Lifeline at risk for 2 million jobless by Niki2

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

OH NOES!!!

Slackers will need to actually find jobs and work??!?!!?!?!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Thursday, November 4, 2010 10:35 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Let's give them Census jobs again! Reports are the first one was messed up and undercounted....jeeeesh, Obumma can't even do that right. Put a few hundred thousand Obama economy victims back into the Census and he's sure to get that unemployment way down...perhaps to a 9.2

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Thursday, November 4, 2010 10:50 AM

Wulf may lack a certain, i don't know, but he's kinda right, it's not a slacker welfare state. There's a limitless amount of work out there, it's just the Americans won't do it, that's why we import million of mexicans.

Of course, it's not the american people's fault, they're not lazy, they're just buried under a mountain of debt. They can't afford to work, because, given the tax structure, the job would never cover the debt.

Think about it: For a middle class income, you would have to pay:

Minimum $100k for your college tuition, even if you're not sending kids to college, you're still in the low 20s in student loan debt for the avg american.

Minimum $100k for your home. If you're in a city like most people, much much more.

Your income is going to be hacked up like this:
20% FICA
10% state tax
27% federal
and 10-ish % total local taxes.

That means 2/3 of your nominal income goes for taxes.

If you want to compete with the world labor market, you'll might go down a tax bracket, but still it'll be harsh:

At 35k, you pay, as a contractor, you get no bennies and no deductions (remember, this is the world that is available.) That means:

$7k for FICA
3.5k for state
8.75k for federal
3k-6k or so local, probably higher in the cities.

That's and avg. of 23.75k in tax. Now you have $12,250.

About $4 is going in student loan payments
$20,244 on average goes in mortgage payments...

Ooops america, you just lost your home

AND you're employed.

Okay, you rent.

$10,680 That saved 10,000, and you save on the local taxes, so you can get 4500ish back.

Now we have you at $6,180

So, you've got 12,250 +4500, -10,680 -4,000=

$2,070. Okay, from this you have to pay utilities and buy food. Maybe you can squeak by if you can skip out on heat, but otherwise, screw it, you're going to have to borrow. My heat bill alone is $3k

Okay, now enter another problem of reality:

The international job market is really only paying $20k. (sure this saves you a little on taxes, you're now paying $9k tax if you don't own, If you rent something really cheap you can squeak by if you didn't have this debt, but the rent is TOO DAMN HIGH!)

So...

Niki, honestly. Look at the situation. Why would any sane person vote for a democrat unless they were already one of the moneyed elite? Sure, I can see that republicans are NOT the solution to the problem, because they've just proved in their 8 years of total control that they were just as tax and borrow and spend as the democrats, or close enough as to make no difference, but you might be able to see where an average american might have just a *little* bit of sympathy for the Tea Party position without being a total moron?

The only reason reason I'm not in the above situation is that my grandparents were strict fundamentalist Christians who instilled in me certain moral lines that I will not cross, and you might recognize these: Never borrow, take no charity and sign no contracts. It's a set of beliefs that is commonly held by religious extremists like the Mennonites.

But the average American was sold the American Dream, which included a home, which came with a mortgage, rather than a box of tools and a couple years hard work; and it came with a college education which would make you smart and employable... Quite frankly, that was a bill of goods and a lie, and I don't blame anyone for buying it because there wasn't a lot of counterpoint from any moral authority out there saying "Don't do it, screw it, drop out in 5th grade."

Jes saying is all.

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Thursday, November 4, 2010 3:42 PM

KANEMAN

Tell 'em to get a life...maybe the wouldn't need a lifeline.....Idiot

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Thursday, November 4, 2010 4:15 PM

FREMDFIRMA

Simple fact: Most jobs do not PAY enough to cover the expenses of the things required to obtain them.

Bare minimum, car, phone, high school diploma.

Well lesse - car payment, rent, insurance inspection emissions tags title registration, license... that's WAY more a chunk than most folk realize, and as you go "downslope" into "da hood" it only goes UP as your ability to afford it goes DOWN.

