Cheney in 94 by Righteous9

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

R9

Even though there was questionable "stuff" (the "whereas"s) in the resolution http://www.c-span.org/resources/pdf/hjres114.pdf, the resolution itself clearly indicated that war powers were to be invoked for three reasons: Iraq was a threat to the US, Iraq wasn't complying with the UN, and Iraq was complicit in 9/11. Sadly, the president misused his war powers. And the Senate Report 07/04 http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/iraq.html, which was called for after the infamous "uranium/Africa" SOTU, was delayed considerably by Bush and Senate cronies. B/c of that, it came far too late to alter the course Bush was set on. Though it documented fairly well the cherry-picking of the Bush administration, by then the US had already invaded. Also, as a side note, there was to be a separate report as to whether the Bush administration exerted undue influence on the intelligence. But Senate pepubicans put it off till 'after the election' b/c they didn't want to 'politicize' the process, and then, well, it just fell off the radar and was never done

"SEC. 3. AUTHORIZATION FOR USE OF UNITED STATES ARMED FORCES.
(a) AUTHORIZATION.—The President is authorized to use the Armed Forces of the United States as he determines to be necessary and appropriate in order to—
(1) defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and
(2) enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq.

(b) PRESIDENTIAL DETERMINATION.—In connection with the exercise of the authority granted in subsection (a) to use force the President shall, prior to such exercise or as soon thereafter
as may be feasible, but no later than 48 hours after exercising such authority, make available to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and the President pro tempore of the Senate his
determination that—
(1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic or other peaceful means alone either (A) will not adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq or (B) is not likely to lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq; and
(2) acting pursuant to this joint resolution is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorist and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed or aided the terrorist
attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 4:10 AM

BIGDAMNNOBODY

Quote:
Originally posted by Righteous9:
And I'll Second HKCavalier's entreaty for somebody to adress Cheney's comments on quagmire and american casualties.
HERO, Geezer,Finn, Bigdamnnobody Johnstraw, if you choose to add to this post at some point, please do us that favor of not selectively avoiding the question.

Perhaps Cheney's position on Iraq in '94 was swayed by the initial success of the Afghanistan campaign in '01. Is being 'drunk' on success better than being 'drunk' on power?

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 5:12 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/05/28/clinton.iraq/index.html

"The National Intelligence Estimate concluded that the United States had "compelling evidence" that Iraq was restarting its efforts to develop a nuclear bomb and had concealed stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons from U.N. inspectors after the cease-fire that ended the 1991 Persian Gulf War."

"(Biden) said Bush initially told Congress he would allow inspectors to certify whether Iraq had dismantled its weapons programs."

"A U.S.-led survey later concluded that Iraq had attempted to conceal some weapons-related research from the United Nations, but had abandoned its chemical, biological and nuclear weapons programs in the 1990s."

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 7:23 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

- "If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
--President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998

- "Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
-Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998

- "Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
-- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999

- "We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
-- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002

- "I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
-- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002

Thanks for these great reminders that the Dems are full of shit...and there are lots more quotes with video on all of them. I don't know why Repubs don't throw them up all the time in these sad sack-o-shit's faces, but at least it's nice to see here so all the 5-year olds who post here can see it for themselves....the utter hypocrisy of these self-centered Dem leaders, their outright lying and slander of our President, their calculated-by-poll flip-flopping about something so serious...they have all betrayed their country and I hope they all rot in hell.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 7:45 AM

RIGHTEOUS9

Thanks for that great reminder that Repubs are full of shit Jongstraw, and how willingly you gloss over the blaring point of this original post that clearly points out Cheney lied to us when he told us that we would be greeted in Iraq as liberators.

You going to tell me that's just shoe polish?

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:18 AM

America loves a winner!

*sigh*

Time to set the record straight, again!

Quote:
rue wrote: Bush called for an NIE. The CIA which compiled the NIE said that case for WMD was equivocal at best, and that the claim of Iraq's so called nuclear moves were untrue (and which the CIA removed from TWO previous speeches before Bush's SOTU). Bush then lied about the NIE to make a case. So yes, Bush lied. I hope that clears up your self-described confusion on this point, though there seems to be a vast amount unaddressed.

