How to spin your issue: Health care by Niki2

America loves a winner!

Sig,

its clear that I'm dealing with someone less informed and more motivated by insults than fact and honest debate. I'm not going anywhere, but I'm wasting my time w/ such a deluded and comitted socialist as you.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:01 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Yup, Piz, I agree. Nonetheless what's proposed isn't "gov't-run", it's a few restrictions on insurance companies, which, as I said above, won't kill the ins. companies; it hasn't in other countries. What's proposed are regulations to curb outlandish actions; even "public option" would be only PAID FOR by the government. The only true "government-run" would be single payer--and even THAT has allowed for-profit insurance companies to exist, as is shown by other countries' solutions.

And yes, I mentioned too that extra tests are sometimes justified by fear of lawsuits; some kind of tort reform IS needed, but that's a tightrope I wouldn't want to walk!

And yup, even the figures originally quoted LAUD the care people get under Medicare by inference, so that alone calls into question the validity of using them as an argument for the US style, as it shows our "public option" works great.

Did anyone else hear some kind of mumble about being unininformed? Did that come from someone whose only source thus far has been defeated? Does that mumble have anything more pertinent to add which shows they ARE informed? Or is it just another attempt to turn the discussion into a snark fest? Or did I hear it wrong? Posted about the ravens down at Wildcare who learned to mimic human speech, maybe that was it...I can't tell the difference sometimes...it's such an incoherent mumble.

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:10 AM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.

Auraptor, I don't know if it's a short attention span or what, but there have been a whole host of valid and reasonable arguments made against your position, and everyone here is yet to see you counter them.

I don't like the personal nature of some of the comments against you, but at the same time be aware that your inability to face opposing facts and logic puts you about on an intellectual par with PirateNews - it's impossible for anyone here to show you when you're wrong, and you end up as just a similar kind of loud, un-debatable irritation.

Heads should roll

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:10 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
less informed and more motivated by insults

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Less informed! That's a hoot!

So, strippping the insults out of my posts, would you care to respond to the various facts and logic that I've put forth? Or are you just going to go into a snit-fit?

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:11 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"However, in fairness it has to be added that part of the impetus for too many tests is fear of legal complications, as well."

No.

The long answer is that the expensive health care is in McAllen, Texas - which PASSED tort reform and has next to no lawsuits adding to expense - or to defensiveness in medicine.

However, as the article pointed out, doctors which view their practice of medicine more in terms of incomes and less in terms of outcomes (and there are two measures of that) DO take part in maximal practice of their medicine. Whereas doctors who receive a flat salary - the Mayo Clinic is one but the article points to other examples as well - practice less but better medicine.

In sum, lawsuits are not driving excessive, expensive, and dangerous medicine.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:13 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Rue; good point, thank you. Didn't see the specifics you mentioned. Still believe, however, that it IS the motivation in some cases (or the added motivation?). Here in CA, having more lawyers per capita than any other state, it's a valid point nonetheless, trust me, if you can, 'cuz I don't think I can prove it with cites, only with knowledge of my state.

Piz, are you pissing into the wind? If so, move upwind, dear; snit fits don't warrant getting anything messy on your clothes. Let'em piss into their OWN wind, maybe?

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:30 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Quote:
less informed and more motivated by insults
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Less informed! That's a hoot!

So, strippping the insults out of my posts, would you care to respond to the various facts and logic that I've put forth? Or are you just going to go into a snit-fit?

Well, he DID say he's not going anywhere; I took that to mean INTELLECTUALLY he's not going anywhere. And he's right - he hasn't grown a bit or gone anywhere in all the years he's been here.

And my money is on "snit-fit". He won't respond to facts, because he's got his own facts, which carry not only the weight of their being RapFacts (and therefore superior to the mere FACTUAL facts), but they also carry the considerable weight of HIS OWN OPINION, which is worth more than ANY truth, in him mind. ;)

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:37 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Are you positive they're the person's own opinions, Mike? All too often they seem like just blatant echoing of the worst right-wing talking points, so I often wonder if there's any "opinion" involved, rather than just parroting.