And don't no one insult me about public transportation, it's a joke in 99% of america, and part of WHY employers say "must have car and phone".

Then there's rent, phone bill, electricity, and of course food - not to mention the little things most people take for granted, like dishwashing liquid, toilet paper, detergent (and expenses for laundry if you don't have your own washer/dryer, which do not come cheap!) and so on and so forth.

And of course, when you start talkin degrees, you're talkin massive loads of student loan debt, plus additional debts incurred trying to fill in what the loan doesn't cover, a bigass pile of debt, often for a job that pays not bloody much more than minimum fuckin wage...

And up the scale from there.

And the very folk who will not jack the minimum wage are the very same folk who gleefully abetted the strikebreakers with their military, and ensured that todays unions are nothing more than subcorporations which fuck you just that much more, and happen to be all but toothless against the corporate empires.

And, of course, the taxes...

So it ain't a point of finding work at all, it's a point of finding work that will pay the goddamn expenses WITH enough left over to start mitigating if not reducing the debt - cause there's nothing more horrible to watch than the slow spiral of some damn fool who's taken a job cause it was the only thing they could get, as he falls further and further behind.

Oh yeah, and just you TRY getting decent work of any kind without a fixed address, a shower, decent clothes - much less a car and phone, eh ?

Why you think I don't bitch about "entitlements" - cause directly, this is just money the Gov already stole via taxation, this is the vulture taking the hock of meat, chewing it down to the gristle and tossing it back, as if it were an act of benevolence ?
Please.
Had they not taken so much in the first place, a lotta these folk WOULD have been able to get by - this is a mugger who steals your wallet handing you back bus fare out of pity, is what it is.

Indirectly, this is part and parcel of the cozy little gov-corp alliance that crushed the unions, murdered the strikers, and destroyed any hope of fighting for a fair share instead of being reduced to starveling peons while the CEOs gobble down multimillion dollar salaries and bonuses even as they drive the company into the ground since their gov buddies will bail em out, and outsourced the jobs to third world countries run by "friendly" dictators we often as not set up in the first place.

So this pathetic, not-really-enough-to-survive-on pity payment doesn't offend me, cause it's not even in the same league as military/corporate welfare, or our so-called protectors and their goddamn protection RACKET (80.1 BILLION, and what do you get for it but the alphabet goons *creating* pathetic terrorists or helping real ones?!) not by a long shot.

To put it in perspective, rob a bank with a gun, go to jail, rob it with a briefcase and a suit, get a bonus...

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Thursday, November 4, 2010 5:11 PM

Frem,

The system is *designed* that way.

In case you don't notice me keep posting it, the only difference between the original contracts for indentured servitude and those of today is that now there's no exit clause. It is slavery.

Taxes aren't levied to generate revenue, they can already print the currency if they wanted, it's to reduce your income, to keep you working. Your salary is designed to equal the payments on your debt.

My feeling on entitlements is that this is the "good" that the govt. does as an excuse to justify its existence, and I don't want to give them that pleasure. Besides, you said it yourself, you give them power the instant you take what they're giving.

It's our system that makes people unable to work for the wages of the world. It's not that the minimum wage has to come up, it's that the drains on our income need to come down. We need to be a competitive labor force, and so just a short list of what we should not be paying through the nose for:

1. Housing
2. Education
3. Taxes (aka, the war fund)
4. Transportation
5. Healthcare

Frankly, most countries have public transit, but there are so many cars everywhere already, it's not even necessary. If we weren't so bent on personal ownership, there would always be available cars to take anywhere, forever. I figured it out once, there are in america about ten times as many dormant functional cars sitting in walking distance of any human for every one which is driving. It's serious overkill. Everyone could sell their cars to giant carshare companies, and if there were like 20 of them, there would be competition, and we could pay a buck a day to rent a car or something.

Housing? We could have free housing available in competition with rental and ownership, stop propping up the real estate market and let it collapse. Do away with these massive monopoly landlords that set prices. The rent here is set by people in the city, in reality, it's 90% empty. There's no reason it should cost a dime, except that there are people who have credit and borrow, etc.

