Obama planning power grab w/ Census ? by AURaptor

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Obama planning power grab w/ Census ?

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Saturday, February 14, 2009 12:23
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Saturday, February 14, 2009 2:27 AM

America loves a winner!

White House: Census Director to ‘Work Closely’ with West Wing

By Jonathan Allen, CQ Staff

The Obama administration acknowledged Thursday that the as-yet-unnamed Census Bureau director will have a direct line to the White House but sought to define the relationship as one in which the director would “work closely with” rather than report to President Obama’s senior staff.

After black and Hispanic leaders raised concerns over Commerce Secretary-nominee Judd Gregg ’s commitment to core functions of the Census Bureau, a senior White House official told CQ on Wednesday that the director would report directly to the White House.

That brought fire Thursday from Republicans, who accused the White House of attempting to gain advantage in the politically delicate process of counting Americans and of violating the law by circumventing the Commerce secretary. The decennial census is used to determine the apportionment of congressional districts among the states and federal funding for numerous programs.

The White House took a small step back from what the senior official told CQ, releasing a statement late Thursday that couched the relationship between the Census Bureau director and the West Wing as one in which the director would work with the high-level officials rather than report directly to them.

“From the first days of the transition the census has been a priority for the president, and a process he wanted to reevaluate,” White House spokesman Ben LaBolt said. “There is historic precedent for the director of the Census, who works for the Commerce secretary and the president, to work closely with White House senior management — given the number of decisions that will have to be put before the president. We plan to return to that model in this administration.”

House Republicans are incensed about the prospect of the Census Bureau director reporting directly to the White House staff, which is led by former Rep. Rahm Emanuel (2003-09), a longtime political operative and onetime chairman of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee.

“Any attempt by the Obama administration to circumvent the census process for their political benefit will be met with fierce opposition as this ill-conceived proposal undermines a constitutionally obligated process that speaks to the very heart of our democracy,” said California Rep. Darrell Issa , the top Republican on the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee.

Issa and North Carolina Rep. Patrick McHenry, the top Republican on the subcommittee that oversees census issues, sent a letter to Obama detailing their concern that such a move might circumvent existing law and be used for partisan gain.

“Requiring the census director to report directly to the White House and placing responsibility for administration of the Bureau outside the Department of Commerce may even violate federal law,” they wrote. “According to Title 13 of the U.S. Code, the Bureau is to be administered ‘within, and under the jurisdiction of, the Department of Commerce.’ ”

The selection of a Republican Commerce secretary by a Democratic president was always certain to cause some discomfort on the political left and the political right.

Gregg’s record on Census Bureau funding, in particular, highlighted the high stakes political battle over how people are counted.

Gregg opposed “emergency” funding for the 2000 census and sought to fund Justice Department programs at the expense of Commerce programs when he ran the Commerce-Justice appropriations panel. He also voted for a Republican-written budget that called for abolishing the Commerce Department in 1995.

“The constitutionally mandated decennial census needs to be fair, accurate and trusted. By circumventing the secretary of Commerce’s oversight of the Census Bureau and handing it directly to a political operative such as Mr. Emanuel, you are severely jeopardizing the fairness and accuracy of the 2010 census,” Issa and McHenry wrote.

House Republicans do not have a vote in the confirmation process.

First posted Feb. 5, 2009 2:28 p.m.

http://www.cqpolitics.com/wmspage.cfm?parm1=1&docID=news-000003025792

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 4:34 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Maybe they could have ACORN or MSNBC conduct the next Census. Those folks are really good at numbers and people. And now with all the stimulous money available, they'll at last have the resources they need to do it in the most honest and accurate way possible. A new approach to the crusty methods that have served the country all through the decades. Now it's in the hands of the experts.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 4:40 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

I heard this topic being discussed on the news, and it was broght up that every single living former Census director was opposed to having the census report directly to the White House.

For all the talk of how W was trying to broaden the powers of the Executive branch, this truly crosses the line.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 5:17 AM

WHOZIT

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
I heard this topic being discussed on the news, and it was broght up that every single living former Census director was opposed to having the census report directly to the White House.

For all the talk of how W was trying to broaden the powers of the Executive branch, this truly crosses the line.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

Rush Limbaugh had a good point on Friday, he wondered what the Dems and the press would say if Bush & Rove tried this? My guess is that Olberman's tiny little brain would explode.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 5:44 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by whozit:

Rush Limbaugh had a good point on Friday, he wondered what the Dems and the press would say if Bush & Rove tried this? My guess is that Olberman's tiny little brain would explode.

