Run out and get more guns while you can... by pizmobeach

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

"But if you want to buy more than two AK-47s, that’s not only perfectly legal, it doesn’t get reported to the ATF!"

Jesus Christ Niki.

AK-47s, as you understand them, have been illegal since the 60s.

THERE ARE NO LONGER ANY FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPONS ALLOWED.

The most us peons can hope to get are semi-auto rifles.

Do your fucking research before you start to smear, mmmkay?

And don't, just don't, fall back on the bs "but we have a shotty at home" bullshit.

You obviously have no clue or grasp of the 2nd amendment debate in America. Just leave it alone.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, January 28, 2011 11:19 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

I mis-typed that, it should have been "AK-47 TYPE guns", as in the material I quoted. Of course I know the difference between a true automatic AK-47 and the semi-automatic but similar ones available everywhere today, but it's not that big, so your snark is irrelevant. It speaks to a typo, not a truth.

It is also wrong:

Quote:
Private ownership of fully automatic AK-pattern rifles was regulated by the National Firearms Act (NFA) of 1934. The Gun Control Act of 1968 ceased the import of foreign-manufactured fully automatic firearms for civilian sales and possession.

In 1986, an amendment to the Firearm Owners Protection Act stopped all future domestic manufacturing of fully automatic weapons for civilian use (non-military/non-LEO).

However, automatic firearms manufactured domestically prior to 1986 or imported prior to 1968 may be transferred between civilians in accordance with federal, state and local law. A number of Soviet and PRC rifles were brought into the U.S. during the mid-1960s, when returning Vietnam veterans brought them home after capture from enemy troops. Some of these were properly registered during the amnesty period under the 1968 NFA law.

Semi-automatic AK-type rifles are legal and obtainable in most states of the United States, however they may or may not be legal to own or possess depending on state, county, city, and local laws and ordinances.

The 1989 Semi-Automatic Rifle Import Ban (18 USC 925(d)(3)) and the 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban specifically banned the AK-47 by name, and many other such weapons (including obvious clones of AK-47's) manufactured after 1994 had to be modified to the letter of the law (removal of barrel threading, bayonet lug and folding stock). This ban expired on September 13, 2004, as part of the law's sunset provision, making all domestically produced semi-automatic AK-47s legal.

Got that? Wikipedia is fastest and easiest, but if you need other sources, there are myriad out there which I can quote for you.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, January 28, 2011 11:22 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Okay, you guys got into mental illness, which is off topic but something I have opinions about, so here we go:

Quote:
And now we see one of the "benefits" of ObamaCare.

The governemnt gets to decide if you are "sane" enough to have rights.

Jezus, Wulf...this has nothing to do with the health-care law, you’re REALLY reaching. There is only one right infringed upon, so saying “sane enough to have rights” is reaching even further.

Rose, you made a valid point:

Quote:
one of the reasons he had for not wanting children was his family and personal history of mental illness and instability.

Having been in the mental-health community for over a decade, I can tell you we’ve had numerous discussions on this matter, and more than a few people feel the same way. Given the gene for bipolarity is genetic, they’re scared of passing it on...I mean really SCARED. Especially as the gene is indiscriminate; the child can MANIFEST with any of the mood disorders, from depression to schizophrenia. It’s awfully sad to hear them, but I understand the fear. The irony is that, having known those who DID have children, they made more sensitive, more aware and better parents than many supposedly “sane” people I’ve known! It’s like their fear makes them especially aware of the potentials, which makes them more attentive to their kids and mistakes they might make which their (mentally ill) parents made with them. It’s a sad dichotomy.

On the other hand,

Quote:
The fact of the matter is that if someone is put in a mental institution, they do lose all their rights. Institutions are essentially prisons, with the patients kept rather isolated. Their activities and what they can have are greatly restricted. Guns are the least of it. I'm sure that some of them aren't allowed forks. I'm not saying this is okay, I'm just pointing out the fact.

People institutionalized lose all their rights, agreed; so do people institutionalized in jails. Once out, however, few rights are restricted, guns being one of them.