Healthcare, stop this nonsense of licensing only a medical elite to diagnose and treat non-life threatening illness, or even life threatening ones, and have real competition. It's already well established that free computer systems are significantly more accurate at diagnosing medical problems than even the most trained doctors, and that the most effective treatments for almost all conditions are well known and can be manufactured for next to nothing. We don't need a single payer system, we need to level the market, at about 1% of the cost it costs us now. According to the recent UN Study, the most effective healthcare system in the world, in terms of increasing your chances of survival with a life threatening condition is the Indian Ayurvedic system.

Taxes. This requires clever economic manipulations, but it can be done. Place everyone below their deductables, and exempt them from FICA by hooking them up to a competing plan which is drawn from something like the above.

Finally, Education. It's just information. Information available online is already vastly superior to that which can be gotten with a university education.

Now, imaging for a minute if we left minimum wage where it is, and you take that $7.50 an hour times a full 40 hours a week, 50 weeks a year. That's $15,000. Now, what if an average worker lived in a home where they owed no rent, paid no taxes and their medical costs were nominal, transportation nominal, then $10,000 of that could be annual savings. That would be a pretty nice job, no?

It ain't our lack of income that's making us poor, it's our lack of control of the outgo.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 6:52 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

I know the numbers.

I know how bad it can be, and get.

I was working 3 (yes 3) jobs at one point just to afford rent, food, and gas.

It was hell. 3 hours of sleep a night, 15 minutes for a shower, and it off to the races again.

Don't even get me started on where I lived, either.

But I did it. I turned that experience and grit into finding better and better jobs.

Finally, i went to a Temp Agency, who found me a great (singular) job. From there I was able to afford a better place to live, and better food, while also beefing up my resume.

It CAN be done. I KNOW it.

What I CANNOT stand are lazy, slacking, weaklings. "Oooo, its too hard..... Ooooo, I have a degree, that means you need to pay me eleventy million or I wont take the job....Ooooo, if you don't pay me what I want Im gonna have a temper tantrum, and go on WELFARE or UNEMPLOYMENT..."

So basically, all of us who busted our asses, didn't ask for handouts or favors, are stuck with paying more in taxes for these useless types.

But. I guess we do have thing these leaches will never have. Can never have.

Pride. Strength. Resolve. Grit.

I know, not wonder, KNOW that what I have, I have EARNED.

Think on that the next time you cash your unemployment check, slaves.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, November 5, 2010 7:00 AM

CUDA77

Like woman, I am a mystery.

Changing the title back...

ETA: And again...

ETA2: And for a third time...

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Friday, November 5, 2010 8:59 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
Why would any sane person vote for a democrat unless they were already one of the moneyed elite?

You’ve got to be kidding. Aside from the fact that millions are born into poverty with no hope of escaping it, by far Republicans represent the “moneyed” interests in America, corporatists, CEOs and Wall Street “elites”. The statement that only moneyed elites vote for democrats is wrong. Frem is right on

Quote:
Most jobs do not PAY enough to cover the expenses of the things required to obtain them.

Damned straight.

There are definitely problems with our safety-net system which need to be corrected, and yes, there is some fraud and some people are lazy. But they are not in the majority by a long shot. As far as I’m concerned, condemning everyone who is dependent on the government for the safety nets in place is selfish, blind and deliberately ignorant. I hope all who feel that way find THEMSELVES in that situation eventually. It would be very appropriate.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, November 5, 2010 9:00 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
Why would any sane person vote for a democrat unless they were already one of the moneyed elite?

Quote:
Most jobs do not PAY enough to cover the expenses of the things required to obtain them.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, November 5, 2010 9:03 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Hey Nix... you cash your uneployment/welfare check this week? What ARE the people of California paying to keep you sitting on your butt?

Just curious.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, November 5, 2010 9:50 AM

FREMDFIRMA

Yo, fuckhead.

For every one that climbs out of that hole, there's fifty who DID EVERYTHING RIGHT, and still failed to do so, due to ill health, injury, catching a couple ounces of lead, or what have you.

