bush lied ' idiocy. He has done some things right, some things wrong, but has done a fairly good job over all, w/ what he's been delt.

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Chrisisall

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Originally posted by chrisisall:
A major attack is when peeps get hurt, or physical damage is done, so yeah, the '93 thing was major IMO.

And mythology is stuff that ain't real (like Robocop).

Silly Chrisisall

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Another U.S. official ... called the plot "largely aspirational" and described the Internet conversations as mostly extremists discussing and conceptualizing the plot. The official said no money had been transferred, nor had other similar operational steps been taken.

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Originally posted by rue:
Some really poor dudes get arrested in Florida for trying to get a Florida cop to buy them boots. And despite all the fanfare, the PATH plot was summarized like this:

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Another U.S. official ... called the plot "largely aspirational" and described the Internet conversations as mostly extremists discussing and conceptualizing the plot. The official said no money had been transferred, nor had other similar operational steps been taken.

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'Really poor dudes' can be flashed a wad of $$ and, if properly motivated, can end up doing some really bad things.

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Originally posted by rue:

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'Really poor dudes' can be flashed a wad of $$ and, if properly motivated, can end up doing some really bad things.

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So entrapment is good police work?

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Originally posted by rue:

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'Really poor dudes' can be flashed a wad of $$ and, if properly motivated, can end up doing some really bad things.

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So entrapment is good police work?

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