Are you sure it's just snit-fitting, or that a casual search through the internet for something to post which, when nullified, leaves the person nowhere to go, so what looks like snit-fitting is actually a way to get out of actual debating? If so, think how sad it is; one happens across something that seems definitive, cries "ah-HAH!", puts it up, has it torn apart, and has no opinion of their own or facts to back up their point. What is one uneducated enough who doesn't wish to debate do, but try to sidetrack the thread by claiming superior intelligence and snarking, then claiming all others are unintelligent and run like hell? Must be awfully frustrating, to think you've got the perfect comeback then see it knocked down, don'tcha think?

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:39 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Mike, if I don't add to your post its bc I'm trying so hard to be good....

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:44 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"Gov run agencies are incredibly inefficient ..."

Government agencies are extremely efficient. Somewhere, and I'd have to look it up, I read that Medicare has a 1-2% overhead, while private medical INSURANCE companies ALONE have a 30% overhead of profit and paperwork. And private hospitals and doctors and other services add their overhead as well. All together, private sector healthcare is extremely INefficient, ESPECIALLY compared to government.

... "I witness it all the time with a family member's Medicare."

The problem with Medicare, and there is a problem, stems from two things that I know of (and there may be more).

One is that doctors, hospitals labs and other diagnostic facilities, rehab facilities et al were treating it as the bottomless bankroll. It's that old problem of the role of profit, but with government as the sugar-daddy. To be boringly explicit, they ran more tests, did more teatments and surgeries, brought in more specialists, and so on.
The government tried to solve that back in the 80s with DRGs - diagnosis related groups. Depending on which category of diagnosis the patient fell under, the government would only pay so much money, and no more.
There were and are many problems related to the concept, for example, if a patient came in with TWO diagnoses - congestive heart failure AND diabetic foot ulcer - the least expensive one was reimbursed while the other was not.
Since then DRGs have been expanded to medical testing. And recently, Medicare decided to NOT pay for iatrogenic (medically-caused) infection, b/c, as the theory goes, there never should be any if proper procedures are followed. And why should Medicare pay for sloppy work ?

The OTHER problem is that the greedy republicans, and some cowardly democrats, have been trying to gut Medicare for all this time, with quite a bit of success. At this point reimbursement is so low it doesn't even cover costs in many cases.

Between the two of those, there are complicated rules that have been built into medical billing procedures, for not enough reimbursement.

"Fwiw, I've also heard Dr.s say they will run extra tests because they are afraid of being sued if they aren't thorough enough."

What is driving up costs is the malpractice INSURANCE. HOWEVER - in places where there has been tort reform or restrictions placed on the ability to sue - Texas and NYC - insurance rates have not stopped and continue to climb in step with insurance rates in the rest of the country.
I leave you to decide who is a fault on that one.

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Silence is consent.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 9:52 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

Piz, are you pissing into the wind? If so, move upwind, dear; snit fits don't warrant getting anything messy on your clothes. Let'em piss into their OWN wind, maybe?

Niki, - is that like some miner 49'er colloquialism? I'm not sure what it means but it sounds condescending as hell. If it is then stuff it up yer pazootie. If not, forgive my lack of knowledge of west coast slang.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:11 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Good point Rue, I'd forgotten it's the malpractice INSURANCE causing the real problem. Duhhh..

Piz, if you're asking the mening of "pissing into the wind", it's a coloquialism I thought most people knew. Means kind of "wasting your effort" or doing something that brings no good results--closest I can get, I'm afraid.

But no, doll, I'm just teasing. The threads at the top have become funny, to me, in their (somewhat) effort to deal with what I call the wind. So I've gotten into teasing mode, and I'm having trouble stopping. I should click on some more substantial issues, hopefully with that "wind" not in them.

Certainly no offense was intended, I assure you.

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:15 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Rue, appreciate the info, I don't dispute any of your data - with the exception of what "inefficient" may mean, as in it's not just money but how the system works. If anyone has been to their local DMV any time recently then surely that's an example of a Gov agency that is the nightmare scenario. Who's to say that wouldn't be Gov. Health Care?

