REAL WORLD EVENT DISCUSSIONS

Why Obama is losing.

POSTED BY: AURAPTOR
UPDATED: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 17:01
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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:12 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:


Romney camp raises $3.5 million after Ryan veep announcement

Andrea Saul@andreamsaul
$3.5 million raised online in 24 hrs of @MittRomney's pick of @PaulRyanVP #RomneyRyan2012




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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:16 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Okay...Mitt is going to try and buy the election with huge amounts of money form very rich contributors. That I agree with. Problem is most polls still have Obama in the lead.

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:37 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!



Such childish delusions...

When Obama raised boat loads of $ from his very rich Hollywood friends .... crickets

When Romney raises money ? He's BUYING the election.


You're such an idiot, it's sad.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:39 AM

HKCAVALIER


Where'd all that money come from, ya think? Ordinary people, or the top 0.01%? Of course, the deep pockets are positively thrilled with Ryan's brand of "fiscal" responsability--responsability to them! Responsability to get them mo' money! Of course Romney's gonna raise a ton of money with this tool. And you, Mr. Raptor, are perfectly thrilled as well.

You really think Ryan's Randroid elitism is gonna go down well with the American people as he seeks national office? You really think gutting Medicare and Social Security is gonna net him actual votes? I thought y'all believed Ron Paul was crazy.

If Romney weren't such a lost cause at this point, he would have picked a VP that would actually help him get some votes, not just more money. With the billions the richest 0.01% stand to gain from the tax cuts Ryan would send their way, 3.5 mil is a steal. Are you really in such a hurry to be owned?

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:59 AM

CHRISISALL


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
He's BUYING the election.

Nah, he's TRYING to buy the election. He won't win it on policy alone.

You've been owned, schooled & punked, AU. Pack your back & droop yer head, yer party & yer candidate's chances are dead.

Chrisisall, wearing a frilly Mal thing on his head, and ready to shoot unarmed, full-body armoured pleebs

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Monday, August 13, 2012 10:59 AM

JONGSSTRAW


This election may be won or lost based on voter turnout. I don't think that picking Ryan increases the numbers for Republicans, but I do think it provides Obama with fertile material to motivate his base into going out and voting for him again.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:02 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
He's BUYING the election.

Nah, he's TRYING to buy the election. He won't win it on policy alone.

You've been owned, schooled & punked, AU. Pack your back & droop yer head, yer party & yer candidate's chances are dead.

Chrisisall, wearing a frilly Mal thing on his head, and ready to shoot unarmed, full-body armoured pleebs



None of what you say is remotely close to being true, Chrissy.

Romney and Ryan will win. Period. Time for you to wake up to that fact.


HK - funny you mock the top 1% as being ' all in' for Romeny, yet all those Hollywood elites, George Soros, etc... all those wealthy dupes who so blindly give to Obama, so as not to be viewed as the 'evil' rich, they get a complete pass from you, huh?

Quite frankly, I'm stunned ANYONE who is a part of the 1 % gives any money to Obama.




Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:04 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
This election may be won or lost based on voter turnout. I don't think that picking Ryan increases the numbers for Republicans, but I do think it provides Obama with fertile material to motivate his base into going out and voting for him again.



Yep. A lot of folks that were apathetic a couple days ago are fired up now.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:06 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

Such childish delusions...



Says the guy who denies anything that doesn't fir his pre-decided narrative.

What are the polls saying again?

Oh, right, that's the part you left out, since it doesn't fit.... ya'll see where this goes. Same place as always - Rappyland.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:26 AM

STORYMARK




When your VP pick garners less confidence than the previous, disasterous choice..... why that's GREAT NEWS! We're winning!

In Rappyland.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:41 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Ryan is a disaster for Romney and Republican hopes. I simply ask WHY PICK RYAN????? What does he bring to the "team"? Nothing that I can see but grief and a moving target to be attacked ad infinitum. He won't likely even be able to sway Wisc. to the Republican side. It's political suicide, just as I described in the other Ryan thread.

And what about Rubio? Marco was the guy to go to, not a polarizing and despised figure like Ryan. Rubio could deliver Florida's 28 electoral votes with relative ease just as he crushed his Dem opponent for Senate. He could also have influenced some Hispanics in other states to switch sides, and at this point anything positive in that direction is a blessing. Or Ohio's Portman as VP choice to help win Ohio? Romney can't win without Ohio either.

Ryan brings nothing but ideological rancor to the race. Hell, Romney could have picked Rush Limbaugh, Sarah Palin, or Ann Coulter for that matter if he wanted to really fire up Obama's base. Another Republican disaster is in the works, and all I can say is that the former McCain campaign staffers who now work for Romney must be elated with the choice. Now THEY'LL get post election political jobs at MSNBC like other McCain saboteurs did after 2008, and if they're real lucky their names will figure prominently in the 2013 HBO cable movie Game Change II.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:43 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Cash is POURING into the Romney campaign now.

You go ahead and believe the heavily biased Democrat sampled polls. I'm giddy over the Ryan pick, and can't wait for a complete and total ASS KICKING come November.


