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Originally posted by Causal:
Maybe it's not so much a left/right bias as it is the perennial myopia of the American media. We pretty much think that if isn't happening in America--or at least to Americans--then it doesn't matter.

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Originally posted by citizen:
I do wonder what the responce would be if the headline were "15 US soldiers and Marines captured by Iran".
As for why they 'allowed' themselves to be captured, it was too dirigibles against several armoured gunboats as I hear. I've heard of the mighty American military (not to mention many others) turn and run or surrender to much more favorable odds.

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Originally posted by kaneman:
ShinyEd, you know exactly why it is being buried.

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Originally posted by citizen:

I posted this on Serenitymovie.org's RWE, another site mostly dominated by Americans, and it wasn't exactly ignored, but it was deemed undebate worthy.

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Originally posted by citizen:

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Originally posted by Causal:
Maybe it's not so much a left/right bias as it is the perennial myopia of the American media. We pretty much think that if isn't happening in America--or at least to Americans--then it doesn't matter.

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I posted this on Serenitymovie.org's RWE, another site mostly dominated by Americans, and it wasn't exactly ignored, but it was deemed undebate worthy. I didn't even bother posting it here.

I do wonder what the responce would be if the headline were "15 US soldiers and Marines captured by Iran".

As for why they 'allowed' themselves to be captured, it was too dirigibles against several armoured gunboats as I hear. I've heard of the mighty American military (not to mention many others) turn and run or surrender to much more favorable odds.

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Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Whitehall, or Parliament, or Westminster, or wherever they call an ambassador to chew him out)

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And a question for anybody actually British: supposedly these guys were off of a British warship. What was it doing while they were being captured and hauled away? Wandering around somewhere over the horizon? Checking out another ship? Why didn't it go to General Quarters and attack, to protect its own?

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Originally posted by kaneman:
"It's never that simple as "we have bigger ships, we win, Hooyah!" even if simpletons such as Kaneman think so'

Actually, it is that simple.

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Originally posted by rue:
Canker sore


Let's no compare Bush to Blair, then. That IS weak.

(Since you called me Ruse, I'll go back to calling you Canker Sore.)

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Originally posted by kaneman:
Oops, I forgot about the Vietnamese navy.

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Originally posted by SignyM:
I personally think that Blair should do what the Reagan Administration did:

Sell arms, nuclear technology, or whatever the hell else Iran wants in exchange for prisoner release while loudy proclaiming never to negotiate with terrorists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran-Contra_Affair

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Originally posted by BigDamnNobody:
But Reagan....

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Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Hey SmarmyEd..., sorry..ShinyEd....you're a real hoot!...In one post you advise not posting personal feelings to avoid being labeled a troll, and then in the following post you go on one of your mini-rants!

Here's my opinion about this Iran- British Navy thing....::::Not only should Great Britain declare war on Iran (as seizing soldiers is an act of war), they should also blockade & embargo and financially strangle Iran. They should also work with the USA to try in a US or World Court Mr. Achminassholeijhad in absentia for the 1979 Teheran kidnappings and seizure of American property..plenty of eye-witnesses still alive to testify...by the books ( or anti-Bush/Cheney methodology)...get ALL the "legal shit" outta the way before any serious retaliation, and then bring it all down like a ton...with strong and impactful acts against Iran...not a shooting war folks, just lots of well-deserved pressure. The unfortunate realities of Russia & China however, must be considered in advance as well...surely big America & wise England can find a way to make Russia & Putin change his loyalty away from Iran and to us...right??? Is it ONLY about thier f'ing oil to the Rooskies??? Dont they give half a crap if Iran starts wars using Hezbollah, seizes British seamen, funds & trains & promotes the slaughter in Iraq ( not America folks...we're the GOOD GUYS), and is finishing off their nukes....attached of course to the Clinton/Gore biggest campaign donors..the Chinese missles to attack the Middle east & Europe & Russia...Surely Putin cant be THAT much of a fucking NEADERTHAL ...not to make deals with the DEVIL>>>>He should remember, or learn first, that Stalin made deals with Hitler, and that turned into 20 million dead fucking Russians....So is it just a Russian thing that their "leaders" care absolutley not one iota for their population??? ...AND the Chinese...well SOMEBODY ought to remind those fine gents how many British & American soldiers died in WWII rescuing their defenseless country from the 12-year Japanese occupation and onslaught of mass death, mass rape, and mass starvation...Remember that Mr Han? or that doesn't matter either anymore? Now...we're all facing the Iranian fallout in the coming decade.
The WHOLE WORLD NEEDS TO UNITE AGAINST IRAN....for the sake of the whole world!

