Psycho says: 'You Don’t Ever Touch a Cop!' by piratenews

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Psycho says: 'You Don’t Ever Touch a Cop!'

POSTED BY: PIRATENEWS
UPDATED: Wednesday, February 17, 2010 18:56
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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 11:41 AM

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!

Father arrested at crash scene for answering questions by paramedic for dying son
http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/50610.html

Father of Path Valley crash victim faces charges over incident on the scene with Pennsylvania State Police
http://www.publicopiniononline.com/ci_14399217

Father Faces 10 Years After Altercation With Pennsylvania Officers at Scene of Son’s Car Crash
http://jonathanturley.org/2010/02/16/father-faces-10-years-after-alter
cation-with-pennsylvania-officers-at-scene-of-sons-car-crash/

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 11:50 AM

BYTEMITE

Quote:
And it’s also worth questioning what percentage of newer cops come from a combat-military background after 8+ years (and counting) of churning out war/survival-experienced soldiers back in to civillian life – while I love the military and all the sacrifice that is made for our country, I do not necessarily want my local law enforcement ’serving the public’ having the mindset of us-versus-them from a militaristic ’secure the situation at all costs’ approach.

Says it all.

EDIT: Well, except I never asked anyone to die for me. That always makes me feel a little bit troubled. And that sometimes I don't really want the military "representing" me, because their interests and my interests in a given region don't tend to be the same.

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 1:47 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
Quote:
And it’s also worth questioning what percentage of newer cops come from a combat-military background after 8+ years (and counting) of churning out war/survival-experienced soldiers back in to civillian life – while I love the military and all the sacrifice that is made for our country, I do not necessarily want my local law enforcement ’serving the public’ having the mindset of us-versus-them from a militaristic ’secure the situation at all costs’ approach.

Says it all.

Reminds me of a Bill Hicks line from the FIRST Gulf War:

"I'm in a curious position about the Iraq War, because I support the war, but hate the troops."

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 1:58 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

The only thing missing from this story was a Taser or two. And that would SURELY bring out Geezer, Hero, (that weird buzzing noise), et al in support of the police.

What I don't get is why the RCMP has such a well-deserved reputation overall, while the US police have such a bad one. What are we doing wrong here ?

***************************************************************

"Come to LA and we'll treat you like a King !"

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 2:15 PM

KWICKO

What are we doing wrong? Well, for starters, we're letting them get away with referring to themselves as law ENFORCEMENT. Sorry, but when you start calling them "enforcement" and stating that they're in the business of ENFORCING the laws, they actually start to think that way. And part of ENFORCEMENT involves FORCE.

Then we have that whole "thin blue line" thing, where cops will always, ALWAYS back up cops. Their first instinct when faced with any kind of unkind words towards their "finest" is to deny outright, then whitewash, and finally, ONLY under the harshest limelight, will they EVER admit that maybe they could have done things a little differently.

ETA: And because THIS is the image of the cops that too many people have, because they seem to have cultivated it themselves:

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 2:53 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Name change goes only so far I think. For example: where I work many departments had their names changed from 'service' to 'management', or some other. The 'Information Services Department' was changed to 'Information Mangement' - and they are just as lousy as ever. Meanwhile the 'Enforcement' branch was changed to 'Compliance'. If anything, it made the word 'compliance' look even extremely coercive.

So a 'Police Service' might be just as bad as the 'Armed Services'.

I seem to recall that there was a head of the CHP who was determined to turn it around. And unbelievably, he DID change an entire existing culture. It used to be, as I was told, the epitome of everything bad that you associate with cops. But decades after his tenure, their reputation is still pretty good.

If anyone could figure out WHAT he did, maybe that would be good to emulate.

Police aren't the only organization that needs a new start.

The local county hopital here has undergone a series of administrative turnovers, worker firings, operational changes, specific regulations, oversight etc - all to no effect. Nothing seems to make a dent. A similar effort is now in place in a hospital across the country where I used to work decades ago. Back then the EMTs used to call it Sloppy Joe's. I THINK it's improving, but slowly, and only after getting rid of the entire administration and replacing almost everyone from the top on down. And STILL it's only SLOWLY changing.

I really wonder what it would take to change the police in-place, like was done with the CHP.

And after that - we can start on the banking, pharma and insurance industries !

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 3:16 PM

KWICKO

I'll defer to Frem's expertise in this area, but he taught me one thing about it: Adhere to Robert Peel's principles, and the toughest part of the battle is already won:

Quote:
The nine principles by Sir Robert Peel

The basic mission for which the police exist is to prevent crime and disorder.

The ability of the police to perform their duties is dependent upon public approval of police actions.