Jong - we NEED ideological rancor in this race. McCain played the 'go along to get along ' crap, and look where it got him ?

The time is now. No longer can we kick the can down the road. I'd rather die fighting for what's right, than surrender for the sake of 'making nice' w/ the crooks and traitors across the aisle.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, August 13, 2012 11:57 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Jong - we NEED ideological rancor in this race. McCain played the 'go along to get along ' crap, and look where it got him ?

The time is now. No longer can we kick the can down the road. I'd rather die fighting for what's right, than surrender for the sake of 'making nice' w/ the crooks and traitors across the aisle.




We need the electoral votes from Florida and Ohio a lot more than Paul Ryan's divisive economics.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 12:09 PM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Jong - we NEED ideological rancor in this race. McCain played the 'go along to get along ' crap, and look where it got him ?

The time is now. No longer can we kick the can down the road. I'd rather die fighting for what's right, than surrender for the sake of 'making nice' w/ the crooks and traitors across the aisle.




We need the electoral votes from Florida and Ohio a lot more than Paul Ryan's divisive economics.




The only folks Ryan's economics is divisive for are the Democrats. They're living in a fantasy world, which if it keeps up, will end this country in a Greece like situation, but far worse. Ryan's approach is a sober, adult view of the world, and not one in which Obama lives, full of lolly pop trees and gummy bear clouds.

Like when Simon said to River... " It's time to wake up"


Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Monday, August 13, 2012 12:10 PM

WHOZIT


Time to send Biden out there to rally the troops....cause he's nutz.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 12:16 PM

JONGSSTRAW


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Jong - we NEED ideological rancor in this race. McCain played the 'go along to get along ' crap, and look where it got him ?

The time is now. No longer can we kick the can down the road. I'd rather die fighting for what's right, than surrender for the sake of 'making nice' w/ the crooks and traitors across the aisle.




We need the electoral votes from Florida and Ohio a lot more than Paul Ryan's divisive economics.




The only folks Ryan's economics is divisive for are the Democrats. They're living in a fantasy world, which if it keeps up, will end this country in a Greece like situation, but far worse. Ryan's approach is a sober, adult view of the world, and not one in which Obama lives, full of lolly pop trees and gummy bear clouds.

Like when Simon said to River... " It's time to wake up"




Believe me, I understand all that. But elections aren't about truths any more. It's all smoke and mirrors; image, momentum, and cash. I'm sticking to my belief that Rubio or Portman could have delivered a big and vital state to the Republican column, whereas Ryan brings ideology, but no state.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 12:26 PM

SIGNYM

I believe in solving problems, not sharing them.


Quote:

They're living in a fantasy world, which if it keeps up, will end this country in a Greece like situation, but far worse. Ryan's approach is a sober, adult view of the world, and not one in which Obama lives, full of lolly pop trees and gummy bear clouds.-rappy

Believe me, I understand all that. But elections aren't about truths any more. It's all smoke and mirrors; image, momentum, and cash.-Jongsstraw



I think in the climate thread Rappy said something about perception being truth in politics. Now he wants to say it's not.

Jongsstraw, IIRC, you live in FL. You may be somewhat biased because of where you live; I'm not sure you realize how fired up conservatives in other states are going to be about Ryan. And Dems are not SO in love with Obama that they will come out in droves to defend him. The one segment that Ryan for sure alienates is the 50+ crowd, who don't want their Medicare taken away, and this group tend to be reliable voters.

Up until now, Obama has made the race about personality, and has managed to portray Romney as a rich guy who's totally out of touch with the middle class (which he is. Not that Obama is much better, but he does seem more likeable.) Now the discussion is going to be about policy.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 2:22 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Cash is POURING into the Romney campaign now.

You go ahead and believe the heavily biased Democrat sampled polls. I'm giddy over the Ryan pick, and can't wait for a complete and total ASS KICKING come November.



You keep bringing up the cash issue, must be proud that your boy's only chance is to buy the election.

As for the polls, the 538 blog and it's forecast was dead on accurate in 2008. Realclear was not as accurate, but still had Obama winning, just by less than he did.

The only ass kicking is reality kicking you over and over again. Fortunately for you you are far to stupid to feel the pain.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 2:24 PM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The only folks Ryan's economics is divisive for are the Democrats.



...and people who understand economics, people who don't want it to take 40 some years to balance the budget, and people who like medicare.

You know that last group, many of them live in Florida. Romney simple can't win the election if he loses Florida.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 3:15 PM

1KIKI

Goodbye, kind world (George Monbiot) - In common with all those generations which have contemplated catastrophe, we appear to be incapable of understanding what confronts us.


This could be an interesting dynamic, where the best get-out-the-vote plan is the other candidate. People might vote AGAINST someone in droves.


SignyM: I swear, if we really knew what was being decided about us in our absence, and how hosed the government is prepared to let us be, we would string them up.