So don't shine me, boy - the system IS set up, as DT said, as a treadmill of perpetual debt, indentured servitude, and the worst of it is you whining and whinging about having the HUMAN FUCKING DECENCY to feed and assist the poor, in a society that drop shot most of em to begin with...

All the while you got not a goddamn thing to say about the military and intel budgets, not to mention the black budget stuff, and how RIDICULOUSLY it gets spent...
(case in fucking point, THIS)
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/modern-art-was-cia-weapon-1578
808.html

But no, you whinge about helping folk out cause you hate them bitterly, cause the mere EXISTENCE of anyone who does not act and believe exactly like your dumb psychotic ass is a threat to you and all you believe, since it blows up the myth that you have to be such a dick cause there is no other viable way.

That someone could exist, could prosper, beliving and acting otherwise reveals that all you have ever done in the name of your tiny little worldview, all the evils you've committed, NO LONGER HAVE AN EXCUSE - and you can't bear that, so you'd rather see them dead, and you'll tell yourself any bullshit story to feel all better about it while dismissing anything else cause you're too much a pansy to face reality.

Were we to chop that military-corporate-intel welfare in half, or even by a third, we could feed, clothe and offer healthcare to THE ENTIRE FUCKING PLANET, and never notice the loss.

But no, you'd rather hate and hurt, pump up your ego on the pain of others, all to soothe your wounded fuckin pride.

You're pathetic, and you disgust me.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:16 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
For every one that climbs out of that hole, there's fifty who DID EVERYTHING RIGHT, and still failed to do so, due to ill health, injury, catching a couple ounces of lead, or what have you.

Yup.

I don't get any checks for welfare or unemployment; man, you can't keep ANYTHING straight, can you? So sad.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:17 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Aww, I pissed off Captain Trips...

How about this dickless... people CAN better themselves, make something of themselves, WITHOUT taking a handout from the government.

But without slaves, without people being easily manipulated into believing they are victims... you and your ILK, like NIX, wouldn't have any leg to stand on would you?

Goodness, the idea that people can, do and WILL survive and MAKE it without your corrupt ideals and handouts scares the SHIT out of you.

Does it NOT?

And to think.. I used to believe that anarchists had an interesting worldview.

But you clowns just want people to be broken and bowed. How else do you get people to believe your shit?

Well, heres one kid who you can't fuck.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:25 AM

CANTTAKESKY

Quote:
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
Were we to chop that military-corporate-intel welfare in half, or even by a third, we could feed, clothe and offer healthcare to THE ENTIRE FUCKING PLANET, and never notice the loss.

That's why I miss Grayson. I'm not a Democrat by any means of the imagination, but he got one thing right. The War Is Making You Poor Act was the most brilliant idea ever. Cut down military spending and use it to make $35,000 completely tax deductible. It is so reasonable, I want to cry.

It is also so reasonable it would never have a chance of passing. Because as my various astute fellow RWEDers pointed out, the system is set up to do exactly the opposite. And the system, no matter how often you vote, ain't going to change.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:45 AM

JONGSSTRAW

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
Aww, I pissed off Captain Trips...

How about this dickless... people CAN better themselves, make something of themselves, WITHOUT taking a handout from the government.

But without slaves, without people being easily manipulated into believing they are victims... you and your ILK, like NIX, wouldn't have any leg to stand on would you?

Goodness, the idea that people can, do and WILL survive and MAKE it without your corrupt ideals and handouts scares the SHIT out of you.

Does it NOT?

And to think.. I used to believe that anarchists had an interesting worldview.

But you clowns just want people to be broken and bowed. How else do you get people to believe your shit?

Well, heres one kid who you can't fuck.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

Oooooh, now THAT'S a post!

Yanno, everyone here is always calling me an idjit, a moron, and just about any derogatory insult concerning my limited intelligence....yet I always made enough money during my life to live well in a nice home, and put 2 kids thru college. Paid for my daughter's wedding and a nice gift. Always had nice cars and took nice vacations. I have never gotten un-employment or any Govt handout. I've survived many recessions and many dismal Democrat economic disasters. Maybe it's because I grew up with the "old school" ethic of hard work and keeping your nose clean. Most young people today are utterly clueless about such things....it's a shame for them and their families.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:48 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Yeah, love how the Dims left a ticking time bomb for the GOP, knowing these issues would come up, after the land slide domination at the polls.