The point I was trying to make was that having Great Ideas is not always enough, and one side doesn't have monopoly on them. It's how they're implemented that can have the most effect on success. How do you motivate workers and management? Profit? Attaboys? I think your Mayo clinic example is uplifting and hopeful, but not everywhere is the Mayo Clinic, has that kind of cache - that alone can motivate, I'm not sure that's something you can just replicate in other places.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:24 AM

PIZMOBEACH

... fully loaded, safety off...

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

Piz, if you're asking the mening of "pissing into the wind", it's a coloquialism I thought most people knew. Means kind of "wasting your effort" or doing something that brings no good results--closest I can get, I'm afraid.

But no, doll, I'm just teasing. The threads at the top have become funny, to me, in their (somewhat) effort to deal with what I call the wind. So I've gotten into teasing mode, and I'm having trouble stopping. I should click on some more substantial issues, hopefully with that "wind" not in them.

Certainly no offense was intended, I assure you.

Ahhh, wasn't sure of the context it was meant, thx. I love this place when it's about exchanging ideas, but when it gets snarky and full of insults, uh, less so. I think we can learn more if we include everyone. But, hey, what do I know.

Scifi movie music + Firefly dialogue clips, 24 hours a day - http://www.scifiradio.com

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:28 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Ooops, I'm forced to speak up in the defense of equality again. Yes, the DMV used to be a nightmare, but ours amazed me the last couple of times I went there. It was a "by-the-numbers" system; you went to an initial window where the person separated you into one of two categories and gave you a number for each. They had a couple of lit boards showing the numbers and they called them out as they came up. When your number was called, you went to the window indicated--and they had a LOT of employees, so a lot of windows.

In both cases, I got what I wanted accomplished in less than half an hour...a wait, admittedly, but I was dealt with effectively and accurately in both cases.

So I guess it's how the individual government agency is RUN, and to that I have no answer.

Piz, I like it better if everyone's included, too, but when a couple of people have no desire except to hurl insults and no desire to debate or discuss reasonably, I'm finding it much more effective at keeping myself from getting angry to just ignore them or, if I wish to respond, think of them as things, not people. It helps me keep my sense of humor and not get drawn into actual nastiness on my part. Just a personal solution to an unpleasant fact of participating here.

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:33 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Actually, come to think of it, the better solution right now would be to go walk the dogs. We're only focusing on three or four topics, and most of those have become either funny or sad in that they are wrapped around a couple of posters who have nothing of value to contribute anyway (I'm referring to one or two specific snarkers, nobody else).

So rather than continue "playing" here, I should go do something constructive; maybe there will be more topics under discussion when I come back. Ergo; best wishes to all (even the ____ among us), I'm outta here...

"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:37 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

"If anyone has been to their local DMV any time recently then surely that's an example of a Gov agency that is the nightmare scenario. Who's to say that wouldn't be Gov. Health Care?"

There is a philosophy that says that government should not be involved in anything at all, ever. And that the private sector ALWAYS does a better job. You see it in moves to privatize education, war (contractors, mercs) etc; to 'contract-out functions like prisons etc; to deregulate banks and insurance companies etc, to not enforce existing regulations such as Enron energy price fixing, and to not let regulations keep up with new practices such as derivatives; to stop providing services such as transportation ... AND to starve government agencies, such as the DMV. *

My point is that JUST BY VIRTUE OF BEING GOVERNMENT-RUN DOESN'T MAKE IT BAD. And you have to look a the work that has gone into making something fail.

"How do you motivate workers and management? Profit? Attaboys? I think your Mayo clinic example is uplifting and hopeful, but not everywhere is the Mayo Clinic ..."

Profit tends to motivate the wrong things. I would never use profit as a motivating tool.

There are many things that DE-motivate workers that are well known. Unclear goals. Unfair application of rules and rewards. Lack of control over your work. Lack of non-monetary recognition. Not having the tools to do the job. Boring and repetitive work.

Simply having a well managed place of employment - and I have worked in two, which were a VA Hospital and a County Hospital - keeps people motivated and productive, even if they are working for the government. And bad management wil demotivate people, even if they are working for a private group.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:49 AM

America loves a winner!

If you have insurance.

Yes. If you care enough about your own life, and if you don't want to burden the rest of society because of your own personal issues or because you're flat out too lazy....

Under NO circumstance should the Federal Gov't , or ANY Gov't force 1 person to forfeit a portion of their own lives to placate someone else who could otherwise do for themselves.

