Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:
Ignore the fact that any parameter in a complex system experiences variation, grab the ONE stat you can find that backs your viewpoint, ignore everything else, and blow your ass online.

---

Quote:

---

Since 1998 this has become a crisis yet there is no actual warming during that period. Thats like taking shelter from a storm that does not exist.

---

Quote:

---

The WMO points out that the decade from 1998 to 2007 was the warmest on record. Since the beginning of the 20th Century, the global average surface temperature has risen by 0.74C. ... Adam Scaife, lead scientist for Modelling Climate Variability at the Hadley Centre in Exeter, UK, said their best estimate for 2008 was about 0.4C above the 1961-1990 average, and higher than this if you compared it with further back in the 20th Century.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:

Quote:

---

Since 1998 this has become a crisis yet there is no actual warming during that period. Thats like taking shelter from a storm that does not exist.

---

Did you actually read the article that you posted? it said

Quote:

---

The WMO points out that the decade from 1998 to 2007 was the warmest on record. Since the beginning of the 20th Century, the global average surface temperature has risen by 0.74C. ... Adam Scaife, lead scientist for Modelling Climate Variability at the Hadley Centre in Exeter, UK, said their best estimate for 2008 was about 0.4C above the 1961-1990 average, and higher than this if you compared it with further back in the 20th Century.

---

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2007/






---------------------------------
Let's party like it's 1929.

---

Quote:

---

But experts say we are still clearly in a long-term warming trend - and they forecast a new record high temperature within five years.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Righteous9:

Holy shit, seriously, the issue of global warming is settled....even the people who say we aren't at fault aren't saying it isn't happening. I thought you weren't a religious man Hero, but here you are, going against the current of science, in favor of dogmatic certainty, again. What is it about this topic that you so consistently feel compelled to convolute the facts with your common "sense?"

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
So why even try to bring science into the equation?

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Righteous9:
Holy shit, seriously, the issue of global warming is settled....even the people who say we aren't at fault aren't saying it isn't happening.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Storymark:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
So why even try to bring science into the equation?

---

Because it's better than sticking our fingers in our ears and saying "Nya Nya, I can't hear you" like you and others do.

I'll take science over rationalizing or self-denial any day.

Besides, I though you wingnuts stick to the "the science isn't conclusive" meme? It can say it's not man-made if it's inconclusive. Can't have it both ways, Rappy.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Storymark:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
So why even try to bring science into the equation?

---

Because it's better than sticking our fingers in our ears and saying "Nya Nya, I can't hear you" like you and others do.

I'll take science over rationalizing or self-denial any day.

Besides, I though you wingnuts stick to the "the science isn't conclusive" meme? It can say it's not man-made if it's inconclusive. Can't have it both ways, Rappy.

---

Yes, we I can have it both ways, because it's inconclusive. Your default position is that ANY change is "man made " , when in fact that hasn't been proven. And I enjoy you wingnuts calling US the wingnuts. That truly is precious.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

---

Quote:

---

No, my default position is "play it safe, just in case". Besides, I don't see a cleaner enviornment as having a down side if it's not true.

And no, you can't have it both ways, unless you are being a total hipocrit. You can't say there's nothing conclusive - and then state a difinitive conclusion, dipshit.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Since we don't know if/ how man has any role in rising temps, we can conclusively say that we don't know what effect, if any , cutting our 'carbon footprint' will do for the planet.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Storymark:
No, my default position is "play it safe, just in case". Besides, I don't see a cleaner enviornment as having a down side if it's not true.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Storymark:
No, my default position is "play it safe, just in case". Besides, I don't see a cleaner enviornment as having a down side if it's not true.

---

No new factories, oil refineries, power plants...not to mention throwing coal miners, loggers, and related service workers out of their jobs. Higher taxes, higher unemployments, higher energy costs, inflation, fire, flood, disease, animal overpopulation, bad TV (did you see 'Green Week' on NBC), turning off City lights for no reason, having to listen to AlGore, feeling guilty for dumping oil down the sewer, recycling (its a pain), treehuggers, Greenpeace, crazy folks burning down my new expensive house, and lastly...I miss coke in a glass bottle.

---

Quote:

---

"No new factories, oil refineries, power plants"- this is silly, if we built new ones they'd be cleaner and more efficient then ones built prior to 1980, and we could start phasing out the older ones.

H

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:
See, Rap belongs to the Auraptor School of Economic Analysis. It's proven so gratifying he's now applying the fact-free approach to everything else!

---------------------------------
Let's party like it's 1929.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
I am fact based, not fact challenged, as y'all are.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
I'd like to have the source for that Reagan quote, and the context.

---

Quote:

---

Reagan was quoting John Adams' well-known quotation, facts are stubborn things. He certainly knew the correct words--it was a simple misstatement--but it makes a funny quote in its own right.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
I'd like to have the source for that Reagan quote, and the context.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by chrisisall:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
I am fact based, not fact challenged, as y'all are.

---

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Good one, AU!!! Glad I wasn't drinkin' soda just then!!! *wipes tear from eye*

The climate's changin'. Maybe mostly a natural cycle...maybe man-hurried...but the facts are undeniable. It's gonna be a bumpy ride, and I'm prepared- are YOU?

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Kwicko:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:
I'd like to have the source for that Reagan quote, and the context.

---

Ask, and ye shall receive...

"Facts are stupid things." –Spoken by Ronald Wilson Reagan at the 1988 Republican National Convention, attempting to quote John Adams, who said, "Facts are stubborn things".




