Will Smith Hitler Comment by Causal

The thing that gripes me is that if a person makes a comment about Hitler or the Nazis that even looks like it might be anything other than negative (regardless of whether it actually is or not), that person will be eaten alive. Come on now. I think Smith's comment is instructive: not even a person like Hitler thinks of himself as evil. In the mind of such a person, what they're doing is right. So how can we help people think more accurately about the things they do, such that the world won't have to have another Hitler or Stalin or Pol Pot?

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 5:36 AM

""Even Hitler didn't wake up going, 'let me do the most evil thing I can do today'," said Will. "I think he woke up in the morning and using a twisted, backwards logic, he set out to do what he thought was 'good'. Stuff like that just needs reprogramming."

And ?
This is news ?

To paraphrase Mal
"Ain't nothin worse than a monster who thinks he's right with God."

Most evil in the world isn't done by evil men, it's done by people who honestly believe in their heart that what they are doing is right, like The Operative from Serenity - their ideology blinds them to the horrors they create.

When ideology trumps reason, and a persons humanity is suppressed or damaged in some fashion (See Also: Works of Alice Miller)- and that person achives a position of power, such abuses are all but inevitable.

While not specifically antagonistic against most religions, this is the primary reason I am averse to them - common sense would tell you that sending someone to thier death at the end of a sword or gun barrel is an immoral, inhumane act, but look how often it gets done, and gets justified, by "True Believers" and the damned fools who blindly follow them.

One of the things I am earnestly being thankful for today is the fact that shrub has all the charm and charisma of a nettlebush draped in limburger cheese...

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 5:38 AM

SERGEANTX

This is the sort of thing that makes democracy a dangerous thing. And what really annoys me is not the stupid people who respond do such misinterpretations and demagoguery. They don't know they're being lied to (although I'd like to encourage them to think a bit more critically than they do). But the people who propagate this crap DO know better - and they do it anyway, for their own ulterior motives.

We need to start calling out the journalists and pundits who play these games and rubbing their noses in it.

SergeantX

"Dream a little dream or you can live a little dream. I'd rather live it, cause dreamers always chase but never get it." Aesop Rock

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 5:39 AM

Casual, Well Said, and thanks.

I know we agree on almost nothing else, but that one thought.. we do, and seem to on it's vital importance, the NEED to understand that as a preventive measure.

Here's for hopin this one doesn't go flamewar.
(we can hope, right ?)

-F

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 8:17 AM

HKCAVALIER

I've long held the notion that the essence of evil is the denial of evil. Which is to say, without humility, without the basic acknowledgement that we, all of us, are capable of doing great harm in one way or another, we are likely to commit acts of cruelty and violence against others. The moment a person, or, much worse, a group of people manage to convince themselves that "they can do no wrong," that they are "the good guys" despite what they actually do, is the first step on the road to atrocity.

Absolutely, Hitler saw himself as "the good guy" saving humanity from the "bad guys." More interestingly to me is the idea that every action we take is preferable to some other action in our mind. O.J. killed his wife to avoid something he found even more terrible. What was it? Actions can be good or evil, but we humans come equipped with the capability of both, no matter who we are.

O' course, it doesn't hurt if we can convince ourselves that our own actions are caused by other people--someone else's actions or even just their presence makes us do the terrible things we elect to do. That's why blame is such a dangerous mental habit, it's the blank check upon which we may write whatever revenge strikes our fancy.

What frustrates me most about the press latching onto Mr. Smith's words in this way is that we've become a world of tattle-tales. And the press has become the equivalent of some nasty clique of high school cheerleaders massaging the egos of the powerful and humiliating anyone they can get away with defaming.

That's what's so utterly infuriating about the whole "P.C." madness: it's the moral opprobrium of the school yard. People talk about the "dumbing down" of the culture but what I mostly see is the "maturing down" of the culture. Any adult--that is, a person acquainted with human suffering and falibility, with responsibility and consequences--should be able to see what Will Smith was saying. As a very wise man once said, "And? This is news?"

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 11:57 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
I've long held the notion that the essence of evil is the denial of evil. Which is to say, without humility, without the basic acknowledgement that we, all of us, are capable of doing great harm in one way or another, we are likely to commit acts of cruelty and violence against others. The moment a person, or, much worse, a group of people manage to convince themselves that "they can do no wrong," that they are "the good guys" despite what they actually do, is the first step on the road to atrocity.

Well, and interestingly, this can happen no matter what a person's ideological commitments. So no matter which end of the ideological spectrum you occupy, there's great danger in thinking that your cause justifies any means whatever.

Quote:
The press has become the equivalent of some nasty clique of high school cheerleaders massaging the egos of the powerful and humiliating anyone they can get away with defaming.

That's what's so utterly infuriating about the whole "P.C." madness: it's the moral opprobrium of the school yard. People talk about the "dumbing down" of the culture but what I mostly see is the "maturing down" of the culture.

I like the comparison of the media with snobbish high school girls. Another point of comparison: any hint of weakness and they attack. Their favorite targets are the ones that are already down.