Which is not to say in ANY way that I’m arguing ANYTHING positive when it comes to mental institutions. I won’t get started on THAT... However, forcibly institutionalized people (it’s called 51/50ing someone) can only be kept there for X amount of time, 48 hours I believe; people found criminally insane by the courts are a different matter, but they’re in the VAST minority. Everyone else has the right to be released quickly, as long as they’re not a danger to themselves or society, and anyone who signs themselves IN can also sign themselves OUT just as readily and the institution can’t stop them.

Magons, sigh...

Quote:
As usual, lots of 'all or nothing' thinking and bat shit crazy conspiracy theories = extremism

I agree. Also sadly,

Quote:
There is a huge difference between suffering from mild depression, and someone who suffers from acute paranoid schizophenia or a psychotic illnesses, yet they all come under the heading 'mental illness'.

The other issue is that people with diagnosed mental illnesses are often quite stable people. They've learnt to manage their illness, and have had support doing it and usually have a deal of insight into their illness and its impact. These are the kind of people who would probably self exclude from ownership of firearms. It those with undiagnosed mental illnesses that cause the most havoc in my view. They may not even be aware of their illness or its impact on themselves and others.

Absolutely right on, in my view. It’s those who ACT OUT their mental illness, which dangerous people usually do numerous times before they get violent, who I believe should be brought to the attention of SOMEONE, Loughner being a perfect example.

The school DID try to talk to his parents and recommend he get help, remember. From then on it was the parents’ responsibility unless he did something that endangered or harmed others.

Wow, Hardware, you made an excellent point which nobody else has mentioned, as far as I know:

Quote:
since Loughner lied on the ATF for 4473 when he obtained his pistol that he had already committed a federal felony?

The problem is, how does anyone KNOW he’d already committed a felony unless he comes to the attention of the authorities, in which case it’s after the fact, so....

Byte, when it comes to

Quote:
The real trick is managing the appearance of day to day functionality.

remember that it cannot be a diagnosed mental illness unless it SEVERELY AFFECTS NORMAL FUNCTIONING. That’s DSM-IV language, always has been, and is the criteria for p-docs diagnosing someone. Unfortunately, “severely affects” is a subjective concept... Loughner’s functioning was DEFINITELY severely affected, as we now know, but given I imagine HE was unaware he was mentally ill, how does a p-doc see him to diagnose him? It’s a conundrum.

With regard to that, DT,

Quote:
Where mainstream society sees us as lunatics, we see them as sheep

I assume you’re able to function? Then have no diagnosable mental illness. Being a crackpot or eccentric, having views outside the norm, do not constitute mental illness. Being able to hold down a job, attend school, etc., because of ACTING OUT, needs to be considered for diagnosis. Only CONSIDERED. Anthony’s got it, you’re “confusing crazy with unstable”. I’m not “crazy” about the term “crazy”, but the concept is what I’m trying to impart.

Quote:
Looking at the world in a special way is very different from being an unstable person. The reason I'm not happy with unstable people having power over others is because, being unstable, even they can't control or predict what they'll do with that power.

Bing...O! And I wouldn’t worry about the government considering undesirable behavior as mental illness; they have plenty of ways of going after “undesirable behavior” without resorting to that.

Rose, to your entire post starting out “Technically correct...” I absolutely agree with every word.

DT, while I agree about “that point has many warning signs that are certain to cross the legal code”, I heartily disagree with

Quote:
I think the mentally ill are largely just people who are aware of the inherent chaos of the human mind, an awareness brought to them by a random event which shocked the system. I don't find the sane to be more rational than the lunatic of whatever stripe.

Many mentally ill people aren’t aware they ARE even mentally ill—I wasn’t, and wasn’t diagnosed until I was 48, and my life would have been VERY different if I’d known earlier. We may BECOME more aware of the vagarities of our minds if we self-educate once diagnosed, but few people who are truly mentally ill are aware of it to begin with. As to random events, yes; once again, we are born with a GENE which might OR MIGHT NOT ever manifest in our lives, and manifestation is usually brought on by some major event. Unfortunately, for the vast majority of us, that event was childhood abuse. To that I can testify, as in all my experience with other mentally ill, far more than half of them manifested because of something in their childhood, usually one kind of abuse or another. Come, admittedly, manifest for no known reason, some manifest because of physical injury, some bipolars (more than should be) manifest because they were given only anti-depressants, without mood stabilizers, which can make us manic. Happened to me, is how I got re-dx’d from depression to bipolarity, and is now a subset of diagnoses in the DSM-IV.