That's 'caring' for you. If the Dims had any principles, they'd have put this up BEFORE the election, but they're cowards, and pussies.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:58 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Ehh, I got heated.

Just sick of the whole "Be a slave, its not your fault you can't hack it" bs I constantly hear around here.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, November 5, 2010 10:58 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I get it, y'know. You want those who are unable to "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" to just go away and die. I understand...I just wish you guys could suffer through a debilitating injury or disease and be unable to work, THEN see how it feels. That would be interesting.

We paid off ur home completely years ago, like 25 years ago. We put Jim's kids through college. We've got enough to survive retirement, I hope. We bought motorcycles, three trips to Europe, and more. But I'm not stupid enough to think everyone had the breaks we had, or to smugly believe I made it all happen. But that's okay, maybe karma will come around and teach you the realities of life. I can only hope.

Quote:
Yanno, everyone here is always calling me an idjit, a moron, and just about any derogatory insult concerning my limited intelligence

Oh, gawd, I DO adore that...considering what you call ANYONE with whom you disagree!

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, November 5, 2010 11:01 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Oh isnt that cute...

NSDemoLibs are GREAT at those underhanded insults... arn't they folks?

Yeah, keep taking that check, Nix. I wonder how much of your Harley got paid for by some working class schmuck.

Think about THAT next time you are "cruising" around.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, November 5, 2010 11:10 AM

STORYMARK

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:

Minimum $100k for your college tuition,

Obviously there are schools that cost that much, but to say it's the across the board minimum is a huge load of bullshit.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

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Friday, November 5, 2010 1:40 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Yeah, love how the Dims left a ticking time bomb for the GOP, knowing these issues would come up, after the land slide domination at the polls.

That's 'caring' for you. If the Dims had any principles, they'd have put this up BEFORE the election, but they're cowards, and pussies.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

You mean the same way the Republitards left the Bush tax cuts as a ticking deficit timebomb? Because they're such pussies and cowards that they wouldn't push the issue to try to make them permanent, instead pushing off such decisions on others, years down the road, when they figured they'd be safely retired!

The modern definition of "socialist" is anyone who's winning an argument against a tea-bagger.

AURaptor's Greatest Hits:

Friday, September 24, 2010
I hate Obama's America. You're damn right about that.

Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 1:54 PM

WHOZIT

MSNBC has canned Keith Olbermann, life is good.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 2:51 PM

Frem,

That was fucking hilarious. It was awesome.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 3:48 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

I get it, y'know. You want those who are unable to "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" to just go away and die.

Hun, nut case Grayson used this b.s. line and got himself bounced for it.

No one's buying it any more. But by all means, keep it up.

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

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Friday, November 5, 2010 3:49 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!

Quote:
Originally posted by whozit:
MSNBC has canned Keith Olbermann, life is good.

Canned now? Or just put into time out ?

"The modern definition of 'racist' is someone who is winning an argument with a liberal."

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Friday, November 5, 2010 3:53 PM

FREMDFIRMA

What's sad is how these dumbfucks tap dance around the pointed concept that maybe if the Government didn't hijack damn near 30% of the total income of these people with its fucking taxes, they might be able to get by - but no, they ignore that completely in favor of screaming at them for the horrible "crime" of accepting back some pittance of the money the goddamn Gov stole from em in the first place.

Seriously, the Gov takes the money, which requires people to collect it, to count it, sort and allocate - then decides to give some of it back, which requires people to assess and make that decision, sort and allocate, pay it back out, all these useless little piggies with their trotters in the trough, chomp chomp chomp, makin a living they've just denied to people who do work, and can't get by, dishing out humiliating and harrassment, and heaven help some poor schmuck getting that assistance if they even come CLOSE to maybe climbing out the hole cause they'll cut em off in a heartbeat, pull the rug out from under em to make sure they STAY down there, all the way paying only just barely enough to string em along, keep em hopin...