Police must secure the willing co-operation of the public in voluntary observance of the law to be able to secure and maintain the respect of the public.

The degree of co-operation of the public that can be secured diminishes proportionately to the necessity of the use of physical force.

Police seek and preserve public favour not by catering to public opinion but by constantly demonstrating absolute impartial service to the law.

Police use physical force to the extent necessary to secure observance of the law or to restore order only when the exercise of persuasion, advice and warning is found to be insufficient.

Police, at all times, should maintain a relationship with the public that gives reality to the historic tradition that the police are the public and the public are the police; the police being only members of the public who are paid to give full-time attention to duties which are incumbent on every citizen in the interests of community welfare and existence

Police should always direct their action strictly towards their functions and never appear to usurp the powers of the judiciary.

The test of police efficiency is the absence of crime and disorder, not the visible evidence of police action in dealing with it.

Rule Number One: The police are YOUR employees, not the other way 'round.

And once we get THAT sorted out, maybe we can teach it to Congress! :)

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 3:23 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
The only thing missing from this story was a Taser or two. And that would SURELY bring out Geezer, Hero, (that weird buzzing noise), et al in support of the police.

What I don't get is why the RCMP has such a well-deserved reputation overall, while the US police have such a bad one. What are we doing wrong here ?

***************************************************************

"Come to LA and we'll treat you like a King !"

Not lately Rue,

they have been tasering everyone in sight the last few years, and that has driven their public view into the ground...

this is one of the worse incidents, but not the most outrageous

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2007/11/14/bc-taservid
eo.html

Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 3:37 PM

RUE

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"... they have been tasering everyone in sight the last few years, and that has driven their public view into the ground..."

Drat. Dudley is dead.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 4:29 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"... they have been tasering everyone in sight the last few years, and that has driven their public view into the ground..."

Drat. Dudley is dead.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

New Commissioner, hopefully the incidents force him to take steps to deal with what has become a culture of abusive behavior.

I even know a couple of RCMP members, and they were as pissed off as anybody...

With a little effort, some retraining, and a few attitude adjustments I think the problem is a fixable one...

The problem down in the states ...

whole lot bigger culture, look at cop shows on TV

think of these as what recruits people into a profession, then once there the attitude spreads out right...

American Cop Shows

Canadian Cop Show

If you watch this one, the use of violence is the last resort, they talk people down, if that doesn't work they try a non lethal response, and only lethal force if someone is going to die if they don't.

It is the ideal type of thing, I realize it isn't always so cut and dried, but damn it this should be the goal.

Instead of get that asshole or whatever Seagal says, the lead guy says lets keep the peace... isn't that more what we want as a society ?

Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 4:53 PM

FREMDFIRMA

STEP ONE - Peelian Principles, as Mikey has noted.

STEP TWO - As an assignment of those principles, make police subject to EVERY SINGLE BLOODY NITPICK of the law they enforce upon us, specifically including weapons regs, let's see how sensible THEY think it when they have to keep their service weapon in the trunk with the ammo in a seperate, also locked, box...

STEP THREE - Accountability, make them fully accountable to a civilian review board drawn from the community, for their actions within that community, let the people being "serviced" decide whether they are being assisted or abused.

STEP FOUR - Real penalty, a police officer is the public face of law and order, of the civil government, and has sworn an oath to obey and uphold the law, as such, should they flagrantly and deliberately violate said law during the course of their profession (as oppose to off-duty) they should without reservation, automatically face the MAXIMUM penalty for the crime, if not an additional sentencing for "under cover of law" if the criminal act was in direct relation to their duties.

STEP FIVE - Hit them where it hurts, every lawsuit, penalty, damages and the like assessed against the department or it's officers shall be applied directly to the departments budget alone, no kiting it off to the general fund, and even if the judgement is against a specific officer the department bears responsibility for their conduct and as such should carry appropriate penalty, and if a continuing pattern of misbehavior exists, then clearly they are not providing the services they are billing for and a budget cut is justified.

I'll note that this is EXACTLY what has been happening to our local PD, and after the double-whammy of the lawsuits, budget cut, and SECOND budget cut when they had the nerve to make vague threats in public editorials about what might happen if they didn't get a budget increase, their behavior has turned around quick, but not completely...

See, we found out not long ago they've had a blatantly illegal ticket quota as official policy since 2008, and BEEN LYING ABOUT IT ALL THIS TIME, with threats and gag orders concealing it, till a dispute over an officer not meeting it cause they were busy investigating an actual crime brought in a private arbitration firm (the same one I once threatened City Council of my former township with) who was NOT under a gag order, who then told the press, at which point the quota was struck down...

And yanno, I smell ANOTHER budget cut coming, I believe I do.
If they will not do the job, or prefer robbing/extorting to protecting the public, well then the public can decide NOT to bloody pay for it, then!