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Monday, August 13, 2012 4:09 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Fox News poll: Obama leads Romney by 9

Quote:

Mitt Romney has had a tough couple of weeks on the campaign trail -- and it shows in the latest Fox News poll. After a barrage of campaign ads, negative news coverage of his overseas trip and ongoing talk about his tax returns, Romney’s favorable rating and standing in the trial ballot have declined. As a result, President Obama has opened his biggest lead since Romney became the presumptive Republican nominee.
The president would take 49 percent of the vote compared to Romney's 40 percent in a head-to-head matchup if the election were held today, the poll found. Last month, Obama had a four percentage-point edge of 45 percent to 41 percent. This marks the second time this year the president has had a lead outside the poll’s margin of sampling error.
Obama’s advantage comes largely from increased support among independents, who now pick him over Romney by 11 percentage points. Some 30 percent of independents are undecided. Last month, Obama had a four-point edge among independents, while Romney had the advantage from April through early June.
There was also an uptick in support for Obama among women, blacks and Democrats.




Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/08/09/fox-news-poll-obama-lead-gr
ows-as-romney-support-slips/#ixzz23TxV63lw




"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Monday, August 13, 2012 4:20 PM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Meanwhile, Obama is trusted more than Romney on foreign policy (13 points), helping people achieve the American dream (+8 points), national security (+ 8 points), health care (+ 7 points) and stopping Iran from getting nuclear weapons (+4 points).

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/08/09/fox-news-poll-obama-lead-gr
ows-as-romney-support-slips/#ixzz23U0GT2rc



Fox, those dirty leftists.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 3:13 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


"Romney and Ryan will win. Period. Time for you to wake up to that fact." One to be saved...

I don't know why you guys go on like you do. I'm with Geezer: Get a room! As with so many, this thread has turned into one of the predictable tit for tats...borrrring. Do you not even notice that Raptor twists and turns the discussion by bringing up irrelevant facts; that he has proven himself totally incapable of ever, ever, admitting the right did anything wrong OR that both sides in politics screw up; fixated on anything bad he can say about the left, however outrageous or untrue; etc., etc., etc.? He leads you around by your noses and you buy into it every time. Sheees!

Jong is the only one sticking to the topic, and he's right on:
Quote:

This election may be won or lost based on voter turnout. I don't think that picking Ryan increases the numbers for Republicans, but I do think it provides Obama with fertile material to motivate his base into going out and voting for him again.
Tho' I'm not sure it provides Obama with all that much--until and unless his people find out how to milk the Medicare thing REAL good. Romney's tactic has already moved to "Obama has raided Medicare" and "Obama will take $700 million from Medicare, WE'RE the ones who want to save it". The right is never going to hear that the same cuts Obama proposes are already IN the Ryan plan, and that those cuts are mostly to hospitals and providers, etc., to get rid of waste. They're not going to hear that, any more than Raptor will (tho' he'd deny it to the heavens even if he DID).

I think at this point 99.999% of people have made up their minds both who to vote for and if they'll bother to vote. This is just a distraction; I don't think it gins up either Republican or Democratic bases...it MIGHT change some minds among the elderly, putting Florida at risk for Romney, but that's about it. Jong, your other post is too long to quote, but I agree with it as well, for the most part.

The minuses of Ryan are coming to light too fast to keep track of, and it will continue I'm sure. So will the taxes question, tho' that may well be at least in part why Ryan was chosen, and chosen now.


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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 5:40 AM

STORYMARK


Quote:

Originally posted by Niki2:


I don't know why you guys go on like you do.



I say why every few days, but okay....


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 5:50 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
The only folks Ryan's economics is divisive for are the Democrats.



...and people who understand economics, people who don't want it to take 40 some years to balance the budget, and people who like medicare.

You know that last group, many of them live in Florida. Romney simple can't win the election if he loses Florida.



No one 55 or older would have their benefits touched, so the lie that Left is pushing is shameless, as it is reckless.

Does Erskine Bowles know anything about economics ? ( Chairperson of the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform, White House Chief of Staff, etc.. )

Obama seems to think so, and HE praises Ryan's plan.

Obama? He HAS no plan to balance the budget. So tell me, who is the adult in this discussion, and who is the big eared,whiny man - child who is going around lying about everything and not standing up and taking responsibility for his actions ( or in-actions ) like a man?

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 7:20 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Americans watch Kim Kardashian on TV, and go out to movies about vampires or movies starring Russell Brand. You cannot honestly expect values, integrity, honesty, and accountability to ever creep into an election race. The spinmeisters are always many moves ahead of the so-called fact checkers.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 7:44 AM

HKCAVALIER


So, the fact that people who will be 65 in ten years are going to be screwed out of their SS is somehow good news to y'all?

Who'd-a-thunk back when the Nihilists and Bolsheviks were throwing around the term "Kleptocracy" that a hundred years later a major political party in America would actually run with it as their FRICKEN PLATFORM!

The mind boggles.

HKCavalier

Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 9:02 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Yup, the mind boggles, doesn't it?

Gawd, you were right on with "kleptocracy"! I had to look it up, it's been so long since I've heard a specific definition of the word. What's truly amusing is that "This type of government corruption is often achieved by the embezzlement of state funds." HAH! What we'd get with Vulture/Voucher would be LEGALIZED embezzlement... I realize "kleptocracy" isn't what we'd actually get, but it makes me smile to read the definition and see how it DOES apply to what the right wants for us...