Once again,

Quote:
Depression I would only cure if its extreme or chronic

Depression SHOULD only be treated if it’s severe or chronic—-as in ongoing. Again with the DSM-IV and functioning. Everyone gets depressed; that doesn’t make them unipolar (depressive).

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, January 28, 2011 11:23 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

...and more:

Given you were MIS-diagnosed schiz, DT, I disagree with a number of the things you said.. I’ve always thought next to Borderline, Schiz was the single worst mental illness to battle. What exactly is “happy”? What is “productive”? Americans consider themselves too much as what their occupation is; I believe there are many ways to be productive besides a career. And in my opinion, reversing a “cure” (which is the wrong word, as mood disorders like schiz and bipolarity cannot BE cured, only managed), therein can lie a great danger; those who are helped by meds and who NEED meds to function who stop taking them can be unaware of their problems and become a danger to themselves and/or others.

Quote:
But a therapist has recently led me into a study of cognitive patterns which are more about how we have decided to wire our brains, not as the result of any physical or chemical factors, but by our own agency. These tendencies can be altered slightly by very highly tuned adjustments in diet or supplementation, but ultimately thats a stop gap measure in a means toward cognitive restructuring, and the replacing of negative reinforcement behaviors with more positive ones.

Yes, I’m aware of CBT and diet changes. In the support group I was in, several people did their own experiments with reducing or eliminating white flour, sugar, coffee and other things. It made a dramatic difference in each of their lives...but it IS only a partial “fix”. There are many things we can do aside from meds which can modify the problem, but nothing “fixes” it completely, in my opinion.

What you describe, DT, sounds an awful lot like schiz to ME—which of course is subjective. Given you are able to be aware of the difference between reality and unreality, in my opinion that is all that is needed. It’s those who either can’t or have to fight HARD to (again, “A Beautiful Mind” and the battles he went through) are the ones I believe need help; as long as one can recognize the difference, one can control it, or at the very least not give in to it, and nothing further is needed. As you said, it’s an aspect of you which may sometimes be difficult, sometimes only a nuisance, but you can deal with it. Loughner (if he truly is a paranoid schiz) couldn’t. Biiig difference.

Oh, I take part of that back. I don’t know about other mental illnesses, but unipolarity and bipolarity CAN cease to be, for some people, in old age. So I read. Not sure why.

Quote:
The chronic ruminator will often see connections in his past to his future which are tenuous at best, and eventually can convince himself that he is entirely a product of his past. Once he has done this, it can be exceedingly difficult for him to accept the influences of the present, and indeed, the influences of his own repetitive thought patterns on his future thoughts.

Oh, SO true; I’ve known many like that too. The of EMDR (which was incredibly helpful for me) is to see what happened in the past which might still be affecting us through today’s eyes, adult eyes, which usually shows that we internalized something which wasn’t actually about US, but as children we took it as such. Once seen, we’re almost always able to change the pattern, the triggers, etc. Some people can “move on” without seeing the past---but not many, as what affected us before almost always affects us SUBCONSCIOUSLY---but however we deal with it, the concept is to LET it be in the past and go from “now”. I’ve known both kinds of those, too.

I agree with everything you said in THAT post, too, Rose. I wouldn’t say I’m “happier” now; I’m definitely more peaceful and more content and less stressed. While I wish I could work again, I look back at my life and it astonishes me how I raced around madly, lived by impulse, lost friends and didn’t really “live”. I’m aware now, which I never was before. And yes, I’m still on meds...I’m lucky not to have the severe side effects some suffer, my meds are minimal, don’t fog me up or anything, so I have no desire to go off them. I also practice a lot of things which have equally changed my life and my outlook, so I use all the tools available to me. I’m also tickled you found one of the “good” ones...sometimes they’re virtually impossible to find, and people get abused because of trusting them too much...especially p-docs (I won’t get started on THAT, either!).