Bush didn't lie, and the CIA can't remove anything from HIS SOTU address. They can strongly suggest, but it's THE PRESIDENT's address. As for the issue of Iraq's nuclear program, The Senate Report on Pre-War Intelligence in Iraq concluded, ".... that prior to October, 2002, it was reasonable for the intelligence community to assess Iraq may have been attempting to obtain uranium from Africa. "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Senate_Report_of_Pre-war_Intelligence_on_
Iraq#Niger_and_the_Iraqi_nuclear_program

Screw you, Joe Wilson.

Iraq wasn't complying worth a damn, and everyone knows it. After 10+ yrs of NOT complying, what did it matter to Saddam if they could delay still longer? Saddam gambled that he could keep the charade going, and he lost.

How did Iraq not live up to its end of the bargin? Read the 17 Resolutions from the U.N. Read Resolution 1441.

Quote:
Congressional leaders had more than enough intel ... the lie here is that the Senate was told ONLY what the President wanted them to hear, which is complete bunk.

" Over the past fifteen years our assessments on Iraq WMD issues have been presented routinely to six different congressional committees including the two oversight committees, the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, and the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence. To the best of my knowledge, prior to this NIE, these committees never came back to us with a concern of bias or an assertion that we had gotten it wrong. " - Stuart A. Cohen. Vice Chairman - National Intelligence Council

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB80/NIC%20Speeches%20-%20Iraq
's%20WMD%20Programs.htm

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:23 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Righteous9:
Thanks for that great reminder that Repubs are full of shit Jongstraw, and how willingly you gloss over the blaring point of this original post that clearly points out Cheney lied to us when he told us that we would be greeted in Iraq as liberators.

You going to tell me that's just shoe polish?

We have been greeted as liberators, by a great many people in Iraq. Guess you don't recall seeing the throngs of people cheering as we tore down Saddam's statue in the middle of Baghdad, huh?

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:25 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by Righteous9:
You going to tell me that's just shoe polish?

No...actually, if you insist, I'd tell you that your post is a feeble attempt to avoid facing the hard reality of truth that Auraptor posted. You can't run away from the stench of the Dem. leaders own words about Iraq and Saddam, nor can you ignore the hateful, disgusting rhetoric, name-calling, and absolute hypocrisy of those ultra-smarmy opportunistic rats. Trying to compare the Cheney note, that one strategy note, to the encyclopedia brittainica of Dem two-faced bald-assed lies, false accusations, and revisionist slanderings is a bit more than shoe polish....I'd call it hiding your head in the ground like an ostrich, with your butt sticking up in the air for all to see.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:40 AM

RIGHTEOUS9

Heh..so you avoid the question.

What a pussy

as to yours, its simple. Rue has gone over it pretty well above. they didn't have the information. They were trusting the office of president to not be lying to them. He was lying to them.

In the cases predating, so they weren't happy with Saddam. It's proof they weren't ignoring him...they just weren't warmongering idiots that sought to deal with the problem by invading and putting our troops in the middle of a quagmire. Those who voted for the resoultion authorizing the president's use of our armed forces aren't above criticism either.

They made a bad decicion - but that decion was largely predicated on the Administration's false claims of smoking gun intelligence.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 9:57 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Righteous9:

as to yours, its simple. Rue has gone over it pretty well above. they didn't have the information. They were trusting the office of president to not be lying to them. He was lying to them.

Yes, they did have the information. They knew as much as anyone, voted for the war, and then tried to crawfish away from the political fallout, which they helped create in the first place, then offered up this lame ass excuse that they didn't know.

They knew. Bet your sweet ASS they knew, and they didn't need the President to 'inform' them of anything.

" Over the past fifteen years our assessments on Iraq WMD issues have been presented routinely to six different congressional committees including the two oversight committees, the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, and the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence. To the best of my knowledge, prior to this NIE, these committees never came back to us with a concern of bias or an assertion that we had gotten it wrong....

