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REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS
If you're a Democrat, obviously you're a Communist!
Monday, April 16, 2012 6:54 AM
NIKI2
Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...
Quote:"I have here in my hand a list of 205 communists ..." The ghost of Joe McCarthy's ulcerous accusations hung over a disturbingly casual comment this past week by U.S. Rep. Allen West, R-Florida. When asked by a constituent at a town hall, "What percentage of the American legislature do you think are card-carrying Marxists?" "That's a fair question," West replied. "I believe there's about 78 to 81 members of the Democratic Party that are members of the Communist Party." Keep in mind that this is the man Sarah Palin recently recommended be Mitt Romney's vice presidential nominee. John P. AvlonAnd not only did West not apologize -- or receive significant criticism from his fellow Republicans -- his revealing response was to raise funds off it. The number West picked out was apparently based on the number of congressmen affiliated with the Congressional Progressive Caucus. This is an organization of the most liberal members of Congress, but to call them communists is a slander splashed with blood. Communists, of course, murdered more than 100 million people in the past century, if you add up the rough total of butchery by Vladimir Lenin (Soviet Union), Joseph Stalin (Soviet Union), Mao Zedong (China) and Pol Pot (Cambodia). This is the reason people were understandably offended at Miami Manager Ozzie Guillen's recent comments professing admiration for Cuban Communist dictator Fidel Castro. But there were no widespread protests or requests for censure in West's case. Instead it was greeted as an almost unremarkable part of the new normal. A military man of West's rank understands the magnitude of his misstatement. So I'm assuming that he was sincere in the accusation. To equate liberals in Congress with communists is like equating conservatives in Congress with fascists -- something only the most brain-dead Occupy protester would attempt. And just for a moment imagine if a liberal member of Congress made an equal and opposite accusation, saying that all the members of the tea party caucus were Nazis. It would be rightly greeted with wall-to-wall outrage. But the asymmetric polarization of our politics has made such accusations within the easy reach of politically successful ideologues at unguarded moments. West's comments were simply extensions of U.S. Rep. Michele Bachmann's infamous statement in 2008 about how then-candidate Barack Obama -- and many Democratic members of Congress -- held "anti-American views." They really believe this stuff: Anyone who is not avowedly conservative is considered liberal -- and therefore anyone who is avowedly liberal is considered communist. This is not a little insane. It is this logic also that allows conservative activists to paint Obama as socialist or communist. Anything even slightly left of center is immediately seen as extreme. Thereby ideas embraced by Republicans even a decade ago -- such as the individual mandate to buy health insurance -- are now seen as radical and a clear attempt to undermine the U.S. Constitution and replace freedom with socialism. This is what happens when politics starts looking like a cult with litmus tests and loyalty oaths and periodic purges of anyone who dissents. Perspective is the first thing abandoned. And when a member of your "team" says something extreme, it is either ignored or excused by invoking extreme statements from the other side of the ideological gulf -- therefore the conservative response to Rush Limbaugh calling Sandra Fluke a slut was to try and make the debate about Bill Maher's past statements about Sarah Palin. An insensitive but not entirely inaccurate statement by liberal pundit Hilary Rosen is suddenly seen as serving as a surrogate for the Obama campaign despite their immediate denunciations of it. Extending this logic, Mitt Romney will be held that responsible for anything extreme conservative talking heads say in this campaign. Fundraising off extreme statements is just the latest innovation -- something even more cynical than anything Joe McCarthy might have tried. At least for now, West is not a new McCarthy. He's not a fearful force, but a fringe voice in Congress. But the ratcheting up of rhetoric has been occurring for so long that we almost don't notice it anymore. This feeds the cycle of incitement that is polarizing our politics. It will only stop when members of the two parties start condemning extreme comments made by members of their own team. And if elected officials start to equate liberals with communists, it is time to break the glass in case of emergency, because we are losing any sense of perspective in American politics. http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/15/opinion/avlon-west-communists/index.html?iid=article_sidebar, hear! And Dems DID condemn Rosen's comments, bear in mind (despite the fact that I think what she said was actually understood by the majority of people as being that she'd never had a "job"). Essentially, "anything goes" on the right, including insanity and already-PROVEN flat-out lies! Where does it stop? Or DOES it? How do we get back to sanity? Or DO we?
Monday, April 16, 2012 9:21 AM
M52NICKERSON
DALEK!