Byte, your story is far too familiar as well. The psychiatric profession has a LONG ways to go, and unfortunately those who run it have some very bad attitudes. The things I’ve seen and experienced is that they medicate us into zombie state or institutionalize us JUST until they consider we aren’t “acting out” anymore, then turn us loose, often worse off than we were before. As to medicating a ten year old, gawd, I won’t even get into that, this is already farrr too long and I’d start spewing obscenities. I’m so sorry you went through that; smoke comes out of my ears when I hear a story like yours, it’s all I can do not to scream.

DT:

Quote:
Bipolar is an opinion of an observation of a collection of symptoms.

Yes, and the same is true of depression and schizophrenia, UNTIL they can come up with a physical diagnostic tool. Which they have, by the way, down at Stanford and other places, it’s just not yet ready for wide use. I wish I could get into it to find out for sure, tho’ only out of curiosity. Because yes, at the present time and up until now, they’re only subjective diagnoses and therefore fallible. Which, by the way, is how I got mis-dx’d unipolar, and I ended up researching, comparing, talking to those close to me about whether I fit the symptom pattern (to which, every one of them said “Yeah, that’s you...”) and considering things in my past before I went back to the p-doc and got re-dx’d. It came about because I was only given antidepressants and went hypomanic.

Okay, I'll quit now.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, January 28, 2011 11:45 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Wow.

3 very long posts to say:

"Don't worry! ObamaCare is GREAT! Just submit to its will, and you might be able to keep your means of self-protection! YAY OBAMACARE!"

Good job Niki.

Seriously, do they hand out pom-poms to those that tow the line? Im curious.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Friday, January 28, 2011 12:05 PM

DREAMTROVE

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Lowering dopamine is a good idea when it's as high as mine. After a certain point, all the extra activity stops being smarts and fun and starts being paranoia and insomnia. I can have much more fun and apply myself more effectively when I'm not freaking out. Outside observers have said I'm quicker and funnier, and most of my teachers have complimented my intelligence this week. Lowering it enough to quell the constant stomach-gnawing worry has not damaged my capacity.
Lowering high leptin can make you lose weight. If it's too low or too high, constant hunger is an issue. Same with lowering high insulin. I've lost forty pounds. The clinic my doctor runs actually specializes in weight loss and longevity, as well as mood.
I got much of the basic information on what these chemicals can do from my doctor. He walked me through the possible issues and then walked me through my test results. Since then I've read a few books and every article I could find about it. I've gone back to school wanting to study neurochemistry, officially. The more I learn about it, the more I want to. Since it's been one of the most transformative and positive times in my life, I naturally came to believe that everyone could benefit from having a look at what their nervous and endocrin systems were up to. I like having explanations and options. It opened up my world, as well as setting me on a whole new course of study that I can actually get excited about. Turns out not everyone is as enthused as me, of course, but I still think there could be great benefit in just getting the test results. They're very cool to see, and can tell you what your options are, whether you want to take them or not. Trouble is, my doctor is very unusual, so I don't know what to tell people who don't live here, other than to look for a D.O. who studied endocrinology and won't deal with insurance companies because they insist he use treatment options he doesn't agree with. It's a rare animal. I'm constantly glad that he could be found right next to my own little city.

Ritual is what happens when we run out of rational.

PR

That's actually your norepinephrine. Excess dopamine gets converted into norep which runs your fear center. It's not the one directly keeping you awake, but indirectly, because norep is a universal stimulant which raises the cortisol levels, and it's the cortisol keeping you awake.

You might want to lay off the norep booster if it's this severe. Your body won't really let you have too much dopamine or serotonin, so you won't be able to get there without some major drugs. Excess serotonin is converted to melatonin which helps you sleep. Still, I think boosting serotonin is a lot healthier, taking melatonin directly acts as a depressant, and can lower your melatonin sensitivity causing more insomnia if overused.

It's a fascinating topic, and one that I've been studying for a decade now. I could rant forever on it (I've ranted a lot on this board over the years.)

