"The Circle of Denial" is in full swing, bless its little heart:[quote]On Tuesday, hearings in the Senate focused on similar themes: what caused the well..."/>

REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

'It wasn't my fault'

POSTED BY: NIKI2
UPDATED: Saturday, May 15, 2010 09:08
SHORT URL:
VIEWED: 1588
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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 9:20 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


"The Circle of Denial" is in full swing, bless its little heart:
Quote:

On Tuesday, hearings in the Senate focused on similar themes: what caused the well to explode, and why the blowout preventer did not work.

Three executives from the three principal companies working on the well all blamed each other.

BP (BP), which owns the well and subcontracted the other companies to work on it, said it was Transocean's job to ensure that the blowout preventer was functioning. Transocean was the owner of the drilling rig that sunk, the Deepwater Horizon, and also owned the blowout preventer.

Transocean (RIG) said the blowout preventer worked just fine in tests, and that it may have gotten jammed with concrete or other well fluids that were injected by a third contractor, causing the well to explode. Either way, argued Transocean's president, it was the faulty well, not the rig or the blowout preventer, that ultimately caused the leak.

Halliburton (HAL, Fortune 500) was the third contractor; it injected cement and other well fluids into the hole before the explosion. But a Halliburton exec said it was only following the orders of BP, which wanted a heavier fluid, known as mud, removed from the well before the well was capped with a concrete plug.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/05/12/news/companies/bp_house_hearing/index.
htm?hpt=T2


"It wasn't my fault"--the cry heard 'round the world every time something goes wrong...


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 12:00 PM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Bumpety-bump-bump?


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Wednesday, May 12, 2010 12:14 PM

FREMDFIRMA



None of it's any surprise, Niki.

Although I do know (their security talks too much) that they've been faking the safety tests for those kind of seals for a while now, with a nod and wink from the regulators, such as they are.

You'd be better at diggin that one than me, I wouldn't know where to start, and I got a lot on my plate at the moment.

-F

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 7:55 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Aside from all the idiocy that's been going on and tolerated by Dumbya's administration at the MMC, there's this:
Quote:


Regulations for offshore drilling rigs largely date to 1978 and have not kept pace with technological advances, Coast Guard inspectors told a federal inquiry into the Deepwater Horizon accident Wednesday.

"The pace of the technology has outrun the current regulations," Lt. Cmdr. Michael Odom told a board looking into the April 20 blast that left 11 dead and a runaway oil leak in the Gulf of Mexico.

Odom, who inspected the Deepwater Horizon in July 2009, said the Coast Guard regulations date to an era when offshore drilling was closer to the coastline and not as industrially complex as now.

Capt. Verne Gifford, a 23-year Coast Guard veteran, testified that the agency does not mandate inspections of things like dynamic positioning systems, which keep the floating rigs in place. Such devices weren't in use when the regulations had their last major overhaul three decades ago.

One would think, if regulation weren't the joke it was the past eight years (and before), this would have been noticed and corrected. But of course, "drill baby drill" is a simplistic slogan easily swallowed and doesn't consider such things.




"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 8:52 AM

FREMDFIRMA



Found it, or at least references to it.

Not fond of Arianna, cause I do not trust her, but the story has been crosschecked.

Whistleblower Claims That BP Was Aware Of Cheating On Blowout Preventer Tests
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/12/bp-whistleblower-claimed_n_57
3839.html


Whistleblower: BP Falsified Tests on Its Blowout Preventers
http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/47159

This kinda thing is a very common practice, remember that my initial entry in the field of security also involved keeping such abuses nice and quiet, a part of my job I hated bitterly and the eventual motivation behind my jump to a PMC soon thereafter.

And it's always worth grilling the security, especially if you can find a seriously disgruntled one lookin for a new career who doesn't care that honesty and blowing the whistle will get him blackballed, cause they're usually paid jack shit, treated like dirt, and yet they know *all* the dirt, whether they're supposed to or not.

-F

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 8:59 AM

PIRATENEWS

John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!


Quote:

Originally posted by Fremdfirma:

This kinda thing is a very common practice, remember that my initial entry in the field of security also involved keeping such abuses nice and quiet, a part of my job I hated bitterly and the eventual motivation behind my jump to a PMC soon thereafter.

And it's always worth grilling the security, especially if you can find a seriously disgruntled one lookin for a new career who doesn't care that honesty and blowing the whistle will get him blackballed, cause they're usually paid jack shit, treated like dirt, and yet they know *all* the dirt, whether they're supposed to or not.



My wife got a security guard fired this week, after he showed her how to file down keys to duplicate the $10,000 Master Key. $100,000 had been burgled since he started working. She also forced another security guard to stop sleeping on the job.

Inside job is always motive #1.

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 10:07 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Ummmmm... Not to go overly simplistic on y'all or anything, but whenever you hear people go testify in front of Congress, and they start off by saying, "Well, I don't think this is the time to point fingers and assign blame..." - you should know goddamned well exactly who they're trying to keep the blame from being assigned to and the fingers pointed at: THEM!

It's one of those things I picked up in bullshit corporate meetings. First one to say "Now isn't the time to place blame", is to blame. It's not scientific, but it's 100% reliable. :)

Mike

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions


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Thursday, May 13, 2010 10:27 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Definitely 100% reliable under those circumstances, I agree.




"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Thursday, May 13, 2010 10:58 AM

RAHLMACLAREN

"Damn yokels, can't even tell a transport ship ain't got no guns on it." - Jayne Cobb


Sounds like all three are to blame, with a little bit more on BP, since they signed off on everything.