As for as the "P.C. madness" the thing that drives me nuts is the idea that people have the right to not be offended. Where did that idea come from? Whence the notion of entitlement generally? Ridiculous.

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 5:27 PM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
""Even Hitler didn't wake up going, 'let me do the most evil thing I can do today'," said Will. "I think he woke up in the morning and using a twisted, backwards logic, he set out to do what he thought was 'good'. Stuff like that just needs reprogramming."

And ?
This is news ?

Trouble is, that ain't what they said he said. As you know, it got published as ", "Will Smith said Hitler was good." whole ' nother thing...

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 5:53 PM

That being why I posted the exact quote prior to discussing it, I much prefer digging out the facts and making my own decisions on a subject rather than simple blind acceptance of whatever the mainstream media (or even alternative media) is tryin to spoonfeed us this day or week.

Governments, Police, Newspapers... they're all people, when it comes right down to it.

And people are... well, people, and we lie, cheat and steal.. sure, it's all a matter of degree - but when our humanity is so damaged that we begin to do those things to ourselves out of mere habit, that's when things get kinda flaky.

First they lie to themselves, then somehow twist it up until it's palatable to them, then they try to foist it on US... "for our own good".

And the first line of defense against that is thinking radicals who'll slam it right back in their faces while the rest of the populace is still debating on whether it's a good idea or not.

The more aware one is of how these things happen, right now... the more scared, or angry, take your pick, one oughta be - and right now, I tellya, I'm pretty pissed.

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 6:34 PM

BADKARMA00

To me, Hitler isn't the point of this story anyway. The simple fact is that some reporter, eager to 'create' a story that was sure to attract attention, basically lied their ass off, and will likely get away with it.
We shouldn't be surprised, I suppose. Reporters have been doing that for a while, turning simple statements into sensational news stories, without regard for truth. You-know-who on CBS did it to Bush. Ron Lapiere, a former CNN correspondent, did it to the military. The list is long, but distinguished.
I support a free press, I really do. The reasons are vast, most important among them, to keep the huddled masses, (that would be us) aware of what's going on.
But there has to be a point where reporters are held accountable for this kind of go se.
Anyway, Merry Christmas everyone, and Long Live Firefly!

Bad_karma

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 11:30 PM

FLETCH2

Everyone is the hero in their own story... even Hitler.

What Will Smith said is obvious to anyone that has ever sat down and thought about the nature of evil.

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Tuesday, December 25, 2007 11:47 PM

HKCAVALIER

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
The moment a person, or, much worse, a group of people manage to convince themselves that "they can do no wrong," that they are "the good guys" despite what they actually do, is the first step on the road to atrocity.

Well, and interestingly, this can happen no matter what a person's ideological commitments. So no matter which end of the ideological spectrum you occupy, there's great danger in thinking that your cause justifies any means whatever.

Absolutely, Causal, that point is crucial--when you believe your ideology itself frees you from moral accountability, you're on your way to becoming a very bad person to have around. And of course, the inverse is entirely true as well--when we condemn whole peoples based solely on their "evil ideologies" we've fallen very low indeed. This phenomenon is easy to spot in, say, militant Islamists, but not so obvious amongst our homegrown ideological zealots.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 12:06 AM

CANTTAKESKY

Long time no see, HK. Happy holidays to you.

Everybody's made great comments. I only have 2 quotations to add.

Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.
-- C. S. Lewis

Compassion has no ideology.
-- Anthony de Mello, S.J.

--------------------------
Aude sapere (Dare to know). -- Samuel Hahnemann, M.D., founder of homeopathy

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 2:15 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Will Smith was spot on. I fail to see the controversy. Hitler did think he was doing right w/ God. He was a believer in what he was doing.

"Hillary tried to get a million dollars for the Woodstock museum. I understand it was a major cultural and pharmaceutical event. I couldn't attend. I was tied up at the time." - John McCain

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 3:24 AM

KIRKULES

This story just demonstrates why its important to have personal integrity when your in the pubic eye. These media idiots picked the wrong man to try and defame. Will Smith's reputation as an honest honorable man makes the public want to jump to his defense instead of automatically condemning his alleged statement. I don't even have to hear Smith's response to the allegation to know they lied about what he said, his past actions have given him the credibility that gets him the benefit of the doubt from me.

The problem is most of the time these stories are true and it's the actor that is lying not the media. Names like Alex Baldwin, Tim Robins and Rose O'Donnell come to mind. They spout off some ignorant BS and then when the media reports what they said they freak out because of the negative publicity and begin damage control. They lie and blame the media for distorting their words because they know that most people distrust the media.

It's a sad state when people have lied to and mislead the public to the point that a media misrepresentation has more credibility than the actual words that come from an individuals mouth.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 5:19 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
The thing that gripes me is that if a person makes a comment about Hitler or the Nazis that even looks like it might be anything other than negative (regardless of whether it actually is or not), that person will be eaten alive. Come on now.

Lets test that:

Boy that Hitler and those Nazis sure were good dancers...