One key factor is to understand how NT systems effect one another. Like X boosts Y and Z but competes with A and actively inhibits B, etc.

I'm about as certain as I can be that norepinephrine is responsible for fear because I have a potent specific norep-inhibitor, which is Kava. It will kill all your fears in just a couple minutes. I mean, it's instant normal, but alas, also dangerous, if used long term.

Dopamine inhibitors just gave me amnesia.

Another really excellent thing for sleep is exercise. The human body is designed to get four hours of exercise a day, and most of us don't manage it. I do in the summer, but unfortunately I live in an area with endless winter, so I get out of shape.

Dinner also boosts sleep. I'm not eating dinner at the moment, because I'm trying to lose weight. I'm under 200 now and happy about it, I want to be around 150. I gained weight initially because of the antidepressants, which sent me from 150 to 250. I got back down to 180, when a friend of mine talked me into his fitness plan, and part of it was that you couldn't check your weight until the first month was over. At that point it was 220. Ouch. Since then I haven't gotten under 200 until this week. A little allostasis set in there.

My main problem I want to fix is the induced memory problems. I need to go through some radical mental resistance training (remember, any change you make your body is likely to adjust to in the long term, so if you change levels, and keep them changed, your body will change the number of receptors in the opposing direction) So, for instance, I've been sluggish and forgetful, so I want to take sedatives until my body adjusts to their presence, and then take them away, and when my body reacts to that, give it some decent brain fuel so it will adjust to accept higher NT level production.

There's balance, and then there's overall numbers, and amount of neurological activity. If you have 3x and 1y, that's an imbalance. 2x and 2y is a balance, as is 1x and 1y and 3x and 3y. Pharma tends to want to lower the 3x to 1x, herbal supplements tend to want to raise the 1y to 3y. The latter is probably a better idea in most cases, but not necessarily.

Then there's the whole signal to noise ratio issue... As I said, I could go all Niki on you on this sort of post

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Friday, January 28, 2011 12:09 PM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Quote:
"Don't worry! ObamaCare is GREAT! Just submit to its will, and you might be able to keep your means of self-protection! YAY OBAMACARE!"

Are you fucking KIDDING me??? What has ANY of this got to do with "Obamacare"??? Have you completely lost your mind, Wulf, or disappeared completely into your fantasy world?!?!

All of what I discussed has been the case since long, LONG before Obama was ever even nominated, much less elected.

The first post was to you, the rest were to everyone else who had been discussing mental illness. Or didn't you comprehend that? None of it had ANYTHING to do with the new health-care law.

You're really losing it, boy; TRY to pay attention!

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Friday, January 28, 2011 12:33 PM

PHOENIXROSE

You think you know--what's to come, what you are. You haven't even begun.

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
3 very long posts to say:

"Don't worry! ObamaCare is GREAT! Just submit to its will, and you might be able to keep your means of self-protection! YAY OBAMACARE!"

Um. That isn't what she said.
I do wonder what part of the healthcare bill you think is saying that the government will chose your treatment. Most insurance companies will only cover certain treatments, but you can take other options if you have any means to, and refuse treatments if you wish to. So what exactly is different about medicaid or other government coverage? I'm not saying I don't think more options should be covered, I'm just wondering exactly where you see the difference.

Ritual is what happens when we run out of rational.

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Friday, January 28, 2011 1:39 PM

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Niki, I agree with your post on mental illness. To me, it's not about being happy all the time or to be considered normal. It's about being well. People should be able to experience the full gamut of human emotions, happiness through to despair, as life circumstances decree. That is all about being mentally well. When people are not mentally well, many of those emotional states are either blunted, or experienced in the extreme. Part of being well is the capacity to manage your emotions, to know that the grief will pass, just like the joy. And to be able to function enough to have an okay life. To be able to hold down a job, have relationships, etc etc.

Re Institutions - I have mixed feelings about them. These days it's pretty difficult to even find a temporary place to recover if you're experiencing the most serious of mental illnesses, and the result is a lot of mentally ill people taking themselves off their meds, becoming unstable and ending up homeless or in jail. I think they threw out the baby with the bath water when they closed the institutions, because they didn't need to be places of persecution, they could have been places of recovery and for some people in chronic cases, somewhere appropriate to live.

