Jesus Rifles: another success for government regulation? by NewOldBrownCoat

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Jesus Rifles: another success for government regulation?

POSTED BY: NEWOLDBROWNCOAT
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 26, 2010 08:56
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Friday, January 22, 2010 4:55 PM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"... what language in the Constitution prohibited people from putting references to the Bible on their products ..."

When they spec and sell their products to the government, doooood.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Friday, January 22, 2010 5:01 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"... what language in the Constitution prohibited people from putting references to the Bible on their products ..."

When they spec and sell their products to the government, doooood.

Provide a cite.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Friday, January 22, 2010 5:07 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"The First Amendment's Establishment Clause prohibits the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” This clause not only forbids the government from establishing an official religion, but also prohibits government actions that unduly favor one religion over another. It also prohibits the government from unduly preferring religion over non-religion, or non-religion over religion.?"

And while I have a very nice link, I'm not going to post it. You can use google to find where it came from. Otherwise, you have your cite. Now go away.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Friday, January 22, 2010 5:40 PM

GEEZER

Keep the Shiny side up

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"The First Amendment's Establishment Clause prohibits the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” This clause not only forbids the government from establishing an official religion, but also prohibits government actions that unduly favor one religion over another. It also prohibits the government from unduly preferring religion over non-religion, or non-religion over religion.?"

And while I have a very nice link, I'm not going to post it. You can use google to find where it came from. Otherwise, you have your cite. Now go away.

Okay, pretty much what I expected.

First, give any evidence that the government failing to find religious references on equipment they buy is "establishing an official religion".

Second, cite anything in the Constitution that prohibits a private business from putting religious references on anything they sell. The First Amendment would seem to prohibit that. If the government doesn't want to buy items with religious references on them, they should either specicify that in their tenders for submission of products, or find it in their evaluation of the product and request a change.

As usual, you're seeing conspiracies where none exist.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

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Friday, January 22, 2010 6:50 PM

FREMDFIRMA

I do find it just a little ironic that all the references seem to be to "light", and a scopes function is to "light the way" for a bullet.

I think folks are still makin too much of it, pro and con, honestly.

-F

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Monday, January 25, 2010 10:14 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Is Chik-Fil-A supplying meals to our troops in Iraq and Afghanistan now? (And I guarantee you they aren't on Sundays!)

If not its a shame...our troops deserve the best sniper scopes and chicken.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.

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Monday, January 25, 2010 10:15 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"If its a good product why discriminate?"

It's called the constitution. You should check it out some time.

The Constitution is silent on the issue of sniper rifles.

There is a long history of this sort of thing. Remember the bombs painted with funny slogans...

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.

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Monday, January 25, 2010 10:17 AM

WULFENSTAR

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

I wonder if they said something like:

"Heres the answer to the enemies of free people."

Would folks have a problem with it?

Probably.

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Monday, January 25, 2010 10:25 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"The First Amendment's Establishment Clause prohibits the government from making any law “respecting an establishment of religion.” This clause not only forbids the government from establishing an official religion, but also prohibits government actions that unduly favor one religion over another. It also prohibits the government from unduly preferring religion over non-religion, or non-religion over religion.?"

You are correct in your interpretation, but incorrect in your application.

Can you show me a better sniper scope that favors another faith or no faith at all? Unless you can show that the govt chose the scopes because of the scripture citations, then your argument does not hold water. You can't argue that they are unduly favoring someone unless they are in fact unduly favoring them in some fashion. Just because a Chistian company benfits from a fairly bid govt contract, does not, absent other evidence, mean that its being established or unduly favored. I guarrantee that if we wanted suicide vests then the best ones probably have some Koran verses on them.

In fact you are arguing that the government should "unduly" discriminate against religious companies and products by failing to choose products that may or may not have a religious connection of some kind regardless of the quaility or price.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.

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Monday, January 25, 2010 12:16 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"If its a good product why discriminate?"

It's called the constitution. You should check it out some time.

The Constitution is silent on the issue of sniper rifles.