Worth a note that every police dept from here to my former township is up to it's ass in deep shit right now, and the one in between has just been called out for having 300% more officers than any township in the state that size, who are paid comparitively 250% more, in an area with the lowest crime rate for fifteen miles around...
AND happens to be some of the most rabidly ticket and forfeiture happy bastards in the state!

You can just HEAR the budget axe being sharpened all the way from here.

And although it may seem counter-intuitive, making them personally and financially accountable has *SUBSTANTIALLY* improved their behavior, although it's not as easy as that to turn around years of them being allowed to act as petty little Lords, but the positive impact cannot be denied...

Which brings us to...

STEP SIX - Personal judgement, it makes no sense to hire police if you cannot trust their judgement, and if you do, then it makes even less to never let them use it.
By making more and more "crimes" a must-arrest situation and removing the power of judgement from the officer on the street, a certain tension is created where the officer is GOING to be treated like an invading army cause no one can ever TRUST them with anything, nor should they!
I mean, really, who is the old man with the 40oz on his porch "harming" with his mild public intoxication, he's not GOING anywhere, not gonna DUI, and about the worst he's likely to do is hand out a "back in my day.." speech, so why exactly do you *HAVE* to arrest him, eh ?
That's just pickin shit, it is.

Alternatively.

STEP SIX (Alt) - Thin Red Line, if the police refuse to cooperate with the community, the community should refuse to cooperate with police, treating every encounter like they really are, as PN calls em "Public death squads", and limiting compliance to the absolute gun-to-the-head minimum necessary to get the hell AWAY from them without injury/arrest.

We have something in between here at Site Three, as unless having a proveable, valid reason to be here, responding to an emergency or having been called by a resident, they're neither welcome nor wanted here - this is both a reminder of past bad behavior and a "turf issue" for us, since we're HERE because they could not or would not protect this community, and yet seemed quite happy to victimize it on quota day by driving around spotlighting license plates, even though such is illegal on private property.

They acknowledged this with good grace, and while not exactly happy about being rapped on the knuckles like that, understand that our presence saves them the necessity of patrolling here, allowing them to spend more effort on higher crime areas, so we have a mutual professional understanding - they DO know we're professionals and not yahoos or cop-wannabes, which limits any potential conflict since our jobs do not overlap as much as folk might think.

Anyhow, that's all I got time for at the moment.

-F

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 5:55 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Oh yeah, and Always Blow on the Pie...

http://www.news.com.au/world/always-blow-on-the-pie-advice-a-hit-for-k
iwi-cop/story-e6frfkyi-1225792410987

This officer is Kiwi, not Canadian, but the laid back attitude is similar.

Seriously, in comparison with the friggin *atttitude* of american cops, which is why americans find this so humorous, mind you - even the worst of the RCMP are comparatively polite and decent, they have their bad seeds, true, but my dealings with em up till recently have been quite pleasant.

If that had been the DPD, they would have tackled him into the wall, pancaked him, worked him over with a bit of the boot and then tasered him fifteen times and attributed the sudden custody death to that mystery ailment "excited delirium", about like usual.

Yeah, american cops are insane.

-Frem

PS - To Pancake (police slang): Have the largest, heaviest available officer leap onto the suspect repeatedly in an attempt to injure them in a fully-deniable way.

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 5:55 PM

KWICKO

Quote:

And although it may seem counter-intuitive, making them personally and financially accountable has *SUBSTANTIALLY* improved their behavior, although it's not as easy as that to turn around years of them being allowed to act as petty little Lords, but the positive impact cannot be denied...

That one stands out especially, Frem (although they're ALL fantastic ideas).

But this one ISN'T counter-intuitive, at least not to me, in my daily job. I enacted it myself, unilaterally, in my current job. I told everyone there that *I* am responsible for every single thing that ships out of my warehouse. MY name is on it, and my good word, and if there's a problem, I'm going to investigate, I'm going to be checked, and I'm going to get to the bottom of it, and if it's my fuck-up, I'm paying for it out of MY pocket.

That met strong resistance from every single person in the business, because they knew I was setting a performance example that THEY might be asked to live up to. But I've done it, and I've told them that this is MY choice, MY way of making ME do the job right, and they can join me or not, but I'm documenting mistakes, and we'll see how it works out.

And to date, I've had two screwups in 4 years, just plain bone-headed mistakes, and I've plunked money down on my boss's desk, which she's repaid about 50-fold in performance bonuses. :)

So yeah, I'll put my money where my mouth is, because I'm going to come out ahead if I'm doing my job better, and everybody else wins too - especially the paying customers, which is what we all are where the cops are concerned, right?