Monday, April 16, 2012 9:22 AM
Quote:Originally posted by m52nickerson: Allen West is nutty as squire crap. I honestly think people voted him in just to troll Washington. I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
Monday, April 16, 2012 10:36 AM
WULFENSTAR
http://youtu.be/VUnGTXRxGHg
Monday, April 16, 2012 10:43 AM
AURAPTOR
America loves a winner!
Monday, April 16, 2012 11:00 AM
KWICKO
"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money
Monday, April 16, 2012 11:01 AM
Quote:Originally posted by WULFENSTAR: No... You are now National-Socialists. Communists as well, but Nazis first. "None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."
Monday, April 16, 2012 11:15 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money Seems to be the problem with capitalism, too.
Monday, April 16, 2012 11:19 AM
KPO
Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.
Quote:Communists as well, but Nazis first.
Monday, April 16, 2012 1:20 PM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money Seems to be the problem with capitalism, too. And, as ever, Kwickie puts on a stunning display of just how little he'll ever know about... anything .
Monday, April 16, 2012 4:37 PM
FREMDFIRMA
Monday, April 16, 2012 6:02 PM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 1:20 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: How much money did the federal government have to give the financial sector when they ran out of other people's money in 2008, while you were screaming about the economy being "on fire"?
Quote: Look Rappy and his pet Wolf are trying to use words that don't understand. Next they will try and claim that they can get a higher security level then the president like Allen West did.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 1:28 AM
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: But since it was primarily the fault of govt in the first place, dabbling in the free market and forcing banks to make bad loans to those who couldn't repay them,
Quote:Originally posted by AURaptor: Never heard of Margaret Thatcher, huh? And I'm not Lt Col Allen West, so I can't speak as to what level of security HE can get.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 2:58 AM
GEEZER
Keep the Shiny side up
Quote:Originally posted by Niki2: They really believe this stuff: Anyone who is not avowedly conservative is considered liberal -- and therefore anyone who is avowedly liberal is considered communist. This is not a little insane.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 3:26 AM
CAVETROLL
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 3:28 AM
Quote:Originally posted by GEEZER: Quote:Originally posted by Niki2: They really believe this stuff: Anyone who is not avowedly conservative is considered liberal -- and therefore anyone who is avowedly liberal is considered communist. This is not a little insane. Or: They really believe this stuff: Anyone who is not avowedly liberal is considered conservative -- and therefore anyone who is avowedly conservative is considered Nazi. This is not a little insane.
Quote:And just for a moment imagine if a liberal member of Congress made an equal and opposite accusation, saying that all the members of the tea party caucus were Nazis. It would be rightly greeted with wall-to-wall outrage.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 4:36 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:07 AM
STORYMARK
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:09 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:11 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Niki2: I simply HAVE to believe Wulf was joking. Surely not even HE is that dumb?!
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:25 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:39 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 5:46 AM
Quote:Originally posted by WULFENSTAR: Communism (which is an ethos of the same vein as National-Socialism) is also alive and well within the Democratic Party. Evidence being that the self-proclaimed Communist Party has overwhelmingly supported Democratic Lib-Prog candidates. Not to mention its open support of the so-called Occupy "movement".
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 6:11 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 6:26 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 6:36 AM
AGENTROUKA
Quote:Originally posted by WULFENSTAR: Liberals-Progressives support Socialism on a National scale. Look at ObamaCare, or spreading-the-wealth, or any of a hundred other things they've done and/or are trying to do. Thus, the term National-Socialist (i.e. NAZI) applies. Nazism isn't just about trains, gas, and death camps. (Tho, that is its end result.) Its also political correctness, censorship, disarmament and propaganda. I could point out the times where the Democratic Lib-Prog Party has engaged in such things, but then this post would go on for days, and days, and days.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 7:04 AM
Quote:Originally posted by AgentRouka: Dude. No. Seriously. No. You seem to have no trace of a clue what national socialism was. It was first and foremost an ideology based on a paranoid racism and the idea that a people (a "nation", hence "national") form an identity greater than the individual to the point where the individual is a meaningless part of that fictional whole. The purity of that "nation" must be preserved against intermixing and interference from other such super-identity groups, ones that are (of COURSE) genetically inferior.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 7:25 AM
Quote:Originally posted by kpo: From the article: Quote:And just for a moment imagine if a liberal member of Congress made an equal and opposite accusation, saying that all the members of the tea party caucus were Nazis. It would be rightly greeted with wall-to-wall outrage.