Kleptocracy, for those as forgetful as me:
Quote:

where the government exists to increase the personal wealth and political power of its officials and the ruling class at the expense of the wider population, often without pretense of honest service.

Kleptocracies are generally associated with corrupt forms of authoritarian governments, particularly dictatorships, oligarchies, military juntas, or some other forms of autocratic and nepotist government in which no outside oversight is possible, due to the ability of the kleptocrat(s) to personally control both the supply of public funds and the means of determining their disbursal.

That's not that far off, even if other aspects of kleptocracy don't apply!

The distorted thinking of people like Raptor is also incredible. He tosses out nonsequitors like "nobody over 55 will get their Medicare touched" like it means something, claims Obama likes Ryan's plan (flat-out LIE), etc., etc., like anyone was actually going to pay attention or give credence to what he writes, and of course with absolutely no effort whatsoever to include facts, cites, etc., etc. I guess it makes him happy to just spout-spout-spout anything that he heard on Faux News or right-wing talk shows...works for him...


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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 11:39 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
No one 55 or older would have their benefits touched, so the lie that Left is pushing is shameless, as it is reckless.



Just like the lies about health care reform...it works, and will work. The left is just learning to play ball the way the right has for many years.

Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Does Erskine Bowles know anything about economics ? ( Chairperson of the National Commission on Fiscal Responsibility and Reform, White House Chief of Staff, etc.. )



Swing and a miss...

http://projects.newsobserver.com/node/25426

Oh, and how do others from that commission feel? It is very easy to only listen to people who agree with you.


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:
Obama? He HAS no plan to balance the budget. So tell me, who is the adult in this discussion, and who is the big eared,whiny man - child who is going around lying about everything and not standing up and taking responsibility for his actions ( or in-actions ) like a man?



Obama's plan it to increase taxes on those who can afford it while slowly reducing government spending as the economy improves. See the President, who is the adult in the room, understands math. Seems others don't. You can't cut taxes and spending and fix the budget, the numbers simply don't add up. Even Ryan's plan adds to the deficit for many years to come.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Tuesday, August 14, 2012 12:48 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

So tell me, who is the adult in this discussion, and who is the big eared,whiny man - child who is going around lying about everything and not standing up and taking responsibility for his actions ( or in-actions ) like a man?




Huh. Up until this moment, I never realized you consider yourself "big eared"...


Classic!



"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

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Wednesday, August 15, 2012 5:58 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Quote:

Obama's plan it to increase taxes on those who can afford it while slowly reducing government spending as the economy improves. See the President, who is the adult in the room, understands math. Seems others don't. You can't cut taxes and spending and fix the budget, the numbers simply don't add up. Even Ryan's plan adds to the deficit for many years to come.
In a nutshell.

And golly gosh, from what I'm hearing--even from the RIGHT--is that the choice of Ryan has not only doomed Romney, it's gonna wreak havoc with down-ticket candidates. They're running from the ticket as fast as they can, poor babies. The national party has really screwed their chances of taking the Senate...and maybe even of holding onto the House!
Quote:

After the initial enthusiasm about the boldness of Mitt Romney's choice of Paul Ryan as running mate, Republican pundits and consultants early this week began voicing measured concerns that the Medicare front may not be where the battle should be joined for November.

Politico reported on Tuesday that many key Republican consultants in Washington are nervous about Ryan and the Medicare distraction, while some are downright despondent and resigned.

Quote:

(CBS News) CHILLICOTHE, Ohio - When Mitt Romney announced on Saturday he was picking Wisconsin Congressman Paul Ryan as his running mate, he was roundly applauded by Republicans and especially conservatives. But as attention has shifted from jobs and the economy to Ryan's position on Medicare and social programs, some in the party are showing some concern about the selection.

In a USA Today/Gallup poll, 39 percent of Americans said Ryan is an excellent or pretty good choice for vice president. Forty-two percent said he's fair or poor.

The Gallup poll taken Sunday showed Romney's pick helped in his conservative base. Thirty-six percent of Republicans said they are more likely to vote for him -- that's 6 points higher than when John McCain picked Sarah Palin in 2008.

But some inside the GOP establishment tell CBS News there are fears Ryan will do more harm than good with independent voters.

Romney has staked his campaign on the economy, the issue voters say they care about most. But getting more attention now are Ryan's proposals to cut the budget and reform entitlements like Medicare.

Quote:

CLEVELAND -- No one wants to admit it openly, but here in Ohio, one of the top battleground states, the reaction to the choice of Paul Ryan is disappointment by Republicans and relief by Democrats. Both sides believed that to secure Ohio's 18 electoral votes, Romney would have been better off picking Ohio Sen. Rob Portman.

No vice-presidential pick can guarantee his home state. But one influential Republican strategist, who voiced his dismay only on background, told National Journal on Saturday that Portman could have added between 1.5 and two points for Romney in Ohio -- and Ryan could make it harder to win here.