The only government in the world that claimed that Iraq was not working on, and did not have, biological and chemical weapons or prohibited missile systems was in Baghdad " - Stuart A. Cohen. Vice Chairman - National Intelligence Council

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 10:23 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"prior to this NIE, these committees never came back to us with a concern of bias or an assertion that we had gotten it wrong...."

Other quotes from the same place:

"The NIE judged with high confidence that Iraq had chemical and biological weapons as well as missiles with ranges in excess of the 150 km limit imposed by the UN Security Council, and with moderate confidence that Iraq did NOT have nuclear weapons."
Then how did it get into the SOTU, one wonders.

"I was able to swear under oath that not only had no one pressured me to take a particular view but that I had not pressured anyone else working on the Estimate to change or alter their reading of the intelligence information."
Cheney would go over and pressure low-level analysts himself, though.

"and the heads of those organizations blessed the wording and placement of their alternative views"
Not according to the Senate Report.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Up until that disastrous SOTU that generated the investigation that uncovered the issues that were documented in the Senate Report, the NIEs were non-political. Bush & Co were trading on the expectations generated by past history.

Plus remember, the UN had inspectors in Iraq when the US decided to attack.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 10:28 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Hey Rightous.. I try hard to be civilzed with idiots like you and the rest of your miserable, pathetic pals here...but what do I get for it....?? So... PUSSY....like that?....try to realize that some of those quotes were from when Clitman was Prez...and after that they got the exact same reports that Bush got. Lose with some dignity and grace.....ok punk?

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 10:30 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Hey Jong

What do you have against democracy ?

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 3:18 PM

Quote:
We have been greeted as liberators, by a great many people in Iraq. Guess you don't recall seeing the throngs of people cheering as we tore down Saddam's statue in the middle of Baghdad, huh?

No, I don't.
[IMG]

[/IMG]

Yet another bullshit faerytale from the right wing.
[IMG]

[/IMG]

Why don't you take a whiff of what yer shovelling, asshat ?

-F

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 4:27 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
and with moderate confidence that Iraq did NOT have nuclear weapons."

Never claimed they did. But it was clear from the intel available that Iraq was attempting to purchase yellowcake uranium from Africa, as the NIE concluded. That's ALL the Presidents SOTU address made mention of, and that's exactly what the report stated.

Quote:
"I was able to swear under oath that not only had no one pressured me to take a particular view but that I had not pressured anyone else working on the Estimate to change or alter their reading of the intelligence information."

Cheney would go over and pressure low-level analysts himself, though.

Got any evidence of that ? I'm doubting you do. So, it seems all you REALLY have is a quote stating the opposite of that which you wish were true, then simply dismissing the quote anyway.

There was nothing 'disasterous' about the '03 SOTU, and any such hyperbole is simply absurd.

The U.N. had inspectors, but , once again, you're trying to push the delusion that Iraq was complying fully. It wasn't, not by a long shot. Thus the war.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 4:46 PM

America loves a winner!

Frem, how soon before Saddam's statue was brought down was that photo taken? My guess is that it was a pretty long time. What you can't deny, as much as you'd like to , is that milions of Iraqis were glad to see Saddam go.

Despite the hard times, we can't deny that there's another side to this war that you don't want to see or the mainstream press doesn't want to show either.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2007 6:40 PM

Uh huh.

The same mainstream press that tried so desperately to link Al Qeada to 9-11 ?

The same mainstream press that showed us blatantly fake tapes of "Osama" with some real nice plastic surgery and grecian formula action ?
With a MEMRI translation so far off it could also in itself be called a lie ?

The same mainstream media who tried to sell us Chalabi, who lied end to end, and sold us out, and then managed to somehow miss covering that little problem ?

The same mainstream media that shovelled us bullshit about Jessica Lynch and Pat Tillman ?

The same mainstream media that's been sucking Bushs pathetic little dick for over five years now, spinning and shilling every chance they get to try and make him look less like an idiot ?

The same mainstream media that tried to bury Abu Gharib and pretend it didn't happen ?