And it's money THEY TOOK FROM EM in the first place that's the fucking bait for the trap!

Again, it's like a mugger handing you back bus fare out of pity after taking your wallet, how the hell is this an act of benevolence - and how on EARTH can anyone but the stupidest squarehead think accepting such is worse than the theft ?

You wanna talk welfare, lets talk about all those Government drones I just described, chowing down on the money that SHOULD *remain* in the hands of the working poor, instead of being run down the trough line so all them fuckers can chow down on it before tossing the mangled bone back as a final insult, one people have no choice but to accept cause they've been taxed right out of the survival bracket...

But as usual, Wulfie looks backwards through the telescope and wonders why everyone laughs at his dumb ass, blinded by his own defiant resistance to anything that counters his preciously held worldview, no matter how true it is.

-Frem

I do not serve the Blind God.

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Friday, November 5, 2010 4:55 PM

Quote:

What's sad is how these dumbfucks tap dance around the pointed concept

Depends on who the dumbfucks are. If you mean congress, they're doing that on purpose because they don't want to decrease the taxes they're rolling in, they just want to decrease the refunds they're doling out.

If you mean the whining wulfenpopulous, they're faaar dumber than that. They just ate a talking point and now they have someone to be angry about: Quick, everyone, lynch the welfare queen, I mean the mexican, I mean the muslim, wait, look over there, there's something shiny, it might be the ball. Not that the knuckleheads on the left are any brighter: They were after the heads of the christians, and the chinese, and the indians and now it's the tea partiers not realizing that it's their own damn leaders and their own damn financial backers on both sides that are putting them in this mess.

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maybe if the Government didn't hijack damn near 30%

Oh, but it's so much worse than that. A quick study of any internal business on an indian reservation or other tax-free society reveals that when the dust has settled, about 75% of the price of everything you buy is tax. The workers who made it were taxed at every level, and the company paid tax, plus the factory paid property tax and then it was shipped by a shipping company that paid tax by a trucker who paid tax who bought gas sold by people who paid tax at a gas station that paid tax to say nothing of the gas tax, before it got to the store where the salesman paid tax, and his store, and the property that the store… *before* you pay the sales tax on it.

So yes, the govt. jacks 30% or more (10% state here in NY, and also 10-20% FICA) oh, and then there's the one Ron Paul points out, that the real inflation rate is and has been around 14% for the last decade when you look at the real buying power of the dollar, which is all because of our borrow and tax to pay the interest so we can borrow, and we damn well know where most of that money is going, which is the war, in one way or another, which means handouts to big corporations in one way or another..

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paying only just barely enough to string em along, keep em hopin...

Yes, that would be the trick. Keep the carrot close enough to the mule's nose that he thinks he can actually get it...

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And it's money THEY TOOK FROM EM in the first place that's the fucking bait for the trap!

And this would be one of my problems with the welfare system, other than the way it is actually distributed, which is about 2/3 of that cash goes to the rich, but it makes people reliant on that handout, and you know the govt. is never going to give them enough to get out. The most chilling statistic I saw on this recently was this one:

Average cash savings of Americans
Whites: $46,000
Blacks: $500

You know that doesn't happen without someone *designing* it to happen that way. I have a guy working for me right now who is trying to pull his family out of the hole, so I'm lending him a hand: He knows that the sub-prime scam was targeted as a trap for blacks, but he was about to bury himself in mortgage debt, and was still sinking fast, so I introduced him to how to troll for really cheap properties on ebay, buy everything yourself, pay cash up front, and then do the work himself. So, he's actually moving up pretty close to your neck of the woods. Anyway, the short of it is now he will own a home, and not owe anything, because debt is the key to keeping the poor poor.

The fact is, we're never going to get a decent tax system because the people writing the tax code are the top wage earners

Wulf,

Sorry about that, it just you step into the line of fire dude... and you don't just do it once, you do it over and over and at times ya kinda remind me a of a dog I once knew with dents from the various vehicles he had slain... Big dog. Black Lab actually.

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Saturday, November 6, 2010 7:54 AM