Some Republicans fear that Ryan's controversial plans to overhaul Medicare will be a tough sell to Ohio's blue-collar voters. "I'm shocked," said the strategist. "Why would you put them into play? Why would you put Florida into play?"

Hee, hee, hee; it just keeps getting better and better...


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Wednesday, August 15, 2012 7:43 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


And better and better:
Quote:

Republicans strategists are worried that Rep. Paul Ryan’s (R-Wis.) addition to the presidential ticket will cost their party House and Senate seats this fall.

Their concern: Democrats will successfully demonize Ryan’s budget plan, which contains controversial spending cuts and changes to Medicare.

“There are a lot races that are close to the line we're not going to win now because they're going to battle out who's going to kill grandma first, ObamaCare or Paul Ryan's budget,” said one Republican strategist who works on congressional races. “It could put the Senate out of reach. In the House it puts a bunch of races in play that would have otherwise been safe. ... It remains to be seen how much damage this causes, but my first blush is this is not good.”

Many Republicans in tough races this year, especially in the House, voted for Ryan’s proposal, which makes it hard for them to distance themselves from it.

And while Republicans are expected to keep the House, the more seats they lose, the closer the Democrats will be to a takeover in 2014. The Senate is too close to call; the GOP only needs to gain four seats (if President Obama wins reelection) to take control.

The National Republican Congressional Committee (NRCC) circulated a memo to lawmakers and candidates on Monday, obtained by The Hill, that they say offers a road map for winning the debate over Ryan’s proposal.

The presentation tells candidates to fight back on Medicare until the issue becomes a tie then refocus the debate on the economy. To do so, Republicans are advised to tie their opponent unequivocally to Obama’s law, highlight the law’s cuts to Medicare and offer counter-messaging that uses credible outside spokespeople — like seniors, or, in Amodei’s case, his mother — to convince seniors that Republicans are in the right on the issue.

Former Rep. Tom Reynolds (R-N.Y.), who chaired the NRCC from 2003-2006, warned that he foresaw in this election shades of President George W. Bush’s fight to create a voucher program for Social Security early in his second term, which many say cost the GOP seats in 2006. “You saw what happened to Bush with Social Security in the 2006 election,” he said. “This is déjà vu.”

Reynolds warned that Romney and Ryan need to get ahead of the story and define themselves before Democrats do it for them. “This next couple weeks is what this is about, Ryan getting vetted. They should use that time to further explain Romney-Ryan as they see it relative to entitlements including Medicare. If they don't define themselves for it Democrats will do it for them,” he said.

One Republican strategist who’d seen the NRCC’s memo worried that the plan offered little new advice, and having Ryan at the top of the ticket lent additional credibility to Democrats on the issue. "It becomes more difficult. The Republican argument and Democrat argument on Medicare now aren't on equal footing anymore — Ryan being on the top of the ticket gives Democrats more credibility,” the strategist said. “There's going to be more resonance when the Democrats attack our guys. It's going to be a part of the national discussion, there's going to be more credibility on this now, and we're not going to be able to wave them off as nonsense.“ http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/presidential-races/243473-gop-conc
erned-ryan-could-cost-party-house-and-senate-seats
this from a Republican and NRA supporter:
Quote:

I have an acquaintance who is a full-fledged NRA supporter and member. He generally doesn't like Republican policies but often votes that way over the issue of guns.
Up until last week he had every intention of voting for Romney for that reason. But then Romney announced that Ryan is his running mate. BANG. Just like that, he is now voting for Obama.

He could stomach the what-passes-for-centrist-in-today's-GOP Mitt Romney, but not the let's-destroy-medicare-and-Social-Security radical Paul Ryan.

He's just one example, but truly middle of the road voters are complicated. There may be some who were leaning Obama and are now leaning Romney because of Ryan, but outside of his relative youth, charm, and good looks it's hard to see what appeal he has to undecided voters. (Palin had all three as well - okay, the charm part is up for debate but I think a certain segment of the population liked her. And keep in mind the "relative" qualifier...) The economy is still Issue Number One, and Ryan's pet issues are ones on which he is vulnerable (he voted for Bush's budgets like a good minion) and which are not necessarily related to the economy.

I think the Dems and allied groups aren't wasting any time trying to define Ryan as the radical that he is. http://www.coloradopols.com/diary/18300/republicans-worry-about-ryan-e
ffect-on-house-senate
]
I'm reading it all over the place:
Quote:

You've heard them on television and read them on POLITICO -- cheerful, defiant statements from Republican political professionals about Mitt Romney's bold masterstroke in tapping Paul Ryan as his running mate, and turning the 2012 presidential race into a serious, far-reaching debate about budgets and the nation's future.

Don't buy it.

Away from the cameras, and with all the usual assurances that people aren't being quoted by name, there is an unmistakable consensus among Republican operatives in Washington: Romney has taken a risk with Ryan that has only a modest chance of going right -- and a huge chance of going horribly wrong.

In more than three dozen interviews with Republican strategists and campaign operatives -- old hands and rising next-generation conservatives alike -- the most common reactions to Ryan ranged from gnawing apprehension to hair-on-fire anger that Romney has practically ceded the election.