And out of all of this, they somehow have some good news, somewhere, about this lunacy in iraq, and don't wanna show it cause of "liberal" bias ?

What the fuck are you smoking you abject moron, to believe such a thing ?

You think those poor sodders are happy that we offed Saddam, and dismantled a secular, although brutal, regime, only to replace it with a buncha militant religious fanatics who are even worse.

These are just a few bitches, (thanks eddie) of the locals who you seem to think adore us so very much.

* "I lost 10 of my family. I once lived in that house with six other relatives, now I am alone...The coalition has got what it wanted, it has liberated the country. But as far as I am concerned, my loss is too great to accept."

* "Bush is the same as Saddam."

* "Yes to freedom, yes to Islam, no to America, no to Saddam."

* "Iraqis must rule Iraq. We don't need either an American general or a UN bureaucrat in charge."

* "They say they came here to liberate us. We have paid a heavy price for the removal of Saddam Hussein, so the Americans should go now."

* "We would love to have Saddam Hussein back. He's the only one who can control these mobs. Tell that to the Americans."

* "I am very sad for my country. Very sad for Baghdad. To see the Americans inside it is very difficult for me. Because they invaded my country."

* "We will never allow them to stay."

* "What kind of humanitarianism Americans talk about, to shoot a person like that?"

* "We must be united and support each other against the Anglo-American invasion. We must try to put an end to this aggression. This is not only my opinion. This is the opinion of all the people in Mosul."

* "Leave our country, we want peace."

* "This is not the America we know, which respects international law, respects the right of people."

* "If this is freedom, I don't want it."

* "They are killing us and no one's talking about it. We want Saddam back. At least there was security."

* "Saddam was a butcher, and now this. This is a residential area. Why are the Americans blowing up weapons near us?"

* "They are lying. They're ready to shoot for any reason. They're criminals. Saddam Hussein is gone but I think he's better than the US."

* "I refuse to help the Americans. They bombed our country. Why? Why?"

* "American troops want to appoint their own administration and not listen to the opinion of the people in the street. The people they have appointed so far were in the Baath party and the previous regime. People mistrust them. They will not cooperate with anything the troops do."

* "It was disgusting. Despite that, none of our young men has pointed a weapon against America...but next time, God alone knows what popular anger could lead to?"

* "Go home, America."

* "Our arrest by the Americans was worse than the arrests that Saddam ordered against our students."

* "We can't go where we want, move freely where we want. I have been searched and questioned as if I were the foreigner here. They are not educated people, they are stupid people. They are treating us badly."

* "The Americans are occupying us now. This is a fact."

* "We suffered under Saddam, we don't want to suffer under the Americans too."

* "I thought the Americans said they wanted a democracy in Iraq. If it is a democracy, why are they allowed to make the rules?"

* "We are running out of patience with the Americans here."

* "You are the masters today, but I warn you against thinking of staying. Get out before we force you out."

* "We want all the Marines to leave this place now, and also all of the press cars, or we will destroy them."

* "They did the destroying, why can't they repair them?"

* "He is my only son. Will I ever see him again? Why did they take him away from me?"

* "No good Bush!"

* "Of course we miss Saddam Hussein now...The Americans are only here to occupy us and drive us into ruin."

* "They said they are coming here to liberate us from the regime of Saddam Hussein. But it should not be in such a way."

* "This is cruelty. The rate is not even enough to pay for the lift into work. A packet of decent cigarettes costs more than a day's pay. A packet of nappies is one month! Is this fair? Even under Saddam, it was better than this."

* "They can watch us through their binoculars when we're walking down the street. I don't like having them here."

* "Sooner or later, US killers, we'll kick you out."

* "I hate Americans. I want revenge. I will wait, I will join a group, and, one day, I will kill Americans."

* "We demand compensation from the Americans, but we also demand our town back. Even in Israel they do not shoot children in such numbers when they throw stones in a demonstration."