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Originally posted by kaneman:
Hello,
My name is Kaneman and I endorse this message. Shit, really fu*king endorse this message

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Originally posted by Jongsstraw:

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Originally posted by kaneman:
Hello,
My name is Kaneman and I endorse this message. Shit, really fu*king endorse this message

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Thanks a lot Kaneman! I certainly didn't intend to go off like I did, but once I got started, it just flowed out....I know you like & frequently go for the extreme, but judging by the fact that my post & your response literally stopped this thread dead in its' tracks I wonder why no other person seemingly has no reaction to the harsh truths I posted.....or maybe it's just that it was way too trollific for most....also, all my sympathies to you over your heartbreaking loss.

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Originally posted by ShinyEd:

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Originally posted by citizen:
I do wonder what the responce would be if the headline were "15 US soldiers and Marines captured by Iran".
As for why they 'allowed' themselves to be captured, it was too dirigibles against several armoured gunboats as I hear. I've heard of the mighty American military (not to mention many others) turn and run or surrender to much more favorable odds.

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Interesting!....15 Americans captured by Iranian gunboats?....I think as much as they would hate it, the media...even NBC..would HAVE to cover the story...of course they'd spin it to blame Bush somehow for it.

As I understand it, the Bristish have different engagement rules than Americans...I think (?) they can only fire if fired upon....whereas we freedom-loving Americans just shoot up anything that moves, and then issue apologies for all the innocents later.

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Originally posted by ShinyEd:
You seem to either have a soft spot for Iran, or a dark heart for America. I suggest you move to Iran and live there for a spell....I think you'd love it...
Internet ...not
Firefly....not
Women's rights....not
Democracy....not
Personal freedom....not
Then they'll kidnap your family and force you to become a suicide bomber for them in Iraq...but hey, since there's no moral, ethical, or historical equivalency issues here for you, you won't mind any of that....and don't forget to send me a postcard from Sharia Training School.

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Originally posted by Khyron:
On the streets of Tehran the political temperature also appears to be rising. Demonstrators have besieged the British embassy calling on their government to execute the "British spies".

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Originally posted by SignyM:
also, all my sympathies to you over your heartbreaking loss.

Kaneman lost something?

---------------------------------
Always look upstream.

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Originally posted by citizen:

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Originally posted by Khyron:
On the streets of Tehran the political temperature also appears to be rising. Demonstrators have besieged the British embassy calling on their government to execute the "British spies".

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If that happened there would be no choice but to declare war. It is also very clear that the Iranians were not justified in taking British personnel, and not only invaded Iraqi territory but committed an act of War on Britain at the same time. Technically they've declared war on three sovereign nations, Iraq (thereby the US and Britain as Iraq is tantamount to a protectorate whatever the current American public position) and Britain outright through the illegal seizure of military personnel.

However, Britain simply hasn't the resources to attack Iran, if they did Iran wouldn't dare be so openly belligerent, America does (just about) have the resources to propagate a conflict with Iran (though not the resources to hold the territory, the US could certainly kick over Ahmadinejad sand castles) which is, I imagine why the Iranians aren't seizing US personnel.

But the current situation aside if we really had wanted to see democracy spread in the Middle East Iran would have been the place to start, and not by blowing shit up by the way. They already have democracy, okay not the perfect representation of it but I find the protestations of Americans about rigged elections and candidates under the thumb of this or that group rather hypocritical. So Iran's candidates are selected by religious leaders? Americas are mostly in the pocket of one corporation or another or taking their cues from Christian Fanatics.

I'm not suggesting that America is a Christian version of Iran, obviously (though I rather suspect a vast swath of the Christian Fundamentalists and Evangelicals of America would rather like that) what I am saying is that the Iranian people do have some semblance of Democracy and they want more, and with gentle coaxing and diplomacy not at the edge of a ballistic missile you'd find slowly but surely Iran would have become ever more democratic.

But of course such a course would have been utterly devoid of the big bangs and pretty fireworks that keep the voting public waving flags and cheering, so is of course utterly unacceptable.

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More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Originally posted by kaneman:
I actually agree with Citz post...

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Originally posted by citizen:
I do wonder what the responce would be if the headline were "15 US soldiers and Marines captured by Iran".

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