But...but...but! people will DIE!!!

Everyone dies. And demagoging that point isn't a valid excuse to take from some to give to others. It's NOT the proper function of Gov't to do so.

If Gov't doesn't do it, then it won't get done ? Bull shit. Absolute, total and unqualified bullshit. People, individuals, have the skills and know how to see to it that those who need help, get help. Yes, the private sector is the answer. Your church, the free market, state or nation wide coops.... there's a list of things which could be done to achieve the goals everyone wants w/ out involving the wasteful, intrusive and frankly unconstitutional burden of mandated Universal health care.

People don't like
to be meddled with.

We tell them what to do,
what to think.

Don't run, don't walk.

We're in their homes
and in their heads
and we haven't the right.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 10:59 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

* Just to point out that the CA DMV has made its improvements as a result of spending on a computer system over a decade ago.

Since people can now go on-line to take care of their routine business, the lines are shorter. The 'paperwork' such as it is is faster b/c it is done electronically, rather than by physical paper files and mail.

Effort, time and money went into making it right, something that many government agenices are currently being starved-out of ...

... but to get back to the topic, dollar for dollar, government functions are much more efficient than private. Though to get the desired result, you DO have to pony up enough money.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:03 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
Everyone dies.

Since you imply that it makes no difference WHEN people die, do you suppose you could go first in line???

I'll wait and see how it goes.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:08 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

We're in their homes
and in their heads
and we haven't the right.

It would have been nice to see this applied to the USPARTIOT Act, to illegal warrantless wiretapping, to bans on gay marriage, and other Republican abortions.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:25 AM

Quote:
Under NO circumstance should the Federal Gov't , or ANY Gov't force 1 person to forfeit a portion of their own lives to placate someone else who could otherwise do for themselves.

But...but...but! people will DIE!!!

Everyone dies. And demagoging that point isn't a valid excuse to take from some to give to others. It's NOT the proper function of Gov't to do so.

If Gov't doesn't do it, then it won't get done ? Bull shit. Absolute, total and unqualified bullshit. People, individuals, have the skills and know how to see to it that those who need help, get help. Yes, the private sector is the answer. Your church, the free market, state or nation wide coops.... there's a list of things which could be done to achieve the goals everyone wants w/ out involving the wasteful, intrusive and frankly unconstitutional burden of mandated Universal health care.

Where was that attitude of "do for yourself" when you were insisting that we MUST invade Iraq? Your justification was that... that... PEOPLE WOULD DIE!

So? So fucking what. People die every day, right? Why should I pay the bill for trying to save them?

Isn't that what you're advocating NOW? That which you quite clearly NEVER advocated THEN?

Why do you hate Americans so much, and love Iraq more than your own country?

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:34 AM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Quote:
Everyone dies.
Since you imply that it makes no difference WHEN people die, do you suppose you could go first in line???

I'll wait and see how it goes.

That's the sort of witless, brain dead retort I've come to (sadly) expect from the likes of you.

To quote Clinton's Surgeon General Jocelyn Elders:
"Well, we're all going to die of something, someday!"

Did ya see that ? See how it turned it right back on ya ?

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:44 AM

America loves a winner!

ok kwickie, by YOUR idiotic and brain f'd stupid rationale....

Millions slaughtered by NAZI Germany in Europe ? F 'em

Haiti earthquake kills 250,000 and many more need help? F 'em

Slaughter in Kosovo, while Europe sits on her hands and does nothing ? F 'em

When people are in control of their own destiny, their own health, you want Gov't control. But when they're being slaughtered by murderous tyrants and are affected by titanic forces of nature.... F 'EM !!

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:55 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
ok kwickie, by YOUR idiotic and brain f'd stupid rationale....

Millions slaughtered by NAZI Germany in Europe ? F 'em

Haiti earthquake kills 250,000 and many more need help? F 'em

Slaughter in Kosovo, while Europe sits on her hands and does nothing ? F 'em

When people are in control of their own destiny, their own health, you want Gov't control. But when they're being slaughtered by murderous tyrants and are affected by titanic forces of nature.... F 'EM !!

