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Originally posted by Hero:
All the reasonable and informed folks on the subject

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Some people vote straight party line for either side. I think most people vote the way they do for very good reasons.

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You should not assume people are stupid or ignorant or whatever for making a decision different then yours.

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You risk dehumanizing your opposition and that could lead to the very oppression you fear.

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If you don't trust people to make the right decision and if that's the case, perhaps you should take the decision out of their hands.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Chris,
Neo cons aren't 1/4th the fascist as Obama
& the Dems.

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Originally posted by RIPWash:
Citizen (and Kwicko and Storymark and . . . ), I know you'll probably dispute this, but here is a report from 1999 from ABC News here in the US that shows the connection of Bin Laden and Hussein.

As my good friend Glenn Beck says . . . "I'm just sayin' . . ."

**EDIT** And yes I know there's a more recent report from ABC News stating that there was no link between the two, but their 1999 report went into the relationship rather extensively. Hmmmmmm . . . .

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Originally posted by citizen:

If an American news source is saying it, I'm more inclined to believe it isn't true.

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Originally posted by Hero:
Thats my point, they created "marriage" they created it and defined it. You want something different...I say fine, nothing wrong with personal unions between same sex couples...but its something different, its not marriage.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Funny, that's similar to what Rush Limbaugh has said about the US news media as well.

I'm just sayin'.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Rush is as much a part of the US News media as you are w/ the British news media. You comment on news events, which means you are basically the internet equivalent of those writers who write opinion pieces in news papers. As such that might be one of the few times I am on too something, because if citizen's saying something, it's probably bullshit.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
It's funny to see you try to contort your own twisted logic.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
You're the one gettin' all fussy, tossin' out insults and all. Look who's the angry monkey now!



Might be past your beddie-bye time.

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Originally posted by chrisisall:
Why is it okay to stare at a beautiful car, or a beautiful child, but not a beautiful girl?

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Hee hee. Now you're gettin' cranky AND delusional. All I did was to turn your own words onto yourself. I never got ' personal', you did.

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Originally posted by citizen:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Hee hee. Now you're gettin' cranky AND delusional. All I did was to turn your own words onto yourself. I never got ' personal', you did.

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You turned my words, directed at no one at this site, on to me, and some how that isn't personal. Hmm. That's not a delusional thing to say, but if you think anyone's going to buy it, you've pretty much just proved you're the stupidest moron on this site.

I know, you're just pissed off because I so completely owned you in that other thread so quickly you barely had time to run away! I'ts ok, just declare yourself the winner here, and we can all laugh at the delusional crazy monkey while you puff yourself up and act self important.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

Awww.... look who woke up cranky on a fine Saturday morn.

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Geeze, you're easier than a liquored up sorority girl.

(and I say that not as an insult, but with regret. )

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
Kerry's pic is clearly self explanatory. As for what Bush is doing to the 1 vollyball palyer, I've got no damn clue. She's explaining or demonstrating somethin, but I got nothin.

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Originally posted by yinyang:

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Originally posted by chrisisall:
Why is it okay to stare at a beautiful car, or a beautiful child, but not a beautiful girl?

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Um, because girls are children?

Justsayinisall

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
As for what Bush is doing to the 1 vollyball palyer, I've got no damn clue.

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Originally posted by chrisisall:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:
As for what Bush is doing to the 1 vollyball palyer, I've got no damn clue.

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Of course not, you like Bush better, so you can accept him staring at a young woman.


The laughing Chrisisall

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

The two photos are not anywhere near the same, thus there's no comparison. Liking W or not, isn't the issue.

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Originally posted by chrisisall:

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Originally posted by AURaptor:

The two photos are not anywhere near the same, thus there's no comparison. Liking W or not, isn't the issue.

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LOL, of course, looking at a female's ass is much more respectful than looking at a female's boobs. It's the curve of the neck that delineates the offense, I forgot, sorry your worshipfullness.


The laughing Chrisisall

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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Originally posted by jewelstaitefan:

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Originally posted by chrisisall:
I can fully understand why someone might have voted for him the first time, by why in the name of Our Dear & Fluffy Lord would ANYONE have voted for him the second time? Were they SO scared of the terrorists taking over? Was that it?

Comments? Theories?


The laughing Chrisisall

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Because we were smart enough NOT to vote for John Kerry. Maybe if the Democrats had put up a candidate, it might have been different, it's not like there isn't a decent Democrat in existence - but just that the party won't allow a reasonable person in the top ticket.

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Yeah, but you say that as if it's something only the Dems are guilty of! :) Plenty enough of that syndrome going around BOTH parties, to be honest.

Mike

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Originally posted by RIPWash:
It's completely different, in my opinion, to claim to be an unbiased news media outlet like CNN or MSNBC and have the news anchors be so completely in one corner of the political landscape.