* "It has never been this bad before. It just seems to get worse every day. I used to have hope, but I can no longer believe we will be saved. No one cares for us. I have four people at home and my husband was killed during fighting in Basra. I have no money and I no longer know what to do. I want to survive, but it just keeps getting harder."

* "Islam, Islam, Islam, death to the Americans."

* "This area never had any looting. Everyone here knows everyone else and we live very quietly, so why are the Americans here? We don't need them."

* "To America and its allies we say: where are your honeysweet promises? Now is the time to fulfill them."

* "They are sick. They are deeply, deeply sick. Tell the Americans we don't believe in this freedom."

* "What do I think of the Americans? Look at where my foot used to be, look at my dead brother and the rest of my family, with which I do not know what to do. I had a wife and seven children who were all right, and now? That is what I think."

* "We miss having safety, security, and jobs. The Americans have made many promises, but they have broken them. We wish Saddam were still in power."

* "There's no milk, no medicine, no salaries, no safety in the streets. What kind of freedom are you talking about? Under Saddam it was better than now!"

* "The Americans and the British promised everything but brought nothing. All of us will fight them if they stay here too long. No Iraqi will accept this turning into the occupation of their country."

* "These soldiers, they are the sons of George Bush. We will fight them."

* "War sucks big time. Don't let yourself ever be talked into having one waged in the name of your freedom. Somehow when the bombs start dropping or you hear the sound of machine guns at the end of your street you don't think about your 'imminent liberation' anymore."

* "We hate Americans. We lost our living. They destroyed our life, our happiness. Saddam Hussein was an unjust man, but he never did this."

* "Nothing is better since Saddam has gone."

* "We hated Saddam but at least under Saddam you could be safe. The Americans said they were coming to liberate the Iraqi people, not for the oil. But this is not liberation."

* "I consider what was done to be a crime of war. How would President Bush feel if he had to dig his daughters from out of the rubble?"

* "We were told it was going to be paradise, and now they are killing our children. The Americans did not bother to warn us that this is a contaminated area."

Oh yeah, they sound real happy with us, don't they ?
The only locals who even tolerate us are the ones on our payroll, and the longer we stay there, the madder they'll get.

And that's not half as bad as it COULD get, our support of Isreal and it's Nazi-esque behavior has eroded our support everywhere in the middle east because were not a neutral actor, we look the other way when our so-called "ally" does stuff we'd bomb anyone else for, and while you may not look at it that way, rest assured that those on the receiving end of american munitions given to them do.

So tell me, what's gonna happen if the growing hatred of us leads to the fall of the Pakistani government, and the leaders of the coup launch a nuke at Tel Aviv, eh ?

We've been down this road, time and time again, all the bullshit and faery tales you believe in don't stop the ugly reality from intruding on the situation, and the longer it goes on with deluded maniacs like you cheering it on, the closer the brink comes.

Face the facts you dimwit, in nearly five years of me being here, I've called it spot-on the whole time, and every one of your plastic bubble world fantasies has come to naught but wishful thinking - it's time to grow up, man up, and let a little reality into your little fantasy world...

Or become increasingly irrelevant, you've already made yourself a laughingstock around here, maybe that should tell you something.

What bothers me the worst is that wackos like you, loft other wackos into public office, resulting in the nightmare our country has become - not one whit safer, and ten times less free, and for what ? faery tales and lies.

I could care less what you wanna believe, but when those beliefs and the actions that result from them impact MY life, I take offense, and here's a hint for you, it ain't just the Iraqis who're gettin madder and madder at these maniacs, sooner or later it's gonna get that ugly here, cause folks just won't take it no more.

Of course, i'm prolly just wasting my time, you'll go on believing what you wanna believe, right up till some pissed off lynch mob drags you down the street - something I do *not* wanna see here, but looms ever closer every time any attempt to reason fails.

I toldja Iraq would be a damn disaster, and I'm tellin ya now, unless this course is turned, we're lookin at a second civil war here, on american soil - is it really worth it, to cling to pathetic fantasies ?

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 8:45 AM

America loves a winner!

Congrats Frem... you're now part of the nut job, black helicopter, PirateNews whackos club.