Quote: Say What? Democrat Compares Republicans to Nazis ABC News Jonathan Karl reports: The newfound civility didn’t last long. Political rhetoric in Congress doesn’t get much nastier than the words of one House Democrat during the debate on repealing the health care law. In an extraordinary outburst on the House floor, Rep. Steve Cohen (D-TN) invoked the Holocaust to attack Republicans on health care and compared rhetoric on the issue to the work of infamous Nazi propagandist Joseph Goebbels. “They say it's a government takeover of health care, a big lie just like Goebbels," Cohen said. "You say it enough, you repeat the lie, you repeat the lie, and eventually, people believe it. Like blood libel. That's the same kind of thing. And Congressman Cohen didn’t stop there. “The Germans said enough about the Jews and people believed it–believed it and you have the Holocaust. We heard on this floor, government takeover of health care. Politifact said the biggest lie of 2010 was a government takeover of health care because there is no government takeover," Cohen said. Cohen made his comments late last night, but they have attracted no attention because his speech was made to a virtually empty House chamber with no reporters around to watch.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 7:53 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Niki2: Geezer, I'm confused. Wulf said we were National-Socialists, Commies AND Nazis...can we be Nazis too?
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 7:57 AM
Quote:Originally posted by GEEZER: Quote:Originally posted by kpo: From the article: Quote:And just for a moment imagine if a liberal member of Congress made an equal and opposite accusation, saying that all the members of the tea party caucus were Nazis. It would be rightly greeted with wall-to-wall outrage. Or not. Quote: Say What? Democrat Compares Republicans to Nazis ABC News Jonathan Karl reports: The newfound civility didn’t last long. Political rhetoric in Congress doesn’t get much nastier than the words of one House Democrat during the debate on repealing the health care law. In an extraordinary outburst on the House floor, Rep. Steve Cohen (D-TN) invoked the Holocaust to attack Republicans on health care and compared rhetoric on the issue to the work of infamous Nazi propagandist Joseph Goebbels. “They say it's a government takeover of health care, a big lie just like Goebbels," Cohen said. "You say it enough, you repeat the lie, you repeat the lie, and eventually, people believe it. Like blood libel. That's the same kind of thing. And Congressman Cohen didn’t stop there. “The Germans said enough about the Jews and people believed it–believed it and you have the Holocaust. We heard on this floor, government takeover of health care. Politifact said the biggest lie of 2010 was a government takeover of health care because there is no government takeover," Cohen said. Cohen made his comments late last night, but they have attracted no attention because his speech was made to a virtually empty House chamber with no reporters around to watch. http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/01/abc-news-jonathan-karl-reports-the-newfound-civility-didnt-last-long-political-rhetoric-in-congress-doesnt-get-much/ And he didn't even limit it to the Tea Party Republicans.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 8:01 AM
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 8:02 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: That's only because the Republicans themselves don't limit such behavior to the tea-bagging contingent within their ranks.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 8:05 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Riiiiiight, Geezer. Saying someone lied, "like" Goebbels is EXACTLY the same as saying some is a Nazi.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 8:10 AM
Quote:Originally posted by GEEZER: Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Riiiiiight, Geezer. Saying someone lied, "like" Goebbels is EXACTLY the same as saying some is a Nazi. Take it up with ABC. It's their story. There's a quote and a cite and everything. Really. Try and keep up.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 9:12 AM
Quote:Originally posted by GEEZER: Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: That's only because the Republicans themselves don't limit such behavior to the tea-bagging contingent within their ranks. And now there'll be no wall-to-wall outrage at you calling Republicans Nazis either.
Tuesday, April 17, 2012 9:16 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Quote:Originally posted by GEEZER: Quote:Originally posted by Storymark: Riiiiiight, Geezer. Saying someone lied, "like" Goebbels is EXACTLY the same as saying some is a Nazi. Take it up with ABC. It's their story. There's a quote and a cite and everything. Really. Try and keep up. ....Wow. I didn't take issue with the story - but with how YOU presented it. Keep up, indeed. "Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"
Wednesday, April 18, 2012 2:34 AM
Quote:Originally posted by Kwicko: So to sum up: ABC expressed some outrage (or at least framed the story in an outrageous fashion), and I've no doubt that Fox did the same, so you have outrageous coverage from the "liberal media" AND the right-wing mouthpieces at Fox. Sounds pretty wall-to-wall to me.
Wednesday, April 18, 2012 2:47 AM
Wednesday, April 18, 2012 6:07 AM
Thursday, April 19, 2012 10:26 AM
Thursday, April 19, 2012 10:47 AM
Thursday, April 19, 2012 10:53 AM
Quote:Originally posted by WULFENSTAR: Gun-Control - Democrats. Political Correctness - Democrats. Affirmative Action - Democrats. ObamaCare - Democrats. The ones posing as Republicans are no better. Might be time for us to choose differently. How many here are not fooled by the "Blue vs. Red" setup we've been given? Yeah, Americans love a winner. Love our sports. Love our under-dog winner stories. After all, its the story of our entire culture. But it might have been hijacked. Might be time for a new direction.