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

Not MY rationale - YOURS. YOU were the one who said, and I quote, "Everyone dies. And demagoging that point isn't a valid excuse to take from some to give to others. It's NOT the proper function of Gov't to do so."

Iraqis die. Demagoguing that point was never a valid excuse for your government to take from some to give to others. That was NOT the proper function of a government to do so.

I'm glad you agree that YOUR rationale is, and again I quote, "idiotic and brain f'd stupid". You're all that, and then some.

Oh, and in case you were in a coma, it was your hero, Rushbo, who claimed that we shouldn't be doing anything to help Haiti, because we'd already paid our income taxes. Go look it up.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 11:59 AM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Well, "logic AND reason" have never been Rappy's strong points.

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Silence is consent.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 12:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Well, "logic AND reason" have never been Rappy's strong points.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

Too true.

By the way, wouldn't using MY tax money to treat injured soldiers who were hurt in a war I was vociferously opposed to, amount to taking from some to give to others?

I say if you want to support the war, put YOUR money where your mouth is, not mine. I've got my weapons, and I'm plenty capable of protecting myself and my property. If you don't, too bad for you, according to Rappy's brain-fucked rationale.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 12:24 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Well, "logic AND reason" have always been Rappy's strong points.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

Fixed that for ya.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 12:26 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

By the way, wouldn't using MY tax money to treat injured soldiers who were hurt in a war I was vociferously opposed to, amount to taking from some to give to others?

I say if you want to support the war, put YOUR money where your mouth is, not mine. I've got my weapons, and I'm plenty capable of protecting myself and my property. If you don't, too bad for you, according to Rappy's brain-fucked rationale.

National defense is a proper function of Gov't, so your ' brain fucked ' rationale does not hold water.

Per usual.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 12:35 PM

I have a vote and I'm not afraid to use it!

Oh dear, I hear an echo. Must be something really, really MT around here.

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Silence is consent.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:10 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Quote:
"But...but...but! people will DIE!!!"

Everyone dies. -Rappy

Since you imply that it makes no difference WHEN people die, do you suppose you could go first in line??? I'll wait and see how it goes.- Signy

That's the sort of witless, brain dead retort I've come to (sadly) expect from the likes of you.-Rappy

Actually, Rappy, I was hoping that by making YOU the target of your own POV, you would see the callousness of your ways. Sigh. Too much to expect.

In any case, now I see that your REAL argument against any form of government healthcare isn't based on what's cheaper, more effective, or even fairer. If that were the case, you would not support the theft of money from working people in the form of laws which protect profits. (Hard as this may be to grasp, "profit" is not a god-given right, nor is it a "natural" institution. It's a law, protected by the guns of the gubmint.) What your POV boils down to is: I have my money, and I'm gonna keep it.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:28 PM

MAL4PREZ

See what happens when Operation Ignore breaks down? The thread becomes AAA: All About Auraptor. He must be loving it!

Not that I'll ever waste my valuable lurking time on his posts, but the replies from normally interesting posters are just ooooozing with his foul stench.

Bummer.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:32 PM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

Well, if and when Rappy posts something worth responding to, I WILL respond to it. Otherwise, I ignore him. Same way I treat PN.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

By the way, wouldn't using MY tax money to treat injured soldiers who were hurt in a war I was vociferously opposed to, amount to taking from some to give to others?

I say if you want to support the war, put YOUR money where your mouth is, not mine. I've got my weapons, and I'm plenty capable of protecting myself and my property. If you don't, too bad for you, according to Rappy's brain-fucked rationale.

National defense is a proper function of Gov't, so your ' brain fucked ' rationale does not hold water.

Per usual.

Wrong.

It's a proper function of government to "provide for the general welfare" of its people, according to the Preamble to the Constitution of the United States of America, so your brain-fucked rationale is looking weaker and weaker. After all, if you don't have your health, nothing else much matters - INCLUDING that alleged "national defense".

Why was Iraq necessary to our "national defense" anyway?

Spin, boy! SPIN!

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 1:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by mal4prez:
See what happens when Operation Ignore breaks down? The thread becomes AAA: All About Auraptor. He must be loving it!

Not that I'll ever waste my valuable lurking time on his posts, but the replies from normally interesting posters are just ooooozing with his foul stench.