Your right. I feel guilty even having written that. I feel dirty. All dancing skills aside Hitler and the Nazis were evil and committed that most terrible crimes against their fellow men. They were so bad that whatever good qualities they had...snazzy dressers, good marching skills, excellent personal heigene...it pales to insignifigance beside the wholesale slaughter of an entire race of people.

H

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:30 AM

Thought this might interest you:

The "Hitler Fallacy" http://www.fallacyfiles.org/adnazium.html

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:34 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:
This phenomenon is easy to spot in, say, militant Islamists, but not so obvious amongst our homegrown ideological zealots.

Easier to point outward than inward, eh?

Consider the vicious hatred of Clinton by the right and Bush by the left. I will freely confess to having been a Clinton-hater; he could do no right in my eyes. Everything he did was wrong. But having lived through eight years with President Bush, I see that unqualified hatred of someone is just silly. Does Bush brush his teeth in an evil manner? Did Bill Clinton put on his suit in an evil way? Unqualified hatred for someone ultimately robs that person of their humanity. And once you've done that, you can justify all manner of atrocious behavior.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:47 AM

What an irony to that, one of the Xmas gifts I recieved this year, from a friend and his Polish grandfather, was a WWII Radom Auto with, according to them a "very dark history", given with a card expressing their belief that I should have it, and why...

If this is what I believe it to be, I am verymuch honored by that, though heaven knows it's too big for a carry piece.

-F

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 9:49 AM

FREDGIBLET

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
Does Bush brush his teeth in an evil manner?

Of course.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 10:35 AM

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:

Lets test that:

Boy that Hitler and those Nazis sure were good dancers...

H

supposedly, he loved dogs, too...

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 10:48 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Supposedly, he loved dogs, too...

That must mean that anybody who loves their dog is evil, too!

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:16 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
That must mean that anybody who loves their dog is evil, too!

Well seems reasonable to me. Trying to keep logical fallacies out of a debate is just a way of ignoring someone's 'point', and 'debate team tactics'. Best to just tell it like it is, we need to know how much we hate the person making the argument, otherwise we won't know how best to ignore anything we don't agree with, duh!

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
We need to know how much we hate the person making the argument, otherwise we won't know how best to ignore anything we don't agree with, duh!

Heh.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:37 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
Heh.

You're only saying that because you have farty pants.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:38 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:
Quote:
Originally posted by Causal:
Heh.
You're only saying that because you have farty pants.

Well you only say that because of that dry British wit! Better be careful--you could mummify somebody with that wit...

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Wednesday, December 26, 2007 11:42 AM

KIRKULES

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:

Boy that Hitler and those Nazis sure were good dancers...

This is true, if anyone doesn't believe it check out this video.

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Monday, March 28, 2022 7:48 AM

He has a tranny LGBT son he used to kiss on the mouth

I hear he freaked out at the Oscars

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Monday, March 28, 2022 8:21 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Yeah. He went black on black against Chris Rock for saying that he was looking forward to seeing Jada in G.I. Jane 2.

I posted about it in here.

http://fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=64983

The Leftists keep saying that words are violence, and then showing you what actual violence looks like.

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Me: "Remember Covid?"

Useless Idiots: "What's Covid, durr? Russia, Ukraine, Putin, NATO *drool*. DURRRR!!!!"

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Thursday, April 6, 2023 9:10 AM

Will Smith

goes fully Reaverfan Wishimay, We Need to “Cleanse” America From Trump AND His Supporters

https://rumble.com/v2ghrxq-hollywood-cuck-will-smith-we-need-to-cleans
e-america-from-trump-and-his-sup.html

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Thursday, April 6, 2023 11:15 AM

6IXSTRINGJACK

Will who?

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Growing up in a Republic was nice... Shame we couldn't keep it.

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Wednesday, May 17, 2023 5:42 AM

Jada Pinkett Smith it bez dem ‘White Supremacy’ Responsible for Cleopatra’s Terrible Audience Score

Get Soros funded Netflix and BBC virtue signal nonsense to try alter history, offend an entire country, offending an entire race and upsetting their entire audience before calling them all KKK white supremacist Hitlers to get people on your side.

https://thepeoplesvoice.tv/jada-pinkett-smith-says-white-supremacy-res
ponsible-for-cleopatras-terrible-audience-score/

She cheated on him and then ritually humiliates him on live tv and blamed him for the 'cheating'

Almost like he's under some witch spell

Would it have been cool if Will Smith round house kicked her in the face shattering her jaw...not in real life but in 'Minecraft' of course

however I would not be shocked to learn Will Smith himself is into all this odd weird stuff, he used to almost French kiss his son on the mouth in public during Hollywood events, Moisés Arias, who was 20 at the time, was photographed shirtless in a bed with then-13-year-old Willow Smith. The photo triggered an investigation into the family by the Los Angeles County Department of Children and Family Services

Some rapper a friend of Pinkett Smith's son Jaden—said that he and Pinkett Smith had been involved in an adulterous affair

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Wednesday, May 17, 2023 5:45 AM