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Sunday, January 30, 2011 7:02 AM

KANEMAN

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
Quote:
"Don't worry! ObamaCare is GREAT! Just submit to its will, and you might be able to keep your means of self-protection! YAY OBAMACARE!"
Are you fucking KIDDING me??? What has ANY of this got to do with "Obamacare"??? Have you completely lost your mind, Wulf, or disappeared completely into your fantasy world?!?!

All of what I discussed has been the case since long, LONG before Obama was ever even nominated, much less elected.

The first post was to you, the rest were to everyone else who had been discussing mental illness. Or didn't you comprehend that? None of it had ANYTHING to do with the new health-care law.

You're really losing it, boy; TRY to pay attention!

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

Why is it always about Obamacare with you liberals? Wulf was just pointing out how retarded your point was. So, do you get pom poms? Stop turning a serious topic about something important into a talk about something that will ultimatly be de-funded or repealed.

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Sunday, January 30, 2011 7:41 AM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
"But if you want to buy more than two AK-47s, that’s not only perfectly legal, it doesn’t get reported to the ATF!"

Jesus Christ Niki.

AK-47s, as you understand them, have been illegal since the 60s.

THERE ARE NO LONGER ANY FULLY AUTOMATIC WEAPONS ALLOWED.

The most us peons can hope to get are semi-auto rifles.

Do your fucking research before you start to smear, mmmkay?

And don't, just don't, fall back on the bs "but we have a shotty at home" bullshit.

You obviously have no clue or grasp of the 2nd amendment debate in America. Just leave it alone.

Wulfie, it's more than a bit ironic that YOU have no idea what the hell you're talking about. Of course full-auto weapons are still legally obtainable. So are "silencers", or suppressors. You just have to fill out the right paperwork and get approved. I personally know two people who've done so in the past year.

Yup, believe it or not, I (a lefty-looney lib) personally know TWO people who've not only NOT had their guns all taken away by Obama (despite the howling protestations by the right that he's coming for them), but who've actually gotten approved for machinegun ownership AND suppressor/silencer ownership.

The claims you're making would make it illegal to go to a machinegun shoot, and I know where there's one held every month, open to the public. Wouldn't the ATF swoop in and arrest everybody there if your claims had any credence?

But keep on spreading the idiocy that Obama's gonna steal your guns. Completely ignore all reality, and never let the facts stand in your way. It's gotten you this far, after all.

This Space For Rent!

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Tuesday, February 1, 2011 8:26 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

Except:

They were more than likely allowed under the "grandfather clause" WHICH essentially states that they bought USED auto-weapons as fully-automatic weapons (new) are not allowed to be imported.

"The claims you're making would make it illegal to go to a machinegun shoot, and I know where there's one held every month, open to the public. Wouldn't the ATF swoop in and arrest everybody there if your claims had any credence?"

AGAIN, these are PRE-ban weapons.

Now, if Im mistaken, please tell me where I can get my hands on a full auto Russina-built *current* AK (drool), or a full auto MP5...

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Tuesday, February 1, 2011 9:09 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

Magons, your attitude about mental illness is excellent, and something we try to impart to anyone newly-diagnosed who comes onto our site.

The problem for ME, and others, was that the gamut of emotions I/we experienced was so far outside the norm that it interfered with our functioning, having relationships, or leading the quality of life to which we were entitled, that we needed to seek some kind of help.

My "hero" is Hagop Akiskal (who I may have mentioned before). He's specialized in bipolarity for decdes, and has said so many things I think the entire psychiatric community should learn, that it's frustrating they haven't. He was one of the first to admonish that "medicating them into mediocrity" was something of which the psychiatric community was all too willing to do; he kept saying that what people wanted was to aleviate the SYMPTOMS of their illness, while leaving the beneficial aspects (i.e., for bipolars, higher IQ, artistic talents, etc.) unhindered. That's something psychiatry just doesn't seem to grasp as of yet. "Take a pill" is about it for many p-docs, and after that they just want us to check in periodically to make sure we're not "acting out". Bah!