Mike

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:


Well, we can give Ronnie a pass on that one...

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Glad you find facts so funny, Chris.

---

Quote:

---

Well, we can give Ronnie a pass on that one, seeing how he was busy saving the entire human race from thermo nuclear war, what w/ defeating the Soviets and all. At least Reagan knew who John Adams was, unlike Algore.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Kwicko:
What's your source and context to prove that Reagan had any idea who John Adams was, or that Al Gore doesn't?

---

Quote:

---

Before we came to Washington, Americans had just suffered the two worst back-to-back years of inflation in 60 years. Those are the facts, and as John Adams said, ``Facts are stubborn things.'' Interest rates had jumped to over 21 percent, the highest in 120 years, more than doubling the average monthly mortgage payments for working families -- our families. When they sat around the kitchen table, it was not to plan summer vacations, it was to plan economic survival. Facts are stubborn things.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Kwicko:
What's your source and context to prove that Reagan had any idea who John Adams was, or that Al Gore doesn't?

---

Quote:

---

Q: During your talks with Mrs. Thatcher in February you referred to the special quality of relations between the U.S. and Britain. What are these special qualities?

The President: In a few weeks, it will be the 200th anniversary of the date on which John Adams was received by King George III and diplomatic relations were established between the United Kingdom and the United States. With a few exceptions, the two centuries which followed have been marked by a growing closeness between our two countries. Our nations have been drawn together by common traditions and heritage and a common devotion to the concepts of liberty and human dignity. These bonds have been forged over the centuries as our countries have stood together to meet both the challenges of war and the opportunities of peace. Today relations between Great Britain and the United States are marked not only by cooperation and mutual respect but also by a deep and abiding friendship.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:
I've cited numerous articles from the 1930s on where about every ten years they claim in bold headlines either 'GLOBAL WARMING' or 'GLOBAL COOLING' when in fact its no hotter or colder now then it was ten or even 100 years ago.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Kwicko:

Quote:

---

Well, we can give Ronnie a pass on that one, seeing how he was busy saving the entire human race from thermo nuclear war, what w/ defeating the Soviets and all. At least Reagan knew who John Adams was, unlike Algore.

---

Well, isn't that convenient? Of course, once again, and as usual, you're assuming facts not in evidence - dangerous territory for a "fact based" life form (or biped) such as yourself, eh?

What's your source and context to prove that Reagan had any idea who John Adams was, or that Al Gore doesn't?

---

Quote:

---

By your litmus test, Kennedy must get a pass on that whole bullet-catching incident, as well as everything else he did, since he'd been busy saving the planet from thermonuclear war, too.

Mike

---

Quote:

---

Conversely, I am fact based, not fact challenged, as y'all are.

---

Quote:

---

Well, I was around when Reagan was in office, so I know how smart he was.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:

Quote:

---

Conversely, I am fact based, not fact challenged, as y'all are.

---

This is your first factual error....

Quote:

---

Well, I was around when Reagan was in office, so I know how smart he was.

---

Hey, guess what?
ME TOO!

I know how smart he was, too! I even recall the joke that was going around at the time: Didja here the one about the RR typewriter? It has no memory and no colon!

See? My facts are better'n yours! More specific, and funnier.

(BTW- Do you recall when the Challenger blew up?)

---

Quote:

---

Reagan gave one of his most moving speeches ever that day.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:

Quote:

---

Reagan gave one of his most moving speeches ever that day.

---

. He was not a "brilliant" man taken "later" by Alzheimer's.

---------------------------------
Let's party like it's 1929.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SignyM:
He was not a "brilliant" man taken "later" by Alzheimer's.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:


Its ok to disagree with the man's politics without hating the man. I hated Clinton's politics, but as a fella, he wasn't the worst and I admire what he accomplished on a professional level. Sure, I'd not trust him in a room with my little sister or loan money to the man, but aside from that he was just as good and bad as anybody else.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by chrisisall:
I agree with Hero on this- there is much to respect concerning Reagan...and it took GW to make that clear to me...

---

Quote:

---

Now, death has done all that death can do. And as Ronald Wilson Reagan goes his way, we are left with the joyful hope he shared. In his last years, he saw through a glass darkly. Now he sees his Savior face to face.

And we look to that fine day when we will see him again, all weariness gone, clear of mind, strong and sure, and smiling again, and the sorrow of his parting gone forever.

May God bless Ronald Reagan, and the country he loved.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:

It was a moving speech. I'm glad to see you give President Bush some due credit.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by chrisisall:
The speech (eulogy) was fine, but GW had it written for him.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:

From what I understand about Bush is that for big speeches like this he puts his ideas onto paper,

---

Quote:

---

gives it to the speechwriter

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by chrisisall:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Hero:

From what I understand about Bush is that for big speeches like this he puts his ideas onto paper,

---

In crayon...

Quote:

---

gives it to the speechwriter

---

Who basically, er, WRITES it...

Har har Chrisisall

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by rue:
Rap

"He most certainly was. Understand , I'm not comparing him to William F. Buckley Jr , or Stephen Hawking , but Reagan was wiser and smarter than most."

Not smart enough to write the speeches you liked so much, or smart enough to create the policies. He was, at most, the face of a background group. Even then he was suffering from early Alzheimer's and it took a phalanx of 'handlers' and a 'hearing aid' to make him look at least normal.

BTW, what is it about you that you can only admire severely brain-damaged people like Reagan and GW Bush ?

***************************************************************
"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."

---