And this is part of what I had in mind when I posted a while back about the red-light camera locator App for the iPhone, and the speed-trap App, and all the rest of it. The cops are pissed about it all, but WHY? If it gets people into compliance, ISN'T THAT WHAT THEY WANT?! WASN'T THAT THEIR MAIN PRIORITY, ACCORDING TO THEM?!

They're pissed because it exposes 'em for what they are: a protection racket, an extortion ring, a true Donut Mafia. They give two shits about safety or compliance - what they REALLY want is YOUR MONEY. And the worst part is, it shows.

Mike

Work is the curse of the Drinking Class.
- Oscar Wilde

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 6:10 PM

GINOBIFFARONI

How would US airport cops handle this one ?

Smelly passenger removed from plane

An American who hoped to travel on a flight from Charlottetown to Montreal earlier this month was removed from the plane because he smelled.

'The safety and comfort of our passengers are certainly our top priorities.'— Manon Stuart, Air Canada Jazz

The Air Canada Jazz flight was waiting for takeoff when some passengers complained about the odour. Efforts were made to isolate the man from other passengers, but flight officials eventually decided to ask him to get off the plane.

"Because of privacy reasons, I really can't provide specific information on the passenger who was involved or the reason for the deplanement. But I can confirm that there was one passenger deplaned from our flight," Manon Stuart, a spokesperson for Air Canada Jazz, told CBC News Wednesday.

"As an airline, the safety and comfort of our passengers are certainly our top priorities, so any situation that is perceived as a threat to either the safety or the comfort of our passengers is taken seriously."

It's the pilot's decision whether to fly if there is a problem. Charlottetown airport officials said they were notified of the incident.

The man, who was visiting P.E.I., was allowed to travel on another flight the next morning

Read more: http://www.cbc.ca/canada/prince-edward-island/story/2010/02/17/pei-air
plane-passenger-body-odour-584.html#ixzz0frD1VMmk

A foreigner with a strange odor....

Taser + FBI + Holding Tank Maybe

Think I'm kidding ?

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/feb/11/local/la-me-arabic12-2010feb12

Arabic-language flashcards don't fly with TSA
A Pomona College student from Philadelphia was jailed after airport security workers found study cards, including the words 'bomb' and 'terrorism.' He's suing.
February 11, 2010|By Larry Gordon

Nicholas George planned to brush up on his Arabic vocabulary during a flight in August from Philadelphia to California, where he was to start his senior year at Pomona College. So he carried some Arabic-English flashcards in his pocket to study on the plane.

But those flashcards changed George's life far beyond the classroom. The 22-year-old from Pennsylvania is speaking out against what he contends are abuses by federal authorities in airport security measures.
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George, a physics major who is considering a career as a U.S. diplomat in the Middle East, is suing the Transportation Security Administration, the FBI and Philadelphia police for jailing him after his flashcards were found and confiscated in a Philadelphia airport screening. His lawsuit, filed in federal court this week, said his four hours in detention, half of that in handcuffs, violated his rights to free speech and protection against unreasonable search and seizure.

"I feel the TSA acts like it has a blank check as long as what it does is in the name of fighting terrorism," George, said Thursday from Claremont, where he lives in a dormitory. "Of course, the TSA's job is to keep us safe -- but they have to follow the Constitution and respect rights."

If his flashcards triggered such deep suspicion, George said, "then we've got a real 1st Amendment issue here. I have a right to study Arabic."

The student acknowledged that a few of the vocabulary words, including "bomb" and "terrorism," may have alarmed authorities, but he also said he needed to learn them in order to understand the news of the day in Arabic-language newspapers.

George said his interest in Arab culture began when he saw "Lawrence of Arabia" as a child. "The more I studied it, the more I was fascinated it by it," he said. He plans to take the State Department exam to become a foreign service officer.

Last year, George spent a semester in Jordan, where he studied Arabic, and then traveled to Egypt, Ethiopia and Sudan. He said his passport, with stamps from those countries, and a book in his possession that was critical of U.S. foreign policy, may also have raised suspicions at the airport.

Professors describe George as an excellent student in science and Arabic.

"He's sharp and he's really interested in the language, interested in the culture. He loves to pick up expressions and idioms," said Bassam Frangieh, a professor of Arabic at Claremont McKenna College, where George takes classes through the Claremont Colleges consortium

Either you Are with the terrorists, or ... you Are with the terrorists

Life is like a jar of Jalapeño peppers.
What you do today, might Burn Your Ass Tomorrow"

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Wednesday, February 17, 2010 6:56 PM

FREMDFIRMA

http://www.legendaryusa.com/Donut_Police_Patch_p/hp8275.htm

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