And the more pessimistic strategists don't even feign good cheer: They think the Ryan pick is a disaster for the GOP. Many of these people don't care that much about Romney -- they always felt he faced an improbable path to victory -- but are worried that Ryan's vocal views about overhauling Medicare will be a millstone for other GOP candidates in critical House and Senate races.

If you are one of those people who thinks if someone has something negative to say, they should have the guts to put their name on it, you won't find much to impress you in this article. Nearly all the Republican professionals interviewed for this story said they would share their unfiltered views only "on background" rules of attribution.

But Washington political chatter is a pervasive reality even when the chatterers prefer not to risk personal relationships or professional prospects by publicly second-guessing their party's nominee. For Romney, even if he ultimately proves the doubters wrong, the skepticism among capital insiders is an obstacle as he seeks to frame a general election argument.

And that skepticism about Ryan among GOP strategists is striking.

They're worried about inviting Medicare -- usually death for Republicans -- into the campaign. They're worried it sidetracks the jobs issue. They're worried he'll expose the fact that Romney doesn't have a budget plan. Most of all, they're worried that Romney was on track to lose anyway -- and now that feels all but certain.

"Whether or not they [the Romney campaign] want to say that they have their own plan on Day One, or whatever they're doing, it doesn't change the reality of them having to own the Ryan plan. How is that in the wheelhouse of creating jobs?" added a GOP consultant.

Joked another: "The most popular phrase in Washington right now is: 'I love Paul Ryan, but ...'"

The most cutting criticism of Ryan, shared only by a handful of strategists, is that Ryan isn't ready to be president -- or doesn't come across as ready. A youthful man who looks even younger than his 42 years, Ryan could end up labeled as Sarah Palin with a PowerPoint presentation, several operatives said.

"He just doesn't seem like he can step into the job on Day One," said the strategist, who professed himself a Ryan fan.

And that's just what it does to the Romney-Ryan ticket. Forget how it plays in close House and Senate races.

"Very not helpful down ballot -- very," said one top Republican consultant.

"This is the day the music died," one Republican operative involved in 2012 races said after the rollout. The operative said that every House candidate now is racing to get ahead of this issue.

Another strategist emailed midway through Romney and Ryan's first joint event Saturday: "The good news is that this ticket now has a vision. The bad news is that vision is basically just a chart of numbers used to justify policies that are extremely unpopular."

The Romney campaign isn't oblivious to Republican skittishness about the pick. In fact, several sources close to the Romney campaign said that top advisers to the candidate initially favored Tim Pawlenty as a "do no harm" choice for the vice presidency, and that even late in the process some leaned toward Ohio Sen. Rob Portman as a running mate who would bring gravitas and governing heft to the ticket -- without Ryan's obvious risks.

Sources close to the selection process tell POLITICO that within the Romney campaign, there was considerable unease about picking Ryan -- but also a recognition that each of the possible picks for running mate had drawbacks to varying degrees.

With Ryan, some on the campaign feared that his first and most crucial days on the trail would be consumed with answering charges about his views on entitlements and completely get the ticket away from its economic message. That's the signal concern now among the Republican worrywarts.

"It turned a referendum into a choice," said one Washington Republican lawyer. "[Choosing Ryan] forfeited the no-real-world-experience point Romney has been building up for months [about Obama] and put a new state in play that was otherwise trending his way [Florida]."

Republicans are not (evidently) at the point of publicly breaking ranks with Romney and Ryan, and may never get there. After all, Romney is still the presidential nominee and Ryan commands deep respect -- even awe -- in many corners of the party. Several have noticed that Romney seems more energized since Ryan joined the ticket and that their chemistry seems real.

Yet the Romney campaign has quieted few doubts in the 36 hours since announcing Ryan for vice president. The Republican presidential nominee has endured withering press coverage in senior-heavy Florida and dodged questions about where his views on Medicare differ from Ryan's.

The longer Republicans have to litigate this issue instead of campaigning on jobs and the economy, strategists say, the more ground they will lose against Obama and the greater the odds that Romney will drag down other members of his party.

Since Saturday, however, the actions of campaigns on both sides of the 2012 race have effectively spoken for themselves on the importance Ryan's plan may have in the race: Democrats have launched, almost by reflex, into a full-scale "Medi-scare" campaign while Republicans have rushed to blunt that argument with attacks on Obama's health care plan.

Yet another operative deeply involved in the 2012 campaign said that in "every competitive race in the country, strategists have held conference calls in the last 48 hours to try to figure out how to be on offense on this. A week ago we were talking about jobs, and this week we're talking about entitlement reform."

"Everybody loves Paul Ryan. Everybody supported the Ryan plan," the strategist said. "But nobody thinks Ryan should be the tip of the spear." http://www.azcentral.com/news/politics/articles/20120810paul-ryan-pick
-republicans-worried-politico.html

Raising 3.5 million dollars ain't gonna count for SHIT with all the millions being spent on this campaign. You always get a spike when a VP is picked--how much did the pick of Sarah Palin raise immediately after she was announced? And we know where THAT went...