So, do all of these huge, heavy, awkward, oil rigs just float over the source, tethered to a point below the surface? I thought these things were supposed to have legs.

Doesn't sound very sturdy.


--------------------------------------------------
Find here the Serenity you seek. -Tara Maclay

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Saturday, May 15, 2010 4:24 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:






Just bringing this up because I've been meaning to comment on it, and keep getting sidetracked. :)

Niki, there's a *reason* Governor Goodhair called it an "act of god" - and it's not the reason you're thinking of, I'll bet. (You were thinking "because he's a damned idiot", right? I know I was.)

If he calls it an "act of god", he's hoping that will help the oil industry in the upcoming lawsuits, is what I'm thinking. Their liability is likely capped at some amount for "acts of god" as insurance companies call them, where they might NOT be capped as low for human error or negligence. Yes, it SEEMS like a stupid, idiotic thing to say, because it looks so clearly to be negligence, or at the very least to have a very strong negligent aspect, but I think he's hoping to try to help stave off some of the lawsuits and damage awards. After all, now they can go into court and say, "Well, the governor of Texas says it was an Act of God, so who are we to argue?"

So it's just ol' Tricky Rick trying to give a little hand-out (and hand-job) to his pals in the industry.

Mike

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions


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Saturday, May 15, 2010 4:53 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


Hello,

It seems pretty straightforward to me.

You treat it like a crime. (Since it is.)

Bring in the crime scene techs, document everything. Bring in the detectives. Question everyone. Take the whole thing to pieces just like a plane crash. Examine every bolt to the nth degree. Re-trace every ounce of the history. Burrow through every report.

Then take whoever to court, based on scientific evidence and firm policework. It IS the wrong time for Senate hearings. We haven't completed the investigation yet.

There's probably a hundred scoundrels in need of thumping.

--Anthony



"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

"You can lose a quark you don't girth." -Dreamtrove's words to live by, translated by Ipad

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Saturday, May 15, 2010 6:42 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Oh, I knew that Mike. Or I guess, I figured it out. It's pretty obvious, contracts usually have the clause, and either way, it's an attempt to deflect blame.. Stupid and they won't get away with it, but obvious.

The problem is I think, Anthony, that THEY are the only people who know enough to figure out what went wrong, and of course they're all pointing fingers at one another.

My pessimism says they'll get away with it, and it's gonna be awful, more awful than anyone realizes. The "dispersant" they've used is apparently as toxic as the oil (good idea, guys!) and they've had no luck capping it, so it's still spewing oil and probably will for a long time to come. They keep coming up with ideas; the ideas keep not working.

The fact that MMS is so screwed up and has been since Dumbya unregulated the oil industry and made it clear he didn't give a damn about checking on them, I don't know how they'll ever get it back under control. Not only were people screwing each other, lobbyists and MMS employes alike, but it turns out people leave lobbying the oil industry and become HEADS of MMS, and vice versa, which is insane. At least Obama's done something about that in future, but what about NOW?

Thank gawd the Govenator is doing SOMETHING right in getting together with Oregon and Washington to put a PERMANENT ban on drilling off the West Coast. I hope it goes through...

One of the most stupid things I've heard is that, given how much oil we're losing to the spill, we need to drill even MORE than we did before!

Nothing will stop the Repubs from pushing oil drilling, that much is for sure!


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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Saturday, May 15, 2010 7:01 AM

ANTHONYT

Freedom is Important because People are Important


"The problem is I think, Anthony, that THEY are the only people who know enough to figure out what went wrong"

Hello,

I think any competent group of engineers can unravel it.

The question is, will we treat this like a plane crash?

Because plane crashes get taken to pieces and analyzed to the nth degree. And that's what's needed here. A group of engineers and scientists CAN deconstruct this disaster if we tell them to.

I worry more about this: Nobody in charge really wants to know. Because if it all came out, then they'd have to make boggling changes to the whole industry.

If the full disaster ISN'T deconstructed like a crime scene, then they can make superficial conclusions married to superficial solutions designed to give everyone the superficial sensation that everything is F.I.N.E.

--Anthony


"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

"You can lose a quark you don't girth." -Dreamtrove's words to live by, translated by Ipad

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Saturday, May 15, 2010 8:06 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Yeah, I gotta go with Anthony on this one. Bring in "forensic engineers", and they'll tell you not only WHAT failed exactly, but WHY, WHERE, HOW, AND WHEN it failed.

And, of course, that's the very last thing the industry wants to happen, because then they'll be tasked with enacting REAL fixes to insure that it doesn't happen again.

And all along, leading up to this disaster and even after, what I've been hearing keeps reminding me of the old Smiths song...

Quote:



Don't blame the sweet and tender hooligan, hooligan
Because he'll never never do it again
And of course he won't
Well, not until the next time


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Saturday, May 15, 2010 9:08 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Ahhh, but changes ARE being made, big ones...check my thread on Obama addressing it. The first changes since, well, a decade ago...let's see, that would be under whose watch? Nobody connected with Big Oil, I'm sure!

I hope they follow through, and yes, you're probably right, scientists COULD figure it out if given the chance.

We'll have to wait and see...I won't even put my money on Obama getting it to happen, I've been disappointed before. Still...


"I'm just right. Kinda like the sun rising in the east and the world being round...its not a need its just the way it is." The Delusional "Hero", 3/1/10

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