And explode prematurely, from what's been reported about Mr Olbermann.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 5:59 AM

WHOZIT

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by whozit:

Rush Limbaugh had a good point on Friday, he wondered what the Dems and the press would say if Bush & Rove tried this? My guess is that Olberman's tiny little brain would explode.

And explode prematurely, from what's been reported about Mr Olbermann.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

Talkshow host Mark Levin had one of Olberman's ex-girlfriends on one night, I hope he re-airs it some night

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 6:00 AM

KIRKULES

This is all part of his plan to be FDR the sequel. Next will come stacking the Supreme Court and using the IRS against his political enemies.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 8:17 AM

FREMDFIRMA

For all that I think y'all are rabidly partisan to the point of near lunacy, some of ya, I don't much like the sound of this either...

But yer gonna have to break this down into captain dummy talk for me to explain just why it's such an awful idea - I mean, it sure sounds like one, and Rahmbo gives me the friggin creeps just being in any position of power whatever, but I need to know how the gears in this case WORK if you want some sand dumped into em.

-F

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 8:45 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

And if they change how they do the census, will negroes still count as three-fifths of a person? Reason I ask, is because that's in the Constitution as pertains the census, ya see.

Sometimes the census and the way it's done can change, and it's not always for the worst.

Mike

"It is complete now; the hands of time are neatly tied."

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 8:51 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

George W. Bush's first commerce secretary was his campaign chairman, Don Evans. Bill Clinton's commerce secretaries included his campaign chairman, Mickey Kantor, and Ron Brown, who was chairman of the DNC when Clinton first ran for president. George H.W. Bush gave the job to Bob Mosbacher, finance chairman of his 1988 campaign.

I don't remember any Republicans complaining that Don Evans or Bob Mosbacher might be in charge of the census. In fact, you could easily conclude that by insisting that a Republican be in charge of the census, Republicans are guilty of politicizing the process.

And yet reporters take seriously the Republicans' complaints that Rahm Emanuel might have some influence over the census.

---------------------------------
It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 9:17 AM

KIRKULES

The Constitution is for the most part full of restrictions on what the Federal Government can not do. The census is one of the few things that is actually Constitutionally required of the Feds. The concern here is that if the methodology used in collecting census numbers will be changed by political operatives to control the number of Congressional seats each State gets. It has generally been accepted in the past that the Constitution requires an actual count of the number of citizens in each State. Due to the fact that US citizens move often and because of the difficulty in counting 300 million people, it has been suggested that it might be more accurate to use statistical models to estimate the populations, instead of an actual count. If this happens then partisans could write the model to favor red States over blue States. If the census becomes a political tool used by those in power to consolidate their power by adding House seats in friendly States, our two party system will become a one party system and another 60 years of Democrat control of the House will be the result.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 9:55 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Quote:
If the census becomes a political tool used by those in power to consolidate their power by adding House seats in friendly States

Becomes ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering

-F

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 10:13 AM

KWICKO

Quote:
"Representation and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers ... . The actual Enumeration shall be made within three Years after the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States, and within every subsequent Term of ten Years, in such Manner as they shall by Law direct."
-- Article I, Section 2 of the Constitution of the United States

That seems pretty simple and straightforward. "ACTUAL Enumeration" = an actual count. This would seem to disqualify "sampling" as an effective census-taking measure.

I can see where there's a problem with the way it's handled, though - in 1913, the taxation and representation parts were disconnected, when the government went to direct taxation of individuals. Before that, it was as it was intended to be: the census was the basis of representation AND taxation. If a state wanted to inflate their reported population to increase representation, they could - but their tax burden would increase by the same amount.

Makes a good case against sampling, but a better one for putting it back the way it was, if you ask me.

Mike

"It is complete now; the hands of time are neatly tied."

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 10:47 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
And if they change how they do the census, will negroes still count as three-fifths of a person? Reason I ask, is because that's in the Constitution as pertains the census, ya see.

Sometimes the census and the way it's done can change, and it's not always for the worst.

Mike

"It is complete now; the hands of time are neatly tied."

Would you prefer " negros " count as 3/5ths, or a nothing at all. That was the choice they were dealing with , back then, and trust me, 3/5ths is far better than counting for nothing. We've since dealt with that issue.

It's simple. The Dems want to count imaginary people, ( those who may or may not exist ) and the GOP wants to count ACTUAL people.

