Sockpuppet Rant by Bytemite

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Sockpuppet Rant

POSTED BY: BYTEMITE
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 04:07
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VIEWED: 2158
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Sunday, January 17, 2010 4:26 PM

Hi, everybody. So, yeah. This is going to be a rant. I'm going to try to be as nice as possible about this, and I'm not going to name names, but I think it's time for something more to be said about this.

As the past day went by, I found myself increasingly upset about this issue. Perhaps any new member we encounter is possibly a sockpuppet, but is this issue widespread enough for us to warrant treating any potential new member like they might be a sockpuppet? This treatment could be damaging, both to the potential new poster, and for our boards long term growth and usefulness as a communication platform.

It's in our best interests to give new folks the benefit of the doubt, just as we'd hope to be treated when wandering into a new community. Especially if we're asking for help and a safe haven to express ourselves and ask questions.

Sockpuppet itself is an insult, it's an attack on the credibility of the user, that they are not representing who they really are. The implication is that the user in question is being dishonest, or their original persona is unliked, or that they are being cowardly and expressing something their original persona would not say. As an ad hominem, it is not relevant to the debate.

We have no reason to think anyone on this board has some ulterior motive for being here that they need to conceal. You want a conspiracy theory? Not trusting each other will rip us apart long term, and I know this first hand.

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Sunday, January 17, 2010 4:37 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Well said, and you're 100% right. And I'm one of the dicks who was being an ass about it. Apologies to all.

We've gotten so intertwined in our own personal little battles that we're now seeing enemies where there are none, and it's shameful behavior. We're better than that, and we need to remember to BE better.

Thanks, Byte, for standing up for what's right.

And sorry, but your title just got screwed up, so I tried to correct it.

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Sunday, January 17, 2010 7:53 PM

BYTEMITE

It's okay, Kwicko. It doesn't make you an asshole, but it makes your personality different. You will have trouble with different things. There are some things that are asked that some people are just going to find difficult. For you, the sockpuppet thing became part of your snark factor. I recognize and even enjoy the snark factor part of your personality.

I can even understand being wary, I'm pretty wary myself a lot. Maybe it's about protecting ourselves and not letting people in, but then by doing so they're shut out in the cold. We have to be careful about that. That's all I'm saying. They're treading water, and I'm compelled to throw my hands in, and hope they catch hold so I can help pull them ashore.

>_> and, I can't deny that people have questioned if I'm two different people, I do have some vested interest here. But it really didn't bother me until yesterday and today. It hurts me somewhere, when I see someone asking for help, and just, you know. It'll get me into trouble someday, I know, I can be naive about answering the call. But it doesn't change the twisty tension feeling with the larynx and the sternohyroid.

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Sunday, January 17, 2010 8:03 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Ayep, that being one of my issues with it.

OTOH: I cut my teeth on ANSI text BBS's and can identify folk by their word and phrase choices, cadence of text and even misspellings much in the way telegraph operators can identify someone by the "fist" of the message, so if I call it, I'm usually pretty damned sure, mind you.

And I do give the benefit of the doubt, unless it's bloody OBVIOUS - because of the very problems you mention, which is what enrages me when folks use them as "backup" in an argument.

-F

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Sunday, January 17, 2010 11:22 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Also, yes... that need, to be NEEDED, also known as "Hero Complex" - it's one of the curses of being a Dark Spark, Byte, the damn near absolute inability to resist a call to aid by someone in real emotional distress because it echos your own pain and becomes an un-ignorable compulsion.

Just be glad you don't have it on the scale I do, resisting it being all but pointless, I chose to revel in it, Large Ham, side order of Cheese.

And I think that prolly just clued you in to the bloody reason for the dichotomy of an 'evil overlord' type whos purposes are anything but.

What's worse is that it's friggin REFLEX for us, even when there's real physical danger present, or your efforts may compound the situation, by the time coherent thought even catches up with you, you're already more than halfway there, and when "there" is a VERY dangerous situation, well....

-F

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Monday, January 18, 2010 4:44 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
>_> and, I can't deny that people have questioned if I'm two different people, I do have some vested interest here. But it really didn't bother me until yesterday and today.

Sorry if I offended you Byte, I hope you know that wasn't my intention. Yes, I was curious about you and DT, so I rather impulsively jumped in with both feet - seemed better that than to just suspect it and not say anything.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Monday, January 18, 2010 7:31 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Okay, I haven't yet gotten down to the thread where Littlebird appeared, so I'm guessing things happened there which instigated this thread...if I'm wrong, ignore me.

Everything you said is right on, dear, and I agree 100%. Before I came here (well, before the OB actually), I'd never encountered a sock puppet (my internet forums have been limited to places where it's very, very hard to make a sockpuppet)--when I learned they existed here and even that they might be used frequently, it put me in a place where I questioned everyone at first, and I remain "fragile" about new people arriving under certain circumstances. As I said, I wondered; my instant reaction is to welcome newcomers and not think beyond that, but coming there and here has made me wary--probably moreso than people who are used to dealing with the issue.