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Originally posted by RIPWash:
I don't recall hearing any anchor on Fox gush over McCain the way CNN and MSNBC gushed over Obama. What I heard (in my opinion), for example, was Fox questioning of why a fuss was being made over how many houses McCain could remember owning vs. the overlooking of Obama's ties to . . . yup, I'm gonna mention them . . . Bill Ayers and Kaleed Rashidi (not sure of the spelling on that one). The only yelling I've ever heard on Fox News was by someone on the Left getting upset over a common sense question being asked of them and their refusal to answer adequately.

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Originally posted by RIPWash:
Man, I know I'm gonna get blasted for this, but . . .

A point I like to make is that the likes of Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity and Glenn Beck . . . they've all made no bones about it. They're conservatives and they approach their shows from that point of view. They are commentating on politics from a certain slant. From their own personal beliefs and values. It's completely different, in my opinion, to claim to be an unbiased news media outlet like CNN or MSNBC and have the news anchors be so completely in one corner of the political landscape. Chris Matthews gushed about Obama and said he got a flutter up his leg during one of Obama's speaches and claims it's HIS job to make sure Obama succeeds. He never made such claims (that I know of) during the Bush administration.

All I'm sayin', ladies and gents, is that there's a reason that Rush, Hannity and Beck are the highest rated talk show hosts in the U.S. People want to hear what they have to say. There's also a reason that Air America failed so miserably. No one listened despite all the fanfair and talent. Advertisers want to support programs that make them money and the same goes for radio stations. Like it or not. Poeple are in business to make money. That's what makes the world go 'round.

I also saw above a quote about the stock market starting at 10,000 and ending at 8,000 for Bush's administration. But the fact of the matter is that the stock market hit record highs in between that time also.

Zoe: "Get it running again."
Mal: "Yeah"
Zoe: "So not running now"
Mal: "Not so much"
- Out of Gas

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the stimulous package had over 8,000 lines of earmarks and pork. He also promised, in the last debate, to "take a scalpel" to the budget and eliminate projects that didn't work and expand those that did. So far, a proposed 8-9% increase in the budget.

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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the stimulous package had over 8,000 lines of earmarks and pork. He also promised, in the last debate, to "take a scalpel" to the budget and eliminate projects that didn't work and expand those that did. So far, a proposed 8-9% increase in the budget.

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Couple points of clarification:

1) Those earmarks number some 9000 - yet that is STILL less than 2% of the proposed spending. And 40% of those earmarks were inserted by Republicans, so it's hardly a Democrat free-for-all.

2) A propsed 8-9% increase in the budget WHICH NOW INCLUDES THE IRAQ/AFGHANISTAN WAR SPENDING. Please be clear on this in the future. Bush's budgets never included any war spending; that was always addressed through "emergency funding" bills, and left out of the yearly budgets. So that 8-9% increase may well result in a SMALLER budget if you take the war spending into account.



Mike



The "On Fire" Economy -
The Dow closed at 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day GW Bush took office. Eight years later, it closed below 8000 on the day he left office - a net loss of 25%. That's what conservatives call an economic "success".

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That's what a lot of people on the left think, but again that's a matter of opinion depending on what side of the political spectrum you're on.

Look at it this way. Everything is a matter of personal opinion. People on the left see hate speech on the right and vice versa. Some of it warranted, some not. Being what I would call a conservative (but perhaps more libertarian), I see a LOT more hate-filled speech coming from the left. But that's just my opinion.

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Originally posted by Kwicko:

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That's what a lot of people on the left think, but again that's a matter of opinion depending on what side of the political spectrum you're on.

Look at it this way. Everything is a matter of personal opinion. People on the left see hate speech on the right and vice versa. Some of it warranted, some not. Being what I would call a conservative (but perhaps more libertarian), I see a LOT more hate-filled speech coming from the left. But that's just my opinion.

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That's what a lot of people on EITHER side think, to be blunt about it. Whichever side you're on, you see hate speech coming from the other side, but rarely your own. After all, if you're BEING called a "surrender monkey", it's probably more likely to seem offensive, whereas those who HEAR someone else being called such, doesn't strike them as offensive in the least.

In other words, we're somewhat programmed to hear the things from "the other guy" that we're vehemently opposed to, or that we're offended by, and we tend to tune out the stuff that we agree with or even that only mildly annoys us. So when you, as someone on the right, hears someone on the left go on a long diatribe against one of your favorite politicians, you tend to only focus on the negative parts, which your mind labels "hate speech". And if you were to then hear someone from your side go on a similar diatribe about the evils of the other side, you'd hear things you're pretty much in agreement with, which reinforce your already-held notions instead of challenging them, so your ming doesn't register any of it as offensive or hateful.

As you say, YOU see more of it coming from the Left. I, as a liberal, see much more of it coming from the Right. Like I said, in a way we're programmed to see it that way, because we already have our own internal biases that we've formed over the years...

Just another way of looking at it, and something to think about.

Mike



The "On Fire" Economy -
The Dow closed at 10,587.60 on January 20, 2001, the day GW Bush took office. Eight years later, it closed below 8000 on the day he left office - a net loss of 25%. That's what conservatives call an economic "success".

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Originally posted by RIPWash:
I don't mean to argue Citizen, but personal bias does leak into perceptions of the world around us.

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