As to facilities, I've observed the exact opposite, in some ways. It seems, as above, the concept now is to admit people JUST until they stop "acting out", then turn them loose, period. I saw it over and over with Jo when she lived with us; I'd take her to the psychiatric ward or have to call the police or EMTs to do so when I couldn't handle her; they'd toss her in the psychiatric ward and she'd come out with new medications or increased medications a day or two later, with nothing else by way of treatment or resources.

It's possible this is different from place to place; the only experience I had with psychiatric facilities was here in Marin and once in San Francisco (which was horrific; I didn't want to let her go in originally and wouldn't have if there'd been any other option, and pulled her out the next morning when she asked me to).

As to Wulf, thank gawd he doesn’t know where to get his hands on what he wants, and please, don’t anyone tell him where to! He’s one of the last people I would feel comfortable about having a “weapon of mass destruction”, given his attitudes and beliefs!

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Tuesday, February 1, 2011 9:35 AM

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...

By the way, as to noncompliance. From what I've observed over the years, people more often become noncompliant with their medications because of the extreme side effects--the blood/brain barrier, etc. A large proportion also do so because the medication DO work, and they're convinced they're "fixed". It's been shown, and I've both observed it and experienced it myself, that many of us are affected by our illness in that when we're not in an episode of one form or another, our brain FORGETS how it was when we were, so the danger of feeling like "that will never happen again" makes some become noncompliant.

But I do agree that lack of resources, AND the omission by p-docs of stressing the importance of things other than medication, attributes to noncompliance in many cases. We work hard at encouraging "newcomers" to the disorders to self-educate, learn coping skills and symptom modification strategies, get therapy, learn their own "triggers", insist on trying other medications if the ones they're put on aren't working or cause bad side effects, and essentially utilize every resource they can find to mitigate their symptoms. Medication, when it works at all, should be emphasized as ONLY the first step; far too many walk out of the p-doc's office with a diagnosis and a prescription, and nothing else. This has been a personal bugaboo to me for over a decade now, and continues to be maddening. Psychiatry seems to prefer being stuck and not moving forward when it comes to treatment...but I should stop talking about that, as it belongs in the other thread. We've kind of gotten off topic in this one, tho' I found the side discussion very interesting.

Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off

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Tuesday, February 1, 2011 4:52 PM

KWICKO

Quote:
Originally posted by Wulfenstar:
Except:

They were more than likely allowed under the "grandfather clause" WHICH essentially states that they bought USED auto-weapons as fully-automatic weapons (new) are not allowed to be imported.

There are several types of weapons that are not allowed to be *imported*, but are still perfectly legal to have and to own. You're shifting the goalposts. I showed you that you were wrong, so you tried to change your argument because you'd been shown up.

Tried to import a Dragunov lately? Tried to BUY one lately? (Hint: You can still legally do the latter)

Quote:

"The claims you're making would make it illegal to go to a machinegun shoot, and I know where there's one held every month, open to the public. Wouldn't the ATF swoop in and arrest everybody there if your claims had any credence?"

AGAIN, these are PRE-ban weapons.

Again, these are FULLY-AUTOMATIC weapons, which you claimed were illegal.

Quote:

Now, if Im mistaken, please tell me where I can get my hands on a full auto Russina-built *current* AK (drool), or a full auto MP5...

Where you can get your hands on one? That's easy. *Legally*? That's somewhat trickier.

But you have no use for "laws" anyway, right? So why would you care if it's legal or not?

This Space For Rent!

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Tuesday, February 1, 2011 8:49 PM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I just wanted to step in here for a moment.

You can legally acquire fully automatic weapons in the United States if you pay a fee to the Federal government, which registers your weapon, and submit to a background check.

You can also legally convert semi-autos to full-auto with the right fees and paperwork. You can also shorten barrels and build silencers.

It's expensive, and often prohibitively so, but not illegal.

The erstwhile Assault Weapons Ban had nothing to do with any of that, however.