Bummer.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

Yeah, my bad - Bytemite remarked in another thread that we should all just engage him, so I decided to comply to show what THAT would look like.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 2:31 PM

MAL4PREZ

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:

Yeah, my bad - Bytemite remarked in another thread that we should all just engage him, so I decided to comply to show what THAT would look like.

I recall what that looks like, and really don't want to to get back to it. Perhaps this little bit of this thread is a helpful reminder: the foul wind will try and try to get anyone to nibble on his bait, even going as far as posting something "worth responding to", but it will devolve from there. The joker is here for nothing but attention. A therapist would serve him much better. When I can get the bile to stay down, I really do pity the guy.

I also fully realize I'm being an ass here, and the best thing I could do would be to respond on topic to keep rational discussion going. I hope to have more chances to do just that over the next few weeks, since work will let up a bit.

As far as health care reform right now: I'm waiting to see what comes out of Congress in the next few weeks. I do think something good has happened, in that the hypocritical BS of last summer is finally getting shot down, even to the point that the Blue Dogs are getting called out.

I'm cautiously optimistic that the days of Faux News misinformation are over. Some folks will always fall for that blatant nonsense, but the majority are on to the game.

-----------------------------------------------
hmm-burble-blah, blah-blah-blah, take a left

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 3:26 PM

BYTEMITE

Quote:
Yeah, my bad - Bytemite remarked in another thread that we should all just engage him, so I decided to comply to show what THAT would look like.

I still think this is preferable to the wind talking thing.

Maybe it's different because you've been around longer, maybe you've seen more threads get hijacked with insults, but if you really want to ignore him, why say anything at all? Debate or don't respond. :/

Sorry, I know I was a spoilsport, but the windtalker thing just isn't working for me. The whole thing is STILL about the infighting between AURaptor and everyone else, and it takes up SO much threadspace, threadspace which could be used for discussion with people you WANT to engage with.

EDIT: Okay, I want to clarify here. You're gonna do what you want. That's good. Often times, HILARIOUS. I like that about this forum. No moderators, people are held to task for what they say.

There are ways I can cope with this on my side, same as when you guys have to scroll past PN, so none of you have to change anything about what you're doing. I'm okay with that.

I'm just letting you know, on my side, seeing seemingly every single thread comprised of ten or more successive posts about the wind talking, sometimes multiple times per thread, is a little much for me.

I've said my piece, whatever you choose, it's fine by me. Rappy seems like he can take it. Hell, seems sometimes like he likes it. So keep on keeping on.

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 3:47 PM

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Well, if and when Rappy posts something worth responding to, I WILL respond to it. Otherwise, I ignore him. Same way I treat PN.

Oh lord, if only that were true!

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Wednesday, March 3, 2010 5:53 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Solution: Failure to acknowledge whatever.

Period.

-F

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Thursday, March 4, 2010 12:29 AM

America loves a winner!

What's that I hear ? Why it's faint, but I can just make out the words.....

When danger reared it's ugly head,
He bravely turned his tail and fled.
("no!")
Yes, brave Sir Robin turned about
("I didn't!")
And gallantly he chickened out.

****Bravely**** taking to his feet,
He beat a very brave retreat.
Bravest of the braaaave, Sir Robin!

Singin' your fav song, I see.

Bones: "Don't 'rawr' her!"
Booth: "What? she'rawred' me first."

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Thursday, March 4, 2010 6:30 AM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.

I'm with Byte.

Rappy, you have not responded to a single point I ... or anyone else... brought up. I'm not going to bother to list them, all you have to do is scroll up and read what people posted about the topic, quote them, and respond directly in some way. But here's a hint: Usually, when peeps try to have a discussion they bring up either additional facts OR they try to show inconsistencies/ consequences in the other person's argument using logic, OR they attempt to come up with alterantives. Repeating personal opinions ad nauseum isn't discussion, and neither is constantly whining about "unfair" treatment.

Not only are you NOT ADDING to the discussion, you're detracting from it in a significant way. I've listened to you and responded directly to your points, but you have not done the same for me. That's your loss, not mine.

Back to our regularly scheduled program.

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Thursday, March 4, 2010 8:19 AM