Logically, I see the GOP's method as being the most fair and honest.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 10:50 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
George W. Bush's first commerce secretary was his campaign chairman, Don Evans. Bill Clinton's commerce secretaries included his campaign chairman, Mickey Kantor, and Ron Brown, who was chairman of the DNC when Clinton first ran for president. George H.W. Bush gave the job to Bob Mosbacher, finance chairman of his 1988 campaign.

I don't remember any Republicans complaining that Don Evans or Bob Mosbacher might be in charge of the census. In fact, you could easily conclude that by insisting that a Republican be in charge of the census, Republicans are guilty of politicizing the process.

And yet reporters take seriously the Republicans' complaints that Rahm Emanuel might have some influence over the census.

You're missing the point, entirely. It's not who runs the Census, but to whom the director answers. Is it the Commerce Dept, as per usual, or , as Obama is floating the idea, directly to the White House ?

Beyond any question, Obama, and not the GOP , is guilty of politicizing this topic.

Try and keep up, dear.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:06 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Logically, I see the GOP's method as being the most fair and honest.

Yeah. They want to count only ACTUAL people who vote for them.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:20 AM

KIRKULES

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Quote:
If the census becomes a political tool used by those in power to consolidate their power by adding House seats in friendly States

Becomes ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerrymandering

-F

Gerrymandering is a problem for the States to sort out, but power remains on the State level. Can you imagine the mess if this also occurred on the Federal level. We would be looking at another Civil War in no time.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:22 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:

Yeah. They want to count only ACTUAL people who vote for them.

While the Dems want to count the dead, the illegals and those who vote for them, TWICE.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:40 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
While the Dems want to count the dead, the illegals and those who vote for them, TWICE.

Exactly. They're both as bad as each other for slightly different reasons.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:56 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Hey, the US Constitution says we have to count how many folks are living in the country. That's ALL the GOP wants to do, is comply w/ the Constitution. That's all ANY party should want to do, but the Dems are wanting to take things a bit further. There's no " yeah, but the GOP is equally wrong for wanting ... " No. there's none of that here. I'm so sick and tired of folks saying that if one party does something wrong, then automatically, the other party is equally as guilty too. Might be the case some times, but not here. Sorry.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 11:58 AM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Hey, the US Constitution says we have to count how many folks are living in the country. That's ALL the GOP wants to do, is comply w/ the Constitution. That's all ANY party should want to do, but the Dems are wanting to take things a bit further. There's no " yeah, but the GOP is equally wrong for wanting ... " No. there's none of that here. I'm so sick and tired of folks saying that if one party does something wrong, then automatically, the other party is equally as guilty too. Might be the case some times, but not here. Sorry.

I'm saying the GOP is just as interested in election fraud as the Dems, they just go about it a different way. And they do, no matter how much you want to restrict the field to see only the way the dems do it in an orgy of partisanship. Sorry.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 12:04 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

election fraud is one thing, the census is another. Yeah, I know how one ties in w/ the other, but the census is it's own , 10 year beast, where as elections occur every 2 years. I'm just saying that it's easier to check up on REAL #'s with real people, than to wave your hand and say " oh, 7 folks live under that bridge " and none of those 7 folks live anywhere else, either. Per the issue of the census, it's far easier, imo, to commit fraud when you don't have to put an actual name to an actual physical address.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 12:16 PM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
election fraud is one thing, the census is another. Yeah, I know how one ties in w/ the other, but the census is it's own , 10 year beast, where as elections occur every 2 years. I'm just saying that it's easier to check up on REAL #'s with real people, than to wave your hand and say " oh, 7 folks live under that bridge " and none of those 7 folks live anywhere else, either. Per the issue of the census, it's far easier, imo, to commit fraud when you don't have to put an actual name to an actual physical address.

So, the dems do it every ten years and the GOP does it every two years, doesn't that make them worse?

Anyway. It might be far easier, but it being far harder, doesn't stop the GOP from denying peoples votes, if those votes aren't for them. And I'd say preventing an actual person from voting is worse, no? How would you like your vote denied, simply because it was for the wrong political party?

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 12:19 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

The GOP doesn't deny anyone's right to vote, and the Dems are cheating every damn day, not just during elections. You know not of what you speak so debate on this is pointless.

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Saturday, February 14, 2009 12:23 PM

CITIZEN

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

The GOP doesn't deny anyone's right to vote, and the Dems are cheating every damn day, not just during elections. You know not of what you speak so debate on this is pointless.

Yeah, totally. No voter fraud from the GOP. That's also not a partisan thing to say. You're right. You are always right

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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