Then it's a good thing we aren't discussing sniper rifles, isn't it? The ACOG scope is a 4x32 "red dot" scope that Trijicon makes for the military's M16/M4 family of assault rifles. The M16/M4 is in no way to be confused with a "sniper" rifle, as it lacks both the range AND the accuracy needed for such a weapon, not to mention the lack of ballistic energy (kinetic energy) to really do the job.

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Monday, January 25, 2010 1:00 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
God makes us shoot straight.

Absolutely hysterical!

Quote:
But I say that its sad that you refuse to even acknowledge that there might, MIGHT, be a higher power, greater than yourself.

Can't speak for Mike, but my not believing in organized religion doesn't mean I don't believe there might be a higher power; it means I don't believe in a "god" standing over your shoulder, making you shoot straight, or in a religion run by humans that supposedly interprets for him. "With god on our side" simply translates into "my god is bigger and badder than your god", and is merely an instigation to murder because you're "right". Bullshit.

For the rest of that, I'll just say "What Mike said".

Quote:
Second, cite anything in the Constitution that prohibits a private business from putting religious references on anything they sell. The First Amendment would seem to prohibit that. If the government doesn't want to buy items with religious references on them, they should either specicify that in their tenders for submission of products, or find it in their evaluation of the product and request a change.

You just said it; nothing in the Constitution prohibits PRIVATE business from putting religious references on their product; the GOVERNMENT is prohibited from utilizing religious references; they missed it, now it's been brought to their attention they requested a change; said change is apparently being made. End of story.

Quote:
Just because a Chistian company benfits from a fairly bid govt contract, does not, absent other evidence, mean that its being established or unduly favored.

Has nothing to do with a Christian COMPANY; has to do with their product.

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Monday, January 25, 2010 1:36 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
I guarrantee that if we wanted suicide vests then the best ones probably have some Koran verses on them.

Actually, I think some of the best "suicide vests" right now are being made in the USA, and supposedly are bullet resistant, but in reality their ceramic plates tend to shatter pretty easily, and our soldiers view wearing them as a bit of a suicide mission.

But I suppose your god just hates those soldiers. Man, he sure does seem to have a hard-on for killing American kids, doesn't he? Why does god hate our troops?

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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 5:19 AM

HERO

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
The M16/M4 is in no way to be confused with a "sniper" rifle, as it lacks both the range AND the accuracy needed for such a weapon, not to mention the lack of ballistic energy (kinetic energy) to really do the job.

Modern Warfare 2...

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.

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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 7:47 AM

OUT2THEBLACK

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
I wonder if they said something like:

"Here's the answer to the enemies of free people."

Would folks have a problem with it?

Probably.

Good point , Wulf...You've made a lot of good points in this thread .

Illegitimati non carborundum

"...Great robbers punish little ones to keep them in their obedience; but the great ones are rewarded with laurels and triumphs, because they are too big for the weak hands of justice in this world, and have the power in their own possession which should punish offenders."

--John Locke - 1632-1704 - The Second Treatise of Civil Government , 1690

http://www.constitution.org/jl/2ndtreat.htm

"American preachers have a task more difficult, perhaps, than those faced by us under South Africa's apartheid, or Christians under Communism.

We had obvious evils to engage; you have to unwrap your culture from years of red, white and blue myth. You have to expose, and confront, the great disconnect between the kindness, compassion and caring of most American people, and the ruthless way American power is experienced, directly and indirectly, by the poor of the earth.

You have to help good people see how they have let their institutions do their sinning for them. This is not easy among people who really believe that their country does nothing but good, but it is necessary, not only for their future, but for us all." --Peter Storey, former president of the Methodist Church of South Africa

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Tuesday, January 26, 2010 8:56 AM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
The M16/M4 is in no way to be confused with a "sniper" rifle, as it lacks both the range AND the accuracy needed for such a weapon, not to mention the lack of ballistic energy (kinetic energy) to really do the job.

Modern Warfare 2...

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.

Seriously? You're actually basing your working knowledge off a video game?

Heck, why don't we just deploy the X-02 Wyvern for ultimate air superiority? ;)

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