Personally, I think Ryan is a WORSE pick than Palin, tho' to me not as offensive a one, since Ryan seems like a nice guy and is intelligent. We shall see....

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Wednesday, August 15, 2012 8:58 AM

HERO


Quote:

Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Okay...Mitt is going to try and buy the election with huge amounts of money form very rich contributors. That I agree with. Problem is most polls still have Obama in the lead.


President Obama has raised more money then Mitt Romney, the problem is that he's been spending it with little return. Now his doners who have been hit time and again for four years running are not shelling out the same money they were up to about a year ago.

Romney on the other hand is just tapping into his base's support including Tea Party money and the big boys who bankrolled his competitors in the primaries.

Its an intersting strategic bind for the President. He waged an expensive campaign against Romney in June and July which has kept this race a statistical tie. Romney now has the benefit of cash and momentum and can focus on a handful of battleground states. I think you will see the Romney offensive take off during the Republican National convention with a phase 2 rollout the week after the Dem convention. Dem's have the money to keep up the fight in September but by October the President will be rolling on empty barring some dynamic change (like VP Hillary Clinton).

H

Hero...must be right on all of this. ALL of the rest of us are wrong. Chrisisall, 2012

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Wednesday, August 15, 2012 9:23 AM

JONGSSTRAW


Obama already has what he needs.

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Wednesday, August 15, 2012 11:31 AM

M52NICKERSON

DALEK!


Quote:

Originally posted by Hero:
President Obama has raised more money then Mitt Romney, the problem is that he's been spending it with little return. Now his doners who have been hit time and again for four years running are not shelling out the same money they were up to about a year ago.

Romney on the other hand is just tapping into his base's support including Tea Party money and the big boys who bankrolled his competitors in the primaries.

Its an intersting strategic bind for the President. He waged an expensive campaign against Romney in June and July which has kept this race a statistical tie. Romney now has the benefit of cash and momentum and can focus on a handful of battleground states. I think you will see the Romney offensive take off during the Republican National convention with a phase 2 rollout the week after the Dem convention. Dem's have the money to keep up the fight in September but by October the President will be rolling on empty barring some dynamic change (like VP Hillary Clinton).



He won't be empty by October. That and the race is not a statistical tie in the state polls, which point to which states will be won, which decides the election.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.

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Monday, August 20, 2012 3:16 PM

KWICKO

"We'll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false." -- William Casey, Reagan's presidential campaign manager & CIA Director (from first staff meeting in 1981)


Quote:

Originally posted by AURaptor:

You go ahead and believe the heavily biased Democrat sampled polls.




Even the Fox polls are "heavily biased" for the Democrats? They've got Obama up by 9 in the swing states.

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 10:43 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Yup, even FauxNews had Obama up by 9 points, but that was August 7, and these things not only change, but don't necessarily mean anything. It's the swing states that count anyway, at this point.

However, for the fun of it: Taken August 6-13,
Quote:

A new poll shows that a majority of voters in 12 key U.S. swing states feel they are worse off than they were four years ago, yet still support President Barack Obama over his presumptive Republican rival, Mitt Romney.

The results of the survey, conducted jointly by the USA Today newspaper and the Gallup polling agency, were published Monday. They show that when respondents were asked "Are you better off than you were four years ago?" those in the swing states (competitive states most likely to swing the Electoral College in the November 6 presidential election) answered "no" by 56-42 percent. Voters polled in all 50 states answered "no" by 55-42 percent.

Still, the poll found that President Obama leads Romney in the swing states, 47-44 percent. The 12 swing states surveyed are Colorado, Florida, Iowa, Michigan, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Mexico, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia and Wisconsin.

One key in determining how big a threat the lack of improvement in voters' lives is to Obama's re-election chances is whether they blame him for their situation. The poll finds that voters do not widely blame Obama for their circumstances. Twenty percent of swing-state voters say they are not better off and blame Obama alone. Another 15% are not better off and blame Obama but also blame George W. Bush. And 21% do not blame Obama, including 7% who believe Bush alone is responsible.

It is quite possible that voters may cut Obama some slack on the economy, given that he took office during one of the worst economic downturns in U.S. history. And the poll finds that is the case for just under half of voters in the swing states, with 46% saying Obama has done as well as could be expected in dealing with the economy given its condition when he took office, while 52% say he has not. The majority of those who are better off say Obama has done as well as could be expected, while most of those who say they are not better off disagree.

Still, swing-state voters are not convinced they would be better off in four years under Romney. Forty-four percent predict they would be better off four years from now if Romney wins and 49% say they would not be better off. Those figures are roughly the same when voters are asked to predict their situation in four years if Obama is re-elected -- 42% say they would be better off and 52% say they would not be. http://www.voanews.com/content/poll_majority_of_swing_state_supporters
_unhappy_but_still_back_obama-/1491487.html
more recently, Politico, as of yesterday, has the electoral college for ten swing states standing at Obama, 111; Romney 15. Overall, they put the electoral college at Obama, 332; Romney, 206 http://www.politico.com/2012-election/swing-state/.