That's about all I've got to say about that.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 9:03 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"Congrats Frem... you're now part of the nut job, black helicopter, PirateNews whackos club.

That's about all I've got to say about that."

Is that b/c he said what Iraqis are thinking -

Most Iraqis Favor Immediate U.S. Pullout, Polls Show
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/26/AR2006
092601721.html

Poll: Iraqis Back Attacks on U.S. Troops
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/28/AR2006
092800408.html

Poll Shows Dramatic Decline in How Iraqis View Lives, Future
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/19/AR2007
031900421.html

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 9:45 AM

Quote:
Congrats Frem... you're now part of the nut job, black helicopter, PirateNews whackos club.

Then you're seriously fucked, given my predictive accuracy in comparison to yours.

I notice you make no effort to refute any of that, neither, so yeah, go sit in your corner and pout, while the adults try to sort out the mess you and yours made.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 10:03 AM

America loves a winner!

What 'predictive accuracy' ?? That's a damn joke. You think far too much of yourself.

Your delusional rant was too babbling to even take seriously.

I can assure you, those in charge are far more the adults than you or yours will ever be.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 12:15 PM

Quote:
What 'predictive accuracy' ?? That's a damn joke.

Twin towers still not rebuilt ? check.

Mired in afghanistan for years ? check.

Bogged down in iraq ? check.

Patriot act NOT sunsetted ? check.

Contractors ripped us off in iraq ? check.

Chalabi was fulla shit, hung us out to dry ? check.

AIPAC spying and manipulation of US intelligence ? check.

Entire planet hates our guts ? check.

In debt up to our ass ? check.

Infrastructure hangin by a thread ? check.

Record oil company profits ? check.

Haliburton fucking us completely over ? check.

Gun confiscation and forced relocation in the US ? check.

Massive domestic spying ? check.

Secret gulags and torture ? check.

Election chicanery in 2004 ? check.

UN booting us from various councils ? check.

Ammunition shortages ? check.

Humvee not effective in desert/urban scenario ? check.

Poor equipment leading to excessive casualties ? check.

Post invasion chaos and disorder ? check.

Iraqis turning on us when we start looting the place ? check.

Allies bailing on us ? check.

No significant WMDs found ? check.

Mission Accomplished = Laughable Farce ? check.

Dems lacking the spine to impeach ? check.

Stupidly martyring Saddam ? check.

Lack of national guard troops making natural disaster worse ? half-check
(I said Florida, not Louisiana)

That's just a few things off the top of my head, mind you.
If it's a joke, it ain't fuckin funny, and here we are again, me tellin you what's gonna happen, and you denyin that it will.

We've been here before, and your rah-rah bullshit now comes back to haunt you.

-F

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 1:19 PM

America loves a winner!

Wow. After the fact commentary. Truely predictive.

You're even worse than those Bible prophecy zealots.

People love a happy ending. So every episode, I will explain once again that I don't like people. And then Mal will shoot someone. Someone we like. And their puppy. - Joss

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Wednesday, August 15, 2007 5:17 PM

After the fact ?

Go read the archived posts here, this is stuff that's been addressed and discussed as far back as the archive goes and somewhat before - hell, I posted an editorial on another site back in december 2001 about how the Patriot Act was about as "temporary" as any previous dictators "state of emergency" and how McCarthyism would raise it's ugly head again here in the states if we let it.

There's no after the fact about it, these issues have been discussed, called in advance, and pointed out here as far back as my memory goes, case in point, this thread.
http://www.fireflyfans.net/thread.asp?b=18&t=6631

I am far from the only one who's called this stuff in advance, as it was downright obvious to anyone with half an ounce of sense, which leaves you out, obviously - I just seem to be the only one who cares enough to bother rubbing it in your face, perhaps cause seeing one of my buddies in a bag recently has pissed me off at folks like you who helped put him there.

You won't get no mercy from me, and yes, maybe I am kicking you while your down to sate my rage, and if so, what of it ? cause you damned sure have it comin.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Thursday, August 16, 2007 12:06 AM