Warm regards,

--Anthony

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 2:11 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

AnT-

Don't these have to be "grand-fathered" automatics? (Guns produced before 1968?)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_Control_Act_of_1968

(Heh, if Im wrong... Im starting a Vera change-jar...)
"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 5:14 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

The Mp5 was produced starting in 1966. Surely you've seen one or two kicking around? I promise they weren't all 'grandfathered' in. There's simply too many in too good a condition.

Check out a class III dealer in your area. Discover the world of legal machine-gun ownership.

Oh, and make sure you have a lot of money and a clean record.

--Anthony

Edited for grammar and clarity

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 5:28 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

"Title II of the Gun Control Act of 1968 is a revision of the National Firearms Act of 1934, and pertains to machine guns, short or "sawed-off" shotguns and rifles, and so-called "destructive devices" (including grenades, mortars, rocket launchers, large projectiles, and other heavy ordance).Acquisition of these weapons is subject to prior approval of the Attorney General, and federal registration is required for possession. Generally, a $200 tax is imposed upon each transfer or making of any Title II weapon."

Hello,

Here is the relevant brief.

The 'prior approval' is your Federal paperwork and background check.

Most modern class-III machineguns are, I believe, re-manufactured in the States to be that way. They are not imported that way, to my knowledge.

ETA: See this listing
http://www.impactguns.com/store/MGT-1077.html

It speaks of a 'conversion' conducted by a particular company. I think this is the local remanufacture of a weapon to be fully automatic.

--Anthony

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 5:37 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

Now, if I am mistaken on any particular point, I am happy to be cured of my delusions. However, the large number of automatic weapons available in my area that were clearly constructed after 1968 leads me to believe that Title II is being used to re-manufacture weapons locally into fully automatic status, and then sell them on the market for exorbitant fees to people who get the proper permissions and pay the proper taxes to the Feds.

--Anthony

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 6:04 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I have just learned that with the proper FFL license, you can manufacture brand-new machine-guns. However, you cannot transfer them to ordinary citizens, and must dispose of them if you ever lose your license.

I wonder how many people are FFL dealers and manufacturers on paper, but really just have the 'business' so that they can enjoy machine-gun ownership?

--Anthony

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 6:06 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

AnT-

Has anyone, to your knowledge, argued that this process is prohibative? That it makes it unfairly difficult to practice a right?

Its kind of like: Hey, you CAN practice free speech IF you fill out these forms, submit to a backround check taking 6 months, and have at least 100 dollars per word?

Just curious.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 6:47 AM

Freedom is Important because People are Important

Hello,

I am not aware of any such challenge, but I am not a lawyer.

I personally do feel the process is prohibitive. I feel the citizenry and the police forces should be able to maintain an arms parity.

--Anthony

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 7:02 AM

http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg

I would argue that the citizenry should be able to maintain an arms parity, not only with the police, but with the military. (At least, in terms of small arms.)

Well, maybe if Hero (whom I think is a lawyer) is sniffing about, maybe he could answer the question.

"Hope is a good thing, maybe the best of things, and no good thing ever dies"

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 7:31 AM

HARDWARE

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
Hello,

The Mp5 was produced starting in 1966. Surely you've seen one or two kicking around? I promise they weren't all 'grandfathered' in. There's simply too many in too good a condition.

Check out a class III dealer in your area. Discover the world of legal machine-gun ownership.

Oh, and make sure you have a lot of money and a clean record.

--Anthony

Edited for grammar and clarity

Assured by friends that the signal-to-noise ratio has improved on this forum, I have disabled web filtering.

The Gun Control Act of 1968 required registration of all class 3 firearms. In 1986 a new piece of legislation was passed that created a machine gun registry where those full auto guns were all organized on a list. This unalterably capped the number of fully automatic weapons available to the public. The registry has never been funded since it was created, causing the cap, a de facto ban on new full auto guns.

Now, the recent SCOTUS decisions, Heller and McDonald, refer to the type of guns already in use. It is as if there was a no blacks ban in a building and SCOTUS said it was okay to allow the type of people who commonly use the building to continue using the building. HELLO! You can't declare a restricted mark the baseline for freedom.

The more I get to know people the more I like my dogs.

...and he that has no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. Luke 22:36

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Thursday, February 3, 2011 7:40 AM