They'd better get their act together! It's still early on, and anything can happen, as everyone knows, but that's a pretty big gap for just over two months from election time.

From the pundits I've been hearing that Obama's pretty much tied up minorities, young and women voters, which leaves Romney only men and the elderly (some of whom he's losing now because of the Medicare issue). That's a tough sell, if it's true. Obviously it's not 100%, as there will be those in any of those groups who won't vote as predicted, but it's got to be uncomfortable for Romney.

It's still a looong ways off; will be interesting to see what the polls come up with as the Akin thing has time to sink in. All in all, first Medicare now this; as the saying goes, any time we're not talking about the economy, Romney is losing. Here's hoping more crap comes up that splatters all over Romney...

What was that about "Why Obama is Losing"? (/snicker)


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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 11:05 AM

JONGSSTRAW


In 1980 incumbent Jimmy Carter was 10 points ahead of challenger Reagan at this date in the race. Reagan went on to crush Carter in the election. Point is a lot of things can happen between now and election day. For example, an un-known US Representative could possibly utter the most offensive things ever heard in politics, and it might ripple its' way across the whole shebang. Or an administrations' campaign might want to reconsider how to better deal with national security leaks rather than enter a war for hearts and minds against Navy Seals and Special Ops heroes.

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 11:09 AM

NIKI2

Gettin' old, but still a hippie at heart...


Think I said that, a couple of times. Many things can turn a race this way and that, and polls are only interesting, not necessarily valid, which I also think I said.


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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 11:43 AM

REDREAD

The poster formerly known as yinyang.


Quote:

A new poll shows that a majority of voters in 12 key U.S. swing states feel they are worse off than they were four years ago, yet still support President Barack Obama over his presumptive Republican rival, Mitt Romney.


Just had a (tangential) thought - maybe the reason people always seem to feel worse off than they did four years ago is because political campaign machines are designed to make us feel worse off. Also, the ongoing election cycle and all its claptrap tends to feel more intense than previous ones because we're currently experiencing it.

It would help to know if a majority of Americans have ever said yes, they are better off, in the history of this poll question. Alas, I tried finding that info, but my Google skills have failed me.


||| Blog post explaining my name change: http://www.fireflyfans.net/blog.aspx?bid=9414 |||

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 11:53 AM

AURAPTOR

America loves a winner!


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:

Or an administrations' campaign might want to reconsider how to better deal with national security leaks rather than enter a war for hearts and minds against Navy Seals and Special Ops heroes .



The MSM had determined that such things will not be discussed, questioned, or elaborated on, so they'll remain safely OUT of the public forum of discussion.

Same goes w/ Fast and Furious, the violent drug war on the SW border of our nation, Jon Corzine losing 1 BILLION dollars and there's not even an investigation...

No, it's far more important that we look at what took place years AFTER Romney left Bain Capital, where no laws were broken, than to pay attention to Corzine's dealings at MF Global, WHILE HE WAS CEO.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen
" We're all just folk. " - Mal

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 1:07 PM

JONGSSTRAW


The more Romney gains in strength in terms of campaign money and poll numbers, the more the MSM is going to dig their heels in and defend and promote Obama on everything, while they also rev up their relentless assault on Romney. That's the sad reality we saw in 2008. Now it's even more important than ever for them that Obama wins. He can't fail, not our first African-American President. They've invested too much, gone all in so to speak... no, that will never happen.

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 1:36 PM

STORYMARK


LOL.... Oy.


Note to anyone - Please pity the poor, poor wittle Rappyboy. He's feeling put upon lately, what with all those facts disagreeing with what he believes.

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 1:39 PM

KPO

Sometimes you own the libs. Sometimes, the libs own you.


I know, right-whingers have such a victim-complex.

It's not personal. It's just war.

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Tuesday, August 21, 2012 5:01 PM

FREMDFIRMA


Quote:

Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
The more Romney gains in strength in terms of campaign money and poll numbers, the more the MSM is going to dig their heels in and defend and promote Obama on everything, while they also rev up their relentless assault on Romney. That's the sad reality we saw in 2008. Now it's even more important than ever for them that Obama wins. He can't fail, not our first African-American President. They've invested too much, gone all in so to speak... no, that will never happen.


The same mainstream media that contains Newsweek and it's bullshit article, oh so properly excoriated ?
Generally it's a bad idea to try sellin something no one wants, like GM mighta learned about marketing SUVs to people who wanted Econoboxes, except for that damn bailout.
So who's gonna bail YOU out, when you dig yourself in over your head, Jong ?

Factually the media in general has been all but fellating Romney and that shitheel Ryan, which is all according to the plan cause the higher the pedastal you put these punks on, the bigger the bang when their true nature is exposed and it falls over - the feeling of betrayal by the media, and turning upon them in denial of their own complicity is one thing we're COUNTING ON, to not only put that lackwit Obama back in office as a roadblock to the batshit crazy of the GOP, but to enable a counterstorm and flush of their lackeys in all offices nationwide.

It ain't the Reign of Terror which I would, honestly prefer, but it'll be a purge all the same, if this goes off well, and step by step, so far, so good.

-Frem

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