Frem, it would be incredibly helpful, since you said you can spot them, if you would just MENTION that someone is/might be a sockpuppet when you can. Just knowing it's possible and that there's someone who will let me know it is would help me more than I can say; it would let me go on reacting with my normal instincts--to welcome all newcomers and trust them until they do something to make me feel otherwise. I'd reeeely like to go back to feeling that way.

I may have more to say once I've read the thread in question, and if this thread wasn't born out of that, please forgive...it just seemed it was and that maybe it was directed at me for being suspicious.

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Monday, January 18, 2010 7:48 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

As a matter of personal policy, I treat every individually-identified poster as an individual, even if I suspect they're a sock puppet. As someone (was it you, BYTE?) said: even if you're addressing a sock puppet, you're STILL addressing the person behind the sock puppet. Personally, I don't care. I try to address the topic, not the person (although some peeps like Geezer have such a history with me that I veer off-course). Besides, I'm not that devious or that smart, so I kinda pick a strategy and stick with it, and taking people at their word is one of them. That way, I don't get tripped up on my own past behavior. Especially on a discussion forum, where it doesn't matter anyway!

BTW- I had a sock puppet for a bit- that was JKIDDO. I said earlier that it was me posting from a different computer... I regularly change my passwords and had simply not bothered to remember the SIGNYM password, and that particular PC insisted on remembering the old one. I made a point of remembering a changing the password on the PC, so my posts are now all under one name again.

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Monday, January 18, 2010 8:06 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I'm not apologizing for my paranoia, it's part of who I am. My instinct has always been to take everyone I meet at face value until something makes me feel otherwise, and it's gotten me "taken" at times, to the point of putting my husband and I in about $75,000 debt once. IRL, I don't usually mind being wrong, but that was a helluva sting. I'd rather trust people until I know otherwise and I continue to do so most of the time. But I have got an issue about sock puppets, I admit.

For me, it would be helpful if, in a situation such as what you described, someone would put "It's me, Byte, I just can't use my usual handle" in their tag line or something...BUT THAT'S JUST ME. That's what I did on a couple of occasions where I was stuck in the same situation as you mentioned. I do know it's my own issue, however, and don't ask anyone to do ANYTHING because of me.

I admit I'm beginning to feel defensive about having questioned whether someone is real or not, and somewhat guilty that I am unable to take everyone at face value here now, so I'll try to stop explaining myself.

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Monday, January 18, 2010 8:15 AM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Niki, everyone is different. I speak for me. I'm kinda stupid, yanno? I have to stick with certain rules of thumb 'cause I'm not smart enough to do otherwise. But that's just me.

FWIW, IRL we got taken too: Cautiously tried to help someone split off from her dysfunctional family. Put a some thousand behind the effort, too. Turns out, we could not exert enough of a pull to get her to leave that situation behind, so now she's circling the drain with the rest of her relatives.

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Monday, January 18, 2010 8:23 AM

FREMDFIRMA

The most amusing part of that, Siggy, was that knowing it was you, cause it was a continued conversation and you have a fairly unique style, I hadn't even caught it was a different username until much, much later - and since imho there wasn't any real attempt to hide it, given that you were continuing a conversation directly from one to the other, just shrugged it off, there's no malice in that - I never knew why, but figured it was something like that.

The ones that bother me are the ones who actively try to misrepresent themselves to support their own arguments, even to the point of TRYING (and mostly failing) to use a different style and vocabulary, for no other purpose than to support an argument which doesn't even hold it's own weight - that stopped bein a problem when mosta the rightwingnuts ran for the hills, but it was especially vile when the "arguments" were based on racial, religious, or ethnic intolerance...

I *WILL* come down with a bang on sockpuppetry of that type, but if there is no harm in it, generally try to avoid invading someones privacy.

Of course, pulling the rug out from under Mikey, and so quickly was both funny in it's own right, since I knew he'd take no offense, and serves well enough as notice to less savory puppetmasters as well.

I'll take someone as they are so long as there is no malice in it - I know at least one MPD chick elsewhere who has a seperate username for each mental "Faction" even though she is currently mid-fusion and they're aware of each other.

-F

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Monday, January 18, 2010 8:34 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
I *WILL* come down with a bang on sockpuppetry of that type, but if there is no harm in it, generally try to avoid invading someones privacy.

Thank you, Frem, I will relax now and leave it in your capable hands, and I'm MOST grateful! I, too, have no problem with sock puppets if they mean no harm.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 3:56 PM

KIRKULES

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
As a matter of personal policy, I treat every individually-identified poster as an individual, even if I suspect they're a sock puppet.

I think your policy is the only reasonable one possible given even a doubt about someone’s sock puppet status.