Thursday, April 19, 2012 12:20 PM
CUDA77
Like woman, I am a mystery.
Quote:Originally posted by WULFENSTAR: Gun-Control - Democrats. Political Correctness - Democrats. Affirmative Action - Democrats. ObamaCare - Democrats. The ones posing as Republicans are no better. Might be time for us to choose differently. How many here are not fooled by the "Blue vs. Red" setup we've been given? Yeah, Americans love a winner. Love our sports. Love our under-dog winner stories. After all, its the story of our entire culture. But it might have been hijacked. Might be time for a new direction. "None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you... YOU are locked in here with ME."
Thursday, April 19, 2012 6:05 PM
Quote:Say What? Democrat Compares Republicans to Nazis
Thursday, April 19, 2012 6:37 PM
PIRATENEWS
John Lee, conspiracy therapist at Hollywood award-winner History Channel-mocked SNL-spoofed PirateNew.org wooHOO!!!!!!
Friday, April 20, 2012 5:58 AM
Quote:Ellison declined the opportunity to return the rhetorical fire to Republicans across the aisle, calling such an exchange "childlike." "There's a lot of ugly names you could call someone who has a right-wing perspective — on the extreme — but we don't engage in tit-for-tat because that's childlike, we're adults," he said. "We swore an oath to uphold the U.S. Constitution, and that's what I'm going to do, I'm not going to be distracted by somebody who is not clear on what we are supposed to be doing over here." http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/house/222637-house-dems-dismiss-wests-childlike-communist-comments no, that's not all he said, he doubled down:Quote:"I'm just talking about the fact of the ideologies, the principles you believe in," he said on CNN, urging others to "stand upon truth" and learn to identify the ideological motivations of members of Congress. "I'm calling it this: communist, progressive, Marxist, socialist, statist." “I’m not going to back down. I’m not going to be afraid about the fact that I called a spade a spade," he said Tuesday. http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/222479-rep-west-doubles-down-on-communist-ideology-of-progressive-caucus also went furtherQuote:West reiterated the "communist" comments he made last week, telling CNN on Thursday that progressivism was just a new name for the American communist party. "At the turn of the century here in the United States of America, American communists renamed themselves progressives, but the strategy, the tactics, the ideology remains the same. Same cite as firstAs to the blog in question, I assume Geezer didn't notice that it was an OPINION piece, not a news story... Reading Wulf's various "remarks" (I use the term loosely), I was hit with the perfect description of what he does: He PONTIFICATES! Never thought of it before, recognized the condescension and apparent belief that he is "teaching" us...or somesuch...but that word hit me as I was reading, and it is the most apropos description, surprised it didn't occur to me before. Of course, he pontificates IGNORANTLY, but that's kind of beside the point.
Quote:"I'm just talking about the fact of the ideologies, the principles you believe in," he said on CNN, urging others to "stand upon truth" and learn to identify the ideological motivations of members of Congress. "I'm calling it this: communist, progressive, Marxist, socialist, statist." “I’m not going to back down. I’m not going to be afraid about the fact that I called a spade a spade," he said Tuesday. http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/222479-rep-west-doubles-down-on-communist-ideology-of-progressive-caucus also went furtherQuote:West reiterated the "communist" comments he made last week, telling CNN on Thursday that progressivism was just a new name for the American communist party. "At the turn of the century here in the United States of America, American communists renamed themselves progressives, but the strategy, the tactics, the ideology remains the same. Same cite as firstAs to the blog in question, I assume Geezer didn't notice that it was an OPINION piece, not a news story... Reading Wulf's various "remarks" (I use the term loosely), I was hit with the perfect description of what he does: He PONTIFICATES! Never thought of it before, recognized the condescension and apparent belief that he is "teaching" us...or somesuch...but that word hit me as I was reading, and it is the most apropos description, surprised it didn't occur to me before. Of course, he pontificates IGNORANTLY, but that's kind of beside the point.
Quote:West reiterated the "communist" comments he made last week, telling CNN on Thursday that progressivism was just a new name for the American communist party. "At the turn of the century here in the United States of America, American communists renamed themselves progressives, but the strategy, the tactics, the ideology remains the same. Same cite as first
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