That said, I do think it is funny when sock puppets start threads about sock puppets (not necessarily referring to this thread). If I believed in multiple personality disorder, I would attribute it to a few around here given the vaguely familiar yet hard to pinpoint similarities between a few of the regulars around here lately.

It also amuses me that some claim clairvoyant powers to identify sock puppets, but only use that power to identify sock puppets that disagree with them. I similarly possess he power to identify witches with absolute certainty. The burden of being so super extra special is almost to much to bare.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:07 PM

BYTEMITE

I'm still not sure if that sock puppet is really a sock puppet. I've talked to both, and despite similar ideological beliefs, they seem to have completely different interests. One is very, very good at math. The other one I can't imagine doing algebra, let alone calculus. No offense, most of my friends IRL are artists, and they don't like math either.

Whoops, I'm talking about sock puppets. >_> Well, I could be accused of being a sock puppet of anyone. If I spend enough time around someone, I end up picking up their writing patterns. It takes a while out of their presence to return to something middle-road.

Ha, good point though. :) I guess when people contrast so much with us, similarities between them become more obvious than between people who agree with us.

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:23 PM

THATWEIRDGIRL

I wish I were a sock puppet. That would be kinda fun, no? I can picture all of us becoming sock puppets from some demented curse...how would we type? Perhaps a rainbow knee sock...or argyle.

I'd like to claim some funky unusual buttons right now. If we become sock puppets, make sure I don't get plain ol' white or black buttons. Thanks.

---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 5:30 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Spare me the whining, Kirk - they not only did it, but when backed into a corner, fucking admitted it.

Only reason I took so much issue with it was that they were getting so vile it was not only intolerable, but some of the crap they were advocating had the potential to bring legal trouble down on the site.

I find your timing and motives a bit questionable, but straight up, much as we didn't agree I never thought you were an active participant (pun oh so intended) in that garbage.

-F

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:12 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
I'm still not sure if that sock puppet is really a sock puppet. I've talked to both, and despite similar ideological beliefs, they seem to have completely different interests. One is very, very good at math. The other one I can't imagine doing algebra, let alone calculus. No offense, most of my friends IRL are artists, and they don't like math either.

Heck, I don't *like* math, either. But I force myself to study it, just to try to stay sharp. It's my worst subject, but truth be told, art IS math. :)

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:14 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by thatweirdgirl:
I wish I were a sock puppet. That would be kinda fun, no? I can picture all of us becoming sock puppets from some demented curse...how would we type? Perhaps a rainbow knee sock...or argyle.

I'd like to claim some funky unusual buttons right now. If we become sock puppets, make sure I don't get plain ol' white or black buttons. Thanks.

---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

Did someone say "rainbow knee sock"?

Sorry. Couldn't resist. :)

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Tuesday, January 19, 2010 7:33 PM

BYTEMITE

Sooo... Which part is the candy?

(I couldn't either)

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Saturday, January 23, 2010 1:59 PM

SIMONWHO

Okay, I admit it, PirateNews is my sockpuppet - it was a joke that just got out of hand.

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Saturday, January 23, 2010 3:38 PM

THATWEIRDGIRL

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Okay, I admit it, PirateNews is my sockpuppet - it was a joke that just got out of hand.

If only that were true...

---
Sometimes I lie awake at night, and I ask, "Where have I gone wrong?" Then a voice says to me, "This is going to take more than one night."
-- Charlie Brown
www.thatcostumegirl.com
www.thatweirdgirl.com

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Monday, January 25, 2010 3:02 PM

JAMERON4EVA

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Okay, I admit it, PirateNews is my sockpuppet - it was a joke that just got out of hand.

YOU'RE PIRATENEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A nice guy like you, PIRATENEWS. Hey, least you're keeping us entertained.

PN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

"Mom, he has her chip. He has her."
John Connor,"Born To Run", TSCC EP 2x22

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Monday, January 25, 2010 3:58 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by jameron4eva:
Quote:
Originally posted by SimonWho:
Okay, I admit it, PirateNews is my sockpuppet - it was a joke that just got out of hand.

YOU'RE PIRATENEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! A nice guy like you, PIRATENEWS. Hey, least you're keeping us entertained.

PN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

"Mom, he has her chip. He has her."
John Connor,"Born To Run", TSCC EP 2x22

It was a joke. In order for SimonWho to be PN, he'd have to change his username to SimonJews.

Try to keep up, Jameron. *I* have a sockpuppet; it's The Spelling Fairy. There are a few other sockpuppets around here, some known, some as yet undiscovered, some merely suspected, but Simon is NOT PirateNews. I'd put money on that.

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 4:07 AM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
*I* have a sockpuppet; it's The Spelling Fairy.

I created an account called 'Grammar' once, in response to all the hate for grammar-nazis. I was going to go through horribly written posts, edit them, and re-post them. I promptly forgot all about it, and can't remember what email I used. Sad story. I'm glad you also made a voice to speak for all of us

[/sig]

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